Commisioners is there a better way to handle illegal rosters? (1 Viewer)

[belljr]

So I have been the commissioner of my league since 94.

Way back in the day we would not have illegal lineups because they were called in. We always had a rule that illegal rosters would result in ZERO points for that week.

Well in all my years we have never had an illegal roster, until yesterday. This is not illegal in the sense of players on BYE weeks. We actually don't penalize for that. We have other rules for tanking but sometimes BYE week starters just happen.

Anyway, I'm fine sticking with my guns for zero points, as the guy started 3 rb's and 1 wr. CBS tells you your roster is illegal. I know this was done accidentally, guy is not a cheat etc.

So my question is, is there a better system? SHould he get to start all is lowest roster players automatically? Using the roster the week before? Although in this case he had 6 players on BYE so, I know he was changing his roster.

What about total points? We have a prize for that and this cost him. Would adding the lowest score of the week minus say 10 points be fair? Obviously can't do it this year but thoughts for the future.

If I caught this early in the day I would have called him but I didn't see it until last night.

 

[runner06]

I'm guessing it's start 2 RBs / 2 WRs?

If so maybe you could count his lowest two scoring RBs in his starting lineup and his one WR? That would be my thought.

 

[belljr]

I'm guessing it's start 2 RBs / 2 WRs?If so maybe you could count his lowest two scoring RBs in his starting lineup and his one WR? That would be my thought.

Yeah sorry, probably should have mentioned that it's1QB, 2 rb , 2wr, 1te, 1k, 1def - pretty basicHe started1qb, 3rb, 1wr, 1te, 1k, 1def.So he is getting zero for the week but I'm looking to see if there may be something "fairer" for the future.

 

[shadyridr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

 

[sports_fan]

You're doing it the right way. An illegal roster should result in an automatic loss.

 

[Area51Inhabitant]

Seems pretty fair to me.

 

[belljr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

 

[spodog]

He started1qb, 3rb, 1wr, 1te, 1k, 1def.So he is getting zero for the week but I'm looking to see if there may be something "fairer" for the future.

That seems mega-harsh. If you suspect this was somehow an honest mistake, then I'd think just awarding him whatever points he would have accrued using his 2 lowest scoring RB's and 2 lowest scoring WR's would be more fair.

 

[shadyridr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

 

[Dr. Awesome]

How about remove the highest scoring player from the offending position and an additional penalty of x points. It doesn't guarantee a loss but it makes it damned difficult to win - but still gives the team a chance if it was an honest mistake and their opponent sucks that week.

 

[belljr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

Yeah that won't be happening.

 

[Reepicheep]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

 

[belljr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

 

[shadyridr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

Yeah that won't be happening.

mfl doesnt allow this. ill enjoy my problem free site while youre still trying to sort this out. gl2u

 

[unckeyherb]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

 

[shadyridr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

exactly. so guys looking for a better way, were giving him a better way, and hes saying not happening. why ask?

 

[PainGain]

With the possibility of it being a mistake, I would probably give his highest scoring RB a Zero for the week. This would prevent any future shenanigans and not be overly harsh for something the software should have not allowed.

 

[gandalas]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

Yeah that won't be happening.

Why exactly do you have such loyalty to CBS' site? From what I understand, they are the most expensive by FAR ($100+ per league site, right?), and yet have little bugs like this one all over the place.MFL ain't pretty, but for $60 or less per league, plus it gets it right. And you can MAKE it pretty if you want to take the time on it....

 

[Joe Summer]

Well in all my years we have never had an illegal roster, until yesterday. This is not illegal in the sense of players on BYE weeks. We actually don't penalize for that.

Why not? What is the difference between starting a kicker on a BYE and leaving that same kicker on the bench? If you're going to be unfairly punitive in one situation, then you may as well be unfairly punitive in both situations.

 

[Sweet Love]

He started1qb, 3rb, 1wr, 1te, 1k, 1def.So he is getting zero for the week but I'm looking to see if there may be something "fairer" for the future.

That seems mega-harsh. If you suspect this was somehow an honest mistake, then I'd think just awarding him whatever points he would have accrued using his 2 lowest scoring RB's and 2 lowest scoring WR's would be more fair.

