Mocking - Chargers/Jets Trade make sense? (1 Viewer)

[The Duff Man]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

 

[diesel7982]

Chargers are giving up WAY too much in that trade.

 

[The Duff Man]

Chargers are giving up WAY too much in that trade.

This is my first year following the draft so I don't dispute your statement, just wondering why you think so since the trade value is almost even. Are those charts not indicative of real value?

 

[jetsman]

no good. that early 2nd allows us to get a first round talent that slips. its not worth the move up for ten spots.......I wouldnt even do it without the 3rd rounders involved because the top 40 are 1st round talents on my board...19 and 29 dont grade out that different since that next pick gives us more value than 50 will. we have too many holes to fill to waste a pick to slide up. jets give up too much based on their multiple needs and it helps the chargers more since they have fewer holes.

 

[Bri]

It's as good an idea as anyone else's duffman

I think both teams are in OK spots. Chargers can get a LBer if Edwards walks or a WR(reche in NE). Jets can get D'Brick. Only way I see the Jets trading is for Bush.

To each his own though

 

[Riffraff]

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams.

NY can get Martin's successor at 1.29 since either Maroney or White (doubtful) may last that long. No need to trade up for a position that most consider to be fairly deep in first round grades.

 

[cstu]

I hope the Chargers can trade down like this. For their needs, the #19 is a waste and they could do just as well with picks in the late 1st/early 2nd.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Chargers are giving up WAY too much in that trade.

no good. that early 2nd allows us to get a first round talent that slips. its not worth the move up for ten spots.......I wouldnt even do it without the 3rd rounders involved because the top 40 are 1st round talents on my board...19 and 29 dont grade out that different since that next pick gives us more value than 50 will. we have too many holes to fill to waste a pick to slide up. jets give up too much based on their multiple needs and it helps the chargers more since they have fewer holes.

I'd split the middle here.In a vacuum, the Jets are coming out ahead -- although I don't think it's nearly as bad as diesel makes it sound. As for the particular needs of each team, that's a tougher issue. I'll let the guys more up on the draft figure this one out (I don't really know when the supposed cutoffs are, although those generally are more mythical than real). But moving up from 29 to 19 would usually require a bit more than the 50 to 35 and the 81 to 71 swap. Something like a third or fourth rounder next year I'd guess.

 

[jetsman]

value wise youre right chase, but in the Jets situation who s available at 19 that is not going to be there at 29 that is worth losing the 1st round talent that Slips Like Winston or McNeill or a White? its not worth the risk

 

[tommyGunZ]

Assuming Justice is off the board, if there's also a run on CBs and Cromartie, Joseph, Williams, and Hill go before 19 (not likely, I know) the Bolts may be willing to move down. I think the Bolts are scared of Allen, but would take Cromartie despite the risks. They also probably couldn't pass on Williams, Hill, or Joseph to trade down.

If you polled Charger Nation, my guess is that you'd probably get 70% of the crowd to say they think the Bolts go defensive back early and hope a name OL falls to them at 50.

I also saw a mock that had Moss falling to San Diego at 50. If Moss is there, it will be a tough decision for AJ; he wants to add a dynamic playmaker to stretch the field but knows that Rivers needs some help up front. Oben swears he'll be ready by the end of the summer, but he's still wearing a boot, last I heard.

 

[tommyGunZ]

value wise youre right chase, but in the Jets situation who s available at 19 that is not going to be there at 29 that is worth losing the 1st round talent that Slips Like Winston or McNeill or a White? its not worth the risk

It really boils down to the Jets falling in love with someone who will be available at 19 but will be gone by 29. Teams do crazy things when they fall in love.

 

[cstu]

value wise youre right chase, but in the Jets situation who s available at 19 that is not going to be there at 29 that is worth losing the 1st round talent that Slips Like Winston or McNeill or a White? its not worth the risk

It really boils down to the Jets falling in love with someone who will be available at 19 but will be gone by 29. Teams do crazy things when they fall in love.

Obviously if the Jets are looking for the same positions as the Chargers, like OL, then they wouldn't want to make the trade. However, if they wanted a RB then the trade would be worth it to get who they want.

 

[Dolfan]

I'm not sure if we'd be getting screwed value-wise, but I'd be happy if the Dolphins traded #16 and #82 (1st and 3rd) for the Jets #29 and #35.

