Can somebody convince me that Steve Smith (2 Viewers)

[Chinchilla]

If all the players from the NFL were put into a draft pool and the GMs drafted their entire rosters from scratch, do you think Steve Smith would be drafted in the top-5 among WRs?

WTF? Not even close to the same argument.

I doubt NFL GM's would take Smith as a top 5 WR.

I still think Smith is top 2 or 3 in the league.

so you know more about the NFL and talent evaluation than most GMs?

Oops.Ryan Leaf?

 

[AnonymousBob]

Who would the top five wr's be?  Holt, Ward, CJ, Boldin, Fitzgerald, Randy Moss, AJ?  A case could certainly be made that Smith would go in the top five wr's.

I would rank Moss, Owens, Chad, Holt ahead of him, and then likely group Smith with players like Ward and Harrison (his age hurts him a bit though). In terms of long-term potential, I like Fitz more than Smith.

After all that's happened you'd take Owens before Smith? Ward gets credit for being such a team guy-so shouldn't TO LOSE some points for being a cancer? I'd much rather have Smith on my team than Owens.

sorry, I wasn't clear. I wouldn't want Owens on my team so there's no way I'd "take" him over Smith. But, I do still think Owens is a better all-around WR than Smith on the field. He just has some other fatal flaws that damage his value.

I also think he has more talent. But when you factor in age+attitude I don't know if ANY GM would take him above Smith. Guys like Harrison would also fall further if only because of age. I'd say Moss, Holt, CJ, Smith, Ward, Fitz, AJ...Heck, a case could be made that Moss would fall below some of the others as well. At a certain point you've gotta be willing to sacrifice talent for attitude. If I were to start a team Moss would not be the first wr I'd take.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

If all the players from the NFL were put into a draft pool and the GMs drafted their entire rosters from scratch, do you think Steve Smith would be drafted in the top-5 among WRs?

WTF? Not even close to the same argument.

I doubt NFL GM's would take Smith as a top 5 WR.

I still think Smith is top 2 or 3 in the league.

so you know more about the NFL and talent evaluation than most GMs?

Oops.Ryan Leaf?

 

[Michael Brown]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:1.Moss2.Owens3.Chad4.Harrison5.Holt6.Fitz/Hines/SmithAnd yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

 

[Michael Brown]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?

As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:

1.Moss

2.Owens

3.Chad

4.Harrison

5.Holt

6.Fitz/Hines/Smith

And yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

Oh yeah, looks like I put them in a particular order. Good job by me not deleting that part.

 

[AnonymousBob]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?

As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:

1.Moss

2.Owens

3.Chad

4.Harrison

5.Holt

6.Fitz/Hines/Smith

And yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

But you CAN'T IGNORE character-that is part of the player.

 

[Burning Sensation]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?

As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:

1.Moss

2.Owens

3.Chad

4.Harrison

5.Holt

6.Fitz/Hines/Smith

And yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

Seems like you may be guilty as well. I dont doubt Harrison was a great player, and continues to be a good one, but dont you think alot of what he has done can be contributed to having the best QB in the league throwing to him?Edited to add, how can you say Fitz is "infinitely more talented" than Smith? I am not saying Fitz is not very talented, but i dont think you can say more talented than Smith. I REALLY dont think anyone other than you and Fitzgeralds family members would use the term "infinitely"

 

[Michael Brown]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?

As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:

1.Moss

2.Owens

3.Chad

4.Harrison

5.Holt

6.Fitz/Hines/Smith

And yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

Seems like you may be guilty as well. I dont doubt Harrison was a great player, and continues to be a good one, but dont you think alot of what he has done can be contributed to having the best QB in the league throwing to him?Edited to add, how can you say Fitz is "infinitely more talented" than Smith? I am not saying Fitz is not very talented, but i dont think you can say more talented than Smith. I REALLY dont think anyone other than you and Fitzgeralds family members would use the term "infinitely"

True, I used the wrong word there. There's no way one all-pro WR can be infinitely more talented than another all-pro WR, so that's my mistake.As far as Harrison, he runs about the best routes and has some of the best hands that I've ever seen. Having Manning throwing to him certainly has helped, but I truly believe that with his work ethic he would be a stud WR no matter who his QB was.

