Is Tebow being given a Fair shot? (2 Viewers)

[bakes]

You people are fanatics....he is not an nfl qb...get over it.....

Why would someone go into a thread about Tim Tebow and then complain that everyone was talking about Tim Tebow? There's other threads about other players if Tebow doesn't suit your fancy.

Is there some invisible ink on sbonomo's post that the rest of us can't see?

Nope, just some leftover Turkish Taffy.

 

[Buffaloes]

ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games

in an era where rules/emphasis has been tweaked to ensure passing numbers across the board are up, this isn't an apples to apples comparison

 

[GroveDiesel]

Tebow does need to be more accurate and the idea of not practicing well but then playing well on Sundays seems silly to me. Denver's defense kept them in low scoring games that Tebow could them win. If the defense was giving up 30 points a game, I don't think TT would have a very good record.All that being said, I don't think that basing how good he is on the decisions the Broncos and Jets made is really fair either. Of course Elway wasn't going to want Tebow. I don't think Elway would want Cam Newton or RGIII either because they don't fit his perception of what it takes to be a winning NFL QB. He wants someone that plays like him (ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games). But Elway got the chance to get Peyton Manning. Of COURSE he's going to take Manning over Tebow. That was obviously happening from the first time Tebow did something amazing to win a game at the end and the cameras flashed to Elway and the look of disgust on his face.And giving Rex and the Jets any type of credit for being able to make the right decision is laughable. It's pretty clear that Ryan is in WAY over his head and has chosen to ride Sanchez to the death of his career. Throw in the tattoo thing and it's clear that something weird beyond just football is going on there. The Jets had a good defense last year even with Revis being out and all sorts of other injuries. But Sanchez was a turnover machine. Each week he found new ways to turn the ball over. Say what you will about Tebow, but he doesn't turn the ball over. That's one reason why he was a great fit with Denver last year and why they could win close low scoring games. I don't care how bad you practice, that item alone should have earned Tebow some starts eventually. Only an incompetent buffoon with a giant ego and some weird twisted fetish would keep trotting out the guy that keeps turning the ball over and directly leading to losses when he has a guy proven to be a defense's friend.

I agree that there are some coaching staffs and organizations that are just incompetent, but all of them? Jacksonville has Henne and Gabbert and tebow would solve part of their ticket problem and they want nothing to do with him. There does not seem to be even one team that thinks he can be an effective starting QB.

I don't know how you can possibly know no NFL teams want him. You have said it twice now and that just seems like pure conjecture on your part. Let's wait until he is actually on the market before making blanket claims like that.

 

[GroveDiesel]

ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games

in an era where rules/emphasis has been tweaked to ensure passing numbers across the board are up, this isn't an apples to apples comparison

Elway was horrible over his first 16 games. It's just not possible to adjust his stats for any rule changes that change that. He was really truly awful.

 

[packseasontix]

Tebow needed a shot in New York which he never got. I don't care if he looked horrible in practices. Your not doing crap anyways might as well get him out there as the starter 1 game and see what he can do for you.Otherwise cut him as gadget plays are moronic. You don't take the ball out of the hands of the best player. Rodgers on the sideline while Cobb takes a direct snap? No thank you

 

[Tau837]

I think a big reason Tebow won those games in Denver was in part because nobody had a playbook on this guy, coupled along with the unpredictable nature of broken down plays. Its very hard to defend what you know little about. But Tebow isn't much of a mystery anymore, and the whole" wildcat" crapola was figured out how to defend years ago. There's no place for it in the NFL anymore. His limitations are now very apparent, and say what you want about his advantage on read option, it's not enough on its own to keep on winning in this league.

RG3 is an effective pocket passer. Tebow isn't, or at least not reliably. The guy throws a great ball about as often as a truly good QB throws bad ones. Blame it on his mechanics. Blame it on his coaching. Lay the blame wherever you'd like, either way the fact remains: this guy can't even show effectiveness and/or earn a staffs confidence in a practice situation where his own teammates have to let up on the gas a little so not to hurt him. Start him? Exactly why? The idea that Tebow is suddenly going to overcome his deficiencies as an NFL calibur QB in live action is just wishful thinking, as if the guy just needs to warm up or knock some rust off. That's just not the case with Tebow. Im sorry.

Praise his legs all you want. You can't run a QB 20 times a game and expect him to stay healthy for 16 regular season games, much less deep into the even more physical nature of the playoffs. If Denver gave Tebow the shot from week 1 during his season there and ran him 20 times a game (plus all of the running he'd have to do on broken plays, ect.), he would have never lasted. Guaranteed.

Not sure what's so funny, I agree with him.

Me, too. And if you aren't confident that he can avoid injury given the pounding he would take, you have a bigger problem. You need a backup QB that can run the Tebow offense. But the type of offense that would fit Tebow wouldn't fit many other QBs very well. That's a problem that tends to be overlooked in these discussions IMO.

