For those wanting to take WR/WR on the turn in the 1st/2nd (1 Viewer)

[Ministry of Pain]

Alright, you’ve drawn one of the last picks in round 1. You have mocked out the RB and see you will be choosing form the likes of maybe Clinton Portis, Travis Henry, Maroney, Rudi Johnson if you’re lucky…none of this is real exciting to you and comes with a lot of questions so you start looking at WR. And you say to yourself that you can lock up 2 WR and not have to take one for a long time allowing you to mix n match RB in maybe 3-5 of the next 5-7 rounds. I think it’s a worthy strategy but you have to really be careful which 2 WR you are going to lock up. Let’s look at the most likely scenarios of WR that you will have access to.

Steve Smith:

2003: 1,100/7…started to break out

2004: Injured

2005: 1,560/12…his career year so far.

2006: 1,160/8…Had a preseason injury but played in 14 games.

Carolina struggled last season and they don’t look that sharp this season. Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chad Johnson:

2003: 1,350/10

2004: 1,270/9

2005: 1,430/9

2006: 1,360/7

Now he has started all games for the past 5 seasons which means he appears to be a low injury risk but he has only cracked double digit TD once and that was 4 years ago. And last year he had a bunch of games where he had little to no impact at all. As long as Rudi Johnson can keep banging them in form short yardage, where is the big upside with CJ?

Marvin Harrison:

1999: 1,660/12

2000: 1,400/14

2001: 1,500/15

2002: 1,700/11

2003: 1,270/10

2004: 1,100/15

2005: 1,100/12

2006: 1,350/12

Seriously folks…if you want to make sure you lock up a minimum of 1,100-1,200 yds and 10-12 TD, doesn’t it make sense to take this guy? What is not sexy about 8 straight years of a minimum of 1,100 yds and 10 TDs…and going for 12+ in 6 of those 8 seasons? Has Peyton manning slowed down? Is Reggie Wayne really eating into his production? I realize the guy is 35 but he takes great care of himself and is never involved in any controversy or media issues. He just shows up and does his job.

Reggie Wayne:

2004: 1,200/12

2005: 1,050/5…remember how mad everyone got that year?

2006: 1,300/9

He has had 2 really good years and 1 so so for his draft position in between. He is entering his 7th season in the NFL and has been to 1 Pro Bowl not that it matters. I have seen Wayne taken at 2.01 in drafts. Until Wayne actually outperforms Harrison I don’t see how you can pull the trigger on Wayne 1st in redrafts.

Terrell Owens:

1998: 1,050/14

2000: 1,450/13

2001: 1,400/16

2002: 1,300/13

2003: 1,100/9

2004: 1,200/14

2005: Let’s not go there

2006: 1,180/13

Owens has scored 13+ TDs in 6 of the last 9 seasons…in fact he is 4th on the all time TD list for receptions, and tied for 9th overall rush/rec with 114. Owens has had Steve Young, Jeff Garcia, Donovon McNabb, and now Tony Romo so he hasn’t had the same QB his whole career as others in this pack have. I know he is a controversy away from something bad happening but he is happy with his contract right now and he will be a big part of the offense in Dallas. And even when he is double covered it doesn’t matter. He also catches a lot of TD inside the 10 and 20 so he is always a threat to score. Hard to not want him as one of the WR in a WR/WR turn early or even as the #1WR taken off the board.

Now there are other WR that I think have the talent and skills plus the almighty opp to crack the top5. I do love Larry Fitzgerald but Leinart is going into only his 2nd season and Fitz has shown a little bit of durability issues…maybe it’s the heat down in AZ but it seems like all of their top flight WRs over the years have had some injury problems. I think Javon Walker suffers from the same scenario at QB but he is another that could crack the top5.

I didn’t mention Torry Holt but the injury concerns over him right now would have me spooked to grab him on the turn at the end of the 1st.

Lee Evans is a guy I like a lot and he reminds me of Steve Smith a lot. He has tremendous skills and plays in a subpar offense but seems to keep finding the end zone and racking up yards. If he could take another step forward this year…maybe he can have a 1,400/10-12 TD type year.

Andre Johnson is another guy where given time with Schaub, he could become more productive. He had 100+ catches last season…just needs for someone to get him the ball deep more which will create more ypc for him and TD opps.

So the safe bet might be Owens/Harrison although I doubt many owners are going to go that route that opt for WR/WR for the turn in the 1st/2nd.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

2005: 1,050/5…remember how mad everyone got that year?

Yes, yes. I remember being very dissapointed. I had Wayne and Harrison that year and it fell way short of what I was expecting. Seems the "rest" of the squad was stealing my lock for 25 or so TD's and 2500 or so yards out of my receiver tandem.{sigh}

 

[gman8343]

Nice thread, MOP. For the record, in my main $ league last year (PPR for WRs/TEs but not RBs) I had the 11th pick and went Chad Johnson/Torry Holt, first time I'd gone WR/WR. I ended up with Jamal Lewis/Fred Taylor/Thomas Jones as my RBs and had an early exit from the playoffs.

I'd consider going WR/WR if the value was there but this year I think there are a bunch of guys I see who can put up similar numbers to the elite guys that can be available a round or two later - TJ Housh/Driver/ROY/Boldin etc.

