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***Official 2018 Baltimore Orioles Thread*** Pitching Can’t Get Any Worse (4 Viewers)

Here is a shocker: the Orioles demoted Miguel Gonzalez so they could activate Ubaldo Jimenez. Gonzalez has a 2.43 ERA since the beginning of July, when we was finally right after being on the DL. Wow.
Man, I hope Gonzales doesn't get too shook up over these incidents of being sent down. I don't pretend to understand the rules of all of this. How many more times can he e sent down without someone else claiming him?

That said, Jimenez was fine. Delmon Young has been Buck's stealth weapon this season.
The option process is very complicated. But everything in baseball is.

I think minor leaguers have 3 options, but they are good for the full year. So someone like Preston Guillmet can be called up and sent down as many times as they want, and it counts as using one option.

I don't think Gonzales has used many of his options, so he could probably yo-yo next year too.

 
Here is a shocker: the Orioles demoted Miguel Gonzalez so they could activate Ubaldo Jimenez. Gonzalez has a 2.43 ERA since the beginning of July, when we was finally right after being on the DL. Wow.
Man, I hope Gonzales doesn't get too shook up over these incidents of being sent down. I don't pretend to understand the rules of all of this. How many more times can he e sent down without someone else claiming him?
Gonzo said he's fine with it, just like Gausman was. These guys know it's a numbers game right now - he'll only miss 1 start, most likely. They have to be in the minors for 10 days, so he'll make one start down there and make his following start back in the bigs. Above poster is right - once you exercise a minor league option on a guy, it's good for the whole year. Earlier this season, Buck said it was rare for a team to have 4 starting pitchers with options, which is another reason they can run this Norfolk shuttle routine.

I would love to see some advanced stats on Jimenez -- I feel like I've never seen a pitcher get a hitter in an 0-2 or 1-2 count and then nibble and walk a guy as much as he does. He really seems to get too fine once a hitter gets 2 strikes and it invariably comes back to bite him. Can't tell you how many times I've seen a 1-2 count followed by two breaking balls in the dirt and then a 3-2 walk.

Hardy still out tonight with a sprained thumb - so Flaherty's at SS. And Davis is on the bench for Pearce. Hardy and Davis teamed for 78 HRs last year, but have only 26 this year. Still better than Flaherty and Pearce, though, who have combined for 16 HRs this year. So I'll go ahead and predict a Flaherty round-tripper tonight.

 
Would be nice to get some sweeps, but taking 2 out of 3 isn't so bad.
Sweeps are really hard to do.

In the past, Buck has actually said the goal is to win series. I think they have won 7 series in a row, counting the 1 makeup game as a series sweep. Last series they lost was to Oakland right after the All Star break ended.

 
God, that looked really bad. Please give updates on Machado if anyone hears. ####.
Yep, right at the end, it looked like there was some sirt of "pop" with the knee. I don't know how to explain it, but you know what I mean. The whole joint just sort of jumped, like something broke loose.

 
CRUUUUUUUZZZZZZ.

Big. Need some momentum here with the injury cloud. Hope it's just a sprain.

Nice to have the O's on local TV, even with one of the worst announcing teams in professional sports.

 
X-rays looked promising last night according to the orioles and there is a MRI scheduled for today at 10am.

Trip tot he 15 day DL is almost a certainty, even if it's a sprain.

So, would we rather have Davis at 3rd and Pearce at 1st or Davis at 1st and Flaherty at 3rd?

 
Very concerned about Manny. I think once in the minors, he was running the bases, something happened, and he needed to be carried off the field. If so, this is the 3rd time. Ouch.

If Pearce is not hitting, they will probably put Davis at 1st and Flaherty at 3rd. If Hardy is still out, the left side of infield looks a lot weaker defensively. Of course, we saw it earlier this year.

I am guessing Manny goes on the DL if he can't play for a week or more. They need the roster spot badly if Hardy needs more days to recover.