 

[Ignoramus]

Tebow needed a shot in New York which he never got. I don't care if he looked horrible in practices. Your not doing crap anyways might as well get him out there as the starter 1 game and see what he can do for you.

I tend to agree. The problem is that if Rex puts in Tebow and they still suck, the problem then becomes the coaching. Keeping Sanchez in there gives them a convenient scapegoat.Of course, the other side of the coin is that letting Tebow start one game, or two games, or even seven games won't be enough for the Tebowvangelists. They need to see at least fifteen seasons of ####ty quarterbacking to have a full body of work to judge.

 

[Hairy Snowman]

I want to reiterate that Tebow had a history of throwing the ball accurately in High School and College before the Broncos began tinkering with his throwing motion. I would like to see what would happen if Tebow was able to throw naturally. I realize its slow. But because of his size, he escapes pass rush and pressures the defensive backfield. It causes the break down in a defense. He doesn't have to have fast mechanics if he does that consistently. His running skills cause break downs. He just needs to recognize the break downs and throw the ball accurately. I think backup in Washington makes sense. I also think Andy Reid could utilize him in KC.

 

[Maelstrom]

I want to reiterate that Tebow had a history of throwing the ball accurately in High School and College before the Broncos began tinkering with his throwing motion. I would like to see what would happen if Tebow was able to throw naturally. I realize its slow. But because of his size, he escapes pass rush and pressures the defensive backfield. It causes the break down in a defense. He doesn't have to have fast mechanics if he does that consistently. His running skills cause break downs. He just needs to recognize the break downs and throw the ball accurately. I think backup in Washington makes sense. I also think Andy Reid could utilize him in KC.

Reminds me of what happened with Blair Walsh (Min PK) - in his last year of college he was trying to speed up his kicking motion, causing his accuracy to suffer greatly. The Vikings had him slow down (by like .5s or something) and he has been pretty darn accurate this season.I don't think we know the entire story behind Tebow. I do not believe that his outspokenness about his faith has anything to do with whether he has gotten chances or not though - there are many NFL players that are relatively outspoken about their faith.

 

[zDragon]

I see the 73 page Tebow Era thread and decided this deserves its own thread. Tebow has been a winning QB in the NFL. He provided a dimension that has caused numerous copycats around the league. Washington, Carolina and San Francisco, just to name a few, have run a version of the read-option this year following its success with Tebow last year. However, I am saying that Tebow provides an element none of the other QBs do - durability of a fullback/H-Back. I feel he has a different frame than any of the other people playing the position. He has been running the read option since high school. He can handle a 200+ carry season. Tim brings a power running game to the QB position. As a fan of power running teams like Pittsburgh or the NYG, I know football is won or lost by your ability to dominate a 10 yard area from the line of scrimmage. Especially in the 4th quarter, Tebow helps you dominate that 10 yard area. I still believe he has not been used properly yet. I believe he needs to run the ball at least 10 times a game. Get 20+ runs out of your running back and you can expect the defense to be hurting. Because he CAN run 20 times in a game, the safety HAS to respect the QB rushing. There is no one in the game that will force the safety in the box like Tebow. So there is usually no help over the top on defense. Which is why the deep ball opens up.I think the biggest problem with Tebow is that the coaches tinkered too much with his throwing motion. Because of the safety crowding the line, I don't think that Tebow needs to have the fastest throwing motion. Or even a fast motion. He needs to see the defense and throw accurately when people are open. I think the coaches should stop listening to Steve Young, who has been trying to change his motion in a way so Tebow could fit into a west coast offense, and let Tebow just chuck the ball like a baseball the way he does. I am telling you accuracy of his throws was not a problem in high school or college. It was always the speed of his delivery. People need to see whether he can use his slow mechanics in the nfl. He has earned that. If he was accurate on his throws, there would be no debate. To the point of the post, I think he was brought to New York strictly as a publicity stunt to trump the Giants following the Super Bowl win. The owner of the Jets should be ashamed. At the least, he set back the career of Tebow, who appeared promising. In the end, Tebow won games and could still win games with 15 creative read-option plays in a run based offense. I think he is getting the shaft.

This is really turning me off from the NFL and the media that covers it. Nobody can say that he was given a fair shot. Nobody. I see some of these average QBs get gigs time and time again with NO success, EVER. This guy, was a standout in college...has won everywhere he has played, and has always been a professional leader in life and the lockerroom. He gets a chance to shine in Denver and does. He gets kicked out. He goes to NY waiting for Sanchez to fail and come in a take over. He never gets his shot because the team is afraid that he will win. Don't tell me that this doesn't have to do with him being vocal about his belief either. That is the ONLY sane reason. I've watchted the NFL for 25 years and have never seen anything like this. This guy is a winner, plain and simple and is being black-balled by the NFL.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I see the 73 page Tebow Era thread and decided this deserves its own thread.

