NutterButter
Footballguy
Exactly. What responsible husband and father would pass up an opportunity to make enough money be able to buy that Ferrari and beach house?
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Leveraging an external offer against your own company (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Evilgrin 72
- Start date
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
It is, and I totally ignore correspondence that looks like this. This recruiter that contacted me this time around is really good and comes across as my advocate (whether or not he actually is) rather than a guy just trying to jam a peg into a hole without regard for fit. He's a partner in his firm and works almost exclusively with executives in similar situations to mine and really knows how to handle himself.so true
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
SacramentoBob
Footballguy
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Most of them involve shaving or waxing and leopard-print low rise bikini underwear. It's a jungle out there.Whoa, what kind of offers are you getting on LinkedIn?
chet
Footballguy
I have some experience here. This is a card you can play only once at any given employer. If you decide to play it, you must be prepared to leave the company if they don't offer you something close to the competing offer. If you choose to stay and they haven't offered more money, benefits etc then they will know they have you by the short ones. There's no way to answer how you will be treated if you stay with more money because it depends not only on how you present it, but also on the personality of the COO/CEO.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
LOOK AT ME!!!
I make decisions quicker than a fighter pilot!@#!@#!@#!@#!#@
That's the job, for the most part. If I came in to this job cold right now, I would have a really hard time being effective right away - anyone who replaces me is going to have a similar issue unless they filled the position internally. Frankly, there are very few (maybe no) people currently employed here that have the natural ability to do it.
NutterButter
Footballguy
i personally wouldn't mention any other offer. its impossible to know how your current employer is going to handle that long term if he does match and you stay. i'd make the case for something close to what you're being offered and if they pass, I'd be out of there.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Thanks. It would definitely be a one-time play; I've been here nearly 15 years and have never once given any indication that I was shopping around, because I wasn't. I will also present it with all the grace and tact I have - I honestly have no idea how I will be treated if it all washes out the way I suspect it might. That's why I'm fishing for like stories here - it's a major x factor.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Had a similar situation about a year and a half ago (although not at a management level). I had a boss I didn't really like working for and we had a couple of dust ups. Nothing bad, (he probably didn't even realize they were dust ups) but he basically said a few things to me that made me think I didn't have a lot of support going forward. I also knew that I could make a lot more money elsewhere and that they were basically dangling a promotion I'd already earned in front of me like a carrot so that I'd keep pushing hard through the end of the year (I had basically made my sales goal by May)
So on a whim, I applied for an open position at a competitor. It was actually the company where I'd started my career (left on good terms the first time due to a regional restructuring). They called me within 2 days of posting for the job, and I was out there for an interview within a week. They offered me a job less than 48 hours after that with what ended up being like a 30% pay increase.
Went to my boss (and his boss, who I liked) and laid out the situation for them. I expressed my frustrations with the situation and basically told them I wanted to stay but needed some assurance that I'd be taken care of going forward (in terms of promotions, training opportunities, etc). While they were able to give me a little bit of a bump (like 1/3 of the difference) it was still way below the offer. And to be honest, I was concerned that they'd give me that raise but then basically hold it against me when I (hopefully) got the promotion at the end of the year. (giving me a token additional bump)
After a night of soul searching and basically trying to find a reason to stay, I decided I really couldn't. One of the tipping points came after talking to my uncle, who is the CEO of a rather large company in my industry. He basically told that from a management perspective, if I stayed, I'd likely always been seen as someone who is just looking for every dime I could get. My concerns about management style and the way I was treated would be totally ignored because, in their mind, I was just some guy who would jump at the next chance to make an additional 10%.
So I guess what I'm saying is...if you're going to bring the offer to them, you better be damn willing to walk. Despite the extra money, I regret my decision every day. Ended up with a good company (large corporation) but my particular department has systems, workflows and strategies that I just can't stand. Basically making myself miserable for an extra few hundred bucks a paycheck. Not even close to worth it.
So on a whim, I applied for an open position at a competitor. It was actually the company where I'd started my career (left on good terms the first time due to a regional restructuring). They called me within 2 days of posting for the job, and I was out there for an interview within a week. They offered me a job less than 48 hours after that with what ended up being like a 30% pay increase.
