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Happy days for some are here again (1 Viewer)

Manster said:
Oh ok, I get it.  Now that your guy is in, we're gonna give him a pass and call it a "speech issue".  Nevermind he's potentially the oldest prez ever.....and he looks, and sounds like the oldest prez ever.  I'm sure he's just as sharp as anyone who remembers when the telegraph was invented.
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He's not "my guy," I'm an independent voter. However, if he governs reasonably effectively(after the last 4 years, the bar is so low it's actually buried), I'd consider voting for his successor far more so than any GOP candidate they could come up with.

 
Kal El said:
He's not "my guy," I'm an independent voter. However, if he governs reasonably effectively(after the last 4 years, the bar is so low it's actually buried), I'd consider voting for his successor far more so than any GOP candidate they could come up with.
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Oh it'll be biz as usual.  Uncle Joe will put his guys in strategic spots. The deficit will increase.  The middle class will continue to pay more taxes.  The Saudis will do whatever they want.......but it'll be a feel good story, cuz that's how Dems roll......sleight of hand baby! 

Oh yea I forgot to mention, global warming will be YUUUUGE! And we will worry about it constantly while china, india, etc pollute to their hearts desire

 
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Manster said:
Oh it'll be biz as usual.  Uncle Joe will put his guys in strategic spots. The deficit will increase.  The middle class will continue to pay more taxes.  The Saudis will do whatever they want.......but it'll be a feel good story, cuz that's how Dems roll......sleight of hand baby! 

Oh yea I forgot to mention, global warming will be YUUUUGE! And we will worry about it constantly while china, india, etc pollute to their hearts desire
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The Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget estimated that the policies Trump campaigned on in 2016 and then pushed while in office will add $3.9 trillion to the fiscal deficit through 2026. The estimate excludes costs to deal with the coronavirus which it said were unforeseen.

The bulk of the cost comes from three culprits, the group said: the 2017 tax overhaul, higher military and veterans outlays, and two agreements reached with Congress to put spending over and above caps on annual government outlays.

“We estimate that taken together, these $3.9 trillion of tax cuts and spending will lead to about a 15 percent of GDP increase in debt by 2026. They explain the majority of the difference between CBO’s 2016 debt projection of 86 percent of GDP in 2026 and its current projection of 107 percent of GDP, the highest level in our nation’s history,” the group said.
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:coffee:

 
Manster said:
In Oregon, no matter how many positive cases, the hospitalizations remain low......even now.....and it's been spiking much higher than it ever was before for well over 2 weeks.....yet hospitalizations remain constant, and low.....it's interesting
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Gov. Kate Brown and healthcare leaders from across the state sounded the alarm Tuesday about the record-setting volume of COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and the number of patients in intensive care units from Portland to Medford.

“There’s no question that we are at a crossroads,” Dr. Renee Edwards, Oregon Health & Science University’s chief medical officer, said during a news conference.

Last month, state health officials warned Oregon could reach capacity in its hospitals by mid- or late December. Officials did not address how that projection has changed in the past week, as cases surge and with some metrics suggesting Oregon is now in the top five nationally for the rate of transmission.

But Oregon’s growing hospitalization numbers have triggered precautionary trip wires. Healthcare organizations in the metro area began regularly meeting for the first time last week, Edwards said, to discuss their overall hospital and ICU capacities should they need to move patients from one facility to another.

Oregon now has 285 people actively hospitalized with confirmed cases of COVID-19, nearly double the number from just two weeks ago. That includes 67 people in intensive care as of Tuesday, a new high.

As of Tuesday, the Oregon Health Authority reported that hospitals have 146 intensive-care beds and 701 non-ICU beds available statewide. About a quarter of those are in Region 1, which includes the Portland metro area and the northern Oregon Coast.

But in the past week, the metro area has seen a 57% increase in COVID-positive patients, according to Oregon Health Authority figures.

Meanwhile in southern Oregon, Jackson and Josephine counties have seen a 162% increase in hospitalized patients in the past week.

That trend continues.
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:coffee:

 
Manster said:
So it's all Trump's fault, right?  Haha

How long has uncle Joe in politics?  He's been right on the front lines the whole time!