Tebow has been a winning QB in the NFL. He provided a dimension that has caused numerous copycats around the league. Washington, Carolina and San Francisco, just to name a few, have run a version of the read-option this year following its success with Tebow last year.

However, I am saying that Tebow provides an element none of the other QBs do - durability of a fullback/H-Back. I feel he has a different frame than any of the other people playing the position. He has been running the read option since high school. He can handle a 200+ carry season. Tim brings a power running game to the QB position. As a fan of power running teams like Pittsburgh or the NYG, I know football is won or lost by your ability to dominate a 10 yard area from the line of scrimmage. Especially in the 4th quarter, Tebow helps you dominate that 10 yard area.

I still believe he has not been used properly yet. I believe he needs to run the ball at least 10 times a game. Get 20+ runs out of your running back and you can expect the defense to be hurting. Because he CAN run 20 times in a game, the safety HAS to respect the QB rushing. There is no one in the game that will force the safety in the box like Tebow. So there is usually no help over the top on defense. Which is why the deep ball opens up.

I think the biggest problem with Tebow is that the coaches tinkered too much with his throwing motion. Because of the safety crowding the line, I don't think that Tebow needs to have the fastest throwing motion. Or even a fast motion. He needs to see the defense and throw accurately when people are open. I think the coaches should stop listening to Steve Young, who has been trying to change his motion in a way so Tebow could fit into a west coast offense, and let Tebow just chuck the ball like a baseball the way he does. I am telling you accuracy of his throws was not a problem in high school or college. It was always the speed of his delivery. People need to see whether he can use his slow mechanics in the nfl. He has earned that. If he was accurate on his throws, there would be no debate.

To the point of the post, I think he was brought to New York strictly as a publicity stunt to trump the Giants following the Super Bowl win. The owner of the Jets should be ashamed. At the least, he set back the career of Tebow, who appeared promising. In the end, Tebow won games and could still win games with 15 creative read-option plays in a run based offense. I think he is getting the shaft.

This is really turning me off from the NFL and the media that covers it. Nobody can say that he was given a fair shot. Nobody. I see some of these average QBs get gigs time and time again with NO success, EVER. This guy, was a standout in college...has won everywhere he has played, and has always been a professional leader in life and the lockerroom. He gets a chance to shine in Denver and does. He gets kicked out. He goes to NY waiting for Sanchez to fail and come in a take over. He never gets his shot because the team is afraid that he will win. Don't tell me that this doesn't have to do with him being vocal about his belief either. That is the ONLY sane reason. I've watchted the NFL for 25 years and have never seen anything like this. This guy is a winner, plain and simple and is being black-balled by the NFL.

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

 

[Phenix]

The hate has gone too far. how can anyone in their right mind think this guy is given a fair shot. HE NEVER PLAYED OVER SANCHEZ JUST ONE YEAR AFTER LEADING A TEAM TO THE FINAL 4 IN THE AFC..Again, how is that fair. No one is worse than Sanchez, yes even Tebow is better then that useless waste of space.

 

[Run It Up]

Hes been given an unfair shot.He has no business quarterbacking an NFL team.

 

[lod01]

ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games

This comparison takes stupid to a whole new level. In case you have no idea why it is so stupid, explain why you are comparing Tebow to Elway of all QB's. That is when you will see the stupidity of it.I'll help ya. Hint: 'they both played for Denver.' Yeah, like I said, stupid.Hey, I got an idea for ya. Compare him to Peyton Manning, especially W-L record. It will make think Tebow is even more special.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.But lets look at the facts:In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him. Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

 

[PatsFanCT]

Who cares? There's no such thing as a "fair shot". Nobody is entitled to anything in the NFL. You either earn it, or you don't.

 

[pittstownkiller]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.But lets look at the facts:In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him. Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

 

[ConnSKINS26]

I'm going to go sign Tebow in my Madden career just so I can cut him again and then watch him languish in FA. I'm really excited about it.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.

But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

Why? You think if he looked great in practice they would lie about it?

 

[GroveDiesel]

ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games

This comparison takes stupid to a whole new level. In case you have no idea why it is so stupid, explain why you are comparing Tebow to Elway of all QB's. That is when you will see the stupidity of it.I'll help ya. Hint: 'they both played for Denver.' Yeah, like I said, stupid.Hey, I got an idea for ya. Compare him to Peyton Manning, especially W-L record. It will make think Tebow is even more special.

Or maybe the comparison was made because Elway is the one that made the decision to get rid of Tebow? Are you able to comprehend why that would be meaningful, especially in the context of discussing Elway's reasons for getting rid of Tebow?