 
Dear Baby Jeebus,

Please reach down your magic healing power to Camden Yards and touch the knees of your chosen one, Emmanuel Machado, making sure they shall no more buckle nor tremble nor give way forever and ever.

Amen.

P.S. Thank you for the rainout to give this battered crew a well-deserved day of rest. And for the 6-game lead.

 
Dear Baby Jeebus,

Please reach down your magic healing power to Camden Yards and touch the knees of your chosen one, Emmanuel Machado, making sure they shall no more buckle nor tremble nor give way forever and ever.

Amen.

P.S. Thank you for the rainout to give this battered crew a well-deserved day of rest. And for the 6-game lead.
I second the motion. Amen!
 
Dear Baby Jeebus,

Please reach down your magic healing power to Camden Yards and touch the knees of your chosen one, Emmanuel Machado, making sure they shall no more buckle nor tremble nor give way forever and ever.

Amen.

P.S. Thank you for the rainout to give this battered crew a well-deserved day of rest. And for the 6-game lead.
I second the motion. Amen!
As a secular Jew, I pray to Einstein and whomever controls hollywood, if that helps.

 
Sounds like we may have dodged a bullet with it being a mild / moderate ligament sprain. Hopefully it won't go beyond the 15 day DL.

 
Baseballprosectus.com has the Orioles chances of winning the division at 86.5%, wildcard at 5.2%, playoff chances at 91.7%. They are finally getting some respect.

Having a 6.5 game lead on Toronto and 7 game lead on the Evil Empire is pretty sizable. Of course, it's not big enough when you are in first.

 
Baseballprosectus.com has the Orioles chances of winning the division at 86.5%, wildcard at 5.2%, playoff chances at 91.7%. They are finally getting some respect.

Having a 6.5 game lead on Toronto and 7 game lead on the Evil Empire is pretty sizable. Of course, it's not big enough when you are in first.
It has nothing to do with respect. It has to do with the lead they have

 
The nicest part is that the O's are 7 up on NY in the loss column, and 8 on the Jays.

Baltimore is now 68-50. If they just go .500, they finish 90-72.

To tie them, NY would have to go 29-15. Toronto would have to go 27-14.

And right now Baltimore is playing at a much better than .500 clip - they're on pace to win 93 games.

I guess another way of putting it is ... Magic Number!

To win East over NY: 38

To win East over TOR: 37

 
Ain't the beer icy F'ing cold!

No dumb ### crackers complaining about AJ swinging at the first pitch too much right now.

8 straight series wins. Magic # vs. Yankees is 36. Let's go Mariners

 
As an out of towner, a nice additional benefit to the recent up years, especially this season, is the increased coverage and more on air games to watch. So good to have relevance. i wear my ol' joke bird hat with pride.

 
Magic Number to win East over NY: 36

To win East over TOR: 35

Only 3.5 behind Oakland for best record in baseball.

So help me, I'm already beginning to think about playoff match-ups. Still feel like I would prefer to play KC, with OAK getting the winner of the LA-DET-SEA Wild Card pile. But I don't really know that much about KC and the way they keep winning has me starting to rethink that scenario.

 
They stole a win last night with the rainout. That's the kind of break you need to win pennants. The last 2 weeks have been about as sweet as it gets - 4-game sweep at home of Texas, then going 2-1 in three consecutive series vs. Boston, Washington and the Yankees. Nice 10-3 stretch to end the first half.

Glad they built a little buffer, because it gets real tough now. 10-game West Coast swing vs. Oakland, LA and Seattle kicks off a string of 26 straight games vs. teams over .500.
17-8 during that stretch (with 1 rainout). Uh, that's pretty good.

Now starting 26-game stretch vs. teams at .500 or below (so they'll probably go 11-15).

I have to say, I don't think I've enjoyed a month of baseball this much since maybe the 1989 Why Not? season. I wasn't living in town for 96-97, so I can't really compare. But even more than '89, this reminds me of late 70s and early 80s Orioles baseball - where you just expected them to win pretty much every night.

