KC dealing S Wesley to DEN?! (1 Viewer)

[Denver Obsession]

Well, it’s not unheard of for players to move between division rivals. In fact, sometimes it’s the best thing that can happen to a player. In 2001, Eddie Kennison retired (the day before a game) from Denver only to ‘unretire’ the next week. When the dust settled he was playing for Denver’s divisional rival KC. As a Chief, Kennison has experienced a career boost - posting more than 800 yards receiving in each of the past six years (including two +1000 yard years).

Now, the rumor circulating Kansas City is that their former starting safety Greg Wesley is looking to leave the team. Denver has expressed interest and it looks like they may have even offered a draft pick for the safety. However, the Chiefs are in a bad position. They don’t want to give Denver a player they would have to face twice a year (especially one with inside info on all aspects of their game). Adding Wesley to Denver’s already wicked secondary is not something the Chiefs relish. This is making them very hesitant to pull the trigger on the deal.

However, with Wesley unhappy and KC looking to unload his $2.7M base salary, if they don’t do the deal with Denver they will be forced to cut Wesley. In that case Denver could sign Wesley without giving KC a dime - which is just as undesirable for the Chiefs.

Either way, it is likely that Denver will end up with Wesley. In that case he will join the best secondary in the NFL. And if working with Champ Bailey, John Lynch and the newly revamped Defense isn’t enough to help Wesley’s career, maybe two games against his former team will.

Denver fans can only hope so!

Kansas City Star Article: FULL STORY

Greg Wesley’s NFL stats: LINK

2001 Article on Eddie Kennison’s Move to KC: FULL STORY

 

[NorrisB]

Hes washed up, the Chiefs would be lucky to unload him.

 

[-OZ-]

Hes washed up, the Chiefs would be lucky to unload him.

I wouldn't say "washed up", but not an impact player by any means. Getting a pick from a rival would be better than dropping him, and he isn't worth his contract anyway.

 

[Simris]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?

Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

 

[B. Nugget]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

With the 2 young guys we got in the draft last year, it makes a ton of sense to deal him. Besides, if Denver wants a safety that can't tackle or defend the pass, that only helps the Chiefs.

 

[BoltBacker]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

 

[Donnie Brasco]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

 

[V1LL]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

 

[jgb95]

just more good news for pollard and page owners!!!!

 

[bcr8f]

just more good news for pollard and page owners!!!!

 

[SSOG]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience. I don't think this would be a terrible move for Denver, since they field the oldest safety tandem in the entire NFL (iirc, Lynch is the oldest, and Ferguson is one of the 5 oldest, and Denver is the only team without a starting safety under the age of 30). Given the ages of Ferguson and Lynch, as well as their injury histories, I think the odds of them missing time are very high, and Wesley would add some nice insurance (hopefully some nice CHEAP insurance)... but if we're talking about veteran safety insurance, I'd much rather get Darius than Wesley. Either way, though... in the end, Denver needs some YOUTH at safety (from the sound of it, it looks like they're not that comfortable with Hamza Abdullah and Sam Brandon after all).

 

[Courtjester]

But what is the downside of this move??

I mean, if they are giving a 1st or 2nd, yeah, this is a bad move. If it is a 5th or 6th, what have they lost?

You bring someone in who knows initimately the details of your rival you play 2 times a year. You add experience

and another body that can step right in and play.

 

[ICON211]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience. I don't think this would be a terrible move for Denver, since they field the oldest safety tandem in the entire NFL (iirc, Lynch is the oldest, and Ferguson is one of the 5 oldest, and Denver is the only team without a starting safety under the age of 30). Given the ages of Ferguson and Lynch, as well as their injury histories, I think the odds of them missing time are very high, and Wesley would add some nice insurance (hopefully some nice CHEAP insurance)... but if we're talking about veteran safety insurance, I'd much rather get Darius than Wesley. Either way, though... in the end, Denver needs some YOUTH at safety (from the sound of it, it looks like they're not that comfortable with Hamza Abdullah and Sam Brandon after all).

And Lynch might be the most overrated player currently in the NFL.

 

[BoltBacker]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience. I don't think this would be a terrible move for Denver, since they field the oldest safety tandem in the entire NFL (iirc, Lynch is the oldest, and Ferguson is one of the 5 oldest, and Denver is the only team without a starting safety under the age of 30). Given the ages of Ferguson and Lynch, as well as their injury histories, I think the odds of them missing time are very high, and Wesley would add some nice insurance (hopefully some nice CHEAP insurance)... but if we're talking about veteran safety insurance, I'd much rather get Darius than Wesley. Either way, though... in the end, Denver needs some YOUTH at safety (from the sound of it, it looks like they're not that comfortable with Hamza Abdullah and Sam Brandon after all).