 

[Linton Trust]

good write up... i personally have Roy Williams ranked #1, Lee Evans #2 and Chad Johnson #3. I like Johnson being the first WR taken because he's the best out of those taken that high imo... it's not out of question for him to score 10-14 tds (and with the Rec's, yards, that's a top 5 performance easy).

i didn't go WR/WR this year... but that's because the person before me took chad johnson... so i went parker/s. smith... then on the way back got roy williams/a. johnson... then got lee evans to round out my roster (we're allowed 5 roster choices, including 1RB and 4WRs)... i am a firm believer that taking RBs early is overrated (except LT and Sjax)... especially in my ppr (flex lineup) league... but none of the other owners seem to get that...

 

[bjabrad]

Nice thread, MOP. For the record, in my main $ league last year (PPR for WRs/TEs but not RBs) I had the 11th pick and went Chad Johnson/Torry Holt, first time I'd gone WR/WR. I ended up with Jamal Lewis/Fred Taylor/Thomas Jones as my RBs and had an early exit from the playoffs. I'd consider going WR/WR if the value was there but this year I think there are a bunch of guys I see who can put up similar numbers to the elite guys that can be available a round or two later - TJ Housh/Driver/ROY/Boldin etc.

This is true for my scoring system as well at 0.5 ppr. The good news is that you lock in WR value, the bad news is that you limit your upside to that of Green, Taylor, Dunn, MBIII and you also end up with everybody in the league taking good value WR's in the middle rounds and if you do, they'll just rot on your bench since you've got two #1 WR's that you'll never take out of your lineup regardless of the matchup.I think the best mock plan I've seen shows RB/WR/RB or RB/Gates (depending on your scoring system)/RB and then waiting until late for your QB. What does DD show to be the best for your scoring system?

 

[Willowdoc]

good write up... i personally have Roy Williams ranked #1, Lee Evans #2 and Chad Johnson #3. I like Johnson being the first WR taken because he's the best out of those taken that high imo... it's not out of question for him to score 10-14 tds (and with the Rec's, yards, that's a top 5 performance easy). i didn't go WR/WR this year... but that's because the person before me took chad johnson... so i went parker/s. smith... then on the way back got roy williams/a. johnson... then got lee evans to round out my roster (we're allowed 5 roster choices, including 1RB and 4WRs)... i am a firm believer that taking RBs early is overrated (except LT and Sjax)... especially in my ppr (flex lineup) league... but none of the other owners seem to get that...

If you only need to start 1 RB this is definitely true. S Smith as my # 1 WR would be ranked 5 in your system and Chad and TO may be 6/7. Much less pressure to choose a RB in your system

 

[Mystery Achiever]

I think the best mock plan I've seen shows RB/WR/RB or RB/Gates (depending on your scoring system)/RB and then waiting until late for your QB.

I normally go rb-rb-wr or even rb-rb-rb, but this year, i found rb-wr-rb my best option. probably a combination of where the drop-offs are this year, as well as the fact that i had middle draft slots (4,6,8).I don't think I could go WR-WR, feeling the RB drop-off would be too much if I didn't take one.

 

[Gopher State]

Good write up, I don't agree with Lee Evans, the o-line seems to of gone backwards in Buffalo, Lynch looks lost, I think Evans gets a heavy dose of double team every time out. The key will be if JP improves, but if the line doesn't improve he be on his back a lot.

 

[Linton Trust]

good write up... i personally have Roy Williams ranked #1, Lee Evans #2 and Chad Johnson #3. I like Johnson being the first WR taken because he's the best out of those taken that high imo... it's not out of question for him to score 10-14 tds (and with the Rec's, yards, that's a top 5 performance easy). i didn't go WR/WR this year... but that's because the person before me took chad johnson... so i went parker/s. smith... then on the way back got roy williams/a. johnson... then got lee evans to round out my roster (we're allowed 5 roster choices, including 1RB and 4WRs)... i am a firm believer that taking RBs early is overrated (except LT and Sjax)... especially in my ppr (flex lineup) league... but none of the other owners seem to get that...

If you only need to start 1 RB this is definitely true. S Smith as my # 1 WR would be ranked 5 in your system and Chad and TO may be 6/7. Much less pressure to choose a RB in your system

yeah our choices are: 1RB-4WR... 1RB-3WR-1TE...2RB-2WR-1TE...1RB-2WR-2TE... & 3RB-1WR-1TE...it's also a full 1 ppr league...when i plug my numbers in - i get mostly Wrs in the first few rounds...yet all people draft is RBs...this is a case where VBD gives me a huge advantage, because their magazines are telling them to draft RBs...

 

[simey]

Steve Smith:

Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chris Weinke was the quarterback in weeks 14-16. In week 16, Weinke only threw the ball 7 times. When Jake came back in week 17 Smith caught 2 touchdowns.

 

[Linton Trust]

Good write up, I don't agree with Lee Evans, the o-line seems to of gone backwards in Buffalo, Lynch looks lost, I think Evans gets a heavy dose of double team every time out. The key will be if JP improves, but if the line doesn't improve he be on his back a lot.

Lee Evans got double teamed last year... in fact in the 2nd preseason game this year he was getting double teamed and still bringing in catches... Losman locks onto him... the coach might not like that - but i do...

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

I think it is a risky proposition, and only one I'd try in PPR leagues that start 3 WRs AND who don't have PPR for RBs.

Still a fan of RB-WR-WR-RB...

 

[Captain Hook]

In a 12 team league there should be at least one good RB available at 1-11 or 1-12.

