NYC assassination news thread - Please no politics (1 Viewer)

[IvanKaramazov]

I would have hoped this was some sort of fringe thing. Not sure.

Either way, I think Governor Shapiro is right.

I think it is. You should have read what was in the weeds on Twitter when I was there briefly. But I always chalked it up to communists and foreign bots. There were large groups of Western communists that were constantly agitating for killing their enemies. I’m not making that up.

They’re supplemented and complemented by Russian and Chinese bots looking to sow discord in America. I was reading something where China and Russia have spent untold millions (maybe billions) to pay people to be on social media and say stuff like this while posing as Americans. They believe in dispiriting Americans and weakening our country this way. It’s an asymmetrical psychological operation. A psy-op, in short.

You want to know who's not a bot? Former Washington Post reporters who are cheering on this assassination publicly, under their own name. Academics whose institutional affiliations we can all look up online who are posting under their own names. Those are real people, and they punch way above their weight in terms of cultural influence. For every one of those folks, there are 20 who have the good sense to keep their mouths shut. I can walk down the hall in my building right now and show you their offices.

I know it feels reassuring and broad-minded to write these folks off as a weird, unrepresentative fringe, but this has been brewing for 20 years. I don't know how much political violence you need to see until you realize that this is actually a problem. Edit: The "you" here is directed at the general reader, not you personally, @rockaction

 

[IvanKaramazov]

If you think that support for political violence is a fringe position held by only a few weirdos in the fever swamps of social media, perhaps check out this mainstream site.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I think there's part of me that was genuinely surprised by a NY Times facebook post calling the CEO a ""Mass murderer for profit" would get almost 2,000 "likes". Maybe that's just me being dumb and not factoring in that maybe 1,800 of those are bots or something.

But it was notable I thought.

And maybe this is more a wealth inequity thing. We talked about this a while back on the PSF where some popular posters thought it was great or :shrugged: at protestors bringing a Guillotine to Jeff Bezos' home for a protest. https://forums.footballguys.com/thr...ront-of-jeff-bezos-home.786326/#post-22813270

Was interesting too that the less talkative majority thought it was a bad thing.

But maybe folks are right and this is too political.

 

[Max Power]

But maybe folks are right and this is too political.

I think it's more societal. This is where we are as a collective. There are obviously a couple issues at play here and everyone draws lines at different intersections which leads to a lot of the disagreement. If cooler heads prevail there are issues like for profit healthcare and wealth inequality that could be discussed.

I don't think this situation is unique to America. History is filled with inflection points based on radical actions.

 

[rockaction]

I would have hoped this was some sort of fringe thing. Not sure.

Either way, I think Governor Shapiro is right.

I think it is. You should have read what was in the weeds on Twitter when I was there briefly. But I always chalked it up to communists and foreign bots. There were large groups of Western communists that were constantly agitating for killing their enemies. I’m not making that up.

They’re supplemented and complemented by Russian and Chinese bots looking to sow discord in America. I was reading something where China and Russia have spent untold millions (maybe billions) to pay people to be on social media and say stuff like this while posing as Americans. They believe in dispiriting Americans and weakening our country this way. It’s an asymmetrical psychological operation. A psy-op, in short.

You want to know who's not a bot? Former Washington Post reporters who are cheering on this assassination publicly, under their own name. Academics whose institutional affiliations we can all look up online who are posting under their own names. Those are real people, and they punch way above their weight in terms of cultural influence. For every one of those folks, there are 20 who have the good sense to keep their mouths shut. I can walk down the hall in my building right now and show you their offices.

I know it feels reassuring and broad-minded to write these folks off as a weird, unrepresentative fringe, but this has been brewing for 20 years. I don't know how much political violence you need to see until you realize that this is actually a problem.

I think we agree. I’m just talking about Twitter. I think you and I have agreed about the level of political violence that we fear will be accepted, and the future problems we might face. Remember, I’m not sanguine at all about our country’s direction in this respect. And yes, I also know Taylor Lorenz has been having diarrhea of the mouth, but she always does and nobody who knows anything listens to her no matter her credentials.

But that’s not to pooh-pooh what you’re saying. I’m actually sure we agree.

If you think that support for political violence is a fringe position held by only a few weirdos in the fever swamps of social media, perhaps check out this mainstream site.

And you’ll remember my “Can We Disinvite A Communist From A First Amendment Symposium?” thread I took out in response to Good Posting Judge’s Nazi punching thing, which if you read, you’ll also find me there condemning the thread.