Yeah, I agree...when total points are involved, it is an absolute killer for one honest mistake. Personally, I would give the guy a loss off the bat (no matter how much he may have won by) and then I would pull out the score of his top RB, and then score the rest of the lineup, giving the WR2 spot a zero. I do like that solution, but are you going to be able to go into the system and manipulate the scores like that (or any other solution)...I have never been a commish, so I do not know whether it is possible.

 

[footballnerd]

you sure you have your settings right? I've never used CBS before but there has to be something that prevents what just happened.

 

[Sweet Love]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

Yeah that won't be happening.

Why exactly do you have such loyalty to CBS' site? From what I understand, they are the most expensive by FAR ($100+ per league site, right?), and yet have little bugs like this one all over the place.MFL ain't pretty, but for $60 or less per league, plus it gets it right. And you can MAKE it pretty if you want to take the time on it....

I know people laugh at its limitations, but I am fine with the Yahoo free site we use for one of our leagues...it is a straight-forward PPR, but since your league is so old, you may not have intricate scoring scenarios and it would do just fine...you can certainly start people on bye weeks, but it literally is impossible to start someone out of position.

 

[bryhamm]

set the lineup back to last week. in essence, he made a change that should not have been allowed. so, undo the illegal change (ie set it back to what it was before the change). so what if a bunch of the players on a buy week. he should have been more careful.

 

[Reepicheep]

This would be like designing a chess game and making it possible to move the pieces anywhere on the board.

 

[QuizGuy66]

[ffa] I recommend a double electric fence to prevent illegal lineups from happening [/ffa]

Seriously, though, I think the worst 2 RB method is the way to go. Give a 0 for the 2nd WR spot.

-QG

 

[belljr]

exactly. so guys looking for a better way, were giving him a better way, and hes saying not happening. why ask?

A better way, not a better site. I have leauges on many sites so I am familiar with them. My question was an alternative to zero points.

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

switch sites. it wont happen again

Yeah that won't be happening.

Why exactly do you have such loyalty to CBS' site? From what I understand, they are the most expensive by FAR ($100+ per league site, right?), and yet have little bugs like this one all over the place.MFL ain't pretty, but for $60 or less per league, plus it gets it right. And you can MAKE it pretty if you want to take the time on it....

My "loyalty" to cbs is really because we have been with them since the beginning. Back when it was free. Everyone chips in 10 bucks to pay for the site and everyone enjoys the site. Plus I honestly don't feel like setting up a "new" one in case I miss some setting or scoring option It's part lazy, it's part comfort, and honestly it's part ease since half the leauge is not th emost computer savy If I can import to MLF easy I will, don't want to lose the 10 years that is on the CBS site plus spreadsheet I have prior to 2000

 

[The Rook]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

I'm not going to defend CBS because much of what you say is accurate, but also wondering to what extent does a system have to "cover" for an individual. I get it that this sounds like a one time mistake, but if this guy really cares, I bet he doesn't make the same mistake again after taking the loss and zero points. I may be a bit jaded because we have "one of those guys" in our league that I feel like we're always trying to make things idiot proof for and it get's tiring wondering what we can do to the system to make it easier. How hard is it to double check your lineup?

 

[belljr]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

I'm not going to defend CBS because much of what you say is accurate, but also wondering to what extent does a system have to "cover" for an individual. I get it that this sounds like a one time mistake, but if this guy really cares, I bet he doesn't make the same mistake again after taking the loss and zero points. I may be a bit jaded because we have "one of those guys" in our league that I feel like we're always trying to make things idiot proof for and it get's tiring wondering what we can do to the system to make it easier. How hard is it to double check your lineup?

You don't leave the page on CBS, you stay on the roster page, it shows all your starters and at the top SAYS it's illegal, why it's illegal etc etc. So yes it "saved" the lineup even though it was illegal but it keeps you on the roster page even after such a move.my point of the thread though was not to bash/ rehash how bad cbs, is mfl is better. I know other sites would not have allowed this to get this far. My question was is ZERO "fair", if I gave the guy his 2 lowest starting rb's doesn't that possibly open up other issues. What if his 2 lowest players still give him a W anyway. No one has said anything yet but I will be sending out an email for 2012 changes. Just crappy all the way around.