 
Missed most of the game. Needless to say it was pretty boring to watch online with us being down 2-1 most of the game. Got home for the ninth just to get me nervous, but rewarding for sure.

 
They stole a win last night with the rainout. That's the kind of break you need to win pennants. The last 2 weeks have been about as sweet as it gets - 4-game sweep at home of Texas, then going 2-1 in three consecutive series vs. Boston, Washington and the Yankees. Nice 10-3 stretch to end the first half.

Glad they built a little buffer, because it gets real tough now. 10-game West Coast swing vs. Oakland, LA and Seattle kicks off a string of 26 straight games vs. teams over .500.
17-8 during that stretch (with 1 rainout). Uh, that's pretty good.

Now starting 26-game stretch vs. teams at .500 or below (so they'll probably go 11-15).

I have to say, I don't think I've enjoyed a month of baseball this much since maybe the 1989 Why Not? season. I wasn't living in town for 96-97, so I can't really compare. But even more than '89, this reminds me of late 70s and early 80s Orioles baseball - where you just expected them to win pretty much every night.
It's closer to this than any other era, I think.

The biggest difference is that the starting pitchers on those 70s/80s teams were more established as "really good" (& were mostly just better). Palmer (when he wasn't putting himself on the DL), Flanny, & Stone all were CY winners. MacGregor & Martinez were top-flight #2s. Then there were the kids like Boddicker & Storm Davis. Orioles fans thought the stream of incoming, good pitchers would never end but the spigot shut off after the '83 season.

The late 60s/early 70s Orioles were littered with studs (HOFers, MVPs, CYs, and All Stars all over the place).

The 96/97 bunch were basically rentals (though I enjoyed the run).

1989 was just completely out of nowhere and disappeared just as fast, but that WAS a fun season.

 
Adam Kilgore of the Washington Post writes about the latest on the Nationals' rights fee dispute with MASN. Even though he is a Nats beat writer, his articles has pretty clearly laid out the Orioles side of the dispute.

Here is the link to the article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/nationals/orioles-nationals-baseball-to-file-arguments-concerning-injunction-in-masn-dispute/2014/08/13/1aa8aeaa-2303-11e4-8593-da634b334390_story.html

The article has quotes from a MASN executive, Haley, who quotes the contract:

In the original agreement between the Nationals and Orioles, Haley writes, the contract “mandates setting every five years the telecast rights fees for the subsequent five years pursuant to [the revenue sharing committee’s] ‘established methodology for evaluating the fair market value of all other related party telecast agreements in the industry.’ ”
MASN further claims they used the same firm the created the "established methodology" and has done all the previous valuations for years. I think I read elsewhere that this model was created for MLB 15 or 20 years ago.

 
Nats response to the dispute is in the Post today: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/wp/2014/08/14/orioles-owe-nationals-55-million-60-million-in-fees-from-masn-mlb-panel-ruled/\

Highlights are:

1. Arbitration panel ruled that $55M to $60M for rights fees. Nats says this is much closer to MASN figure than Nats figure.

2. Arbitration should be binding per the contract.

3. Nats also called the Orioles’ claimed victimhood “verges on the nonsensical.”

No mention from the Nats on the method for calculating the rights fees.

 
Nats response to the dispute is in the Post today: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/wp/2014/08/14/orioles-owe-nationals-55-million-60-million-in-fees-from-masn-mlb-panel-ruled/\

Highlights are:

1. Arbitration panel ruled that $55M to $60M for rights fees. Nats says this is much closer to MASN figure than Nats figure.

2. Arbitration should be binding per the contract.

3. Nats also called the Orioles claimed victimhood verges on the nonsensical.

No mention from the Nats on the method for calculating the rights fees.
#### the Nats. Only a matter of time before they go the way of the Senators from a City with no soul.

