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Hillary takes responsibility for loss. Blames Russia, FBI, misogyny, media, and unprecedented interference. (1 Viewer)

Y'know I get the dislike, maybe even hatred, but when you see what we ended up with I find the disdain for her to be shocking and disheartening (at the very least). The most dangerous person to hold the office of the Presidency in any of our lifetimes is currently occupying the White House. Personally I think that is a good thing because the the country needed a kick in the ### and opposition of him is that kick. But all things being equal she would have been a much better option to occupy the office than this lunatic.

Bottom line is that comparisons between his insanity and hers is a complete false equivalency.




 




 
I am not a supporter of Trump either ...hell, I gagged as I voted for Hillary.  

I was voting for stability though I was very concerned about what she may have continued to do with taxes and government spending.  Not to mention only a continuance but escalation of "pay for play" politics.  I was very concerned about the stock market impact of Trump as well.  

Though I like the idea of an outsider to come in and shake things up for the better, Trump is way in over his head and way too egotistical to admit it ...or get enough people in the administration who aren't "yes people."  And yeah, I think he's dangerous.  

 
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I am not a supporter of Trump either ...hell, I gagged as I voted for Hillary.  

I was voting for stability though I was very concerned about what she may have continued to do with taxes and government spending.  Not to mention not only a continuance but escalation of "pay for play" politics.  I was very concerned about the stock market impact of Trump as well.  

Though I like the idea of an outsider to come in and shake things up for the better, Trump is way in over his head and way too egotistical to admit it ...or get enough people in the administration who aren't "yes people."  And yeah, I think he's dangerous.  
I always forget to throw disclaimers in when I respond to posts that I am not always calling out the poster. Sometimes they just inspire a thought. So I apologise if you thought I was calling you out.

Bit how do we feel about Trump and his impact on taxes and government spending? Let alone where he stands on pay for play politics considering all his, and his kids, foundations and businesses are open for business with them in charge.

That is a big part of the reason why I think comparisons between Hillary and Donald are a huge false equivalency.

 
Oh yeah, Trump's moves so far are incredibly disappointing.  Hiring GSachs people, son-in-law, etc.  The 15% business tax plan will certainly create another huge jump in the deficit - and not really stimulate jobs ...just enrich the rich.  

I'm retired and appreciating the stock market movement since his election, though we are only about 50% in stocks.  I have googled around, and asked in here why the jump - the only thing I can really see is the promise of this tax plan.  And what happens if it gets voted down?  

 
She didn't even bother to campaign in Wisconsin. Her campaign was a total disaster. She collapsed literally on camera and needed help going up and down stairs. Her campaign servers got hacked by a stupid phishing scam.  If she couldn't beat Trump and ran such a piss poor campaign god only knows how horrible she would have been as president. 

 
Also seems to cause the current president to throw little fits every couple of days.
She does suffer in the comparison with Saddon Trumpsein. It is refreshing to have a president who never makes excuses himself and always accepts responsibility for his mistakes.

It was incredibly courageous and heroic even when the Yemen mission didn't go well, and despite authorizing it, blaming it on the generals and Obama. MUCH better example of inspiring leadership there.

But Putin's a killer? We're killers, too. You think we're so innocent? Better to defend the most un-American thing ever uttered by a sitting US president.

I have no doubt if the grifter had lost, based on what he said later in the campaign leading up to the election (like criminally and seditiously calling for polling monitors, in some cases OUTSIDE THEIR DISTRICT, and in which the genius probably didn't factor in some people might have been murdered in states like FL with concealed weapons, due to being a malignant narcissistic sociopath), Don the Con would have graciously accepted defeat, idiotically whining if he lost the election was stolen from him, which could have incited violence and rioting (which he is getting sued for, very presidential), and again, one of the most monstrously self-absorbed, megalomaniacal and un-Democratic statements ever uttered in American political history. A national disgrace and travesty, international embarrassment and blight on the founding father's legacy. 

Hell yes she was flawed, but not psychotic, I'd take her over 10 murderous dictator slobberers (Putin, Erdogan, Kim Yong-Un, Duterte - all "strong leaders" who get marvelous, tremendous ratings, he would be "honored" to meet!). It's reptillian and infantile to parse geopolitical ethics through the lens of Nielsen-like Apprentice ratings. 

* In the interest of consistency, if HC is pathetic for making excuses AFTER she lost, how does Naranja Loco rate whining BEFORE the election was even over.  :)

 
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Alright, I've been reading more on citizens united and am changing my tune somewhat.

This was a pretty good read:

http://www.truth-out.org/archive/component/k2/item/89548:corporate-speech-and-campaign-finance-reform-making-sense-of-citizens-united-v-federal-election-commission

I freely admit that freedom of speech is extremely important. I just want transparency and to somehow remove as much money and corruption out of our politics as possible. Easier said then done obviously.

Add to that the proliferation and embrace of fake news in the internet's age and we've got huge problems.

