Julius Jones: I Was Running "Like a Robot" (1 Viewer)

[Sigmund Bloom]

Link

"I was being told a little bit where to run and not really being able to use my instincts," Jones said Sunday. "Maybe I listened to coach Parcells a little too much and was kind of running like a robot ... I was being coached and just listening to my coach."

I will say this completely jives with what I (and many others) saw on the field. Jones seemed to stick to the called play/hole to a fault. He wasn't creative or spontaneous, and he rarely looked for cutback lanes or used his physical gifts except for straight ahead speed.

"Everything is brand new. Plays are new, perception is new. Just a new start for everybody," Jones said. "The coaches, I like the way they operate. Things are a little bit more laid back. ... Playing in a system like that, where you have freedom and you like the guy you're playing for, you're going to win a lot more games."

"He's been productive here. I think he'll continue to be," Phillips said. "He's a good screen runner, good draw runner, stretch outside runner that can cut. We're going to get him the ball as much as we can."

I'll admit that I was one of the loudest voices last year saying that MBIII was more talented, and I still think he's the better overall back. When Parcells left, my first thought re:RBs was that maybe Barber would get the lion's share now because Parcells seemingly blind loyalty to Jones between the 20s would not be a factor any more. Jones' comments have made me pause - what if Parcells was such a strong presence that he caused Jones to override his natural running instincts? There hasn't been any sign (yet) that the new regime will shift to MBIII as the primary back, and if Jones experiences a resurgence under Phillips, I doubt that shift will happen. If anything, Jones could be a value at his current ADP, which is significantly lower than MBIII's.

ETA: Jones is also in the all important "contract year"...

Thoughts?

 

[Ilov80s]

I still don't think JJ is very talented RB. The change in coaching won't change what I have seen at ND and Dallas.

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

Unless I hear any thing concrete, I'll be targetting Jones this year. From what I can tell: A member of a very solid RBBC who will put up good RB3 #s and be a great fill in for bye weeks, and his current ADP is at where? rd 9? 10?

 

[Jason Wood]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

What if Julius looks like the back he was in 2004 during camp?

 

[Banger]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

seems to be a better receiver as well.

 

[packersfan]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

I think they're both talented. Jones is currently running with the first team. If that remains the case, he's looking like a strong value pick. He's sliding in a lot of drafts I've seen so far and as a RB3 he's well worth pursuing in my opinion. Barber could be taken a bit too early if he's not the starter. I like him a lot, but what I've been seeing so far in drafts has me viewing him as being a bit over-valued.

 

[Cowboys#1]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.

JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

 

[Bankerguy]

Ahh....my fav topic. Everyone knows where I stand.

 

[Cowboys#1]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

Did you read the article posted? JJ explains why he was running the way he was last season. He was programmed by Parcells to run the play as designed.. Of course thats going to limit his patience. He also knew he had 2 downs to get yards or Barber was coming in.Parcells did more harm to JJ than JJ did to himself.

 

[BostonSportsGuy]

He surely wasn't running like Megatron --- that robot didn't take any crap

 

[Ridgelake]

As a big Cowboy fan, I've thought a fair amount about this topic and JJ's quotes.

Basically, I think JJ is making excuses for being an average/good back instead of a premier back. Yes, Parcells was inside his head. But there was a reason Parcells was on him. I'll leave it at that.

Its important to note that Dallas' running game scheme will not change next year. Running game coordinator/O-line coach, Tony Sporano, was held over from Parcells' staff. This part of the playbook is unchanged.

I'd be surprised if you saw a material change in how JJ and MB3 are used. The pair was very effective last year in their respective roles. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I'd expect JJ to be around 1000-1200 yards and a handfull of TD. Barber maybe 500 yards again with the goal-line carries.

 

[Banger]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

I was in the Barber/Jones debate last year with Bankerguy and probably you and others. I was on the Barber side and still am. Barber was used as a short yardage back and still had a .7 ypc advantage over Jones. Jones was primarily given the 1st/2nd down carries and averaged a decent 4.1 ypc with a new staff on board I don't think it's a given that he'll retain that role. Everytime I watch the two Barber looks much better and stronger, Jones always seems to go down very easily while Barber always seems to bull his way for those extra yards. I bought Barber for cheap last year and was very happy with it. This year he'll be too expensive so I'll avoid the situation all together.

