Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Pete's mom should hook up with Uncle Junior.
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Mad Men on AMC (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Red Apples
- Start date
badmojo1006
Footballguy
"Did she go to China for that tea?" 
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Please tell me we're not going down the Pete and Peggy road again. 
badmojo1006
Footballguy
I almost thought Pete had told his mom that she had the babyPlease tell me we're not going down the Pete and Peggy road again.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Who is that guy that is hitting on Pete's mom?
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
The doctor that Bob recommended.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Did Peggy just offer a threesome?
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Premier
Footballguy
Pretty sure it was Stan.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Bob Benson hitting on Pete!
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
It was Stan.
And Bob is fruity.
And Bob is fruity.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
OMFG
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Whoa! 
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
You can feel right through the screen how sick to his stomach he is. Great stuff.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Well, he deserves it.
And you wonder why Bob Benson was hitting on Pete. he can do a lot better
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
I love Peggy's pest control solution. 
Last edited by a moderator:
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Sally is going to grow up to be a woman with some serious daddy issues.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Watching this a second time. Missed this one the first time around: Don and Arnold are having drinks at the bar.
Arnold: I've been meaning to knock on your door anyway... you know, catch a game or something. I get baseball tickets -- mostly the Mets.
Don: Well I'm glad you didn't!
This is supposed to be 1969, right? The "Amazin' Mets" won the World Series that year. This must have been early in the season when expectations were low.
Arnold: I've been meaning to knock on your door anyway... you know, catch a game or something. I get baseball tickets -- mostly the Mets.
Don: Well I'm glad you didn't!
This is supposed to be 1969, right? The "Amazin' Mets" won the World Series that year. This must have been early in the season when expectations were low.
Ted Lange as your Bartender
Footballguy
It's 1968 since last week was the Democratic convention. The Mets were slowly improving in '68 but still pretty terrible (73-89, their best season to date by far)
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Ah, thanks. I just figured they were being clever.
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Just another odd Bob Benson scene that has no place nor makes sense. My theory is Bob is the ghost of the man falling in the opening credits.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Through nearly six full seasons of "Mad Men," it feels like we've seen nearly every trick in the show's bag, at least when it comes to Don Draper. Other characters may grow, change and/or surprise us with what they're capable of doing and being as the '60s move along, but Don is Don. We know his secrets. We know his limitations, just as we know his strengths. And we know or think we know exactly what Jon Hamm can do in this great role. So what strikes me, more than anything else about "Favors" a superb overall episode of the show that was a reminder of the power of shared history among characters we've been watching for six seasons was that sequence immediately after Sally catches Don and Sylvia having sex in the maid's quarters. We've seen Don Draper scared before. We've seen Don Draper angry before. We've seen Don Draper be a little kid before. But we've never seen... this. We've never seen Don Draper with absolutely no idea what to do next. We've never seen Don Draper pacing back and forth the way he does in the lobby of his building, exploring a series of equally unappetizing possibilities: Do I go back up to my mistress's apartment so she can take me along on a massive guilt trip? Do I chase after the daughter I've completely betrayed, even though I have no idea where she's going, or what to say to her? Do I... what the hell do I do here? Jonesy, you got any ideas?
And that moment of Don being at a complete loss stands out and is among the single best things I've ever seen Hamm do on this show not only because he usually has some answer (even if it's to run away), but because of the nature of the betrayal that puts him in this unhinged place.
We've seen Don Draper do bad things to a lot of people over the years. We've seen him cheat on both wives. We've seen him roughly grab the reins with Bobbie Barrett. We've seen him steal a dead man's identity, yell at Peggy until she's a sobbing mess, put his own interests ahead of the agency's time and again, and even take Sylvia's reading material while ordering to stay in her hotel room. This is not a prince of a man, ladies and gentlemen. But the one relationship he has that was close to sacred the one person with whom he genuinely tried to be a decent human being with most of the time(*) was with Sally. It is not nice to hurt your wife, your mistress, your protege or your commanding officer, but it seems like a whole other order of sin to do it to your daughter.
(*) Keep in mind that in one of the show's earliest episodes, Don skips out on Sally's birthday party and fails to bring the cake like he was supposed to because, as usual, he feels like an intruder in someone else's life, and he can't deal. But even there, he at least gets her a dog to make up for his embarrassing absence.