The two problems with starting WR/WR from either slot are:

1) You have to be 100% correct on your later RB choices - no room for error, and

2) The best players likely available for you on the 3/4 turn are going to be WR

So, I vote with Jeff and would suggest one RB and one WR with first picks and then depending on lineup considerations, go WR/RB or WR/WR on the second pair of picks.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think it is a risky proposition, and only one I'd try in PPR leagues that start 3 WRs AND who don't have PPR for RBs.Still a fan of RB-WR-WR-RB...

Hey JP, my point is not really to advocate doing a WR/WR play but if you are going to make that play, I think one needs to really zero in on the right guys. TO and Harrison to me almost locks for top5 if you take them.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Steve Smith:

Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chris Weinke was the quarterback in weeks 14-16. In week 16, Weinke only threw the ball 7 times. When Jake came back in week 17 Smith caught 2 touchdowns.

I wasn't ripping the guy but it's a fact that he evaporated when the big weeks came around. I like Steve SMith but he doesn't have the stats like TO and Marvin to justify being the blind #1WR taken off the board in every league...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

 

[YoUnG GuNz]

No mentioning of Roy Williams.

 

[Mystery Achiever]

TO and Harrison to me almost locks for top5 if you take them.

these are the guys i took round 2 (marvin twice - he's dropped a bit )

 

[jcuadrado]

I went RB-WR-WR-RB this past weekend and regret it....the RB runs were ridiculous..the only semi starting RB in the 4th was Brandon Jackson/Tatum Bell/. Went Smith and Chad and I have a very bad feeling about it...LJ was my 1.4 pic pic as he fell there....SA went 3rd.

This was a flex league where WR's score 1pt for every 8 yds...RB's is 1pt for every 10.....no PPR for anything.

If you plan to go this route think about it good....I wish I hadn't. You could hit on some nice WR's later in the draft. RBs are harder to come by.

This is where doing so many mocks hurt me. I scored on a bunch of RBs later in the mocks...when the real draft came around it was totally different....good luck.

 

[AB in DC]

Steve Smith:

Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chris Weinke was the quarterback in weeks 14-16. In week 16, Weinke only threw the ball 7 times. When Jake came back in week 17 Smith caught 2 touchdowns.

I wasn't ripping the guy but it's a fact that he evaporated when the big weeks came around.

Are you expecting Chris Weinke to be the QB again? If not, how are Smith's stats with Weinke relevant to this discussion?Say what you want about Carr, but he's light years better than Weinke.

 

[AB in DC]

...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

Wait a sec -- Carolina actually has a competent backup QB for a change...and you consider this a negative??

 

[ColForbin]

i got the #2 overall in a 12 man redraft. Im taking Sjax obviously, but with my 2nd and 3rd pick, I'm targeting 2 WRs....id rather have the 2 stud WR (Holt, Marvin, Chad, Smith, TO or Roy) than grab Deuce McAllster or Edgerin James or Bjacobs. Im still ending up with the pick of MBIII or Peterson or Caddy or Jamal with pick 4 as my end RB, but I'll deal with it to have 2 of the top 6 WRs.

 

[meanjoegreen]

Steve Smith:

Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chris Weinke was the quarterback in weeks 14-16. In week 16, Weinke only threw the ball 7 times. When Jake came back in week 17 Smith caught 2 touchdowns.

I wasn't ripping the guy but it's a fact that he evaporated when the big weeks came around. I like Steve SMith but he doesn't have the stats like TO and Marvin to justify being the blind #1WR taken off the board in every league...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

You conveniently left out why Smith's numbers went down in weeks 14-16. As for the QB situation, Delhomme is the starting quarterback. He took too much heat last year with the Panthers disappointing season. He wasn't as bad as people make him out to have been. He actually had his highest completion percentage last year. He took the Panthers to the Super Bowl his starting year, the following year they were banged up with injuries and were 1 win away from making the playoffs, and the following year he took them to the NFC Championship game. Last year he had a bumpy season before hurting his thumb, but that offensive line was terrible. Delhomme is only second to Joe Montana for having the highest quarterback rating ever in the playoffs. The dude isn't going to be unseated by Carr unless it's by injury. If he does get injured, Carr is way better than Weinke.

 

[AB in DC]

Chad Johnson:

2003: 1,350/10

2004: 1,270/9

2005: 1,430/9

2006: 1,360/7

Now he has started all games for the past 5 seasons which means he appears to be a low injury risk but he has only cracked double digit TD once and that was 4 years ago. And last year he had a bunch of games where he had little to no impact at all. As long as Rudi Johnson can keep banging them in form short yardage, where is the big upside with CJ?

You're contradicting yourself here. Getting double-digit TDs is his upside. Remember, Chris Henry caught 9 TD last year; he won't do that again this year. So unless you can make the case that the Cincy passing game will decline significantly, Chad Johnson has a very good chance at 9-11 TDs. And that's not counting the possibility that he could increase his yardage, too. People don't seem to realize, but despite a decline in yardage from 2005 to 2006, CJ still led the NFL in receiving yardage last year. So does every other top WR have a better chance at increasing yardage totals than CJ does?

Nothing against Harrison/Owens -- they are clearly top-4 WRs going into a fantasy draft -- but SSmith and CJohnson are top two.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

Wait a sec -- Carolina actually has a competent backup QB for a change...and you consider this a negative??

Carr is a competent back up...we have no proof of that. We do know that he can't start and the only opp he got was as a back up for a team that seems to be unsettled with their starting QB after last season.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Steve Smith:

Smith did not crack the century mark after week 10 and had zero TDs in the money weeks of 14-16. In fact he didn’t catch a pass in week 16. Of course the guy has shown he has oodles of talent but if you are going to go WR/WR on the turn you want to make sure you don’t mess up.