 

[BigJim®]

Ahh....my fav topic. Everyone knows where I stand.

I think I know where you stand. You were an unrelenting JJ proponent/MBIII detractor, and then this February you acknowledged being wrong about MBIII last year. Where do you believe you stand now?

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

I'd be surprised if you saw a material change in how JJ and MB3 are used. The pair was very effective last year in their respective roles. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

How they were used in weeks 1-11 (JJ getting about 20 carries a game) or how they were used in weeks 12-17 (JJ getting about 10 carries a game)?

 

[Banger]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

Did you read the article posted? JJ explains why he was running the way he was last season. He was programmed by Parcells to run the play as designed.. Of course thats going to limit his patience. He also knew he had 2 downs to get yards or Barber was coming in.Parcells did more harm to JJ than JJ did to himself.

you don't think every RB in the league is coached to hit a hole? JJ isn't a good enough RB to let him go freelancing out there. If he were Parcells would have let him do it.ETA...Jones has some of the most ardent defenders I've seen for a guy that's basically had a few good games and averaged a yawn inspiring 4.2, 3.9 and 4.1 ypc (career avg 4.0).

 

[SOmojo]

Julius Jones is not being looked at as the backup to Barber.

Wade Phillips has already commented on taking the reigns off of Julius Jones, and adding in screen options to make more use of his potential.

Jones had a decent amount of receptions in 2005, and had a YPR of close to 16 in his limited activity last season.

Parcells is no longer there to screw the guy up. Most who watched him on a weekly basis seen this happening.

Remember last season. In the first 10 games of the season, Jones averaged 20 carries a game and the team went 6-4. With Romo as the starter, the team was 3-1 with 3 of those 4 games being on the road, and the home game being against the Colts.

In the final 6 games, Jones carries was cut to 10 per game and the team went 3-3, losing 3 of the last 4 games down the stretch. That is what cutting Jones playing time and increasing Barber's playing time gets you.

Phillips wont be this stubborn with his "system" as Parcells was.

 

[Ridgelake]

I'd be surprised if you saw a material change in how JJ and MB3 are used. The pair was very effective last year in their respective roles. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

How they were used in weeks 1-11 (JJ getting about 20 carries a game) or how they were used in weeks 12-17 (JJ getting about 10 carries a game)?

How they were used in weeks 1-11. After week 12, Dallas' defense fell apart, forcing the offense to play aggressively/pass lots. Assuming Wade gets the defense playing up to snuff, the offense will be more balanced. That means running the ball 30 times a game overall.

 

[SOmojo]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

Did you read the article posted? JJ explains why he was running the way he was last season. He was programmed by Parcells to run the play as designed.. Of course thats going to limit his patience. He also knew he had 2 downs to get yards or Barber was coming in.Parcells did more harm to JJ than JJ did to himself.

you don't think every RB in the league is coached to hit a hole? JJ isn't a good enough RB to let him go freelancing out there. If he were Parcells would have let him do it.

Julius Jones did freelance in his rookie season, when we all loved what he was doing, and he was regularly chewed out on the sidelines for not following the blocking into the hole that didn't exist. It got worse in 2006, to the point that he hit he hole that didn't exist on every play.

 

[BigJim®]

For the record, I don't think JJ is doing himself any favors making excuses. Does MBIII have an excuse for scoring 16 TDs and generally being more productive with his touches? In hit-the-hole offenses you hit the hole. You don't "get robotic." The system didn't seem to hurt MBIII when he wound up with a 4.8 YPC.

 

[Banger]

Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season.

What did Jones do over the same period?13-2610-3810-2722-11255-203-0 (3.69 ypc) vs. 27-91-3 (3.37 ypc - used in primarily a short yardage role). Jones didn't exactly light the world on fire either.

 

[SOmojo]

The system didn't seem to hurt MBIII when he wound up with a 4.8 YPC.

