Marvin Harrison WR28? (1 Viewer)

[whosnext]

I am a firm believer in David Dodds top 300 or top 220 this year. He has Marvin Harrison listed as the 28th WR. Does anyone one else think this is a little low? Does'nt his preseason work bring his rank up? He looks healthy and is only one year out from elite statis.

 

[Anonymous Internet User]

he's almost 36 years old. tough to continue to produce at that age the year after a somewhat major injury that prevented him from playing most of the season.

if he's healthy, i think top 20 is very possible.

if he's lost a step, i think #28 is more reasonable.

that said, i just took him 5.02 in a PPR redraft and am happy to take the risk.

 

[Big_Russel]

Old smold...

Harrison will be better than the 28th highest scoring WR this season. The ranking is too low. Period.

 

[Jon_Moore]

Assuming 12 teams, he's drafted as a WR3. I know it's not going to be a popular thought, but if the injury is fully healed, there's no reason he can't finish top 5.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

i think hes too low, but i picked CJ (det) over him in the 4th and he went in the 5th in a good 12 team league?

I think he has to outperform that?

 

[whosnext]

Assuming 12 teams, he's drafted as a WR3. I know it's not going to be a popular thought, but if the injury is fully healed, there's no reason he can't finish top 5.

Thats what I was thinking.

 

[Marc Levin]

If you think Harrison is about as healthy as he can be, and is motivated to play football this year, it is low and he's a great value.

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

Count me in camp one - I am targetting him as my WR3 from this point forward (I really believe he is playing possum here and taking advantage of the veteran perogative of blowing off the preseason - when the football starts flying for real, he'll play hard)

 

[packersfan]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

 

[joffer]

Assuming 12 teams, he's drafted as a WR3. I know it's not going to be a popular thought, but if the injury is fully healed, there's no reason he can't finish top 5.

there are plenty of reasons - Moss, Owens, Wayne, Edwards, Colston, Fitzgerald, Johnson, etc.

 

[whosnext]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

 

[Rovers]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

 

[jestertj]

He was the 17th receiver off the board in a draft I was in last night.

 

[packersfan]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

 

[Marc Levin]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina? Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54Overall:Harrison = 74th overallHackett = 109th overallMush/Bruce = 134/137

 

[Marc Levin]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

He'll be drafted on name recognition alone in most drafts at well above Dodds' WR28 - the ADP charts say 59th overall, WR21

 

[packersfan]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

He'll be drafted on name recognition alone in most drafts at well above Dodds' WR28 - the ADP charts say 59th overall, WR21

I agree. That brings me to my point - if you can get Harrison as your WR3 I think the value is there. But you have to be 100% convinced he's back in order to take him as your WR2. How many people here are 100% convinced of that?

 

[David Yudkin]

Long story short, Harrison's health was the SECONDARY factor from the time he got hurt until now. His MENTAL STATE and DESIRE TO PLAY are what's open for debate, as that is what kept him out week after week, month after month last season. Harrison had full medical clearance to play shortly after he was hurt last year.

So if we keep his medical health a constant (ie a minimal component to this), then we need to evaluate those other issues. IMO, until we see Harrison doing everything he would normally do, practicing as he would normally practice, taking hard hit across the middle on a regular basis, playing both 100% of the time AND with 100% commitment, I would be leery of his outlook heading forward. Of course the team is going to say he's fine . . . they did that all last year, too.

I realize that we very likely may not get to see that on display until after it's too late (ie post fantasy drafts), but I would be content on letting another owner worry about him each week while taking someone else with fewer headaches.