We were very much in agreement in that thread and had the same reaction to a lot of the “cool kids” around here back then. I’ve noticed they’ve either come back to the woodwork or been replaced by versions 2.0. I would urge you to go back and read that thread if you think I wasn’t in complete disagreement and unwilling to mix it up with some really bright, self-assured people.

Can I punch Nazis? (spoiler alert: yes)

Do we think the guy that was punched in the video has changed his mind about being a Nazi? I doubt it. The only way to eliminate the problem is to kill Nazis. Can I kill a Nazi? I wouldn't rat you out for it. :shrug: Hell, I'll even give you an alibi, maybe help you get rid of the body...

forums.footballguys.com

Just saying that I think I’m aware of the problem and I’m not being “broad-minded” to the point where my head is in the sand about it. At all. In fact, the posts that were deleted of mine last night and this morning talked about our spiritual rot within media and higher education. You would have been titillated. As it were, the usual crew on the board got sore and the mods deleted what I said. STEADYMOBBIN22 did say that they should “let Michelangelo paint,” which made it all worth it.

 

[El Floppo]

But maybe folks are right and this is too political.

I think it's more societal. This is where we are as a collective. There are obviously a couple issues at play here and everyone draws lines at different intersections which leads to a lot of the disagreement. If cooler heads prevail there are issues like for profit healthcare and wealth inequality that could be discussed.

I don't think this situation is unique to America. History is filled with inflection points based on radical actions.

And Health Insurance is one, maybe THE, area where individuals feel the results directly without regard for their political, religious or any other beliefs.

 

[eoMMan]

So he had $10k in cash on him and his passport…he could have ditched all the evidence on him (gun, fake id from the hostel, his manifesto, etc) and fled the country easily.

Once again, this isn’t about him being dumb. He wanted (wants) the notoriety and fame. I’m sure it’ll hit him that he ruined his life at some point….a life that was set up to be a great one and one of great privilege.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I would have hoped this was some sort of fringe thing. Not sure.

To further what I said before - we’re talking about a little more than 100 reviews slamming McDonalds per the article you shared.

I find in this day and age you read headlines like “Italian Americans outraged over Chris Pratt voicing Super Mario” and when you actually read the article it’s based on a handful of tweets made by people that may or may not be actual Italian Americans - and in any case don’t represent all Italian Americans.

Same here - as we’re looking at a few loonies that took time to slam a McDonalds employee for doing the right thing - and then try to extrapolate it as some phenomenon sweeping across the country - so that we have something to be outraged about as well - when it’s just a few fools posting from their parents basement.

I do think it's a spectrum.

NY Times facebook account had a post linking to their article, "Who was Brian Thompson, CEO of United Healthcare?"

Most popular comment with almost a couple thousand "likes" was:

"Mass murderer for profit"


Yolonda Wilson, an associate professor who teaches a course on “Law and Morality” at St. Louis University, said she was “not rejoicing” but also “I’m not sad about it, either,” she added. “Chickens come home to roost.”

x.com

x.com

Granted, X and Facebook don't speak for the nation. Hopefully those are way on the far end of the spectrum.

“Social media” =/ “American public”.

It represents small but vocal group of people that look to spike outrage.

Most people in the middle don’t feel the need to push an agenda.

I think you know that.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Here's a nice little conversation from 2017. Two posters who used to be regulars here. This post was edited by a moderator, so it is the "acceptable" version of whatever was posted.

Are we still stuck on the "It's not happening" stage?

 

[Dr. Octopus]

As you can see it’s working, as we now get outrage from the “other side”.

 

[eoMMan]

I think there's part of me that was genuinely surprised by a NY Times facebook post calling the CEO a ""Mass murderer for profit" would get almost 2,000 "likes". Maybe that's just me being dumb and not factoring in that maybe 1,800 of those are bots or something.

But it was notable I thought.

And maybe this is more a wealth inequity thing. We talked about this a while back on the PSF where some popular posters thought it was great or :shrugged: at protestors bringing a Guillotine to Jeff Bezos' home for a protest. https://forums.footballguys.com/thr...ront-of-jeff-bezos-home.786326/#post-22813270

Was interesting too that the less talkative majority thought it was a bad thing.

But maybe folks are right and this is too political.

I think the insider trading allegations really angered people too in addition to being the CEO of a health insurance company.

I read something that said all health insurance back in 1970s was non-profit. Can someone confirm?

 

[Joe Bryant]

Most people in the middle don’t feel the need to push an agenda.

