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Mad Cow's Italy trip discussion thread (2 Viewers)

Where should we go for our trip?

  • Italy

    Votes: 96 76.2%
  • France/Paris

    Votes: 18 14.3%
  • Other

    Votes: 12 9.5%

  • Total voters
    126
Chemical X said:
can you clarify this?  some of these roads i am unfamiliar with.  your destination is somewhat south of siena?  
Yeah - going to Buonconvento, a bit South of Siena.  Looks like there are three main routes we could drive.  We probably don't want to do the the most direct one (through Orvieto), because Google Maps shows it taking 15 minutes longer and we'll be going that way on the way back to Rome.

The other two routes both start out along the coast.  One turns inland fairly quickly, and the other stays near the coast for a  longer stretch.  They show identical drive times on Google Maps.  Trying to figure out which has the better combination of easy driving+nice scenery.

 
Yeah - going to Buonconvento, a bit South of Siena.  Looks like there are three main routes we could drive.  We probably don't want to do the the most direct one (through Orvieto), because Google Maps shows it taking 15 minutes longer and we'll be going that way on the way back to Rome.

The other two routes both start out along the coast.  One turns inland fairly quickly, and the other stays near the coast for a  longer stretch.  They show identical drive times on Google Maps.  Trying to figure out which has the better combination of easy driving+nice scenery.
i will tell you, i have driven, from FCO, the 90 loop to A1 going north a bazillion times, past orvieto.  it’s a 6 lane road and in some spots, 8 lanes.  it is tolled.  e80 i have driven on 2x, primarily to get to civitavecchia.  it is free and 4 lanes, speed is less than A1.  the views are not what you think they are.  in most spots, just rural.  A1 is not great either for views, but you do see baschi and orvieto from a distance.  me, i would take 90 to A1 and up by sinalunga i think, catch the E45 towards siena.  come into buonconvento that way, pay the tolls, but ensure motorways most of the way.  if you take 80, your W to E trip is likely 2 lanes and i would surmise, winding in many spots.  i think the times are if you are the only humans driving that day in ideal conditions.  

 
i will tell you, i have driven, from FCO, the 90 loop to A1 going north a bazillion times, past orvieto.  it’s a 6 lane road and in some spots, 8 lanes.  it is tolled.  e80 i have driven on 2x, primarily to get to civitavecchia.  it is free and 4 lanes, speed is less than A1.  the views are not what you think they are.  in most spots, just rural.  A1 is not great either for views, but you do see baschi and orvieto from a distance.  me, i would take 90 to A1 and up by sinalunga i think, catch the E45 towards siena.  come into buonconvento that way, pay the tolls, but ensure motorways most of the way.  if you take 80, your W to E trip is likely 2 lanes and i would surmise, winding in many spots.  i think the times are if you are the only humans driving that day in ideal conditions.  
Thanks!  Looks like it may have been due to temporary traffic conditions.  It's now showing that way as the fastest - almost half hour less than when I looked the other day.

 
Thanks all. I had looked up some distances and thought things were a bit further but good to know. We should be able to walk everywhere except maybe for dinner when we are dressed up, wife has heels on or whatever. By the way, do many restaurants have dress codes in either Florence or Positano? Hoping dressy jeans and a polo are enough most places? Here’s our basic itinerary! We will do more than what I list if course but want a bit of time to explore as well. 

Day 1- land in Rome, train to Florence

Day 2- Duomo, Ponte Vecchio 

Day 3- Accademia/Uffizi 4 hour tour 

Day 4- train to Naples and car to Positano

Day 5- Capri

Day 6- Path of Gods

Day 7- Pizza making class

Day 8- to Rome, Colliseum night tour

Day 9- Vatican breakfast 

Day 10- home
Just me - I’d only do Florence and Rome if I’m there 9-10 days. Maybe a day trip to Venice. You’d want 2 more days in Florence for sure and need more in Rome. Recommend the other cities on your next trip 

 
Just me - I’d only do Florence and Rome if I’m there 9-10 days. Maybe a day trip to Venice. You’d want 2 more days in Florence for sure and need more in Rome. Recommend the other cities on your next trip 
I realize it’s ambitious. We don’t know when we will be back so we are squeezing it all in. All 3 of those cities seem like places you could spend weeks in, but we want to have as many unique experiences as possible. 