My comments were made based on two things;- According to FBG's depth charts they have Curome Cox(26yo) listed as the starter until we see Furguson healthy. I wasn't sure it was a lock that Ferguson was going to start this year.... is it 100%? Ferguson will turn 34 this season and his drop off very soon is inevitable even if he wasn't trying to come back from a season ending injury.- Yes, Wesley is 'older'(except when compared to Ferguson) but DEN is a superbowl contender and a veteran in their prime that's familiar with divisioin opponents wouldn't be a bad thing.You're the DEN homer.... where would you rank all three? Cox/Ferguson/Wesley? I think Wesley is the best of the three but I'm sure they'd like to develop Cox. When you start to discuss 34-year-olds returning from season ending injuries(to his knee I believe) I might rank him #3 out of the trio.

 

[BoltBacker]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience. I don't think this would be a terrible move for Denver, since they field the oldest safety tandem in the entire NFL (iirc, Lynch is the oldest, and Ferguson is one of the 5 oldest, and Denver is the only team without a starting safety under the age of 30). Given the ages of Ferguson and Lynch, as well as their injury histories, I think the odds of them missing time are very high, and Wesley would add some nice insurance (hopefully some nice CHEAP insurance)... but if we're talking about veteran safety insurance, I'd much rather get Darius than Wesley. Either way, though... in the end, Denver needs some YOUTH at safety (from the sound of it, it looks like they're not that comfortable with Hamza Abdullah and Sam Brandon after all).

And Lynch might be the most overrated player currently in the NFL.

All the more reason to bring in safety help of any kind. Who knows, by seasons end a Wesley/Cox may play better than a Lynch(35yo)/Ferguson(34yo) combo.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Historically, the AFC West has been really bad at doing this.......Look at all these KC related moves

Albert Lewis KC UFA signs with OAK

Harvey Williams KC UFA signs with OAK

Marcus Allen OAK UFA signs with KC

Chester McGlockton OAK UFA signs with KC

Neil Smith KC UFA signs with DEN

the afore mentioned Kennison signing from DEN to KC

Lenny Walls DEN UFA signs with KC

Rich Gannon KC UFA signs with OAK

those are just off the top of my head....these teams steal players all the time, so I don't think KC is too worried in trading him to DEN - esp. if it nets a 3rd or 4th.

 

[bostonfred]

I don't think many teams are going to need a secret weapon to beat KC this year.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

I don't think many teams are going to need a secret weapon to beat KC this year.

KC may see 10 in the box every 1st and 2nd down this season, esp. if Croyle starts.People are sleeping on the KC OL though...it is one good tackle away from being decent.LT-McIntosh is really a RT---and a decent one at that.. But he is a below average LTLG-Waters is an absolute stud when he isn't helping the LT with his own jobC-Weigmann is the next good one to go....his frame and build were quited for Priest's outside running style. He is average @ the point of attack. I would not be surprised to see Chris Bober here.......and he would be fine...not great but fine.RG-John Welbourn FINALLY gets to play his natural position where he excelled in Philly. Again, he is an average to above AVG guard.RT-Chris Terry, with a clear head, is a good RT......he has a decent track record when he can stay on the field. If he is not there we have MAJOR issues. It would probably fall to Will Svitek --who was all NFL EL and was hyped a lot before last season. But he only played 3 games I think, before landing on IR.Not All-Pro's (sans Waters) like Roaf and Shields, but they are better than the casual fan thinks-----or what the casual media member reports.

 

[pinda]

Historically, the AFC West has been really bad at doing this.......Look at all these KC related movesAlbert Lewis KC UFA signs with OAKHarvey Williams KC UFA signs with OAKMarcus Allen OAK UFA signs with KCChester McGlockton OAK UFA signs with KCNeil Smith KC UFA signs with DENthe afore mentioned Kennison signing from DEN to KCLenny Walls DEN UFA signs with KCRich Gannon KC UFA signs with OAKthose are just off the top of my head....these teams steal players all the time, so I don't think KC is too worried in trading him to DEN - esp. if it nets a 3rd or 4th.

a 3rd or a 4th for a guy they are going to cut anyway? Especially at the safety positoin? Geez Kev, you a KC fan?as for the list above, Smith played a solid role for Denver in the superbowl years and Gannon of course did very well with Oak.

 

[SSOG]

And Lynch might be the most overrated player currently in the NFL.

Not as long as DeAngelo Hall is still playing, he isn't.

You bring someone in who knows initimately the details of your rival you play 2 times a year.

