Can Greg Little learn to catch? (1 Viewer)

[spider321]

The guy played mostly RB in college and, as a result, has dropped multiple easy balls this season.(at least 3 this past Sunday)

Can he learn to catch a football at the NFL level or is that something that must be learned earlier in a guy's career?

 

[shnikies]

The guy played mostly RB in college and, as a result, has dropped multiple easy balls this season.(at least 3 this past Sunday)Can he learn to catch a football at the NFL level or is that something that must be learned earlier in a guy's career?

You can't teach hands, heart, height or speed. Speed can be taught to an extent.

 

[wiscstlatlmia]

The guy played mostly RB in college and, as a result, has dropped multiple easy balls this season.(at least 3 this past Sunday)Can he learn to catch a football at the NFL level or is that something that must be learned earlier in a guy's career?

You can't teach hands, heart, height or speed. Speed can be taught to an extent.

Darrius Heyward Bey disagrees lol

 

[ConnSKINS26]

I think he might, only because he's still pretty new to this whole WR thing. If he had been a WR his whole life, I'd be much more skeptical. But, even DHB showed more reliable hands this season.

He's got the physical tools to succeed if he can just develop above-average (in terms of NFL receivers) hands. Even guys like Marshall and T.O. never had elite hands, in general. Little was always a guy who would need lots of targets to succeed, I think. More of a PPR receiver with lots of YAC ability.

 

[loose circuits]

does he have tiny hands?

 

[Time Kibitzer]

I wouldn't be so worried about Greg Little's dropping problems. The more important thing is that he catches the ball the right way, he doesn't wait for the ball to hit him in the body, he attacks it with his hands. Terrell Owens dropped a tonne of balls in his career, but he caught the ball the right way and he was still a fantasy stud every year. I'm not saying Greg Little is going to be the next TO, just that dropping balls and fantasy success are not exclusive.

 

[Brewtown]

T.O. had a problem with drops his entire career. 1998 or 99 playoff game vs the Pack when he dropped like 3 important passes and then caught the game winner at the buzzer all the way through his years in Philly and Dallas. He kind of always had the dropsies and still had a H.O.F. career and great fantasy numbers.... Every person and case is unique.... He could be a guy who struggles with drops for his whole career.... He is putting up good fantasy stats as a rookie.... My guess is that he only gets better....

 

[Brewtown]

I wouldn't be so worried about Greg Little's dropping problems. The more important thing is that he catches the ball the right way, he doesn't wait for the ball to hit him in the body, he attacks it with his hands. Terrell Owens dropped a tonne of balls in his career, but he caught the ball the right way and he was still a fantasy stud every year. I'm not saying Greg Little is going to be the next TO, just that dropping balls and fantasy success are not exclusive.

Wow, I didn't see your post when I posted... That is kind of creepy

 

[moderated]

Little has good hands but his mind is overloaded learning how to be a wr so his focus is a bit off.

He was a former basketball player and has the hand eye coordination but just needs experience. For a guy to come into the nfl after only playing wr for a year and then missing an entire season is actually pretty remarkable.

He has all the tools, just not the experience yet.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

I'm a firm believer if you can't catch by the time you're drafted you won't suddenly 'get it' once you reach the pros.

It's one of the few areas where you either have it or you don't.

 

[Brewtown]

I'm a firm believer if you can't catch by the time you're drafted you won't suddenly 'get it' once you reach the pros.

It's one of the few areas where you either have it or you don't.

DROP PERCENTAGE: WIDE RECEIVERS from pro football focusWe’ve recently been running a series of articles, breaking down aspects of player performance, and next up we’re looking at wide receivers. Following on from an article we did last year, it seemed a good place to start would be in breaking down the drop issues wide receivers have.

Now the drop stat in itself is an interesting one. A glance can suggest which receivers have the more questionable hands in the league, but it’s not exactly fair to class all guys with 12 drops, for example, together. After all, one could have 24 receptions, and the other 124.

So in one of our simpler metric type articles, we’re bringing you our Drop Percentage for all receivers who had at least 50 catchable balls thrown their way (catchable balls determined by just adding together the number of receptions and drops).

