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NFL might start suspending over flagrant hits that are currently illeg (1 Viewer)

:lmao:

Are Harrison's fanboys STILL crying yet because their mighty, mighty hero got a well-deserved penalty for being a dirty player?
I suppose this is aimed at Steelers fans so I will answer. The officials on the field did not think the hits were dirty or excessive -- Harrison wasn't penalized on either play.
Kind of like how the officials didn't think Polamula made that INT against the Colts in the '05 playoffs, but the league came out and said that it was the incorrect call? Same thing here. The league, by fining him, is saying that his hit was cheap and dirty. Officials are not gonna make the correct calls 100% of the time on the field.
Perhaps but I think officials on the field are in a better position to judge intent to injure than someone in a league office reviewing the game after the fact.
 
I love big hits as much as the next guy and I have been THRILLED to see SOME of the punishment he has delivered, but I don't want to see a guy die as a result of one of those blasts any sooner than I have to (it will happen, just a matter of when and how often). If that makes me a #####, so be it.
I don't think anyone wants to see anyone injured. As I said previously the game wasn't played any harder last week than it was last month, year or even 10 years ago. I have no problem with punishing players that repeatedly use dirty tactics and the league has always had the ability to do so. I think a lot of people are overreacting.
 
Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
I can side with no helmet and no head contact, but those hits when the receiver touches the ball and its pretty much just shoulder pad to body contact are total BS to penalize, but whatever, league is going downhill.
 
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Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
Ya, Ray Anderson was in an interview and was stammmering and stuttering at some point when trying to describe what they wanted.I stated it before... it came down to the football aspect on one side and his mother aspect of "because I said so" routine on the other.

 
Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
I can side with no helmet and no head contact, but those hits when the receiver touches the ball and its pretty much just shoulder pad to body contact are total BS to penalize, but whatever, league is going downhill.
They weren't to the body, they were to the head. That's the point. That said, those were some good *** hits under the previous rules, I can see why people are sad to see them go. But too bad, there's plenty of room for big hits under the new rules. And I'd like to see if players like Harrison lead with their heads and use it as a weapon if you remove their helmets from the equation.

Harrison and fans who would rather see a player come to the sidelines asking coach where his wedding shoes are because he has to attend his sister's wedding in 10 minutes, than sacrifice head shots need to get over it.

 
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The "sissification" of the game continues.

WTF is a defenseless receiver? Seriously, when did that p###y phrase enter the game.

Next comes flags around the waste, then 2-hand tag, then skirts.

F#@$ the NFL league office.

 
Ok I'm now confused, they repeatedly say you can't lead with head, forearm, shoulder on a defenseless WR, making a catch.

Then they show Ray Lewis shoulder hitting a guy in the chest with his shoulder stating it as a clean hit, the Robinson hit they say he launched with his shoulder.

Is it becuase Robinson hit was higher on the body then Lewis.

 
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My only problem with the video is that it is very difficult to tell some of the illegal hits from legal hits in realtime. If you have to go in Super Slo-Mo or fram-by-frame to make a determination of whether a hit is legal or illegal then they are drawing the line too fine.

Only flagrant violations should result in a fines and suspension IMO.

 
Marcellus Wiley (9 year player rep in NFL) just destroying the NFL over this situation on Mike & Mike.

As I alluded to before... this has everything to do with $.

They want to go to 18 games this offseason, and they know they wont have public opinion on their side of the health issue.

 
Then they show Ray Lewis shoulder hitting a guy in the chest with his shoulder stating it as a clean hit,
The not-so-funny part is... if Keller ducks his head for any reason at the last second... the NFLs poster boy picture of a "perfect tackle/hit" is actually going to draw a fine and suspension when the inadvertant helmet-to-helmet contact happens.
 
Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
I can side with no helmet and no head contact, but those hits when the receiver touches the ball and its pretty much just shoulder pad to body contact are total BS to penalize, but whatever, league is going downhill.
They weren't to the body, they were to the head. That's the point. That said, those were some good *** hits under the previous rules, I can see why people are sad to see them go. But too bad, there's plenty of room for big hits under the new rules. And I'd like to see if players like Harrison lead with their heads and use it as a weapon if you remove their helmets from the equation.