 

[packersfan]

Long story short, Harrison's health was the SECONDARY factor from the time he got hurt until now. His MENTAL STATE and DESIRE TO PLAY are what's open for debate, as that is what kept him out week after week, month after month last season. Harrison had full medical clearance to play shortly after he was hurt last year.So if we keep his medical health a constant (ie a minimal component to this), then we need to evaluate those other issues. IMO, until we see Harrison doing everything he would normally do, practicing as he would normally practice, taking hard hit across the middle on a regular basis, playing both 100% of the time AND with 100% commitment, I would be leery of his outlook heading forward. Of course the team is going to say he's fine . . . they did that all last year, too.I realize that we very likely may not get to see that on display until after it's too late (ie post fantasy drafts), but I would be content on letting another owner worry about him each week while taking someone else with fewer headaches.

Agreed. Where he's going right now I just think there are far too many questions about him in my mind which would prevent me from taking him as my WR2. Give me one of the young WRs with serious upside like Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery or Calvin or even a Roy Williams. If I'm going the veteran route I'll look at Ward. I feel more comfortable with them because I feel more comfortable projecting how they may do this season. With Marvin, I can't get a good feel at all. One of the strongest credos in fantasy is to not let last season's misery impact this year's projections. At least it is for me. But being a Harrison owner last season and suffering through week after week after week after week ... of the guy not wanting to play, it's tough for me to just wipe that all away and believe he's Marvin Harrison again. Where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd feel comfortable drafting him. But he won't fall that far in all probability and that means he'll be on someone else's roster this season and not mine.

 

[Marc Levin]

I think his ADP is right about where I'd take him in quite a fewleagues.

I am often taking my WR3 in the first 24 WRs if I have to start 3 in a PPR.

"Value" is always perceived. As a WR3, I'm OK taking Harrison at around his ADP. If i have two RBs and two WRs on board, I very well might take a chance on Harrison's upside in the 5th.

 

[whosnext]

Long story short, Harrison's health was the SECONDARY factor from the time he got hurt until now. His MENTAL STATE and DESIRE TO PLAY are what's open for debate, as that is what kept him out week after week, month after month last season. Harrison had full medical clearance to play shortly after he was hurt last year.So if we keep his medical health a constant (ie a minimal component to this), then we need to evaluate those other issues. IMO, until we see Harrison doing everything he would normally do, practicing as he would normally practice, taking hard hit across the middle on a regular basis, playing both 100% of the time AND with 100% commitment, I would be leery of his outlook heading forward. Of course the team is going to say he's fine . . . they did that all last year, too.I realize that we very likely may not get to see that on display until after it's too late (ie post fantasy drafts), but I would be content on letting another owner worry about him each week while taking someone else with fewer headaches.

Agreed. Where he's going right now I just think there are far too many questions about him in my mind which would prevent me from taking him as my WR2. Give me one of the young WRs with serious upside like Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery or Calvin or even a Roy Williams. If I'm going the veteran route I'll look at Ward. I feel more comfortable with them because I feel more comfortable projecting how they may do this season. With Marvin, I can't get a good feel at all. One of the strongest credos in fantasy is to not let last season's misery impact this year's projections. At least it is for me. But being a Harrison owner last season and suffering through week after week after week after week ... of the guy not wanting to play, it's tough for me to just wipe that all away and believe he's Marvin Harrison again. Where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd feel comfortable drafting him. But he won't fall that far in all probability and that means he'll be on someone else's roster this season and not mine.

Yeah he is a risk but so was Randy Moss last year. I know it is like comparing apples to oranges but Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery will not be a top 5 but I think Harrison can still be a top 5. I guess it is a risk reward type thing. If he is there at pick 38 I am considering it. That would be my 5th pick. I should have Frank Gore, Drew Brees, Chad Johnson, and Brandon Jacobs if all goes well. I think Harrison would be worth it if I am this solid.c

 

[David Yudkin]

Long story short, Harrison's health was the SECONDARY factor from the time he got hurt until now. His MENTAL STATE and DESIRE TO PLAY are what's open for debate, as that is what kept him out week after week, month after month last season. Harrison had full medical clearance to play shortly after he was hurt last year.So if we keep his medical health a constant (ie a minimal component to this), then we need to evaluate those other issues. IMO, until we see Harrison doing everything he would normally do, practicing as he would normally practice, taking hard hit across the middle on a regular basis, playing both 100% of the time AND with 100% commitment, I would be leery of his outlook heading forward. Of course the team is going to say he's fine . . . they did that all last year, too.I realize that we very likely may not get to see that on display until after it's too late (ie post fantasy drafts), but I would be content on letting another owner worry about him each week while taking someone else with fewer headaches.