 
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That was a quick pivot from Mea Culpa to Youa Culpa.  

She ran a terrible campaign, did not listen to her husband's advice, she had zero charisma and was a flawed candidate that was never going to connect with middle America.   This is why she lost.  

Just go away. 

 
Good one Bob, I had not heard that one.  

Bit of a stretch.
Admittedly, Binky.

I'll be here all week and recommend the veal. Please tip your bartender.

Sad!

Don

Sad! Don

Saddon

* If the petty, humorless, buffoonish, cartoon villain, strong man dictator shoe fits?

 
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Doesn't she have a bunch of million dollar speeches to be giving?  Her and Billy should be off giving paid speeches in the Congo, Russia, Quatar, or maybe domestically for some huge corporation.  

 
One thing I don't get about people in a position like Hillary is now - why the hell don't you just enjoy all your money and retirement?  This isn't a anti-Hillary post, there's people with lots of money in all kinds of fields that seem to want to stick around.  I would be deciding which tropical paradise I wanted to spend my week visiting and what kind of food and adult beverages I'd be having that day.  Do I want to snorkel today?  Lobster, steak or both?  

 
I think she honestly believes it was all the things she's blaming.  I don't think she's being dishonest, I just think she has no awareness of her own blind spots. It's almost as if, even though the campaign is over, she still needs advisors.
Well, she also has facts and data that absolutely support what she's saying, but why let that stuff get in the way of a conservative-bash-Hillary-thread, amIrite? 

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/309871-nate-silver-clinton-almost-certainly-wouldve-won-if-election-were-before

 
One thing I don't get about people in a position like Hillary is now - why the hell don't you just enjoy all your money and retirement?  This isn't a anti-Hillary post, there's people with lots of money in all kinds of fields that seem to want to stick around.  I would be deciding which tropical paradise I wanted to spend my week visiting and what kind of food and adult beverages I'd be having that day.  Do I want to snorkel today?  Lobster, steak or both?  
Because she actually cares about the issues she's been advocating for for decades? 

 
"Clinton stated broadly that she takes “absolute personal responsibility” for her failure to win the White House. Yet the Democratic nominee declined to fault her strategy or message, nor did she acknowledge her own weak­nesses as a campaigner"

LINK

Get ready for Hillary 2020!  :coffee:

“Remember,” Clinton said, “I did win more than 3 million votes [more] than my opponent.”
That's a woman for you right there.  Nothing is ever their fault.  

 
That's the answer, but it's one most of the people here will never accept. Hillary has always believed in public service. It's the central theme of her life. 
The best public service she could provide right now would be to go away.  The anti-Trump movement does not need her to be its public face.

 
One thing I don't get about people in a position like Hillary is now - why the hell don't you just enjoy all your money and retirement?  This isn't a anti-Hillary post, there's people with lots of money in all kinds of fields that seem to want to stick around.  I would be deciding which tropical paradise I wanted to spend my week visiting and what kind of food and adult beverages I'd be having that day.  Do I want to snorkel today?  Lobster, steak or both?  
She's hungry for power, and no amount of money satiates that hunger. It's mental state normal people don't suffer from, but also one where they are attracted to politics, so the country gets to suffer from it. 

 
She's hungry for power, and no amount of money satiates that hunger. It's mental state normal people don't suffer from, but also one where they are attracted to politics, so the country gets to suffer from it. 
Assigning personal motivations to people you don't know personally is unwise.  I do it too, though I am much better at avoiding it than I was years ago.  

 
She's hungry for power, and no amount of money satiates that hunger. It's mental state normal people don't suffer from, but also one where they are attracted to politics, so the country gets to suffer from it. 
I think she never forgave herself for not putting the hammer down on Obama back in the primary of 08.  It was her turn and she settled for a resume pad as SoS.  People had Republican fatigue after 8 years of Bush (culminating in the financial crisis) so any Democrat was beating any Republican.  If she was the nominee, she would have won....and it kills her inside living with this.

 
I think she never forgave herself for not putting the hammer down on Obama back in the primary of 08.  It was her turn and she settled for a resume pad as SoS.  People had Republican fatigue after 8 years of Bush (culminating in the financial crisis) so any Democrat was beating any Republican.  If she was the nominee, she would have won....and it kills her inside living with this.
Spock, when Stat is agreeing with your take, time to reassess.  

 
As a Democrat, watching her is absolutely cringeworthy.

Yeah, she's right and all. But she just comes off like a sore loser which plays right into the GOP's hands.

 
“He [Trump]  should worry less about the election and my winning the popular vote than doing some other things that would be important for the country,” Clinton said.

Seriously, she is a cancer on the Democratic party and needs to go away. But that's not what cancers do.
She does need to go away...but that's a great line that you know just trolls the troll.