Had Julius Jones been the 3rd down back, and the back that could come in for a few series in the 2nd half of games against worn down defenses, he probably averages 5+. Jones averaged 4+ behind a bad offensive line, with his runs coming at times the defense were lined up to stop the run, not lined up to prevent 3rd down conversions.

 

[Winning IS Everything]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

You may want to check your stats.....Barber had 100 (of ~135) carries on 1st/2nd down for a 4.8 yard per carry average. The majority of his production was done while the team was leading, when defenses are guarding against the run. I would say this is NOT a case of "piling up yards" against the dime and on 3rd and 25.

 

[Banger]

.... losing 3 of the last 4 games down the stretch. That is what cutting Jones playing time and increasing Barber's playing time gets you.

that's absolutely incorrect....Jones 55-203-0 (3.69 ypc) vs. Barber 27-91-3 (3.37 ypc - used in primarily a short yardage role) over the last 4 games. They were both used in the same roles and they didn't rely more on Barber they just didn't get as many carries.

 

[Jason Wood]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.

JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

Yards per rush 2006: Jones (4.1) vs. Barber (4.8)
Yards per rush career: Jones (4.0) vs. Barber (4.4)
Rushing TDs: 16 in 37 games (Jones) vs. 19 in 29 games (Barber)
Goal-line TDs: Jones (7) vs. Barber (13)
Goal-line TD%: Jones (23%) vs. Barber (38%)
Short-yardage conversion %: Jones (51%) vs. Barber (57%)
Average on 1st down: Jones (3.75 YPR) vs. Barber (4.25 YPR)
Average on 2nd down: Jones (4.40 YPR) vs. Barber (4.32 YPR)
Average on 3rd down: Jones (3.95 YPR) vs. Barber (4.85 YPR)
Average inside the red zone: Jones (2.66 YPR) vs. Barber (2.99 YPR)
Receptions per target: Jones (70.9%) vs. Barber (71.9%)
Receiving TDs: Jones (0) vs. Barber (2)
Yards per reception: Jones (7.7) vs. Barber (7.6)
% rushes stopped at or behind line of scrimmage: Jones (9.7%) vs. Barber (4.4%) -- 2nd best in NFL
Big play rushes (>10 yards): Jones (9.4%) vs. Barber (15.5%)
Fumbles 2006: 1 for Jones vs. 0 for Barber
Fumbles, Career: 8 for Jones vs. 3 for Barber
Games missed: 11 of 48 (23%) for Jones vs. 3 of 32 (9%) for BarberAll running behind the same lines and same coaches. Explain to me, objectively, how Julius Jones is a better runner in any facet of the game? Barber is more explosive, doesn't get stuffed, doesn't turn the ball over, is healthier, and is far better in short yardage. The only area where Jones has an edge, and it's paltry, is as a receiver.

 

[BigJim®]

The system didn't seem to hurt MBIII when he wound up with a 4.8 YPC.

Had Julius Jones been the 3rd down back, and the back that could come in for a few series in the 2nd half of games against worn down defenses, he probably averages 5+. Jones averaged 4+ behind a bad offensive line, with his runs coming at times the defense were lined up to stop the run, not lined up to prevent 3rd down conversions.

Oh geez. With apologists like this I don't see why JJ even feels a need to make whiny excuses for himself. Please see Jason's stats above. I'm sure there's an excuse for all of that.

 

[packersfan]

Although I'm a Barber fan and believe he could be a very good starting RB, someone better tell the Cowboys that he's better than Jones because as we sit here today, Jones is still the starter and there's no indication from the team that's going to change. In fact, the early comments (and yes it's early) indicate they want to do more with Jones, not less.

Again, Jones is looking like a great value pick right now and Barber is over-valued.

 

[JimboJim]

Being a Cowboys fan and living here in Dallas, I think I've watched every game both of these guys have ever played. I'll throw out a few opinions I have about both.

Jones

- Primarily used between the 20's. Has really struggled near the goal line; inside the ten. I've seen a number of times they gave him 2-3 stright GL carries and he got stuffed.

- More of a home run threat than Barber; can take one 70+ yards.

- Not much of a downfield receiver.

- Gets caught in the backfiled way too often; the line hasn't been great though.

