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MVP (1 Viewer)

Zigg

Footballguy
It's a travesty that these clowns think Adrian is the "hands down" first half MVP. Obviously it means nothing as much can change in the 2nd half, but either change the name to Most Outstanding Player or Most Great Player With Lots Of Good Teammates. Bautista is "hands down" the best hitter in baseball, but will lose the award because Gonzalez signed with a better team. No doubt that Gonzalez is a great player, but right now, Bautista is better.

.468/.702/.1170

.414/.591/.1006

 
Depends on the second half, but if Adrian drops off and Verlander keeps pitching like he is, he has to be considered.

 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last

 
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It's a travesty that these clowns think Adrian is the "hands down" first half MVP. Obviously it means nothing as much can change in the 2nd half, but either change the name to Most Outstanding Player or Most Great Player With Lots Of Good Teammates. Bautista is "hands down" the best hitter in baseball, but will lose the award because Gonzalez signed with a better team. No doubt that Gonzalez is a great player, but right now, Bautista is better..468/.702/.1170.414/.591/.1006
Travesty is the earthquake in Japan. The best player on the best team in the AL winning the MVP over a guy with some better stats isn't.
 
Depends on the second half, but if Adrian drops off and Verlander keeps pitching like he is, he has to be considered.
Verlander might not even win Cy Young. Last time I checked Cy Young predictor it was 1. Weaver 2. Verlander.
 
It's ironic that you can't win MVP unless you have a great supporting cast. If Bau is on Boston and Gonzalez is on Toronto and they are posting the same numbers they are now, Bau would be MVP in a landslide.

 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers. There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I see this argument a lot in every sport and I still don't understand it. You mention Arod with the Rangers. Is this saying that he is somehow less valuable because the Rangers were in last place? Did his value increase when he went to the Yankees? The players he played with became better. A player's value is the same no matter what team he plays for. For any of these awards to make any sense, there does need to be two, or the term MVP needs to be changed. The most valuable player in any league is the best player in the league no matter what the record of his team is.
 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I see this argument a lot in every sport and I still don't understand it. You mention Arod with the Rangers. Is this saying that he is somehow less valuable because the Rangers were in last place? Did his value increase when he went to the Yankees? The players he played with became better. A player's value is the same no matter what team he plays for. For any of these awards to make any sense, there does need to be two, or the term MVP needs to be changed. The most valuable player in any league is the best player in the league no matter what the record of his team is.
Yes, and the bolded is ridiculous.
 
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Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I see this argument a lot in every sport and I still don't understand it. You mention Arod with the Rangers. Is this saying that he is somehow less valuable because the Rangers were in last place? Did his value increase when he went to the Yankees? The players he played with became better. A player's value is the same no matter what team he plays for. For any of these awards to make any sense, there does need to be two, or the term MVP needs to be changed. The most valuable player in any league is the best player in the league no matter what the record of his team is.
Yes, and the bolded is ridiculous.
You are right, without Bautista they would be in last place (or closer to it) and not in next to last place.My point being that there is a difference between best player and most valuable. The most valuable player is not always the best player. Its two different things. Thats why you always hear about a team with two players having great years splitting the vote. Without Gonzalez would Boston be in 1st place? Forgetting for a moment that they probably would have bought someone else to play there of course. MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers). Take him off the team and the team takes a step backwards. If you are in last place, you would still be in last place without the best player. Cant be that valuable to the team can he?

We do agree there needs to be two awards. One for the best player of the year, and one for the MVP, the player who without, a team wouldnt be in contention.

 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I see this argument a lot in every sport and I still don't understand it. You mention Arod with the Rangers. Is this saying that he is somehow less valuable because the Rangers were in last place? Did his value increase when he went to the Yankees? The players he played with became better. A player's value is the same no matter what team he plays for. For any of these awards to make any sense, there does need to be two, or the term MVP needs to be changed. The most valuable player in any league is the best player in the league no matter what the record of his team is.
Yes, and the bolded is ridiculous.
You are right, without Bautista they would be in last place (or closer to it) and not in next to last place.My point being that there is a difference between best player and most valuable. The most valuable player is not always the best player. Its two different things. Thats why you always hear about a team with two players having great years splitting the vote. Without Gonzalez would Boston be in 1st place? Forgetting for a moment that they probably would have bought someone else to play there of course. MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers). Take him off the team and the team takes a step backwards. If you are in last place, you would still be in last place without the best player. Cant be that valuable to the team can he?