Dependable in 2010

It’s not shocking to see that up near the top, we have a couple of guys who do most of their damage in catching shorter, underneath routes. Still, you have to give credit to Jordan Shipley and Earl Bennett for holding onto everything thrown their way. That’s the kind of dependency that should make life a lot easier for a potential rookie starter at quarterback in Cincinnati, and you would think it might make Jay Cutler seem a little less erratic.

When discussing the top receivers in a list like this, you’re never far from mentioning Larry Fitzgerald. Despite dealing with some terrible quarterback play that wasn’t just inaccurate, but would lead you into harms way often, Fitzgerald did more than you’d expect most mortals to do by dropping only three of the 90 catchable balls thrown his way. This was good enough for fourth, behind another guy who always finishes highly on this list, Kevin Walter.

Indeed, with their two best receivers in the top fifteen, you can’t argue the Texans aren’t helping out Matt Schaub in this regard. Walter has become one of the league’s most reliable targets, while Andre Johnson eliminated some of the drops that had always been a part of his game. Somehow Johnson managed to improve this season, and he did so on an injured ankle.

Elsewhere in the Top 10, you have a couple more guys who play mainly in the slot (Mike Thomas and Eddie Royal), and perhaps more surprisingly, one of the leagues’ best deep threats in 2010, Brandon Lloyd. The catches tend to be a bit harder the further downfield you go, but Lloyd displayed a previously unseen consistency to make plays on balls that you didn’t think he had any right to.

Just outside the top ten is a name that will surprise a few, Braylon Edwards. The New York Jet developed a reputation for drops after a 2008 that saw his star fall in Cleveland. He didn’t help himself with the odd terrible (but highly publicized) drop in 2009 and even now the label of a guy with bad hands sticks (every drop of his receives more press time than other top guys). Remarkable then that he only dropped four balls all year, a better rate than either of the other Jets to make this list. The ever excellent Santonio Holmes dropped eight balls and finished in 42nd, while the normally reliable Jerricho Cotchery put 10 on the ground for the third worst number in the league. Edwards’ name will come up later, making his improvement in New York all the more stark.

Wide Receivers, Top 15 Drop Percentage, 2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

1 Jordan Shipley CIN 52 0 52 0.00%

2 Earl Bennett CHI 50 0 50 0.00%

3 Kevin Walter HST 51 1 52 1.92%

4 Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 90 3 93 3.23%

5 Eddie Royal DEN 59 2 61 3.28%

6 Lance Moore NO 70 3 73 4.11%

7 Mario Manningham NYG 60 3 63 4.76%

8 Brandon Lloyd DEN 77 4 81 4.94%

9 Anquan Boldin BLT 70 4 74 5.41%

10t Mike Thomas JAX 66 4 70 5.71%

10t Deion Branch NE 66 4 70 5.71%

12t Braylon Edwards NYJ 62 4 66 6.06%

12t Derrick Mason BLT 62 4 66 6.06%

14 Austin Collie IND 58 4 62 6.45%

15 Andre Johnson HST 86 6 92 6.52%

Things weren’t all good, and now we’re getting into dropping some criticism on players. While he may be as scary a deep threat as there is in the league, a one-dimensional player like DeSean Jackson never really scores that highly in our grading. You can attribute some of that to his league-leading 19.67% of drops on catchable balls – this Eagle is your vintage boom or bust receiver.

It’s more of a surprise to see Steve Smith just behind him, with injury and poor quarterback play seemingly having a huge impact on Smith’s ability to play to the level we expect from him. Given his stellar performance in recent years, you wouldn’t know how much of this was Smith being bogged down by the problems in Carolina, but it’s something for potential trade partners to consider.

Other noteworthy names near the bottom include Mike Williams of Tampa Bay. The rookie impressed many so much that his peers voted him into their top 100 players of 2011, though it does come as a surprise. He did show a tremendous ability to make plays after the catch, but with 11 drops you start to realize he’s got a way to go before he’s really earned a spot as one of the top receivers.