Agreed. Where he's going right now I just think there are far too many questions about him in my mind which would prevent me from taking him as my WR2. Give me one of the young WRs with serious upside like Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery or Calvin or even a Roy Williams. If I'm going the veteran route I'll look at Ward. I feel more comfortable with them because I feel more comfortable projecting how they may do this season. With Marvin, I can't get a good feel at all. One of the strongest credos in fantasy is to not let last season's misery impact this year's projections. At least it is for me. But being a Harrison owner last season and suffering through week after week after week after week ... of the guy not wanting to play, it's tough for me to just wipe that all away and believe he's Marvin Harrison again. Where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd feel comfortable drafting him. But he won't fall that far in all probability and that means he'll be on someone else's roster this season and not mine.

Yeah he is a risk but so was Randy Moss last year. I know it is like comparing apples to oranges but Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery will not be a top 5 but I think Harrison can still be a top 5. I guess it is a risk reward type thing. If he is there at pick 38 I am considering it. That would be my 5th pick. I should have Frank Gore, Drew Brees, Chad Johnson, and Brandon Jacobs if all goes well. I think Harrison would be worth it if I am this solid.c

I don't see the Moss situation at all analagous to Harrison last year. Moss wasn't hurt, Harrison wasn't on an all-time bad team, Harrison wasn't traded to one of the premier teams in the league, Moss is much younger, etc. And IIRC, MOss was getting projected in the Top 10-15 WRs . . . not near WR30.

 

[packersfan]

Long story short, Harrison's health was the SECONDARY factor from the time he got hurt until now. His MENTAL STATE and DESIRE TO PLAY are what's open for debate, as that is what kept him out week after week, month after month last season. Harrison had full medical clearance to play shortly after he was hurt last year.So if we keep his medical health a constant (ie a minimal component to this), then we need to evaluate those other issues. IMO, until we see Harrison doing everything he would normally do, practicing as he would normally practice, taking hard hit across the middle on a regular basis, playing both 100% of the time AND with 100% commitment, I would be leery of his outlook heading forward. Of course the team is going to say he's fine . . . they did that all last year, too.I realize that we very likely may not get to see that on display until after it's too late (ie post fantasy drafts), but I would be content on letting another owner worry about him each week while taking someone else with fewer headaches.

Agreed. Where he's going right now I just think there are far too many questions about him in my mind which would prevent me from taking him as my WR2. Give me one of the young WRs with serious upside like Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery or Calvin or even a Roy Williams. If I'm going the veteran route I'll look at Ward. I feel more comfortable with them because I feel more comfortable projecting how they may do this season. With Marvin, I can't get a good feel at all. One of the strongest credos in fantasy is to not let last season's misery impact this year's projections. At least it is for me. But being a Harrison owner last season and suffering through week after week after week after week ... of the guy not wanting to play, it's tough for me to just wipe that all away and believe he's Marvin Harrison again. Where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd feel comfortable drafting him. But he won't fall that far in all probability and that means he'll be on someone else's roster this season and not mine.

