My Case for MJD at #1 Overall (2 Viewers)

[SSOG]

Agreed... SSOG is horrible at cherry picking stats.

Holy personal attack, batman.My point was that comparing MJD last season to Peterson last season in order to gauge their talent was a *FAR* more egregious example of cherry-picking, because MJD lost three starting offensive linemen by the end of week 1, while Peterson had one of the top 5 lines in football. That's why I brought up his career numbers in the first place- to control for the terrible injury luck the Jags had last year.

Now, you want to call me a cherry-picker, then fine, go right ahead... but I'd like to take this chance to point out that MJD's ypc was 4.2 last year. His career ypc was 4.8. His ypc so far this year is... 4.7. In other words, right in line with his career average. Some might call that cherry-picking. Others simply call that being right.

If you want to talk about cherry-picking, look more towards the guy who cherry-picked MJD's stats behind a wrecked o-line while ignoring his entire body of work to date and said the following:

In the three games he started last season, he averaged 4.0 YPC. For the season he averaged 4.2 YPC. I don't see 4.4 or higher this season being realistic IMO.

 

[Instinctive]

Agreed... SSOG is horrible at cherry picking stats.

Holy personal attack, batman.My point was that comparing MJD last season to Peterson last season in order to gauge their talent was a *FAR* more egregious example of cherry-picking, because MJD lost three starting offensive linemen by the end of week 1, while Peterson had one of the top 5 lines in football. That's why I brought up his career numbers in the first place- to control for the terrible injury luck the Jags had last year.

Now, you want to call me a cherry-picker, then fine, go right ahead... but I'd like to take this chance to point out that MJD's ypc was 4.2 last year. His career ypc was 4.8. His ypc so far this year is... 4.7. In other words, right in line with his career average. Some might call that cherry-picking. Others simply call that being right.

Some might call that a misleading line of logic. The point wasn't that you shouldn't use MJD's career, it was that you can;t take his career and only take Peterson's most recent season. You take both careers. You definitely cherry picked, don't try to deny it.And, btw, I think Switz is an even worse cherry-picker than you are. Or should I say better? You both cherry pick extremely well, but it's a bad thing...so are you worse or better at it?

BTW...not a personal attack. Grow some thinker skin. He was basically saying good post. Good god have people gone soft and become easily offended around here.

 

[SSOG]

Some might call that a misleading line of logic. The point wasn't that you shouldn't use MJD's career, it was that you can;t take his career and only take Peterson's most recent season. You take both careers. You definitely cherry picked, don't try to deny it.

And, btw, I think Switz is an even worse cherry-picker than you are. Or should I say better? You both cherry pick extremely well, but it's a bad thing...so are you worse or better at it?

BTW...not a personal attack. Grow some thinker skin. He was basically saying good post. Good god have people gone soft and become easily offended around here.

Like I said, the split I chose (Adrian Peterson last season, MJD's career) most accurately described what has happened so far this season (Peterson's YPC is closer to last season's average than his career average, while MJD's is closer to his career average than last season's average). I would have happily used MJD's averages from last season to predict this season if I didn't believe there were some HEAVILY extenuating circumstances (namely: MJD losing the majority of his offensive line by the end of week 1). ADP had no such extenuating circumstances, so I had no problem with using his numbers last season. You call that cherry-picking. That's fine. As I said, the sample sizes were statistically comparable and it has most accurately modeled the results so far this season, so I call that being right. Also, that was the very definition of a personal attack. He was not addressing my argument (saying "SSoG's argument is wrong because of cherry-picked stats"), he was attacking my personal credibility ("SSoG always cherry-picks stats and therefore his opinion is not to be trusted"). That's an ad hominem argument, and not the first one he's directed my way today. I wasn't offended by it, I was simply reminding Switz to attack my argument and not my credibility.

 

[Instinctive]

Sooo....what do we do with this one?

Simply add CJ4.24 to the discussion? I know the popular thing right now is put CJ first overall no matter what, but can you really go wrong with CJ, MJD, or AD?

 

[switz]

Also, that was the very definition of a personal attack. He was not addressing my argument (saying "SSoG's argument is wrong because of cherry-picked stats"), he was attacking my personal credibility ("SSoG always cherry-picks stats and therefore his opinion is not to be trusted"). That's an ad hominem argument, and not the first one he's directed my way today. I wasn't offended by it, I was simply reminding Switz to attack my argument and not my credibility.

You call this a personal attack:

if you listen to SSOG the Broncos have the worst OL in the league

Wow ETA-

FWIW, I really enjoy your posting, even if we disagree about a lot of things. I've never IMO posted a personal attack against you. It's more of calling a spade "a spade". I don't believe I've ever called you stupid, or anything like that. Saying you cherry pick stats isn't discrediting everything you post, it's merely saying you are painting with too small of a brush. I'm guilty of that many times as well, it happens. Small brushes highlight certain details, but miss the whole picture. Large brushes paint a big picture, but ignore details. Both are necessary, which is why it's good we have a lot of posters on this board, so we can see players (if we choose to) from multiple perspectives. Sorry if I offended you, it really wasn't my intention at all.

