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Harvin to Bills/ Formerly the Harvin to Hawks & Jets (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Bigboy10182000
- Start date
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Harvin. pfffft pass
This is a good point. Just curious, how many passes do you expect Cassel/BufQB to throw this year? In Bowe's career year, he got 133 out of 475 team passing attempts. Randy Moss got 126 while Welker got 150 out of 533.GroveDiesel said:
Those aren't very high attempt totals, but it certainly appears 1-2 guys could be productive in Buffalo if they are the offensive focus. In the last few years in NY, the Jets have thrown 496, 474, and 492 passes. It is worth noting that they did throw the ball 545 times in 2011. The most during Ryan's tenure. Greg Roman has thrown the ball even less in SF.
If there is a real 4-way split for targets, no one will do better than WR3. It appears Harvin will need a lot of rushes to be even a semi-important fantasy player.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
I'm not sure I'd bet too highly on any of them. I think it's very possible that they have a decent to good offense overall, but that no one person is consistent enough to be great fantasy material . Well, in the passing game anyway. I think McCoy is going to out up great numbers. If I had to pick one guy though, it would probably be Watkins. He is the most talented overall IMO and things are going to be much more opened up for him thanks to the other weapons. I think Harvin and Clay will be matchup nightmares, but that their fantasy production will be inconsistent and less than their actual football production.
smbkrypt24
Footballguy
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Not to be combative, but I think decent to good is best case scenario. The only reason Rex Ryan or Greg Roman ever had a decent to good offense was when they had an awesome defense that gave them the ball back and an awesome offensive line to run the ball down people's throats. Offhand I'm thinking 2009 Jets and Kaepernick's breakout year. Just looked them up and the 2009 Jets finished 17th in points scored and the 49ers have hovered around 10th-11th the last three years. I think the offensive line is going to hurt Roman a lot, but this defense should be really good. Maybe even as good as the 49ers the last few years.
A million pages ago, you guys beat me up for saying he's overrated. I still think he is and has proven as such with his small stat totals.
I don't, however, think this guy can't make an impact.
A lesser talent, but more productive player Earnest Byner switched from RB to WR and did well at each. There's probably others I can't think of but ....there's something about a guy focusing on one role that lends to the continuity and cohesion of the rest of the team whereas a "weapon" type style doesn't usually work as well.
Recently Denard Robinson playing weapon versus 2014 RB, is a good example.
He doesn't need to be a far better version of Derrick McCluster. In Ten, if McCluster was on the field, he got the ball probably 90% of the time regardless where he lined up. This is too easy for a defense. I wonder what was similarly predictable with Harvin. in KC, McCluster was part RB part WR and similarly exciting at times but all in all not the "weapon" I'm sure people hoped for.
I did like him as a back-breaking sub if ADP came out but that team had a top quality OL that could say we are going to run, try and stop us-most teams can't pull that off.
I've read how he just wants to be a WR and I wish him well with this. I hope he does just that. I really think focusing is important for him and the effect on the team.
I liked Manuel his first few games and felt like his play and confidence dropped dramatically after that. If he can get his confidence back, he's the guy here. If not, they should just let him go as QBs without confidence are useless.
I don't, however, think this guy can't make an impact.
A lesser talent, but more productive player Earnest Byner switched from RB to WR and did well at each. There's probably others I can't think of but ....there's something about a guy focusing on one role that lends to the continuity and cohesion of the rest of the team whereas a "weapon" type style doesn't usually work as well.
Recently Denard Robinson playing weapon versus 2014 RB, is a good example.
He doesn't need to be a far better version of Derrick McCluster. In Ten, if McCluster was on the field, he got the ball probably 90% of the time regardless where he lined up. This is too easy for a defense. I wonder what was similarly predictable with Harvin. in KC, McCluster was part RB part WR and similarly exciting at times but all in all not the "weapon" I'm sure people hoped for.
I did like him as a back-breaking sub if ADP came out but that team had a top quality OL that could say we are going to run, try and stop us-most teams can't pull that off.
I've read how he just wants to be a WR and I wish him well with this. I hope he does just that. I really think focusing is important for him and the effect on the team.
I liked Manuel his first few games and felt like his play and confidence dropped dramatically after that. If he can get his confidence back, he's the guy here. If not, they should just let him go as QBs without confidence are useless.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
I think this is where his value really lies. Harvin's value is much larger overall to a team than his own stat line indicates. The pressure he puts on a defense with his skill set and versatility opens it up for other players. When you have to account for him, it helps keep the 8th defender out of the box, or another WR from being double teamed, or forces a linebacker out in space more. Those all have value for a team over just traditional stats.