And yeah, to the above poster I agree that you have to take character into account when you are choosing who to put on your team. But the argument was about talent in and of itself without factoring in character. If we are discussing that aspect, I'd obviously drop Owens way down and Moss a few pegs down as well, putting Holt, Harrison and CJ atop my rankings.

 

[clint_c]

Evertime I see this thread it makes me want to masturbate to the fact I got Steve Smith in the 4th round.

 

[Winston Smith]

Evertime I see this thread it makes me want to masturbate to the fact I got Steve Smith in the 4th round.

 

[BassNBrew]

Not sure if you add this to the equation, but Smith is returning punts too. In my opinion, what makes him special is his ability to take a reception at the line of scrimage the distance.Regarding Moose...he had a history of only stepping up during contract years.

 

[abe froman]

He is not in your top 5 right now?

Who would you rather have?

I'm not sure. He might squeeze in.I still would have a hard time ranking him over players like TO, Moss, Chad, and Holt. I also think a case could be made for players like Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson to either be more proven than Smith, at the same level as him, or to have more upside. I probably am worrying too much about his lack of height, but I think a bigger WR would be a more complete weapon in the red zone and as a blocker. Smith clearly belongs in the top tier of WRs in terms of quickness, hands, route running, big play ability, and RAC skills.

Does the fact that Muhammad put up huge numbers in Carolina last year affect anyone's perception of Smith?

Although this would probably be better if discussed here, i will respond in this thread anyhow.If doing a draft TODAY, redraft or dynasty, you would take TO over Steve Smith....seriously?

As for Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson, please tell me you are kidding, with the exception of Fitzgerald, how can you even argue for any of the other guys?

Oh yeah, Andre Johnson!?!?!?!??!?!?

what are you talking about?the initial post from BnB before the season started said that he thought Steve Smith was a top-5 WR in the NFL in terms of his "football abilty".

THIS WAS NOT A FANTASY FOOTBALL RANKING OF TOP-5 WRS.

Steve Smith is awesome and is having one of the best WR seasons of all time. Does that automatically mean he's one of the best 5 WRs in the NFL? Why doesn't Muhammad belong there after what he did last year then?

Mushy would be a top 5 NFL WR if he still was CAR #1 WR. Delhomme focuses in on his #1 and gives them the opportunity to make big plays often. Mushys strength is catching the ball at the highest point over 1-2 DB's, while Smith leaves 1 DB at the line of scrimmage and beats the others with RAW NFL TALENT/SKILL...if you disagree with that then you havent watched him play. Now since Smith is CAR's #1 I'd have to say that yes he is easily a top 5 NFL WR and will continue to be around there as long as he's a Panther..

While I do think Smith has proven he's one of the five best WRs in football right now (I was skeptical due to his size as well, but watching a few Panther's games changed that), you really seem to be missing Aaron's point. He is talking about the best WRs purely from an ability perspective, independent of which team they play on. So, to say, Muhammed is a top 5 WR only if he plays on Carolina really is an unfair statement. While changing teams affects a players fantasy value, it will not change their natural ability, which is what Aaron is talking about.

A. how would you rank DB's theyve played thus far?B. Does the name SMOOT factor into your top 10?

C. Did you see what he did to Smoot (even had highlights on ESPN)?

He has rediculous breakaway moves, reads the defense as well or better than most NFL QB's, exploiting DOUBLE TEAMS regularly, soft hands, get out of town speed..more but Im curious to see some examples as to why he ISNT worthy of being considered as a top 5 WR in your mind(s)?? AND CUT THE REGERGITATED "He's too short, blah blah blah" for as long as he's been healthy, and the #1 WR He's been a stud and more recently a top 5 WR. Lets hear it.

 

[abe froman]

Who would the top five wr's be?  Holt, Ward, CJ, Boldin, Fitzgerald, Randy Moss, AJ?  A case could certainly be made that Smith would go in the top five wr's.

I would rank Moss, Owens, Chad, Holt ahead of him, and then likely group Smith with players like Ward and Harrison (his age hurts him a bit though). In terms of long-term potential, I like Fitz more than Smith.