This is so totally overrated. It's not like Kansas City is this huge defensive think-tank. Everyone has so much film on KC and Herm Edwards that I really doubt there's much Wesley could tell Denver's coaches that they don't already know. Everyone always gets back to Lawyer Milloy when he went from New England to Buffalo, but that's a dramatically different situation- in that instance, Lawyer was cut something like a week before the game, *AFTER NEW ENGLAND HAD IMPLEMENTED ITS GAMEPLAN*. That's the info that Milloy spilled, and that's the kind of info that Wesley simply can't provide.

My comments were made based on two things;- According to FBG's depth charts they have Curome Cox(26yo) listed as the starter until we see Furguson healthy. I wasn't sure it was a lock that Ferguson was going to start this year.... is it 100%? Ferguson will turn 34 this season and his drop off very soon is inevitable even if he wasn't trying to come back from a season ending injury.- Yes, Wesley is 'older'(except when compared to Ferguson) but DEN is a superbowl contender and a veteran in their prime that's familiar with divisioin opponents wouldn't be a bad thing.You're the DEN homer.... where would you rank all three? Cox/Ferguson/Wesley? I think Wesley is the best of the three but I'm sure they'd like to develop Cox. When you start to discuss 34-year-olds returning from season ending injuries(to his knee I believe) I might rank him #3 out of the trio.

The reason Denver didn't consider drafting a safety in the first round, in Ted Sundquists own words, was because they thought they were close to a Superbowl and he couldn't see any safety who could beat out Lynch or Ferguson for a starting job this year. So Denver's GM definitely was 100% convinced that Ferguson would be starting this season, or at least he was back during the draft.As to where I'd rank the three, Ferguson is a dramatically underrated player and is clearly tops on that list if healthy (he's even better than Lynch, at the moment). After Ferguson I'd put Sam Brandon, who has starting experience and is probably Denver's best coverage safety (outside of the times when they use their third CB, Darrent Williams, as a safety). Then Curome Cox. As to wear Wesley fits... it's hard to say, since I haven't seen a whole lot of him, but unless he's better than Reggie Nelson, Denver Brass thinks he's worse than Ferguson at the least (since they said flat out they didn't think Reggie Nelson could beat out Nick Ferguson for a starting job).

 

[BusMan]

And Lynch might be the most overrated player currently in the NFL.

Not as long as DeAngelo Hall is still playing, he isn't.

You bring someone in who knows initimately the details of your rival you play 2 times a year.

This is so totally overrated. It's not like Kansas City is this huge defensive think-tank. Everyone has so much film on KC and Herm Edwards that I really doubt there's much Wesley could tell Denver's coaches that they don't already know. Everyone always gets back to Lawyer Milloy when he went from New England to Buffalo, but that's a dramatically different situation- in that instance, Lawyer was cut something like a week before the game, *AFTER NEW ENGLAND HAD IMPLEMENTED ITS GAMEPLAN*. That's the info that Milloy spilled, and that's the kind of info that Wesley simply can't provide.

My comments were made based on two things;- According to FBG's depth charts they have Curome Cox(26yo) listed as the starter until we see Furguson healthy. I wasn't sure it was a lock that Ferguson was going to start this year.... is it 100%? Ferguson will turn 34 this season and his drop off very soon is inevitable even if he wasn't trying to come back from a season ending injury.I- Yes, Wesley is 'older'(except when compared to Ferguson) but DEN is a superbowl contender and a veteran in their prime that's familiar with divisioin opponents wouldn't be a bad thing.You're the DEN homer.... where would you rank all three? Cox/Ferguson/Wesley? I think Wesley is the best of the three but I'm sure they'd like to develop Cox. When you start to discuss 34-year-olds returning from season ending injuries(to his knee I believe) I might rank him #3 out of the trio.

The reason Denver didn't consider drafting a safety in the first round, in Ted Sundquists own words, was because they thought they were close to a Superbowl and he couldn't see any safety who could beat out Lynch or Ferguson for a starting job this year. So Denver's GM definitely was 100% convinced that Ferguson would be starting this season, or at least he was back during the draft.As to where I'd rank the three, Ferguson is a dramatically underrated player and is clearly tops on that list if healthy (he's even better than Lynch, at the moment). After Ferguson I'd put Sam Brandon, who has starting experience and is probably Denver's best coverage safety (outside of the times when they use their third CB, Darrent Williams, as a safety). Then Curome Cox. As to wear Wesley fits... it's hard to say, since I haven't seen a whole lot of him, but unless he's better than Reggie Nelson, Denver Brass thinks he's worse than Ferguson at the least (since they said flat out they didn't think Reggie Nelson could beat out Nick Ferguson for a starting job).

I agree, although I believe it was Dominique Foxworth that played a bit of safety when Ferguson and Brandon were out last year.