Sally has had her issues with her father, but by and large he's always been the hero in any dispute between her parents. Catching Don brazenly having sex with his downstairs neighbor reframes an awful lot of what she thinks she knows about her father, and about her parents' marriage and who was right and wrong a lot of the time. And though Megan isn't her mother, seeing Don betray her like that gives Sally one more thing not to believe in, and one more reason to spend a lot of her teenage and adult years in therapy and/or consuming a heavy quantity of drugs. When she listens to his ridiculous explanation for what happens, it comes with a series of physical barriers the door, her hand on top of her face, going along with the huge emotional one Don inadvertently put up. She doesn't believe him, doesn't respect him, doesn't want to deal with him, and he has brought this on himself by being unable to stop doing all the things he does to hurt himself and others.
That a parent would so cavalierly and obliviously damage his child like that is not a new tale. But "Favors" deals over and over with the notion of parents letting down their children (and, sometimes, vice versa), but also of parental figures and/or caretakers falling down on the job or people winding up without anyone to fill that role for them.
Don and Sylvia's reconciliation comes as a result of Mitchell Rosen's problems with the draft board a development Sylvia and Arnie were completely unaware of until it was far too late. Pete has passed his mother's care entirely off to Manolo, and has no idea what's really going on though, as Bob Benson notes, nothing at all may be going on outside of Mrs. Campbell's impaired mind. Nan Chaough gives Ted a hard time about loving his life at the office far more than he does her and their sons, though at least Ted and the boys get to share a nice moment when he comes home after Nan has fallen asleep. Peggy, still in the Upper West Side apartment, calls Stan to help with her rat problem, to which Stan reasonably replies that he's not her boyfriend, and therefore not the person who would be expected to drop everything and come over to deal with it. Don and Ted's a relationship has, despite their closeness in age and professional accomplishment, taken on an odd father/son vibe, with Ted frequently seeking Don's approval, and here with him taking Don to task for falling down on the job of looking after the agency's (and Ted's) best interests.
And there's that strange scene between Pete and Bob, where we seem to finally get an answer to the mystery that is Bob Benson allowing for the possibility that the show could still reveal him to be the immortal, vampiric, time-traveling offspring of either Pete and Peggy or **** Whitman and Aimee the hooker, and/or a sociopath who is planning to cook and eat the entire creative department of SC&P as he makes an unwanted pass at Pete. It's an odd choice even above and beyond the idea that Bob might be attracted to Pete in that Bob seems to read people well and Pete has just, upon learning that Manolo is gay, called the man a degenerate capable of all manner of disgusting things. Even if he still felt that attraction as opposed to, say, Sal's heartbroken response to hearing Ken describe Kurt with similar language back in "The Jet Set" that would seem a clear signal to abort in this particular moment, no?
Still, Bob's theory that you can make someone love you by attending to their every need stands at odds to what we see going on elsewhere in the hour. Don has taken Sally's love as a given, though he's rarely done anything to earn it, and is devastated to realize that he's lost it. (And also, because Don is a selfish ###, he's just freaked out that she will tell Megan, or Betty, or anyone at all.) Mrs. Campbell and Pete have always been emotionally distant from one another, yet there's an expectation on each of their parts that the other should be treating them better than they do, simply because they're related.
In perhaps the episode's best scene or, at least, the best scene that doesn't involve Sally getting her heart stomped into a million tiny pieces by her father we see Pete and Peggy getting drunk after a successful pitch meeting with Ocean Spray, while designated pilot Ted has to stay sober and pay the check. Theirs has always been a complicated relationship, and one the show hasn't touched on in recent years as each character has evolved. But Peggy's conversation with the senile Mrs. Campbell brought back so much of their history with every one of the old lady's words applying to both Peggy and Trudy before we got to watch Pete and Peggy genuinely enjoy each other's company for a few moments and reflect on all they've been through. It was both an echo of some similar Don/Peggy scenes in "The Suitcase" as in that episode, nouns aren't particularly necessary, because everything is understood between the two parties and their audience and also a much kinder version of the kind of after-hours Pete/Peggy scenes we saw in the early years. Back in season 1, Pete told a confident, happy Peggy, "I don't like you like this." Here, Pete can tell her, "At least one of us ended up important" and have the sentiment feel at least half complimentary (the other half: self-pity). As Pete observes, Peggy really knows him, and some of the best scenes in this series revolve around characters with shared history taking a moment to reflect on what that means, and who they are now versus who they were way back when.
