Edelman fumble recovery for a TD (1 Viewer)

[HULLOBUDMAN]

To the OP:

I don't necessarily like going to a vote for decisions like this becasue typically you have 3 types of people involved in the voting. The peole who benefit if he gets it. The people that benefit if he doesn't get it. Finally the people who are out of it and get swayed to vote for the way the benefits a buddy. I have commished for a number of years and did the vote thing in the past. It was a horrible mistake that nearly ruined the league. Being the commish is a thankless job and it sucks to be put in this type of situation. I think you did the right thing trying to get opinion from completely uninterested parties. Hopefully you can weed out the BS in this thread and it does you some type of benefit. Whatever your decision, craft a rule in the offseason that you have unilateral control to make a decision or that the rule can't change during the season.

BTW, the ignore function works great on the website.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[T J]

How has this not come up? Jacoby Jones has scored TD's on special teams as has Randal Cobb. Have they been awarded TD points for that? If so you have your answer. If not you can't just change the scoring format at the very end of the year.

Jacoby Jones has never been started, but regardless he and Randall Cobb's TDs are awarded under "punt/kickoff retrun for TD = 6pts plus .04pts per return yard. The question here is the defensive nature of the TD scored. It's not the same as a basic return. What if Edelman had returned an interception for a TD? Does he get 6pts? He does play some DB also. I'm personally inclined to say yes even though we do not play IDP..

No. It's defense.

So just curious, if Randall Cobb scores a TD on kickoff or punt return, who gets the points by your line of thought? Special teams only I have to assume given your logic, which if so, I view as ludicrous. Cobb individually should get his AND the special teams should get 6. I cannot imagine that being scored any other way. And that is definitely how our league scores it.

 

[unckeyherb]

Why would he get points for that? Your rules state that its a defensive/st td. He's on the ST. That 'player' (team defense /ST) gets the td. Pretty simple really. Not sure how you can modify a scoring rule like that in week 11. 10 weeks of scoring have happened based on your current rules. As commish its your job to stay out of the way as much as possible. Dicking with the scoring rules is the opposite of that.

Because you started him as an individual at WR who managed to get a TD a non traditional way, what is so dang hard to understand?

Because the scoring rules give team defense/ST points for that play. Obviously the rules need to be changed in order to award points to an individual. If the league wants to do the scoring that way, fine. I disagree with it but to each his own. Point is he's proposing a midseason rule change that directly affects how points get scored. Does he plan on retroactively going back each week and checking if this has happened before and if so is he going to add points, possibly changing the outcome of games? Either way you can't do it IMO.

 

[DropKick]

Thanks for the feedback.I do find it interesting that the consensus is to not award the individual player a TD. I feel the opposite, but no worries.

I think there's two categories of scoring involved in special teams (edit: well, three counting place kickers). Kick returner points (yards and TDs), and defensive acts. Edelman's was a defensive act. If your league chose not to give individuals points for any of the other defensive acts that are normally considered point worthy, I think consistency says you don't give points for the defensive TD.At least until your league decides to change the rule in the off season.

I understand. Just seems counter intuitive to me that a TD scored, regardless how, is potentially not awarded to the player scoring it.

Not counter intuitive at all when you recognize the team D/ST as a unit. Simple as that!

 

[Sea Duck]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

 

[unckeyherb]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

I happen to agree, but plenty of others do not.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

 

[unckeyherb]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

So I'll ask my question again. Are going to go back and see if this situation has happened before, and if so are you going to retroactively change scores? The lack of a rule as you put it IS the rule until the season is over. 3/4 of the season has been played. If I tried to do what you are proposing my league-mates would kill me.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

So I'll ask my question again. Are going to go back and see if this situation has happened before, and if so are you going to retroactively change scores? The lack of a rule as you put it IS the rule until the season is over. 3/4 of the season has been played. If I tried to do what you are proposing my league-mates would kill me.

We do have a rule saying that all scores are final at the start of the next week's games so the time to protest scoring is well-defined. The fact of the matter though is it's a fairly rare occurrence where the situation could even be called into question. In this instance it did happen and it was called into question by the Edelman owner. My own philosophy regarding fantasy football scoring has always been if there were a TD scored by an individual on someone's roster, regardless how it was scored, that player should get the points, and that overlap with team D or ST is fine.

I'm letting the league decide via vote. The parties involved all agreed to abide by the outcome, but I will say that if it were my decision alone, I would absolutely award Edelman the points. But I also recognize that my opinion means diddly when commishing a league. I have to go by what's best for the league and in this case, it's to let the other owners decide how they want this handled via a vote.

 

[GregR]

How has this not come up? Jacoby Jones has scored TD's on special teams as has Randal Cobb. Have they been awarded TD points for that? If so you have your answer. If not you can't just change the scoring format at the very end of the year.

Jacoby Jones has never been started, but regardless he and Randall Cobb's TDs are awarded under "punt/kickoff retrun for TD = 6pts plus .04pts per return yard. The question here is the defensive nature of the TD scored. It's not the same as a basic return. What if Edelman had returned an interception for a TD? Does he get 6pts? He does play some DB also. I'm personally inclined to say yes even though we do not play IDP..

No. It's defense.

So just curious, if Randall Cobb scores a TD on kickoff or punt return, who gets the points by your line of thought? Special teams only I have to assume given your logic, which if so, I view as ludicrous. Cobb individually should get his AND the special teams should get 6. I cannot imagine that being scored any other way. And that is definitely how our league scores it.