Chris Weinke was the quarterback in weeks 14-16. In week 16, Weinke only threw the ball 7 times. When Jake came back in week 17 Smith caught 2 touchdowns.

I wasn't ripping the guy but it's a fact that he evaporated when the big weeks came around. I like Steve SMith but he doesn't have the stats like TO and Marvin to justify being the blind #1WR taken off the board in every league...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

You conveniently left out why Smith's numbers went down in weeks 14-16. As for the QB situation, Delhomme is the starting quarterback. He took too much heat last year with the Panthers disappointing season. He wasn't as bad as people make him out to have been. He actually had his highest completion percentage last year. He took the Panthers to the Super Bowl his starting year, the following year they were banged up with injuries and were 1 win away from making the playoffs, and the following year he took them to the NFC Championship game. Last year he had a bumpy season before hurting his thumb, but that offensive line was terrible. Delhomme is only second to Joe Montana for having the highest quarterback rating ever in the playoffs. The dude isn't going to be unseated by Carr unless it's by injury. If he does get injured, Carr is way better than Weinke.

How many teams do you have Steve Smith on?I am merely pointing out that for whatever the reasons are, Steve Smith has some things you can point to as to why he shouldn't be taken #1 blindly. I guess Marvin Harrison and TO have just been lucky? At the 1.12/2.01 slot, it might seem a little high to grab Harrison and TO but you willnever get them at the end of the 3rd so even if the ADP is showing mid 2nd, what difference does it make as long as you ensure two locks in the top5? The difference between Harrison/TO, and say Steve Smith will be very very small if at all at the end of the year...HOWEVER that is assuming that Smith will produce 1,200-1,500 yds and 12-15 TDs and I am just saying that it might not be a given.

 

[*****]

I went RB-WR-WR-RB this past weekend and regret it....the RB runs were ridiculous..the only semi starting RB in the 4th was Brandon Jackson/Tatum Bell/. Went Smith and Chad and I have a very bad feeling about it...LJ was my 1.4 pic pic as he fell there....SA went 3rd.This was a flex league where WR's score 1pt for every 8 yds...RB's is 1pt for every 10.....no PPR for anything.If you plan to go this route think about it good....I wish I hadn't. You could hit on some nice WR's later in the draft. RBs are harder to come by.This is where doing so many mocks hurt me. I scored on a bunch of RBs later in the mocks...when the real draft came around it was totally different....good luck.

I had the opposite experience. I went Gore/Holt/Gates in the first three rounds. My league is PPR so the WR run was much stronger than I expected (Owens, Harrison, CJ, Steve Smith were all gone by 2.12 so I took Holt). But, because of this, I got Brandon Jacobs at the end of the 4th and Ahman Green at the end of the 6th. Drafts just sometimes have a life of their own and do things you don't expect.

 

[JMJ]

If you do choose to do this, the two best options are:

Harrison

Owens

or

Harrison

Wayne

 

[-OZ-]

Good write up, I don't agree with Lee Evans, the o-line seems to of gone backwards in Buffalo, Lynch looks lost, I think Evans gets a heavy dose of double team every time out. The key will be if JP improves, but if the line doesn't improve he be on his back a lot.

Lee Evans got double teamed last year... in fact in the 2nd preseason game this year he was getting double teamed and still bringing in catches... Losman locks onto him... the coach might not like that - but i do...

Evans is a stud, but with an ADP of 39 who's taking him at 12/13? If you're drafting out of the 12 hole, you should be able to get Evans at 3.12, so there's no way I'm taking WRs at 12 and 13. I can see Harrison or TO in the early 2nd, Evans in the 3rd. Making it RB WR WR RB. But, if for whatever reason you decide to do this, I'm going TO/Marvin.

 

[BassNBrew]

...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

Wait a sec -- Carolina actually has a competent backup QB for a change...and you consider this a negative??

Carr is a competent back up...we have no proof of that. We do know that he can't start and the only opp he got was as a back up for a team that seems to be unsettled with their starting QB after last season.

Seriously, do you really think if you say it enough that it will become reality? The only way Carr plays is if Delhomme is injured...period.My rankings are Owens, Smith, Wayne, Housh, Walker/Holt.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

Wait a sec -- Carolina actually has a competent backup QB for a change...and you consider this a negative??

Carr is a competent back up...we have no proof of that. We do know that he can't start and the only opp he got was as a back up for a team that seems to be unsettled with their starting QB after last season.

Seriously, do you really think if you say it enough that it will become reality? The only way Carr plays is if Delhomme is injured...period.My rankings are Owens, Smith, Wayne, Housh, Walker/Holt.

BnB, I am not saying Delhomme isn't the starter but you are making the point that Carr is not a great QB and we don't know if he is a competent back up or not. This team has too much talent to go 8-8 again without some serious changes namely the coaching staff so I think Fox is perhaps on the hot seat a little bit. If they started out 1-3 or something and Delhomme was struggling and he felt like he needed a spark...OK you're right I can't bring myself to type that Carr will be inserted other than an injury...but I don't think he is a great back up anymore than I thought he was a good starter.Good back ups are guys like Don Strock who could come off the bench, or Frank Reich...those are competent back ups.

