Darren McFadden and Michael Bush (1 Viewer)

[kremenull]

What no has talked about is that the Raiders finally have an offensive coordinator. Tom Cable couldn't call a game to save his life. Now we have Hue Jackson as the new OC, who came over from Baltimore and was responsible for that team's offensive emergence. Hue Jackson brings some grit and is a very vocal leader. The OTA's are the most colorful in years and he is getting the offense and defense into skirmishes. He is going to bring some nasty attitutde to the team. Already DHB is progressing well, and while it's too early to evaluate this team, it looks light years ahead of Cable's "remedial education of how not to commit penalties, no contact" camps that he had early last year. Hue Jackson = huge action.

Yeah, it was mainly him, but also mainly Cam Cameron. (Flight of the Conchords reference in case anyone thinks I'm r3t@rd3d for using mainly twice).

Cameron, Rice, Flacco, etc.- there were plenty of people more important to the Ravens offensive emergence than their QB coach. Don't get me wrong, he has to be an upgrade for Oakland, but it's not like he's some guru. He'll help, but he alone isn't going to transform them into an offensive powerhouse overnight.As for Bush, a 4.6 career YPC (on an admittedly smallish sample) is certainly showing something, especially considering the situation he was in. He's certainly shown more than McFadden at this point.

Yeah, being amongst the next wave of emerging talents who are in line for an NFL head coaching position sure sounds like an insignificant piece to the team's success.Meet Hue Jackson, a star on the rise, soon-to-be NFL Head Coach, and the man primarly responsible for Flacco's quick development.....in case u didn't know.

Raiders will be dramatically improved on offense (and defense) and will be in the championship hunt in 2010.

Grape is ny favorite Kool-Aid.......

You keep thinking that about Jackson if you'd like. He's such a "star on the rise" that so many teams were beating down his door, offering their head coaching job to him, right? It's not like the offensive coordinator position for the Raider's is one of the most coveted jobs in the league right now.This is his 3rd OC gig, his previous two he's held the position for 1 season, and settled for a lesser position with a new team the following season- it's not like he moved on to bigger, better things. His previous two teams have both finished 23rd in total offense (Atlanta was actually 23rd in yards, 29th in points in his season there). Not a stellar track record.

Don't get me wrong, I like Jackson and he is an improvement for Oakland. I also think that the Raiders should be better this season. All I'm saying is, he wasn't the main reason for Baltimore's success on offense. In case you didn't know.

Yeah, and all those experiences can only benefit him, I would think. Look, I'm not saying that any one person is primarily responsible for a team's success, but on the other hand let's not minimize his contribution, either. Jackson also know that if he can drastically improve the Raiders offense, which has been mired in futility for the past few years, then he will also receive a ton of credit, and again, it will not be entirely his doing in this case, either, but he will be a pretty significant 'player'. It just amazes me how people seem to overlook that there is quite a bit of talent on offense to work with in Oakland, and they will be very interesting to watch this season. And a lot of NFL insider eyes will be on Hue Jackson as well......

No biggie man, your position is well taken and understood.....

 

[Stinkin Ref]

You know. I don't think I've owned a single Raider in the past 3 or 4 seasons.I still think they could both play roles as an RB3. Lately, I've thought of Oakland backs as matchup fill ins. It always seemed like someone was hurt, meaning one of the other backs would get all of the carries. Having said all that, I think I'll shying away from the Oakland backfield again this year.Thanks for the link!

same here...I have pretty much stayed away from this train wreck....and let's be honest....neither of these guys could keep Justin freakin Fargas off the field...these are the type of guys I love seeing my leaguemates draft....if I miss out on a breakout from one of these guys, then so be it....

 

[Stinkin Ref]

wow...went back and actually read most of this thread....kinda surprised by all the love in here for these guys....people are expecting some pretty serious improvements here and I just don't see it.......these guys couldn't keep Fargas off the field....and the RBBC approach pretty much means the staff doesn't have the confidence in either of them to be "the man".....

speaking of that, has Fargas signed anywhere....?....cause if not, wouldn't surprise me in the least to see OAK bring him back and things go back to the way they have been..........

 

[massraider]

wow...went back and actually read most of this thread....kinda surprised by all the love in here for these guys....people are expecting some pretty serious improvements here and I just don't see it.......these guys couldn't keep Fargas off the field....and the RBBC approach pretty much means the staff doesn't have the confidence in either of them to be "the man".....

I am not bothered by the RBBC. Most teams use a two-back system, not sure why the Raiders use of it shows a lack of confidence in the players. And it's not like they don't bring different things to the table. My concerns are DMC's lack of balance, and health, and Bush not being able to handle more than 2 carries without looking for a breather. Last year, they didn't use DMC enough in the passing game, and when they did, JaMarcus would miss him, or put it in a spot where he couldn't make anything happen. And defenses sold out on the run, so the inside wasn't there.I could see both being decent RB3 in fantasy this year, but more than that from either one would surprise me.

 

[zamboni]

It's been said in some capacity, but what concerns me about Bush is that Cable does not appear to be fully in his corner, while team brass - for obvious financial/draft reasons - is probably going to give McFadden every chance to be the guy they drafted in the top 5.

It seemed as though the opportunity for Bush was there last year when Fargas went down, and McFadden wasn't playing that well. But Cable never seemed to stay with Bush. Whether it's the often-discussed issue of Bush asking out or some other reasons, the limited number of carries Bush received certainly didn't indicate a lot of confidence.