 
Been on work trip in Rome for last week. Went to this place tonight. There is of course amazing food in this town, but this place has been my best meal hands down. Highly recommend.
Woah... super close to where we stayed.  Looks awesome... Will try this next time!

 
Thanks all. I had looked up some distances and thought things were a bit further but good to know. We should be able to walk everywhere except maybe for dinner when we are dressed up, wife has heels on or whatever. By the way, do many restaurants have dress codes in either Florence or Positano? Hoping dressy jeans and a polo are enough most places? Here’s our basic itinerary! We will do more than what I list if course but want a bit of time to explore as well. 

Day 1- land in Rome, train to Florence

Day 2- Duomo, Ponte Vecchio 

Day 3- Accademia/Uffizi 4 hour tour 

Day 4- train to Naples and car to Positano

Day 5- Capri

Day 6- Path of Gods

Day 7- Pizza making class

Day 8- to Rome, Colliseum night tour

Day 9- Vatican breakfast 

Day 10- home
have you booked your tours and trains?

 
Chemical X said:
have you booked your tours and trains?
Have booked Vatican, Florence museum tour and coliseum night tour. Still need to do duomo and Capri. I thought trains weren’t available this far in advance (going in October).....

 
Have booked Vatican, Florence museum tour and coliseum night tour. Still need to do duomo and Capri. I thought trains weren’t available this far in advance (going in October).....
you can check schedules and compare italo vs trenitalia.  i used italo fyi, cheaper and nicer trains imo.  they also have discounts if you go to their website and sign up.  

 
Just got back from Italy - 4 nights in Tuscany, 3 in Rome.  Trip was great, but mistakes were made and lessons were learned. Happy to answer any questions here or via PM.  Going to focus on stuff that might be useful here.

Rented a car at the airport in Rome (and returned it there after our time in Tuscany).  Driving in Italy was no problem at all. Parking was a huge problem, nearly everywhere. That said, this was a holiday week, so our problems with parking may be less acute at other times.

Stayed near Buonconvento.  Not sure I'd recommend our hotel, but the scenery south and east of where we stayed is incredible.  Loads of great places to pull over at the side of the road and enjoy. Also, not sure how often they're there, but one of the best things we ate was a panini from a street vendor in Buonconvento - porccheta, pecorino and white truffle oil.

San Gimignano was great.  We drove around for an hour before we got parking.  Should have just waited on line to get into the largest lot (P3 I think) from the beginning and it would have taken 10-15 minutes.  Didn't get to try either, but friends recommended both La Mangiatoia and Mandrango there.

Orvieto was probably our favorite town, even though we didn’t have time to do a tour of the underground or go down St. Patrick’s Well (both of which look really cool).  Parking is less of a problem than in other towns, because they have a huge parking garage (search for ‘campo della fiera’ for directions) with escalators up to one end of the town.

One thing to be aware of in Tuscany - restaurants generally have even more limited hours than in Rome and other parts of Europe.  Many of them are open for lunch from 12:30-2pm and dinner from 7:30-10pm. Almost nothing is open between 3pm-7pm, except maybe in the more touristy areas of towns.  If you want a schedule of late breakfast plus a big mid-to-late afternoon meal...that’s just not going to work at all. To make things even worse, many of the restaurants were fully booked, so definitely make reservations ahead of time.

Not sure I have anything super-useful to suggest about Rome and Florence.  Just don’t be an idiot like me...make super-duper-double-extra sure that you pay close attention to where you park your rental car.  We spent about an hour looking for our car in Florence and were 90%+ sure that it was gone and had basically no idea how to handle the situation if we hadn’t gotten lucky and found it just before we gave up.  Best meal of the trip was at a casual restaurant in Rome, just of Via Nazionale.  Slightly confused about what restaurant it was, but PM me for clues.