 

[mjohnell]

I just had my draft picking from the 11 spot. My league starts 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE/1K/1DST standard scoring, no ppr. Strategy was as follows:

1. If Peyton is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available RB at 2.02 and best available WR at 3.11

2. If Rudi is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available WR at 2.02 and 3.11

3. Otherwise, grab your favorite 2 WR's at 1.11 and 2.02 and grab best available RB at 3.11 and 4.02

After this I just drafted for value.

My top 7 WR's

1. Marvin

2. Steve

3. Chad

4. Terrell

5. Torry

6. Reggie

7. Larry

This is how my first 4 picks went

1.11 RB-Rudi

2.02 WR-Steve

3.11 WR-Terrell

4.02 WR-Larry

Now you see the reason I listed my top 7 WR's. I could not pass up the opportunity to start 3 of my top 7 WR's. I was still able to land a nice size crew of RB's to compensate for not taking a RB2 early. I got Ahman, Lamont, Fred Taylor, Deshaun, and Chris Brown. I'm pretty sure someone will emerge out of this group to give me solid RB2 numbers.

This is the first year I didn't go RB/RB and I can't say I'm disappointed with how my draft went. I would strongly recommend this strategy.

 

[BassNBrew]

...plus his QB situation has started to become unsettled a bit which makes me uncomfortable.

Wait a sec -- Carolina actually has a competent backup QB for a change...and you consider this a negative??

Carr is a competent back up...we have no proof of that. We do know that he can't start and the only opp he got was as a back up for a team that seems to be unsettled with their starting QB after last season.

Seriously, do you really think if you say it enough that it will become reality? The only way Carr plays is if Delhomme is injured...period.My rankings are Owens, Smith, Wayne, Housh, Walker/Holt.

BnB, I am not saying Delhomme isn't the starter but you are making the point that Carr is not a great QB and we don't know if he is a competent back up or not. This team has too much talent to go 8-8 again without some serious changes namely the coaching staff so I think Fox is perhaps on the hot seat a little bit. If they started out 1-3 or something and Delhomme was struggling and he felt like he needed a spark...OK you're right I can't bring myself to type that Carr will be inserted other than an injury...but I don't think he is a great back up anymore than I thought he was a good starter.Good back ups are guys like Don Strock who could come off the bench, or Frank Reich...those are competent back ups.

I'm not following you here. I would suggest that Delhomme's chances of playing 16 are about the same as Romo's and neither are significantly less that Manning.Let's put that aside and get back to your original premise. For WR/WR to work, one of the picks will have to throw down some huge numbers. Owens has and can do it. I believe Smith fits that category too. Personally I think Harrison and CJ are the second best WRs on their team. Because of that I see their upside limited to a very good status as opposed to elite.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I just had my draft picking from the 11 spot. My league starts 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE/1K/1DST standard scoring, no ppr. Strategy was as follows:1. If Peyton is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available RB at 2.02 and best available WR at 3.112. If Rudi is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available WR at 2.02 and 3.113. Otherwise, grab your favorite 2 WR's at 1.11 and 2.02 and grab best available RB at 3.11 and 4.02After this I just drafted for value.My top 7 WR's1. Marvin2. Steve3. Chad4. Terrell5. Torry6. Reggie7. LarryThis is how my first 4 picks went1.11 RB-Rudi2.02 WR-Steve3.11 WR-Terrell4.02 WR-LarryNow you see the reason I listed my top 7 WR's. I could not pass up the opportunity to start 3 of my top 7 WR's. I was still able to land a nice size crew of RB's to compensate for not taking a RB2 early. I got Ahman, Lamont, Fred Taylor, Deshaun, and Chris Brown. I'm pretty sure someone will emerge out of this group to give me solid RB2 numbers.This is the first year I didn't go RB/RB and I can't say I'm disappointed with how my draft went. I would strongly recommend this strategy.

No PPR...Marvin Harrison finished about #30 overall in that scoring format last year. And the difference between WR1 and WR20 is not as much as some think.You have a pretty solid team but you will likely hover around .500 to a little better and make one of the final playoff spots(doing my Carnak impersonation)...then you will simply have to get lucky in the playoffs.

 

[Chili1034]

I pulled the dreaded 14 (last) pick last night. 1/2/3/1/1 (NO D) Standard scoring. RB went with the top 13 picks but had to take 1 RB so I grabbed McGahee. I took Steve Smith at 2.1 knowing I would be hurting at RB. Jacobs almost fell to me in the 3rd but was taken at 3.13. I rolled the dice taking Evans and Gates knowing I was hosed at RB. Only two backs went the next 26 picks and they were A. Green and J. Lewis. I took Rivers at 5.14 and D. Foster at 6.1. So I ended up with my starters being:

Rivers

McGahee

Foster

S. Smith

Evans

Hackett

Gates

My top reserves are Betts and Welker/Roydell Williams

The DD has my lineup as 3rd overall, 26 points out of 1st.

Not a bad team for a 14 team league.

 

[Iggles]

In my money league 12-team non-PPR, Ihad the 7th pick and decided to go RB first then WR/WR and ended up with:

1st Westbrook (yea since I'm in a Philly league and rarely will get Eagles becayse they go too high)

2d Chad Johnson (major RB run going)

3rd Roy Williams (lots of QBs going plus RB2s)

4th Adrian Petersen MN (not much left so went for upside)

Slim pickings at RB and top QBs at this point and all of the WRs looked the same so I went for CHI Defense. I know it was too early and I probably should have gone RB but it sounded good at the time.