I do think that Bri makes a good point in that his value declines if he's not out there much and they go to him 90% of the time he's in the game. The best part of a weapon like Harvin is putting stress on a defense on every single play because he offers so much unpredictability. If you put him on TH field sparingly and give him the ball every time he's out ere, you do the exact opposite.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
They've rotated the duties a lot the past couple years, as they had a lot of decent options. I suspect Percy will be at the top of the list, since they have a lot of weapons on offense.Yenrub said:
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
The thing with Ryan teams, Buddy or Rex as HC, is that the defense is the total focus. No matter if the offensive talent can elevate Cassell, the offense will be maximizing running the ball and playing it tight. You're going to see a lot of unused talent on O.
Papa John's
Footballguy
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Have you watched him play? There is no debate, the guy is extremely talented. In my opinion he's a better version of CJ Spiller (to make a semi-similar comparison.) When healthy, and when he's not a cancer in the locker room he is a great asset to a team. Those two caveats are the only reasons I'm not ecstatic about his signing.
Also... Ernest Byner played WR? I'm going to have to look that up...
msommer
Footballguy
How long since he showed the NFL his amazing talent? Three or four years?
In the mean time he's only shown his bad sides.
But, wait, now he is magically going to rejuvente and 'explode'
Color me a sceptic
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Well, he played for the Jets last year, who were terrible on offense. He still showed a few flashes...
http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2014120705/2014/REG14/jets@vikings/watch#menu=gameinfo%7CcontentId%3A0ap3000000439633&tab=videos
He beat that guy like a drum off the line.
Prior to that he played in 6 games over two years with Seattle, due to injuries, etc. I already stated that is a concern. However, if he stays on the field, I see no reason he can't return to 09-11 numbers.
That said, stats are overrated. As some have mentioned, his presence on the field is valuable.
And the QB is? And the scheme is how run heavy? And Roman incorporates a short passing game for Manuel, including a RB screen game that he never schemed for Kaepernick? And the targets in that short passing game are?These are a few of the questions that we need to answer to begin reasonable projections for next season. I'm uncertain how much of the 9rs offense was Harbaugh and how much was Roman. So, it will be interesting to see. Rex likes to scheme for his defense to win games and his offense to not cost his defense that chance. My guess is we downgrade most of the pieces on offense, but it's only guesswork for now.
Van Dyman
Footballguy
Dez
Footballguy
It was a Monday night game and he had 3 TD's called back and I lost my game by less than 6 pts and missed the playoffs by 1 game...not bitter though
KellysHeroes
Footballguy
Besides Wilson's rookie yr this guy never had a good QB
FunkyPlutos
Footballguy
Percy Harvin: Seahawks wideouts viewed me as threat
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000506758/article/percy-harvin-seahawks-wideouts-viewed-me-as-threat
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000506758/article/percy-harvin-seahawks-wideouts-viewed-me-as-threat
seahawk 17
Footballguy
Seattle wideouts were upset that Harvin was hogging all of the scheduled physical therapy time.
Percy Harvin needs injection, sidelined with hip pain:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000512376/article/percy-harvin-needs-injection-sidelined-with-hip-pain
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000512376/article/percy-harvin-needs-injection-sidelined-with-hip-pain
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
lol at this article.
Sanjay Lal was the Jets WR coach from 2012-2014. It's the same guy he was with last year.
FUBAR
Footballguy
GolferMike
Footballguy
Any of you guys in Dynasty leagues trading Harvin? What kind of value/draft picks are you guys getting for him?
ROYALWITCHEESE
Footballguy
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I know one coach who needs to be fired.
Even if that were true, that MIGHT be true for prototypical WRs. Not guys like Harvin.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
I have this idea forming in my head that Harvin with Taylor might make sense. More rollouts, More backfield movement. I think he can maybe profit more from Taylor white Watkins, sadly, because he is as we know a great talent, is maybe going to suffer from lack of downfield targets.
This is my speculation so just looking for opinions.
This is my speculation so just looking for opinions.
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cstu
Footballguy
Welker didn't even break out until he was 26 and played well until he was 32. That said, I don't think it's going to happen for Harvin.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
That was a pretty nice game Harvin had vs Indy, and he and Taylor might be a good combo this year.
But somehow I don't think BB will let him do much this week.
But somehow I don't think BB will let him do much this week.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
This happened vs the Colts. Teams have always been so obsessed with Harvin's flexibility.