Harrison and fans who would rather see a player come to the sidelines asking coach where his wedding shoes are because he has to attend his sister's wedding in 10 minutes, than sacrifice head shots need to get over it.
The thing is in video for the Desean Jackson hit Ray Anderson says that its not an illegal hit because of head contact but because its a hit to a defenseless receiver, any contact with the head, shoulder or forearm to a defenseless receiver is illegal, but then in the Ray Lewis hit its a legal hit to a defenseless receiver. That right there should show the rule is flawed. If a tiny WR gets hit, its illegal, but if a big TE gets hit its okay, or as shown later in the video a hit on a defenseless kicker is legal as well. Check out this article about a tweet from a kicker on the rule.

 
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Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
I can side with no helmet and no head contact, but those hits when the receiver touches the ball and its pretty much just shoulder pad to body contact are total BS to penalize, but whatever, league is going downhill.
They weren't to the body, they were to the head. That's the point. That said, those were some good *** hits under the previous rules, I can see why people are sad to see them go. But too bad, there's plenty of room for big hits under the new rules. And I'd like to see if players like Harrison lead with their heads and use it as a weapon if you remove their helmets from the equation.

Harrison and fans who would rather see a player come to the sidelines asking coach where his wedding shoes are because he has to attend his sister's wedding in 10 minutes, than sacrifice head shots need to get over it.
The thing is in video for the Desean Jackson hit Ray Anderson says that its not an illegal hit because of head contact but because its a hit to a defenseless receiver, any contact with the head, shoulder or forearm to a defenseless receiver is illegal, but then in the Ray Lewis hit its a legal hit to a defenseless receiver. That right there should show the rule is flawed. If a tiny WR gets hit, its illegal, but if a big TE gets hit its okay, or as shown later in the video a hit on a defenseless kicker is legal as well. Check out this article about a tweet from a kicker on the rule.
I must have misheard this part 'not an illegal hit because of head contact but because its a hit to a defenseless receiver' because if that's true and has nothing to do with the head as point of contact, then that's a load of bs and Ray should have given his head a shake instead of sounding like an awkward 70s clip narrator. I fully support getting head-shots out of the game, those where the player receiving the hit raises his head at the last second needs to be viewed with discretion obviously. Just like hockey it's still a fast game, and obviously cases can't be viewed as black and white. There will be a lot of debate on various hits in the coming years on whether it was dirty, or just the nature and speed of the game.

But I do think this is a start, I'm just surprised they tried to send this message in such a vague and rushed fashion. Seems like a panic move instead of taking their time to get it right.

 
Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
I actually have no problem with this video, aside from the DeSean Jackson hit. I think that was one of the flukes that you can't avoid. The other "illegal" hits (Though, I haven't seen a real good replay of Harrison's) are ones in which I think the defensive player needs to be held accountable.
Here’s the video roger goodell sent to players & coaches. It includes examples of illegal & legal hits under NFL rules
Half the DBs & LBs in te league are going to get suspended lol
I'll bet you, or anyone, there are no more than 2 suspensions due to these hits this season. I get so sick of all the sky-is-falling reactions to this stuff. Give the league some credit. Give them some time prove their intent, before you go preaching the end of the world. If, after this weeks games, we have 7 suspensions, then yeah we can ##### and moan, but don't jump to conclusions.
My only problem with the video is that it is very difficult to tell some of the illegal hits from legal hits in realtime. If you have to go in Super Slo-Mo or fram-by-frame to make a determination of whether a hit is legal or illegal then they are drawing the line too fine.
I totally disagree. I believe if you have to go to super slow-mo you shouldn't throw a flag. However, if an NFL official watches video in slow-mo on a Monday afternoon and sees evidence of a neglectful player (like Meriweather) making a dangerous play, then a suspension could be warranted.
Speculation that many owners have contacted Goodell and are upset with him on this issue?
I HIGHLY doubt that. I think owners know Goodell is just trying to make a statement, and establish the fact that defensive players need to be a bit more careful with their hits. It's no different than a parent that let's their kids get away with some small bad behavior over and over with a warning or very mild punishment. But then, that N-th time they do it the parent says "You know what, I want this to stop, and it's for you own good. I've told you N times and you haven't stopped. This time you are grounded."
 