Id rank:1.TO-Because he's already proven he can

2. Moss-because he's Moss-4 TD's doesnt do anything for me though..,

3. CJ-age, talent-TJ is an issue along with Rudi, and Perry

4. Holt-talent but HAS BEEN in a great situation which may change fairly soon

5. Smith is Lebron James, while Harrison (please stop with having him in your top 5 already..) is Jordan..

6. Fitz-talent and future top 5'er

7. anybody but WARD-Hate that guy..plus he cant be as much of a beast blocking, rushing etc..his bones have seen their healtiest days..

z

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[S.K.A.]

The spin that Aaron and Co. are trying to put on this is laughable. Football wise, not fantasy football talent.If you could somehow remove character from T.O., he is better.Smith is putting up good numbers, but can he get a jump ball? How does he block? It would be much easier to admit that you were wrong and move on. BTW, I am fully aware that you have backed off of your August assertions that Smith was a one-season wonder and that he is "not-that-far-off" from being top-five. Newsflash: He is not that far off from being MVP.

 

[Cunning Linguist]

There was talk on the pregame tonight of Smith being the MVP.

 

[abe froman]

Da/\/\n.. I cant believe my league doesnt give points for blocks, or jump balls caught.. You see..when you are 5-6 steps ahead of the defender(s) there's no need to jump; just catch-in-stride and get ready to put the baby to sleep.

 

[S.K.A.]

Everyone gets one wrong every now-and-then. Learn from it and move on from it.Lord knows I was wrong about Roy Williams this year. I gave that guy more credit for being able to play through injuries than I should have.Steve Smith is a top five guy anyway you slice it, this year.

 

[Sammy3469]

Not sure if you add this to the equation, but Smith is returning punts too. In my opinion, what makes him special is his ability to take a reception at the line of scrimage the distance.

Regarding Moose...he had a history of only stepping up during contract years.

I agree with this and have a hard time seeing anyone save TO doing some of the things Smith does after the catch with DBs in close proximity. Smith's real value is in his ability to make something out of nothing...it's only recently that he's transferred that speed and quickness (and I should add that he's hands down quicker than any of the other WRs in this conversation) into route running. His quickness (more than pure speed) allow him to miss the jam at the line of scrimmage that stops other more smallish receivers. He gets a release that lots of others just can't get. Once he gets that release, he's already gone.

Plus, he isn't afraid to go over the middle.

And he blocks, too.

 

[jwvdcw]

He is not in your top 5 right now?

Who would you rather have?

I'm not sure. He might squeeze in.I still would have a hard time ranking him over players like TO, Moss, Chad, and Holt. I also think a case could be made for players like Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson to either be more proven than Smith, at the same level as him, or to have more upside. I probably am worrying too much about his lack of height, but I think a bigger WR would be a more complete weapon in the red zone and as a blocker. Smith clearly belongs in the top tier of WRs in terms of quickness, hands, route running, big play ability, and RAC skills.

Does the fact that Muhammad put up huge numbers in Carolina last year affect anyone's perception of Smith?

Although this would probably be better if discussed here, i will respond in this thread anyhow.If doing a draft TODAY, redraft or dynasty, you would take TO over Steve Smith....seriously?

As for Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson, please tell me you are kidding, with the exception of Fitzgerald, how can you even argue for any of the other guys?

Oh yeah, Andre Johnson!?!?!?!??!?!?

I think hes talking real NFL, not FF, but I'm not sure.

 

[jwvdcw]

He is not in your top 5 right now?

Who would you rather have?

I'm not sure. He might squeeze in.I still would have a hard time ranking him over players like TO, Moss, Chad, and Holt. I also think a case could be made for players like Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson to either be more proven than Smith, at the same level as him, or to have more upside. I probably am worrying too much about his lack of height, but I think a bigger WR would be a more complete weapon in the red zone and as a blocker. Smith clearly belongs in the top tier of WRs in terms of quickness, hands, route running, big play ability, and RAC skills.

Does the fact that Muhammad put up huge numbers in Carolina last year affect anyone's perception of Smith?

Although this would probably be better if discussed here, i will respond in this thread anyhow.If doing a draft TODAY, redraft or dynasty, you would take TO over Steve Smith....seriously?