- Streaky; when he gets a good game going, he stay hot. Has put up a a bunch of stinkers though.

- Has missed a bunch of time due to injuries.

Barber

- Used mostly inside the 20's, late in games and would rotatoe in maybe 1-2 series in the first half.

- Much more punishing runner than Jones.

- Has the ability to get consistantly get the 10-20 yarders... not likely to break a 50+.

- Excellent GL runner; Alexander like in his ability to find the end-zone.

- Not much of a receiver.

- Haven't seem him with too many 20-25 carry games.

- Good blocker.

I think both players are good backs. Jones is more of a home-run threat, but can still carry the ball 20-25 times if need be; a bit inconsistent though. Barber has shown the ability to be a really good, consistent back, in short stints. I think it remains to be seen if he can carry the full load.

Personally, I like the rotation they had last season. If they went exclusively with one player, I would go with Barber, just because he doesn't seem to get dropped behind the line too often, which is a major drive killer and one huge problem for the Cows over the last few years. However, I think the team is afriad to rely solely on Barber without knowing he can last a full season.

Unless something wild happens, I think you'll see a lot of what you did last season with these two guys. It may suck for FF, but it really worked for the Cowboys.

 

[BigJim®]

In fact, the early comments (and yes it's early) indicate they want to do more with Jones, not less.

Were these early comments before or after JJ was reported by several sources to be on the trading block prior to the draft? Were they before or after Jerry Jones himself was quoted in March saying he liked what the team was doing with MBIII but would probably keep his RBs (including JJ) intact "unless we have an opportunity in the draft to do something"? I understand and agree that MBIII is a very difficult guy to rank with JJ still on the team, but IMHO people need to focus a little more on reading between the lines and a little less on coachspeak, assuming it is coaching comments about an increased role for JJ that you are referring to. You don't leak to the media interest in trading someone you plan to champion with an increased role.

 

[redman]

I'm a tad surprised we haven't seen the Draft Robot in this thread. He doesn't have to take that kind of talk from Julius Jones!

 

[packersfan]

In fact, the early comments (and yes it's early) indicate they want to do more with Jones, not less.

Were these early comments before or after JJ was reported by several sources to be on the trading block prior to the draft? Were they before or after Jerry Jones himself was quoted in March saying he liked what the team was doing with MBIII but would probably keep his RBs (including JJ) intact "unless we have an opportunity in the draft to do something"? I understand and agree that MBIII is a very difficult guy to rank with JJ still on the team, but IMHO people need to focus a little more on reading between the lines and a little less on coachspeak, assuming it is coaching comments about an increased role for JJ that you are referring to. You don't leak to the media interest in trading someone you plan to champion with an increased role.

The comments from Phillips came recently, after the draft. Trust me, I understand coachspeak, but plenty of people last season tried to read between the lines thinking Barber was going to take over as the starter and it never happened. Hell, I was a Barber owner so I would have loved for it to happen. But it never did. And right now, there are zero indications the Cowboys are going to shift away from the way they used these guys last season. Like I said, I like both RBs but the Cowboys had a very good situation last season - Jones topped 1,000 yards rushing and Barber was a freak near the goal line. Why would they want to change things if they didn't have to?

 

[Da Guru]

I still don't think JJ is very talented RB. The change in coaching won't change what I have seen at ND and Dallas.

I agree..I don`t buy what JJ is selling. JJ ran soft last year.

 

[BigJim®]

Why would they want to change things if they didn't have to?

I'm not saying they would. But not changing what works is a far cry from increasing JJ's role. Not changing things leaves JJ highly questionable as a RB starter for FF purposes. He probably can't make up the yards needed to compensate for TDs he's losing. And when I mentioned "reading between the lines" I don't think it's altogether surprising for a team to publicly fawn over a guy they tried unsuccessfully to publicly trade. It's the age old art of mending bridges. The proof will be in the proverbial pudding, and my money is a natural and merited increased role for MBIII even if JJ is given a chance to redeem himself with a new staff.

 

[redman]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

Did you read the article posted? JJ explains why he was running the way he was last season. He was programmed by Parcells to run the play as designed.. Of course thats going to limit his patience. He also knew he had 2 downs to get yards or Barber was coming in.Parcells did more harm to JJ than JJ did to himself.