Yeah he is a risk but so was Randy Moss last year. I know it is like comparing apples to oranges but Bowe, Holmes, Cotchery will not be a top 5 but I think Harrison can still be a top 5. I guess it is a risk reward type thing. If he is there at pick 38 I am considering it. That would be my 5th pick. I should have Frank Gore, Drew Brees, Chad Johnson, and Brandon Jacobs if all goes well. I think Harrison would be worth it if I am this solid.c

You're right about Moss. That definitely paid off last year. And I think Harrison could pay off for his owners this year too. I'm not denying that. I'm just saying I'm not comfortable taking him as my WR2. If I can get him as my WR3 after 25-30 or so are off the board that's when I'd be comfortable with him. But I realize that isn't likely to happen so I don't anticipate Harrison being on my team this year.

 

[Rovers]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

 

[Nate]

In the expert rankings, plenty have Harrison ranked much lower than Dodds, after two weeks of preseason.

Sure he might return to form. But all the signs of a changing of the guard in Indy are there.

The rankings don't project his ceiling. Sure he could be top 5. A lot of receivers could be top 5. But Harrison's floor this season is low, low, low.

All that said, I'll be taking him if he comes cheap. But he probably won't in my leagues.

 

[BusterTBronco]

Marvin Harrison is done. D-O-N-E, done! If he had any pride, he would retire and not ruin his legacy with the season he is about to have.

Marvin Harrison 2008 = Rod Smith 2006

 

[Rovers]

Marvin Harrison is done. D-O-N-E, done! If he had any pride, he would retire and not ruin his legacy with the season he is about to have.Marvin Harrison 2008 = Rod Smith 2006

I take it your sig line is indicative of your FF accumen.

 

[tommyGunZ]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

C'mon now - are there any WRs after the first couple off the board who fit this criteria? No WRs after the top 6-7 are sure things at all. No doubt that there are legitimate question marks, but along with those red flags is a decade worth of 90-1200-10+ seasons. It's not hard to look at his stats and find the anomaly.

 

[David Dodds]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

Old info. Here is the updated list:http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_816.php

I have Harrison at WR28.

 

[packersfan]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

C'mon now - are there any WRs after the first couple off the board who fit this criteria? No WRs after the top 6-7 are sure things at all. No doubt that there are legitimate question marks, but along with those red flags is a decade worth of 90-1200-10+ seasons. It's not hard to look at his stats and find the anomaly.

I'm not talking about finding a sure thing in that range. I'm talking about whether or not I have a level of comfort with other WRs compared to Harrison. And for me, I do. Yes Harrison has had a magnificent career. He's a first-ballot Hall of Famer. But I worry that at his age, last season's injury may have been an indication of more injuries to come. Combine that with his lack of enthusiasm for returning to the field last year and I'm just not confident taking him as my WR2 - which is where he is being drafted. That's why I said where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd be comfortable drafting him. I just don't have a level of comfort with Harrison that would lead me to take him among the first 20 WRs in a draft.

 

[tommyGunZ]

If you believe, like most of the rest of the FF world, that Marvin is ailing, unmotivated, and will be the third receiver on the squad this year, he is rated appropriately.

I haven't heard anything about Harrison being unmotivated in camp this year. There were rumors last year that he didn't push himself very hard to return from his knee injury but I haven't heard anything about that this year so far. Did I miss that? I'd be interested in that because I'm struggling like hell to rank Harrison this year. I really thought he was done after last year but all the reports so far have been glowing and he's looked good in the two preseason games - at least in terms of moving around, running routes and all that. He looks much better than he did in the playoff game against the Jags. To answer the OP's question - I'm not sure there will be 27 WRs off the board before Harrison in most drafts. He seems to be going in the 20-25 range and closer to 20. To me, that's the concern. Like Marc, I'd gamble with him as my WR3 but he's being drafted in WR2 territory in most of the drafts I've seen so far and I still think that's a big gamble. It certainly could pay off but I think it's a gamble.

Dwayne Bowe is currently listed as the WR19 I would take Harrison before him.