 

[FlapJacks]

After what Henne has done, I can't blame Jax for declining. I think acQuiring Tebow requires a commitment to revamp an offense to his skill set. I think such an offense could succeed, but NFL coaches are risk-averse and would not want to do this. It's clearly not Ryan's style. I do think the CFL may be a good fit.

 

[GregR]

Instead of saying, "he wins". Explain what he does well to contribute to the team.

Winning. No seriously, on top of the intangibles with leadership, motivation, and rallying guys around him, he forces defenses to stack the box and play the run/ run option. Which leaves guys wide open or one on one downfield. That's why he doesn't necessarily have to be accurate. He just has to be opportunistic and take advantage of big plays when they present themselves. That's the tebow offense in a nutshell I think. Which, by the way, isn't a whole lot different from the Vince Young offense, or the Mike Vick offense, or the RG3 offense, or the Colin Kaepernick offense.

But those offenses complete 10-15% more of their passes than Tebow does.

 

[SacramentoBob]

He was given the exact shot he deserved, which is none.

 

[rustycolts]

So I wonder how long its going to take.

 

[SacramentoBob]

He was given the exact shot he deserved, which is none.

He was really good in punt formations though. He missed his true calling.

 

[monk]

Tebow won more playoff games with the Broncos last year than Peyton did this year

 

[gcoast3]

Broncos made it as far this year with Peyton...

 

[rustycolts]

Tebow won more playoff games with the Broncos last year than Peyton did this year

Wondered how long it would take two posts not bad.I really enjoyed watching Tebow play for the Gators and was really hoping he would have the chance to play in the NFL.As far as his accuracy goes he was pretty damn accurate in college.He has several records in the SEC for passing but I know college and the pros are two different things.As much as I was hoping to see him succeed In the NFL, I think the points brought up about the coaches and other experts who actually work in football and can judge talent are more qualified than me to judge weather Tebow can make it.He is a great kid and maybe he could make it in the CFL,but I think he will hang up his cleats and start a ministry ala Danny Weurful.Looks like another Gator QB that will never make it in the NFL

 

[GregR]

Kind of ironic that the amount of over zealous support that fans have given Tebow is actually a part of why teams don't want to give him a shot. His presence creates too much controversy, not necessarily because of anything Tebow himself has done.Not that that's the only, or primary, reason he's not in demand, but it definitely contributes.

 

[FinHead]

Tebow is exciting to watch and he finds a way to win. He was probably the best player on the Jet's offense and it's amazing they kept starting Sanchez at QB. I hope he gets an offseason and a real shot to start somewhere next season... he's got a lot more upside than Vick.

 

[teamramrod]

waaaaaaaaaI am sorry, life is not fair. Go ask Alex Smith. If Tebow could actually be a true QB in the NFL then let him.but the two best are Brady and Peyton and how mobile are they?Go on a mission somewhere and leave us alone.peace

 

[coolnerd]

Kind of ironic that the amount of over zealous support that fans have given Tebow is actually a part of why teams don't want to give him a shot. His presence creates too much controversy, not necessarily because of anything Tebow himself as done.

Yep. Collin Klein is as close to a righthanded clone of this guy as it comes. Highly productive, christian player who is tough running QB with questionable passing skills. Watch where he goes in the draft and that's where Tebow should have gone.

 

[Hairy Snowman]

As some of the O-Linemen of the Jets made sure to declare publicly during the season, the offensive linemen had never been in a read option offense and they refused to learn it. This has as much to do with the selfish nature of the players on the Jets as much as Tebows unique skill set. Regarding the "fair" shot, the 49ers demonstrated last night that the read option ("college offense") works fine in the NFL. There has never been anyone who has run that offense better than Tebow. Fact.

 

[Two Deep]

he is not very athletically inclined in the head if you get my drift.

 

[Black&Gold]

I see the 73 page Tebow Era thread and decided this deserves its own thread.

Tebow has been a winning QB in the NFL. He provided a dimension that has caused numerous copycats around the league. Washington, Carolina and San Francisco, just to name a few, have run a version of the read-option this year following its success with Tebow last year.

However, I am saying that Tebow provides an element none of the other QBs do - durability of a fullback/H-Back. I feel he has a different frame than any of the other people playing the position. He has been running the read option since high school. He can handle a 200+ carry season. Tim brings a power running game to the QB position. As a fan of power running teams like Pittsburgh or the NYG, I know football is won or lost by your ability to dominate a 10 yard area from the line of scrimmage. Especially in the 4th quarter, Tebow helps you dominate that 10 yard area.

I still believe he has not been used properly yet. I believe he needs to run the ball at least 10 times a game. Get 20+ runs out of your running back and you can expect the defense to be hurting. Because he CAN run 20 times in a game, the safety HAS to respect the QB rushing. There is no one in the game that will force the safety in the box like Tebow. So there is usually no help over the top on defense. Which is why the deep ball opens up.