We do agree there needs to be two awards. One for the best player of the year, and one for the MVP, the player who without, a team wouldnt be in contention.
There's already the MVP award and the Hank Aaron Award for the best hitter. Now, if they thought the MVP was solely for the "best hitter" (even taking into account that the MVP could be a pitcher)....why did they create the Hank Aaron award?
 
MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers).
How exactly does Adrian Gonzalez make other players around him better?
By getting on base, driving in runs and fielding his position. Same as everybody else only better.
:confused: Him doing those things allows his teammates to have better counting numbers, but not sure it actually makes them better baseball players.I could see a slight argument that someone batting right before him might get better pitches to look at, but even that isn't really someone becoming a better ball player, just someone who is getting easier pitches to hit. I think the only position that would even have an argument about making teammates better would be a catcher who can call a good game or something.Too much of this MVP talk revolves around stupid "intangibles" or "making players around him better" when it should just be who is the most valuable to their team. And this MVP can be on a last place team, IMO. What player improves the team to the greatest degree. You replace Gonzalez with an average 1B, and you replace Bautista with an average OF and you try to determine how much worse off the team is. Certainly not an easy thing to do, obviously.
 
MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers).
How exactly does Adrian Gonzalez make other players around him better?
By getting on base, driving in runs and fielding his position. Same as everybody else only better.
:confused: Him doing those things allows his teammates to have better counting numbers, but not sure it actually makes them better baseball players.I could see a slight argument that someone batting right before him might get better pitches to look at, but even that isn't really someone becoming a better ball player, just someone who is getting easier pitches to hit. I think the only position that would even have an argument about making teammates better would be a catcher who can call a good game or something.Too much of this MVP talk revolves around stupid "intangibles" or "making players around him better" when it should just be who is the most valuable to their team. And this MVP can be on a last place team, IMO. What player improves the team to the greatest degree. You replace Gonzalez with an average 1B, and you replace Bautista with an average OF and you try to determine how much worse off the team is. Certainly not an easy thing to do, obviously.
Gonzo's D probably help his fielding teammates and his pitchers.
 
MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers).
How exactly does Adrian Gonzalez make other players around him better?
By getting on base, driving in runs and fielding his position. Same as everybody else only better.
:confused: Him doing those things allows his teammates to have better counting numbers, but not sure it actually makes them better baseball players.I could see a slight argument that someone batting right before him might get better pitches to look at, but even that isn't really someone becoming a better ball player, just someone who is getting easier pitches to hit. I think the only position that would even have an argument about making teammates better would be a catcher who can call a good game or something.Too much of this MVP talk revolves around stupid "intangibles" or "making players around him better" when it should just be who is the most valuable to their team. And this MVP can be on a last place team, IMO. What player improves the team to the greatest degree. You replace Gonzalez with an average 1B, and you replace Bautista with an average OF and you try to determine how much worse off the team is. Certainly not an easy thing to do, obviously.
Exactly. There is a complete abandonment of logic when people talk about MVP awards, especially in baseball. Fans, analysts, writers, everybody. A team's record should have nothing to do with who the most valuable player in baseball is. None. The amount of wins a player brings to the table from his contributions is more relevant, but hard to determine, and even that wouldn't be the end-all in determining value.
 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I see this argument a lot in every sport and I still don't understand it. You mention Arod with the Rangers. Is this saying that he is somehow less valuable because the Rangers were in last place? Did his value increase when he went to the Yankees? The players he played with became better. A player's value is the same no matter what team he plays for. For any of these awards to make any sense, there does need to be two, or the term MVP needs to be changed. The most valuable player in any league is the best player in the league no matter what the record of his team is.
Yes, and the bolded is ridiculous.
You are right, without Bautista they would be in last place (or closer to it) and not in next to last place.My point being that there is a difference between best player and most valuable. The most valuable player is not always the best player. Its two different things. Thats why you always hear about a team with two players having great years splitting the vote. Without Gonzalez would Boston be in 1st place? Forgetting for a moment that they probably would have bought someone else to play there of course. MVP makes the players around him better (Kirk Gibson on the '88 Dodgers). Take him off the team and the team takes a step backwards. If you are in last place, you would still be in last place without the best player. Cant be that valuable to the team can he?

