*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (10 Viewers)

[timschochet]

If the Lakers don't make the playoffs this year, the Suns get their pick as part of the Nash trade.

Ouch. Just add a little salt in, why dont cha?

 

[Abraham]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

 

[Kev4029]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

 

[Abraham]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

 

[No. 16]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

Classic case of a wrong fit for sure.

 

[the moops]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

Classic case of a wrong fit for sure.

Is it D'Antoni or just the mix of players that don't fit?

 

[Abraham]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

Classic case of a wrong fit for sure.

Is it D'Antoni or just the mix of players that don't fit?

Well, it seems to have been "a while" since Dantoni was any good as an NBA coach. Not saying its all on him, but the team is clearly not playing to its strengths...and that does start with the coach.

 

[the moops]

Should have left Bickerstaff as head coach

 

[No. 16]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

Classic case of a wrong fit for sure.

Is it D'Antoni or just the mix of players that don't fit?

Well, it seems to have been "a while" since Dantoni was any good as an NBA coach. Not saying its all on him, but the team is clearly not playing to its strengths...and that does start with the coach.

Seriously...Which starting line up would you think would be a Top 5 OPP FG% and Rebounding DIFF Team:

Steve Nash

Kobe Bryant

World Peace

Pau Gasol

Dwight Howard

or

Stephen Curry

Klay Thompson

Harrison Barnes

David Lee

Festus Ezeli

I was never a big believer in coaches having such a huge impact on defense....but Mark Jackson is proving me wrong. The Warriors may not keep it up but whatever he's doing in Oaktown is amazing considering 3/5ths of his starters have only average athleticism. I forgot what podcast or where I read it (I think Lowe), but they said to give kudos to Mark Jackson because if D'Antoni were coaching the Warriors they'd play zero defense and would be scoring 150 a night.

 

[tommyGunZ]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

I see your point, but there were MANY people (in this thread, on the internet as a whole) thinking the two offseason trades made the Lakers the favorite to win the title. I don't see how missing the playoffs can be seen as anything other than a massive disappointment.

That wasn't just an internet thing, ESPN had the hype machine really working on this.

Futhermore, it is inconceivable that a team featuring 3 of the top-20 players in the league (and Steve Nash) would have to squeak in to the playoffs.

This is Mike D'Antoni's last coaching gig in the NBA. Don Nelson could do better with this team.

Classic case of a wrong fit for sure.

Is it D'Antoni or just the mix of players that don't fit?

Well, it seems to have been "a while" since Dantoni was any good as an NBA coach. Not saying its all on him, but the team is clearly not playing to its strengths...and that does start with the coach.

Seriously...Which starting line up would you think would be a Top 5 OPP FG% and Rebounding DIFF Team:

Steve Nash

Kobe Bryant

World Peace

Pau Gasol

Dwight Howard

or

Stephen Curry

Klay Thompson

Harrison Barnes

David Lee

Festus Ezeli

I was never a big believer in coaches having such a huge impact on defense....but Mark Jackson is proving me wrong. The Warriors may not keep it up but whatever he's doing in Oaktown is amazing considering 3/5ths of his starters have only average athleticism. I forgot what podcast or where I read it (I think Lowe), but they said to give kudos to Mark Jackson because if D'Antoni were coaching the Warriors they'd play zero defense and would be scoring 150 a night.

Michael Malone deserves a lot of, if not all, the credit. He also turned around New Orleans' defense a couple years ago. GS cannot afford to let him go, the way Boston let Thibs go.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

Where do you think they end up in the West this year?

 

[timschochet]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

Give me some hope, Tommy! I want to believe. How are they going to get out this mess? Make a prediction.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

 

[Abraham]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

You don't think one could be related to the other?