You could levy the same charge against Steve Johnson of Buffalo, who was capable of looking the real deal one game, and then dropping five passes the next. Consistency and concentration are key attributes of guys who finish highly in these rankings, and it would be fair to say both men could do with working on those attributes to take their already impressive games to the next level.

Wide Receivers, Bottom 15 Drop Percentage, 2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

41 Steve Smith NYG 48 6 54 11.11%

42 Santonio Holmes NYJ 61 8 69 11.59%

43 Jacoby Jones HST 51 7 58 12.07%

44 Michael Crabtree SF 55 8 63 12.70%

45 Wes Welker NE 93 14 107 13.08%

46 Brandon Marshall MIA 86 13 99 13.13%

47 Steve Johnson BUF 82 13 95 13.68%

48 Miles Austin DAL 69 11 80 13.75%

49 Jordy Nelson GB 66 11 77 14.29%

50 Steve Breaston ARZ 47 8 55 14.55%

51 Mike A. Williams TB 64 11 75 14.67%

52 Pierre Garcon IND 72 13 85 15.29%

53 Jerricho Cotchery NYJ 53 10 63 15.87%

54 Steve L. Smith CAR 46 10 56 17.86%

55 DeSean Jackson PHI 49 12 61 19.67%

Looking Deeper

To get a bit further into it, I’ve pulled all the data from the last three years to see who has that consistency over a longer period. The qualifying amount of catchable balls thrown goes up to 120, and the results get more interesting.

Up front, you’ve got two of the perennial favorites in this list with the aforementioned Walter and Fitzgerald showing 2010 was no fluke. Also in the top five, Vincent Jackson shows what Philip Rivers missed last year. His ability to go down the field and make tricky catches, is something that makes him one of the most in-demand receivers, even with a franchise tag on him.

Some of the other names that should be of interest are Austin Collie up in eighth, while Pierre Garcon finished sixth from bottom. They don’t play identical roles in the Colts offense, but you can put some of Peyton Manning’s 2010 struggles on the absence of Austin Collie (as well as Dallas Clark) and extra reliance on the less dependable Garcon.

Wide Receivers, Top 10 Drop Percentage, 2008-2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

1 Kevin Walter HST 164 5 169 2.96%

2 Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 325 11 336 3.27%

3 Eddie Royal DEN 187 9 196 4.59%

4 Vincent Jackson SD 150 8 158 5.06%

5 Lance Moore NO 149 8 157 5.10%

6 Jason Avant PHI 144 8 152 5.26%

7 Anquan Boldin BLT 258 15 273 5.49%

8 Austin Collie IND 135 8 143 5.59%

9 Michael Jenkins ATL 152 10 162 6.17%

10 Derrick Mason BLT 232 16 248 6.45%

Meanwhile down at the bottom you’ve got some pretty big names competing for title of “worst hands” over the past three years. It tells you about the improvements of Edwards that even though he finished just outside the Top 10 in 2010, he finished at the bottom of the three-year rankings (by and large due to those incredible 19 drops in 2008).

Wide Receivers, Bottom 10 Drop Percentage, 2008-2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

36 Santana Moss WAS 242 29 271 10.70%

37 Brandon Marshall MIA 291 37 328 11.28%

38 Nate Washington TEN 136 18 154 11.69%

39 Marques Colston NO 220 30 250 12.00%

40 Pierre Garcon IND 144 20 164 12.20%

41 DeSean Jackson PHI 187 26 213 12.21%

42 Randy Moss MIN 185 26 211 12.32%

43 Terrell Owens CIN 196 28 224 12.50%

44 Dwayne Bowe KC 205 33 238 13.87%

45 Braylon Edwards NYJ 168 29 197 14.72%

So there you have it. The numbers show some steadily good (like Walter and Fitzgerald), some steadily not-so (like Jackson), and even some capable of a huge turnaround (like Edwards). While none of it makes Walter flatly more valuable than the deep threat that is Jackson, maybe a bit more credit is due for the Texan and his role in their offense. Either way, more grist for the mill.

 

[spider321]

Do you have a Cliff's Notes version?