As for Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson, please tell me you are kidding, with the exception of Fitzgerald, how can you even argue for any of the other guys?

Oh yeah, Andre Johnson!?!?!?!??!?!?

what are you talking about?the initial post from BnB before the season started said that he thought Steve Smith was a top-5 WR in the NFL in terms of his "football abilty".

THIS WAS NOT A FANTASY FOOTBALL RANKING OF TOP-5 WRS.

Steve Smith is awesome and is having one of the best WR seasons of all time. Does that automatically mean he's one of the best 5 WRs in the NFL? Why doesn't Muhammad belong there after what he did last year then?

Mushy would be a top 5 NFL WR if he still was CAR #1 WR. Delhomme focuses in on his #1 and gives them the opportunity to make big plays often. Mushys strength is catching the ball at the highest point over 1-2 DB's, while Smith leaves 1 DB at the line of scrimmage and beats the others with RAW NFL TALENT/SKILL...if you disagree with that then you havent watched him play. Now since Smith is CAR's #1 I'd have to say that yes he is easily a top 5 NFL WR and will continue to be around there as long as he's a Panther..

Why does it matter where he plays? We're just talking about talent, not numbers, so where they play shouldn't matter. If you switched Smith to Chicago and MM back to Carolina, then their numbers would be different but your rankings of them as NFL players shouldn't.

 

[thatguy]

He is not in your top 5 right now?

Who would you rather have?

I'm not sure. He might squeeze in.I still would have a hard time ranking him over players like TO, Moss, Chad, and Holt. I also think a case could be made for players like Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson to either be more proven than Smith, at the same level as him, or to have more upside. I probably am worrying too much about his lack of height, but I think a bigger WR would be a more complete weapon in the red zone and as a blocker. Smith clearly belongs in the top tier of WRs in terms of quickness, hands, route running, big play ability, and RAC skills.

Does the fact that Muhammad put up huge numbers in Carolina last year affect anyone's perception of Smith?

Although this would probably be better if discussed here, i will respond in this thread anyhow.If doing a draft TODAY, redraft or dynasty, you would take TO over Steve Smith....seriously?

As for Ward, Harrison, Horn, Fitzgerald, J.Walker, A.Johnson, please tell me you are kidding, with the exception of Fitzgerald, how can you even argue for any of the other guys?

Oh yeah, Andre Johnson!?!?!?!??!?!?

I think hes talking real NFL, not FF, but I'm not sure.

You're right.

 

[jwvdcw]

put it this way...if your team was in a must-win game with an average QB and average surrounding talent, which WR would you want to be your #1 guy?

If Steve Smith is in your top-5 choices for that one game, so be it. I'm just saying I'm not completely sure he'd be in mine just yet. He's very close though, so the statement was not as ridiculous as it seemed to me at the time.

I agree with this. Muhammed, Anquan Boldin, Steve Smith, Santana Moss...these guys all put up(or are currently putting up) one huge year. That doesn't mean they are top 5.Top 5 guys do it multiple years.

 

[jwvdcw]

Does the fact that Muhammad put up huge numbers in Carolina last year affect anyone's perception of Smith?

Why would it? During the 2003 superbowl season, Smith became Delhomme's go to guy because he outperformed Moose. At the beginning of 2004, Smith was ranked in several top 10 preseason rankings, but he broke his leg in week 1. He was listed as WR #1 in Carolina then, not Moose. Muhammads huge numbers last year tell me that Delhomme is a damn good quarterback, plus Carolina had to throw a lot because they kept losing running backs to injury.

Because perhaps the system favors the #1 WR or Delhomme focuses on the #1 WR a lot. That would mean that he isn't as good as the numbers he puts up. Just like all of those WRs that Jeff Blake made into great FF players weren't top 5 WRs either- it was just that Blake always focused on one guy.

 

[jwvdcw]

put it this way...if your team was in a must-win game with an average QB and average surrounding talent, which WR would you want to be your #1 guy?

If Steve Smith is in your top-5 choices for that one game, so be it. I'm just saying I'm not completely sure he'd be in mine just yet. He's very close though, so the statement was not as ridiculous as it seemed to me at the time.