When Stevie Johnson forced and recovered a fumble, did you give the points for the turnover to both the defense, and to Johnson as an individual too?If not, why the inconsistency?

 

[Witz]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

Asked this earlier -

I know you noted MFL but I imagine it's very similar to CBS Sportsline - the commish rules set up denotes how individual players can score touchdowns (whether rushing, receiving, passing, etc). It also has the ability to count scoring for the individual for punt returns, kick off returns, fumble returns, etc).

How is your system set up on MFL? Did you denote individual TD's for rushing, passing, receiving but not for punt returns, fumble returns, kickoffs? If so, you have your answer.

Depending on how you set up the scoring in your league, you do already have a rule in place whether you agree with it or not.

 

[T J]

How has this not come up? Jacoby Jones has scored TD's on special teams as has Randal Cobb. Have they been awarded TD points for that? If so you have your answer. If not you can't just change the scoring format at the very end of the year.

Jacoby Jones has never been started, but regardless he and Randall Cobb's TDs are awarded under "punt/kickoff retrun for TD = 6pts plus .04pts per return yard. The question here is the defensive nature of the TD scored. It's not the same as a basic return. What if Edelman had returned an interception for a TD? Does he get 6pts? He does play some DB also. I'm personally inclined to say yes even though we do not play IDP..

No. It's defense.

So just curious, if Randall Cobb scores a TD on kickoff or punt return, who gets the points by your line of thought? Special teams only I have to assume given your logic, which if so, I view as ludicrous. Cobb individually should get his AND the special teams should get 6. I cannot imagine that being scored any other way. And that is definitely how our league scores it.

When Stevie Johnson forced and recovered a fumble, did you give the points for the turnover to both the defense, and to Johnson as an individual too?If not, why the inconsistency?

Why do some leagues score 4pts for a QB TD pass and some score 6pts? No consistency there either. I don't have the answer you want other than to say a TD is different than a forced fumble or fumble recovery. It just is. Fantasy football is great in that every league has the flexibility to view and score things as it pleases.

 

[GregR]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

You have a scoring system that was set up in the website. That people can expect will be used in good faith throughout the season without being changed midstream after they have made decisions during the draft, and waivers and during trades. There is no imperative about this situation that rules need to be written to handle it. You have a scoring system that is set already for the season, and it handles the situation, by awarding points to the fantasy positions it was designated to.You say there is no rule being changed, but if you're changing or adding to the scoring system you are certainly changing important rules the league is playing under. The only way scoring rules should be changed or introduced mid year is with a unanimous vote.

This part isn't a matter of difference of opinion. Changing scoring mid-year is wrong. It's a bad move for a commissioner to make. And it's a much worse move for a commissioner to make when his team is one that benefits.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

Asked this earlier -

I know you noted MFL but I imagine it's very similar to CBS Sportsline - the commish rules set up denotes how individual players can score touchdowns (whether rushing, receiving, passing, etc). It also has the ability to count scoring for the individual for punt returns, kick off returns, fumble returns, etc).

How is your system set up on MFL? Did you denote individual TD's for rushing, passing, receiving but not for punt returns, fumble returns, kickoffs? If so, you have your answer.

Depending on how you set up the scoring in your league, you do already have a rule in place whether you agree with it or not.

Heck, I set up the scoring myself. If I thought for one second before the season started that I would have needed to stipulate it a certain way, I would have then. I do not agree that the lack of doing so then negates the ability or necessity to clarify it now, when this is the only time it's come up and will not affect anything retroactively.

 

[Hopeless Lions Fan]

Help me out here, but this about my legaue scoring, not the OP. We score for team DEF TD's, not ST TD's. I have the NE DEF and got the points on Edelman's TD. Wasn't he on special teams, or was that defense?

I know, it sounds like a total noob question.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

I maintain that there is no rule being changed. There just isn't one to begin with. The lack of a rule does not, in my estimation, lend itself to being predisposed one way or the other.

You have a scoring system that was set up in the website. That people can expect will be used in good faith throughout the season without being changed midstream after they have made decisions during the draft, and waivers and during trades. There is no imperative about this situation that rules need to be written to handle it. You have a scoring system that is set already for the season, and it handles the situation, by awarding points to the fantasy positions it was designated to.You say there is no rule being changed, but if you're changing or adding to the scoring system you are certainly changing important rules the league is playing under. The only way scoring rules should be changed or introduced mid year is with a unanimous vote.

This part isn't a matter of difference of opinion. Changing scoring mid-year is wrong. It's a bad move for a commissioner to make. And it's a much worse move for a commissioner to make when his team is one that benefits.

I agree with everything you said, except, you waaaay over emphasize this particular scoring scenario. It's happened once all year - this week. So to say people have made draft decisions, waiver moves, etc..just isn't accurate relative to this one specific,instance which is highly unlikely to occur again this season. And I might add, I do not benefit at all from this. Not one bit. The team in question is not mine and any playoff implications do not affect me either. I've had a tough year and am eliminated from playoff contention. We will not be doing unanimous. Simple majority as this decision has no retroactive impact.

 

[T J]

Help me out here, but this about my legaue scoring, not the OP. We score for team DEF TD's, not ST TD's. I have the NE DEF and got the points on Edelman's TD. Wasn't he on special teams, or was that defense?I know, it sounds like a total noob question.