I think you know that.

Thanks. I think everyone knows that.

The question I think about is how the spectrum is populated.

 

[Juxtatarot]

I think there's part of me that was genuinely surprised by a NY Times facebook post calling the CEO a ""Mass murderer for profit" would get almost 2,000 "likes". Maybe that's just me being dumb and not factoring in that maybe 1,800 of those are bots or something.

But it was notable I thought.

And maybe this is more a wealth inequity thing. We talked about this a while back on the PSF where some popular posters thought it was great or :shrugged: at protestors bringing a Guillotine to Jeff Bezos' home for a protest. https://forums.footballguys.com/thr...ront-of-jeff-bezos-home.786326/#post-22813270

Was interesting too that the less talkative majority thought it was a bad thing.

But maybe folks are right and this is too political.

When I was a kid, I was always confused about the story of Robin Hood. Why is he a hero? Wasn’t stealing wrong? Why are we ignoring that? The explanation, as I understand it today, is that it was an unjust society without means of the people to correct it. There weren’t other options so his actions were for the greater good.

That’s basically the argument of these online posters. Thousands of Americans are either dying or their lives are financially ruined by an unjust, for-profit healthcare system. They view that politicians won’t fix the problem because of lobbyists, corruption, etc. That makes them, at a minimum, emotionally conflicted.

To be perfectly clear, I don’t agree with that. I still have some hope that we will eventually fix our problems. And we just can’t tolerate people assassinating other people because of society’s shortcomings.

 

[eoMMan]

Also cute how some networks are quick to say people from the left are cheering this guy on. Stop. Why does everything need to quickly go political and be specifically left or right?

 

[IvanKaramazov]

As you can see it’s working, as we now get outrage from the “other side”.

The outrage from the other side is just me bringing receipts. It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand. This stuff was right there, in the open, on this site, seven years ago. I'm linking you to one of those exact posts, a post that was apparently reported and mod-approved.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

As you can see it’s working, as we now get outrage from the “other side”.

The outrage from the other side is just me bringing receipts. It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand. This stuff was right there, in the open, on this site, seven years ago. I'm linking you to one of those exact posts, a post that was apparently reported and mod-approved.

You're not that important (but I like you). I'm speaking generally,

Personally, I don't think you're making the point you think you're making but that's ok....this is a social media site in most respects after-all.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

The question I think about is how the spectrum is populated.

I think I spoke to that.

 

[Mister CIA]

As you can see it’s working, as we now get outrage from the “other side”.

The outrage from the other side is just me bringing receipts. It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand. This stuff was right there, in the open, on this site, seven years ago. I'm linking you to one of those exact posts, a post that was apparently reported and mod-approved.

It's still outrage. Good luck.

 

[rockaction]

Here's a nice little conversation from 2017. Two posters who used to be regulars here. This post was edited by a moderator, so it is the "acceptable" version of whatever was posted.

Are we still stuck on the "It's not happening" stage?

KCitons had problems. Homer J was an alcoholic going through his first steps in sobriety. I’ll bet he’s changed. Or maybe I’m naive. I don’t know. In reading that thread, the guys on the side of punching the Nazi are so self-assured and humorous about our protestations that it was like shooting fish in a barrel if one values the glibly constructed dystopic precedent they seemed to want to set.

It’s actually worse than I remember it. These days, I wouldn’t dare wade into that garbage without a hazmat suit on. I have no idea how drunk I must have been to want some of those people as company.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

 

[beer 30]

With all of the support he has gotten over the last week I am curious what the chances are that he gets a sympathetic jury

I sincerely hope people understand that murder is never right, no matter the circumstance. Regardless of your personal feelings about the man, the company or their policies, the rule of law has to overshadow all of that or society as we know it doesn't work. Kinda separates us from the apes. Well that and opposable thumbs.

 

[Mister CIA]

Here's a nice little conversation from 2017. Two posters who used to be regulars here. This post was edited by a moderator, so it is the "acceptable" version of whatever was posted.

Are we still stuck on the "It's not happening" stage?

KCitons had problems. Homer J was an alcoholic going through his first steps in sobriety. I’ll bet he’s changed. Or maybe I’m naive. I don’t know. In reading that thread, the guys on the side of punching the Nazi are so self-assured and humorous about our protestations that it was like shooting fish in a barrel if one values the glibly constructed dystopic precedent they seemed to want to set.