I think we must be in a similar position to the Chargers in that all of the positions we need present really good value in the late 1st/early 2nd area --- Kiwanuka is a perfect OLB for the 3-4 that Saban wants to install; McNeil, Gilles, and Mangold on the OL; and a plethora of solid DBs (Youboty and Jennings just to pick 2 off the top of my head) should be there late 1st/early 2nd.

I think that, unless somebody slips, we will be reaching a bit for anybody at 16.

I almost think it would be better to take BPA at a non-need position at 16 if we can't trade down -- take a DeAngelo Williams, Laurence Marooney, Vince Young, Chad Jackson...

 

[BoltzNBrew]

Chargers 19, 50, 81=1460

NYJ 29, 35, 71=1425

Chargers should ask for the NYJ 5th rounder (138 overall worth 37) to balance out the value.

On the other hand I'd almost rather the Chargers stand pat and take the BPA at #19. Someone is bound to fall into their lap.

 

[msommer]

Another possibility would be SF #6+#22 to Titans for #3 and a lower pick - if NO does not pick Brick

 

[BoltBacker]

Chargers 19, 50, 81=1460

NYJ 29, 35, 71=1425

Chargers should ask for the NYJ 5th rounder (138 overall worth 37) to balance out the value.

On the other hand I'd almost rather the Chargers stand pat and take the BPA at #19. Someone is bound to fall into their lap.

If SD did make a trade I'd hope they'd make it when their pick came up and after Jimmy Williams, Tye Hill and Winston Justice were all off the board. If one of those players were available I think they'd be best off just taking one of them.If those three were gone then the trade to NY makes sense in that Marcus McNeil, Eric Winston, John Joseph, Ashton Yabouty, Kelly Jennings, Antonio Cromartie and/or Richard Marshall should still be available. Really, with picks 29 and 35 I'd be pleased with any two of those players though I'd prefer one OT and one CB from the group. There's a pretty big drop off at CB/OT after those players at least based on what I've read.

 

[jetsman]

and like I said this is all a wet dream for charger fans because the jets have absolutely no interest in moving 29 and 35 to get 16, as I said previously with 40 prospects projecting to have first round grades, and all their holes in their roster, the J-E-T-S HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS KIND OF DEAL. The Chargers would need to seriously overpay. as the Dolphin fan pointed out 15 through 23 or so is full of interchangeable players, so why do the J-E-T-S do this ? is getting a Lendale White that much better than a Maroney, for example to give up getting an Eric Winston at 35 as well as Maroney...?

In the jets situation no way

 

[BoltzNBrew]

and like I said this is all a wet dream for charger fans because the jets have absolutely no interest in moving 29 and 35 to get 16, as I said previously with 40 prospects projecting to have first round grades, and all their holes in their roster, the J-E-T-S HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS KIND OF DEAL. The Chargers would need to seriously overpay. as the Dolphin fan pointed out 15 through 23 or so is full of interchangeable players, so why do the J-E-T-S do this ? is getting a Lendale White that much better than a Maroney, for example to give up getting an Eric Winston at 35 as well as Maroney...?

In the jets situation no way

Over pay to move down?

 

[-OZ-]

Another possibility would be SF #6+#22 to Titans for #3 and a lower pick - if NO does not pick Brick

I like that move a lot if NO takes Leinart.

 

[jetsman]

and like I said this is all a wet dream for charger fans because the jets have absolutely no interest in moving 29 and 35 to get 16, as I said previously with 40 prospects projecting to have first round grades, and all their holes in their roster, the J-E-T-S HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS KIND OF DEAL. The Chargers would need to seriously overpay. as the Dolphin fan pointed out 15 through 23 or so is full of interchangeable players, so why do the J-E-T-S do this ? is getting a Lendale White that much better than a Maroney, for example to give up getting an Eric Winston at 35 as well as Maroney...?