It's considered a defensive TD.

 

[GregR]

Sorry, I guess I misread or misremembered, that your team was somehow involved. Nothing personal intended.

Still, I would not add a new scoring rule. The only scoring change I could fathom making mid-season (without a unanimous vote), would be if the system on the website contained an error so it did not match our written rules. I would not add to the written rules.

Adding a scoring system rule and giving out points after the fact is particularly bad. At the end of the season I'd walk away from a league that did that.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

Help me out here, but this about my legaue scoring, not the OP. We score for team DEF TD's, not ST TD's. I have the NE DEF and got the points on Edelman's TD. Wasn't he on special teams, or was that defense?I know, it sounds like a total noob question.

It's considered a defensive TD.

And your league awards defensive points to the team defense, not to individual defenders. It's mind boggling to me that this is even an issue. Your league rules are not silent on this issue. It's not like your league has no idea how to score defensive TDs. You do it all the time, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense. It's a total red herring that the defender in this instance also happens to play offense.

 

[T J]

Sorry, I guess I misread or misremembered, that your team was somehow involved. Nothing personal intended.Still, I would not add a new scoring rule. The only scoring change I could fathom making mid-season (without a unanimous vote), would be if the system on the website contained an error so it did not match our written rules. I would not add to the written rules.Adding a scoring system rule and giving out points after the fact is particularly bad. At the end of the season I'd walk away from a league that did that.

I understand. I think the guys in our league know I'm trying to do the right thing given the silence of the rule. The voting is currently 6-2 against awarding points. 14 man league and I'm abstaining so one more vote seals the deal. No points. This will not be ambiguous next year.

 

[boonesfarm4me]

Actually this happened to me twice this year Edelman's and earlier this season Garçon recovered a fumble from a teammate in the end zone.

My league rules are it must be a rushing, receiving, punt or kickoff return TD for points to be awarded.. I think this is the way it should be and the DST gets the points.

 

[Sea Duck]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

1. there's no law against changing the rules halfway through the season.2. there is a difference between "changing an existing rule" and "adding a new rule because the existing rules don't cover the scenario".

3. so what if the TEAM already gets the points? What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs....why not on Defensive TDs too?

 

[Sea Duck]

Actually this happened to me twice this year Edelman's and earlier this season Garçon recovered a fumble from a teammate in the end zone. My league rules are it must be a rushing, receiving, punt or kickoff return TD for points to be awarded.. I think this is the way it should be and the DST gets the points.

So you don't have a problem with the DST getting points for an offensive touchdown?

 

[Sea Duck]

Depending on how you set up the scoring in your league, you do already have a rule in place whether you agree with it or not.

I don't think that's the case for MFL. I just checked their list of scoring options and "Individual Special Teams Fumble Return TD" is not one of the options.

 

[T J]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

1. there's no law against changing the rules halfway through the season.2. there is a difference between "changing an existing rule" and "adding a new rule because the existing rules don't cover the scenario".

3. so what if the TEAM already gets the points? What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs....why not on Defensive TDs too?

I agree with all this. But as there are 13 other owners in the league, what I think and what direction we end up going are maybe two different things.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

 

[kegger]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

In basically 75% of the leagues I'm in, there Def/St gets points for kick return TD's as does the individual player, some get yardage to.(I'd say more leagues give them to both then to just the Def/St do)I'm all for whatever players do they gets points for, and if the points go to two or multiple places/players I see no problem with that at all.It's just tough to make a call to give them out During a season unless previously specified players get points for whatever they do on the field.(If a vote agreed that "all points" count then I'd be fine with that there).

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

Please stop using the carriage return. HTH TIA

 

[Phenix]

Actually this happened to me twice this year Edelman's and earlier this season Garçon recovered a fumble from a teammate in the end zone. My league rules are it must be a rushing, receiving, punt or kickoff return TD for points to be awarded.. I think this is the way it should be and the DST gets the points.

Even though a guy who you started gets a TD?Why is everyone so spent on its a DEf/Sp Teams score?So who cares. When a QB scores a TD through the air, a WR gets a TD too. If you start both you get credit for both, yet that is double dipping. Actually looking at most of the comments, just like some are saying this guy has to have Edelmen on the team to defend this. I think most against this are playing against Edelmen. and if you deny it, we will be very educated like most of you and say "sure you are not playing against him."Edelmen should get 2 TDs because he scored 2, again what is so hard to understand about this?

 

[Phenix]

Help me out here, but this about my legaue scoring, not the OP. We score for team DEF TD's, not ST TD's. I have the NE DEF and got the points on Edelman's TD. Wasn't he on special teams, or was that defense?I know, it sounds like a total noob question.

It's considered a defensive TD.

And your league awards defensive points to the team defense, not to individual defenders. It's mind boggling to me that this is even an issue. Your league rules are not silent on this issue. It's not like your league has no idea how to score defensive TDs. You do it all the time, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense. It's a total red herring that the defender in this instance also happens to play offense.

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count. You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?Pathetic, really.Can we get some non bias people in here?

 

[Phenix]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

If anyone will be bent if Edelmen does get credit... it will be you, your opinion that I'm reading borders on comical.In my opinion, you are wrong, almost embarrassingly wrong.

I play in 12 leagues, all but one gets credit for both return TDs for player and D/ST in 11 out of my 12 leagues? Yup that's very few leagues that count for both from personal experience. You are talking out yer ###.

