It's okay Peyton, you're 7-0, ... (1 Viewer)

[Kevin Ashcraft]

This thread is making my head hurt.

It is also pointless

 

[MagicMan]

Amazing how much clearly better a QB Peyton is than Elway was, or Aikman was.. yet they had .. for whatever reason a better ball bounce... a better RB to show up... a better defense.. moreover a better coach (in Rat and Jimmy J).. but you'll already get into the hall. They'll try to knock you down like Marino, and all the haters will try to discount you, because you dont' have a ring,.... but what you really didn't have was a 2,000 yd RB.... like the 'loser' Elway had before.... Elway couldn't complete the job circa the Niner blowout until he inherited TD.. Aikman had the ALL TIME RUSHING LEADER and a superb line and HOF WR... you've made an otherwise pedestrian Marvin a HOFer... but they'll say you inherited he. No worries. You'll get an LJ someday, like Elway did, or join some shop that is superb top-to-bottom, and then, and only then, will they not take from you, mate.

idiot

 

[Warpig]

Oh yeah, there was some real egregious cap violation going on in Denver during the superbowl years.

And Merriman is a victim of the system. You can paint it however you like, but cheating is cheating.

There's a difference between breaking the rules and cheating. Cheating is breaking the rules with the express intent of gaining a competitive advantage. Denver didn't gain a competitive advantage, so they weren't cheating, they were just breaking the rules. Merriman claims he didn't INTEND to gain a competitive advantage (after Flloyd Landis, I'm sick of giving athletes the benefit of the doubt, but that's just me). If Merriman is telling the truth, then he didn't cheat, either- he just broke the rules.If you want a better illustration... coaches get fined for criticizing officiating (unless you're Mike Holmgren, apparently), but I don't think anyone would ever say that criticizing the officiating was cheating.

Solid O-line + solid defense + average skill players will get you a SB before Pedestrian O-line + pedestrian defense + Awesome skill players.

A mediocre-at-best offensive line and an absolutely piss-poor run defense = enough to win the Super Bowl?

What the heck are you guys smoking? If Indy's O-Line the past 3 seasons is "mediocre at best" or "pedestrian", then I suppose Kansas City's offensive line of the past 3 years was just "decent", and Seattle's was "alright", and Denver's was "sort of good".Here's a *FACT* for you- Indy's line has ranked 7th, 1st, 1st, and now 2nd in Adjusted Line Yards (counts all runs of 10+ yards as just 10 yards and then calculates the average per-carry of the runningbacks). That stat is designed to determine how big of an influence the line is having on an RB's success (since the difference between a 20 yard run and a 90 yard run typically has nothing to do with the OL and everything to do with the WRs and RB). You can say that that's all Edgerrin James, but this year James is in Arizona, and Indy ranks 2nd in adjusted line yards while Arizona is 31st (they were 32nd last year). Edgerrin James going from Indy to Arizona has dropped Indy's adjusted line yards one rank, and raised Arizona's adjusted line yards one rank. Indy also always scores among the bottom 3 teams in the league in terms of total yards that come 10+ yards beyond the line of scrimmage- again, the hallmark of a team with ridiculously good run blocking.As far as pass blocking goes, Indy's line has ranked 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 1st, and 3rd in the past 5 years in that category (which measures sacks per pass attempt and then adjusts for the quality of the passrush faced). In other words, Indy's offensive line, in addition to being a stellar run-blocking crew, is also one of the top-3 pass-blocking lines in the business. If you watched the Denver game last week, you'd see that not once during the entire second half did a Denver defender get within 3 feet of Peyton Manning before he threw the ball (and he routinely held it for 5 seconds before unloading).Manning's offensive line is RIDICULOUS- easily one of the top-5 units in the league- and has been for about 4 years now.