 

[Novice2]

I'm guessing it's start 2 RBs / 2 WRs?If so maybe you could count his lowest two scoring RBs in his starting lineup and his one WR? That would be my thought.

/thread

 

[Reepicheep]

I'm guessing it's start 2 RBs / 2 WRs?If so maybe you could count his lowest two scoring RBs in his starting lineup and his one WR? That would be my thought.

/thread

I agree. To generalize the principle:Score the worst possible legal lineup from the started players. To me it doesn't seem fair to the rest of the league if the opponent gets an automatic win.

 

[MIMN]

If you want to let the owner get some points then I would remove the top scoring RB and NOT replace that position with a WR. I think a zero for the week if fair since that is what the rules say.

For those obsessed with how this can happen...CBS add/drops will put the added player in the starting roster even if illegal. I have this happen when waivers run all the time. I "think" that you can't manually set an illegal lineup and save it (at least it used to be).

 

[unckeyherb]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

I'm not going to defend CBS because much of what you say is accurate, but also wondering to what extent does a system have to "cover" for an individual. I get it that this sounds like a one time mistake, but if this guy really cares, I bet he doesn't make the same mistake again after taking the loss and zero points. I may be a bit jaded because we have "one of those guys" in our league that I feel like we're always trying to make things idiot proof for and it get's tiring wondering what we can do to the system to make it easier. How hard is it to double check your lineup?

You don't leave the page on CBS, you stay on the roster page, it shows all your starters and at the top SAYS it's illegal, why it's illegal etc etc. So yes it "saved" the lineup even though it was illegal but it keeps you on the roster page even after such a move.my point of the thread though was not to bash/ rehash how bad cbs, is mfl is better. I know other sites would not have allowed this to get this far. My question was is ZERO "fair", if I gave the guy his 2 lowest starting rb's doesn't that possibly open up other issues. What if his 2 lowest players still give him a W anyway. No one has said anything yet but I will be sending out an email for 2012 changes. Just crappy all the way around.

I guess I just don't understand. If the site acknowledges that its an illegal roster, to the point of noting whats illegal about it, why not just make it impossible to start that lineup? Seems like a ridiculous thing to hang the guy out if he fills out his lineup, misses the note up top that he screwed something up and started his team. You said somr of the guys are not very computer savvy, its quite possible that he missed it. I assume you can set up the lineup via smartphone? Is it possible that this guy filled out his lineup and literally couldn't see the warning at the top of the page that it was illegal? wouldn't this all go away if it was simply not possible to do this? Anyways, I'd say take his lineup, remove the middle scorer of his three illegal RBs and be done with it. FWIW, we institute $5 fines anytime someone starts a player on a bye, IR's or deemed out prior to gametime. GT decisions are not fined. Not the same thing exactly, but this has curbed lazy managers keeping their lineups in from the previous week...

 

[belljr]

If you want to let the owner get some points then I would remove the top scoring RB and NOT replace that position with a WR. I think a zero for the week if fair since that is what the rules say.

For those obsessed with how this can happen...CBS add/drops will put the added player in the starting roster even if illegal. I have this happen when waivers run all the time. I "think" that you can't manually set an illegal lineup and save it (at least it used to be).

No you can, and I agree it's dumb. However this is the first time since using CBS (11 years now) that anyone has ever left an illegal lineup set.

 

[The Rook]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

Not to beat a dead horse but I really can't fathom why they (CBS FF website authors) decided to make it possible to put a player in a roster slot he doesn't qualify for. I mean it just makes no sense at all.

They didn't. He just has 3 rb's active. I know what you are saying though it seems like something easily fixed on their end

3 active RB's equals an illegal roster, hence the message, right? Why is it possible to even make that selection? Seems dumb to me. We use RTS and if you try to do something like that it kicks you back to your lineup page. No possibility of this whatsoever-get a new site that doesn't suck.