In the jets situation no way

Over pay to move down?

yes because youre initiating the trade, the J-E-T-S are happy to get 3 Potential first round talents with their first 3 picks ..... The Upgrade to 16 isnt worth the dwngrade to 50 with all their needs. for a tem with fewer needs Like the Chargers it might make sense but youre moving away from 16 for a reason, namely that the talent at 16 isnt that much better than 23 according to most experts... you figure to get 2 players at 29 qnd 36 that together are better than one alone at 16..... and the J-E-T-S have no incentive to help you do that without an overpay. As Boltbacker Said:There's a pretty big drop off at CB/OT after those players at least based on what I've read.

and the J-E-T-S want to get their two before the dropoff begins

its simple really

 

[Monarch]

Williams won't be there

 

[tommyGunZ]

and like I said this is all a wet dream for charger fans because the jets have absolutely no interest in moving 29 and 35 to get 16, as I said previously with 40 prospects projecting to have first round grades, and all their holes in their roster, the J-E-T-S HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS KIND OF DEAL. The Chargers would need to seriously overpay. as the Dolphin fan pointed out 15 through 23 or so is full of interchangeable players, so why do the J-E-T-S do this ? is getting a Lendale White that much better than a Maroney, for example to give up getting an Eric Winston at 35 as well as Maroney...?

In the jets situation no way

Over pay to move down?

yes because youre initiating the trade, the J-E-T-S are happy to get 3 Potential first round talents with their first 3 picks ..... The Upgrade to 16 isnt worth the dwngrade to 50 with all their needs. for a tem with fewer needs Like the Chargers it might make sense but youre moving away from 16 for a reason, namely that the talent at 16 isnt that much better than 23 according to most experts... you figure to get 2 players at 29 qnd 36 that together are better than one alone at 16..... and the J-E-T-S have no incentive to help you do that without an overpay. As Boltbacker Said:There's a pretty big drop off at CB/OT after those players at least based on what I've read.

and the J-E-T-S want to get their two before the dropoff begins

its simple really

dude, you're delusional. their are 31 first round picks. some internet "grade" doesn't mean the Jets are getting 3 first rounders.Chargers would NEVER agree to the swap proposed.

 

[The Duff Man]

Looks like the fans of both teams say no deal...good discussion though.

I still think the Bolts are best off taking OT in Rd 1, Winston will be long gone so they should try to trade down with somebody otherwise they'll be reaching.

Protecting the franchise QB has to be priority #1....ask David Carr...

 

[jetsman]

Dude youre delusional there are 32 first round picks not 31 as you state. I said there are roughly 40 players who grade out as first rounders, since not all 32 teams have the same draft rankings... can you not get that. Put it this way Tommy... if you took every teams first round list and put the players names in a hat, Im saying there would end up being about 40 diferent players that some NFL team had listed as a first rounder in that hat not counting duplications of course. get it now ? Duff was trying to get two for 1..... a very shrewd move

I already said the jets want no part of this as proposed. dont blame me if you cant understand why its a bad trade from a J-E-T-S perspective. personally from a Charger POV i think its a great move.

Duff. I got your point and I agreed, too bad some people werent sharp enough to get it... I just Felt the J-E-T-S are better off staying put for the same reasons

 

[BoltBacker]

I still think the Bolts are best off taking OT in Rd 1, Winston will be long gone so they should try to trade down with somebody otherwise they'll be reaching.

I agree Winston will be gone by #19 but he's the only OT I'd take that high(obviously Ferguson gone at that point as well).If I had to guess I'd say;

CB @#19(Wiliams/Hill/Joseph) I'm not sure if they think they can cover WR's but I don't.

ILB @#50(Hodge/Jackson/Wilkinson) Godfrey and Edwards only have one good year left on the team. Some think Cooper/Wilhelm are ready to step in but I'm not so sure.

OT @#81(Trueblood/Morris/Scott) Always need OT, never address the need early. AJ did a great job getting Olivea late though.

If Huff/Allen slid down to pick #19 I'd think they might show some interest there too but I doubt either will. They signed McCree, but he was pretty cheap and he isn't all that young either.

It certainly would have been nice if AJ would have used some of that cap space to address some of the holes on the team so SD could have just drafted best player available.

 

[jetsman]

what youve demonstrated rather well I think is that that first pick is kind of in a No Mans Land. wouldnt a trade up using both picks serve the chargers better? Like 19 and 50 for 14 or 13 possibly, in other words fill one position with someone you rate highly rather than reach at both?

 

[BoltBacker]

No.

They have a need at CB and there are enough CB's with first round talent to ensure one of them will be available.

If Hill/Williams/Winston were available at the pick great, but I don't think any of them are worth trading up for. The only player worth trading up for is Furgeson imo and even then only if he slid past #4 which is unlikely.