One of our days staying in Rome we did a day trip by train+ferry to the Amalfi Coast.  If anyone is interested in details of the logistics, let me know.

 
i have been in italy 2 weeks now and have another 10 days left.  been touring houses and we have 2 on our short list.  totally different areas.  1 is near cortona and 1 is in between orvieto and todi.  i will post them in a bit.

 
that's a lot of work  good job, doing our due diligence!  #1 for me.  i like the open space around the house
since all properties are stone, i can’t begin to describe how many have this damp, dank smell when we enter them.  80% are basically not occupied and just sit, unused.  the unoccupied houses are much worse than those that are lived in.  so many 90 year old brits selling properties and i have no idea why they are here.  i have not seen an american yet.  me and the mrs. are hoping somehow that properties being sold in italy come with pictures and a way to smell them online next time.  2 properties had AC, several had no heating systems.  no matter the property, we will need to renovate every bathroom and kitchen to bring it up to our US standards.  we have good ideas about #1.  having a 2 bedroom 2.5 bathroom is our ideal set up and the master has an ensuite.  i need to do some outside work and make sure it becomes fully fenced for the beagle.  can you imagine having your fridge in another room apart from the kitchen?  bathrooms are still outside.  1 house yesterday for 198€ smelled like someone vomited in my mouth.  1 house today had black mold on most of the walls.  no one but us seems to care.  i really can’t blow my nose and shower enough.  my favorite item is my hand sanitizer.

 
Chemical X said:
since all properties are stone, i can’t begin to describe how many have this damp, dank smell when we enter them.  80% are basically not occupied and just sit, unused.  the unoccupied houses are much worse than those that are lived in.  so many 90 year old brits selling properties and i have no idea why they are here.  i have not seen an american yet.  me and the mrs. are hoping somehow that properties being sold in italy come with pictures and a way to smell them online next time.  2 properties had AC, several had no heating systems.  no matter the property, we will need to renovate every bathroom and kitchen to bring it up to our US standards.  we have good ideas about #1.  having a 2 bedroom 2.5 bathroom is our ideal set up and the master has an ensuite.  i need to do some outside work and make sure it becomes fully fenced for the beagle.  can you imagine having your fridge in another room apart from the kitchen?  bathrooms are still outside.  1 house yesterday for 198€ smelled like someone vomited in my mouth.  1 house today had black mold on most of the walls.  no one but us seems to care.  i really can’t blow my nose and shower enough.  my favorite item is my hand sanitizer.
family friends bought a wreck of a house in france.  it took them 3 years to make it into what they wanted.  it's awesome now!

 
so, today we drove around top of lago trasimeno and went to a nice mall in corciano to buy a new camera since my walmart kodak crapped out after 2 weeks.  then we went to lungarotti in torgiano and shipped back 24 bottles.  then we went to todi and to house 1 in acqualoreto.  2 minutes away in morre is a bar and a gorgeous farmacia, fully stocked with an english speaking dottoressa who sold me 30 atorvastatin for 7.80.  having a farmacia near for my meds is absolutely awesome.  took us about 25 mins to get to orvieto, if a train to rome or florence is needed.  15 minutes to ponte rio, the commercial area of todi.  all in all, a good day.  monday we are revisiting with our agent, the seller’s geometra and our trusted plumber, electrician, handyman.  if all goes well, we likely offer and maybe sign next week.  likely gonna start at 235€.

 
Am I the only one that loved the interior of two?

