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Well at least the Knicks PF/C can put 26 points up a night and hit an 18 foot shot when it counts. Saying the Nets are anywhere close to being a contender is a joke. Excluding Lopez, they don't have another player who is in the top 15 of their position and whoever is starting at SG and SF is one of the worst starters at that position in the league.
Also Wilson Chandler has to be one of the most underrated players in the NBA. He is so unselfish, he has no problem being 3rd or 4th fiddle and barely ever takes bad shots.Dude would average 20+ points if he played on a team like the Nets or Raptors
Who cares? The bottom line is outside of the Bulls or Magic adding Melo to any of the teams interested in him will not make them a contender. With the CBA set to expire and the likelihood of smaller/shorter guaranteed contracts Melo will lose a lot of money if he doesn't sign the extension before the trade deadline and there's no way he'll leave that money on the table and that's why I think Denver has more power than most think.
Um, yes it does. Maybe not a frontrunner, but if the Knicks or many other teams can add a Melo to their team they are contenders. And once Melo is on board other players in FA down the line will/can take pay cuts to bolster lineup.
What are the others teams that become contenders by adding Melo?Bulls and Magic are the only teams that come to mind that would become instant contenders with Melo. Everyone else would become a 2nd round playoff team at best.
Dallas Mavericks
Nope. The Mavs don't have a problem scoring. They can't defend/rebound with the elite teams.
The type of team that makes it to the conference finals or semis and gets spanked by the Spurs or the Lakers...not a playoff brand of basketball. Sexy in the regular season, dog#### in the postseason. Looking forward to fading them in the playoffs...free money.
i don't know about that. carlisle's mavs certainly play harder than they did before. they finished respectably in both offensive and defensive categories. they are improving on that this year. that said, they're much the same team they have been over the past few years. they need to peel away some of the peripheral players because dirk isn't getting any younger. he's at the point in his career where he's going to breakdown physically and they really don't have anyone else to fall back on. butler is a nice player but he's not going to carry your team.
I was thinking about Knicks, Blazers and Mavs, but they are already contenders.
He creates his own shot and scores at will. Every team needs that.
Who outside of Amare would you really want to take a shot at the end of the game? Teams double and triple team Amare towards end of game Melo would stop this from happening. Lets be honest about the Knicks they are not going to be anyone with defense they will need to outscore teams to win, Melo really helps with this.
Check out the plus- minus for the Felton-Fields-Chandler-Gallo-Amare combo. The Knicks problem isn't it's starting lineup, its their depth (they're basically playing with a cap 11 million less than anyone else until they move Curry). I doubt they move two of that nucleus right now, but will at some point move Curry and others for the depth they need this year. I seriously doubt they move for Melo during the year, but adding him to that 5 player nucleus in the offseason certainly extends the effectiveness of what D'Antoni wants.
I guess we don't have the same definition for "contenders."Knicks - Adding Melo won't address defensive/rebounding issues. Blazers - This one is interesting, but if Roy is complaining about sharing the rock with Miller how much more with Melo? If the knee issues rob Roy of his impact then adding Melo is a slight upgrade. LA is good on the offensive end, but again leaves plenty to be desired on defense.Mavs - They would upgrade their offense, but again Melo does nothing to address their man to man defense. They will lose in the playoffs because the teams they will be playing against are able to execute on offense AND will be able to game plan for heir zone D. Melo is a great scorer, arguably the best, but he needs to be inserted into a strong defensive team to become champion. If you were able to magically put Melo on the Bulls or Magic, I would take those teams over the Lakers, Celtics, and Heat.
I think u are over analyzing here. Melo brings so much firepower to an offense, he will make other players way more efficient IMO. If he comes to the Knicks, Amare will have much much better looks and will shoot a higher FG%. Then the other players, Gallo, Fields, Chandler will net better shots. With Blazers, a one two punch with Melo and Aldridge will be far better then anything Melo had with Denver in 6 years.He had not much to work with in Denver if you look back at his teams
Time for the league to fix the Lakers. Maybe they trade some contracts and a meh player like bynum to the nugs for Anthony?
I think the Spurs may be able to run with them...but I agree, the Lakers just don't care right now.