 

[No. 16]

Seriously...Which starting line up would you think would be a Top 5 OPP FG% and Rebounding DIFF Team:Steve NashKobe BryantWorld PeacePau GasolDwight HowardorStephen CurryKlay ThompsonHarrison BarnesDavid LeeFestus EzeliI was never a big believer in coaches having such a huge impact on defense....but Mark Jackson is proving me wrong. The Warriors may not keep it up but whatever he's doing in Oaktown is amazing considering 3/5ths of his starters have only average athleticism. I forgot what podcast or where I read it (I think Lowe), but they said to give kudos to Mark Jackson because if D'Antoni were coaching the Warriors they'd play zero defense and would be scoring 150 a night.

Michael Malone deserves a lot of, if not all, the credit. He also turned around New Orleans' defense a couple years ago. GS cannot afford to let him go, the way Boston let Thibs go.

Agreed, but if NBA execs really believe Malone deserves a lot of the credit (which I believe is fair since I remember reading reports of "other" coaches suggesting to Mark Jackson to hedge less on PnR), he'll be gone unless the Warriors are willing to over, over pay him. I think he's already the highest paid assistant in the league and I think Lacob had even said it himself last year he saw both as a combo hiring.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

You still can't see past "OMG KOBE SCORED A LOT OF POINTS!1!!1". Its okay. One of these days you'll get it.

 

[tommyGunZ]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

Where do you think they end up in the West this year?

7th.

 

[No. 16]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

There are two types of Lakers fans:Lakers Fans

and

Kobe Fans

You my friend are #2.

 

[timschochet]

Why can't one be both?

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Looks like GS will lose their 1st rounder this year to the Nets for that awful Marcus Williams trade. Still wasn't a good deal, but that it may be in the back half of the draft eases the sting.

In re: the LA pick, I found this:

The L.A. Lakers will send the least favorable of their own 1st round pick (top-14 protected), Cleveland's own 2013 1st round pick, Sacramento's own 1st round pick (top-13 protected) and Miami's 2013 1st round pick to Phoenix. If the L.A. Lakers' 1st round pick is within the top-14 selections, Phoenix will automatically receive the L.A. Lakers' 1st round pick. [L.A. Lakers-Phoenix, 7/11/2012]

 

[Kev4029]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

Where do you think they end up in the West this year?

7th.

Ahead of GS, Denver, Memphis, Houston, LAC, SA or OKC? At best they are the 8 seed.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

You guys digging Laker graves, are you using the same shovels you used back in '05 and '06 when you buried LA and said they'd never win another title with Kobe?

Where do you think they end up in the West this year?

7th.

So they're going to win 2/3's of their remaining games? Their defense has been pretty bad, and now Howard might be out. Who's going to stop anyone on that team?

 

[tommyGunZ]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

There are two types of Lakers fans:Lakers Fans

and

Kobe Fans

You my friend are #2.

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

 

[Popinski]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

You still can't see past "OMG KOBE SCORED A LOT OF POINTS!1!!1". Its okay. One of these days you'll get it.

You are forgetting that Kobe will also 1st team All-Defense for the 19th time.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Wonder how Kobe fans will spin this season. No Smush Parker to lay all the blame on.

If Kobe retires tomorrow or never wins another game, he will still be one of the all time greats. He'll still be a 5 time champion. What you don't seem to get is that, as disappointing as this season has been so far, it's little more than a coda to those of us who love Kobe. He's already achieved the pinnacle of his sport- several times now. The argument about his greatness ended a long time ago.

Or it can be seen as him completely failing as the leader of the most talented team in the league. Pretty embarrassing to miss the playoffs with a team boasting 4 HOF'ers.

It takes someone really special to blame the guy who's 6th in the league in PER for the Laker troubles, instead of the other 3 HOF's whose PERs have fallen off of a cliff. Does your sister live in Colorado Cliff?

You still can't see past "OMG KOBE SCORED A LOT OF POINTS!1!!1". Its okay. One of these days you'll get it.

You are forgetting that Kobe will also 1st team All-Defense for the 19th time.

Yep. And Laker fans will believe he earned it.