 

[Courtjester]

And Lynch might be the most overrated player currently in the NFL.

Not as long as DeAngelo Hall is still playing, he isn't.

You bring someone in who knows initimately the details of your rival you play 2 times a year.

This is so totally overrated. It's not like Kansas City is this huge defensive think-tank. Everyone has so much film on KC and Herm Edwards that I really doubt there's much Wesley could tell Denver's coaches that they don't already know. Everyone always gets back to Lawyer Milloy when he went from New England to Buffalo, but that's a dramatically different situation- in that instance, Lawyer was cut something like a week before the game, *AFTER NEW ENGLAND HAD IMPLEMENTED ITS GAMEPLAN*. That's the info that Milloy spilled, and that's the kind of info that Wesley simply can't provide.

My comments were made based on two things;- According to FBG's depth charts they have Curome Cox(26yo) listed as the starter until we see Furguson healthy. I wasn't sure it was a lock that Ferguson was going to start this year.... is it 100%? Ferguson will turn 34 this season and his drop off very soon is inevitable even if he wasn't trying to come back from a season ending injury.- Yes, Wesley is 'older'(except when compared to Ferguson) but DEN is a superbowl contender and a veteran in their prime that's familiar with divisioin opponents wouldn't be a bad thing.You're the DEN homer.... where would you rank all three? Cox/Ferguson/Wesley? I think Wesley is the best of the three but I'm sure they'd like to develop Cox. When you start to discuss 34-year-olds returning from season ending injuries(to his knee I believe) I might rank him #3 out of the trio.

The reason Denver didn't consider drafting a safety in the first round, in Ted Sundquists own words, was because they thought they were close to a Superbowl and he couldn't see any safety who could beat out Lynch or Ferguson for a starting job this year. So Denver's GM definitely was 100% convinced that Ferguson would be starting this season, or at least he was back during the draft.As to where I'd rank the three, Ferguson is a dramatically underrated player and is clearly tops on that list if healthy (he's even better than Lynch, at the moment). After Ferguson I'd put Sam Brandon, who has starting experience and is probably Denver's best coverage safety (outside of the times when they use their third CB, Darrent Williams, as a safety). Then Curome Cox. As to wear Wesley fits... it's hard to say, since I haven't seen a whole lot of him, but unless he's better than Reggie Nelson, Denver Brass thinks he's worse than Ferguson at the least (since they said flat out they didn't think Reggie Nelson could beat out Nick Ferguson for a starting job).

I notice you cut and paste from my post, but don't answer the overall question, "What is the downside of this, if all Denver is offering is a future 4th or 6th round pick?"

 

[The Jacket]

Wesley stinks.

To get him on the Broncos AND with compensation would be ridiculously good.

 

[SSOG]

I agree, although I believe it was Dominique Foxworth that played a bit of safety when Ferguson and Brandon were out last year.

Yes, you're right, I meant to put Foxworth but I was posting in a hurry and didn't proof-read.

I notice you cut and paste from my post, but don't answer the overall question, "What is the downside of this, if all Denver is offering is a future 4th or 6th round pick?"

What is the downside? Well, the downside is that Denver sends away a 4th or 6th round pick on a player that doesn't improve the franchise. You talk as if 4th or 6th rounders are junk, trash, veritible pennies to be frittered away on a whim- this is only true if you're the Washington Redskins. Denver isn't the Washington Redskins, Denver is the team that winds up taking all of the draft picks that Washington fritters away.Looking at the current Denver Broncos, here's a brief list of players who were drafted in the 4th round or later: Mike Bell (RB2), Brandon Marshall (WR2), Rod Smith (WR3), Brandon Stokley (WR4), Domenik Hixon (WR5), Kyle Johnson (FB1), Cecil Sapp (FB2), Tom Nalen (C1), Greg Eslinger (C2), Chris Kuper (OG1), Chris Myers (OG2), Matt Lepsis (LT), Eric Pears (RT). This is just offense, mind you- there are plenty more names where that came from on defense, starting with Marcus Thomas, who was a fourth rounder THIS YEAR, and really demonstrates the downside of not having a 4th round pick (you have to trade a bunch of other picks to get one if there's a player you like).Heck, why not just offer a 6th rounder for Bo Jackson? What's the downside, since it's just a 6th rounder? Nevermind that pretty much the entire Denver Broncos starting offensive line outside of Ben Hamilton came from the 6th round or later...From what I hear, Greg Wesley is a very mediocre safety. Furthermore, he's very old, as far as safeties go, so he's not even a YOUNG mediocre safety. Denver already has plenty of mediocre safeties (Cox, Brandon), as well as plenty of old safeties (Lynch, Ferguson), so if you'll permit me to flip your question on you... "What is the upside of this, if all Denver is getting is an old and, by all accounts, mediocre safety?"