That's what I'm saying. I don't think 27 WRs will be taken ahead of Harrison in most drafts. I think he'll go in the 20-25 range and possibly in the 15-20 range. That speaks to my point - if you take him as your WR2, you need to be 100% confident he'll deliver. I'm not 100% confident even though the reports thus far have been quite good. If I could get him as my WR3, I'd take him but I doubt he'll last that far in my draft because he isn't lasting that far in the drafts I've seen so far.

C'mon now - are there any WRs after the first couple off the board who fit this criteria? No WRs after the top 6-7 are sure things at all. No doubt that there are legitimate question marks, but along with those red flags is a decade worth of 90-1200-10+ seasons. It's not hard to look at his stats and find the anomaly.

I'm not talking about finding a sure thing in that range. I'm talking about whether or not I have a level of comfort with other WRs compared to Harrison. And for me, I do. Yes Harrison has had a magnificent career. He's a first-ballot Hall of Famer. But I worry that at his age, last season's injury may have been an indication of more injuries to come. Combine that with his lack of enthusiasm for returning to the field last year and I'm just not confident taking him as my WR2 - which is where he is being drafted. That's why I said where Dodds has him ranked is where I'd be comfortable drafting him. I just don't have a level of comfort with Harrison that would lead me to take him among the first 20 WRs in a draft.

I agree with your rationale, if not your conclusion. You hit the flags - his age and desire are certainly cause for concern. IMO, his upside outweighs those concerns, and I have no problem taking him over the Roddy Whites, LColes, Chris Chambers, Greg Jennings, and Dwayne Bowes, all of whom also carry their own red flags.Perhaps he's finished - who knows. But if you take him with a 5th or 6th round pick, and he's back to normal, it's the kind of pick that wins leagues. And even if he's not All Pro Marvin, but just steady Marvin, he's still a solid WR3, so the risk isn't as great as some believe it to be, IMO.

Certainly one of the intriguing issues this summer.

 

[Marc Levin]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

That is clearly an old/incorrect list as it has Engram at WR28. I checked this week's top-200 overal, and it is not similar to that list - likely because you have to be a subscriber to link to the list now, so it may be defaulting to an old list? I have no idea - but the list you have linked above is outdated.My ADP/ranking numbers are accurate as of today.

 

[Rovers]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

Old info. Here is the updated list:http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_816.php

I have Harrison at WR28.

Recently renewed my sub.... how is it then that this is dated info? Just sayin, if it's old, maybe it ought to be deleted? How does one navigate the site to make sure they are not loking at dated rankings? not bein a wise #### here... I will look at the link you posted... and do what I can to be sure I don't click on any other old info... thanks.PS: I think being behind Coles, Curtis and Chambers is still too low. Peyton Manning's #2 WR still has to be a top 20 WR if he's healthy, JMHO.

 

[Marc Levin]

The rankings don't project his ceiling.

That's why I always struggle with my rankings -I have to balance between being accurate with where the player will end up at the end of the year and their "worth" to your squad either on a per game basis or where I think their potential lies.

 

[Marc Levin]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

Old info. Here is the updated list:http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_816.php

I have Harrison at WR28.

Recently renewed my sub.... how is it then that this is dated info? Just sayin, if it's old, maybe it ought to be deleted? How does one navigate the site to make sure they are not loking at dated rankings? not bein a wise #### here... I will look at the link you posted... and do what I can to be sure I don't click on any other old info... thanks.

Front page, click on top-220, there is a little "8/16" next to it

 

[Marc Levin]

I don't see the Moss situation at all analagous to Harrison last year. Moss wasn't hurt,

While you are correct in all other regards, I recall Moss was actually hurt heading into TC, which was why we didn't see much of him in the preseason and which was how he kind of exploded on the scene . . .

 

[Rovers]

One HAS to think Marvin is all washed up one ranks him behind the likes of Bruce, at 104 overall, and Hackett and Mush ranked respectively at 7 spots (overall) and 32 spots (overall) behind Harrison. Heck, we don't even know who will be the #2 WR between Hackett and Mush, but they are ranked right in that same teir with Harrison! I mean... ANY starting WR on Indy is in the same teir with the #2-#3 WR on Carolina?