I think the biggest problem with Tebow is that the coaches tinkered too much with his throwing motion. Because of the safety crowding the line, I don't think that Tebow needs to have the fastest throwing motion. Or even a fast motion. He needs to see the defense and throw accurately when people are open. I think the coaches should stop listening to Steve Young, who has been trying to change his motion in a way so Tebow could fit into a west coast offense, and let Tebow just chuck the ball like a baseball the way he does. I am telling you accuracy of his throws was not a problem in high school or college. It was always the speed of his delivery. People need to see whether he can use his slow mechanics in the nfl. He has earned that. If he was accurate on his throws, there would be no debate.

To the point of the post, I think he was brought to New York strictly as a publicity stunt to trump the Giants following the Super Bowl win. The owner of the Jets should be ashamed. At the least, he set back the career of Tebow, who appeared promising. In the end, Tebow won games and could still win games with 15 creative read-option plays in a run based offense. I think he is getting the shaft.

This is really turning me off from the NFL and the media that covers it. Nobody can say that he was given a fair shot. Nobody. I see some of these average QBs get gigs time and time again with NO success, EVER. This guy, was a standout in college...has won everywhere he has played, and has always been a professional leader in life and the lockerroom. He gets a chance to shine in Denver and does. He gets kicked out. He goes to NY waiting for Sanchez to fail and come in a take over. He never gets his shot because the team is afraid that he will win. Don't tell me that this doesn't have to do with him being vocal about his belief either. That is the ONLY sane reason. I've watchted the NFL for 25 years and have never seen anything like this. This guy is a winner, plain and simple and is being black-balled by the NFL.

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

Name one 1st rounder that was cut after 2 seasons without off the field troubles. Let alone one that had the success that Tebow had in his 2nd season. His time in NY was terrible. He doesn't get on the field after Sanchez gets benched...REALLY? The media and the NFL is making an example of Tebow for being vocal about his faith. They don't mind people with faith in the NFL, just don't be a vocal figurehead for it. If his name was Abdul Shad Mohammad, he'd be given every starting chance possible. Even if he lost every game for years, he'd be given a chance. That is the only possible explanation. And all the haters will say I'm crazy...sure, he doesn't look good in practice. What a bunch of garbage. And it's not like I think you have to be a saint to be a great QB in the NFL. I've had Ben in Pittsburgh and wouldn't trade him for any QB. But you can't tell me that a proven winner can't find playing time in the NFL AS A QB.

 

[PatsFanCT]

Tebow is exciting to watch and he finds a way to win. He was probably the best player on the Jet's offense and it's amazing they kept starting Sanchez at QB. I hope he gets an offseason and a real shot to start somewhere next season... he's got a lot more upside than Vick.

This is probably the most ridiculous post in a thread full of ridiculous posts.

 

[12punch]

I see the 73 page Tebow Era thread and decided this deserves its own thread.

Tebow has been a winning QB in the NFL. He provided a dimension that has caused numerous copycats around the league. Washington, Carolina and San Francisco, just to name a few, have run a version of the read-option this year following its success with Tebow last year.

However, I am saying that Tebow provides an element none of the other QBs do - durability of a fullback[/H-Back. I feel he has a different frame than any of the other people playing the position. He has been running the read option since high school. He can handle a 200+ carry season. Tim brings a power running game to the QB position. As a fan of power running teams like Pittsburgh or the NYG, I know football is won or lost by your ability to dominate a 10 yard area from the line of scrimmage. Especially in the 4th quarter, Tebow helps you dominate that 10 yard area.

I still believe he has not been used properly yet. I believe he needs to run the ball at least 10 times a game. Get 20+ runs out of your running back and you can expect the defense to be hurting. Because he CAN run 20 times in a game, the safety HAS to respect the QB rushing. There is no one in the game that will force the safety in the box like Tebow. So there is usually no help over the top on defense. Which is why the deep ball opens up.

I think the biggest problem with Tebow is that the coaches tinkered too much with his throwing motion. Because of the safety crowding the line, I don't think that Tebow needs to have the fastest throwing motion. Or even a fast motion. He needs to see the defense and throw accurately when people are open. I think the coaches should stop listening to Steve Young, who has been trying to change his motion in a way so Tebow could fit into a west coast offense, and let Tebow just chuck the ball like a baseball the way he does. I am telling you accuracy of his throws was not a problem in high school or college. It was always the speed of his delivery. People need to see whether he can use his slow mechanics in the nfl. He has earned that. If he was accurate on his throws, there would be no debate.

To the point of the post, I think he was brought to New York strictly as a publicity stunt to trump the Giants following the Super Bowl win. The owner of the Jets should be ashamed. At the least, he set back the career of Tebow, who appeared promising. In the end, Tebow won games and could still win games with 15 creative read-option plays in a run based offense. I think he is getting the shaft.

didn't teblows break his ribs after about 10 plays this year?