 
Nats response to the dispute is in the Post today: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/nationals-journal/wp/2014/08/14/orioles-owe-nationals-55-million-60-million-in-fees-from-masn-mlb-panel-ruled/\

Highlights are:

1. Arbitration panel ruled that $55M to $60M for rights fees. Nats says this is much closer to MASN figure than Nats figure.

2. Arbitration should be binding per the contract.

3. Nats also called the Orioles claimed victimhood verges on the nonsensical.

No mention from the Nats on the method for calculating the rights fees.
#### the Nats. Only a matter of time before they go the way of the Senators from a City with no soul.
The Orioles have made some pretty big charges in their case (i.e. Selig promised prospective buyers the lower rights fees were temporary).

The Orioles may end up in a position like the Redskins on the salary cap penalty: if the league really wants to screw them over, they have the power to do it.

 
Jesus - that Cleveland dude was nails last night. I see what all of the raves are about now.

Chen pitched maybe his best game ever for the Orioles.

Big bounce-back tonight.

 
Wow, kind of a crappy weekend and yet the lead remains at 7 games.

Magic # vs NY - 34

Magic # vs TOR - 32

Also, Ubaldo definitively pitched his way out of the rotation, which is good news (for the rest of this season).

 
Wow, kind of a crappy weekend and yet the lead remains at 7 games.

Magic # vs NY - 34

Magic # vs TOR - 32

Also, Ubaldo definitively pitched his way out of the rotation, which is good news (for the rest of this season).
Wow, kind of a crappy weekend and yet the lead remains at 7 games.

Magic # vs NY - 34

Magic # vs TOR - 32

Also, Ubaldo definitively pitched his way out of the rotation, which is good news (for the rest of this season).
What to do with Jimenez is tricky. They are committed to him for another 3+ years at $12.5M per year. He can't be sent to the minors. And I don't think he has pitched much in relief.

I think he gets another chance. But come September and expanded rosters, he could be riding the bench and not seeing much playing time at all.

 
Here is a pretty good write up on the MASN/Nats dispute:

http://www.camdenchat.com/2014/8/15/6004095/orioles-nationals-masn-dispute-arbitration-rights-fees-court-case

Here is one interesting thought:

This brings to mind the old saying about the law, "If you have the facts on your side, pound the facts. If you have the law on your side, pound the law. If you have neither on your side, pound the table."
The Orioles are pounding the facts and that the Revenue Sharing Definitions Committee (RSDC) of MLB did not follow the established methodology.

The Nationals are pounding the law, stating that the arbitration is binding, even if a serious error has been made:

In their own filing, the Nationals, among other things, offer this statement: "As the U.S. Supreme Court has instructed in applying the Federal Arbitration Act ... 'It is not enough for petitioners to show that the panel committed an error - or even a serious error.'"
And the Orioles are countering that the arbitration panel was not fair, loaded with people who would benefit from higher rights fees and worked to a predetermined outcome.

Obviously the Orioles are in a position to get screwed here. But it's not clear if the legal system will help them at this point. If the injunction against the Nats and MLB to move against the Orioles is upheld, it will give the Orioles position more weight in they continue to negotiate. If the injunction is dropped, the Orioles will most likely lose.

 
Here is a pretty good write up on the MASN/Nats dispute:

http://www.camdenchat.com/2014/8/15/6004095/orioles-nationals-masn-dispute-arbitration-rights-fees-court-case

Here is one interesting thought:

This brings to mind the old saying about the law, "If you have the facts on your side, pound the facts. If you have the law on your side, pound the law. If you have neither on your side, pound the table."
The Orioles are pounding the facts and that the Revenue Sharing Definitions Committee (RSDC) of MLB did not follow the established methodology.

The Nationals are pounding the law, stating that the arbitration is binding, even if a serious error has been made:

In their own filing, the Nationals, among other things, offer this statement: "As the U.S. Supreme Court has instructed in applying the Federal Arbitration Act ... 'It is not enough for petitioners to show that the panel committed an error - or even a serious error.'"
And the Orioles are countering that the arbitration panel was not fair, loaded with people who would benefit from higher rights fees and worked to a predetermined outcome.