Dodds has some inside info, or he really screwed up with this one. It happens... but this one is a real boner. I would trade Bruce, Hackett AND Mush for Harrison in a redraft!

Hackett = WR41; Mush = WR 53; Bruce = WR 54

Overall:

Harrison = 74th overall

Hackett = 109th overall

Mush/Bruce = 134/137

I Bruce- 104M Harrison- 109

Hackett- 116

Mush- 141

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_810.php

BTW, that is 49 spots below harrison's ADP in overall rankings....

Old info. Here is the updated list:http://subscribers.footballguys.com/2008/08top200_816.php

I have Harrison at WR28.

Recently renewed my sub.... how is it then that this is dated info? Just sayin, if it's old, maybe it ought to be deleted? How does one navigate the site to make sure they are not loking at dated rankings? not bein a wise #### here... I will look at the link you posted... and do what I can to be sure I don't click on any other old info... thanks.

Front page, click on top-220, there is a little "8/16" next to it

Thought that is what I had done, but obviously, that is NOT what I had done! I guess I got to old rankings in some round about back door pathway while I was going over many of this fine site's rankings and info... I certainly did not look at old rankings on purpose!

 

[Marc Levin]

Yeah, not sure how you did that, though your link has the date 8/10/08 in it, so that my have something to do with it . . .

 

[David Yudkin]

I don't see the Moss situation at all analagous to Harrison last year. Moss wasn't hurt,

While you are correct in all other regards, I recall Moss was actually hurt heading into TC, which was why we didn't see much of him in the preseason and which was how he kind of exploded on the scene . . .

Not that I want to go scrambling for old posts, but I mentioned last year around this time that I had heard that the Moss thing was a smokescreen precipitated by BB to catch teams off guard.

 

[Marc Levin]

I don't see the Moss situation at all analagous to Harrison last year. Moss wasn't hurt,

While you are correct in all other regards, I recall Moss was actually hurt heading into TC, which was why we didn't see much of him in the preseason and which was how he kind of exploded on the scene . . .

Not that I want to go scrambling for old posts, but I mentioned last year around this time that I had heard that the Moss thing was a smokescreen precipitated by BB to catch teams off guard.

BB was acting deceitful to gain an advantage?No way . . .

 

[vikingdave]

anyone who thinks Harrison will EVER be a WR1 again is crazy...WR2 is even pushing it...WR28 seems about right...old ### WRs coming off injury dont bounce back with monster years...

 

[Rovers]

anyone who thinks Harrison will EVER be a WR1 again is crazy...WR2 is even pushing it...WR28 seems about right...old ### WRs coming off injury dont bounce back with monster years...

So.... Coles over Marvin? Just not buying that Harrison is all washed up as P Manning's #2 WR. When, or if he goes to #3, OK...... but no way Chris Chambers is gonna have a better year than Harrison, and Hackett and Mush battling for the #2 spot in Carolina aren't even close to Marvis conservative upside. BTW, how old is Hines Ward? I'd take Marvin over him too. Not sayin he's a #1 WR, but he will be a solid 2.

 

[Jerry Lawler]

In a PPR league last year, Santonio Holmes was WR24 with 52/924/8. Donald Driver was WR23 with 82/1048/2. If you split the difference between those two disparate statistic types, you would get 67/986/5. If Harrison is healthy enough to play, it's difficult for me to imagine him not surpassing those statistics, even if he is essentially washed up physically. The Colts are tied to Harrison pretty strongly and have committed $12 million to him this season (http://www.coltscap.net/salarycap.php). I think they're loyal enough to start him this season if he's able to play. The Colts have shown a willingness to hold players out during the pre-season if there is any reason to be concerned about injury, so his participation in pre-season games is strong evidence of his ability to play. Given his familiarity with Tom Moore's option routes and Manning's comfort level with Harrison, I can't think of 28 WR's I would rather have this season.