If "Mad Men" were to run another 10 or 15 years, as opposed to likely ending after next season, I could imagine a scene where Don and an adult Sally wind up at a bar together, and she gives him hell for all that he failed to do for her, and all the ways that he and Betty screwed her up. But at a certain point in that scene, I can also imagine them laughing over that time he brought the dog back after blowing off her party, or when she accidentally put rum on his french toast instead of syrup.
Don has fallen down on the parenting job in almost every way imaginable. But he does know Sally, and unfortunately Sally knows him. He has not done right by her, as we saw in such devastating fashion tonight, but there's a connection there that will not go away no matter how much Sally might understandably want it to.
Some other thoughts:
* I am open to any and all theories as to why Stan (as opposed to, say, Ginsberg) would have a poster of Moshe Dayan above his bed.
* September of 1968 was one of the rare months that year without a major tragedy or scandal, which is probably to the show's advantage; though Matt Weiner can only work with what was happening in the world at the time, there comes a point where it becomes desensitizing to see the characters react to one horrific news story after another. Though Vietnam looms as a general issue for the Rosens, the episode as a whole focuses much more on office politics and personal relationships, and is the stronger for it.
* Among John Slattery's many talents: the man can juggle oranges.
* Not only can Pete sense the attraction between Ted and Peggy, but Ted in turn can sense the bond between his two traveling companions. And Mrs. Chaough understands her husband very well, even if she may not know just how much Ted enjoys being in the company of this particular young copywriter.
* Jonesy's another caretaker who doesn't do a very good job of things, repeatedly giving Sally his entire key ring without thought of what might happen. Then again, he's better at the gig than the guy who starts changing out of his uniform in the lobby and doesn't even bother greeting Sally on his way out the door.
* Now that we know Megan isn't dead (yet) and seem to know that Bob is gay (though, again, that could be all part of his master criminal plan), what new crazy theories can we spin out about one or both of them? Could this be like Heinlein's "All You Zombies," and we'll eventually find out that Megan and Bob are the same person from different points in their own timeline?
And that moment of Don being at a complete loss stands out and is among the single best things I've ever seen Hamm do on this show not only because he usually has some answer (even if it's to run away), but because of the nature of the betrayal that puts him in this unhinged place.
We've seen Don Draper do bad things to a lot of people over the years. We've seen him cheat on both wives. We've seen him roughly grab the reins with Bobbie Barrett. We've seen him steal a dead man's identity, yell at Peggy until she's a sobbing mess, put his own interests ahead of the agency's time and again, and even take Sylvia's reading material while ordering to stay in her hotel room. This is not a prince of a man, ladies and gentlemen. But the one relationship he has that was close to sacred the one person with whom he genuinely tried to be a decent human being with most of the time(*) was with Sally. It is not nice to hurt your wife, your mistress, your protege or your commanding officer, but it seems like a whole other order of sin to do it to your daughter.
(*) Keep in mind that in one of the show's earliest episodes, Don skips out on Sally's birthday party and fails to bring the cake like he was supposed to because, as usual, he feels like an intruder in someone else's life, and he can't deal. But even there, he at least gets her a dog to make up for his embarrassing absence.
Sally has had her issues with her father, but by and large he's always been the hero in any dispute between her parents. Catching Don brazenly having sex with his downstairs neighbor reframes an awful lot of what she thinks she knows about her father, and about her parents' marriage and who was right and wrong a lot of the time. And though Megan isn't her mother, seeing Don betray her like that gives Sally one more thing not to believe in, and one more reason to spend a lot of her teenage and adult years in therapy and/or consuming a heavy quantity of drugs. When she listens to his ridiculous explanation for what happens, it comes with a series of physical barriers the door, her hand on top of her face, going along with the huge emotional one Don inadvertently put up. She doesn't believe him, doesn't respect him, doesn't want to deal with him, and he has brought this on himself by being unable to stop doing all the things he does to hurt himself and others.
That a parent would so cavalierly and obliviously damage his child like that is not a new tale. But "Favors" deals over and over with the notion of parents letting down their children (and, sometimes, vice versa), but also of parental figures and/or caretakers falling down on the job or people winding up without anyone to fill that role for them.