 

[SSOG]

Also, that was the very definition of a personal attack. He was not addressing my argument (saying "SSoG's argument is wrong because of cherry-picked stats"), he was attacking my personal credibility ("SSoG always cherry-picks stats and therefore his opinion is not to be trusted"). That's an ad hominem argument, and not the first one he's directed my way today. I wasn't offended by it, I was simply reminding Switz to attack my argument and not my credibility.

You call this a personal attack:

if you listen to SSOG the Broncos have the worst OL in the league

Wow ETA-

FWIW, I really enjoy your posting, even if we disagree about a lot of things. I've never IMO posted a personal attack against you. It's more of calling a spade "a spade". I don't believe I've ever called you stupid, or anything like that. Saying you cherry pick stats isn't discrediting everything you post, it's merely saying you are painting with too small of a brush. I'm guilty of that many times as well, it happens. Small brushes highlight certain details, but miss the whole picture. Large brushes paint a big picture, but ignore details. Both are necessary, which is why it's good we have a lot of posters on this board, so we can see players (if we choose to) from multiple perspectives. Sorry if I offended you, it really wasn't my intention at all.

I agree that this board is a far better place because of the breadth and width of different posters here (yes, even LHUCKS), and I definitely appreciate your many contributions to the forums throughout the years. I know I've even told you this before, and I'm sure I'll wind up telling you again, because it really bears mentioning. We've had our share of arguments, but I've always viewed them more as an inevitability. When two people as stubborn and as opinionated as we are wind up coexisting in such close confines, it's not a matter of if we'll disagree... it's a matter of when we'll disagree, and how big the fireworks will be. I don't mean that as a sign of disrespect or anything, I'm just saying... let's face it, we're both pretty loud, stubborn, and opinionated people. It's who we are. I certainly don't think any less of you for it, and I'd hope that you wouldn't think any less of me for it, either.I took that particular comment as a personal attack because it had no bearing on the discussion at hand. Even if I had said that Denver's O-line was among the worst in the league (and I have never said anything of the sort), I don't understand how that is relevant to a discussion of Matt Forte. I interpreted that throwaway comment as meaning "if you listen to SSoG, Denver's O-line is among the worst in the league. Clearly Denver's O-line is not among the worst in the league. I am presenting this as evidence that you should not listen to SSoG in this entirely unrelated matter". You were attacking my credentials while ignoring my claims.

 

[Instinctive]

Sooo....what do we do with this one?

Simply add CJ4.24 to the discussion? I know the popular thing right now is put CJ first overall no matter what, but can you really go wrong with CJ, MJD, or AD?

 

[SSOG]

Sooo....what do we do with this one?Simply add CJ4.24 to the discussion? I know the popular thing right now is put CJ first overall no matter what, but can you really go wrong with CJ, MJD, or AD?

I assume we're talking redraft? Well, in that case, we're a long way away from August. I'm going to reserve judgment until I see what happens in the draft, free agency, and TCs.

 

[Aardvarks]

I've always found that these "My Case For..." offseason threads are usually long forgotten by Week 2 or 3.

This one will be too, unless CJ, AP, Gore, Rice and a couple other studs miss a bunch of games with injuries... and MJD ascends to the top by default. Then the owner of this "Case for MJD" thread will bump it in December, looking for misguided props. "I called it! Weee!"

But if MJD just does okay, and even begins a subtle career slide--with his patchwork O-line and woeful teammates around him--then this thread-starter will pray it doesn't get bumped.

Know that *I* wouldn't bump it to humiliate you. I'll be too busy shining the 3rd FF trophy that CJ2K helped snag for me.

 

[Instinctive]

I've always found that these "My Case For..." offseason threads are usually long forgotten by Week 2 or 3. This one will be too, unless CJ, AP, Gore, Rice and a couple other studs miss a bunch of games with injuries... and MJD ascends to the top by default. Then the owner of this "Case for MJD" thread will bump it in December, looking for misguided props. "I called it! Weee!" But if MJD just does okay, and even begins a subtle career slide--with his patchwork O-line and woeful teammates around him--then this thread-starter will pray it doesn't get bumped. Know that *I* wouldn't bump it to humiliate you. I'll be too busy shining the 3rd FF trophy that CJ2K helped snag for me.

You do know this is a thread from last year? And that posting to say "this thread is dumb" is really a waste of your time in addition to not really contributing to meaningful discussion?And can you set aside the blind fanboy-ism regarding CJ and present some type of argument that says he will maintain historically unsustainable amounts of 50+ yard TD runs and once-in-a-lifetime-high ypc or the massive amount of touches of the final 4 games as they went for the record with him?I like him and have him on quite a few dynasties of my own but geez...let's not overreact too much. It's easily within the realm of possibility that both CJ and MJD play 16 games and MJD outscores him slightly. I don;t know that the world would be shocked into heart attacks if it occurred.