I know the asnwer isn't Andre Johnson

so you think he sucks and will never be a very good WR?if you put a healthy Andre Johnson in Carolina this year instead of Steve Smith, what type of numbers do you think he'd put up? if Steve Smith was playing hurt in Houston this year, where do you think people would rank him?

AR, I agree with you totally about Smith, but I think you are overrating AJ a bit. Guys like him, Roy Williams, Chambers, Clayton, L Evans, etc. havn't proved enough yet to be in this discussion.

 

[gocats]

Steve Smith is going to remind everyone why he is one of the best WRs in the game.

 

[jwvdcw]

I think Smith is as good or better than most of those guys.  Right now, I'd go:

1.  Moss

2.  Smith

3.  Holt

4.  CJ

then a cluster.

So, you don't think TO is a top-4 NFL wideout in terms of his ability on the field?

Yes, TO would be #2 on that list if he were playing currently. But right now he's not even a consideration.Where would you put Jerry Rice on that list?

Jerry Rice right now wouldn't be on that list because his skills right now aren't top 5 in the world. TO's are.

 

[jwvdcw]

Sorry if me not anointing him the best WR of all time is offending you in some way.

Say what? I never said he was the best WR of all time or implied such, I just don't get how you dismiss him as a top 5 wr this year.

In terms of NFL talent, Steve Smith is not one of the best 5 NFL WRs. However, hes in a great situation this year and taking advantage of it and is a top 5 FF WR this year.How is Smith any better than Mushin Muhammed, who did the same thing when he was in that situation last year?

 

[jwvdcw]

Who would the top five wr's be? Holt, Ward, CJ, Boldin, Fitzgerald, Randy Moss, AJ? A case could certainly be made that Smith would go in the top five wr's.

My list:1.TO

2.R Moss

3.CJ

4.Marvin Harrison

5t.Holt

5t.Smith

 

[jwvdcw]

If all the players from the NFL were put into a draft pool and the GMs drafted their entire rosters from scratch, do you think Steve Smith would be drafted in the top-5 among WRs?

WTF? Not even close to the same argument.

I doubt NFL GM's would take Smith as a top 5 WR.

I still think Smith is top 2 or 3 in the league.

I'm totally confused by your statements. If he wouldn't be taken top 5 then how is he a top 5 WR?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Everyone gets one wrong every now-and-then. Learn from it and move on from it.

Lord knows I was wrong about Roy Williams this year. I gave that guy more credit for being able to play through injuries than I should have.

Steve Smith is a top five guy anyway you slice it, this year.

I've said that I missed on Smith this year.If you want to get involved in the discussion and take shots at people from the sidelines, at least take the time to figure out what people are talking about.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Da/\/\n.. I cant believe my league doesnt give points for blocks, or jump balls caught.. You see..when you are 5-6 steps ahead of the defender(s) there's no need to jump; just catch-in-stride and get ready to put the baby to sleep.

great post. has nothing to do with the discussion going on, but thanks for sharing your league's scoring system.

 

[S.K.A.]

Everyone gets one wrong every now-and-then. Learn from it and move on from it.

Lord knows I was wrong about Roy Williams this year. I gave that guy more credit for being able to play through injuries than I should have.

Steve Smith is a top five guy anyway you slice it, this year.

I've said that I missed on Smith this year.If you want to get involved in the discussion and take shots at people from the sidelines, at least take the time to figure out what people are talking about.

Appreciate the cute little put-down Aaron. I think I have figured out what people are talking about, thanks. Am I on the sidelines, or getting involved in the discussion? I haven't taken the time to figure that one out yet?Steve Smith is top-five. Try and spin it anyway you'd like. You miss some, you hit some. Not really trying to "take shots" at people. Trying to impart a little advice. Learn from it and move on from it, as opposed to spin it, side step, and marginalize it.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Everyone gets one wrong every now-and-then. Learn from it and move on from it.

Lord knows I was wrong about Roy Williams this year. I gave that guy more credit for being able to play through injuries than I should have.

Steve Smith is a top five guy anyway you slice it, this year.

I've said that I missed on Smith this year.If you want to get involved in the discussion and take shots at people from the sidelines, at least take the time to figure out what people are talking about.