Interesting that you take JJ's statements at face value rather than as excuses to a new regime for poor performance under the last one.

 

[Power Monster]

No matter how much spin is put on this I will put my stock on MB anyday of the week over JJ- If MB was named the starter and saw about 80% of the snaps- MB + MDJ = $$$$$$$$$$$

 

[nygiants56]

As a big Cowboy fan, I've thought a fair amount about this topic and JJ's quotes. Basically, I think JJ is making excuses for being an average/good back instead of a premier back. Yes, Parcells was inside his head. But there was a reason Parcells was on him. I'll leave it at that.Its important to note that Dallas' running game scheme will not change next year. Running game coordinator/O-line coach, Tony Sporano, was held over from Parcells' staff. This part of the playbook is unchanged. I'd be surprised if you saw a material change in how JJ and MB3 are used. The pair was very effective last year in their respective roles. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I'd expect JJ to be around 1000-1200 yards and a handfull of TD. Barber maybe 500 yards again with the goal-line carries.

lets see now, take the word of a HOF coach or a 'never has been' named Julius Jones.he must've talked to T.O., because both came out with similar statements on the same day.

 

[Marc Faletti]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.

JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

Yards per rush 2006: Jones (4.1) vs. Barber (4.8)
Yards per rush career: Jones (4.0) vs. Barber (4.4)
Rushing TDs: 16 in 37 games (Jones) vs. 19 in 29 games (Barber)
Goal-line TDs: Jones (7) vs. Barber (13)
Goal-line TD%: Jones (23%) vs. Barber (38%)
Short-yardage conversion %: Jones (51%) vs. Barber (57%)
Average on 1st down: Jones (3.75 YPR) vs. Barber (4.25 YPR)
Average on 2nd down: Jones (4.40 YPR) vs. Barber (4.32 YPR)
Average on 3rd down: Jones (3.95 YPR) vs. Barber (4.85 YPR)
Average inside the red zone: Jones (2.66 YPR) vs. Barber (2.99 YPR)
Receptions per target: Jones (70.9%) vs. Barber (71.9%)
Receiving TDs: Jones (0) vs. Barber (2)
Yards per reception: Jones (7.7) vs. Barber (7.6)
% rushes stopped at or behind line of scrimmage: Jones (9.7%) vs. Barber (4.4%) -- 2nd best in NFL
Big play rushes (>10 yards): Jones (9.4%) vs. Barber (15.5%)
Fumbles 2006: 1 for Jones vs. 0 for Barber
Fumbles, Career: 8 for Jones vs. 3 for Barber
Games missed: 11 of 48 (23%) for Jones vs. 3 of 32 (9%) for BarberAll running behind the same lines and same coaches. Explain to me, objectively, how Julius Jones is a better runner in any facet of the game? Barber is more explosive, doesn't get stuffed, doesn't turn the ball over, is healthier, and is far better in short yardage. The only area where Jones has an edge, and it's paltry, is as a receiver.

That is some truly excellent analysis and a really useful breakdown, but it doesn't necessarily negate the simple assertion of the article -- that Julius Jones got his head screwed up under Parcells, which could explain his ugly performance.Sure, MB3 played for the same coaches, but he doesn't have the same brain, and heck, he might not have even been given the same advice. How one of us reacts to a set of instructions might be completely different than another, and maybe Parcells' style effed him up a bit.

I don't really love either back, so I have no horse in this race. I'm just pointing out that there's a human element the article examines that can't be dismissed by comparing numbers.

 

[kensat30]

I don't see how Julius Jones can possibly win the short-yardage and goalline role away from Barber. Barber was ultraproductive last year and looked like the all around better player.

 

[packersfan]

Why would they want to change things if they didn't have to?

I'm not saying they would. But not changing what works is a far cry from increasing JJ's role.

All I'm saying is the public comments at the present time suggest Jones will get more work, not less. Again, that doesn't mean it will happen but for those believing Jones' role will be reduced there's nothing coming from the coaching staff publicly that indicates that will occur.