 

[ILoveMyLions]

Sorry to hijack the thread here, but do you think the Jets move up at all? What if they moved up to get Cutler in the top 10 ro 15? If they add M. Williams or D. Ferguson with their #4 overall, they could still get Cutler whom I heard they covet as well by trading up. Any thoughts on that?

 

[T Man]

I realize that their has been a lot of talk about the #1 overall, but IMHO the following makes more sense then the Texans drafting Bush #1:

Texans trade 1.01 to NYJ for picks 4 and 35 OR

Texans trade 1.01 to Tenn. for picks 3 and 39.

Yes, I know, using the trade chart, the Texans get hosed. The #1 is supposedly worth 3000 and the value they get back from the Jets would be 2560 and 2720 from Tenn. But who cares. Too many GMs feel that they have to get "equal value" in draft pick trades using the chart; but in reality if you get the guy you want and need, pay less and pick up a pick in the process you have done extremely well. NYJ gets Bush, a marquee player they can sell to the fans. And it gives Ramsey a year to show what he can do or for Pennington to come back.

The Texans could then pick Mario and someone like Marcus McNeil or Mangold with the added 2nd and they would still have their other 2nd to draft LB or DB. If Williams were gone they could pick up Ferguson and get DL, LB or DB with their 2 high 2nd rounders.

The same holds true for NO. Trade down a few spots. (again with NYJ)

NO trades 1.02 to NYJ for #71 (3rd round) and #103 (4th round)

NO's pick is worth 2600. NY's #4 is 2000 plus 240 (#71) and 90 (#103). So NO would get the short side of the trade. But even if they only pick up a 3rd third and fourth, they can still get Hawk. (I think they have Williams, Bush and Hawk as 1-2-3 on their board, and Hawk is a NEED) And they can recoup the 3rd round pick they gave up to move up and get Jamal Brown last year. It would be worth it to NO even without the 4th rounder (or for NYJs later 3rd - #97 - and the 4th).

Probably won't happen because the GMs are so afraid of people saying that they got taken and didn't get equal value. But I think teams like NYJ and Tenn. would trade up if they were on the high side of the trade.

 

[The Duff Man]

I realize that their has been a lot of talk about the #1 overall, but IMHO the  following makes more sense then the Texans drafting Bush #1:

Texans trade 1.01 to NYJ for picks 4 and 35  OR

Texans trade 1.01 to Tenn. for picks 3 and 39.

Yes, I know, using the trade chart, the Texans get hosed.  The #1 is supposedly worth 3000 and the value they get back from the Jets would be 2560 and 2720 from  Tenn.  But who cares. Too many GMs feel that they have to get "equal value" in draft pick trades using the chart; but in reality if you get the guy you want and need, pay less and pick up a pick in the process you have done extremely well.  NYJ gets Bush, a marquee player they can sell to the fans.  And it gives Ramsey a year to show what he can do or for Pennington to come back.

The Texans could then pick Mario and someone like Marcus McNeil or Mangold with the added 2nd and they would still have their other 2nd to draft LB or DB.  If Williams were gone they could pick up Ferguson and get DL, LB or DB with their 2 high 2nd rounders.

The same holds true for NO.  Trade down a few spots. (again with NYJ)

NO trades 1.02 to NYJ for #71 (3rd round) and #103 (4th round)

NO's pick is worth 2600.  NY's #4 is 2000 plus 240 (#71) and 90 (#103).  So NO would get the short side of the trade.  But even if they only pick up a 3rd third and fourth, they can still get Hawk. (I think they have Williams, Bush and Hawk as 1-2-3 on their board, and Hawk is a NEED)  And they can recoup the 3rd round pick they gave up to move up and get Jamal Brown last year.  It would be worth it to NO even without the 4th rounder (or for NYJs later 3rd - #97 - and the 4th).

Probably won't happen because the GMs are so afraid of people saying that they got taken and didn't get equal value.  But I think teams like NYJ and Tenn. would trade up if they were on the high side of the trade.

This is an outstanding point. Look at your options if you are the Texans:1. Stay put and take Bush - who is not an area of need for your team.

2. Move down - get the guy who will help you more and get more picks. You aren't getting "value" for #1 but I fail to see how this is getting hosed as long as you use those picks wisely.