Appreciate the cute little put-down Aaron. I think I have figured out what people are talking about, thanks. Am I on the sidelines, or getting involved in the discussion? I haven't taken the time to figure that one out yet?Steve Smith is top-five. Try and spin it anyway you'd like. You miss some, you hit some. Not really trying to "take shots" at people. Trying to impart a little advice. Learn from it and move on from it, as opposed to spin it, side step, and marginalize it.

I'm not trying to spin anything. Just having a discussion, which is what the whole point of this message board is. People like BassNBrew and the person who started this thread deserve lots of props for predicting a huge year from Smith this year. I liked him going into the year, but clearly not as much as I should've. For example, I took Michael Clayton over him in WCOFF and I'm paying for it.But, I'm still not certain Steve Smith is a top 5 NFL WR, which is what 99% of my posts in this thread have been about. You'll probably notice from the other responses in this thread that I'm not exactly alone in that opinion.

Thanks a lot for your advice. Still think you're way off here, but it's not worth arguing over.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Steve Smith is awesome



great call.

bump for S.K.A.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Steve Smith is one of the top five WR's in the league from a football perspective.

which of these WRs is he better then from a "football perspective"?Terrell Owens

Randy Moss

Chad Johnson

Marvin Harrison

Torry Holt

Hines Ward

Joe Horn

Derrick Mason

Eric Moulds

Laveranues Coles

Javon Walker

Andre Johnson

Answer: Moulds, Ward, MasonComparable: Johnson, Horn, Harrison, Holt, Coles

Not as good: Chad Johnson, Moss, TO, Walker

ok, guy.

Thoughts now?

top-5 still seems a little high to me (Moss, Owens, CJohnson, Holt, Harrison, Ward have put up great numbers over a longer period of time), but he's definitely making a case for himself this year to become one of the league's elite.

another bump for S.K.A.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

If healthy, Smith WILL be a top 10 WR, i am as sure about this than anything else in FF this year.

I feel pretty confident in letting you know right now that this is not going to happen. Hope your other predictions work out better.

Clearly, I was wrong on this. Great call by B.S. as well.

 

[BassNBrew]

Who would the top five wr's be?  Holt, Ward, CJ, Boldin, Fitzgerald, Randy Moss, AJ?  A case could certainly be made that Smith would go in the top five wr's.

My list:1.TO

2.R Moss

3.CJ

4.Marvin Harrison

5t.Holt

5t.Smith

TO can't be number 1 when he can't get along with others well enough to stay on a team. Add to that his perenially injuries. Top five talent...yes. Bottom five head. Add that up and you don't have a number one WR.

 

[BassNBrew]

Props to Aaron for sticking around on this one.

 

[BassNBrew]

Top 5 yet?Check out the TDs tonite on sports center.

 

[BassNBrew]

80-1100-8 max, possibility of 70-900-5.

Above average WR, but not nearly in Muhammad's class, and the offense and situation surrounding the offense will be vastly different this season. 

Im not a Smith hater; I called his 2003 breakout season when no one was high on him...but the situations arent the same.

You are joking right???Moose was the number 2 man behind Smith......officially for one season, but really two. If not for the injury last year it would have been 3 years for Moose as a #2 man.

I'd be shocked if Smith ever puts up a season like Muhammad did last year. Muhammad's a big physical receiver with all the tools.

Exactly. Smith couldnt dream of doing the things Moose did last year. Muhammad has fought through alot of injuries, but hes always had #1 WR ability. Smith is a good #2 WR who can be forced into a #1 role.

What can Muhammad do that Steve Smith can not.....other than be 6 foot tall?

Steve Smith has never had two touchdowns in an NFL game. Muhammad had multiple TDs in back to back games multiple times last year. No comparison.

 

[BassNBrew]

Smith just went at 4.02 in a 12 league with PPR. 

For the Smith lovers - what kind of numbers do you see from him?

Do you have him ahead of Moss, Holt, C. Johnson, Harrison, Owens, J. Walker, Horn, R. Wayne, A. Johnson?

Ahead of:Moss - NO

Holt - NO

CJ - No

Harrison - No

Owens - No

Walker - On the fence if I went with my gut I would say no (mainly b/c of Walkers 12 TD's last year)

Horn - Yes

Wayne - Yes

Johnson - Yes

I could see Smith with 90 rec 1320 yds and 9-10 TD's

Mmm, kool-aid

Edit to add: Sorry Phrozen, I just saw BNB's "top 5 WR in the NFL" remark. Thats far more insane than anything you posted.