We do agree there needs to be two awards. One for the best player of the year, and one for the MVP, the player who without, a team wouldnt be in contention.
Without Gonzalez, the Red Sox may drop from first to the WC, as they'd have Youk at 1st and Beltre at 3rd.You're not crediting the player bringing the most value to his team. You're crediting the player who's value in context of his team most impacts the playoff race. Which if that's really who you want to award, you need to wait until the playoff spots are determined and take the closest race for entry into the playoffs and determine what player was most critical to the team that won that race. Last year in the NL it would have been the NL west and probably Buster Posey or Aubrey Huff.

 
Which if that's really who you want to award, you need to wait until the playoff spots are determined and take the closest race for entry into the playoffs and determine what player was most critical to the team that won that race.
That's dumb.
I agree, but awarding it to the best player on the best team really isn't awarding most valuable within the context of the teams and division races. Afterall, its likely that the Red Sox make the playoffs with or without Adrian Gonzalez. Just like in any given year the Yankees likely make it with or without their best position player. Thats why the MVP should be awarded to the best player, and this year in the AL thats Bautista by a mile.
 
I really don't see anyone who is more Valuable than Verlander. He could end up leading the league in innings, wins, strikeouts, and possibly ERA. The Tigers are a sub .500 team without Verlander.

 
I really don't see anyone who is more Valuable than Verlander. He could end up leading the league in innings, wins, strikeouts, and possibly ERA.
If 1999 Pedro Martinez couldn't win MVP, with his 113 more strikeouts than the next guy, 5 more wins, an ERA 1.5 runs lower , a WHIP .3 better, blah blah blah...than Verlander has no shot.Especially considering this year there are at least 5 guys who are having better years than Pudge did in 1999.
 
I really don't see anyone who is more Valuable than Verlander. He could end up leading the league in innings, wins, strikeouts, and possibly ERA.
If 1999 Pedro Martinez couldn't win MVP, with his 113 more strikeouts than the next guy, 5 more wins, an ERA 1.5 runs lower , a WHIP .3 better, blah blah blah...than Verlander has no shot.Especially considering this year there are at least 5 guys who are having better years than Pudge did in 1999.
I'd would have voted for Pedro. In fact, Pedro did get more 1st place votes. It was a bias against pitchers which probably denied him the honor. Pudge did have though one of the greatest batting years by a catcher in history and a golden glove. But, IMO Pedro then and Justin now are the MVP, no matter the outcome of the vote.
 
It was a bias against pitchers which probably denied him the honor.
Oh I know. Two writers didn't include him on their ballot at all because they felt that pitchers are not worthy of MVP consideration.What made it worse is that ####### moron George King, who was one of these two idiots, voted for two pitchers the previous year. One of those pitchers was Rick Helling and his 4.41 ERA.
 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
If Verlander was offered straight up for him, how fast would they grab it?
Dont know. While payroll isn't an issue for the Sox, Pedroia is signed to a sweet, sweet deal from the Sox perspective. 8 mill in 2012, 10 mill in both 2013 and 2014, and a team option of 11 mill in 2015.Verlander is getting 20 million for the next 3 years.It's close, IMO. I would take Verlander, but not sure it is as one-sided as you seem to think.
 
'the moops said:
'shadyridr said:
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
 
Jon Heyman - SI

Blue Jays star Jose Bautista deserves strong consideration for the American League MVP award, and if someone thinks he's the MVP because he's been the best player in the league, that's understandable.

And if someone else thinks Tigers ace Justin Verlander is the AL MVP because they believe he's been the best and most important performer on a likely playoff team, that's reasonable, too.

But for now, I am going to go with the Yankees' home run and run-producing machine Curtis Granderson for MVP.

While I am not completely opposed to a pitcher winning the MVP award, a precedent is long established that the bar has to be very high for it to happen, which helps explain why no pitcher has done so since Dennis Eckersley in 1992. And I am not strictly opposed to a player on a non-contender winning the award, which has happened on occasion (think Alex Rodriguez of the last-place Rangers in 2003) although I admit that's a tougher one for me since the word valuable suggests that the players' achievements did not go for naught and actually helped a team play into October.