Don't worry dude, if Edelmen was gonna get credit he would of gotten it already. Your safe, your still gonna get the win.

 

[pantagrapher]

The question here is the defensive nature of the TD scored. It's not the same as a basic return. What if Edelman had returned an interception for a TD? Does he get 6pts? He does play some DB also. I'm personally inclined to say yes even though we do not play IDP.

Of course Edelman wouldn't get the points for an interception. You just said yourself that you score points for team defense:

Team Defense, yes. Not Special Teams. New England D did get 6pts awarded for the TD plus another 2 for the fumble recovery - that was MFL scoring.

A fumble recovery TD is a defensive TD. You don't award defensive points to individuals, you award them to the team defense. That's why the New England D got the points for the fumble recovery and the TD. In fact, I'm sure this has happened before and it never raised an eyebrow. Now all of a sudden, simply because Edelman also plays WR, you want to reinterpret the way your scoring system has always worked? If you want to change the rule for next year it's worth discussing with the league, but you can't arbitrarily decide to award Edelman the six points in this case just because he also happens to play WR.

 

[unckeyherb]

My belief is that if a player scores points, then he should get credit for those points. It doesn't matter how he scored them.

That's fine if those are the rules. But as has been pointed out the TEAM defense ST gets the points. I don't understand what the argument is here. You can't change rules halfway through the season.

1. there's no law against changing the rules halfway through the season. There should be if the change affects how a game is scored. Do you seriously not see an issue with this? 2. there is a difference between "changing an existing rule" and "adding a new rule because the existing rules don't cover the scenario". That isn't the case here. There is a rule. The OP doesn't agree with it, but there is certainly a rule. If it was not scored by a guy that also happens to play WR, the points would still be awarded to ST/Def. So, he is not adding a new rule where one doesn't exist. You are 180 degrees on this one.

3. so what if the TEAM already gets the points? What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs....why not on Defensive TDs too? Because 10 weeks have been played based on this scoring situation! That this scenario happens infrequently doesn't negate the impact it could have. I really can't believe this is not clear to everyone-I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Changing scoring rules halfway through the season is a terrible commish move, sets a terrible precedent and has no positive outcome-other than benefiting specific teams and hurting others.

 

[T J]

I'm going to agree to disagree with those who feel that Edelman should not get the points and will seek that inclusion in the off-season. Best I can do as far as this thread is concerned.

Our league has cast a majority vote that those points should not count and that's fine. I disagree with it, but ok by me. That's the way it goes. I do stand by my belief that a TD is a TD however it came about and if an owner derives benefit from that, then power to 'em. And again, it wasn't me. I was actually playing against Edelman but still feel this way.

And for further clarity, I also disagree with those that think that awarding Edelman those points for this one-time event constitutes a mid-season rule change. I genuinely do not believe that to be the case. I believe it to be establishing a rule for the first time for an unforeseen circumstance that required a rule to be made on the fly. And now we have one. No points.

See how easy that was?

 

[unckeyherb]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

If anyone will be bent if Edelmen does get credit... it will be you, your opinion that I'm reading borders on comical.In my opinion, you are wrong, almost embarrassingly wrong.

I play in 12 leagues, all but one gets credit for both return TDs for player and D/ST in 11 out of my 12 leagues? Yup that's very few leagues that count for both from personal experience. You are talking out yer ###.

Don't worry dude, if Edelmen was gonna get credit he would of gotten it already. Your safe, your still gonna get the win.

Do you not see the issue with changing rules halfway through the season? Serious question.

 

[unckeyherb]

I'm going to agree to disagree with those who feel that Edelman should not get the points and will seek that inclusion in the off-season. Best I can do as far as this thread is concerned.

Our league has cast a majority vote that those points should not count and that's fine. I disagree with it, but ok by me. That's the way it goes. I do stand by my belief that a TD is a TD however it came about and if an owner derives benefit from that, then power to 'em. And again, it wasn't me. I was actually playing against Edelman but still feel this way.

And for further clarity, I also disagree with those that think that awarding Edelman those points for this one-time event constitutes a mid-season rule change. I genuinely do not believe that to be the case. I believe it to be establishing a rule for the first time for an unforeseen circumstance that required a rule to be made on the fly. And now we have one. No points.

See how easy that was?

I mean this has to be schtick. There's no way you can believe that instituting a NEW MECHANISM to award points to someone in week 11 where that same mechanism was NOT IN PLACE for the last 10 weeks doesn't constitute a mid-season rule change and questions the integrity of the league. I'd find a new league if this was done in mine.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!

I'm not playing Edelman, numbnuts. This is a thread about how a commissioner should rule on a league issue, which is a topic that interests me. I usually weigh in on these kinds of topics, because I was a commissioner for years, not because I coincidentally am facing the player that's featured in all of those threads.

I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count.

Why would that be funny? OP already clearly stated that, according to his league rules, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense, and punt return TDs are awarded to the individual returner. See, what you and your nonoheaded ilk seem to be missing is this isn't an issue of how you'd like defensive TDs to be scored. This is an issue of how they actually are scored, based on his league rules. And that issue is definitively settled. It's a defensive TD, which is awarded to the team defense, just like they've always been awarded in OP's league. If you/he thinks they should also be awarded to the individual returner, that's a great rule he can add in the offseason, not something he can arbitrarily decide to add in week 12.