 

[wiscstlatlmia]

I think he might, only because he's still pretty new to this whole WR thing. If he had been a WR his whole life, I'd be much more skeptical. But, even DHB showed more reliable hands this season.He's got the physical tools to succeed if he can just develop above-average (in terms of NFL receivers) hands. Even guys like Marshall and T.O. never had elite hands, in general. Little was always a guy who would need lots of targets to succeed, I think. More of a PPR receiver with lots of YAC ability.

I have to agree with this. To say I havnt been a bit worried with all the drops would be a lie though. usually(in the games) I'll just say something like "O Greg" or "come on Greg you can't drop that" and shake my head. I love his heart, I love how hardworking he is and if he is still given the opportunity next year to be the guy in Cleveland, I think he ends up succeeding down the road. Its been a bit scary of a rookie year though. A year filled with wrong routes, drops and missed assignments. As Conn said though, he just looks to be a bit out of his element. From not playing a year of football to being the #1 guy in a west coast offense has to be a pretty ridiculous jump. Add the fact they hes very inexperienced at wr, it kinda adds up. I love rooting for the kid based on his raw potential, just gotta sit and wait. One thought/ question I have. If the Browns end up drafting Justin Blackmon, does that help or hurt Littles production? I get the feeling they wouldn't even get in each others way with they styles they play. I think that would give the Browns a legit opportunity to become a top 10 offense.

 

[shnikies]

You drop a ball because of one of two reasons, lack of concentration or bad hands. I haven't seen Little's drops so I don't know which they are mostly. If it's because of a lack of concentration then that can be fixed. You can't teach good hands, it's a natural ability.

 

[NJDawgPound]

You drop a ball because of one of two reasons, lack of concentration or bad hands. I haven't seen Little's drops so I don't know which they are mostly. If it's because of a lack of concentration then that can be fixed. You can't teach good hands, it's a natural ability.

Of the receivers at the combine 6 foot or taller, only two others had hands that were smaller than his. With smaller hands, I would think the concentration level would need to be higher than usual. Considering the weird offseason due to the lockout, learning on the fly, and being out of football for a year, he's behind the learning curve. I think he'll still have a drop here and there but will improve to the fact that it's a drawback but not a detriment.I picture him as an Anquan Boldin type who would be downright awesome if we had a Larry Fitzgerald beside him in Cleveland. A definite 1A, but not a true #1.

 

[todisco1]

The guy is still learning to play the position. He's very raw as a WR, and I expect significant growth. In dynasty leagues I'd be all over trying to get this guy.

 

[identikit]

The guy is still learning to play the position. He's very raw as a WR, and I expect significant growth. In dynasty leagues I'd be all over trying to get this guy.

This.Not worried at all about Little.Just needs more time.

 

[Sweet Love]

I'm a firm believer if you can't catch by the time you're drafted you won't suddenly 'get it' once you reach the pros.

It's one of the few areas where you either have it or you don't.

DROP PERCENTAGE: WIDE RECEIVERS from pro football focusWe’ve recently been running a series of articles, breaking down aspects of player performance, and next up we’re looking at wide receivers. Following on from an article we did last year, it seemed a good place to start would be in breaking down the drop issues wide receivers have.

Now the drop stat in itself is an interesting one. A glance can suggest which receivers have the more questionable hands in the league, but it’s not exactly fair to class all guys with 12 drops, for example, together. After all, one could have 24 receptions, and the other 124.

So in one of our simpler metric type articles, we’re bringing you our Drop Percentage for all receivers who had at least 50 catchable balls thrown their way (catchable balls determined by just adding together the number of receptions and drops).

Dependable in 2010

It’s not shocking to see that up near the top, we have a couple of guys who do most of their damage in catching shorter, underneath routes. Still, you have to give credit to Jordan Shipley and Earl Bennett for holding onto everything thrown their way. That’s the kind of dependency that should make life a lot easier for a potential rookie starter at quarterback in Cincinnati, and you would think it might make Jay Cutler seem a little less erratic.

When discussing the top receivers in a list like this, you’re never far from mentioning Larry Fitzgerald. Despite dealing with some terrible quarterback play that wasn’t just inaccurate, but would lead you into harms way often, Fitzgerald did more than you’d expect most mortals to do by dropping only three of the 90 catchable balls thrown his way. This was good enough for fourth, behind another guy who always finishes highly on this list, Kevin Walter.