Not changing things leaves JJ highly questionable as a RB starter for FF purposes. He probably can't make up the yards needed to compensate for TDs he's losing. And when I mentioned "reading between the lines" I don't think it's altogether surprising for a team to publicly fawn over a guy they tried unsuccessfully to publicly trade. It's the age old art of mending bridges. The proof will be in the proverbial pudding, and my money is a natural and merited increased role for MBIII even if JJ is given a chance to redeem himself with a new staff.

I'm not ruling that out. I just think it would be unwise to automatically assume Barber is going to become "The Guy" in the backfield. Plenty of people thought that last season but even though I was a Barber owner I never believed it because the combination was too effective the way they were used. So I'm skeptical that even with a new head coach things are going to change this season.

 

[LHUCKS]

Disagreements between coaches and their RB's regarding running style have been around as long as sliced bread and they occur at pretty much every level of football...just an FYI.

 

[jurb26]

Here's a thought. When your running instincts are not good, the coach will demand you just ran the dang play. I believe this to be the case with Jones.

 

[Jason Wood]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.

JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

Yards per rush 2006: Jones (4.1) vs. Barber (4.8)
Yards per rush career: Jones (4.0) vs. Barber (4.4)
Rushing TDs: 16 in 37 games (Jones) vs. 19 in 29 games (Barber)
Goal-line TDs: Jones (7) vs. Barber (13)
Goal-line TD%: Jones (23%) vs. Barber (38%)
Short-yardage conversion %: Jones (51%) vs. Barber (57%)
Average on 1st down: Jones (3.75 YPR) vs. Barber (4.25 YPR)
Average on 2nd down: Jones (4.40 YPR) vs. Barber (4.32 YPR)
Average on 3rd down: Jones (3.95 YPR) vs. Barber (4.85 YPR)
Average inside the red zone: Jones (2.66 YPR) vs. Barber (2.99 YPR)
Receptions per target: Jones (70.9%) vs. Barber (71.9%)
Receiving TDs: Jones (0) vs. Barber (2)
Yards per reception: Jones (7.7) vs. Barber (7.6)
% rushes stopped at or behind line of scrimmage: Jones (9.7%) vs. Barber (4.4%) -- 2nd best in NFL
Big play rushes (>10 yards): Jones (9.4%) vs. Barber (15.5%)
Fumbles 2006: 1 for Jones vs. 0 for Barber
Fumbles, Career: 8 for Jones vs. 3 for Barber
Games missed: 11 of 48 (23%) for Jones vs. 3 of 32 (9%) for BarberAll running behind the same lines and same coaches. Explain to me, objectively, how Julius Jones is a better runner in any facet of the game? Barber is more explosive, doesn't get stuffed, doesn't turn the ball over, is healthier, and is far better in short yardage. The only area where Jones has an edge, and it's paltry, is as a receiver.

That is some truly excellent analysis and a really useful breakdown, but it doesn't necessarily negate the simple assertion of the article -- that Julius Jones got his head screwed up under Parcells, which could explain his ugly performance.Sure, MB3 played for the same coaches, but he doesn't have the same brain, and heck, he might not have even been given the same advice. How one of us reacts to a set of instructions might be completely different than another, and maybe Parcells' style effed him up a bit.

I don't really love either back, so I have no horse in this race. I'm just pointing out that there's a human element the article examines that can't be dismissed by comparing numbers.

Hey Marc,At the end of the day, if the Cowboys think Julius is up to the task, it won't matter what the number say. Which is why I'm not dismissing the notion that he continues to be the "yardage guy" while Barber is the "other guy" because Jones isn't without ability. I was just trying to point out that objectively measured against one another, Barber has been BY FAR the better player.

J

 

[BigTex]

Link

"I was being told a little bit where to run and not really being able to use my instincts," Jones said Sunday. "Maybe I listened to coach Parcells a little too much and was kind of running like a robot ... I was being coached and just listening to my coach."

I will say this completely jives with what I (and many others) saw on the field. Jones seemed to stick to the called play/hole to a fault. He wasn't creative or spontaneous, and he rarely looked for cutback lanes or used his physical gifts except for straight ahead speed.