 
In general yes, polls are accurate.  
I believe most or the vast majority of polls in the days leading up to the election still had Clinton winning, despite Comey and anything else she wants to blame.  She blew it.  She lost to THE worst candidate in presidential history.  Think about that for a minute.  

 
I believe most or the vast majority of polls in the days leading up to the election still had Clinton winning, despite Comey and anything else she wants to blame.  She blew it.  She lost to THE worst candidate in presidential history.  Think about that for a minute.  
So, in general, no the polls weren't accurate. 

 
I believe most or the vast majority of polls in the days leading up to the election still had Clinton winning, despite Comey and anything else she wants to blame.  She blew it.  She lost to THE worst candidate in presidential history.  Think about that for a minute.  
What polls are you referencing?  The polls that had Hillary winning by 2-3% nationally?  Those polls were accurate.  

 
What polls are you referencing?  The polls that had Hillary winning by 2-3% nationally?  Those polls were accurate.  
Those kinds of polls, that measure the overall vote on a national level, are meaningless. You have to look at the battleground states and how each candidate is doing there.  The general consensus, on both of the big cable news channels CNN and Fox, as well as MSNBC, was that Trump's road to the white house was very difficult, based on the polling numbers in those states (OH, PA, FL, etc.).  He basically had to pull off and upset and win most of the battleground states.  Not some.  Most.  And he did. 

 
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Those kinds of polls, that measure the overall vote on a national level, are meaningless. You have to look at the battleground states and how each candidate is doing there.  The general consensus, on both of the big cable news channels CNN and Fox, as well as MSNBC, was that Trump's road to the white house was very difficult, based on the polling numbers in those states (OH, PA, FL, etc.).  He basically had to pull off and upset and win most of the battleground states.  Not some.  Most.  And he did. 
You're mistaking polls for probability.  Silver talked about people underestimating his chances both before and after the election.  Hillary was a 70-30 favorite.  The 30% bet hit.  Anyone who plays poker or blackjack understands this.  

Trump overperformed in a few states, but mostly within the margin of error.  In general, the polls were right. :shrug:

 
I am not a supporter of Trump either ...hell, I gagged as I voted for Hillary.  

I was voting for stability though I was very concerned about what she may have continued to do with taxes and government spending.  Not to mention only a continuance but escalation of "pay for play" politics.  I was very concerned about the stock market impact of Trump as well.  

Though I like the idea of an outsider to come in and shake things up for the better, Trump is way in over his head and way too egotistical to admit it ...or get enough people in the administration who aren't "yes people."  And yeah, I think he's dangerous.  
Two things are fact..Trump is in over his head and an ego maniac, and Hillary was despised by many long before she ran for President. Many who voted for her did not like her.

Trump was an unknown but Hillary was viewed as one of the most unlikable candidates ever. Now to portray herself as a martyr make her even more repulsive.

 
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Two things are fact..Trump is in over his head and an ego maniac, and Hillary was despised by many long before she ran for President. Many who voted for her did not like her.

Trump was an unknown but Hillary was viewed as one of the most unlikable candidates ever. Now to portray herself as a martyr make her even more repulsive.
The hate was largely unfounded.  Trump did or does many of the things she was vilified for.  I mean Trump's talkign about speeches, and then once elected literally lining his pockets by filling Mar A Lago every weekend.  I think this election was won by talk radio.  

 
She does suffer in the comparison with Saddon Trumpsein. It is refreshing to have a president who never makes excuses himself and always accepts responsibility for his mistakes.

It was incredibly courageous and heroic even when the Yemen mission didn't go well, and despite authorizing it, blaming it on the generals and Obama. MUCH better example of inspiring leadership there.

But Putin's a killer? We're killers, too. You think we're so innocent? Better to defend the most un-American thing ever uttered by a sitting US president.

I have no doubt if the grifter had lost, based on what he said later in the campaign leading up to the election (like criminally and seditiously calling for polling monitors, in some cases OUTSIDE THEIR DISTRICT, and in which the genius probably didn't factor in some people might have been murdered in states like FL with concealed weapons, due to being a malignant narcissistic sociopath), Don the Con would have graciously accepted defeat, idiotically whining if he lost the election was stolen from him, which could have incited violence and rioting (which he is getting sued for, very presidential), and again, one of the most monstrously self-absorbed, megalomaniacal and un-Democratic statements ever uttered in American political history. A national disgrace and travesty, international embarrassment and blight on the founding father's legacy. 

Hell yes she was flawed, but not psychotic, I'd take her over 10 murderous dictator slobberers (Putin, Erdogan, Kim Yong-Un, Duterte - all "strong leaders" who get marvelous, tremendous ratings, he would be "honored" to meet!). It's reptillian and infantile to parse geopolitical ethics through the lens of Nielsen-like Apprentice ratings. 

* In the interest of consistency, if HC is pathetic for making excuses AFTER she lost, how does Naranja Loco rate whining BEFORE the election was even over.  :)
Sorry, I thought this topic was about Hillary.  My bad.

 

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