You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?

1) Please provide a link to a single instance of me ragging on anyone by saying they own Edelman. A single instance will suffice.2) For argument's sake, let's say you were right that I'm facing Edelman (which, as usual, you're not): Why would I care how OP rules in his own league? I would only be interested in how my own league handles it, not how T J from the internet's league handles it.

Pathetic, really.

You're being too hard on yourself.

Can we get some non bias people in here?

It's "biased." Oh, speaking of which:

Since my league decided to only credit me with 1 TD from Edelmen, instead of the 2 he had, is why I find myself sweating until Thursday.

No one cares about you, your teams, your trades or your family.

 

[pantagrapher]

I'm going to agree to disagree with those who feel that Edelman should not get the points and will seek that inclusion in the off-season. Best I can do as far as this thread is concerned.Our league has cast a majority vote that those points should not count and that's fine. I disagree with it, but ok by me. That's the way it goes. I do stand by my belief that a TD is a TD however it came about and if an owner derives benefit from that, then power to 'em. And again, it wasn't me. I was actually playing against Edelman but still feel this way.And for further clarity, I also disagree with those that think that awarding Edelman those points for this one-time event constitutes a mid-season rule change. I genuinely do not believe that to be the case. I believe it to be establishing a rule for the first time for an unforeseen circumstance that required a rule to be made on the fly. And now we have one. No points. See how easy that was?

Do you for once consider the team in your league that you acknowledge would lose his game because of the scoring change you wanted to make? He's sitting there with a win and you want to swoop in and mandate that he lose on a play your current scoring structure doesn't count as an individual TD. If I were that owner, I'd be irate that the commissioner is taking such a strong advocacy position in favor of a scoring change. Something doesn't add up here; luckily, it sounds like the league voted and got it right.

 

[T J]

I'm going to agree to disagree with those who feel that Edelman should not get the points and will seek that inclusion in the off-season. Best I can do as far as this thread is concerned.

Our league has cast a majority vote that those points should not count and that's fine. I disagree with it, but ok by me. That's the way it goes. I do stand by my belief that a TD is a TD however it came about and if an owner derives benefit from that, then power to 'em. And again, it wasn't me. I was actually playing against Edelman but still feel this way.

And for further clarity, I also disagree with those that think that awarding Edelman those points for this one-time event constitutes a mid-season rule change. I genuinely do not believe that to be the case. I believe it to be establishing a rule for the first time for an unforeseen circumstance that required a rule to be made on the fly. And now we have one. No points.

See how easy that was?

I mean this has to be schtick. There's no way you can believe that instituting a NEW MECHANISM to award points to someone in week 11 where that same mechanism was NOT IN PLACE for the last 10 weeks doesn't constitute a mid-season rule change and questions the integrity of the league. I'd find a new league if this was done in mine.

Definitely NOT schtick. I honestly do not believe it would have been a new mechanism. I honestly, and not schtickly, believe that where rules are silent, an interpretation needs to be made if a situation arises that necessitates one. I consider this to be such a case. But hey, we're all entitled to our opinions right?

 

[T J]

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!

I'm not playing Edelman, numbnuts. This is a thread about how a commissioner should rule on a league issue, which is a topic that interests me. I usually weigh in on these kinds of topics, because I was a commissioner for years, not because I coincidentally am facing the player that's featured in all of those threads.

I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count.

Why would that be funny? OP already clearly stated that, according to his league rules, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense, and punt return TDs are awarded to the individual returner. See, what you and your nonoheaded ilk seem to be missing is this isn't an issue of how you'd like defensive TDs to be scored. This is an issue of how they actually are scored, based on his league rules. And that issue is definitively settled. It's a defensive TD, which is awarded to the team defense, just like they've always been awarded in OP's league. If you/he thinks they should also be awarded to the individual returner, that's a great rule he can add in the offseason, not something he can arbitrarily decide to add in week 12.

You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?

1) Please provide a link to a single instance of me ragging on anyone by saying they own Edelman. A single instance will suffice.2) For argument's sake, let's say you were right that I'm facing Edelman (which, as usual, you're not): Why would I care how OP rules in his own league? I would only be interested in how my own league handles it, not how T J from the internet's league handles it.

Pathetic, really.

You're being too hard on yourself.

Can we get some non bias people in here?

It's "biased." Oh, speaking of which:

Since my league decided to only credit me with 1 TD from Edelmen, instead of the 2 he had, is why I find myself sweating until Thursday.

No one cares about you, your teams, your trades or your family.

The issue is settled, but I did want to acknowledge a couple things from your post. The only reason the individual and not the ST is awarded points for a kick/punt return for a TD is because we do not play ST at all. If we did, both would definitely get the points. Also, I'm only advocating on these boards - not in my dealings with the league. I expressed my opinion to the league as any owner has the right to do, then instantly deferred my personal opinions to those of the league via a vote. I even abstained from the vote so to characterize what I'm saying in this thread as me trying to change the rules mid-stream is inaccurate. My actions as relates to the league, I believe, were appropriate despite my personal beliefs expressed in this thread.

Prior to next season, I will certainly be looking to sway owners' opinions to include ANY TD scored to count for the player scoring it - regardless how it's scored.

 

[Phenix]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

If anyone will be bent if Edelmen does get credit... it will be you, your opinion that I'm reading borders on comical.In my opinion, you are wrong, almost embarrassingly wrong.