Don and Sylvia's reconciliation comes as a result of Mitchell Rosen's problems with the draft board a development Sylvia and Arnie were completely unaware of until it was far too late. Pete has passed his mother's care entirely off to Manolo, and has no idea what's really going on though, as Bob Benson notes, nothing at all may be going on outside of Mrs. Campbell's impaired mind. Nan Chaough gives Ted a hard time about loving his life at the office far more than he does her and their sons, though at least Ted and the boys get to share a nice moment when he comes home after Nan has fallen asleep. Peggy, still in the Upper West Side apartment, calls Stan to help with her rat problem, to which Stan reasonably replies that he's not her boyfriend, and therefore not the person who would be expected to drop everything and come over to deal with it. Don and Ted's a relationship has, despite their closeness in age and professional accomplishment, taken on an odd father/son vibe, with Ted frequently seeking Don's approval, and here with him taking Don to task for falling down on the job of looking after the agency's (and Ted's) best interests.
And there's that strange scene between Pete and Bob, where we seem to finally get an answer to the mystery that is Bob Benson allowing for the possibility that the show could still reveal him to be the immortal, vampiric, time-traveling offspring of either Pete and Peggy or **** Whitman and Aimee the hooker, and/or a sociopath who is planning to cook and eat the entire creative department of SC&P as he makes an unwanted pass at Pete. It's an odd choice even above and beyond the idea that Bob might be attracted to Pete in that Bob seems to read people well and Pete has just, upon learning that Manolo is gay, called the man a degenerate capable of all manner of disgusting things. Even if he still felt that attraction as opposed to, say, Sal's heartbroken response to hearing Ken describe Kurt with similar language back in "The Jet Set" that would seem a clear signal to abort in this particular moment, no?
Still, Bob's theory that you can make someone love you by attending to their every need stands at odds to what we see going on elsewhere in the hour. Don has taken Sally's love as a given, though he's rarely done anything to earn it, and is devastated to realize that he's lost it. (And also, because Don is a selfish ###, he's just freaked out that she will tell Megan, or Betty, or anyone at all.) Mrs. Campbell and Pete have always been emotionally distant from one another, yet there's an expectation on each of their parts that the other should be treating them better than they do, simply because they're related.
In perhaps the episode's best scene or, at least, the best scene that doesn't involve Sally getting her heart stomped into a million tiny pieces by her father we see Pete and Peggy getting drunk after a successful pitch meeting with Ocean Spray, while designated pilot Ted has to stay sober and pay the check. Theirs has always been a complicated relationship, and one the show hasn't touched on in recent years as each character has evolved. But Peggy's conversation with the senile Mrs. Campbell brought back so much of their history with every one of the old lady's words applying to both Peggy and Trudy before we got to watch Pete and Peggy genuinely enjoy each other's company for a few moments and reflect on all they've been through. It was both an echo of some similar Don/Peggy scenes in "The Suitcase" as in that episode, nouns aren't particularly necessary, because everything is understood between the two parties and their audience and also a much kinder version of the kind of after-hours Pete/Peggy scenes we saw in the early years. Back in season 1, Pete told a confident, happy Peggy, "I don't like you like this." Here, Pete can tell her, "At least one of us ended up important" and have the sentiment feel at least half complimentary (the other half: self-pity). As Pete observes, Peggy really knows him, and some of the best scenes in this series revolve around characters with shared history taking a moment to reflect on what that means, and who they are now versus who they were way back when.
If "Mad Men" were to run another 10 or 15 years, as opposed to likely ending after next season, I could imagine a scene where Don and an adult Sally wind up at a bar together, and she gives him hell for all that he failed to do for her, and all the ways that he and Betty screwed her up. But at a certain point in that scene, I can also imagine them laughing over that time he brought the dog back after blowing off her party, or when she accidentally put rum on his french toast instead of syrup.
Don has fallen down on the parenting job in almost every way imaginable. But he does know Sally, and unfortunately Sally knows him. He has not done right by her, as we saw in such devastating fashion tonight, but there's a connection there that will not go away no matter how much Sally might understandably want it to.
Some other thoughts:
* I am open to any and all theories as to why Stan (as opposed to, say, Ginsberg) would have a poster of Moshe Dayan above his bed.
* September of 1968 was one of the rare months that year without a major tragedy or scandal, which is probably to the show's advantage; though Matt Weiner can only work with what was happening in the world at the time, there comes a point where it becomes desensitizing to see the characters react to one horrific news story after another. Though Vietnam looms as a general issue for the Rosens, the episode as a whole focuses much more on office politics and personal relationships, and is the stronger for it.