It’s actually worse than I remember it. These days, I wouldn’t dare wade into that garbage without a hazmat suit on. I have no idea how drunk I must have been to want some of those people as company.

I mean, we're an entire nation raised on movies and stories where we cheer when the bad guys get comeuppance, and I agree that we should be more thoughtful. But now we're fighting over who the bad guys are, by intention.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

With all of the support he has gotten over the last week I am curious what the chances are that he gets a sympathetic jury

I sincerely hope people understand that murder is never right, no matter the circumstance. Regardless of your personal feelings about the man, the company or their policies, the rule of law has to overshadow all of that or society as we know it doesn't work. Kinda separates us from the apes. Well that and opposable thumbs.

Yes - while some may "understand" how someone can be pushed to that point - no one should be happy about seeking justice as a vigilante,

We, as a society, have more ethical ways to fight back - (i.e. litigation or a media blitz exposing the industry).

I'm a bit taken aback by the "empathy MUST = justification" crowd making it so black and white - but the loudmouths cheering for the murderer probably clouds their view a bit.

 

[rockaction]

I do want to say one thing really quickly but preface it by saying that it is just for accuracy’s sake. We went through great pains to justify it, but eventually the only way to establish America was through political violence against an established order (The British) on what would become our land.

I don’t know what good that does to remember right now because it doesn’t speak to comforting thoughts about the rule of law and the steadiness of a non-violent tradition. People have said that a revolution will always yield but more wars in the future inevitably, espcially if the actual principle and underpinning of our revolution is seen as meritorious, and this may be America’s fatal flaw—even more than slavery was. The ride can last for a while, but once bonds are dissolved through violence, some say it never stops.

But now we're fighting over who the bad guys are, by intention.

Hey CIA, I’m not sure who the “we” are and who the “bad guys” you refer to are. Could you be more specific? Explain it like I’m four again. Are you saying that we’re saying the guys on the board are as bad as Nazis? Or that we’re getting too close to that?

I’m just unsure what you’re trying to say because the pronouns have no referent for me to ascertain who the “we” are and who the “bad guys” are.

 

[Max Power]

Also cute how some networks are quick to say people from the left are cheering this guy on. Stop. Why does everything need to quickly go political and be specifically left or right?

It gets the clicks for the Networks.

I listened to Kim Iverson break down the guys social media and book reviews. He doesn't appear to have a "side", so any reporting about his political leanings is propaganda.

 

[belljr]

Now it becomes interesting to me- what happened to this kid. By all accounts that I've read, a "normal" kid without anything in his background to suggest what he did: privileged background, friends, socially active, physically active, intellectually active. Finishing a BA and MA in 4 years is no easy task.

Sounds like that HI shared living spot is the place that recommended the Kusyinski book as a lark, and from what they say the kid didn't have any extreme views about it or health care. I wonder if that journey started with a somewhat adventurous move into that HI spot? Not blaming them at all, but wondering if something in Luigi's life started pushing him away from "normal". Because he then went socially silent in the last months... What causes that and his terrible actions last week?

what is HI?

 

[rockaction]

Now it becomes interesting to me- what happened to this kid. By all accounts that I've read, a "normal" kid without anything in his background to suggest what he did: privileged background, friends, socially active, physically active, intellectually active. Finishing a BA and MA in 4 years is no easy task.

Sounds like that HI shared living spot is the place that recommended the Kusyinski book as a lark, and from what they say the kid didn't have any extreme views about it or health care. I wonder if that journey started with a somewhat adventurous move into that HI spot? Not blaming them at all, but wondering if something in Luigi's life started pushing him away from "normal". Because he then went socially silent in the last months... What causes that and his terrible actions last week?

what is HI?

Hawaii. It’s the two-letter postal code.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

 

[beer 30]

So he had $10k in cash on him and his passport…he could have ditched all the evidence on him (gun, fake id from the hostel, his manifesto, etc) and fled the country easily.

Once again, this isn’t about him being dumb. He wanted (wants) the notoriety and fame. I’m sure it’ll hit him that he ruined his life at some point….a life that was set up to be a great one and one of great privilege.

$8k USD, $2k foreign currency and claimed he didn't know where it came from and it was planted on him after his arrest. Use of the term patsy was bandied about

 

[Mister CIA]

I do want to say one thing really quickly but preface it by saying that it is just for accuracy’s sake. We went through great pains to justify it, but eventually the only way to establish America was through political violence against an established order (The British) on what would become our land.