Went to my boss (and his boss, who I liked) and laid out the situation for them. I expressed my frustrations with the situation and basically told them I wanted to stay but needed some assurance that I'd be taken care of going forward (in terms of promotions, training opportunities, etc). While they were able to give me a little bit of a bump (like 1/3 of the difference) it was still way below the offer. And to be honest, I was concerned that they'd give me that raise but then basically hold it against me when I (hopefully) got the promotion at the end of the year. (giving me a token additional bump)
After a night of soul searching and basically trying to find a reason to stay, I decided I really couldn't. One of the tipping points came after talking to my uncle, who is the CEO of a rather large company in my industry. He basically told that from a management perspective, if I stayed, I'd likely always been seen as someone who is just looking for every dime I could get. My concerns about management style and the way I was treated would be totally ignored because, in their mind, I was just some guy who would jump at the next chance to make an additional 10%.
So I guess what I'm saying is...if you're going to bring the offer to them, you better be damn willing to walk. Despite the extra money, I regret my decision every day. Ended up with a good company (large corporation) but my particular department has systems, workflows and strategies that I just can't stand. Basically making myself miserable for an extra few hundred bucks a paycheck. Not even close to worth it.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
I see your point, but I'd be sacrificing all my leverage to take that road. It potentially solves the problem of how I would be treated down the road but also lessens the chances of my ideal scenario playing out (they match, I stay.) I had all but ruled this out, but I'll consider it. Thanks for the input..
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Thanks. I expected to see a story like this, but was hoping I wouldn't.
I appreciate you sharing your experience, man... giving me a lot to think about. Your last few sentences encapsulate the other fear I have. The grass isn't always greener and unfortunately, there's almost no way to know without actually taking the job and then it's often too late.
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NutterButter
Footballguy
Since you're very happy where you are, I'd find out how much the other company has in mind. Then I'd make the case for maybe half of that. If they don't agree, you're clearly being underpaid. If they do, you get to stay where you really want to and you get a nice raise. I personally don't place a huge value on money after a certain amount though. Once I reach that amount that provides me the quality of life I'm looking for, everything else you mentioned is way more important.
El Floppo
Footballguy
this makes a lot of sense.
I got into something somewhat similar (offer made without my reaching out for it), but approached it a bit naively.
I was happily working at my old company, but the major project I was on got pulled and without more work and as a consultant of only a couple years, I got laid off. That company found me a new job- where I've been since then (about 4 good, happy years).
About a year ago, the old office came back and really wanted me back- made a great offer that I couldn't refuse. I gave notice to my current office- but they came back with a counter that was even better... and made it clear I was securely part of their future. I had to go back to the old firm- and a gb FFAer- and reneg on my acceptance of their offer. felt pretty terrible going back on my word, even though it was always the right choice.
GL, gb eg... this seems like a can't lose situation. a move to some substantially bigger paychecks, or a counter from your own office.
Buckychudd
Footballguy
I've worked for companies that will counter external offers. As far as being viewed as a turncoat, it really depends on your management but generally they don't hold a grudge and know that you've been undercompensated for a while.
The trick is that you really have to be willing to take the external offer, because an alternative to your d) is "Hey it was nice working with you, enjoy your new job."
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
That's where I am now. I'd like to retire tomorrow, so anything that advances the date that I can leave the 9-5 world behind is appealing to me.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
I'm hoping I don't end up in this exact spot although I acknowledge it's a distinct possibility. Thanks for sharing, GB.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Thanks man. I definitely won't even mention this to current management unless I am 100% willing to walk.
NutterButter
Footballguy
I guess it depends on how much retirement time the new job buys you. It costs a crap load to add additional years to retirement. I'd just be careful that you don't trade in a job where you're happy for somewhere that you're not just to buy a few more years of retirement. I sometimes think that the sooner I can retire the better, but then part of me wonders if when the kids are in college, having every night, weekend and vacation day to do as I please when combined with an easy well paying gig would be just fine.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
I hear you. I just want out of the rat race. I could be perfectly happy and never bored just sitting by the pool reading a novel every day from 9-to-5, no stress, no aggravation. The enfilade of questions (many of them stupid) that I have to contend with all day every day is draining after a while.
Headbutts
Footballguy
Nope, just be honest. I went through something similar six weeks ago. Former employer (large public company) contacted me offering me a 25% raise to come back. Plus bonus, stock options, a very nice offer. Stable company, a job I could run for 10+ years. Different role than I had with them three years ago, different role than my current job (small company, recently delisted). I was completely open with my current management/company owner -- I prefer working here, but money makes the world go 'round. My current employer couldn't match, but they did their best. Salary within 5%, no bonus. They also offered some stock options (likely useless) and more vacation.