 

[BDubs]

Kind of ironic that the amount of over zealous support that fans have given Tebow is actually a part of why teams don't want to give him a shot. His presence creates too much controversy, not necessarily because of anything Tebow himself as done.Not that that's the only, or primary, reason he's not in demand, but it definitely contributes.

The media and the NFL is making an example of Tebow for being vocal about his faith. They don't mind people with faith in the NFL, just don't be a vocal figurehead for it. If his name was Abdul Shad Mohammad, he'd be given every starting chance possible. Even if he lost every game for years, he'd be given a chance. That is the only possible explanation.

 

[pittstownkiller]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.

But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

Why? You think if he looked great in practice they would lie about it?

The Jets have already been outed by most reporters here, about their version of Tebow "quitting". I do not think the Jets version of events can be trusted while so many guys were on the hot seat this year. Last season Tebow managed to stay on the Broncos as a backup, play in a handful of plays until he was given the starting job, this year (for an inferior team) he can't even find a way to get in the field. You can say what you want about Tebow, he at least deserved to start a game in this wreck of a season for the Jets.

 

[SacramentoBob]

As some of the O-Linemen of the Jets made sure to declare publicly during the season, the offensive linemen had never been in a read option offense and they refused to learn it. This has as much to do with the selfish nature of the players on the Jets as much as Tebows unique skill set. Regarding the "fair" shot, the 49ers demonstrated last night that the read option ("college offense") works fine in the NFL. There has never been anyone who has run that offense better than Tebow. Fact.

Looks like Kaepernick runs it better than Tebow ever has.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.

But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

Why? You think if he looked great in practice they would lie about it?

The Jets have already been outed by most reporters here, about their version of Tebow "quitting". I do not think the Jets version of events can be trusted while so many guys were on the hot seat this year. Last season Tebow managed to stay on the Broncos as a backup, play in a handful of plays until he was given the starting job, this year (for an inferior team) he can't even find a way to get in the field. You can say what you want about Tebow, he at least deserved to start a game in this wreck of a season for the Jets.

Why? Because he's a nice guy? The only people who "deserve" to start a game are guys who earn it. Just because Sanchez sucks doesn't mean Tebow is good. If he wanted a shot he should have earned it in practice. He couldn't.

 

[pittstownkiller]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.

But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

Why? You think if he looked great in practice they would lie about it?

The Jets have already been outed by most reporters here, about their version of Tebow "quitting". I do not think the Jets version of events can be trusted while so many guys were on the hot seat this year. Last season Tebow managed to stay on the Broncos as a backup, play in a handful of plays until he was given the starting job, this year (for an inferior team) he can't even find a way to get in the field. You can say what you want about Tebow, he at least deserved to start a game in this wreck of a season for the Jets.

Why? Because he's a nice guy? The only people who "deserve" to start a game are guys who earn it. Just because Sanchez sucks doesn't mean Tebow is good. If he wanted a shot he should have earned it in practice. He couldn't.

You keep saying this like it is fact. How could he earn it with Denver but not in NY? You do sound slightly naive to me, if you believe that performance is the only criteria used in deciding who plays and who doesn't. I never saw a reason that he couldn't make an appearance on the field for a significant time except they didn't want him out there; you seem to think that all programs operate under some righteous virtue of the best are alway given the opportunity; we will have to agree to disagree.

 

[Possum]

As some of the O-Linemen of the Jets made sure to declare publicly during the season, the offensive linemen had never been in a read option offense and they refused to learn it. This has as much to do with the selfish nature of the players on the Jets as much as Tebows unique skill set. Regarding the "fair" shot, the 49ers demonstrated last night that the read option ("college offense") works fine in the NFL. There has never been anyone who has run that offense better than Tebow. Fact.

Looks like Kaepernick runs it better than Tebow ever has.