QB T. Romo, M Hassleback

RB Westbrook , A Petersen, B, Jackson, W. Dunn, Buckhalter

WR CJ, Roy Williams, B. Marshall, Bobby Wade, Demetrius Williams, Mike Furrey

TE Heath Miller, LJ Smith

PK Robbie Gould

DEF Chicago

Not the best draft but picking mid round was tough and then mid draft I grilled the steaks and screwed up a few picks too

 

[Buckna]

I just had my draft picking from the 11 spot. My league starts 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE/1K/1DST standard scoring, no ppr. Strategy was as follows:

1. If Peyton is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available RB at 2.02 and best available WR at 3.11

2. If Rudi is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available WR at 2.02 and 3.11

3. Otherwise, grab your favorite 2 WR's at 1.11 and 2.02 and grab best available RB at 3.11 and 4.02

After this I just drafted for value.

My top 7 WR's

1. Marvin

2. Steve

3. Chad

4. Terrell

5. Torry

6. Reggie

7. Larry

This is how my first 4 picks went

1.11 RB-Rudi

2.02 WR-Steve

3.11 WR-Terrell

4.02 WR-Larry

Now you see the reason I listed my top 7 WR's. I could not pass up the opportunity to start 3 of my top 7 WR's. I was still able to land a nice size crew of RB's to compensate for not taking a RB2 early. I got Ahman, Lamont, Fred Taylor, Deshaun, and Chris Brown. I'm pretty sure someone will emerge out of this group to give me solid RB2 numbers.

This is the first year I didn't go RB/RB and I can't say I'm disappointed with how my draft went. I would strongly recommend this strategy.

No PPR...Marvin Harrison finished about #30 overall in that scoring format last year. And the difference between WR1 and WR20 is not as much as some think.You have a pretty solid team but you will likely hover around .500 to a little better and make one of the final playoff spots(doing my Carnak impersonation)...then you will simply have to get lucky in the playoffs.

That's all someone drafting in the 11 or 12 hole can hope for. You are already well behind the 8 ball when drafting in standard leagues with no 3rd round reversal. Redraft league winners are often highly correlated with a top 3 pick (LT last year, SA the 2 years before that, etc.) which is why owners go stud WR or stud QB when stuck in the late spots. You have to zig, when others zag.FWIW, if going stud WR, the choices are TO & Smith. Both have health questions but they are consistent PPG monsters. That's the swing for the fences WR combo, IMHO.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I just had my draft picking from the 11 spot. My league starts 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE/1K/1DST standard scoring, no ppr. Strategy was as follows:

1. If Peyton is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available RB at 2.02 and best available WR at 3.11

2. If Rudi is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available WR at 2.02 and 3.11

3. Otherwise, grab your favorite 2 WR's at 1.11 and 2.02 and grab best available RB at 3.11 and 4.02

After this I just drafted for value.

My top 7 WR's

1. Marvin

2. Steve

3. Chad

4. Terrell

5. Torry

6. Reggie

7. Larry

This is how my first 4 picks went

1.11 RB-Rudi

2.02 WR-Steve

3.11 WR-Terrell

4.02 WR-Larry

Now you see the reason I listed my top 7 WR's. I could not pass up the opportunity to start 3 of my top 7 WR's. I was still able to land a nice size crew of RB's to compensate for not taking a RB2 early. I got Ahman, Lamont, Fred Taylor, Deshaun, and Chris Brown. I'm pretty sure someone will emerge out of this group to give me solid RB2 numbers.

This is the first year I didn't go RB/RB and I can't say I'm disappointed with how my draft went. I would strongly recommend this strategy.

No PPR...Marvin Harrison finished about #30 overall in that scoring format last year. And the difference between WR1 and WR20 is not as much as some think.You have a pretty solid team but you will likely hover around .500 to a little better and make one of the final playoff spots(doing my Carnak impersonation)...then you will simply have to get lucky in the playoffs.

That's all someone drafting in the 11 or 12 hole can hope for. You are already well behind the 8 ball when drafting in standard leagues with no 3rd round reversal. Redraft league winners are often highly correlated with a top 3 pick (LT last year, SA the 2 years before that, etc.) which is why owners go stud WR or stud QB when stuck in the late spots. You have to zig, when others zag.FWIW, if going stud WR, the choices are TO & Smith. Both have health questions but they are consistent PPG monsters. That's the swing for the fences WR combo, IMHO.

Good points Buckna. I think you're right, at the end of the 1st you are just hoping you can make the playoffs and then survive somehow with less firepower.

 

[BassNBrew]

In my money league 12-team non-PPR, Ihad the 7th pick and decided to go RB first then WR/WR and ended up with:1st Westbrook (yea since I'm in a Philly league and rarely will get Eagles becayse they go too high)2d Chad Johnson (major RB run going)3rd Roy Williams (lots of QBs going plus RB2s)4th Adrian Petersen MN (not much left so went for upside)Slim pickings at RB and top QBs at this point and all of the WRs looked the same so I went for CHI Defense. I know it was too early and I probably should have gone RB but it sounded good at the time.QB T. Romo, M HasslebackRB Westbrook , A Petersen, B, Jackson, W. Dunn, BuckhalterWR CJ, Roy Williams, B. Marshall, Bobby Wade, Demetrius Williams, Mike FurreyTE Heath Miller, LJ SmithPK Robbie GouldDEF ChicagoNot the best draft but picking mid round was tough and then mid draft I grilled the steaks and screwed up a few picks too

So what does this have to do with the topic at hand???