I play in 12 leagues, all but one gets credit for both return TDs for player and D/ST in 11 out of my 12 leagues? Yup that's very few leagues that count for both from personal experience. You are talking out yer ###.

Don't worry dude, if Edelmen was gonna get credit he would of gotten it already. Your safe, your still gonna get the win.

Do you not see the issue with changing rules halfway through the season? Serious question.

I do not if it is cut and dry, and this seems to be the case.Let me ask you, do you think a player who you started who got you points should not get credit for those points?

That is not the right thing.

 

[Phenix]

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!

I'm not playing Edelman, numbnuts. This is a thread about how a commissioner should rule on a league issue, which is a topic that interests me. I usually weigh in on these kinds of topics, because I was a commissioner for years, not because I coincidentally am facing the player that's featured in all of those threads.

I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count.

Why would that be funny? OP already clearly stated that, according to his league rules, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense, and punt return TDs are awarded to the individual returner. See, what you and your nonoheaded ilk seem to be missing is this isn't an issue of how you'd like defensive TDs to be scored. This is an issue of how they actually are scored, based on his league rules. And that issue is definitively settled. It's a defensive TD, which is awarded to the team defense, just like they've always been awarded in OP's league. If you/he thinks they should also be awarded to the individual returner, that's a great rule he can add in the offseason, not something he can arbitrarily decide to add in week 12.

You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?

1) Please provide a link to a single instance of me ragging on anyone by saying they own Edelman. A single instance will suffice.2) For argument's sake, let's say you were right that I'm facing Edelman (which, as usual, you're not): Why would I care how OP rules in his own league? I would only be interested in how my own league handles it, not how T J from the internet's league handles it.

Pathetic, really.

You're being too hard on yourself.

Can we get some non bias people in here?

It's "biased." Oh, speaking of which:

Since my league decided to only credit me with 1 TD from Edelmen, instead of the 2 he had, is why I find myself sweating until Thursday.

No one cares about you, your teams, your trades or your family.

You have too much time on your hands... get a job and get out off mommas basement!

 

[T J]

I'm going to agree to disagree with those who feel that Edelman should not get the points and will seek that inclusion in the off-season. Best I can do as far as this thread is concerned.Our league has cast a majority vote that those points should not count and that's fine. I disagree with it, but ok by me. That's the way it goes. I do stand by my belief that a TD is a TD however it came about and if an owner derives benefit from that, then power to 'em. And again, it wasn't me. I was actually playing against Edelman but still feel this way.And for further clarity, I also disagree with those that think that awarding Edelman those points for this one-time event constitutes a mid-season rule change. I genuinely do not believe that to be the case. I believe it to be establishing a rule for the first time for an unforeseen circumstance that required a rule to be made on the fly. And now we have one. No points. See how easy that was?

Do you for once consider the team in your league that you acknowledge would lose his game because of the scoring change you wanted to make? He's sitting there with a win and you want to swoop in and mandate that he lose on a play your current scoring structure doesn't count as an individual TD. If I were that owner, I'd be irate that the commissioner is taking such a strong advocacy position in favor of a scoring change. Something doesn't add up here; luckily, it sounds like the league voted and got it right.

In fairness, the other guy is irate that the points do not count. I wasn't looking to swoop in and do anything other than what seemed right. And I did. I let the league decide and they did. As I mentioned in my previous post, what I'm saying in this thread and what I actually did are two different things. I'm merely expressing my opinion here. Where the league is concerned a totally different tact taken.I'm curious though what you mean when you say something doesn't add up. That suggests to me that you think I may have some specific motive or that I benefit in some way if things went the way I beleive they should have. I can assure you, neither is the case. I just genuinely believe everything I've said in this thread and enjoy talking about this stuff.

 

[Phenix]

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!

I'm not playing Edelman, numbnuts. This is a thread about how a commissioner should rule on a league issue, which is a topic that interests me. I usually weigh in on these kinds of topics, because I was a commissioner for years, not because I coincidentally am facing the player that's featured in all of those threads.

I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count.

Why would that be funny? OP already clearly stated that, according to his league rules, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense, and punt return TDs are awarded to the individual returner. See, what you and your nonoheaded ilk seem to be missing is this isn't an issue of how you'd like defensive TDs to be scored. This is an issue of how they actually are scored, based on his league rules. And that issue is definitively settled. It's a defensive TD, which is awarded to the team defense, just like they've always been awarded in OP's league. If you/he thinks they should also be awarded to the individual returner, that's a great rule he can add in the offseason, not something he can arbitrarily decide to add in week 12.

You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?

1) Please provide a link to a single instance of me ragging on anyone by saying they own Edelman. A single instance will suffice.2) For argument's sake, let's say you were right that I'm facing Edelman (which, as usual, you're not): Why would I care how OP rules in his own league? I would only be interested in how my own league handles it, not how T J from the internet's league handles it.

Pathetic, really.

You're being too hard on yourself.

Can we get some non bias people in here?

It's "biased." Oh, speaking of which:

Since my league decided to only credit me with 1 TD from Edelmen, instead of the 2 he had, is why I find myself sweating until Thursday.

No one cares about you, your teams, your trades or your family.

