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*****Official Baltimore Ravens Thread***** (1 Viewer)

Wait. . . we unloaded Gino and we got to move up draft spots? double win. that's some Moneyball, Jerry West type, Jedi mind trick on Elway.

 
Schaub signing was good. Solid backup.

I can't wait to see how we approach the draft with 10 picks. I think when we've let the draft come to us, Ozzie is the master. When we move around, it usually results in duds like Pierce and Gino.

Obvious holes or areas of improvement (not in any particular order)

RB

WR

TE

CB

interior o-line depth

OLB

It's really hard not envisioning our first rounder being an offensive skill position pick.

 
So, how do we think the Ravens have done so far in the draft? I'm the furthest thing from a drank wonk, but I like what I've read on these guys so far. Of course, sometimes I think Baltimore gets high grades on their picks just based on the FO's reputation - "Ozzie took him, so he must be good. B+!".

 
The lack of a sure fire corner has me a bit nervous. Plus the lack of a safety. I am also not sold on Perriman.

I did love the TE pick in the 2nd round however.

 
Also not sold on Perriman. Hoping Marlon Brown really puts it together this season and surprises. Wish they had traded back and taken the Ohio State WR.

Reading PFF's stuff, this was a terrible draft for corners. That 2 CB run right in front of us in the 3rd? 4th? was tough because I did like Shaw and the other corner. I think they did well in addressing every other hole while still getting a lot of BPA value.

Can't ask for more than that.

 
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I'm still in baseball mode for the most part, so I haven't paid much attention to camp reports. Anything interesting stand out so far?

 
Echo....echo.....

Ugly-assed game last week and they still almost stole it. The defense was magnificent, IMO.

Losing Suggs hurts, but that's probably the one position that's easiest for the Ravens to replace. I'm guessing Dumervil slides to Suggs' spot and Upshaw starts on the strong side.

They obviously need to win today and I think they do.

 
Well, 0-3 is U-G-L-Y. No sugar coating that.

Big Ben out is pretty much a godsend AT Pittsburgh but you know that'll be a hard fought game regardless.

Next 8 games look really nice with Browns, 49ers, CARDINALS, Chargers, Jags, Rams, Browns, Dolphins.

If we can continue the good karma, Palmer is down by week 7 rendering Arizona mortal.

Get Perriman in the lineup and Forsett going, weirder things have happened.

 
lsutigers said:
Well, 0-3 is U-G-L-Y. No sugar coating that.

Big Ben out is pretty much a godsend AT Pittsburgh but you know that'll be a hard fought game regardless.

Next 8 games look really nice with Browns, 49ers, CARDINALS, Chargers, Jags, Rams, Browns, Dolphins.

If we can continue the good karma, Palmer is down by week 7 rendering Arizona mortal.

Get Perriman in the lineup and Forsett going, weirder things have happened.
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Well, a W's a W. God bless Tucker. Forsett had some decent runs. Perriman's setback is very disappointing for the stretch run.

1-3 with Browns, 49ers, CARDINALS, Chargers, Jags, Rams, Brown, Dolphins.

We come out of that 8-4, we're right back in it.

 
Uruk-Hai said:
How badly was Steve Smith hurt? I didn't watch the game but heard he left and didn't return.
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He took a hit after catching a quick out pass. He was upright and took on 2 defenders who knocked him out of bounds. He got up and started jogging back to the huddle, then suddenly he clutched his back and just laid down in the middle of the field. Medical staff came out and had to help him off the field. For the next 20 min or so he was trying to stretch his back out, riding the exercise bike, etc.

Was later reported he had a lower back contusion. Not sure how significant an injury that will turn out to be but it kept him on the sidelines the rest of the game.

 
Tong Po said:
Uruk-Hai said:
How badly was Steve Smith hurt? I didn't watch the game but heard he left and didn't return.
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He took a hit after catching a quick out pass. He was upright and took on 2 defenders who knocked him out of bounds. He got up and started jogging back to the huddle, then suddenly he clutched his back and just laid down in the middle of the field. Medical staff came out and had to help him off the field. For the next 20 min or so he was trying to stretch his back out, riding the exercise bike, etc.

Was later reported he had a lower back contusion. Not sure how significant an injury that will turn out to be but it kept him on the sidelines the rest of the game.
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I haven't seen any updates today, but my impression is that if it is painful enough to keep a guy like Steve Smith out of an overtime game against the Steelers, that's not good. Nice thing is that due to the nature of the hit it's unlikely to be anything really long-term, and he has an extra three days to rest up.