Edit: Bush is special....nevermind

 

[tommyGunZ]

personally from a Charger POV i think its a great move.

It all depends on who's still there at 19. If Justice goes top 10 and there is a CB run in the teens before the Bolts pick, then a trade down could be the best possible move for the Chargers.I just don't buy the "talent drop off" after 40 picks line. That reeks of internet hype/propaganda - I doubt very seriously any pro personnel folks believe that there are 40 prospects worth 1st round grades and then there is a "significant" drop off.

I think we go too far with the labels and "first round grades". Those labels and grades don't mean #### the Monday after the draft. I've watched the Bolts 2004 7th rounder (Shane Olivea) outplay the #2 pick in the entire 2004 draft (Robert Gallery) for 2 years now.

Love the draft, but it's a glorified crapshoot.

 

[BoltBacker]

I just don't buy the "talent drop off" after 40 picks line. That reeks of internet hype/propaganda - I doubt very seriously any pro personnel folks believe that there are 40 prospects worth 1st round grades and then there is a "significant" drop off.

At least when I say there's supposed to be a talent drop off I'm talking about specific positions, not the draft class as a whole.For instance at CB there are about 7 CB's ranked with mid/late 1st round talent. I don't think any of them are going to last to pick #50. After those first seven the talent pool at CB thins quickly so you could gamble and risk missing out on that top tier of players buy why bother if there isn't a better OT prospect(assuming Winston Justice doesn't last 'til pick #19)?

There very well may be some great talent at pick #50, but if they happen to be RB/TE/OLB what good does that do SD?

 

[jetsman]

I really dont see the J-E-T-S trading up because they need so much to reshape the roster, trading down to get more picks seems to be Mangini's style, from what I hear here at Hofstra. It could all be smoke and mirrors I grant you but Bellichik is that way and Mangini is a disciple of that school of thought. Around here its obvious who they want at four but if they dont get him I can see them trading down once or twice. they have enough needs that they dont want to cost themselves another player or two by wasting picks in trading up.

 

[cstu]

and like I said this is all a wet dream for charger fans because the jets have absolutely no interest in moving 29 and 35 to get 16, as I said previously with 40 prospects projecting to have first round grades, and all their holes in their roster, the J-E-T-S HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS KIND OF DEAL. The Chargers would need to seriously overpay. as the Dolphin fan pointed out 15 through 23 or so is full of interchangeable players, so why do the J-E-T-S do this ? is getting a Lendale White that much better than a Maroney, for example to give up getting an Eric Winston at 35 as well as Maroney...?

In the jets situation no way

Over pay to move down?

Why not? The #19 isn't that useful and the Chargers are more likely to get the guys they want at #29 and #35 than they are at #19 and #50. I would swap 1sts and 2nds picks even up with the Jets even though they would get better "chart value". In real life terms it's better for the Chargers.

 

[cstu]

I really dont see the J-E-T-S trading up because they need so much to reshape the roster, trading down to get more picks seems to be Mangini's style, from what I hear here at Hofstra. It could all be smoke and mirrors I grant you but Bellichik is that way and Mangini is a disciple of that school of thought. Around here its obvious who they want at four but if they dont get him I can see them trading down once or twice. they have enough needs that they dont want to cost themselves another player or two by wasting picks in trading up.

How about getting DeAngelo and keeping him out of the Patriots' hands?

 

[cstu]

I just don't buy the "talent drop off" after 40 picks line. That reeks of internet hype/propaganda - I doubt very seriously any pro personnel folks believe that there are 40 prospects worth 1st round grades and then there is a "significant" drop off.

At least when I say there's supposed to be a talent drop off I'm talking about specific positions, not the draft class as a whole.For instance at CB there are about 7 CB's ranked with mid/late 1st round talent. I don't think any of them are going to last to pick #50. After those first seven the talent pool at CB thins quickly so you could gamble and risk missing out on that top tier of players buy why bother if there isn't a better OT prospect(assuming Winston Justice doesn't last 'til pick #19)?

There very well may be some great talent at pick #50, but if they happen to be RB/TE/OLB what good does that do SD?

Exactly. The Chargers need secondary and OL help and one of those will be lacking at #50. The Jets have more needs and can get a player they need at #50.