I'm not going to defend CBS because much of what you say is accurate, but also wondering to what extent does a system have to "cover" for an individual. I get it that this sounds like a one time mistake, but if this guy really cares, I bet he doesn't make the same mistake again after taking the loss and zero points. I may be a bit jaded because we have "one of those guys" in our league that I feel like we're always trying to make things idiot proof for and it get's tiring wondering what we can do to the system to make it easier. How hard is it to double check your lineup?

You don't leave the page on CBS, you stay on the roster page, it shows all your starters and at the top SAYS it's illegal, why it's illegal etc etc. So yes it "saved" the lineup even though it was illegal but it keeps you on the roster page even after such a move.my point of the thread though was not to bash/ rehash how bad cbs, is mfl is better. I know other sites would not have allowed this to get this far. My question was is ZERO "fair", if I gave the guy his 2 lowest starting rb's doesn't that possibly open up other issues. What if his 2 lowest players still give him a W anyway. No one has said anything yet but I will be sending out an email for 2012 changes. Just crappy all the way around.

In my opinion, yes zero is fair. And you are correct if you try to tinker with his lineup after the fact it opens up other issues. I think in one of your other comments you said this has never happened before. I'm guessing it won't ever happen again because no one wants to take a zero. This can just be a reminder to everyone to take a few seconds and double check your lineup.

 

[belljr]

Forget the website etc, I'll look into maybe changing.

I spoke with most league parties and the 2 teams involved. BOTH teams were cool and said whatever is decided is fine. The guy that messed up WAS/IS fully ready to get zero.

The team the illegal lineup face said he deserved to lose anyway because of how bad his team did.

Most of the league pretty much said it's ZERO. The main reason was this is not a new site , we have all been doing this for years, there has to be some personal resonsibility, etc. They all understood and gave alternatives but said zero was right It sucks but it is what it is.

Anyway so this year we're rolling with the zero and may look to changing it for next year. Thanks for some ideas.

One idea that I think I'm leaning is, instead of throwing out the highest play is giving a ZERO for the illegal position. So in my example - he would get zero for all rb's played and obviously another zero since he started 1 wr.

This way it's a harsh penalty for mesing up but does allow him to accrue points for is other positions and still possibly win.

 

[The Rook]

Forget the website etc, I'll look into maybe changing.I spoke with most league parties and the 2 teams involved. BOTH teams were cool and said whatever is decided is fine. The guy that messed up WAS/IS fully ready to get zero.The team the illegal lineup face said he deserved to lose anyway because of how bad his team did.Most of the league pretty much said it's ZERO. The main reason was this is not a new site , we have all been doing this for years, there has to be some personal resonsibility, etc. They all understood and gave alternatives but said zero was right It sucks but it is what it is.Anyway so this year we're rolling with the zero and may look to changing it for next year. Thanks for some ideas.One idea that I think I'm leaning is, instead of throwing out the highest play is giving a ZERO for the illegal position. So in my example - he would get zero for all rb's played and obviously another zero since he started 1 wr.This way it's a harsh penalty for mesing up but does allow him to accrue points for is other positions and still possibly win.

Sounds like you have alot of reasonable people involved. I'd enjoy the fact you have great owners and leave it as is... You probably won't have to deal with it again for another 10+ years

 

[Genester]

[ffa] I recommend a double electric fence to prevent illegal lineups from happening [/ffa]Seriously, though, I think the worst 2 RB method is the way to go. Give a 0 for the 2nd WR spot.-QG

 

[Hoosier16]

One idea that I think I'm leaning is, instead of throwing out the highest play is giving a ZERO for the illegal position. So in my example - he would get zero for all rb's played and obviously another zero since he started 1 wr.

Scoring the lowest 2 RBs seems the most fair for an honest mistake but if you want it to be punitive as well, then scoring zero for the entire RB position is fair. However, there isn't any reason to score a zero for the WR position. If he is allowed to start a player on 'bye', then it is no different than just starting one WR.

 

[Instinctive]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

My question as well

 

[Righetti]

how does the software even allow him to start 3 rbs?

Good question but other than YOU HAVE AN ILLEGAL ROSTER MESSAGE. They should probbaly not even allow it to save.

maybe it was based on a trade/waiver pickup where the guy was automatically entered into his lineup so there was no 'save' per se