Without Smith the WR group is going to be very, very weak, so I'm hoping he's back in top shape ASAP.

 
So, where is this team really? They are literally 3 plays from being 4-0 and one play from being 0-4. I didn't watch last night's game, but from what I've seen they haven't played like a playoff team who just got unlucky the first three weeks.

The running game - before last night - has been bad.

When Flacco isn't getting killed, he's looked off anytime he hasn't thrown to Smith.

The other receivers are either "meh" or potential busts.

The defense, other than the Denver game, has not been good at all. I thought the DBs would be more solid this season, but they look bad. No pass rush and also are getting gashed on the ground.

I love OzCosta, but most of the recent high draft picks haven't panned out. They've made their hay on late round guys or UFA or sneaky vet pick ups lately, and I don't think that's sustainable.

Truth be told, they've seldom won pretty under Harbaugh. They've had too many games to count where they've played like crap and somehow eked out a win. In fact, many of the games they've played the best they've lost (several Pitt and NE games come to mind). So, maybe this is just karma catching up to them.

But, given how unstable most of the rest of the AFC is, it's not a mathematical stretch to say they have a decent chance still at playing in January.

 
I've been a pretty hardcore fan of the Ravens (as hardcore as you can get living 2000 miles away) since they rode the greatest defence in NFL history to the Superbowl in 2000. I think I can say with confidence that this is the worst their defence has ever been in that time period. The front seven has the depth to weather some key loses and injuries and be passable, but the DBs are just horrible.

Losing to the Browns at home after the worst start in franchise history is as low as I can remember feeling as a Ravens fan. Well, other than the Lee Evans/Billy Cundiff disaster...

So what now? Start looking at a likely top-ten draft pick? Dare we dream of a guy like Hargreaves? Trade down for a safety?

Talk to me people. Give me something to hope for...

 
12 more penalties, including at least a couple of offsides (one of which gave Cle a 1st down, IIRC).

I think teams have figured out that Mosely can't cover anyone as a pass defender.

They gave up 500 yards to Cleveland and let them convert 12(!) 3rd downs.

I dunno what they can do at this point. The defense is a mess. All of their losses have been one-score and I believe they've had a 4th quarter lead in 3 of their Ls.

 
Uruk-Hai said:
12 more penalties, including at least a couple of offsides (one of which gave Cle a 1st down, IIRC).

I think teams have figured out that Mosely can't cover anyone as a pass defender.

They gave up 500 yards to Cleveland and let them convert 12(!) 3rd downs.

I dunno what they can do at this point. The defense is a mess. All of their losses have been one-score and I believe they've had a 4th quarter lead in 3 of their Ls.
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Yeah, I don't know how this gets fixed this year. 3rd blown 4th quarter lead -- quarterbacks having career days. Its just abysmal.

 
It's time for Ozzie to step aside. While he's obviously a HOF GM, his recent drafts have been fairly underwhelming and this team's lack of talent and overall depth is worrisome. It's time to rebuild while Flacco still has a number of good years left. While this team needs help basically everywhere, a couple of WRs who could separate, defensive backs who could cover, and ends who could rush the passer would go a long way.

Let the DeCosta era begin.

 
Ok. Let's talk top 5 draft pick. Team needs:

1a) Safety

1b) Cornerback

3) Edge Rusher

4) Wide Receiver

Jalen Ramsey or Vernon Hargreaves both look like great options. The Ravens really need a ball hawk or at least a shutdown guy.

 
Killtops said:
Ok. Let's talk top 5 draft pick. Team needs:

1a) Safety

1b) Cornerback

3) Edge Rusher

4) Wide Receiver

Jalen Ramsey or Vernon Hargreaves both look like great options. The Ravens really need a ball hawk or at least a shutdown guy.
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Ramsey or Hargreaves would be good options. It's just so tough. Those are the easiest positions to miss on in the draft when you think of historical top 10 selections. How many CB, pass rush or WR's are outright busts or take several years to develop? The close outcomes in the losses show this team is still in win now mode and not a full rebuild.

Givens, Aiken and Brown are all free agents. Hope we continue to get a good look at Givens for the remainder of the year because I think he's the only WR keeper at this point (at a friendly number.) Free agent pickings are SLIM for even a capable WR2 though.

Some good edge rusher talent but would have to pay top dollar for an elite level guy which we never do.

Actually, looking over the 2016 free agency list, there's not a single one I would say is a must keep except Osemele and Tucker. Including Upshaw, let him walk.