 

[ookook]

I agree, although I believe it was Dominique Foxworth that played a bit of safety when Ferguson and Brandon were out last year.

Yes, you're right, I meant to put Foxworth but I was posting in a hurry and didn't proof-read.

I notice you cut and paste from my post, but don't answer the overall question, "What is the downside of this, if all Denver is offering is a future 4th or 6th round pick?"

What is the downside? Well, the downside is that Denver sends away a 4th or 6th round pick on a player that doesn't improve the franchise. You talk as if 4th or 6th rounders are junk, trash, veritible pennies to be frittered away on a whim- this is only true if you're the Washington Redskins. Denver isn't the Washington Redskins, Denver is the team that winds up taking all of the draft picks that Washington fritters away.Looking at the current Denver Broncos, here's a brief list of players who were drafted in the 4th round or later: Mike Bell (RB2), Brandon Marshall (WR2), Rod Smith (WR3), Brandon Stokley (WR4), Domenik Hixon (WR5), Kyle Johnson (FB1), Cecil Sapp (FB2), Tom Nalen (C1), Greg Eslinger (C2), Chris Kuper (OG1), Chris Myers (OG2), Matt Lepsis (LT), Eric Pears (RT). This is just offense, mind you- there are plenty more names where that came from on defense, starting with Marcus Thomas, who was a fourth rounder THIS YEAR, and really demonstrates the downside of not having a 4th round pick (you have to trade a bunch of other picks to get one if there's a player you like).Heck, why not just offer a 6th rounder for Bo Jackson? What's the downside, since it's just a 6th rounder? Nevermind that pretty much the entire Denver Broncos starting offensive line outside of Ben Hamilton came from the 6th round or later...From what I hear, Greg Wesley is a very mediocre safety. Furthermore, he's very old, as far as safeties go, so he's not even a YOUNG mediocre safety. Denver already has plenty of mediocre safeties (Cox, Brandon), as well as plenty of old safeties (Lynch, Ferguson), so if you'll permit me to flip your question on you... "What is the upside of this, if all Denver is getting is an old and, by all accounts, mediocre safety?"

A: Depth

 

[The Jacket]

As I hear it, the Broncos are looking to get quicker on defense in the back 7 with size up front. The Chiefs are definitely looking to get younger and faster.

Wesley is slowwwwwwwwwww.

 

[The Man With No Name]

Historically, the AFC West has been really bad at doing this.......Look at all these KC related movesAlbert Lewis KC UFA signs with OAKHarvey Williams KC UFA signs with OAKMarcus Allen OAK UFA signs with KCChester McGlockton OAK UFA signs with KCNeil Smith KC UFA signs with DENthe afore mentioned Kennison signing from DEN to KCLenny Walls DEN UFA signs with KCRich Gannon KC UFA signs with OAKthose are just off the top of my head....these teams steal players all the time, so I don't think KC is too worried in trading him to DEN - esp. if it nets a 3rd or 4th.

Safety Reggie Tongue played 4 seasons in KC, then went to AFC West rival Seattle for 4 seasons, then to the NYJets for 1 season, then to another AFC West team- Oakland in 2005 where he tore an acl in November, then missed all of 2006.

 

[SSOG]

A: Depth

Maybe it's just me, but spending a 4th round pick and $3 million dollars a year on a guy who's going to maybe be your #3 safety for a year or two seems pretty silly.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Historically, the AFC West has been really bad at doing this.......Look at all these KC related movesAlbert Lewis KC UFA signs with OAKHarvey Williams KC UFA signs with OAKMarcus Allen OAK UFA signs with KCChester McGlockton OAK UFA signs with KCNeil Smith KC UFA signs with DENthe afore mentioned Kennison signing from DEN to KCLenny Walls DEN UFA signs with KCRich Gannon KC UFA signs with OAKthose are just off the top of my head....these teams steal players all the time, so I don't think KC is too worried in trading him to DEN - esp. if it nets a 3rd or 4th.

Safety Reggie Tongue played 4 seasons in KC, then went to AFC West rival Seattle for 4 seasons, then to the NYJets for 1 season, then to another AFC West team- Oakland in 2005 where he tore an acl in November, then missed all of 2006.

Thats another one......also, from the same draft class, Donnie Edwards goes from KC to SD and now back to KC.

 

[moleculo]

I don't think that trading for someone who isn't good enough for the Chiefs would be a good idea.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

I don't think that trading for someone who isn't good enough for the Chiefs would be a good idea.

Well smart guy, last season the Chiefs were better than the Broncos, so maybe they could use him.