Indeed, with their two best receivers in the top fifteen, you can’t argue the Texans aren’t helping out Matt Schaub in this regard. Walter has become one of the league’s most reliable targets, while Andre Johnson eliminated some of the drops that had always been a part of his game. Somehow Johnson managed to improve this season, and he did so on an injured ankle.

Elsewhere in the Top 10, you have a couple more guys who play mainly in the slot (Mike Thomas and Eddie Royal), and perhaps more surprisingly, one of the leagues’ best deep threats in 2010, Brandon Lloyd. The catches tend to be a bit harder the further downfield you go, but Lloyd displayed a previously unseen consistency to make plays on balls that you didn’t think he had any right to.

Just outside the top ten is a name that will surprise a few, Braylon Edwards. The New York Jet developed a reputation for drops after a 2008 that saw his star fall in Cleveland. He didn’t help himself with the odd terrible (but highly publicized) drop in 2009 and even now the label of a guy with bad hands sticks (every drop of his receives more press time than other top guys). Remarkable then that he only dropped four balls all year, a better rate than either of the other Jets to make this list. The ever excellent Santonio Holmes dropped eight balls and finished in 42nd, while the normally reliable Jerricho Cotchery put 10 on the ground for the third worst number in the league. Edwards’ name will come up later, making his improvement in New York all the more stark.

Wide Receivers, Top 15 Drop Percentage, 2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

1 Jordan Shipley CIN 52 0 52 0.00%

2 Earl Bennett CHI 50 0 50 0.00%

3 Kevin Walter HST 51 1 52 1.92%

4 Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 90 3 93 3.23%

5 Eddie Royal DEN 59 2 61 3.28%

6 Lance Moore NO 70 3 73 4.11%

7 Mario Manningham NYG 60 3 63 4.76%

8 Brandon Lloyd DEN 77 4 81 4.94%

9 Anquan Boldin BLT 70 4 74 5.41%

10t Mike Thomas JAX 66 4 70 5.71%

10t Deion Branch NE 66 4 70 5.71%

12t Braylon Edwards NYJ 62 4 66 6.06%

12t Derrick Mason BLT 62 4 66 6.06%

14 Austin Collie IND 58 4 62 6.45%

15 Andre Johnson HST 86 6 92 6.52%

Things weren’t all good, and now we’re getting into dropping some criticism on players. While he may be as scary a deep threat as there is in the league, a one-dimensional player like DeSean Jackson never really scores that highly in our grading. You can attribute some of that to his league-leading 19.67% of drops on catchable balls – this Eagle is your vintage boom or bust receiver.

It’s more of a surprise to see Steve Smith just behind him, with injury and poor quarterback play seemingly having a huge impact on Smith’s ability to play to the level we expect from him. Given his stellar performance in recent years, you wouldn’t know how much of this was Smith being bogged down by the problems in Carolina, but it’s something for potential trade partners to consider.

Other noteworthy names near the bottom include Mike Williams of Tampa Bay. The rookie impressed many so much that his peers voted him into their top 100 players of 2011, though it does come as a surprise. He did show a tremendous ability to make plays after the catch, but with 11 drops you start to realize he’s got a way to go before he’s really earned a spot as one of the top receivers.

You could levy the same charge against Steve Johnson of Buffalo, who was capable of looking the real deal one game, and then dropping five passes the next. Consistency and concentration are key attributes of guys who finish highly in these rankings, and it would be fair to say both men could do with working on those attributes to take their already impressive games to the next level.

