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Thome is top 50 all-time in OBP as well.And if you look at WAR, which takes into account all of his defensive and baserunning ineptitude, as well as the complete lack of a position in his late years, the guy comes in ahead of current or future HOFers such as Derek Jeter, Brooks Robinson, Tony Gwynn, Carlton Fisk, Eddie Murray, Roberto Alomar, Jackie Robinson, Yogi Berra, etc.
Sure you can.What if he hit those 600 HRs over a 25+ year career (meaning he could do it without ever cracking 30 in a year), was a DH the entire time (meaning he contributed nothing defensively, negatively impacted his managers' lineup flexibility every single game, and didn't absorb nearly as much wear and tear as everyone else on the all-time HR list), and had a relatively low OBP (meaning he made far too many outs in pursuit of HR glory)?None of those things are true, of course, and because of that I think he belongs in the Hall. But the point is that a home run total is not the end of the analysis. Or at least it shouldn't be.
Totally agree. Just saying the list of all time HR hitters in that post isn't really the company he keeps. The company he keeps are the guys in your post. Still Hall of Fame caliber guys.
You went a little overboard with your original reply to me though, don't you think? It's not like he hit all 600 hrs as a DH. Although you think I am, I'm not implying he's as good as the names on the list he joined, but he's in the company of greats that only 8 have accomplished in the history of baseball, and the legit ones are in the hall, so in he goes.
Of course I went overboard. Was just having a little fun with your post.
'TobiasFunke said:
What's with this "compiler" crap?
EVERY player compiles stats for their entire career. 300 wins is 300 wins; 600 HR is 600 HR. To accumulate those stats you had to have been good enough to stay in the majors. We're not talking Minnie Minoso here.
I think the compiler tag gets unfairly applied for two reasons. A lot of people don't like the DH and extend their dislike to anyone playing the position. Secondly, Thome has moved around a bit during the later part of his career. The BBWAA seems to love guys like Gwynn and Yount who play their entire careers in one city.Minoso isn't a good example. His last full-time season was at age 35. The cameos in the 70s and 80s were Bill Veeck stunts. For me, the ultimate compiler was Pete Rose.What's with this "compiler" crap?
I think Thome is a bit of a compiler
the last 4 years he's tacked on about 100 home runs to his total, while striking out nearly 1/3 of his plate appearances and batting .250. He hasn't been a fielder in the last 7 years now, so all he does is get paid to hit, and he's barely a viable platoon dh at that.Do we have this argument that Thome is a HOF lock HOF'er, first ballot if he retired at 500 home runs 
(ftr, his batting hof black ink and gray ink scores come in well below the average hof'er)
Can you share your evidence on this one please?
Yeah, Minoso was a tad extreme; I was looking at guys who were getting by on name/reputation alone. I think Rose fits that bill as he was player/manager and able to insert himself when he wanted to.Having said that, I guess my beef with this "compiler" crap is that for the majority of players, if they can't contribute, they're out. Even moreso now, where teams are more inclined to go with a young player with arbitration years over a vet. Hence, someone like Thome is still getting it done. I'm guessing he can still play first; it's just that he doesn't. It's not like he's had an injury history that makes him a bat only.I think the compiler tag gets unfairly applied for two reasons. A lot of people don't like the DH and extend their dislike to anyone playing the position. Secondly, Thome has moved around a bit during the later part of his career. The BBWAA seems to love guys like Gwynn and Yount who play their entire careers in one city.Minoso isn't a good example. His last full-time season was at age 35. The cameos in the 70s and 80s were Bill Veeck stunts. For me, the ultimate compiler was Pete Rose.What's with this "compiler" crap?
I'd think it would be even harder to put up stats moving around and being in different parks & batting lineups.
Maybe so but it's not entirely about stats. It's about winning the hearts and minds of HoF voters. They've demonstrated some favoritism towards guys who've stuck with one team. I think it's a bogus reason but that doesn't mean it doesn't influence some voters.
OK, yet another reason to question the people who vote.
I sensed that the arguments being made against him had to do with people suggesting he was a compiler.What's with this "compiler" crap?
You did notice that I concluded that he is a lock, right?
To be precise, over the past 4 years, Thome has hit 94 home runs, struck out in 25.7% of his plate appearances, and batted .256.Much more importantly, his OBP over that span has been .375 or so, and his SLG has been .524. It doesn't matter if someone is compiling numbers if he is doing it as an effective batter. Thome has still been an effective batter over the past four years.I think Thome is a bit of a compiler
True but he's been a platoon player over most of that period.To be precise, over the past 4 years, Thome has hit 94 home runs, struck out in 25.7% of his plate appearances, and batted .256.Much more importantly, his OBP over that span has been .375 or so, and his SLG has been .524. It doesn't matter if someone is compiling numbers if he is doing it as an effective batter. Thome has still been an effective batter over the past four years.I think Thome is a bit of a compiler
So?True but he's been a platoon player over most of that period.To be precise, over the past 4 years, Thome has hit 94 home runs, struck out in 25.7% of his plate appearances, and batted .256.Much more importantly, his OBP over that span has been .375 or so, and his SLG has been .524. It doesn't matter if someone is compiling numbers if he is doing it as an effective batter. Thome has still been an effective batter over the past four years.I think Thome is a bit of a compiler
The argument against Thome=compiler is that he's still valuable to his team. He is sort of. He's been a 1 win player in 2 of the last 3 years. He was very productive in the third year (2010). But when you factor in that he can't play the field and doesn't hit against lefties, the justification for a roster spot becomes that much harder. I wonder if the Twins or anybody else will want him back in 2012.That said, if he could still play first, I'd welcome him to SF for the stretch run in a heartbeat.So?True but he's been a platoon player over most of that period.To be precise, over the past 4 years, Thome has hit 94 home runs, struck out in 25.7% of his plate appearances, and batted .256.Much more importantly, his OBP over that span has been .375 or so, and his SLG has been .524. It doesn't matter if someone is compiling numbers if he is doing it as an effective batter. Thome has still been an effective batter over the past four years.I think Thome is a bit of a compiler
Most ofthe votes were cast in April 2010, so it's not entirely accurate. I would imagine he would get 90%+ if it was started this week.the poll results here have him at 74.26%, just short of induction
I don't think 90% on this board could agree on anythingMost ofthe votes were cast in April 2010, so it's not entirely accurate. I would imagine he would get 90%+ if it was started this week.the poll results here have him at 74.26%, just short of induction
Love of bacon?I don't think 90% on this board could agree on anythingMost ofthe votes were cast in April 2010, so it's not entirely accurate. I would imagine he would get 90%+ if it was started this week.the poll results here have him at 74.26%, just short of induction
Love of bacon?I don't think 90% on this board could agree on anythingMost ofthe votes were cast in April 2010, so it's not entirely accurate. I would imagine he would get 90%+ if it was started this week.the poll results here have him at 74.26%, just short of induction
you meant turkey bacon right?
Why, because he played in the most games?
Great posting. Look at some of the game's greatest players, and you'll see guys near the top of the most games played list. Aaron, Mays, Yaz, Musial, Rickey, Ripken, etc. Most of these guys didn't stick around for more than a year or two once the production tailed off.
Rose's OPS+ over his last seven seasons: 94, 119, 90, 69, 99, 99, 61His isolated power over his last seven seasons: .072, .065, .066, .041, .051, .054, .051Rose played in almost 900 games almost exclusively at 1B during that span; he had about 60 appearances as a corner OF. He hit 5 HRs and less that 100 doubles in those seven years. He was strictly looking for singles in chase of Cobb's record.Plus he had a stupid haircut.