Regardless, big ups to you for doing this Chemical X. Good luck with your decision. Sounds exciting. 
it photographs great, but it is small.  the kitchen setup with the bar counter makes it livable, but you can’t fake an extra 800 sq ft.  in house 1 we have already discussed a master with claw tub and moving the laundry to bathroom 2 upstairs.  that extra bathroom is key, not that we will ever have company.  we would also be on a dead end and no car would pass us.  entrance to property is gated as well.

 
it photographs great, but it is small.  the kitchen setup with the bar counter makes it livable, but you can’t fake an extra 800 sq ft.  in house 1 we have already discussed a master with claw tub and moving the laundry to bathroom 2 upstairs.  that extra bathroom is key, not that we will ever have company.  we would also be on a dead end and no car would pass us.  entrance to property is gated as well.
That is a lot of square footage. That was about three rooms in my old apt. I figured it was small. They can take realtor shots to make it look a lot more spacious than it is. 

 
That is a lot of square footage. That was about three rooms in my old apt. I figured it was small. They can take realtor shots to make it look a lot more spacious than it is. 
basically 1050 sq ft vs 1850 sq ft.  our main choice has a massive great room.

 
it photographs great, but it is small.  the kitchen setup with the bar counter makes it livable, but you can’t fake an extra 800 sq ft.  in house 1 we have already discussed a master with claw tub and moving the laundry to bathroom 2 upstairs.  that extra bathroom is key, not that we will ever have company.  we would also be on a dead end and no car would pass us.  entrance to property is gated as well.
:(  

 
so, today we drove around top of lago trasimeno and went to a nice mall in corciano to buy a new camera since my walmart kodak crapped out after 2 weeks.  then we went to lungarotti in torgiano and shipped back 24 bottles.  then we went to todi and to house 1 in acqualoreto.  2 minutes away in morre is a bar and a gorgeous farmacia, fully stocked with an english speaking dottoressa who sold me 30 atorvastatin for 7.80.  having a farmacia near for my meds is absolutely awesome.  took us about 25 mins to get to orvieto, if a train to rome or florence is needed.  15 minutes to ponte rio, the commercial area of todi.  all in all, a good day.  monday we are revisiting with our agent, the seller’s geometra and our trusted plumber, electrician, handyman.  if all goes well, we likely offer and maybe sign next week.  likely gonna start at 235€.
very envious , you are very lucky and fortunate to have the ability to do this
excited to follow along your process  

 
sadly, we are not going to offer on the property.  

we went back on monday and spent about 3-4 hours with our agent and our inspector (plumber, electrician).  too many things to discuss here, but at the end of the day, the house scares us in to thinking it’s just going to be money after money.  if we had to move, we’d buy this house, but since this offer is a want and not a need, we just can’t put ourselves in a position to jeopardize what we’ve worked hard for in the states.  

some issues;

the house was recently redone, with new wooden beams; however, the beams are still drying and shrinking and half the second floor has sunk, so all tile needs to be redone, cracks need to be fixed, etc.  the water is spring water which is pumped to the house, but the pump is on the adjacent property that the sellers also own.  what happens if they unplug our pump?  the properties haven’t yet been subdivided.  the house needed updating in all bathrooms, so were talking 5k per bathroom, 10-15k for the kitchen and add 10%.  we haven’t yet discussed fencing our outdoor cleanup.

the is truly sad, we invested 1 year of our time in finding 62 properties to look at.  we wanted to spend the money, but who knows how much the floor is and the extras will add up.  so, 280k that we can get for maybe 240k will be 350k.  

we needed a nice yard for our dog.  we basically said that we’ll lightly keep looking, but maybe stick to the original plan of letting our dog live out his life where we are, then when he goes, we go.  this will give us more leeway in buying or even renting in more metro areas and maybe just city hop 3 months at a time.  

we will likely put maybe a couple of $$ into our existing place to add outlets and buy a microwave.

 
sadly, we are not going to offer on the property.  

we went back on monday and spent about 3-4 hours with our agent and our inspector (plumber, electrician).  too many things to discuss here, but at the end of the day, the house scares us in to thinking it’s just going to be money after money.  if we had to move, we’d buy this house, but since this offer is a want and not a need, we just can’t put ourselves in a position to jeopardize what we’ve worked hard for in the states.  