Obviously the Orioles are in a position to get screwed here. But it's not clear if the legal system will help them at this point. If the injunction against the Nats and MLB to move against the Orioles is upheld, it will give the Orioles position more weight in they continue to negotiate. If the injunction is dropped, the Orioles will most likely lose.
"Get screwed" is an interesting way to describe the Orioles' potential loss here. I'd say it's more like they'd be forced to remove the pinky finger of the fist that they currently have jammed up the Nationals' rear end.

 
Here's another dirty little secret about the MASN dispute. The agreement calls for the Orioles to receive the same amount of rights $ as the Nationals get.

Angelos doesn't want that the National to get more money - because he doesn't want the Orioles to get that much money. He'd rather that $ stay with MASN so that it can go directly into his back pocket.

He is literally fighting to keep the Orioles from getting more money. Because more money for the Orioles is less money for him. Nice conflict of interest, huh?

 
Great job by Norris and by Markakis with the game-saving catch. But don't overlook the huge 3 RBI hit by Schoop when the game was in the balance

 
Here is a pretty good write up on the MASN/Nats dispute:

http://www.camdenchat.com/2014/8/15/6004095/orioles-nationals-masn-dispute-arbitration-rights-fees-court-case

Here is one interesting thought:

This brings to mind the old saying about the law, "If you have the facts on your side, pound the facts. If you have the law on your side, pound the law. If you have neither on your side, pound the table."
The Orioles are pounding the facts and that the Revenue Sharing Definitions Committee (RSDC) of MLB did not follow the established methodology.

The Nationals are pounding the law, stating that the arbitration is binding, even if a serious error has been made:

In their own filing, the Nationals, among other things, offer this statement: "As the U.S. Supreme Court has instructed in applying the Federal Arbitration Act ... 'It is not enough for petitioners to show that the panel committed an error - or even a serious error.'"
And the Orioles are countering that the arbitration panel was not fair, loaded with people who would benefit from higher rights fees and worked to a predetermined outcome.

Obviously the Orioles are in a position to get screwed here. But it's not clear if the legal system will help them at this point. If the injunction against the Nats and MLB to move against the Orioles is upheld, it will give the Orioles position more weight in they continue to negotiate. If the injunction is dropped, the Orioles will most likely lose.
"Get screwed" is an interesting way to describe the Orioles' potential loss here. I'd say it's more like they'd be forced to remove the pinky finger of the fist that they currently have jammed up the Nationals' rear end.
I personally believe that contracts are meant to be followed. The Orioles have a contract with the methodology for calculating the rights fees. The Nats don't want to follow the contract. MLB set up arbitration where they all agreed to not follow the contract (would that be collusion). That is why I call the Orioles getting screwed.

If the Lerners thought the deal was so unfair, they should have never signed it. Or paid less to MLB for the Nationals to reflect the unfavorable terms on the agreement.

 
Here's another dirty little secret about the MASN dispute. The agreement calls for the Orioles to receive the same amount of rights $ as the Nationals get.

Angelos doesn't want that the National to get more money - because he doesn't want the Orioles to get that much money. He'd rather that $ stay with MASN so that it can go directly into his back pocket.

He is literally fighting to keep the Orioles from getting more money. Because more money for the Orioles is less money for him. Nice conflict of interest, huh?
It is not a secret and the motivation is monetary, not for Angelos to screw the Orioles.

Right now, MASN profits are split 85% for the Orioles, 15% for the Nats. The Nats' share grows 1% per year until they hit 33%.

If they are squabbling over $20 M in rights fees for the Nats, there is another $20 M for the Orioles on the table. So that is $40 M that MASN is holding from the teams. Based on the split, the Orioles get $34M and the Nats get $6M. That Is the current operating state, or what the Orioles want.