* Among John Slattery's many talents: the man can juggle oranges.
* Not only can Pete sense the attraction between Ted and Peggy, but Ted in turn can sense the bond between his two traveling companions. And Mrs. Chaough understands her husband very well, even if she may not know just how much Ted enjoys being in the company of this particular young copywriter.
* Jonesy's another caretaker who doesn't do a very good job of things, repeatedly giving Sally his entire key ring without thought of what might happen. Then again, he's better at the gig than the guy who starts changing out of his uniform in the lobby and doesn't even bother greeting Sally on his way out the door.
* Now that we know Megan isn't dead (yet) and seem to know that Bob is gay (though, again, that could be all part of his master criminal plan), what new crazy theories can we spin out about one or both of them? Could this be like Heinlein's "All You Zombies," and we'll eventually find out that Megan and Bob are the same person from different points in their own timeline?
Last edited by a moderator:
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
Just a little gay chicken folks, nothing to get your feathers ruffled about.
Sammy3469
Footballguy
My guess is he wants to cause Pete to do something that looks even worse to the rest of the partners. Benson is always angling for promotions and my guess he knows Pete is "in" with the Ted side of the company and wants that to end.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
As soon as Sally met Mitchell in the lobby my wife said Sally was going to catch don banging the neighbor. We love the show and the episode, as we felt the tension when Sally entered the apartment and don's reaction was some of the best stuff of the season, but things have been somewhat predictable this season.
Premier
Footballguy
McGarnicle
Footballguy
This has been by far the most interesting season for me. Seemed to lack focus early on, but they sure have ramped up the intensity lately. Can't wait to see what happens over the last two episodes. Clearly we are building toward a major turning point with Don and probably a cliffhanger for the ages.
Dan Lambskin
Footballguy
Don should have just used the "wasn't me" defense
pantherclub
Footballguy
What a weird episode.
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
badmojo1006 said:
Do you watch the show in the middle of a car wash or something?badmojo1006 said:
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
So good job on all of those predictions, guys.
Premier
Footballguy
Yea that season finale was a hoot. What's your problem with people discussing theories? Would rather the thread be dormant for a week? You used to be one of my favorite and funny posters here but now you're just a more miserable, bitter version of Smoo.
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
Lots of people have discussed the Megan as Sharon Tate theory. I believe you did a bit more than that by confidently asserting she would die. Do you really not expect people to point it out if you're wrong?
I've made my own predictions. If Don doesn't have a health scare by the end of the season, I'll be surprised. I personally find the Megan theories strained. We'll see if anyone's right.
Premier
Footballguy
If I'm wrong I will be the first to say it. There happens to be 2 episodes left though and the big stuff usually seems to happen in the second to last episode. And I wasn't referring to just that post for tanner's hyper bitterness. It's all over the place now.
Major
Footballguy
Major
Footballguy
first walking in on Roger, now Daddy and whatever Glen did to her....poor girl. She'll probably end up doing pron.
Last edited by a moderator:
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
I just don't get the deal with making predictions/espousing theories.And I'm not bitter. Everyone else just sucks.
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Anyone else noticed that Don just seems to be ####### terrible at his job in this season?
Mad Men is very careful to not telegraph its punches, but I'll take a wild swing and guess that Megan and members of the firm try to stage an intervention.
Mad Men is very careful to not telegraph its punches, but I'll take a wild swing and guess that Megan and members of the firm try to stage an intervention.
Aerial Assault
Footballguy
Hm, not sure. He set up the deal with CGC that got Chevy and he was focused enough in CA to land (a shot at) Sunkist. But yeah, I am tired of him chasing after Linda Cardellini and would prefer to see some of that Draper Magic at work in the office instead."Good said:
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
Yeah, he's a mere shadow of himself.Good Posting Judge said:
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
He's had some hits as well as misses this year, teaming up with CGC was a brilliant masterstroke. But there certainly seem to be more of the latter and less of the former.
He's gotten on the straight and narrow in the past in various ways too, it's interesting to see a character on TV who doesn't get fixed and stay fixed, but is so broken that any fix is only temporary.
Premier
Footballguy
So you don't "get the deal with making predictions" on the message board (
) and you hate reviews of the show. Or at least Sepinwall's. So what's the point of checking into the thread then? Looking for grammar errors to correct?
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Wow, Don chugging the vodka early