 

[Ministry of Pain]

In my money league 12-team non-PPR, Ihad the 7th pick and decided to go RB first then WR/WR and ended up with:1st Westbrook (yea since I'm in a Philly league and rarely will get Eagles becayse they go too high)2d Chad Johnson (major RB run going)3rd Roy Williams (lots of QBs going plus RB2s)4th Adrian Petersen MN (not much left so went for upside)Slim pickings at RB and top QBs at this point and all of the WRs looked the same so I went for CHI Defense. I know it was too early and I probably should have gone RB but it sounded good at the time.QB T. Romo, M HasslebackRB Westbrook , A Petersen, B, Jackson, W. Dunn, BuckhalterWR CJ, Roy Williams, B. Marshall, Bobby Wade, Demetrius Williams, Mike FurreyTE Heath Miller, LJ SmithPK Robbie GouldDEF ChicagoNot the best draft but picking mid round was tough and then mid draft I grilled the steaks and screwed up a few picks too

So what does this have to do with the topic at hand???

BnB, you'll be an early candidate for premature balding if you ask these types of questions. Just nod your head and keep moving almog.

 

[BassNBrew]

In my money league 12-team non-PPR, Ihad the 7th pick and decided to go RB first then WR/WR and ended up with:1st Westbrook (yea since I'm in a Philly league and rarely will get Eagles becayse they go too high)2d Chad Johnson (major RB run going)3rd Roy Williams (lots of QBs going plus RB2s)4th Adrian Petersen MN (not much left so went for upside)Slim pickings at RB and top QBs at this point and all of the WRs looked the same so I went for CHI Defense. I know it was too early and I probably should have gone RB but it sounded good at the time.QB T. Romo, M HasslebackRB Westbrook , A Petersen, B, Jackson, W. Dunn, BuckhalterWR CJ, Roy Williams, B. Marshall, Bobby Wade, Demetrius Williams, Mike FurreyTE Heath Miller, LJ SmithPK Robbie GouldDEF ChicagoNot the best draft but picking mid round was tough and then mid draft I grilled the steaks and screwed up a few picks too

So what does this have to do with the topic at hand???

BnB, you'll be an early candidate for premature balding if you ask these types of questions. Just nod your head and keep moving almog.

LOL coming from the inspiration of the verb going MOP. I was just scratching my head (may cause balding) why someone would post the team from the 7th spot after going RB/WR in a thread devoted to going WR/WR at the turn. I guess I hate seeing interesting threads derailed with drivel.

 

[packersfan]

I just had my draft picking from the 11 spot. My league starts 1QB/2RB/3WR/1TE/1K/1DST standard scoring, no ppr. Strategy was as follows:

1. If Peyton is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available RB at 2.02 and best available WR at 3.11

2. If Rudi is available, grab him at 1.11 and grab best available WR at 2.02 and 3.11

3. Otherwise, grab your favorite 2 WR's at 1.11 and 2.02 and grab best available RB at 3.11 and 4.02

After this I just drafted for value.

My top 7 WR's

1. Marvin

2. Steve

3. Chad

4. Terrell

5. Torry

6. Reggie

7. Larry

This is how my first 4 picks went

1.11 RB-Rudi

2.02 WR-Steve

3.11 WR-Terrell

4.02 WR-Larry

Now you see the reason I listed my top 7 WR's. I could not pass up the opportunity to start 3 of my top 7 WR's. I was still able to land a nice size crew of RB's to compensate for not taking a RB2 early. I got Ahman, Lamont, Fred Taylor, Deshaun, and Chris Brown. I'm pretty sure someone will emerge out of this group to give me solid RB2 numbers.

This is the first year I didn't go RB/RB and I can't say I'm disappointed with how my draft went. I would strongly recommend this strategy.

No PPR...Marvin Harrison finished about #30 overall in that scoring format last year. And the difference between WR1 and WR20 is not as much as some think.You have a pretty solid team but you will likely hover around .500 to a little better and make one of the final playoff spots(doing my Carnak impersonation)...then you will simply have to get lucky in the playoffs.

That's all someone drafting in the 11 or 12 hole can hope for. You are already well behind the 8 ball when drafting in standard leagues with no 3rd round reversal. Redraft league winners are often highly correlated with a top 3 pick (LT last year, SA the 2 years before that, etc.) which is why owners go stud WR or stud QB when stuck in the late spots. You have to zig, when others zag.FWIW, if going stud WR, the choices are TO & Smith. Both have health questions but they are consistent PPG monsters. That's the swing for the fences WR combo, IMHO.

Good points Buckna. I think you're right, at the end of the 1st you are just hoping you can make the playoffs and then survive somehow with less firepower.

I don't think the team listed above has less firepower. He is stacked at WR and in a PPR league that's not a bad position to be stacked at. Rudi obviously isn't a PPR stud RB but the guy is flat out money in any scoring format. You can book him for 1,300 yards and 12 TDs. As another owner who is drafting at the back end in a PPR league (11th pick) I think it's important to load up on talent as best you can. If that means overloading at WR that's hardly a bad strategy. I'm not sure I'd advise WR-WR (in fact I wouldn't) but if you go RB-WR-WR-RB you could come away with a strong foundation such as:RB-Rudi

RB-Peterson

WR-Smith

WR-Walker

OR

RB-Rudi

RB-Portis

WR-Smith

WR-Walker

That's a good foundation in my opinion and certainly should - barring injuries - make your team a very competitive one as long as you draft smart the rest of the way.