 

[cstu]

I still think the Bolts are best off taking OT in Rd 1, Winston will be long gone so they should try to trade down with somebody otherwise they'll be reaching.

I agree Winston will be gone by #19 but he's the only OT I'd take that high(obviously Ferguson gone at that point as well).If I had to guess I'd say;

CB @#19(Wiliams/Hill/Joseph) I'm not sure if they think they can cover WR's but I don't.

ILB @#50(Hodge/Jackson/Wilkinson) Godfrey and Edwards only have one good year left on the team. Some think Cooper/Wilhelm are ready to step in but I'm not so sure.

OT @#81(Trueblood/Morris/Scott) Always need OT, never address the need early. AJ did a great job getting Olivea late though.

If Huff/Allen slid down to pick #19 I'd think they might show some interest there too but I doubt either will. They signed McCree, but he was pretty cheap and he isn't all that young either.

It certainly would have been nice if AJ would have used some of that cap space to address some of the holes on the team so SD could have just drafted best player available.

Daryn Colledge is the best "value" LT available and I'd love the Chargers to take him at #29 and use the #35 on the best available ILB or CB.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I disagree with all of the trade down talk. I want Justice if he somehow falls (5% chance), but most likely I want Cromartie or Hill, whichever is available. OL value can be found later.

 

[cstu]

I disagree with all of the trade down talk. I want Justice if he somehow falls (5% chance), but most likely I want Cromartie or Hill, whichever is available. OL value can be found later.

Cromartie or Hill will likely be there at #29. At worst they would still get one of the top CB's and like you said it's a crapshoot.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I disagree with all of the trade down talk. I want Justice if he somehow falls (5% chance), but most likely I want Cromartie or Hill, whichever is available. OL value can be found later.

Cromartie or Hill will likely be there at #29. At worst they would still get one of the top CB's and like you said it's a crapshoot.

I'm not seeing any mocks were Cromartie or Hill are available at 29. I'm worried that they'll both be gone before 19.

 

[Z-Dog]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

 

[cstu]

I disagree with all of the trade down talk. I want Justice if he somehow falls (5% chance), but most likely I want Cromartie or Hill, whichever is available. OL value can be found later.

Cromartie or Hill will likely be there at #29. At worst they would still get one of the top CB's and like you said it's a crapshoot.

I'm not seeing any mocks were Cromartie or Hill are available at 29. I'm worried that they'll both be gone before 19.

Do you like them that much? I have major concerns with Cromartie, although I like his talent, and Hill seems to be ranked high because of his speed. I'd be just as happy with Joseph, Marshall or Youboty.

 

[poet58]

see thats the point, a trade like this makes great sense for the chargers, but none for the jets, absolutely none, the tiers in this draft, talentwise, makes 29 and 35 worth more than 19 and 50, thats why I said that the chargers needed to over pay. with the depth in this draft theres a drop off around 40. Look at Denvers trade with the 49ers. the saw that 37 was not much different than 22. Charger fans can argue all they like but the Jets lose big time here. the difference from 35 to 50 in quality is much bigger than 19 to 29. the 29 pick could be just as good as 19 in this draft, but the 50 will not be as good as 35...... so I'd never do it this year. a shallower draft yes but not this yearnow 19 and 50 and a 2nd next year for 29 35 and 103 id do as the Jets.

 

[cstu]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

They would be getting two major needs on both sides of the ball in the first round - DE and RB. Maybe I'm misses something, but I don't see the Jets that far away if they can add talent like that in the 1st. This is a team two years removed from the playoffs and still has a lot of talent.

 

[poet58]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

They would be getting two major needs on both sides of the ball in the first round - DE and RB. Maybe I'm misses something, but I don't see the Jets that far away if they can add talent like that in the 1st. This is a team two years removed from the playoffs and still has a lot of talent.

they get Maroney or White staying at 29 if they choose to anyway, youre making my point for me.

 

[cstu]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

They would be getting two major needs on both sides of the ball in the first round - DE and RB. Maybe I'm misses something, but I don't see the Jets that far away if they can add talent like that in the 1st. This is a team two years removed from the playoffs and still has a lot of talent.

they get Maroney or White staying at 29 if they choose to anyway, youre making my point for me.

Neither Maroney or White are in DeAngelo's class. That's a matter of opinion right now but I believe it will be proven in the long-run.