 

[V1LL]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience.

so experience DOESN'T help?

 

[Tackling Dummies]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience.

so experience DOESN'T help?

Not if his experience does not allow him to make plays.

 

[rascal]

It could also be that either Ferguson or Brandon, or perhaps both, are not recovering as expected (or suffered a setback) from their season ending knee injuries that they had last year.

Or it could be that either of them simply don't fit in Bates scheme like they thought.

Denver wouldn't do this unless there was a reason especially when they passed on safety in a deep safety class this past draft.

 

[SSOG]

Why doesn't Denver just let him get cut and pick him up on the cheap?Why deal a pick to KC who is hording picks anyway?

There are several teams that you'd think were in the market for veteran safety help and if Wesley was cut DEN would have to compete for his services. CAR/OAK/HOU/TEN are teams that you'd think would be interested besides DEN.

He would be a great and needed addition to the broncos

I agree. With Champ and Dre already in the defensive backfield an experienced Safety like Wesley only helps.

I agree. What Denver really needs is an experienced safety like Wesley to help mentor the super-green John Lynch and Nick Ferguson. If there's one thing that's lacking in Denver at the safety position, it's not coverage skills, it's not youth, it's not speed... it's experience.

so experience DOESN'T help?

If experience mattered that much, Jerry Rice would still be playing. Eventually you have enough experience and you need strong, fast, athletic, young guys who are able to make plays.With two of the five oldest safeties in the entire NFL, and as the only team in the league starting two thirty-somethings, I would say the Broncos have reached a point where experience at safety really isn't a pressing need anymore.

 

[Warpig]

So is this a done deal or not? I haven't heard anything official.

I just see it as veteran depth for Denver. If KC can get anything for him then they better jump all over it!

*eta* I just checked the Chiefs message boards and saw not a single mention of it. Where's Ashcroft?

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

So is this a done deal or not? I haven't heard anything official.

I just see it as veteran depth for Denver. If KC can get anything for him then they better jump all over it!

*eta* I just checked the Chiefs message boards and saw not a single mention of it. Where's Ashcroft?

1st off......Ashcraft is the name. (Actually it happens daily as I just happened to live in the stats that made John Ashcroift famous)2nd.....no this is not a done deal. It is just conjecture based a KC Star mention a few weeks ago. I don't have al ink to that article because the fine folks at the KC Start make you pay to see archived articles if it is more than a week old.

3rd....I would expect him to NOT be a Chief on Opening Day in Houston. We have Page and Pollard to start and Jon McGraw as a much more capable and cheaper backup......Chad Williams (formerly of the Ravens) has also been signed.

EDIT: There is this thread @ ChiefsPlanet that speaks to the rumor.\

And I did manage to get to the KC Star article.....

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/football/story/160458.html

Pertinent portion:

Greg Wesley (below). A seven-year starting safety, Wesley is as unhappy with his situation as Johnson is with his. He is, for now at least, a backup to Jarrad Page and Bernard Pollard and would like a trade.

The Chiefs have a willing trade partner for Wesley in the Denver Broncos. The teams have agreed on terms of draft-choice compensation, but the Chiefs have yet to sign off on the deal in fear of sending him to a division rival.

In most cases, that’s reason enough not to make a deal. In this case, it’s not. Page and Pollard don’t need Wesley’s looming presence. The Chiefs have capable safety reserves in Jon McGraw and Chad Williams and will probably release Wesley and his $2.7 million base salary, anyway.

In that case, the Broncos would get him for nothing.

 

[BusMan]

The Broncos are already down two picks in the '08 draft (3rd rounder traded as part of the deal to move up for Marcus Thomas in the '07 draft and their 6th traded to St. Louis for DT Jamie Kennedy), so if this trade indeed goes down I would have to agree with the previous poster who indicated this would be a bad sign about the progression of Ferguson and/or Brandon.

Personally, I don't see this trade happening for several reasons:

Denver appears to already have adequate depth at safety, given full recoveries to both Ferguson and Brandon. CB 3 Dominique Foxworth filled in admirably at SS when needed late in the '06 season, and Abdullah and Paymah are still around as well.
The cost is prohibitive to Denver given that they only have five draft picks remaining for '08.
This information likely was leaked from the Chiefs in an effort to stir up interest in Wesley around the league, as they're clearly in rebuilding mode and could use as many picks as possible. I think most NFL front offices know the KC front office is relatively weak right now, and will see this article as nothing more than an attempt to stir the trade pot (thanks Mile High Report ).I'll be surprised (and extremely disappointed) if Wesley ends up in Denver as anything but a free agent.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

The Broncos are already down two picks in the '08 draft (3rd rounder traded as part of the deal to move up for Marcus Thomas in the '07 draft and their 6th traded to St. Louis for DT Jamie Kennedy), so if this trade indeed goes down I would have to agree with the previous poster who indicated this would be a bad sign about the progression of Ferguson and/or Brandon.