Maybe it will be a different story this year, but one could say the same thing about McFadden. If one of the guys gets hurt, then clearly that could be a gold mine. But as of now, I would draft one or both as a project flier, as opposed to expectations of depending on either.

 

[sholditch]

The only reason that people bring up Cable's earlier statements is that he could have said a lot of different things, none of which would have pointed to a definite offseason plan. But he clearly stated that he wanted one feature back and not a committee. The fact that he is now changing his tune to a RBBC means he didn't get what he was looking for.

Two ways to look at it are Cable saw two very different backs that were both good at very different things, and couldn't see a way to not utilize both. The other way to look at it is that he didn't see what he wanted to see in either one of them.

 

[massraider]

The only reason that people bring up Cable's earlier statements is that he could have said a lot of different things, none of which would have pointed to a definite offseason plan. But he clearly stated that he wanted one feature back and not a committee. The fact that he is now changing his tune to a RBBC means he didn't get what he was looking for.

Two ways to look at it are Cable saw two very different backs that were both good at very different things, and couldn't see a way to not utilize both. The other way to look at it is that he didn't see what he wanted to see in either one of them.

I simply think too many people are reading way too much into it. He has said consistently since he was hired last year that he was going with all the backs. One comment in May sure is being analyzed. Actually, here's the real question: Cable has done a complete 180 on his backs, and decided that neither can handle the load, after two minicamps in shorts? What did he see in those camps that he hadn't seen in the last two years watching them in the games? Training camp I could see. But these guys aren't hitting, they are basically learning the offense, but people are concluding that Cable figured out in 6 glorified walkthroughs that neither could handle the load? I don't believe it. I think Cable was always going to use both backs. I don't think a coaches comment in May is sworn gospel, and I sure don't think the team deciding to do what they have already done for years is an indictment of the players.

Maybe this'll work if I also get some negative reports about both players. And I haven't. The minicamp reports have all been about the things that you can look at in minicamp, the QB and WRs.

I blame Lammey and Bloom for this, idle speculation on their podcast.

 

[socrates]

It's been said in some capacity, but what concerns me about Bush is that Cable does not appear to be fully in his corner, while team brass - for obvious financial/draft reasons - is probably going to give McFadden every chance to be the guy they drafted in the top 5. It seemed as though the opportunity for Bush was there last year when Fargas went down, and McFadden wasn't playing that well. But Cable never seemed to stay with Bush. Whether it's the often-discussed issue of Bush asking out or some other reasons, the limited number of carries Bush received certainly didn't indicate a lot of confidence.Maybe it will be a different story this year, but one could say the same thing about McFadden. If one of the guys gets hurt, then clearly that could be a gold mine. But as of now, I would draft one or both as a project flier, as opposed to expectations of depending on either.

Either or both of these guys could be worth a late-round investment, as you say. Expecting either to step in and contribute meaningfully to your fantasy success would be foolish. Neither projects as a viable fantasy starter at this point. Depending on roster size, either player could be a good stash-and-monitor type of back.

 

[humpback]

Yeah, being amongst the next wave of emerging talents who are in line for an NFL head coaching position sure sounds like an insignificant piece to the team's success.Meet Hue Jackson, a star on the rise, soon-to-be NFL Head Coach, and the man primarly responsible for Flacco's quick development.....in case u didn't know.Raiders will be dramatically improved on offense (and defense) and will be in the championship hunt in 2010.Grape is ny favorite Kool-Aid.......

You keep thinking that about Jackson if you'd like. He's such a "star on the rise" that so many teams were beating down his door, offering their head coaching job to him, right? It's not like the offensive coordinator position for the Raider's is one of the most coveted jobs in the league right now.This is his 3rd OC gig, his previous two he's held the position for 1 season, and settled for a lesser position with a new team the following season- it's not like he moved on to bigger, better things. His previous two teams have both finished 23rd in total offense (Atlanta was actually 23rd in yards, 29th in points in his season there). Not a stellar track record.Don't get me wrong, I like Jackson and he is an improvement for Oakland. I also think that the Raiders should be better this season. All I'm saying is, he wasn't the main reason for Baltimore's success on offense. In case you didn't know.

Yeah, and all those experiences can only benefit him, I would think. Look, I'm not saying that any one person is primarily responsible for a team's success, but on the other hand let's not minimize his contribution, either. Jackson also know that if he can drastically improve the Raiders offense, which has been mired in futility for the past few years, then he will also receive a ton of credit, and again, it will not be entirely his doing in this case, either, but he will be a pretty significant 'player'. It just amazes me how people seem to overlook that there is quite a bit of talent on offense to work with in Oakland, and they will be very interesting to watch this season. And a lot of NFL insider eyes will be on Hue Jackson as well......No biggie man, your position is well taken and understood.....

Like I said, I actually like Jackson, I was just responding to the quote that he was responsible for the Raven's offensive emergence. He did a good job in his role with Baltimore, and he does deserve some credit, but saying he's responsible for their success is going overboard. I don't think I'm minimizing his contribution at all by saying he's behind Cameron, Flacco, and Rice in the pecking order for that credit either.I do think it was a good decision to go to Oakland- they've been underperforming lately and have a better QB, so if he can just get them to play decently, it'll look good for him. They have no place to go but up. Plus, if they don't, he might be next in line to be the interim coach if they falter and Cable gets canned mid season.