The broadcast rights are subject to MLB revenue sharing, so MLB gets 31% of them. So if both teams get $20 M in rights fees, the Orioles get $13.8M in additional rights fees, the Nats get $13.8M in additional rights fees, and MLB gets $12.4M from the rights fees. The Rays and the Pirates were both on the arbitration panel and benefit greatly from revenue sharing, would get a good slice of the $12.4M. So they both have a conflict of interest being on the arbitration panel.

But the bottom line: Orioles incremental revenues goes from $34M to $13.8M, down $20.2M. Nats revenues go form $6M to $13.8M. And small market teams get an additional $12.4M.

 
Yeah, Tillman was great tonight. His curve was as good as it gets, reminded me of Otter's stuff, and he and Hundley worked a great plan against the whole White Sox lineup. Made Dunn look foolish every at bat while the rest of the team didn't seem to care to figure Tillman out. Abreu was the lone exception and Tillman/Hundley learned from the early home run and just pitched around him for the most part.

 
Tillman was dominant. After giving up homer on early change-up he put it away and dominated with curve and fastball.

Magic#=31.

Second place Yankees now closer to last than first, 8.5 games back

 
Saw this posted on my dad's facebook page (in between his billion uber liberal rantings)... thought I'd share.

Letter to the Baltimore Sun

"O's Are a Class Act"

am a Cardinal season ticket holder and also attend many Cardinal road games. My wife, three sons, and I took in all three Cardinals vs. Orioles games this month at Camden Yards, and of all of the stadiums we have been to over the years, the Orioles fans were easily the nicest.

Of course, we were wearing Cardinal gear, but no one even teased us during two lopsided Orioles victories. We had pleasant conversations with several groups of Orioles fans seated near us over the weekend. I just want to congratulate all of the classy Orioles fans. Thanks for making us feel welcome.

Chuck Isaak, Chesterfield, Mo.

Read more: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/readersrespond/bs-ed-friendly-fans-20140820,0,7950600.story#ixzz3AxWzgB7M
 
Saw this posted on my dad's facebook page (in between his billion uber liberal rantings)... thought I'd share.

Letter to the Baltimore Sun

"O's Are a Class Act"

am a Cardinal season ticket holder and also attend many Cardinal road games. My wife, three sons, and I took in all three Cardinals vs. Orioles games this month at Camden Yards, and of all of the stadiums we have been to over the years, the Orioles fans were easily the nicest.

Of course, we were wearing Cardinal gear, but no one even teased us during two lopsided Orioles victories. We had pleasant conversations with several groups of Orioles fans seated near us over the weekend. I just want to congratulate all of the classy Orioles fans. Thanks for making us feel welcome.

Chuck Isaak, Chesterfield, Mo.

Read more: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/readersrespond/bs-ed-friendly-fans-20140820,0,7950600.story#ixzz3AxWzgB7M
I've been to literally hundreds of Orioles games and I can confidently state that this letter .... doesn't sound like the author was actually at Camden Yards.

 
The_Man said:
Koya said:
Saw this posted on my dad's facebook page (in between his billion uber liberal rantings)... thought I'd share.

Letter to the Baltimore Sun

"O's Are a Class Act"

am a Cardinal season ticket holder and also attend many Cardinal road games. My wife, three sons, and I took in all three Cardinals vs. Orioles games this month at Camden Yards, and of all of the stadiums we have been to over the years, the Orioles fans were easily the nicest.

Of course, we were wearing Cardinal gear, but no one even teased us during two lopsided Orioles victories. We had pleasant conversations with several groups of Orioles fans seated near us over the weekend. I just want to congratulate all of the classy Orioles fans. Thanks for making us feel welcome.

Chuck Isaak, Chesterfield, Mo.

Read more: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/readersrespond/bs-ed-friendly-fans-20140820,0,7950600.story#ixzz3AxWzgB7M
I've been to literally hundreds of Orioles games and I can confidently state that this letter .... doesn't sound like the author was actually at Camden Yards.
I've never really seen much attitude at an O's game, quite the opposite. Unlike at Yankee Stadium

 

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