some issues;

the house was recently redone, with new wooden beams; however, the beams are still drying and shrinking and half the second floor has sunk, so all tile needs to be redone, cracks need to be fixed, etc.  the water is spring water which is pumped to the house, but the pump is on the adjacent property that the sellers also own.  what happens if they unplug our pump?  the properties haven’t yet been subdivided.  the house needed updating in all bathrooms, so were talking 5k per bathroom, 10-15k for the kitchen and add 10%.  we haven’t yet discussed fencing our outdoor cleanup.

the is truly sad, we invested 1 year of our time in finding 62 properties to look at.  we wanted to spend the money, but who knows how much the floor is and the extras will add up.  so, 280k that we can get for maybe 240k will be 350k.  

we needed a nice yard for our dog.  we basically said that we’ll lightly keep looking, but maybe stick to the original plan of letting our dog live out his life where we are, then when he goes, we go.  this will give us more leeway in buying or even renting in more metro areas and maybe just city hop 3 months at a time.  

we will likely put maybe a couple of $$ into our existing place to add outlets and buy a microwave.
Bummer it didn't work out but sometimes something great will fall into your lap when you least expect it. Hopefully it happens with you guys.

 
Bummer it didn't work out but sometimes something great will fall into your lap when you least expect it. Hopefully it happens with you guys.
I second this. It's too bad this didn't work for you. You seem to absolutely love it in Italy and know the lay of the land quite well. I hope it works out in the future for you. We go in a couple weeks. I'll be using this thread as a reference. Thanks, Chemical X, for detailing your sojourns and travels here. 

 
We're about 3 weeks from our trip to Positano. I remember a bunch of great reviews for La Tagliata, but see a few on tripadvisor that say the food is average and you are a bit rushed through the meal. Just want to reaffirm that it is a must visit.

 
We're about 3 weeks from our trip to Positano. I remember a bunch of great reviews for La Tagliata, but see a few on tripadvisor that say the food is average and you are a bit rushed through the meal. Just want to reaffirm that it is a must visit.
There was a thread somewhere here (hell, maybe this one) where many of us talked it up and someone claimed it was trash. I've seen people swear that they've witnessed the food being microwaved in the kitchen. That last part seems like complete BS to me as it makes no sense just logistically. 

All I'll say is that 5 or so years ago it was definitely a must visit and a great experience. The food wasn't Michelin quality but just had a very comfortable feel to it. If for some reason the food doesn't live up to your standards, I'm very confident in saying that at a minimum you'll get your money's worth just from leaving full, having plentiful solid wine, and some beautiful views in a really unique setting. We're not talking about a $150/plate type dinner that could not live up to that kind of standard.

 
There was a thread somewhere here (hell, maybe this one) where many of us talked it up and someone claimed it was trash. I've seen people swear that they've witnessed the food being microwaved in the kitchen. That last part seems like complete BS to me as it makes no sense just logistically. 

All I'll say is that 5 or so years ago it was definitely a must visit and a great experience. The food wasn't Michelin quality but just had a very comfortable feel to it. If for some reason the food doesn't live up to your standards, I'm very confident in saying that at a minimum you'll get your money's worth just from leaving full, having plentiful solid wine, and some beautiful views in a really unique setting. We're not talking about a $150/plate type dinner that could not live up to that kind of standard.
Thanks for your review. Reading more on TA doesn't give me much encouragement. While we don't mind high end, we do prefer romantic quiet little family run restaurants. Even some of the good reviews on TA say that the experience and view are great but the food is average. I'd rather have a great memorable single plate than getting stuffed on 7 courses of average food. There are quite a few that call it a tourist trap and to avoid. I'm usually good at filtering negative reviews but when there are so many, it makes me think twice. Sing alongs and conga lines with a bunch of drunk American tourists doesn't sound appealing. And the shuttle sounds like there are issues at times too. Too many question marks to dedicate 3-4 hours out of a day.