You make lots of very sensible points in the post above, Griggs Allmoon. I'll attempt to add a few more:

For the people who are saying that the NFL is being less than sincere when they claim that their primary goal in increasing penalties for violent hits to the "neck area" and head (their "real agenda" is to use this as a bargaining chip in negotiations with the players' union or to "improve their public image," etc)... I say, yes, that is entirely possible.

Until recently, the NFL has had a well-documented and shameful history of hiring unethical doctors to produce biased reports to minimize the damage caused by concussions and of using deny-and-delay tactics (including hiring the law firm that the tobacco companies used to stall lawsuits from smokers until they died) to avoid providing health care to former NFL players suffering from damage they sustained during their playing days... So skepticism about the NFL's motives is not unfounded. But... I don't care if the NFL's motives are pure as the driven snow or inspired by Beelzebub, I applaud this attempt to try to make the game safer.

Players who specialize in hits that are borderline dirty have said that the fines that the NFL assessed for illegal hits didn't affect how they played the game (one even said he put aside a certain amount of money every season to pay those fines), so the league had to do something to make those players think twice about continuing to play in a way that put other players in danger of sustaining "life-altering hits." Clearly, fining a player making millions $50K or $75K wasn't enough... Hence the need for suspensions.

And if every once in a great while, a player is unjustly suspended for a game as a result of an accidental hit to the neck or head, that is a far, far, far lesser tragedy than someone's neck being broken (something that has happened at least once in the NFL) or someone suffering serious brain damage as a result of too many hits in the head... Something that way too many former NFL players have suffered... and if you don't know that, perhaps you need to educate yourself on that subject before you dismiss the seriousness of the problem...

To all the Chicken Littles crying that the "sky is falling" because the NFL has decided to assess harsher penalties for violent hits to the head or "neck area" because this will somehow ruin the nature of the game, I say that the game changed for the better when the NFL outlawed "clotheslining"... and imposing harsher penalties for violent hits to the head and "neck area" will also be good for the game.

And if you can't bear to watch NFL games with fewer violent hits to the head and "neck area," the solution is simple: Don't.

Better yet, be proactive and act on your convictions. You and everyone who believes that outlawing "clotheslining" and imposing harsher penalties for hits to the head and "neck area" has "sissified" the game and made it unwatchable should pool together all the money you can gather and start a football league that allows those things.

If you're right that the vast majority of football fans want to see more of that, your oh-so-manly new league is sure to quickly become wildly successful and drive the NFL out of business, making all of you billionnaires. Be sure to invest every cent you can get your hands on in that venture... After all.. It can't miss, right?

 
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Mark Schlereth's rant if it hasn't been posted:

I can't see how people defend Goodell and his cronies, I just can't... and it goes far, far beyond James Harrison.
 
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/commentary/...e=bryant/101027

Originally Published: October 27, 2010

The risky business of football's future

How much longer can the NFL rely on ratings and revenues for its legitimacy?

By Howard Bryant

ESPN.com

There has been over the past several years a smugness emanating from many corners of the NFL, largely based on television ratings in which even routine regular-season games have dwarfed baseball's October showcases, the playoffs and World Series. The ratings make for strong evidence, in football circles, that the NFL has no peers.

Revenues and interest have been exploding, reinforcing the perception of the game's invincibility, even as knowledge about the physical danger to its athletes has increased and a number of its best-known stars have committed crimes and other acts of low character. The league, believing in fans' unquenchable thirst for its product, launched its own television network to promulgate the game year-round and subtly stretched its season to the point that playoffs now extend into February.

Somehow football, arguably the sport with the most obvious performance-enhancing drug problem, has never been held accountable for it by Congress or by the press. While steroids in baseball made the headlines, football has been allowed to glorify its players' gladiator persona.

Is it any wonder the NFL has seemed especially pleased with itself.

But lately, perhaps even suddenly, it is becoming clear that football is not impervious to the forces that would chip away at its position atop the nation's hierarchy of sports industries. In fact, the sport is doomed in its current form. A new scrutiny on the speed of the game and the violence of its collisions makes it unlikely that football will exist in 10 years the way it does today.