Will someone please remove the rubber suit now?

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

Steve Smith a top-5 WR in the NFL is about the funniest thing I've read here in awhile.

Thanks guys.

Did TommygunZ steal your ID this pre-season?Between this and McGahee...

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

Steve Smith is one of the top five WR's in the league from a football perspective.

which of these WRs is he better then from a "football perspective"?Terrell Owens - Wouldn't have the cancer on my team.

Randy Moss - Takes plays off, smokes dope, leaves the field early...no thanks.

Chad Johnson - Top 5

Marvin Harrison - Declining...would take Smith in front of him.

Torry Holt - Top 5

Hines Ward - Really torn here...wish he had a better QB

Joe Horn - On par with Smith

Derrick Mason - I don't think he's as tough or blocks as well.

Eric Moulds - No thanks, maybe not the best WR on his team.

Laveranues Coles - Concerned about that foot injury. If he's that great, why's he so tradeable?

Javon Walker - Borderline, but maybe ahead of Smith. Not thrilled with his attitude, but Smith was there earlier in his career.

Andre Johnson - I don't think so, but would allow that I could be wrong with a lack of data.

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

As for Steve Smith, his best season saw him compile 1100 yards and 7 TDs. You know who put up numbers like that in 2004?

he definitely deserves to be drafted in the top-20, but does anyone realistically see him reaching 1300 yards or double digit TDs this year? that's probably what he would need to crack the top-10 and I don't think he has it in him.

You can't make this stuff up.

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

If healthy, Smith WILL be a top 10 WR, i am as sure about this than anything else in FF this year.

I feel pretty confident in letting you know right now that this is not going to happen. Hope your other predictions work out better.

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

Jason Wood - Smith is tiny, has one top-20 season in four years, plays for a team that isn’t going to pass that much, and will share time with not one, but two solid receivers in Keary Colbert and Rod Gardner. I just don’t understand the love affair with this guy, and can only hope that at least one owner in each of my drafts rolls the dice on him with such a high pick.

WOW.

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

Larry Fitz is infinitely more talented than Steve Smith. Too often, people fail to account for situation. How come we can all agree that Denver RBs aren't as good as their stats would seem to indicate, but when a receiver puts up big numbers, it automatically means he's better than a guy with lesser numbers?

As far as talent goes, these guys are all as good or better than Smith all-around, in no particular order:

1.Moss

2.Owens

3.Chad

4.Harrison

5.Holt

6.Fitz/Hines/Smith

And yes, character issues aside, just about any NFL GM would take all of these guys (except maybe Ward) over Smith.

X

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

The spin that Aaron and Co. are trying to put on this is laughable.

Football wise, not fantasy football talent.

If you could somehow remove character from T.O., he is better.

Smith is putting up good numbers, but can he get a jump ball? How does he block?



It would be much easier to admit that you were wrong and move on. BTW, I am fully aware that you have backed off of your August assertions that Smith was a one-season wonder and that he is "not-that-far-off" from being top-five.

Newsflash: He is not that far off from being MVP.

 

[joffer]

Jason Wood - Smith is tiny, has one top-20 season in four years, plays for a team that isn’t going to pass that much, and will share time with not one, but two solid receivers in Keary Colbert and Rod Gardner. I just don’t understand the love affair with this guy, and can only hope that at least one owner in each of my drafts rolls the dice on him with such a high pick.

WOW.

i know, hard to believe, isn't it? i didn't think it was possible for someone to be this big of a #######. Congratulations.

 

[MyAwesomePrizeAlias]

Jason Wood - Smith is tiny, has one top-20 season in four years, plays for a team that isn’t going to pass that much, and will share time with not one, but two solid receivers in Keary Colbert and Rod Gardner. I just don’t understand the love affair with this guy, and can only hope that at least one owner in each of my drafts rolls the dice on him with such a high pick.

WOW.

i know, hard to believe, isn't it? i didn't think it was possible for someone to be this big of a #######. Congratulations.

Nice analysis.