I don’t know what good that does to remember right now because it doesn’t speak to comforting thoughts about the rule of law and the steadiness of a non-violent tradition. People have said that a revolution will always yield but more wars in the future inevitably, espcially if the actual principle and underpinning of our revolution is seen as meritorious, and this may be America’s fatal flaw—even more than slavery was. The ride can last for a while, but once bonds are dissolved through violence, some say it never stops.

But now we're fighting over who the bad guys are, by intention.

Hey CIA, I’m not sure who the “we” are and who the “bad guys” you refer to are. Could you be more specific? Explain it like I’m four again. Are you saying that we’re saying the guys on the board are as bad as Nazis? Or that we’re getting too close to that?

I’m just unsure what you’re trying to say because the pronouns have no referent for me to ascertain who the “we” are and who the “bad guys” are.

You identified them specifically by name just a few posts back. Russian and Chinese governments would love to see us fail - and I have a sneaking suspicion that Crypto bros are part and parcel to the overall shenanigans. Obviously there is more to say, but this is not the place, and I'm definitley not the person.

 

[belljr]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

You are a Nazi? Why would someone want to shoot you?

 

[IvanKaramazov]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

You are a Nazi? Why would someone want to shoot you?

Brian Thompson wasn't a Nazi either, in the way that you or I would understand the term.

Once you realize that "Nazi" now means "anyone to the right of Kamala Harris," you are much closer to getting it.

 

[thecatch]

I think we agree. I’m just talking about Twitter. I think you and I have agreed about the level of political violence that we fear will be accepted, and the future problems we might face. Remember, I’m not sanguine at all about our country’s direction in this respect. And yes, I also know Taylor Lorenz has been having diarrhea of the mouth, but she always does and nobody who knows anything listens to her no matter her credentials.

Lorenz has hundreds of thousands of followers and is on mainstream media constantly. I've long thought she was, um, underqualified to opine on things but her statements and the support she's getting for her recent statements is just horrifying.

 

[TheAristocrat]

Wow. I figured this thread would be locked, deleted, or severely pruned this morning.

 

[3C's]

Wow. I figured this thread would be locked, deleted, or severely pruned this morning.

At least one post was, probably should be more but the end result due to a couple of smarmy windbags is it'll be locked.

 

[rockaction]

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back . . . work on my campus

I don’t think I’ll ever be able to articulate how ****ed up elite schools make these kids. I mean, I never had a great work ethic. I’ll be honest about that. But my God, I dropped out of society starting at about twenty-six or seven after having gone to a progressive boarding school, an elite university, and working for a big think tank in D.C. This isn’t going to end very well for us, I fear. I swear I hope I’m wrong. I made a reverse Pascal’s wager (thread synergy!) with my life.

Lorenz has hundreds of thousands of followers and is on mainstream media constantly. I've long thought she was, um, underqualified to opine on things but her statements and the support she's getting for her recent statements is just horrifying.

Has anybody read the political section of Teen Vogue lately? I’m not kidding when I ask that. I mean, have you read it? It’s stunning. I’ll leave it at that.

 

[belljr]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

You are a Nazi? Why would someone want to shoot you?

Brian Thompson wasn't a Nazi either, in the way that you or I would understand the term.

Once you realize that "Nazi" now means "anyone to the right of Kamala Harris," you are much closer to getting it.

I have no idea who that is. I'll go put my head back in the sand apparently

 

[Joe Schmo]

So I don't have to infect myself too badly, can someone kindly give me a short bio on Taylor Lorenz? Could look it up but dont want to have to wade through subjective stuff on the webs if possible.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Wow. I figured this thread would be locked, deleted, or severely pruned this morning.

It's been pretty civilized and Joe has been in the middle of it.

 

[rockaction]

At least one post was, probably should be more but the end result due to a couple of smarmy windbags is it'll be locked.

Old guard sounds like he wants to punch a Nazi too! Go on, old guard! Make it rain, baby!

 

[Dr. Octopus]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

You are a Nazi? Why would someone want to shoot you?

Brian Thompson wasn't a Nazi either, in the way that you or I would understand the term.

Once you realize that "Nazi" now means "anyone to the right of Kamala Harris," you are much closer to getting it.

I have no idea who that is. I'll go put my head back in the sand apparently

He's the entire basis of this thread.

 

[rockaction]

So I don't have to infect myself too badly, can someone kindly give me a short bio on Taylor Lorenz? Could look it up but dont want to have to wade through subjective stuff on the webs if possible.