the thing is, though, that Tebow has never had the opportunity to run a full-fledged spread option attack in the pros like SF does with Kaepernick. Comparing the relatively minor ad hoc changes Fox/McCoy made to their running game seven games into the season in 2011 to the total design and philosophy San Francisco's offense embraces is not an apples to apples comparison.what Denver did in 2011 was basically incorporate a read-option play out of shotgun, a heavy shotgun package QB dive, and a triple-option play and tack those plays onto their regular offense. Their coaching staff got a lot of attention for being innovative because those plays were relatively new to the modern NFL (and to be fair, they deserve credit for being willing to try it out), but the design and implementation of how those few run plays were used left a lot to be desired when looking at the way teams like SF/Washington run their offenses.Denver's base passing offense mainly stayed the same all year - they didn't run much shotgun spread, they didn't run much play-action off the read-option or try to dictate passing matchups based on the looks it creates, they didn't try to move the pocket, etc. Instead, they tacked the option plays onto their base offense halfway through the season and mixed them in with a very run-heavy gameplan and a fairly vanilla traditional passing offense.at the risk of sounding like a Tebow apologist, I don't think what Denver did with him is anywhere in the same ballpark as what Kaepernick's getting to do in SF. I think that if Tebow were given the keys to a full spread option offense in the NFL, with a coaching staff and team that committed to that style and philosophy, his comfort level with that offense and the passing matchups it creates, plus his ability to generate offense with his legs, would make him look like a lot better prospect. I think if you put him on the Niners and gave him the same development curve and team support around him that Kaepernick has had, he'd be a viable NFL starter. Tebow got really screwed by Josh McDaniels making him a first round pick - all the draft experts said he was a guy who needed time to develop if he was going to make it in the league, and if he had gone somewhere as a later round pick and had the opportunity to avoid the spotlight and work on refining his flaws, things might have been a lot different for him. as far as the poll question goes, I don't know how to answer that - I don't think that there's any kind of league-wide conspiracy to blackball him. I also think the Jets gave him a raw deal and never had any intention of giving him a real shot at QB or even using him in some type of special offensive capacity (especially after hearing Mike Westhoff's comments about there never having been a Tebow package all year). I think at this point Tebow's best chance is either to catch on with someplace like SF or Washington as a backup and work on his throwing game for a few years, or to go to a CFL team that would be willing to run the spread option with him and try to get back to the league that way a la Warren Moon or Doug Flutie.

 

[Not Sleeping]

I see the 73 page Tebow Era thread and decided this deserves its own thread.

Tebow has been a winning QB in the NFL. He provided a dimension that has caused numerous copycats around the league. Washington, Carolina and San Francisco, just to name a few, have run a version of the read-option this year following its success with Tebow last year.

However, I am saying that Tebow provides an element none of the other QBs do - durability of a fullback/H-Back. I feel he has a different frame than any of the other people playing the position. He has been running the read option since high school. He can handle a 200+ carry season. Tim brings a power running game to the QB position. As a fan of power running teams like Pittsburgh or the NYG, I know football is won or lost by your ability to dominate a 10 yard area from the line of scrimmage. Especially in the 4th quarter, Tebow helps you dominate that 10 yard area.

I still believe he has not been used properly yet. I believe he needs to run the ball at least 10 times a game. Get 20+ runs out of your running back and you can expect the defense to be hurting. Because he CAN run 20 times in a game, the safety HAS to respect the QB rushing. There is no one in the game that will force the safety in the box like Tebow. So there is usually no help over the top on defense. Which is why the deep ball opens up.

I think the biggest problem with Tebow is that the coaches tinkered too much with his throwing motion. Because of the safety crowding the line, I don't think that Tebow needs to have the fastest throwing motion. Or even a fast motion. He needs to see the defense and throw accurately when people are open. I think the coaches should stop listening to Steve Young, who has been trying to change his motion in a way so Tebow could fit into a west coast offense, and let Tebow just chuck the ball like a baseball the way he does. I am telling you accuracy of his throws was not a problem in high school or college. It was always the speed of his delivery. People need to see whether he can use his slow mechanics in the nfl. He has earned that. If he was accurate on his throws, there would be no debate.

To the point of the post, I think he was brought to New York strictly as a publicity stunt to trump the Giants following the Super Bowl win. The owner of the Jets should be ashamed. At the least, he set back the career of Tebow, who appeared promising. In the end, Tebow won games and could still win games with 15 creative read-option plays in a run based offense. I think he is getting the shaft.

This is really turning me off from the NFL and the media that covers it. Nobody can say that he was given a fair shot. Nobody. I see some of these average QBs get gigs time and time again with NO success, EVER. This guy, was a standout in college...has won everywhere he has played, and has always been a professional leader in life and the lockerroom. He gets a chance to shine in Denver and does. He gets kicked out. He goes to NY waiting for Sanchez to fail and come in a take over. He never gets his shot because the team is afraid that he will win. Don't tell me that this doesn't have to do with him being vocal about his belief either. That is the ONLY sane reason. I've watchted the NFL for 25 years and have never seen anything like this. This guy is a winner, plain and simple and is being black-balled by the NFL.

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

Name one 1st rounder that was cut after 2 seasons without off the field troubles. Let alone one that had the success that Tebow had in his 2nd season. His time in NY was terrible. He doesn't get on the field after Sanchez gets benched...REALLY? The media and the NFL is making an example of Tebow for being vocal about his faith. They don't mind people with faith in the NFL, just don't be a vocal figurehead for it. If his name was Abdul Shad Mohammad, he'd be given every starting chance possible. Even if he lost every game for years, he'd be given a chance. That is the only possible explanation. And all the haters will say I'm crazy...sure, he doesn't look good in practice. What a bunch of garbage. And it's not like I think you have to be a saint to be a great QB in the NFL. I've had Ben in Pittsburgh and wouldn't trade him for any QB. But you can't tell me that a proven winner can't find playing time in the NFL AS A QB.