 

[Abraham]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

 

[the moops]

Michael Malone deserves a lot of, if not all, the credit. He also turned around New Orleans' defense a couple years ago. GS cannot afford to let him go, the way Boston let Thibs go.

No way the Celtics, or any team, for that matter, are going to pay an assistant 6.5 million for two years. Or even stand in the way of an assistant getting a head coaching gig.Also - and I agree that Thibs is a great coach, and a great defensive mind, but the Celtics were actually the best team in the league on defense both the year after Thibs left, and last year.

 

[the moops]

You are forgetting that Kobe will also 1st team All-Defense for the 19th time.

I think he will only get 2nd team this year.

 

[Britney Spears]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

Agree with this.

 

[No. 16]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

Agree with this.

Exactly. Like Nash and Howard have alluded to chemistry is the problem with this team and Abe is speaking the truth. Defense is the side of basketball that takes the most teamwork. It is about effort, trust, and scheme. We've seen offenses designed around singular talents (Kobe, Iverson, ATL with ISO Joe) succeed, but to be a real damn good defensive team and in turn a winning basketball team you need to play as a TEAM and that's where D'Antoni (lack of scheme, if you listen to Jalen Rose on Grantland he obviously has no respect for D'Antoni's coaching style) and Kobe (chemistry killer) share most of the burden (though a healthy Dwight Howard does wonders).

 

[Abraham]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

Agree with this.

Exactly. Like Nash and Howard have alluded to chemistry is the problem with this team and Abe is speaking the truth. Defense is the side of basketball that takes the most teamwork. It is about effort, trust, and scheme. We've seen offenses designed around singular talents (Kobe, Iverson, ATL with ISO Joe) succeed, but to be a real damn good defensive team and in turn a winning basketball team you need to play as a TEAM and that's where D'Antoni (lack of scheme, if you listen to Jalen Rose on Grantland he obviously has no respect for D'Antoni's coaching style) and Kobe (chemistry killer) share most of the burden (though a healthy Dwight Howard does wonders).

I won't pretend to know all the ins and outs, but I do know that NBA defense is substantially more complicated than most fans realize. Many players have less trouble on the offensive transition from college to pro than defensive - McHale is on record saying that he never doubted Marcus Morris could score, but it took a year and a camp to get confidence that he could play defense correctly in the scheme. Its the same reason McHale says Terrance Jones is a LONG way from getting minutes. A healthy Howard should work wonders, but even then the defense is likely going to need to be more complex than simply "put dwight in the lane to protect the rim." And with the continued advent of the PNR game in the NBA, it requires that all 5 guys react to what's going on at once...which isn't working well for LAL.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

 

[timschochet]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Jordan Hill is also hurt and won't travel. So the next 3 games: at Houston, at San Antonio, home against Oklahoma City- all without Howard, Gasol, and Hill.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Jordan Hill is also hurt and won't travel. So the next 3 games: at Houston, at San Antonio, home against Oklahoma City- all without Howard, Gasol, and Hill.

LA should get about 7 or 8 stops during that stretch.

 

[bigfeet_88]

D'Antoni breaking up a fight between Kobe and Dwight today:

Fight!

 

[Good Posting Judge]

D'Antoni breaking up a fight between Kobe and Dwight today:

Fight!

Southpaw is in these days, I guess.

 

[SoCalBroncoFan]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

Agree with this.

Exactly. Like Nash and Howard have alluded to chemistry is the problem with this team and Abe is speaking the truth. Defense is the side of basketball that takes the most teamwork. It is about effort, trust, and scheme. We've seen offenses designed around singular talents (Kobe, Iverson, ATL with ISO Joe) succeed, but to be a real damn good defensive team and in turn a winning basketball team you need to play as a TEAM and that's where D'Antoni (lack of scheme, if you listen to Jalen Rose on Grantland he obviously has no respect for D'Antoni's coaching style) and Kobe (chemistry killer) share most of the burden (though a healthy Dwight Howard does wonders).