Although there is no rule saying pitchers should count any less in any MVP debate, history suggests that they generally have only captured the award either in years in which they put up alltime great numbers (and sometimes not even then; Ron Guidry was passed over in 1978 and Pedro Martinez in 1999, two decisions I disagree with). The last starting pitcher to win an MVP came a quarter century ago, when Roger Clemens won the AL award. That's 50 straight votes without a pitcher winning.

I do buy to some degree the argument against pitchers winning the MVP because pitchers have their own award, and past votes have reflected that others feel that way, too. But I am not willing to completely disregard pitchers, as a rare voter or two has done (Pedro was left of one ballot altogether in '99, helping Pudge Rodriguez win the award).

Players on playoff teams (or at least contenders) for MVP should be preferred. There is a decent amount of precedent for that, as well, though I feel even more strongly about it than most others. In addition to A-Rod, in 1987 the Cubs' Andre Dawson won the award after hitting 49 home runs (equaling the second-highest total in a quarter-century), a rare show of support for a player on an also-ran team, and that may happen when such a player laps the field statistically.

But since the award is for most valuable player, and not most outstanding, the effect a player had on the pennant race should be vital. If someone else wants to interpret most valuable as synonymous to best, they can. And if someone else wants to interpret it as being valuable to a particular team, they can, too. But there is plenty of precedent to suggest it means valuable in the league.

Of course, some will argue that precedent shouldn't count, and past mistakes should not be repeated. But I say the players understand going into a season that the criteria counted by most voters includes the team's standing to some degree. Players also know that winning is the goal. And I have yet to see a player on a non-contender publicly claim to be MVP.

Stats are most assuredly a major part of the equation. But they shouldn't be completely determinative. Otherwise, let's just run the numbers through a computer. And rename the award Most Outstanding player. Because there's no way to put a number on the value of leading a team into the postseason, which should be everyone's goal.

Like people, stats are imperfect. Even WAR, which I agree is a very useful stat, is imperfect because it depends on the value placed on other statistics by the person who devises the formula. The ultimate goal of any player is to win, so the value of the individual accomplishments that lead to a pennant should be viewed in that context.

So while Bautista has been the most outstanding player in the league whether you use WAR or OPS or or any other key stat, it's a tough case to make for him as MVP in a year when so many stars are ushering their team into the playoffs.

And while a case most certainly can be made that Verlander is the most valuable, and I certainly wouldn't trash those who think he is the MVP, pitchers with similarly excellent seasons to his generally have had to settle for the Cy Young award. His year has been superb (though a bit short of an alltime great pitching year like Guidry's in 1978, when he went 25-3 with a 1.74 ERA and 248 strikeouts). There are plenty of worthy everyday choices.

AL MVP

1. Curtis Granderson, Yankees CF. He has been a run-generating machine, whether he's batting second or third in the star-studded Yankees lineup. He leads the majors in runs by a wide margin (he has scored 26 more times than Jacoby Ellsbury, who's second), and also leads the majors in home runs and RBIs, and the speedster's slugging percentage is higher than anyone but Bautista. He also has turned himself into a major threat against lefthanders. Easily the best performer in arguably baseball's best lineup. Also, while he's not Austin Jackson as a defender, he's not as lost as a couple Detroit people thought he was when he played for the Tigers.

2. Adrian Gonzalez, Red Sox 1B. He came to Boston with great expectations and he didn't let it bother him a bit, fulfilling every crazy hope. The .345 batting average, the best in baseball, is a bonus, too. Gonzalez also leads the majors in hits and total bases and has driven in 103 runs for the first-place Red Sox.

3. Jacoby Ellsbury, Red Sox CF. He's made everyone forget his injury-plagued 2010 season and turned himself into a power threat and superstar, batting .312 with 23 home runs to go with 36 stolen bases.

4. Justin Verlander, Tigers SP. He's close to winning the pitching Triple Crown, leading the league in wins (20) and strikeouts (218) and ranking second in ERA (2.38). He is also the major league leader in WHIP, hits per nine, starts and innings pitched and is always a threat to throw a no-hitter, something he did back in May.

5. Jose Bautista, Blue Jays OF-INF. No question he's been the best player in the league. His 1.092 OPS is way ahead of the rest. Good at everything on a baseball field.

6. Dustin Pedroia, Red Sox 2B. As recently as a couple weeks ago, Boston people would have said he's their MVP. Embodies a pure ballplayer and is hitting .308 with 17 home runs and 24 steals.