Ultra-left Millennial WaPo writer that is a walking caricature of what one would think would be an ultra-left WaPo writer. Think Bernadette Dohrn meets Teen Vogue. Think crying on the job mixed with a sexual harassment suit against you for complimenting her shirt while she goes to HR talking about equal pay.

 

[belljr]

I think I feel better that I don't know who any of these people are you guys are all speaking about

Back to my independent bubble of bliss and no social media and politics

 

[belljr]

It feels like half this forum is instigators and the other half has its head in the sand.

I'm not looking to pick a fight here, I respect much of what you say on here, but this seems a bit hypocritical.

You're basically saying that you either agree with my views on a position, or else you're either just trying to get a rise out of people or you're ignorant,

This is basically right, but I would put it a little differently. I think a lot of people are in denial about what has been happening in this country over the past decade or so. "Ignorant" comes close to capturing what I'm saying, but it's not quite right. I think people understand, on some level, that that is not how things are supposed to be, but nobody wants to acknowledge it because there's no easy fix.

The people who want to shoot folks like you and me in the back are not weirdos living in their parents' basement. They work on my campus, they write the newspaper articles I read, and they post in this forum with the rest of us. I don't need any more data points for this hypothesis. This dynamic has played out exactly the way that I predicted it would. Again, the receipts are right there. I can't force anybody to look at them, but i know they're there.

You are a Nazi? Why would someone want to shoot you?

Brian Thompson wasn't a Nazi either, in the way that you or I would understand the term.

Once you realize that "Nazi" now means "anyone to the right of Kamala Harris," you are much closer to getting it.

I have no idea who that is. I'll go put my head back in the sand apparently

He's the entire basis of this thread.

Lol had no idea that was his name

 

[Andy Dufresne]

IMO...

A lot of our nation's shouting at each other is a result of trying to make sense of nonsense.

Why did "that person" on "your side" do that? Because that's what "your side" believes of course!

Why did that mass shooter kill all those people? Because you gun nuts love guns of course!

Why did this anti-capitalist shoot that CEO in the back? Because you lefties hate business of course!

But the "of course" part is just not true. Any societal subset will have it's fringes and, worse, lunatics. They leave the reasonable among the masses holding the bag and having to answer for their extreme and anti-social behavior.

But again, that's just attempting to make sense of nonsense. Let's call it like it is here - murdering a businessperson in broad daylight is crazy, antisocial, and abnormal behavior. And just because there are avenues (i.e. social media) available to those like-minded to voice their support doesn't necessarily mean that it's now being accepted as "normal".

This person is deranged and the proof is in the actions. He may have had a privileged upbringing and been provided an Ivy League education and advantage - but that doesn't preclude mental illness. I had a cousin that fits this description; he grew up with wealth and was very intelligent and fun. He also, unfortunately, had mental illness that resulted in institutionalization and ultimately suicide. How could he do that given all the advantages he had? Don't try to make sense of nonsense.

Personally, would I like to see the rhetoric tuned down and the decorum turned up in our society? You better believe it. But I'm not going to make blanket value judgements on the "other side" just because of the actions of their lunatic fringe.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Hey All, I just found this thread...had no idea this section of the site existed. Not looking to have philosophical debates, but I am more than happy to provide facts/context where I can. I am extremely close to this case in numerous ways.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I think there's part of me that was genuinely surprised by a NY Times facebook post calling the CEO a ""Mass murderer for profit" would get almost 2,000 "likes". Maybe that's just me being dumb and not factoring in that maybe 1,800 of those are bots or something.

Even if all 2,000 likes are legitimate - how does that number compare to the U.S. Population or even just the entire Facebook population?

It may seem like a big number, but's its still a fringe of the general population.

We spend way too much time giving the fringe what they want: Attention.

 

[El Floppo]

College, so called elite or otherwise, have always bred idealistic extremism.

I'd like to see specific data that supports anything different than what's always been happening there.

Social media and hot take media has certainly made these views more apparent and intentionally polarizing, but other than all the endless pontificating, I'd like to see in what ways these things have specifically changed. A kid coming unhinged and killing somebody... That's new? That's a sign of the elite apocalypse?

 

[Joe Schmo]

Honestly, I thought corporate boards, law firms and legislatures were the eventual landing spots for the elite university types, lots of conservative Biffs and Buffies.

 

[GoBirds]

Hey All, I just found this thread...had no idea this section of the site existed. Not looking to have philosophical debates, but I am more than happy to provide facts/context where I can. I am extremely close to this case in numerous ways.

Let’s hear it.