Sadly, Melo would be a rebounding and defensive upgrade @ the 4 for NYK.Cliff Clavin said:
And he also has a higher rebound rate than Amare and is probably Amare's equal at defending NBA big men.
the lakers go as kobe goes and he certainly cares. i don't think it's a question of focus but instead a failure of personnel. it's sorry play of their PGs, Pau wearing down a bit , and the uneven play of any player not named odom that are the problems. players become bored or overconfident when they have been there year after year for the grind. i can buy fisher, odom and pau feeling that maybe. the rest of the lakers - the more recent acquisitions like barnes, blake, and artest - have no reason to feel bored with winning championships or the road to winning them because they haven't been there long enough to be complacent. they're vets, sure, and have played a ton of games but winning a title? right now, the lakers are simply off and this could be a symptom of a much bigger problem. chalking it up to simple complacency is ridiculous. as for the spurs, they're playing some good basketball right now. they have an actual bench this year and are getting great play from their guards. they seem to be having fun out there every game. the rodeo schedule is coming up soon and will be a real measuring stick for this team. it always seems to harden the team in time for the playoff run.
Going from really bad to just bad isn't going to lead them to a title. And they are pretty much identical (read: bad) rebounders. Melo is at 13.8 TRB% while Amar'e is at 13.6. Not a noticeable upgrade.
Well this is the best (and only) answer so far. Depth.Come on Knick fans. We're talking about Melo here! You must have some idea on how Melo will make your team the contenders. It can't just be depth. Adding someone like Matt Barnes or Shane Battier gives you depth. Melo must bring more to the table than that.Sammy3469 said:
No more ridiculous than suggesting the two time defending champs (3 time WC Champs) have "personnel" failures. It's early January. If the Lakers are struggling to make the playoffs in March, I'll start to worry. Otherwise, you can merge the Spurs, Thunder, and Mavericks and I'd still favor LA in a 4 game series.
Scoring in the regular season does not = scoring in the playoffs. Melo is a go-to-scorer when playoff intensity is at an apex. No one else on the Knicks is.
i'm not suggesting they won't make the playoffs. i mean, really, they play in the easiest, softest division in the NBA. is there another team in the pacific that might be .500, or even make the playoffs at the season's end?instead i'm saying that they've got problems and it's not boredom. there are teams in the west, like the Spurs, are awfully good (also 3-time WC champs) that might make any title defense a little tricky whether through good coaching, personnel or simply home court advantage. if the lakers keep struggling or fall behind in the rankings then there is a decent chance that kobe's competitiveness might overwhelm and undermine the team itself.No more ridiculous than suggesting the two time defending champs (3 time WC Champs) have "personnel" failures. It's early January. If the Lakers are struggling to make the playoffs in March, I'll start to worry. Otherwise, you can merge the Spurs, Thunder, and Mavericks and I'd still favor LA in a 4 game series.
Of course he does (Melo>>Gallo), he allows them to rotate 6 guys through the lineup and forces teams to get out of the shell on the defensive end (teams are currently sagging the middle and sprinting out to the 3 point shooters as soon as the Knicks start to rotate the ball). At this point the Knicks are going all in on this offensive philosophy, so they don't really care what Melo's Rbd rate is. More of a concern is his eFG% which is actually low compared to the Knicks starting 5. The argument for Melo isn't one of what he does differently/better than what they currently have (though he's clearly an upgrade over Chandler, Gallo, or Fields) it's that he augments them and allows them to play they way they like to play the entire game as the rotate guys for rest.
I hear you, and agree that the Lakers can't half-#### it in the playoffs and beat the Spurs. They're currently what, 2.5 games behind Dallas for the 2 spot in the West? Assuming they catch the Mavs (who are finished IMO), the Lakers will have home court until the WCFs against the Spurs. I'm pretty sure they'll have turned it on effort wise by the time that series rolls around.i'm not suggesting they won't make the playoffs. i mean, really, they play in the easiest, softest division in the NBA. is there another team in the pacific that might be .500, or even make the playoffs at the season's end?instead i'm saying that they've got problems and it's not boredom. there are teams in the west, like the Spurs, are awfully good (also 3-time WC champs) that might make any title defense a little tricky whether through good coaching, personnel or simply home court advantage. if the lakers keep struggling or fall behind in the rankings then there is a decent chance that kobe's competitiveness might overwhelm and undermine the team itself.No more ridiculous than suggesting the two time defending champs (3 time WC Champs) have "personnel" failures. It's early January. If the Lakers are struggling to make the playoffs in March, I'll start to worry. Otherwise, you can merge the Spurs, Thunder, and Mavericks and I'd still favor LA in a 4 game series.