7. Michael Young, Rangers 3B. Best trade that wasn't made was Texas backing away from a deal with the Rockies where they would have gotten Eric Young and one other for the Rangers' perennial leader. Michael Young is batting .336, second in the AL, and has 87 RBIs for the first-place Rangers.

8. Alex Avila, Tigers C. He's better defensively than Tigers teammate Victor Martinez and he has an OPS nearly 100 points higher.

9. Robinson Cano, Yankees 2B. The Home Run Derby winner is one of baseball's best all-around hitters, and while he hasn't been quite as consistent offensively or defensively as he was last year, he's still been darned good. He's batting .303 and has 23 home runs and 95 RBIs.

10. David Ortiz, Red Sox DH. His OPS is actually 18 points higher than Gonzalez's and his .311 average is his highest since 2007.

Others: Yankees SP CC Sabathia, Indians SS Asdrubal Cabrera, Yankees 1B Mark Teixeira, Tigers 1B Miguel Cabrera, Rays INF Ben Zobrist.

NL MVP

1. Ryan Braun, Brewers OF. Terrific all-around players gets slight nod over teammate Prince Fielder. His .999 OPS is tops in the NL.

2. Prince Fielder, Brewers 1B. If this is his going away party, it's been a special one for the free-agent-to-be. He has 29 home runs and 102 RBIs for the NL Central's first-place team and gets points for being a leader in the clubhouse, too.

3. Justin Upton, Diamondbacks OF. Another great trade not made, Upton, whose name was talked about last winter, is the clear star of the upstart D-backs. Upton leads first-place Arizona in batting average, home runs, RBIs, on-base percentage and slugging and is tied for the team-high in stolen bases.

4. Shane Victorino, Phillies OF. His superb all-around season has gone mostly under the radar until lately, but he is eighth in the league in OPS and second in triples.

5. Matt Kemp, Dodgers OF. Best position player in the league following his disappointing 2010 season. His .320 average is 71 points higher than a year ago and he leads the league with 31 home runs.

6. Brian McCann, Braves C. The game's best all-around catcher deserves more plaudits. His .877 OPS and 22 home runs for the NL wild-card-leading Braves should help.

7. Roy Halladay, Phillies SP. The leader of the best rotation going.

8. Craig Kimbrel, Braves RP. The Braves' rookie closer has not allowed a run since June and is one save away from setting a new rookie record of 41.

9. Lance Berkman, Cardinals OF. Superb comeback season surprised just about everyone but Cardinals decisionmakers who signed him in the offseason. Berkman has 30 home runs, his most since 2007, and 81 RBIs, his best total since '08.

10. Albert Pujols, Cardinals 1B. His most incredible feat this was returning after two weeks from broken wrist but his numbers are still impressive: 31 home runs, 78 RBIs and an .895 OPS.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...l#ixzz1WkU225CH

 
Not sure how two players on the same team can be 1 and 2 in MVP race...doesn't that kind of ruin the point of the M in MVP

 
Here is the issue IMO And you allude to it: there needs to be a separate award for beat player and MVP. How can you have an MVP on a last place team? The MVP belongs to the player who's team wouldn't be where they are without him. Boston wouldnt be in 1st w/o Adrian. Dodgers would be in last with or without kemp. Toronto would prob be right where they are without Bautista

And don't give me it's a team game. We are talking about an individual value award. Arod was the best player but not MVP for the last place rangers.

There needs to be two awards so we can eliminate this debate. It's called most valuable for a reason. Can't be that valuable on a last place team. Without you they are still in last
I still say Tejada got screwed that year.
 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
Not this again. Cano is below average defensively. In the last four years, he has been negative in UZR/150 every single year. Pedroia, on the other hand, has been pretty consistently awesome on defense.
 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
Cano displays GG defense?Is this on the Wii or Playstation?
 
Depends on the second half, but if Adrian drops off and Verlander keeps pitching like he is, he has to be considered.
Verlander might not even win Cy Young. Last time I checked Cy Young predictor it was 1. Weaver 2. Verlander.
Weaver is a leading MVP candidate if he can get Angels in the playoffs. Another great game by him tonight.
And Weaver is no longer in the talks
 
Grandy is hitting .275 and is an MVP frontrunner?

Shouldn't MVP players hit higher then Cuddyer and Kubel?

Won't he strike out about 175 times by end of the year?