Money's nice, more money is nicer, but there's more to life than that. Do you like the work you do today? The culture and the future of your current employer? Where do you have the most opportunity to do work you enjoy? To embrace the ephemeral work-life balance? It was an agonizing choice for me, I'm a greedy ******* at my core. I stayed with my current employer. The raise is nice, if less than offered with the new role, and the extra vacation is already being planned
Good luck with your negotiation and decision.
Johnny Rock
Footballguy
EG, what did you end up doing?
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Interviewed at the other company, decided it wasn't the right fit/culture and withdrew from consideration. Never mentioned it to present employer.Johnny Rock said:
ProstheticRGK
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Didn't read all the replies, but here is what happened to me last year and I hope this helps.
Last year, in June, I was approached about moving to a brand new company, I would be moving up a tier from my current position, but this new company wanted me to take on this new position with more responsibilities without a bump in pay. I told them that I needed this much in compensation or I wouldn't leave, they refused.
I have found recently that in the last 8 months since I turned down the job that they have went through 3 other candidates at the position that have all quit.
I guess the moral of the story is, of you know you are worth it then make them pay you for it.
Last year, in June, I was approached about moving to a brand new company, I would be moving up a tier from my current position, but this new company wanted me to take on this new position with more responsibilities without a bump in pay. I told them that I needed this much in compensation or I wouldn't leave, they refused.
I have found recently that in the last 8 months since I turned down the job that they have went through 3 other candidates at the position that have all quit.
I guess the moral of the story is, of you know you are worth it then make them pay you for it.
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James Daulton
Footballguy
Damn, must have been awkward having to deal with that smell in the ceiling for the next few months.
Snorkelson
Footballguy
Now you need to find a way to casually mention it to someone so it gets back to the COO that you turned down a substantial raise that you weren’t even looking for to stay with the company and didn’t even try to leverage it.
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Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Nah, they were looking for someone who was going to be in the office at 7 AM and wasn't going to leave until 7 PM. Super rah-rah cheerleader/motivator type. That's not me. I believe in work/life balance and am more of a mentor/teacher type. I would have been miserable there, it wasn't worth the extra pay.
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Insoxicated
I’m in nearly this exact spot... sorta:
Been with small company for 5 years, paid well under market, but it’s comfortable. Always heard “would love to give you more just can’t swing it”
Finally decided I needed to show initiative, revamped resume and updated linked in.
I got hit up by recruiter for Director level job with Local hospital. I was straight up with boss (CEO) that I had to take interview. He said I’m family and didn’t want to see me go, but totally understood... took the half day for the interview. He said don’t make a decision without giving him a shot to match.
Job wasn’t a good fit, told them and settled back in.
Then a Friend reached out about great job with $40BB Company. 60% more cash, double the PTO, 50%+ telecommuting, global travel, etc. I took interviews but didn’t tell boss.
Got offered the job this week while traveling. Just told CEO the details yesterday. Wants to sit down this morning to talk about a counter.
IMO they can’t match the money, the PTO, the work from home, or the potential for growth.... but even if they match the first 3 I won’t take it.... why? They’ve always told me they can’t pay me more than x... but suddenly they find the money when I have a counter? Cmon...
Been with small company for 5 years, paid well under market, but it’s comfortable. Always heard “would love to give you more just can’t swing it”
Finally decided I needed to show initiative, revamped resume and updated linked in.
I got hit up by recruiter for Director level job with Local hospital. I was straight up with boss (CEO) that I had to take interview. He said I’m family and didn’t want to see me go, but totally understood... took the half day for the interview. He said don’t make a decision without giving him a shot to match.
Job wasn’t a good fit, told them and settled back in.
Then a Friend reached out about great job with $40BB Company. 60% more cash, double the PTO, 50%+ telecommuting, global travel, etc. I took interviews but didn’t tell boss.
Got offered the job this week while traveling. Just told CEO the details yesterday. Wants to sit down this morning to talk about a counter.
IMO they can’t match the money, the PTO, the work from home, or the potential for growth.... but even if they match the first 3 I won’t take it.... why? They’ve always told me they can’t pay me more than x... but suddenly they find the money when I have a counter? Cmon...
Hawks64
Footballguy
Sand
Footballguy