I'll be waiting patiently for the Dems plan to balance the budget and pay down the deficit......😴
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I didn't say it was Trump's fault, but don't lash out at Biden (who hasn't even begun his presidency) for increasing the deficit when Trump added nearly $4 TRILLION to it in  his four years.  That's a hell of a note, sir.  

 
Manster said:
So it's all Trump's fault, right?  Haha

How long has uncle Joe in politics?  He's been right on the front lines the whole time!

I'll be waiting patiently for the Dems plan to balance the budget and pay down the deficit......😴
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GM's point was that blaming the Dems for stuff when they haven't been in charge for the past 4 years isn't logical, and in fact things got worse under Trump.

 
Manster said:
Dude the Oregonian has been a fish wrapper for years!
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Yes, okay.  No arguing with you on this.  You're clearly more in the know than the rest of us.  Maybe you should run for office and bless this state with all your wisdom that the rest of us are failing to grasp because we read the wrong sources, listen to the wrong politicians and believe bogus doctors.

 
Kal El said:
GM's point was that blaming the Dems for stuff when they haven't been in charge for the past 4 years isn't logical, and in fact things got worse under Trump.
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Isn't logical?  So you're saying there's a chance the Biden administration is going to be fiscally responsible?  That's laughable

 
General Malaise said:
Yes, okay.  No arguing with you on this.  You're clearly more in the know than the rest of us.  Maybe you should run for office and bless this state with all your wisdom that the rest of us are failing to grasp because we read the wrong sources, listen to the wrong politicians and believe bogus doctors.
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And apparently you eat all the poop.....so you got that goin for ya

 
General Malaise said:
:lmao:

can't argue with that.
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Look man I get it.  Case numbers are spiking, and it could potentially be a bad sitch for hospitals.  I just cannot read any of stories in the media. I check the OHA dashboard and don't get my panties in a bunch.....I've seen too much fear from people I know who watch the news.....it is unhealthy

 
General Malaise said:
I didn't say it was Trump's fault, but don't lash out at Biden (who hasn't even begun his presidency) for increasing the deficit when Trump added nearly $4 TRILLION to it in  his four years.  That's a hell of a note, sir.  
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It wasn't Trump's fault. It was the fault of all republicans in power in 2017. You're not going to convince someone spitting that word vomit otherwise though. The proof is in the data, but facts only matter when they align with the bias. The deficit matters to fiscal conservatives, but republicans are not fiscal conservatives. 

 
NewlyRetired said:
This is a mistake imo. 

50% of country hates the outcome and I fear over celebrating by the winning side may be seen as taunting by the losing side and we don't need to give any fringe lunatics added fuel to do something stupid.
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C'mon.  Trump himself got up on the stage many times and bragged about winning, calling it a landslide, degrading his opponent further, etc.

But some people in NJ driving around with a smile is apparently too far?

 
Mr.Pack said:
Well for one we won't be hearing about Covid anymore, so we have that going for us.
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Covid all over the cover of the NYTimes homepage today, just as it was yesterday.

At what point do you admit you were wrong and begin to question all of the sources that led you to make such a ridiculous assertion? 

 
tommyGunZ said:
Covid all over the cover of the NYTimes homepage today, just as it was yesterday.

At what point do you admit you were wrong and begin to question all of the sources that led you to make such a ridiculous assertion? 
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How ya doing GB? Congrats on your win.

I have no sources, just my gut feeling. The media ####storm over this would absolutely never have happened if Obama had been in office. The media wanted this on Trump and did anything to get him out of office. I truly believe that and no "source" had to tell me that. Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign.

Covid is bad no question about it. My sister just got out of the hospital and will be dealing with it for a awhile, so I know it's bad, but the media no doubt played a huge part in the hysteria and scaring people.

I've also noticed that Covid is not the #1 story anymore around here. The other night a freaking car accident was and Covid wasn't covered until 4 stories and 6 mins in (Yes, I timed it).

General Malaise said:
I'm beginning to think he wasn't on the fence afterall. ;)
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Sorry you don't believe me but that's not my problem. I was 1000% on the fence and didn't vote for either of the two.