 

[Rovers]

In a PPR league last year, Santonio Holmes was WR24 with 52/924/8. Donald Driver was WR23 with 82/1048/2. If you split the difference between those two disparate statistic types, you would get 67/986/5. If Harrison is healthy enough to play, it's difficult for me to imagine him not surpassing those statistics, even if he is essentially washed up physically. The Colts are tied to Harrison pretty strongly and have committed $12 million to him this season (http://www.coltscap.net/salarycap.php). I think they're loyal enough to start him this season if he's able to play. The Colts have shown a willingness to hold players out during the pre-season if there is any reason to be concerned about injury, so his participation in pre-season games is strong evidence of his ability to play. Given his familiarity with Tom Moore's option routes and Manning's comfort level with Harrison, I can't think of 28 WR's I would rather have this season.

 

[Sweetness_34]

Let those who want to sleep on Marvin sleep. Easy money and I wish some of these guys were in my league....oh wait, some of them probably are. I picked Harrison in my redraft league in 5th round to go with Colston and Andre Johnson. If AJ stays healthy, I can see championship in a PPR league.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Of the top 20 all-time leaders in receiving yards, you won't find anyone who maintained their production beyond the wall of age 34/35. If they suffered an injury in their early 30s, this is especially true. Even a physical fitness freak with an uber regimine (Rice) fell off sharply.

He may well be a starter for a few more years, and I can see him being productive, but not much beyond 800 yards and 6 TDs.

Blasphemy, eh? Don't take my word for it; look at every single player on this list in the top 20 (ages are listed next to each season), then tell me Harrison will be different from every other great WR the game has ever known.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead..._yds_career.htm

You honestly believe he will defy what has happened to every other great wide receier in the last 40 years? Why?

 

[LHUCKS]

Harrison will be on most of my teams this year...he's underranked.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Of the top 20 all-time leaders in receiving yards, you won't find anyone who maintained their production beyond the wall of age 34/35. If they suffered an injury in their early 30s, this is especially true. Even a physical fitness freak with an uber regimine (Rice) fell off sharply.

He may well be a starter for a few more years, and I can see him being productive, but not much beyond 800 yards and 6 TDs.

Blasphemy, eh? Don't take my word for it; look at every single player on this list in the top 20 (ages are listed next to each season), then tell me Harrison will be different from every other great WR the game has ever known.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead..._yds_career.htm

You honestly believe he will defy what has happened to every other great wide receier in the last 40 years? Why?

Jerry Rice was still a beast at 34 and 36. Tim Brown went for 91-1165-9 at age 35. Cris Carter caught 90+ balls, for 1200+ yards, with 13 and 9 TDs at ages 34 and 35.Marvin is as good of a route runner as there ever has been in the league. If there is anyone on that list who I think could catch 90 balls at age 35, it's Marvin Harrison in an offense he has mastered, with Peyton Manning throwing to him.

 

[Rovers]

Of the top 20 all-time leaders in receiving yards, you won't find anyone who maintained their production beyond the wall of age 34/35. If they suffered an injury in their early 30s, this is especially true. Even a physical fitness freak with an uber regimine (Rice) fell off sharply.

He may well be a starter for a few more years, and I can see him being productive, but not much beyond 800 yards and 6 TDs.

Blasphemy, eh? Don't take my word for it; look at every single player on this list in the top 20 (ages are listed next to each season), then tell me Harrison will be different from every other great WR the game has ever known.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead..._yds_career.htm

You honestly believe he will defy what has happened to every other great wide receier in the last 40 years? Why?

