Ut oh, it will be in the room, we will be winning too much at the craps table.looking forward to this discussion at the craps tables.
It's not that difficult to understand if you step outside of your own worldview and look at it from the perspective of someone who's pro-life. Pretend for a moment that you think a fetus is "human" in some philosophically important sense, and that it has the right not to be killed by another person. I get that you don't agree with that premise, but we're talking about the internal consistency of pro-lifers here, so we start from their point of view. Nobody that I know of in the pro-life movement thinks that "Has the right not to be killed by me" is the same thing as "Has the right to be supported by me." I'm not justified in axe-murdering the guy in the next office. It doesn't follow that I'm obligated to pay for his groceries.I can not understand this. Why are religious people not preaching in their churches healthcare for all? No matter the cost! A life is a life!
I am pro life, do you want me to shred you?It's not that difficult to understand if you step outside of your own worldview and look at it from the perspective of someone who's pro-life. Pretend for a moment that you think a fetus is "human" in some philosophically important sense, and that it has the right not to be killed by another person. I get that you don't agree with that premise, but we're talking about the internal consistency of pro-lifers here, so we start from their point of view. Nobody that I know of in the pro-life movement thinks that "Has the right not to be killed by me" is the same thing as "Has the right to be supported by me." I'm not justified in axe-murdering the guy in the next office. It doesn't follow that I'm obligated to pay for his groceries.
There are lots of people who are both pro-life and pro-free-healthcare. It isn't that those positions are necessarily in conflict somehow. It's just that they aren't the same thing.
This is really just another variant of the "If you're pro-life you have to oppose the death penalty" thing. I am and I do, but changing my mind on one wouldn't affect my stance on the other.
I have nothing to argue about, I am just talking about morals. Semantics start with money and religion or any other evil.I agree with you about health care, for what it is worth, but you are attempting to argue semantics with religious people. Think about that.
When you meet your God and say I fought for the ones in the tummy but not the ones alive, what woud he say?
I get it sry.![]()
It looks like you understood the concept of free will allowed others to make bad choices. I noticed you gave to many worthy charitable causes in your life?
I agree. If someone can't afford these basic necessities, society should help.If you are pro free health care how are you not pro free food, free shelter, free water, free housing....??
I try to back up what I preach. Or else why say it.![]()
It looks like you understood the concept of free will allowed others to make bad choices. I noticed you gave to many worthy charitable causes in your life?
I think its awesome that you are willing to have you and your family live at the "bare minimum" in order to support another family or two. Do you also pay for their internet? Keep up the great work that you are doing!I agree. If someone can't afford these basic necessities, society should help.
Why do you assume that the government is the only source of help for people?When abortion gets limited, low income births go up. Then they (republicans) want to take away help for low income families. So have those babies, just don't expect any help raising them. That's your problem.
Why should they have any say in it at all? Republicans cater to Catholics and their abortion views and want to abolish abortion all together, even in a rape case because "god meant to put it there". Even if the mother has had multiple spinal surgeries and could end up paralyzed by carrying to term. I don't expect taxpayers to pick up the tab, but it is healthcare, so if we cover healthcare then it should be available.Why do you assume that the government is the only source of help for people?
I don't understand. Unpack please.Freedom to live.
Freedom to live your life without being robbed of what it would take to pay for healthcare for all.
Liberals never get it.
Who is stopping you?Why should they have any say in it at all? Republicans cater to Catholics and their abortion views and want to abolish abortion all together, even in a rape case because "god meant to put it there". Even if the mother has had multiple spinal surgeries and could end up paralyzed by carrying to term. I don't expect taxpayers to pick up the tab, but it is healthcare, so if we cover healthcare then it should be available.
In freakanomics by Stephen levitt he proposes that a sudden drop in a rapidly climbing crime rate in the 80s was due to abortions being available because there were suddenly less at risk children being born. If you're pro birth, then realize there are consequences that we all pay indirectly one way or another and we need to offer support to these low income at risk births.
Sounds like you're pro choice to me.Freedom to live.
Freedom to live your life without being robbed of what it would take to pay for healthcare for all.
Liberals never get it.
Single payer is just a form of insurance with a nation-wide pool. It's the most sensible logistical system by far.Freedom to live.
Freedom to live your life without being robbed of what it would take to pay for healthcare for all.
Liberals never get it.
The spinal girl I heard on NPR yesterday- the long term contraceptive she uses will no longer be available at planned parenthood. So it is an outlier but it happens. I forget which politician recently said that rape cases were a decision of god and we therefore should let it live, really should be up to the victim in my opinion and whatever their beliefs and conscience holds them to.Ah the old multiple-spinal-surgery-woman-gets-pregnant-by-rape epidemic. Tough to argue against that.
What do you do to help at risk kids in your community?Who is stopping you?
Ah ok, one of these useless threads where someone asks a 'serious' question, gets a thoughtful answer, and responds like a fool. SHUT. IT. DOWN.I am pro life, do you want me to shred you?
Yes, well, fortunately death panels are only a thing with private insurance since it was invented.Seems perfectly consistent to be pro-life and anti-death panels.![]()
I agree with all of this.My main point really is to point out that there are many issues to consider and if you don't want to fund one thing let's put that funding where it helps with some of the future consequences.
I would rather have my taxes go to helping people get healthcare or taking care of the nations impoverished youth by providing safe environments and food and education rather than pay the military billions just to function clerically.
They are. Well, at least some of them are.I can not understand this. Why are religious people not preaching in their churches healthcare for all? No matter the cost! A life is a life!
I grew up in the Catholic church. Went to college at gannon. I don't think I can give an unbiased answer here. So, I will abstainThey are. Well, at least some of them are.
The Catholic Church, for example, is all for providing healthcare for all. You might feel they aren't being consistent because they didn't fully support the ACA when they were actually being consistent with their pro-life and pro- quality of life views. If there was a plan presented that brought about gains in coverage (even including access for immigrants) while not providing for abortions, they'd be all over that.
That is very Catholic of you.I grew up in the Catholic church. Went to college at gannon. I don't think I can give an unbiased answer here. So, I will abstain
I got another war right now, common sense is not for allThat is very Catholic of you.
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Not true, I'm pro life and anti death penalty.Ever notice that people who are anti capital punishment are also pro choice, and vice-versa