 

[Linton Trust]

Good write up, I don't agree with Lee Evans, the o-line seems to of gone backwards in Buffalo, Lynch looks lost, I think Evans gets a heavy dose of double team every time out. The key will be if JP improves, but if the line doesn't improve he be on his back a lot.

Lee Evans got double teamed last year... in fact in the 2nd preseason game this year he was getting double teamed and still bringing in catches... Losman locks onto him... the coach might not like that - but i do...

Evans is a stud, but with an ADP of 39 who's taking him at 12/13? If you're drafting out of the 12 hole, you should be able to get Evans at 3.12, so there's no way I'm taking WRs at 12 and 13. I can see Harrison or TO in the early 2nd, Evans in the 3rd. Making it RB WR WR RB. But, if for whatever reason you decide to do this, I'm going TO/Marvin.

oh, i wasn't saying Evans should be taken 12/13... i was simply saying that he could very well end up being a top 3 WR this year... double teams and all... i took him 4.03 in my league... so i know there's no reason to take him at 12/13... i agree completely....

 

[smapdi]

I had a 12 team PPR redraft and had the last pick. The previous year I had the same spot and got burnt "reaching" for 2 RB's at that point.

When you're stuck at the bottom you have to look at who will get you the most points. Will the 12th and 13th RB get you more points then #1 and #2 WRs?

I was contemplating going WR-WR but Rudi Johson fell into my lap at 1.12

I then went ahead and took Marvin Harrison at 2.01

This was the 1st WR off the board and I had my choice at whoever and decided with Harrison. He is a model consistency and isn't that what you're looking for out of your top 2 picks?

At 3.12 I was able to snag Roy Willams who I feel will be in the top 5 of reievers this season.

2 studs at WR in PPR league where only 2 WR are required is not a bad situation in my book.

 

[kensat30]

I don't know why you would want to go WR/WR this year unless the scoring/positions are heavily slanted towards WRs. There are some quality, HIGH UPSIDE, RBs available at the end of the 1st in even large leagues IMO. At least grab 1 RB. IF you are gonna go WR real early, I think Owens is the pick. Maybe not as much upside as Steve Smith, but you know you are getting a ton of TDs and a real PPG monster from the WR position.

 

[Brother Mouzone]

if you start 3 wr and especially if its ppr i recomend going rb/wr/wr/wr/rb. this works especially well if you have top 7ish draft position. i had 2 and i ended up with sjax, c.williams, harrisson, r.williams, and l.evens.

not bad i'd say!

also got j.norwood!

 

[mektarus]

I had the good fortune to draft from the #1 position in my 12 team redraft league last night. Of course I took LT2 #1 but then every pick but one until it got back to me was a RB. So I decided my best bet was to go WR/WR at the turn (we start 2 WR's). I took Smith/Harrison at the 2/3 turn and then hoped for the best. To my surprise, when the 4/5 turn came around Caddy and Tom Brady were both still sitting there, so I promptly snatched them up. At the 6/7 turn I was able to get Fred Taylor and Lendale White and then I took Joey Galloway and Hasselbeck at 8/9. After that i started drafting defensive player (IDP league) but was able to pick up Turner in the 13th and Bennett in the 18th. I was pleased overall.

1.01: LT2

2.24: Steve Smith

3.25: Marvin Harrison

4.48: Caddy

5.49: Brady

6.72: Fred Taylor

7.73: Lendale White

8.96: Joey Galloway

9.97: Matt Hasselbeck

 

[BassNBrew]

I had the good fortune to draft from the #1 position in my 12 team redraft league last night. Of course I took LT2 #1 but then every pick but one until it got back to me was a RB. So I decided my best bet was to go WR/WR at the turn (we start 2 WR's). I took Smith/Harrison at the 2/3 turn and then hoped for the best. To my surprise, when the 4/5 turn came around Caddy and Tom Brady were both still sitting there, so I promptly snatched them up. At the 6/7 turn I was able to get Fred Taylor and Lendale White and then I took Joey Galloway and Hasselbeck at 8/9. After that i started drafting defensive player (IDP league) but was able to pick up Turner in the 13th and Bennett in the 18th. I was pleased overall.1.01: LT22.24: Steve Smith3.25: Marvin Harrison4.48: Caddy5.49: Brady6.72: Fred Taylor7.73: Lendale White8.96: Joey Galloway9.97: Matt Hasselbeck

 

[the spanker]

Just curious to the guys that took WR-WR in the first two rounds last year.

How well did you do?

 

[Ghost Rider]

In 2006, I took Steve Smith in the first round and Marvin Harrison in the second round. I finished in 2nd place in the regular season, and then narrowly lost in the finals to the owner who had Tomlinson (and that was with S. Smith getting a big fat zero championship week thanks to Delhomme being hurt). So, going WR/WR in the first two rounds can work. Of course, getting Frank Gore in the 4th round and picking up MJD after week 3 for nothing certainly helped.

 

[the spanker]

In 2006, I took Steve Smith in the first round and Marvin Harrison in the second round. I finished in 2nd place in the regular season, and then narrowly lost in the finals to the owner who had Tomlinson (and that was with S. Smith getting a big fat zero championship week thanks to Delhomme being hurt). So, going WR/WR in the first two rounds can work. Of course, getting Frank Gore in the 4th round and picking up MJD after week 3 for nothing certainly helped.

Yes but it sounds more of a gamble to me. You were fortunate to do well with your 4th rd pick and was again with another good RB later. This stabilized your RB scoring. How do you think you would have done if MJD hadn't emerged for you?