If you want to lump Harrison into a pile of other old WR's, and rely on that info to support your opinion, you have every right to do so. I would not call it blasphemy... just a difference of opinion. I don't think anyone is saying he's a #1 WR.... the question is, is he a #3 FF wr? I'd bet the farm on it, barring another injury.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Of the top 20 all-time leaders in receiving yards, you won't find anyone who maintained their production beyond the wall of age 34/35. If they suffered an injury in their early 30s, this is especially true. Even a physical fitness freak with an uber regimine (Rice) fell off sharply.

He may well be a starter for a few more years, and I can see him being productive, but not much beyond 800 yards and 6 TDs.

Blasphemy, eh? Don't take my word for it; look at every single player on this list in the top 20 (ages are listed next to each season), then tell me Harrison will be different from every other great WR the game has ever known.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead..._yds_career.htm

You honestly believe he will defy what has happened to every other great wide receier in the last 40 years? Why?

Jerry Rice was still a beast at 34 and 36. Tim Brown went for 91-1165-9 at age 35. Cris Carter caught 90+ balls, for 1200+ yards, with 13 and 9 TDs at ages 34 and 35.Marvin is as good of a route runner as there ever has been in the league. If there is anyone on that list who I think could catch 90 balls at age 35, it's Marvin Harrison in an offense he has mastered, with Peyton Manning throwing to him.

The 34 and 36 year old beast version of Rice - that was, at best his 11th and 12th best seasons. 143 TDs by age 33, never hit double digits again.Brown never hit 1,000 again after the season you cite, and caught all of 3 TDs in his last 47 games (35 starts). Carter never hit a 1,000 again, falling off to 73-871-6 and 8-66-1 before retiring.

I believe I said he would still be a productive starter, 800 and 6 being my prediction.

No one has ever maintained their former ellite level beyond that mythical wall, espeically coming off an injury season.

If only you actually could get him at his projected ranking or ADP, then he would be worth the risk. But he is the consensus sleeper in every league I have observed, always being drafted well in advance of where he should go given the baggage he carries into this season.

I'll go with the odds and pass.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Of the top 20 all-time leaders in receiving yards, you won't find anyone who maintained their production beyond the wall of age 34/35. If they suffered an injury in their early 30s, this is especially true. Even a physical fitness freak with an uber regimine (Rice) fell off sharply.

He may well be a starter for a few more years, and I can see him being productive, but not much beyond 800 yards and 6 TDs.

Blasphemy, eh? Don't take my word for it; look at every single player on this list in the top 20 (ages are listed next to each season), then tell me Harrison will be different from every other great WR the game has ever known.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/lead..._yds_career.htm

You honestly believe he will defy what has happened to every other great wide receier in the last 40 years? Why?

Jerry Rice was still a beast at 34 and 36. Tim Brown went for 91-1165-9 at age 35. Cris Carter caught 90+ balls, for 1200+ yards, with 13 and 9 TDs at ages 34 and 35.Marvin is as good of a route runner as there ever has been in the league. If there is anyone on that list who I think could catch 90 balls at age 35, it's Marvin Harrison in an offense he has mastered, with Peyton Manning throwing to him.

The 34 and 36 year old beast version of Rice - that was, at best his 11th and 12th best seasons. 143 TDs by age 33, never hit double digits again.Brown never hit 1,000 again after the season you cite, and caught all of 3 TDs in his last 47 games (35 starts). Carter never hit a 1,000 again, falling off to 73-871-6 and 8-66-1 before retiring.

I believe I said he would still be a productive starter, 800 and 6 being my prediction.

No one has ever maintained their former ellite level beyond that mythical wall, espeically coming off an injury season.

If only you actually could get him at his projected ranking or ADP, then he would be worth the risk. But he is the consensus sleeper in every league I have observed, always being drafted well in advance of where he should go given the baggage he carries into this season.

I'll go with the odds and pass.

Every athlete falls off at some point - that's not in dispute. I thought your position was that top 20 all time WRs were very unlikely to have big years after age 34. I pointed out several examples that contradict that line of thinking.Harrison went 6.06 in my draft today.