Just asking...

Side note. Another 200K+ hitter(s) this year?

Drew Stubbs

Mark Reynolds

Adam Dunn - how is that signing looking CWS?

 
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A starting pitcher plays in less than 25% of his team's games. Not sure I can get behind him being the MVP.

Gonzalez has tailed off. I believe Ellsbury will take votes away here. Also, he and Granderson have the same OPS right now.

Granderson is only hitting .271, but BA only comes into play for the Saber-heads when a Yankee is involved. 124 runs scored to date is very impressive. If Granderson were having this season on the Tigers, this would not be a discussion.

Bautista is having the best year OPS-wise.

Pedroia is not even the best 2nd baseman in his division this year, and gets more protection in his lineup (Gonzalez, Ortiz) than Cano (Swisher). Plus, Pedroia is the 3rd best player on his team this year after Gonzalez and Ellsbury. You can use the joke that is UZR all you want. Cano is better.

Right now it's:

1. Bautista

2. Granderson

3. Gonzalez

4. Ellsbury

 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
Cano displays GG defense?Is this on the Wii or Playstation?
Get your minds out of the UZR crap guys and watch the games. Cano may not be the best fielding 2B and Pedroia may be better but Cano is a VERY good fielder and him having a negative UZR basically makes that system worthless in to rate defenses IMO.
 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
Not this again. Cano is below average defensively. In the last four years, he has been negative in UZR/150 every single year. Pedroia, on the other hand, has been pretty consistently awesome on defense.
UZR is the dumbest stat out there. Defensive metrics are completely unreliable. Plus UZR fluctuates from year to year. You cant tell me guys have great defensive years followed by bad defensive years off and on. Claiming Cano is below average defensively reeks of someone who has never watched the guy play and is insulting to baseball. Watch the games, hes clearly a plus defender. Whether hes a GGer or not Ill leave up to other people to debate. Does UZR take arm into account? No I dont think so. But then we'll hear how arm isnt important at 2B which is BS. Having a good arm helps on turning the DP. Also, Ive never seen any 2B go up the middle like him and flip the ball almost behind his back nonchalantly to 1B like he does. No other 2B can make that play
 
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http://baseballmusings.com/?p=64576

Another defensive metric puts Cano near the top and Pedroia middle of the pack defensively. In other words defensive metrics are really really dumb and shouldnt be taken as gospel. Watch the games. Realize that Cano is a plus defensive player just by seeing it. You'll also realize Brett Gardner is the best defensive OFer in baseball. You dont need defensive metrics to tell you that.

 
Robinson Cano turned in an August that was a near-match offensively for MVP candidate Curtis Granderson’s. But on the defensive side, Cano’s performance was unrivaled within the sport.

Yankee of the Month?

Cano vs Granderson

Cano Granderson

BA .345 .286

OPS 1.014 1.080

HR 7 10

RBI 29 29

GFP<< 23 4

>> GFP: Good Fielding Plays

It's easy to look at his .345 batting average and 29 RBI in 28 games and say Cano had a good month, one that may even put him on the fringe of the AL MVP discussion. Let's go one extra dimension and explain his defensive success.

Via the measurements of Baseball Info Solutions, which does video tracking of every major league game, Cano had seven Defensive Runs Saved, matching Kelly Johnson for the most by any second baseman in the major leagues.

Defensive Runs Saved factors in a players effectiveness at turning batted balls into outs and converting double plays in double play situations (runner on first base, less than two outs, play involves the player as either relay man or pivot man).

That’s a significant jump from a couple of months ago when Cano’s defense was not viewed as positively in this space.

Cano also tallied the highest marks in Baseball Info Solutions video review of Good Fielding Plays and Defensive Misplays. Their video tracking team categorizes plays into more than 30 categories of GFPs (good plays-- Web Gem-nominees) and 50 categories of DM&Es (plays that a player failed to make).

Most Good Fielding Plays

August 2011

Team

Robinson Cano Yankees 23

Albert Pujols Cardinals 22

Erick Aybar Angels 21

Ruben Tejada Mets 21

>> Tracked by Baseball Info Solutions

Examples of a GFP would be reaching into the stands to catch a foul ball, turning a double play pivot while being barreled into by an oncoming baserunner, or coming off the base to save a throwing error.