Also, Covid shouldn't be political, you shouldn't be making it political, but I understand why you and others are.

Good luck to your Ducks today GB, I'm on em

 
Mr.Pack said:
Sorry you don't believe me but that's not my problem. I was 1000% on the fence and didn't vote for either of the two.
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I think this is a real thing. We do the group a disservice when we don't believe the words the other person says. Shots that accuse them of lying just don't help. Trust me, I live in the South, we're masters of the stuff like that accusing people of lying without actually saying those words.

By and large, I think we all do better when we believe what people say.

Of course, we also should point out inconsistencies we may see. That's different than accusing someone of lying. I think saying "I don't see how you can say ________ and then say _______. Can you elaborate?" has a much better chance of leading to discussion. 

 
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Mr.Pack said:
The media wanted this on Trump and did anything to get him out of office. I truly believe that and no "source" had to tell me that. Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign.

Covid is bad no question about it. My sister just got out of the hospital and will be dealing with it for a awhile, so I know it's bad
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These two paragraphs together are maybe (probably) the most startling thing I’ve ever read here. I just can’t even...understand the mentality. Man. 

 
Mr.Pack said:
How ya doing GB? Congrats on your win.

I have no sources, just my gut feeling. The media ####storm over this would absolutely never have happened if Obama had been in office. The media wanted this on Trump and did anything to get him out of office. I truly believe that and no "source" had to tell me that. Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign.

Covid is bad no question about it. My sister just got out of the hospital and will be dealing with it for a awhile, so I know it's bad, but the media no doubt played a huge part in the hysteria and scaring people.

I've also noticed that Covid is not the #1 story anymore around here. The other night a freaking car accident was and Covid wasn't covered until 4 stories and 6 mins in (Yes, I timed it).

Sorry you don't believe me but that's not my problem. I was 1000% on the fence and didn't vote for either of the two.

Also, Covid shouldn't be political, you shouldn't be making it political, but I understand why you and others are.

Good luck to your Ducks today GB, I'm on em
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Hope your sis gets well soon. 

 
2Squirrels1Nut said:
Hope your sis gets well soon. 
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Thank you. I've known 6 people who have or have had it and she's the worst because she's a severe asthmatic, a diabetic and just not in good shape at all. The other 5 had very little symptoms.

However she is getting better and her breathing is coming around. She told me she's feeling better today.

 
General Malaise said:
Oh good lord, I was joking.  Hence the winky smiley guy.

Lighten up, folks.  
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I hear you GB. And that's the thing. I know you to be a great guy. But not everyone on the board knows everything about everyone. So for most people, all we have is the words. The emoji doesn't change that. In some ways, even it makes it worse as people can read the wink as "amirite?" and it spirals down. 

I just want us all to be as gracious here as we can. I know you feel the same. I fear we don't have a chance if we're not. 

 
Mr.Pack said:
Thank you. I've known 6 people who have or have had it and she's the worst because she's a severe asthmatic, a diabetic and just not in good shape at all. The other 5 had very little symptoms.

However she is getting better and her breathing is coming around. She told me she's feeling better today.
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I'm happy hear she is getting better. Hang in there GB. Love to you and your family.

 
Mr.Pack said:
I have no sources, just my gut feeling. The media ####storm over this would absolutely never have happened if Obama had been in office. The media wanted this on Trump and did anything to get him out of office. I truly believe that and no "source" had to tell me that. Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign.
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There was no outbreak of SARS when Obama was President.

The last outbreak of SARS in the USA was in 2003-2004. George W. Bush, a Republican, was reigning at the time.

Perhaps it only feels like Obama was responsible for SARS because the media crafted a narrative to shield Bush from criticism? If so, it would tend to contradict the theory that the media only protects Democratic presidents.

 
Sea Duck said:
Perhaps it only feels like Obama was responsible for SARS because the media crafted a narrative to shield Bush from criticism?
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No, no one was responsible for SARS, Ebola, Swine Flu, Covid.

Better?  :shrug:

 
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Joe Bryant said:
I think this is a real thing. We do the group a disservice when we don't believe the words the other person says. Shots that accuse them of lying just don't help. Trust me, I live in the South, we're masters of the stuff like that accusing people of lying without actually saying those words.