The issue is settled, but I did want to acknowledge a couple things from your post. The only reason the individual and not the ST is awarded points for a kick/punt return for a TD is because we do not play ST at all. If we did, both would definitely get the points. Also, I'm only advocating on these boards - not in my dealings with the league. I expressed my opinion to the league as any owner has the right to do, then instantly deferred my personal opinions to those of the league via a vote. I even abstained from the vote so to characterize what I'm saying in this thread as me trying to change the rules mid-stream is inaccurate. My actions as relates to the league, I believe, were appropriate despite my personal beliefs expressed in this thread.

Prior to next season, I will certainly be looking to sway owners' opinions to include ANY TD scored to count for the player scoring it - regardless how it's scored.

Thats how it should be in all leagues anyways, regardless of in season rule changes. The name of the game is to score TDs. To not get credit for one, no matter how scored, is a shame.

 

[T J]

WE GET IT... YOU ARE PLAYING AGAINST EDELMEN!

I'm not playing Edelman, numbnuts. This is a thread about how a commissioner should rule on a league issue, which is a topic that interests me. I usually weigh in on these kinds of topics, because I was a commissioner for years, not because I coincidentally am facing the player that's featured in all of those threads.

I think it is funny you insist so much that he should not get credit for a TD, when if it was a punt return it would count.

Why would that be funny? OP already clearly stated that, according to his league rules, defensive TDs are awarded to the team defense, and punt return TDs are awarded to the individual returner. See, what you and your nonoheaded ilk seem to be missing is this isn't an issue of how you'd like defensive TDs to be scored. This is an issue of how they actually are scored, based on his league rules. And that issue is definitively settled. It's a defensive TD, which is awarded to the team defense, just like they've always been awarded in OP's league. If you/he thinks they should also be awarded to the individual returner, that's a great rule he can add in the offseason, not something he can arbitrarily decide to add in week 12.

You rag on everyone for defending Edelmen by saying he is on our teams, yet does anyone in here not think he is on the team you are playing against?

1) Please provide a link to a single instance of me ragging on anyone by saying they own Edelman. A single instance will suffice.2) For argument's sake, let's say you were right that I'm facing Edelman (which, as usual, you're not): Why would I care how OP rules in his own league? I would only be interested in how my own league handles it, not how T J from the internet's league handles it.

Pathetic, really.

You're being too hard on yourself.

Can we get some non bias people in here?

It's "biased." Oh, speaking of which:

Since my league decided to only credit me with 1 TD from Edelmen, instead of the 2 he had, is why I find myself sweating until Thursday.

No one cares about you, your teams, your trades or your family.

The issue is settled, but I did want to acknowledge a couple things from your post. The only reason the individual and not the ST is awarded points for a kick/punt return for a TD is because we do not play ST at all. If we did, both would definitely get the points. Also, I'm only advocating on these boards - not in my dealings with the league. I expressed my opinion to the league as any owner has the right to do, then instantly deferred my personal opinions to those of the league via a vote. I even abstained from the vote so to characterize what I'm saying in this thread as me trying to change the rules mid-stream is inaccurate. My actions as relates to the league, I believe, were appropriate despite my personal beliefs expressed in this thread.

Prior to next season, I will certainly be looking to sway owners' opinions to include ANY TD scored to count for the player scoring it - regardless how it's scored.

Thats how it should be in all leagues anyways, regardless of in season rule changes. The name of the game is to score TDs. To not get credit for one, no matter how scored, is a shame.

I agree.

 

[unckeyherb]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

If anyone will be bent if Edelmen does get credit... it will be you, your opinion that I'm reading borders on comical.In my opinion, you are wrong, almost embarrassingly wrong.

I play in 12 leagues, all but one gets credit for both return TDs for player and D/ST in 11 out of my 12 leagues? Yup that's very few leagues that count for both from personal experience. You are talking out yer ###.

Don't worry dude, if Edelmen was gonna get credit he would of gotten it already. Your safe, your still gonna get the win.

Do you not see the issue with changing rules halfway through the season? Serious question.

I do not if it is cut and dry, and this seems to be the case.Let me ask you, do you think a player who you started who got you points should not get credit for those points?

That is not the right thing.

You're still missing the point, as is the OP. It really doesn't matter what your views are on how the scoring should be. Take your feelings that a player scoring a TD should be credited with a TD. That absolutely has nothing to do with it. This whole argument boils down to whether or not this is a rule change and whether or not you feel a rule change mid-season is okay. The fact is while you and the OP keep screaming from the hill tops that there isn't a rule to change, you are 100% incorrect. There IS a rule. It's the rule that's been established through the first 75% of the season. Individuals that score a TD on Special Teams do not get credit for the TD. That is the rule. End of story. You can disagree with the philosophy behind that all you want, and certainly if you feel that way, propose a rule change at the end of the year. Because that is what the OP is doing-changing a rule. He and you don't want to see it that way and that's fine. Its incorrect, but its fine. Adding a scoring mechanism where one currently doesn't exist is a rule change. Once you accept that as fact you can move on to the second issue-is it okay to make a scoring rule change mid-season. The obvious answer is no-I don't think anyone would disagree with that. So there is your answer. The OP's league obviously agrees.

Thats how it should be in all leagues anyways, regardless of in season rule changes. The name of the game is to score TDs. To not get credit for one, no matter how scored, is a shame.

I agree.

That's irrelevant to this issue though.