DM&Es include not just typical errors, but things such as falling down or slipping, cutting off a better-positioned fielder to prevent him from making a play, or throwing away the relay of a potential double play.

Cano was credited with 23 Good Fielding Plays, most of anyone in baseball, and 10 more than the next-most by a second baseman (Ben Zobrist of the Rays and Gordon Beckham of the White Sox). In fact, that was well more than the next-most in any month this season by a second baseman. Second-best was 16 by Cano and Nationals second baseman Danny Espinosa in June.

But that month, Cano had nine Defensive Misplays & Errors. This month, he had just four. It’s actually the second straight month that a Yankees player led the majors in GFPs. Mark Teixeira co-led with Blue Jays outfielder Adam Lind, posting 19 in July.

Cano wasn't just clutch at the plate. He was clutch in the field. One of the first of those 23 was key, with the Yankees and CC Sabathia clinging to a 3-2 lead over the White Sox at U.S. Cellular Field on August 1. Cano made a running, twisting catch of Alex Rios’ popup down the right field line to start the seventh inning. It was one of three GFPs that Cano was credited with in that game and set the tone for what was to come.

That one turned out to be big play, particularly when Sabathia escaped trouble later that inning, and the Yankees held on for the win. Even White Sox announcer Ken Harrelson was impressed:

“He just makes everything look easy,” Harrelson said on that night’s broadcast.

Both at the plate and in the field.
 
AL MVP is between Ellsbury and Grandy IMO. NL MVP is JUp IMO
It probably should be Pedroia again in the AL. Gold glove defense and incredible offense from a 2B.
Robinson Cano also displays GG defense and is an even better offensive player than Pedroia. Not sure how you can argue Pedroia over Cano.Cano has .20+ higher OPS, more doubles, HRs, RBIs, runs scored.
Not this again. Cano is below average defensively. In the last four years, he has been negative in UZR/150 every single year. Pedroia, on the other hand, has been pretty consistently awesome on defense.
UZR is the dumbest stat out there. Defensive metrics are completely unreliable. Plus UZR fluctuates from year to year. You cant tell me guys have great defensive years followed by bad defensive years off and on. Claiming Cano is below average defensively reeks of someone who has never watched the guy play and is insulting to baseball. Watch the games, hes clearly a plus defender. Whether hes a GGer or not Ill leave up to other people to debate. Does UZR take arm into account? No I dont think so. But then we'll hear how arm isnt important at 2B which is BS. Having a good arm helps on turning the DP. Also, Ive never seen any 2B go up the middle like him and flip the ball almost behind his back nonchalantly to 1B like he does. No other 2B can make that play
1) GG are as much offensive awards as defensive. They're the worst possible metric to evaluate defense.2) The people that compile the defensive stats watch every single play of every single game. Every single one. So the folks behind each defensive metric as a collective have watched a whole ton more of Cano than you.

3) UZR does have a factor for the arm of a player, but just like pretty much every position on the field, the arm of a defensive player is much less important than the range of that player.

4) Why on Earth do you believe that defense can't fluctute year to year? Everything else in baseball does. So while UZR and its ilk may not be entirely accurate, they're the best out there at the moment.

5) Cano won't be a legit MVP candidate until he ups his walk rate.

 
1) GG are as much offensive awards as defensive. They're the worst possible metric to evaluate defense.
Nowhere did I ever say it was a good metric to evaluate defense. I just said he was GG caliber which means hes a good fielder. Im not arguing hes the best fielding 2B in baseball
2) The people that compile the defensive stats watch every single play of every single game. Every single one. So the folks behind each defensive metric as a collective have watched a whole ton more of Cano than you.
Ive watched every Yankee game since his rookie year (give or take) I doubt the extra games theyve watched make up more than a small sample size. More importantly theres also a bunch of defensive metrics that say hes a great fielder. Why is one right and one wrong?
3) UZR does have a factor for the arm of a player, but just like pretty much every position on the field, the arm of a defensive player is much less important than the range of that player.
Yeah I see that.
4) Why on Earth do you believe that defense can't fluctute year to year? Everything else in baseball does. So while UZR and its ilk may not be entirely accurate, they're the best out there at the moment.
Sorry I cant believe a guy can go from worst defensive player to best in a matter of one year (for example, guys like Kelly Johnson).
5) Cano won't be a legit MVP candidate until he ups his walk rate.
I dont think hes an MVP candidate (yet)
 

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