I hear you brother. White Christian men can't catch a break in this country!PS: That was sarcasm!

 

[KellysHeroes]

Tebow 1 / Manning 0

 

[Dr. Awesome]

This is insane. These coaches have one job, to win to keep their jobs. If they thought Tebow could win them games they will bring him in. The Jets bringing him in was dumb and they misused him and even thought we don't know how we was in practice the Jets probably should have given him a chance.

But lets look at the facts:

In his first year he started three games and played in more. After five games last year the Broncos gave him the start for the rest of the year. They had a chance to a HOF qb and maybe the biggest FA of all time and they replaced him.

Maybe the Jets wronged him which backfired on them, but there is no league wide blacklisting of Tebow.

He allegedly looks like crap in practice. If true, why the hell should they put him in actual games?

Just curious, who is the phrase "he looked terrible in practice" attributed to; the Jets coaching staff? If so, I think we have to take that with a grain of salt.

Why? You think if he looked great in practice they would lie about it?

The Jets have already been outed by most reporters here, about their version of Tebow "quitting". I do not think the Jets version of events can be trusted while so many guys were on the hot seat this year. Last season Tebow managed to stay on the Broncos as a backup, play in a handful of plays until he was given the starting job, this year (for an inferior team) he can't even find a way to get in the field. You can say what you want about Tebow, he at least deserved to start a game in this wreck of a season for the Jets.

Why? Because he's a nice guy? The only people who "deserve" to start a game are guys who earn it. Just because Sanchez sucks doesn't mean Tebow is good. If he wanted a shot he should have earned it in practice. He couldn't.

You keep saying this like it is fact. How could he earn it with Denver but not in NY? You do sound slightly naive to me, if you believe that performance is the only criteria used in deciding who plays and who doesn't. I never saw a reason that he couldn't make an appearance on the field for a significant time except they didn't want him out there; you seem to think that all programs operate under some righteous virtue of the best are alway given the opportunity; we will have to agree to disagree.

I originally said allegedly. It's nestled in this very quote mess we've got going so I'm not saying it like it's fact. But why did he get a chance in Denver and not New York? Various reasons. They drafted him. The fans were going crazy for him. They were under no illusion Orton could actually be a starter for them going forward. The Jets are a mess of a franchise. But no matter how crappy they are, you think Rex Ryan is going to keep the next Steve Young on the bench simply because...what, he's too religious? He has a Sanchez tattoo? The simplest answer is most likely the correct answer. Rex Ryan saw Tebow a lot more than we did. Rex Ryan thought Tebow looked like crap. Rex Ryan played his best option, as lousy as it was.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

1. Tebow was not given a fair shot.2. Nobody in the NFL is owed a fair shot.Now, if Terrelle Pryor and Ryan Lindley can get an NFL start, no reason Tebow shouldn't. I don't believe that those guys "earned" a start but Tebow didn't. He was lied to and treated poorly in New York.Of course, he's owed nothing but his paycheck. But I don't see how anyone could say he was given a fair shot, considering the garbage some teams put behind center. Once the Jets were eliminated, all they could do is lose a meaningless game.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

1. Tebow was not given a fair shot.

2. Nobody in the NFL is owed a fair shot.



Now, if Terrelle Pryor and Ryan Lindley can get an NFL start, no reason Tebow shouldn't. I don't believe that those guys "earned" a start but Tebow didn't. He was lied to and treated poorly in New York.

Of course, he's owed nothing but his paycheck. But I don't see how anyone could say he was given a fair shot, considering the garbage some teams put behind center. Once the Jets were eliminated, all they could do is lose a meaningless game.

He did get a shot. He won games but put up some ugly numbers. He flashed some potential, yes. But he also showed a lot of the flaws scouts had claimed would be a problem. Lots of players flash some potential but never get much playing time. Sometimes guys fluke their way into a few wins. Doesn't mean they're good. If his name weren't Tim Tebow and were instead...say...John Skelton, this hype wouldn't have reached 1/10 of Tebowmania.

 

[Beerguzzler]

I hope he's out of the league so we can stop hearing about a ####ty backup on espn everyday.

 

[Phenix]

ironic since Tebow's numbers over his first 16 games are arguably better than Elway's first 16 games

This comparison takes stupid to a whole new level. In case you have no idea why it is so stupid, explain why you are comparing Tebow to Elway of all QB's. That is when you will see the stupidity of it.I'll help ya. Hint: 'they both played for Denver.' Yeah, like I said, stupid.Hey, I got an idea for ya. Compare him to Peyton Manning, especially W-L record. It will make think Tebow is even more special.

Get help man.