Yeah...they looked like a "top-5"unit in that playoff game against Pittsburgh last year. Maybe they suffer from the same stage fright as Peyton.I think they look better than what they actually are because MOST defenses are too scared to stack the box against Peyton. I think Peyton makes them look better than what they are.Those guys have it so easy because they hardly ever have to pick up blitzes since most of the time defenses are in a nickel or dime package against them.Just goes to show that if they face a good, aggressive defense they can't handle it. Even with Denver last week. Denver was afraid to blitz too much because Peyton was picking them apart. I tell ya what though...if I was getting sliced and diced defensively, I'd just go ahead and say hell with it and send everyone..."KITCHEN SINK BLITZ". Atleast get some hits on Peyton. He'll rattle.

 

[icehouse]

There is a difference between excelling and losing because you didn't have any help (since you do need help in football to win) and losing because you played like crap. Manning has played like crap in most of those playoff defeats. You can directly point to his numbers and say "thats garbage". Compare his post-season play (in losses) to his numbers in the regular season and it's no suprise that he has a choker label, even going back to his college days.

Contrast that to someone like Warren Moon who also never won a ring, but he played well in his defeats and gave his teams leads that the defense blew late in the game.

 

[SSOG]

If you *HONESTLY* believed that the league was of the opinion that Denver gained a competitive advantage by cheating the salary cap, do you really think that the league would have responded by stripping them of a 3rd round pick?

Do you *HONESTLY* believe that if the Broncos did no wrong they would have forfeited a draft pick and been fined one million dollars? The reason that the penalty was not harsher was because the CBA that established the salary cap contained language regarding penalties for failure to comply. Forfeiture of games or titles was not among them.

Of course the Broncos "did wrong". They broke the rules. And Merriman "did wrong" by taking an unapproved supplement. And Chad Johnson "did wrong" by wearing "Ocho Cinco" on his jersey last week. All three times, the parties were punished. Doesn't mean they cheated.

Off the top of my head, I'd also say he's one of the least sacked qb's in the league. Can anybody pull up the stats on that?

Of course he is. Indy's line is custom built for pass blocking. To say he's played behind a poor, or even average, o-line is a BS excuse for Manning never winning a championship.It was always his defense that was supposed to be keeping him down, then, last year, they were the number two defense in the league.Manning is out of excuses now. He needs to produce a championship, or his supporters must admit that he's simply the best regular season QB of all-time.

Manning is <= Dan Fouts.nothing more, nothing less..a great stats QB, who never played in a SB. the guy has never won a championship at ANY level of play, HS,College, Pros.probably never won in pop warner, either. He's simply NOT in the same category as Kelly, Marino, Elway, Aikman, Young..Heck, I wouldn't even lump him in with Phil Simms, a guy who not only won 2 SB's, but engineered one of the greatest SB performances of all-time, for a QB..

Wait, wait, wait... did you just argue that Manning isn't in the same category as Marino because he hasn't won a championship?

Yeah...they looked like a "top-5"unit in that playoff game against Pittsburgh last year. Maybe they suffer from the same stage fright as Peyton.

Oh, crap, I totally forgot that if a player or unit is top-5, he totally can't have a bad game.I need to go back through my top-5 lists. Clearly Tomlinson isn't a top-5 RB, because he rushed 17 times for 7 yards last year against Philly. And Tom Brady has like 6 career 4-INT days, so he's obviously not a top-5 QB, too. And don't get me started on the Chicago Bears defense. They gave up like 500 yards to Steve Smith last year in the playoffs. So totally NOT a top-5 defense. And what about Champ Bailey? Remember when he got repeatedly burned by Joey Porter at home against Oakland two years ago? He's mediocre at best.Alright, I revised my top 5 lists to exclude everyone who had a bad game. As it stands, the only player in the entire league who is in the top 5 at any position is Kellen Winslow. He just hasn't had a bad game yet.

Just goes to show that if they face a good, aggressive defense they can't handle it. Even with Denver last week. Denver was afraid to blitz too much because Peyton was picking them apart. I tell ya what though...if I was getting sliced and diced defensively, I'd just go ahead and say hell with it and send everyone..."KITCHEN SINK BLITZ". Atleast get some hits on Peyton. He'll rattle.

Silly me, and here I was thinking that Peyton Manning had the highest completion%, yards per attempt, TDs per attempt, and QB rating in the entire NFL against the blitz. You're right, though- he clearly rattles, as evidenced by his 0 INTs thrown against blitzes this year.