"Everything is brand new. Plays are new, perception is new. Just a new start for everybody," Jones said. "The coaches, I like the way they operate. Things are a little bit more laid back. ... Playing in a system like that, where you have freedom and you like the guy you're playing for, you're going to win a lot more games."

"He's been productive here. I think he'll continue to be," Phillips said. "He's a good screen runner, good draw runner, stretch outside runner that can cut. We're going to get him the ball as much as we can."

I'll admit that I was one of the loudest voices last year saying that MBIII was more talented, and I still think he's the better overall back. When Parcells left, my first thought re:RBs was that maybe Barber would get the lion's share now because Parcells seemingly blind loyalty to Jones between the 20s would not be a factor any more. Jones' comments have made me pause - what if Parcells was such a strong presence that he caused Jones to override his natural running instincts? There hasn't been any sign (yet) that the new regime will shift to MBIII as the primary back, and if Jones experiences a resurgence under Phillips, I doubt that shift will happen. If anything, Jones could be a value at his current ADP, which is significantly lower than MBIII's.

ETA: Jones is also in the all important "contract year"...

Thoughts?

Wilson has stated the JJ is the #1 rb and MB is the backup. It was in a PC shortly after the draft.

 

[BigTex]

If the new coaches come in with no preconceived notions [and why would they?], Julius Jones will be Marion Barber's backup this year. Barber is stronger, more patient, much better in short yardage, and can get yards after initial contact.

Sorry

 

[Cowboys#1]

Where was the tuna love last year? I wasn't hearing it then?!?

The fact is Tuna had no alleigence to JJ, yes he drafted him, he also drafted Barber. If he felt Barber was Barry reborn he would have been in every down.

Jones did put up some bad games, that goes without saying but I think a lot of people just see the TD totals and think "wow, MBIII is the man, Jones sucks" when that is simply not the case.

I dont think we'll have to worry about this past this year though.. I have a feeling neither MBIII or JJ will be happy if/when we draft a certain RB

 

[BigTex]

Julius Jones is not being looked at as the backup to Barber. Wade Phillips has already commented on taking the reigns off of Julius Jones, and adding in screen options to make more use of his potential. Jones had a decent amount of receptions in 2005, and had a YPR of close to 16 in his limited activity last season. Parcells is no longer there to screw the guy up. Most who watched him on a weekly basis seen this happening. Remember last season. In the first 10 games of the season, Jones averaged 20 carries a game and the team went 6-4. With Romo as the starter, the team was 3-1 with 3 of those 4 games being on the road, and the home game being against the Colts. In the final 6 games, Jones carries was cut to 10 per game and the team went 3-3, losing 3 of the last 4 games down the stretch. That is what cutting Jones playing time and increasing Barber's playing time gets you. Phillips wont be this stubborn with his "system" as Parcells was.

This guy knows what he's talking about and all those the drafted MBIII in the 3rd may regret it in a serious way.

 

[BigTex]

P.S.

You could clearly see the difference in JJ's running style from his rookie season compared to the last two seasons and they were not the same. Bill tried to enforce a runnings style that he clearly wasn't used to.

Someone here started a thread about runningbacks changing their style. Anyone have a link?

JJ has been training very hard in Arizona for this season.

 

[BigTex]

As a big Cowboy fan, I've thought a fair amount about this topic and JJ's quotes. Basically, I think JJ is making excuses for being an average/good back instead of a premier back. Yes, Parcells was inside his head. But there was a reason Parcells was on him. I'll leave it at that.Its important to note that Dallas' running game scheme will not change next year. Running game coordinator/O-line coach, Tony Sporano, was held over from Parcells' staff. This part of the playbook is unchanged. I'd be surprised if you saw a material change in how JJ and MB3 are used. The pair was very effective last year in their respective roles. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I'd expect JJ to be around 1000-1200 yards and a handfull of TD. Barber maybe 500 yards again with the goal-line carries.

lets see now, take the word of a HOF coach or a 'never has been' named Julius Jones.he must've talked to T.O., because both came out with similar statements on the same day.

So has Roy Williams, D. Ware, and Greg Ellis. TO and JJ are not the only ones glad to see the Bill go.