Wide Receivers, Bottom 15 Drop Percentage, 2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

41 Steve Smith NYG 48 6 54 11.11%

42 Santonio Holmes NYJ 61 8 69 11.59%

43 Jacoby Jones HST 51 7 58 12.07%

44 Michael Crabtree SF 55 8 63 12.70%

45 Wes Welker NE 93 14 107 13.08%

46 Brandon Marshall MIA 86 13 99 13.13%

47 Steve Johnson BUF 82 13 95 13.68%

48 Miles Austin DAL 69 11 80 13.75%

49 Jordy Nelson GB 66 11 77 14.29%

50 Steve Breaston ARZ 47 8 55 14.55%

51 Mike A. Williams TB 64 11 75 14.67%

52 Pierre Garcon IND 72 13 85 15.29%

53 Jerricho Cotchery NYJ 53 10 63 15.87%

54 Steve L. Smith CAR 46 10 56 17.86%

55 DeSean Jackson PHI 49 12 61 19.67%

Looking Deeper

To get a bit further into it, I’ve pulled all the data from the last three years to see who has that consistency over a longer period. The qualifying amount of catchable balls thrown goes up to 120, and the results get more interesting.

Up front, you’ve got two of the perennial favorites in this list with the aforementioned Walter and Fitzgerald showing 2010 was no fluke. Also in the top five, Vincent Jackson shows what Philip Rivers missed last year. His ability to go down the field and make tricky catches, is something that makes him one of the most in-demand receivers, even with a franchise tag on him.

Some of the other names that should be of interest are Austin Collie up in eighth, while Pierre Garcon finished sixth from bottom. They don’t play identical roles in the Colts offense, but you can put some of Peyton Manning’s 2010 struggles on the absence of Austin Collie (as well as Dallas Clark) and extra reliance on the less dependable Garcon.

Wide Receivers, Top 10 Drop Percentage, 2008-2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

1 Kevin Walter HST 164 5 169 2.96%

2 Larry Fitzgerald ARZ 325 11 336 3.27%

3 Eddie Royal DEN 187 9 196 4.59%

4 Vincent Jackson SD 150 8 158 5.06%

5 Lance Moore NO 149 8 157 5.10%

6 Jason Avant PHI 144 8 152 5.26%

7 Anquan Boldin BLT 258 15 273 5.49%

8 Austin Collie IND 135 8 143 5.59%

9 Michael Jenkins ATL 152 10 162 6.17%

10 Derrick Mason BLT 232 16 248 6.45%

Meanwhile down at the bottom you’ve got some pretty big names competing for title of “worst hands” over the past three years. It tells you about the improvements of Edwards that even though he finished just outside the Top 10 in 2010, he finished at the bottom of the three-year rankings (by and large due to those incredible 19 drops in 2008).

Wide Receivers, Bottom 10 Drop Percentage, 2008-2010

Rank Player Team Receptions Drops Catchable Drop %

36 Santana Moss WAS 242 29 271 10.70%

37 Brandon Marshall MIA 291 37 328 11.28%

38 Nate Washington TEN 136 18 154 11.69%

39 Marques Colston NO 220 30 250 12.00%

40 Pierre Garcon IND 144 20 164 12.20%

41 DeSean Jackson PHI 187 26 213 12.21%

42 Randy Moss MIN 185 26 211 12.32%

43 Terrell Owens CIN 196 28 224 12.50%

44 Dwayne Bowe KC 205 33 238 13.87%

45 Braylon Edwards NYJ 168 29 197 14.72%

So there you have it. The numbers show some steadily good (like Walter and Fitzgerald), some steadily not-so (like Jackson), and even some capable of a huge turnaround (like Edwards). While none of it makes Walter flatly more valuable than the deep threat that is Jackson, maybe a bit more credit is due for the Texan and his role in their offense. Either way, more grist for the mill.

Interesting data considering that of the top 5 guys (shipley, Walter and Royal) are literally forgotten guys in their offense. Out of the bottom five, you have studs like Steve Smith, D-Jax and to a lesser degree Garcon and Mike Williams...frankly, I am not sure what good hands has to do with being a good fantasy wide receiver.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

No doubt, Greg Little has dropped many balls that he should have caught but he was out last year and is still learning the position. Also Colt McCoy hasn't been the most consistent with his placement.

Little isn't the only Cleveland receiver who has struggled catching the ball so you have to think the QB is playing a role with the drops. Monterio Hardesty was leading the NFL in dropped passes earlier in the year when he first got his shot. It seemed to be primarily a Monterio thing, now Little is really struggling and some of the other receivers have dropped passes so even though I don't want to I have to put some blame on Colt McCoy.