Personally, I don't see this trade happening for several reasons:

Denver appears to already have adequate depth at safety, given full recoveries to both Ferguson and Brandon. CB 3 Dominique Foxworth filled in admirably at SS when needed late in the '06 season, and Abdullah and Paymah are still around as well.
The cost is prohibitive to Denver given that they only have five draft picks remaining for '08.
This information likely was leaked from the Chiefs in an effort to stir up interest in Wesley around the league, as they're clearly in rebuilding mode and could use as many picks as possible. I think most NFL front offices know the KC front office is relatively weak right now, and will see this article as nothing more than an attempt to stir the trade pot (thanks Mile High Report ).I'll be surprised (and extremely disappointed) if Wesley ends up in Denver as anything but a free agent.

Please elaborate.....they just won the stare down with MIA, and have brought in some quality players this offseason.

 

[BusMan]

The Broncos are already down two picks in the '08 draft (3rd rounder traded as part of the deal to move up for Marcus Thomas in the '07 draft and their 6th traded to St. Louis for DT Jamie Kennedy), so if this trade indeed goes down I would have to agree with the previous poster who indicated this would be a bad sign about the progression of Ferguson and/or Brandon.

Personally, I don't see this trade happening for several reasons:

Denver appears to already have adequate depth at safety, given full recoveries to both Ferguson and Brandon. CB 3 Dominique Foxworth filled in admirably at SS when needed late in the '06 season, and Abdullah and Paymah are still around as well.
The cost is prohibitive to Denver given that they only have five draft picks remaining for '08.
This information likely was leaked from the Chiefs in an effort to stir up interest in Wesley around the league, as they're clearly in rebuilding mode and could use as many picks as possible. I think most NFL front offices know the KC front office is relatively weak right now, and will see this article as nothing more than an attempt to stir the trade pot (thanks Mile High Report ).I'll be surprised (and extremely disappointed) if Wesley ends up in Denver as anything but a free agent.

Please elaborate.....they just won the stare down with MIA, and have brought in some quality players this offseason.

LJ's possible holdout
Getting a 4th for Green when they were asking for a 2nd (actually, I could see how KC would consider this "winning", although it's not like Branch for a 1st or TJ for a 2nd)
Allegedly using the KC media to pimp a backup safety everyone knows they're going to have to cut anyway and making this situation more ridiculous by insinuating they might trade with the hated Broncos
Practically screaming REBUILDING by hording draft picks, while having an unclear plan at QB, WR, CB depth, etc.On second thought, I don't believe as strongly in my assertion as I did when I first wrote it, but I still tend to think KC is weak right now and getting weaker.

 

[BoltBacker]

The Broncos are already down two picks in the '08 draft (3rd rounder traded as part of the deal to move up for Marcus Thomas in the '07 draft and their 6th traded to St. Louis for DT Jamie Kennedy), so if this trade indeed goes down I would have to agree with the previous poster who indicated this would be a bad sign about the progression of Ferguson and/or Brandon.

Personally, I don't see this trade happening for several reasons:

Denver appears to already have adequate depth at safety, given full recoveries to both Ferguson and Brandon. CB 3 Dominique Foxworth filled in admirably at SS when needed late in the '06 season, and Abdullah and Paymah are still around as well.
The cost is prohibitive to Denver given that they only have five draft picks remaining for '08.
This information likely was leaked from the Chiefs in an effort to stir up interest in Wesley around the league, as they're clearly in rebuilding mode and could use as many picks as possible. I think most NFL front offices know the KC front office is relatively weak right now, and will see this article as nothing more than an attempt to stir the trade pot (thanks Mile High Report ).I'll be surprised (and extremely disappointed) if Wesley ends up in Denver as anything but a free agent.

Please elaborate.....they just won the stare down with MIA, and have brought in some quality players this offseason.

LJ's possible holdout
Getting a 4th for Green when they were asking for a 2nd (actually, I could see how KC would consider this "winning", although it's not like Branch for a 1st or TJ for a 2nd)
Allegedly using the KC media to pimp a backup safety everyone knows they're going to have to cut anyway and making this situation more ridiculous by insinuating they might trade with the hated Broncos
Practically screaming REBUILDING by hording draft picks, while having an unclear plan at QB, WR, CB depth, etc.On second thought, I don't believe as strongly in my assertion as I did when I first wrote it, but I still tend to think KC is weak right now and getting weaker.