 

[BigJim®]

I just think it would be unwise to automatically assume Barber is going to become "The Guy" in the backfield.

Even though I said I'd personally put my money on Barber, I'm definitely not assuming anything. I've said on a few occasions that MBIII is the single hardest player to value heading into 2007. I honestly don't think there is any debating that. However, this thread is the epitome of deja vu. I find it sort of laughable that all "the usual suspects" are willing to scapegoat Bill Parcells to validate JJ when only one of Dallas' RBs seemed to have this problem adapting to the offense without turning into a mediocre RB. I mean alert the media, coaches typically want RBs to hit the designed hole for a particular blocking scheme. This guy named Curtis Martin seemed to do ok in that system. Ultimately JJ is an oft-injured homerun threat who doesn't seem superior to MBIII at much of anything but whining and making excuses, IMHO. Maybe that will work for him and place a more productive RB on the bench... stranger things have happened.

 

[Marc Faletti]

Here we go again with the Barber is the man crap.

JJ is the far better back and its really not that close. Everyone is so fascinated with Barber's td's and his big runs against dime defenses when its 3rd and 23. Other than 1 good half in week 15 he did nothing the last 4 weeks of the season. I'm a Barber owner in a few leagues and while I really don't care who the RB is as long as they are successful I think that, after watching JJ for 3 years and Barber for 2. JJ is the better back.

Yards per rush 2006: Jones (4.1) vs. Barber (4.8)
Yards per rush career: Jones (4.0) vs. Barber (4.4)
Rushing TDs: 16 in 37 games (Jones) vs. 19 in 29 games (Barber)
Goal-line TDs: Jones (7) vs. Barber (13)
Goal-line TD%: Jones (23%) vs. Barber (38%)
Short-yardage conversion %: Jones (51%) vs. Barber (57%)
Average on 1st down: Jones (3.75 YPR) vs. Barber (4.25 YPR)
Average on 2nd down: Jones (4.40 YPR) vs. Barber (4.32 YPR)
Average on 3rd down: Jones (3.95 YPR) vs. Barber (4.85 YPR)
Average inside the red zone: Jones (2.66 YPR) vs. Barber (2.99 YPR)
Receptions per target: Jones (70.9%) vs. Barber (71.9%)
Receiving TDs: Jones (0) vs. Barber (2)
Yards per reception: Jones (7.7) vs. Barber (7.6)
% rushes stopped at or behind line of scrimmage: Jones (9.7%) vs. Barber (4.4%) -- 2nd best in NFL
Big play rushes (>10 yards): Jones (9.4%) vs. Barber (15.5%)
Fumbles 2006: 1 for Jones vs. 0 for Barber
Fumbles, Career: 8 for Jones vs. 3 for Barber
Games missed: 11 of 48 (23%) for Jones vs. 3 of 32 (9%) for BarberAll running behind the same lines and same coaches. Explain to me, objectively, how Julius Jones is a better runner in any facet of the game? Barber is more explosive, doesn't get stuffed, doesn't turn the ball over, is healthier, and is far better in short yardage. The only area where Jones has an edge, and it's paltry, is as a receiver.

That is some truly excellent analysis and a really useful breakdown, but it doesn't necessarily negate the simple assertion of the article -- that Julius Jones got his head screwed up under Parcells, which could explain his ugly performance.Sure, MB3 played for the same coaches, but he doesn't have the same brain, and heck, he might not have even been given the same advice. How one of us reacts to a set of instructions might be completely different than another, and maybe Parcells' style effed him up a bit.

I don't really love either back, so I have no horse in this race. I'm just pointing out that there's a human element the article examines that can't be dismissed by comparing numbers.

Hey Marc,At the end of the day, if the Cowboys think Julius is up to the task, it won't matter what the number say. Which is why I'm not dismissing the notion that he continues to be the "yardage guy" while Barber is the "other guy" because Jones isn't without ability. I was just trying to point out that objectively measured against one another, Barber has been BY FAR the better player.

J

Word. I would rather have him as my guy, too, if someone put a football to my head and made me pick. Your breakdown makes it an even easier choice.