It cannot be long until an outside body, such as Congress, begins to look at the amalgamation of damning empirical evidence: Technological improvements to equipment designed to facilitate the nature of football as a contact sport; faster, bigger, stronger players; scientific data confirming the devastating effects of the game on life expectancy and brain damage; a performance-enhancing drug policy that has not proven to be a deterrent; and a cultural history that has encouraged football's violence. The conclusion is an obvious one: Football is a death sport.

And in recent months, the personal trouble of former NFL golden children Ben Roethlisberger and Brett Favre has further weakened the credibility of the player as a role model.

Across numerous important fronts, football has lost much of the moral credibility it once possessed. The game might not be going out of business, but it is in grave danger of losing its elevated place in the culture.

All it took was one day. Sunday, Oct. 17, was an afternoon in which a series of vicious hits around the NFL exposed the hypocrisies of the sport, the people who fuel it as a business and the people who watch it for enjoyment.

The day included Atlanta's Dunta Robinson making Philadelphia's DeSean Jackson resemble a crash-test dummy, New England's Brandon Merriwether turning himself into a human projectile against Baltimore's Todd Heap and Pittsburgh's James Harrison using his helmet to knock Cleveland's Mohamed Massaquoi out of the game and the Browns' game the following Sunday. Those hits aren't unique to the sport -- the NFL and its partners have profited from encouraging big hits for years -- but they occurred in short order on the same day, and people paid attention.

Videos of bone-crushing tackles such as those not only have been repeated constantly on television and YouTube over the years, but also in team meetings as a source of pride and intimidation for coaches and players. This is nothing new.

The difference now is the climate in which the hitting occurs. On Oct. 16, the day before the NFL's convergence of helmet-to-helmet collisions, Rutgers University junior tackle Eric LeGrand was paralyzed from the neck down after attempting a special teams tackle against Army. LeGrand underwent emergency surgery to stabilize his spine. The players prayed. His coach, Greg Schiano had tears in his eyes.

LeGrand was in the news cycle for 24 hours and then … the games went on.

In Week 1 of the NFL season, four players were diagnosed with concussions. Dr. Hunt Batjer, the co-chair of the NFL's Head, Brain and Neck Medical Committee, responded that "four concussions don't make a trend."

Over the first six weeks of the season, the number of concussions has doubled from 2009.

Ironically, during a period of time when the safety of the game is being questioned, the NFL has not responded with sober analysis but has answered by undermining its own rhetoric that it cares about safety. The league recklessly endorsed a plan to increase the number of games in a season from 16 to 18, revealing the true sentiment that has existed in the NFL all along: The players are fungible. They are replaceable, temporary assets, and nothing -- not head trauma, not dementia, not Lou Gehrig's disease and not the declining life expectancy rates of the people who play the game -- will get in the way of making money.

Everyone must take a share of the blame for this. The players, undereducated about the health risks and perennially underserved by their union (largely because of their own disunity over the years), parrot the rhetoric that leads to greater profits but physical demise: We all know the risks we take playing this game.

The press and media continue to profit. A few years ago, ESPN's Sunday NFL coverage included a segment called "Jacked Up," in which the network compiled videotape of the biggest, baddest, bone-rattling hits, while commentators declared in unison, as an example, "Todd Heap, you got JACKED UP!" ESPN has since cancelled the segment.

And the NFL, while fining players for excessive hits, has simultaneously profited for years from the sale and marketing of photos and videos of the same violent collisions, glamorizing the intimidation elements of the game. The NFL has sold DVDs of big hits for years.

Roger Goodell, the NFL commissioner, offers the grave and serious appearance that safety and responsibility are important. But outside of an apology from league spokesman Greg Aiello for a licensed vendor selling photos of the illegal hits that happened on Oct. 17 through the league's own web site, the NFL has taken no concrete action, such as fining itself and announcing a dollar figure to donate to charity as a sign that it has accepted responsibility.

The NFL's problems could be reaching a critical mass. Even numerous professional athletes today, seeing how dangerous football has become, don't want their children playing the sport. During the American League Championship Series, Rangers third baseman Michael Young said he wouldn't let his two boys play football, nor would Yankees' closer Mariano Rivera. Both cited the short-term physical injury potential and the long-term possibility for brain injury.