No, but it's still an updgrade. And Melo's not a terrible rebounder. His TRB% is much better than Amare's if you factor in that most of Melo's minutes are at the 3 and Melo players on a team with significantly better rebounds than Amare'. But it would be better to compare Melo to Gallinari or Chandler (guys whose minutes he'd be taking.)
Well that and he has the second highest TRB for a SF (behind Dominic McGuire if i remember correctly) in the NBA... I would say that he is a great rebounder. People that are seriously comparing Amare to Melo are ######ed, Melo plays 90% of his minutes at SF and Amare plays 70% of his minutes at C. Cliff, do you really think that Anthony is a bad rebounder, or is that just shtick?
I think Cliff is talking about Melo's rebounding if he played as a 4 in the NYK system.
Knicks are 5-5 after beating the Spurs the best team in basketball.Knicks are 3-3 so far during this stretch.
Sun, Dec 12 vs Denver - Win
Wed, Dec 15 vs Boston - Loss
Fri, Dec 17 vs Miami - Loss
Sat, Dec 18 @ Cleveland - Loss
Wed, Dec 22 vs Oklahoma City - Win
Sat, Dec 25 vs Chicago - Win
Tue, Dec 28 @ Miami - Loss
Thu, Dec 30 @ Orlando - Loss
Sun, Jan 2 vs Indiana - Win
Tue, Jan 4 vs San Antonio - Win
Fri, Jan 7 @ Phoenix
Sun, Jan 9 @ Los Angeles
Tue, Jan 11 @ Portland
Wed, Jan 12 @ Utah
They maybe get wins vs Indiana and Cleveland (but it is a back to back) and probably steal one somewhere else. What is the next easiest game in there? Playing Miami? @ Phoenix?
So far they've lost their only road games during this stretch. Let's see where they are after the 4 game road trip west.Knicks are 5-5 after beating the Spurs the best team in basketball.Knicks are 3-3 so far during this stretch.
Sun, Dec 12 vs Denver - Win
Wed, Dec 15 vs Boston - Loss
Fri, Dec 17 vs Miami - Loss
Sat, Dec 18 @ Cleveland - Loss
Wed, Dec 22 vs Oklahoma City - Win
Sat, Dec 25 vs Chicago - Win
Tue, Dec 28 @ Miami - Loss
Thu, Dec 30 @ Orlando - Loss
Sun, Jan 2 vs Indiana - Win
Tue, Jan 4 vs San Antonio - Win
Fri, Jan 7 @ Phoenix
Sun, Jan 9 @ Los Angeles
Tue, Jan 11 @ Portland
Wed, Jan 12 @ Utah
They maybe get wins vs Indiana and Cleveland (but it is a back to back) and probably steal one somewhere else. What is the next easiest game in there? Playing Miami? @ Phoenix?
Compared to Gallinari, he's a significant rebounding upgrade.
Still sure about this? Knicks only need to go 5-4 to get 13 wins.
No, the Knicks are a better team than I thought they were...defense be damned. There are 6 legit teams in the East. It's been a long time since that's been the case. As I Bulls fan, I was wondering today if I'd rather the Bulls play the Hawks or Knicks in the first round. I'm undecided.
I'd expect 3-6. They have 2 back-to-backs (Blazers to Utah and Spurs to Thunder) and start with 4 games in 6 days. It's just a brutal road stretch against some of the best teams in the NBA without Gallo. They'll be lucky to go .500 this month. Feb and March get much easier, though.
That's terrible, but holy ####
He tried to tell me that it was Amare's.....but that just seems too out there. Who knows though. This dude has been spot on with Suns rumors before, including the trade earlier this year.That's terrible, but holy ####
As a Bulls fan, I am a little scared if they have to play the Knicks or Magic in round 1. I know that the Bulls are a better team than the Knicks and might be better than the Magic when both are fully healthy. However, the Bulls have had problems against teams with a deep shooting PF so far this season and such a player like Jamison, Rashard Lewis, Hedo, or Chandler causes major problems for the team because Boozer and Gibson have been bad covering them. Jamison and Harrington got a ton of open shots but were horrible and that saved the Bulls in those games. Lewis and Chandler are major reasons the Bulls have lost to the Knicks and Magic. By the time the playoffs come, if the Bulls correct that problem, they should be able to handle the Knicks pretty easily and get past the Magic. If not, they could easily not make the 2nd round.