By and large, I think we all do better when we believe what people say.

Of course, we also should point out inconsistencies we may see. That's different than accusing someone of lying. I think saying "I don't see how you can say ________ and then say _______. Can you elaborate?" has a much better chance of leading to discussion. 
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It's been that way for years in this subforum.  Those of us who are independent voters who voted for neither Hillary nor Trump in 2016 have had to constantly listen to snide remarks and baseless accusations since that we were liars and that we were secretly Trump voters who were too embarrassed to admit it. 

 
Sea Duck said:
I apologize, I don't understand "CRS".

You said, in reference to Obama: "Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign."

Why do you think that SARS broke out during Obama's reign?
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Good day sir. Not doing this pissing match.

 
Mr.Pack said:
Sea Duck said:
I apologize, I don't understand "CRS".

You said, in reference to Obama: "Look no further than the SARS, Ebola and Swine Flu that broke out during his reign."

Why do you think that SARS broke out during Obama's reign?
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Good day sir. Not doing this pissing match.
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:confused:

I don't understand. I'm trying to engage you with honest conversation.

I could see how you might think I started a urination contest if I had manipulated your quotes, or if I had made snarky comments about who liked your posts, or if I had circumvented the site's policy on foul language. But since I did none of those things, I am legitimately confused here.

Is there a reason why you won't answer the question?

 
Manster said:
In Oregon, no matter how many positive cases, the hospitalizations remain low......even now.....and it's been spiking much higher than it ever was before for well over 2 weeks.....yet hospitalizations remain constant, and low.....it's interesting
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Not sure where you’re getting your data, but this seems to suggest otherwise.  November 1st —> 211 hospitalized, November 14 —> 356. 

Sure, there were a few days with no new hospitalizations, but the general trend is clearly upward, especially over the last two weeks.

ETA I saw your link in another post. I think that graph is showing new hospitalizations only. When considering healthcare resources, total current hospitalizations is a much more valuable metric - and that number is not constant. 

 
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Mr.Pack said:
Covid is bad no question about it. My sister just got out of the hospital and will be dealing with it for a awhile, so I know it's bad, but the media no doubt played a huge part in the hysteria and scaring people.
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Apparently they haven’t done a good enough job as we have 250k dead and over 175k+ new cases daily.  

 
Terminalxylem said:
Not sure where you’re getting your data, but this seems to suggest otherwise.  November 1st —> 211 hospitalized, November 14 —> 356. 

Sure, there were a few days with no new hospitalizations, but the general trend is clearly upward, especially over the last two weeks.

ETA I saw your link in another post. I think that graph is showing new hospitalizations only. When considering healthcare resources, total current hospitalizations is a much more valuable metric - and that number is not constant. 
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Yea, I dunno......the OHA graph is through Nov 12 and its steady.  I mean, I'm sure there is, and will continue to be more hospitalizations.....fwiw, I've got insider info that there aren't "many" covid cases at my local hospital......I have zero proof, just 2nd hand info.

My main point is I continue to NOT watch/read ANY news......I've seen what the covid paranoia does......I will continue to be careful, and tune out the S show.

 
Manster said:
Yea, I dunno......the OHA graph is through Nov 12 and its steady.  I mean, I'm sure there is, and will continue to be more hospitalizations.....fwiw, I've got insider info that there aren't "many" covid cases at my local hospital......I have zero proof, just 2nd hand info.

My main point is I continue to NOT watch/read ANY news......I've seen what the covid paranoia does......I will continue to be careful, and tune out the S show.
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Right. It only shows new hospitalizations, not total hospital beds occupied. Big difference.

Unless your local hospital is one of the bigger ones in the area, it’s unlikely they have many cases. They tend to get shunted to referral centers first, as those hospitals have more infrastructure to handle the demands covid patients pose.

 
Terminalxylem said:
Right. It only shows new hospitalizations, not total hospital beds occupied. Big difference.

Unless your local hospital is one of the bigger ones in the area, it’s unlikely they have many cases. They tend to get shunted to referral centers first, as those hospitals have more infrastructure to handle the demands covid patients pose.
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It's a big one

 
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