"No way," Detroit Tigers left fielder Johnny Damon told me, of his son Jackson. Growing up in Florida, Damon was recruited to play football in high school. "The way I look at it this way: If my son has enough talent to play football, he probably has enough talent to play baseball. You get to play longer, and our money is guaranteed."

There is no other American team sport in which the players are as disposable as they are in football. There is no other sport in which star, signature players are discarded faster than NFL running backs are. No sport throws its broken pieces into the garbage like the NFL does.

Troy Vincent, the former Pro Bowl defensive back who served as the president of the Players Association from 2004 to 2008 and joined the league's management labor policy team in February, spoke earlier this month to the University of Southern California football team. Vincent said the right and responsible things to the USC players about staying in school, about avoiding drugs and the off-field quicksand that kills careers and about the importance of receiving a fouryear degree.

When the players expressed their desire to play in the NFL, Vincent revealed the depth of the NFL's knowledge of how disposable the players truly are.

Over the past 20 years, Vincent said, quoting statistics compiled by the NFL, 15,018 athletes have played in the NFL, but 631 of them -- 4 percent -- played three or more seasons. The average NFL career lasts 3.7 seasons, but NFL players do not receive health and pension benefits unless they play four full seasons.

In other words, in a sport that can destroy the body, a sport in which the culture -- at the high school and university levels -- encourages its players to gain excessive, often unhealthy weight to play certain positions, 96 percent of NFL players on average over the last 20 years came and went without any future security from a game that studies show can have devastating long-term effects. No form of false concern or public relations spin -- the NFL's Play 60 anti-obesity campaign stands in direct opposition to the demand from coaches that players gain weight -- can change that reality.

And yet, Goodell and the NFL owners are pushing to increase the length of the season.

There may be no way back to moral legitimacy for the NFL. If the league relies on revenue and ratings to justify its decision to avoid significant safety changes, it sends the message that it has chosen profits over the health of its players. After Robinson waylaid him two Sundays ago, the Eagles' Jackson said the hit felt like "being in a car crash." How long will it be until a player dies on the field from a car-crash hit?

As long as Congress stands by and does nothing, it is tacitly admitting that it is comfortable with the bloody nature of the sport, too. Player after player has said he understands and accepts the risks that come with playing professional football, but that is beside the point. The point is that society historically has intervened to curb other unsafe behavior. Adults, for example, have long known the risks associated with smoking or with not wearing a seatbelt or a motorcycle helmet, but rules and laws were enacted to prevent injuries in those areas, nonetheless.

If the league takes an honorable and ethical approach and acknowledges that serious rule and cultural changes are required in the face of football's increasing violence, the onus will fall on the fan to once and for all come to grips with why he or she watches. Many fans are already suggesting that the hitting -- and not, say, the artistic beauty of a fleet receiver beating a defender on a fly pattern -- is why they watch. Those fans might watch less often if the game slows and players tackle with less violence and recklessness. The NHL once tried to eliminate fighting … until ratings plummeted.

In a nation attracted to violence, the NFL has decisions to make that will reveal its courage -- or its greed.

There may be a suspension of disbelief at work that the sports world won't exist without football as king of all its surveys. Yet an easy historical parallel can be made to boxing, which once reigned over much of the American sports landscape but fell victim to corruption, changing times and its own moral illegitimacy. Thirty years ago (and for much of the 20th century), the heavyweight champion of the world was the most visible, popular person in American sports. Now, boxing -- after, among other things, deaths in the ring and executive malfeasance -- has been discredited by a more affluent, less interested public.

Football runs that risk, the risk that it will come to resemble a grotesque sideshow, no different from, say, pornography. People may still want the game to exist so they can continue to watch it -- as long as their kids aren't the ones participating.

Howard Bryant is a senior writer for ESPN.com.

 
A new scrutiny on the speed of the game and the violence of its collisions makes it unlikely that football will exist in 10 years the way it does today.
Would much rather watch smaller, weaker, slower guys... play absolutely full speed with big hits and no injuries... then watch a dumbed down version of mass monsters, with break neck speed and world class strength play patty cake and grab-###. Set limits to the size+speed+strength=force and you would get rid of much the common variety injuries and issues. Fluke injuries will still happen (as they do in all activities) but we can at least get some great football being played.
 

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