 
Thanks for your review. Reading more on TA doesn't give me much encouragement. While we don't mind high end, we do prefer romantic quiet little family run restaurants. Even some of the good reviews on TA say that the experience and view are great but the food is average. I'd rather have a great memorable single plate than getting stuffed on 7 courses of average food. There are quite a few that call it a tourist trap and to avoid. I'm usually good at filtering negative reviews but when there are so many, it makes me think twice. Sing alongs and conga lines with a bunch of drunk American tourists doesn't sound appealing. And the shuttle sounds like there are issues at times too. Too many question marks to dedicate 3-4 hours out of a day.
I’ve kind of talked myself out of La Tagliata too. Looks beautiful but I don’t eat that much anymore and seems kind of gimmicky. Of course I’ve never been there and defer to the experts here but we will be skipping it in favor of Da Vincenzo’s and La Sponda. Anyone been to Il Tridente or Il Rotrivo?

 
Just stumbled upon this thread yesterday and spent hours reading just about every page.  Took my first trip to Italy last June and I can’t help but want to share my experience.  In summary, the place is simply awesome.  Here was our basic itinerary:

Rome (4 Days) – Hit all the big spots: Colsseum, Palatine Hill, Pantheon, Piazza Navona, Trevi Fountain, Spanish Steps, Vatican.  Really enjoyed Rome, but were thankful we stayed in Trastevere as it was a nice change of pace and had great restaurants.

Florence (3 Days) – As others have said on this forum, Florence was a pleasant surprise and one of our favorites.  From the architecture, to the food, to the people, to the ability to walk everywhere.  Did the Duomo climb, Bell Tower, Baptistry, Palazzo Vecchio, Accademia.  Also hit up Teatro del Sale, which was a fantastic dinner theater, one of the highlights of the trip.

Cinque Terre (3 Days) – Out absolute favorite spot on the trip.  We stayed in Manarola and loved the ability to hop on a quick train to any of the other four villages.  Did a hike to Corniglia, had some amazing food and did some low level cliff jumping.  People were fantastic and loved the small feel of the villages.

Positano (3 Days) – Beautiful area, but in all honesty, we liked Cinque Terre better.  We found it to be extremely crowded and somewhat tricky to get from place to place.  Perhaps it was due to the fact that we did not stay right in town.  We did have a great beach day there.

Capri (3 Days) – Stayed in Anacapri which was much quieter than Capri and very walkable.  Did the chair lift to Mt. Solaro and rented a Banana Boat for a day, both were amazing experiences.  Also hired a private driver to visit Pompeii and Vesuvius.

All in all, it was the best trip I have ever been on.  Some general notes: We did everything by train which was super easy and used Air BnB which afforded us some amazing places with terraces and views.  We felt the time spent in each area was good, but going down South was a bit of a trip.  We liked the North better (food, people, pace, etc.) and are planning round two for next June.  If anyone has any questions, fire away!
 

 
Just stumbled upon this thread yesterday and spent hours reading just about every page.  Took my first trip to Italy last June and I can’t help but want to share my experience.  In summary, the place is simply awesome.  Here was our basic itinerary:
 
Awesome trip!

I always recommend dividing north and south, allowing for more time in whichever area. So much to do and see in the north and better to allow time to relax and explore in the south. 

 
I’ve kind of talked myself out of La Tagliata too. Looks beautiful but I don’t eat that much anymore and seems kind of gimmicky. Of course I’ve never been there and defer to the experts here but we will be skipping it in favor of Da Vincenzo’s and La Sponda. Anyone been to Il Tridente or Il Rotrivo?
We're staying at La Sirenuse so will definitely go to La Sponda and plan on hitting Da Vincenzo. I'll probably keep a few others in mind but will most likely just wing it. There don't seem to be any that get universally bad reviews so it looks like you can't go wrong.

 
We're about 3 weeks from our trip to Positano. I remember a bunch of great reviews for La Tagliata, but see a few on tripadvisor that say the food is average and you are a bit rushed through the meal. Just want to reaffirm that it is a must visit.
We had one of the best dinners on our trip at Casa Mele.  Not your traditional Italian, but the tasting menu was out of this world, very unique food and atmosphere if you are looking for something different.

 

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