You are correct that defense is a product of practice, planning, teamwork and effort. There has to be a trust and respect to know that the guy standing next to you is going to cover your man if you switch and is going to do his best to be in good position on his man and double when called for. I think that how guys play together has more to do with just how they interact on the defensive end. To me it looks like they dont have a good offensive flow. It seems like Kobe gets his and expects everyone to just be aggressive and get theirs. As a teammate I would find that very off-putting and not very team-oriented. Sure, Kobe gets his points, but at what cost? You have to be a cohesive unit - no one person more important than another. When I watch the Clippers play they have this enthusiasm and energy and they just look like they want to play together. They look like they are having fun. I know its not because of their coach, because Vinny Del Negro is not a great coach.

 

[Popinski]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Another few slots on this list for Kobe

 

[Premier]

What's the ETA usually on a torn labrum?

 

[Popinski]

What's the ETA usually on a torn labrum?

Depends on the specific type. But they usually don't need surgery.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Another few slots on this list for Kobe

I think I'd play Kobe over 40 points in their next game, regardless of who they're playing.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Another few slots on this list for Kobe

I think I'd play Kobe over 40 points in their next game, regardless of who they're playing.

Might be sitting out 2nd halves when they're down by 40.

 

[urbanhack]

Is this the NBA thread or the Lakes/Kobe thread?

 

[Short Corner]

Was a Laker fan for 15 years prior to Kobe arriving, and I'll be a Laker fan for 40+ years after he leaves. You guys who follow box scores keep pushing the Kobe is the problem narrative, and those of us who watch every Laker game will have our own opinion. Just as always.

I don't subscribe to the idea that Kobe is the problem. 2 points is 2 points whether he scores the ball or someone else does. That said, the team's defense is clearly losing them games. Kobe is a shell of himself on the defensive end and how motivated can the other guys be if they are expected to defend with vigor on one end and then stand around on the other. Yes, they are professionals. But they also have egos and when Howard and Gasol are each getting three fewer shots per game and the team is losing, attitudes are soon to follow. As it is now, they don't have any legs in the 4th quarter and their defense is not in the same league as the west's top teams. Kobe's high PER is nice and all, but it means nothing if the team is going to miss the playoffs.

Agree with this.

Exactly. Like Nash and Howard have alluded to chemistry is the problem with this team and Abe is speaking the truth. Defense is the side of basketball that takes the most teamwork. It is about effort, trust, and scheme. We've seen offenses designed around singular talents (Kobe, Iverson, ATL with ISO Joe) succeed, but to be a real damn good defensive team and in turn a winning basketball team you need to play as a TEAM and that's where D'Antoni (lack of scheme, if you listen to Jalen Rose on Grantland he obviously has no respect for D'Antoni's coaching style) and Kobe (chemistry killer) share most of the burden (though a healthy Dwight Howard does wonders).

There has to be a trust and respect to know that the guy standing next to you is going to cover your man if you switch and is going to do his best to be in good position on his man and double when called for.

You just have to cover what you are responsible for. If the guy that needs to cover for you doesn't go it's not your problem. The first guy who doesn't rotate is responsible for the break down. If you don't go because you have trust issues with your team mate, then it's on you.

 

[Juxtatarot]

I assumed the Lakers would eventually put it together and at least make the playoffs. If Howard is out for a long while, I'm doubting that for the first time. How crazy that would be!

 

[Britney Spears]

Howard has a torn labrum, Gasol has a concussion. No return date for either.

Jordan Hill is also hurt and won't travel. So the next 3 games: at Houston, at San Antonio, home against Oklahoma City- all without Howard, Gasol, and Hill.

LA should get about 7 or 8 stops during that stretch.

Kobe will put up enormous stats though, so no big deal.

 

[Britney Spears]

Very important PSA (requires sound)

He's doing Pizza Hut commercials now. Is really sad.

 

[Zaxxon]

Danny Ferry=sucks.