The pick for Green is conditional I believe which means it's no better than a 4th rounder but could be worse. All that really matters in all of that is #1. Peterson has a rep of playing hard-ball and LJ seems as though he's thought through this hold-out and speaks dispassionately about the situation. It's a big "IF" but if KC opens the season with Croyle/Bennett/Kennison/Bowe/Gonzales anchored by a suspect offensive line then KC is not making the playoffs. I'm the lone Herm Edwards fan on this board and think he's building a pretty solid defense but there's no way that defense is going to be the dominating variety that will be needed to counter balance that horrendous offense.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

LJ's possible holdout
Getting a 4th for Green when they were asking for a 2nd (actually, I could see how KC would consider this "winning", although it's not like Branch for a 1st or TJ for a 2nd)
Allegedly using the KC media to pimp a backup safety everyone knows they're going to have to cut anyway and making this situation more ridiculous by insinuating they might trade with the hated Broncos
Practically screaming REBUILDING by hording draft picks, while having an unclear plan at QB, WR, CB depth, etc.On second thought, I don't believe as strongly in my assertion as I did when I first wrote it, but I still tend to think KC is weak right now and getting weaker.

By your definition they have had an unclear plan @ WR since 2000 then.....because its been about the same talent level.Re: LJ - how can the Chiefs look weak when they have not even decided what they are going to do. My God what do you want them to do, cut him a blank check?

Re: Green trade - Trent Green was a 37 y/o QB coming off a major concussion. f the pick is a 4th, it falls in line for what TEN got for McNair. Deion Branch and Thomas Jones are not 30-something former Pro Bowl QBs. They are top of the line athletes in their prime.

Re: Wesley - Any GM worth his salt is going to use EVERY ADVANTAGE he can to get the best deal. If he gets a sack of crap in exchange fro Wesley most KC fans will be happy. He would have gotten something when he really should not have gotten anything.

Re: Hording picks - How does that SCREAM rebuilding. They have already gotten considerably younger in the last 2 offseasons.....

DL - lose Ryan Sims, Lionel Dalton, Eric Hicks; gain Tank Tyler, Turk McBride and Tamba Hali

LB - gain Der. Johnson, Nap. Harris (Edwards the obvious exception here)

WR - lose Dante Hall, Johnnie Morton, gain Chris Hannon, Jeff Webb, Dwayne Bowe

OL - lose Roaf and Shields and gaining McIntosh

FS - lose Sammy Knight, gain Jarrod Page

SS - lose Greg Wesley, gain Bernard Pollard

PK - lose Tynes, gain Justin Medlock

KR - lose Dante Hall, gain Jeff Webb/Ean Randolph

QB - lose Trent Green, gain Brodie Croyle

FB - lose Tony RIchardson, gain Kris Wilson/Ronnie Cruz/Boomer Grigsby

So a team that is "rebuilding" won 9 games and backed into the playoffs. And they are weak/on their way down? The logic does not make sense here at all. The only lynch pin to an argument like that would be that HOF OG Will Sheilds meant THAT much. Never mind he was pedestrian at best last season if you watch every snap of each KC game.

I agree on one thing you said.....CB Depth is an issue....after the good starting unit, it is atrocious.

 

[BoltBacker]

By your definition they have had an unclear plan @ WR since 2000 then.....because its been about the same talent level.

Agreed. They have had an unclear plan @ WR since 2000. It just has never come back to haunt them because over that same time span they usually had the best OL in football, a top 3 RB, an above average QB and the best TE in football in his prime to cover for their deficiencies @ WR. None of those will be the case in '07 if LJ does indeed holdout.

 

[BusMan]

I agree with all your points, Kevin---I'm clearly wearing my Broncos' homer glasses in this thread. I still find it obvious that KC is rebuilding this year, but maybe I'm still reeling a bit from KC getting in the playoffs last year when Denver choked down the stretch (yet again), and trying to finally close up that wound.

One thing I do know for certain: in the NFL these days, knowing how things are going to shake down before the season is an exercise in futility. This time last year, lots of folks (myself included) were discussing the Jets as having the potential as a historically horrible team, and clearly that was way off. Maybe my gut feeling about KC is wrong too...but I hope not.

 

[The Jacket]

LJ's possible holdout

Yeah - real good sign of a "weak front office" there.

 

[BusMan]

LJ's possible holdout

Yeah - real good sign of a "weak front office" there.

Clearly, the possible holdout is a distraction, and therefore a weakness. Obviously I wasn't implying that caving in to his demands would be a "strong" move.

 

[BoltBacker]

LJ's possible holdout

Yeah - real good sign of a "weak front office" there.

Isn't it fair to describe their front office in a position of weakness because if they don't bend over for LJ and give him any contract he wants.... they may as well just start rebuilding for 2008?