 

[Gold Plated Nails]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams.  These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB.  Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds.  They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first.  They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round.  Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

They would be getting two major needs on both sides of the ball in the first round - DE and RB. Maybe I'm misses something, but I don't see the Jets that far away if they can add talent like that in the 1st. This is a team two years removed from the playoffs and still has a lot of talent.

they get Maroney or White staying at 29 if they choose to anyway, youre making my point for me.

Neither Maroney or White are in DeAngelo's class. That's a matter of opinion right now but I believe it will be proven in the long-run.

I agree with that statement

 

[jetsman]

Mocking the Chargers I see a potentially balanced trade between them and NYJ, wondering what people think of this scenario:

Chargers give 19, 50, 81

NYJ give 29, 35, 71

NYJ - Assuming they get Ferguson they move up to get Martin's replacement Williams. These two would form an amazing foundation for their offense...once they figure out what to do at QB. Alternatively there are many CB prospects available here that won't last to 29.

SD - They need to get a CB and OT in the first two rounds. They aren't getting Justice, so McNeil or Winston look likely and can be had later in the first. They move up in the 2nd to get a better CB then probably go back to the OL in the 3rd round. Protecting Rivers has to be priority #1 for them.

Regardless of the pick values, there is not much logic to this. Who exactly are the Jets targeting at #19? DeAngelo Williams? Not for a team with so many needs. They will trade up for a QB, or for Bush, and that's it. If Cutler slips past the Vikings, maybe...

They would be getting two major needs on both sides of the ball in the first round - DE and RB. Maybe I'm misses something, but I don't see the Jets that far away if they can add talent like that in the 1st. This is a team two years removed from the playoffs and still has a lot of talent.

they get Maroney or White staying at 29 if they choose to anyway, youre making my point for me.

Neither Maroney or White are in DeAngelo's class. That's a matter of opinion right now but I believe it will be proven in the long-run.

I agree with that statement

of course you would your charger fansif its such a good deal why not offer it to another team or is it because nobody else would want to move down to 50 either. the simple fact is the combination of maroney Or White and #35 is better than D. Williams and #50. to me its that simple as Jets fans have said throughout this post and a few charger fans as well. the Draft pick chart cannot take into account a deep draft

there are tiers in this draft. 1-9 are considered one tier 10 to 17 is a 2nd. 18 to 40 is considered a 3rd tier,, thats what mel Kiper was sayingearlier this year and it seems to hold water as to how trades have gone

the trade really doesnt help the jets any

 

[BoltBacker]

I disagree with all of the trade down talk. I want Justice if he somehow falls (5% chance), but most likely I want Cromartie or Hill, whichever is available. OL value can be found later.

Cromartie or Hill will likely be there at #29. At worst they would still get one of the top CB's and like you said it's a crapshoot.

I'm not seeing any mocks were Cromartie or Hill are available at 29. I'm worried that they'll both be gone before 19.

Do you like them that much? I have major concerns with Cromartie, although I like his talent, and Hill seems to be ranked high because of his speed. I'd be just as happy with Joseph, Marshall or Youboty.

Gunz seems a little over-enthusiastic in regard to Cromartie but I agree that he'll be gone by #29. From everything I read he has all the markings of a boom-or-bust type player while Williams/Hill/Joseph are more sure things. SD needs their guy to come right in and start so I'd rather have Williams/Hill/Joseph then Cromartie despite the fact I'd concede Cromartie could end up being the best CB of the bunch. From all the sources I've looked at it seems like all four of those guys would be gone by pick #29.I think all four of those are better prospects than the next group of Marshall/Youbouty/Jennings, one of which should be available at #29 but I think the prospect of any of those players starting week #1 is much less likely than that first group. Keep in mind just about every team between pick #19 and #29 may take a CB.

Why do so many people say they aren't sold on Tye Hill? Everything I read heaps praises on the guy and he seems to be a perfect compliment to the big hitting physical Jammer.

 

[BoltBacker]

Daryn Colledge is the best "value" LT available and I'd love the Chargers to take him at #29 and use the #35 on the best available ILB or CB.

Disagree. Those who know more than myself on the subject say he's falling in the draft but even if he wasn't he's a sub-300# T from a smaller school. I'm not even sure he'll play T in the NFL, plenty of people are projecting him as a gaurd. I'd rather come out of the first round with a quality starting CB than G.