 

[T J]

What's wrong with giving the points to both the team AND the player? The vast majority of fantasy leagues already do that on kick return TDs

I don't have hard data to back this up but I believe you're totally wrong here. The leagues that double-count return TDs for both the ST unit and the individual player are almost certainly a tiny minority. That doesn't mean it's "wrong" to do so, but if I joined a league and the rules didn't specifically state that's the case, I (and most people) would assume the individual doesn't also get points for the TD, that's very rarely how it works. If commish arbitrarily decided to rule that way 3/4 of the way through the season, I'd be looking for a new league. It's just not how things are done.

If anyone will be bent if Edelmen does get credit... it will be you, your opinion that I'm reading borders on comical.In my opinion, you are wrong, almost embarrassingly wrong.

I play in 12 leagues, all but one gets credit for both return TDs for player and D/ST in 11 out of my 12 leagues? Yup that's very few leagues that count for both from personal experience. You are talking out yer ###.

Don't worry dude, if Edelmen was gonna get credit he would of gotten it already. Your safe, your still gonna get the win.

Do you not see the issue with changing rules halfway through the season? Serious question.

I do not if it is cut and dry, and this seems to be the case.Let me ask you, do you think a player who you started who got you points should not get credit for those points?

That is not the right thing.

You're still missing the point, as is the OP. It really doesn't matter what your views are on how the scoring should be. Take your feelings that a player scoring a TD should be credited with a TD. That absolutely has nothing to do with it. This whole argument boils down to whether or not this is a rule change and whether or not you feel a rule change mid-season is okay. The fact is while you and the OP keep screaming from the hill tops that there isn't a rule to change, you are 100% incorrect. There IS a rule. It's the rule that's been established through the first 75% of the season. Individuals that score a TD on Special Teams do not get credit for the TD. That is the rule. End of story. You can disagree with the philosophy behind that all you want, and certainly if you feel that way, propose a rule change at the end of the year. Because that is what the OP is doing-changing a rule. He and you don't want to see it that way and that's fine. Its incorrect, but its fine. Adding a scoring mechanism where one currently doesn't exist is a rule change. Once you accept that as fact you can move on to the second issue-is it okay to make a scoring rule change mid-season. The obvious answer is no-I don't think anyone would disagree with that. So there is your answer. The OP's league obviously agrees.

Thats how it should be in all leagues anyways, regardless of in season rule changes. The name of the game is to score TDs. To not get credit for one, no matter how scored, is a shame.

I agree.

That's irrelevant to this issue though.

Did you miss the part where I said that my opinions in this thread are not how I dealt with the league? Just curious.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

Definitely NOT schtick. I honestly do not believe it would have been a new mechanism. I honestly, and not schtickly, believe that where rules are silent, an interpretation needs to be made if a situation arises that necessitates one. I consider this to be such a case. But hey, we're all entitled to our opinions right?

I assume you don't have a rule specifically defining how points are awarded to a kicker who picks up a botched snap on a FG attempt and runs it in for a TD. That doesn't mean your rules are "silent" on this issue. You would award him 6 points, because your league awards 6 points to individuals for rushing TDs. The fact that he usually kicks instead of runs with the ball doesn't matter. It's a rushing TD, and your rules do, in fact, outline how points are awarded for rushing TDs. You also don't have a rule specifically defining how points are awarded to a WR who picks up a fumble on an opponent's kick return and runs it in for a TD. That doesn't mean your rules are "silent" on this issue, either. You award the NE defense 6 points, because your league awards 6 points to the team defense for defensive fumble recovery TDs. It's a defensive TD, and your rules do, in fact, outline how defensive TDs are scored. There's no gap in the rules here that necessitates an alternate interpretation. Next year, if you want to add a scoring rule that awards points to the individual defender in addition to the team defense, that's fine. But that's not the rule you currently have in place, and it's not something you can just add in week 12.

 

[SonnyD]

Definitely NOT schtick. I honestly do not believe it would have been a new mechanism. I honestly, and not schtickly, believe that where rules are silent, an interpretation needs to be made if a situation arises that necessitates one. I consider this to be such a case. But hey, we're all entitled to our opinions right?

I assume you don't have a rule specifically defining how points are awarded to a kicker who picks up a botched snap on a FG attempt and runs it in for a TD. That doesn't mean your rules are "silent" on this issue. You would award him 6 points, because your league awards 6 points to individuals for rushing TDs. The fact that he usually kicks instead of runs with the ball doesn't matter. It's a rushing TD, and your rules do, in fact, outline how points are awarded for rushing TDs. You also don't have a rule specifically defining how points are awarded to a WR who picks up a fumble on an opponent's kick return and runs it in for a TD. That doesn't mean your rules are "silent" on this issue, either. You award the NE defense 6 points, because your league awards 6 points to the team defense for defensive fumble recovery TDs. It's a defensive TD, and your rules do, in fact, outline how defensive TDs are scored. There's no gap in the rules here that necessitates an alternate interpretation. Next year, if you want to add a scoring rule that awards points to the individual defender in addition to the team defense, that's fine. But that's not the rule you currently have in place, and it's not something you can just add in week 12.

The real question is, if your league already awards individual TD's as well as DEF/ST for a special teams TD (kickoff or punt return), should Edelman's TD be honored? In other words, our scoring settings are set up so that if Percy Harvin returns a kickoff for a TD, the Vikings DEF/ST would get 6 points and Harvin would also get 6 points.And in this scenario, would this be considered making a rule change or correcting what perhaps wasn't properly set up (scoring setting) to begin with.