 
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Surprised to see flaccos torn acl. He was hopping around after one of the last plays, but played at least 1 play after, right?

 
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Joe's tough --figures it was friendly fire --I wish him speedy recovery -- And frankly, as a Raven's fan, the seasons over and if this were to happen, glad it was this season.

 
Welp.

I feel so bad for Joe. The one thing he always had was his indestructibility. Now that's gone, and he's 31. When he gets back next year, I won't be surprised if he suddenly starts getting dinged up, missing a game or two here and there. Man, I really hate how much the Ravens feel like the mid 80s Orioles right now. A team that's quickly gone from a champion to a bunch of overpaid, older, slower guys who can't get the job done.

The worst part is that as bad as the cap situation has been this year with dead money on guys like Ray Rice and Ngata, it's actually not much better next year. Here are some of the 2016 cap numbers:

Flacco 28.5 M

Webb 9.5

Monroe 8.7

Suggs 7.45

Pitta 6.6 (that's in Dead Money, which I'm assuming will be the case)

Obviously everyone knew this would be the year they had to redo Flacco's deal, but what do they do now with him? I had a thought this morning that I never imagined I'd have - draft a QB with your Top 3 pick next year, and blow it all up with a salary cap purge.

Gonna be some thrilling hype for next week's Monday Night Game - Baltimore vs. Cleveland: tune in to see who loses and takes a giant step toward securing the top pick in the 2016 NFL Draft!

Schaub looked terrible in preseason. Now he's playing behind a patchwork O Line that got Flacco hurt and has no WRs to throw to. Gonna get ugly in the next couple of months. On the bright side, Ravens games should get flexed out of some Sunday night games. Maybe that Dec. 13 game vs. the Seahawks will get flexed into Atlanta-Carolina.

 
Yup -- Joe deserved better -- One Lee Evans drop from taking them to back-to-back Superbowls -and now they're already on the outside looking in it seems

 
Legacies are such funny things. On the one hand, you could say Joe was one Lee Evans drop away from back-to-back Super Bowls. On the other hand, without either Ray Rice on the 4th-and-29, which got Baltimore into the 2012 playoffs, or without the Mile High Miracle to Jacoby - which probably never should have happened if Rahim Moore plays it right - then Joe is a guy who can't win the big one.

 
Flacco is unquestionably the guy to me. You paid him, now you ride him, for better or worse, well into the 2020s. 31 sounds old, but old QBs are having unprecedented success. If you look at guys like Brady, Palmer, Peyton (for the first half of last year), Brees, they all have the game completely mastered, and modern physio, training, surgery etc. are able to keep them in good enough shape to play well into their late 30s. Flacco is good enough to get you there, you just need to have the pieces to support him.

I think the Ravens need to get back to what made them great. They have always had an aggressive, ball hawking, run stuffing defence, and a mauling run game. The run D is just fine (just ask Gurley), but they need secondary help desperately, and some young guns to take over for Doom and Suggs.

On the offensive side, RB is a concern now. Forsett's injury is a best case scenario for a RB season-ender. But he's not getting any younger and was never really able to take over games like Rice or Lewis from the Super Bowl years. I doubt that Buck has that ability either.

Flacco is a guy who can absolutely win another championship if you give him that aggressive defines and the running game. You might say that about a lot of QBs, but Flacco has proven it. For my money he's the best QB the Ravens have ever had, with McNair a distant second.

Last time the Ravens had a top twelve pick, the snagged Ngata, who became the anchor of an elite defence for most of the next decade. I think the Ravens will be picking in the 5-10 range, and they desperately need to nail that pick with an anchor in the secondary or the pass rush.

No need to blow it up. Ozzie just needs to have the draft of a lifetime. For the record, here is a list of Ozzie's top 12 pick in his GM career:

Jonathan Ogden

Peter Boulware

Duane Starks

Chris McAlister

Jamal Lewis

Terrel Suggs

Haloti Ngata

Every single one of those players except Starks (who was a key starter on the greatest defence in the history of football) made multiple Pro Bowls. Every one of those players save Starks and Boulware made multiple All Pro teams. You've also got a couple hall of famers, and both a OPoY and a DPoY on there. This doesn't even count Ray Lewis and Ed Reed, who were drafted in the 20s. Most importantly, in all of Ozzie's top 12 picks, not a single one was even close to a bust. Starks was the worst player among them, and he played in the NFL for ten years.

All this is to say that everything will be fine as long as Ozzie continues to be Ozzie. In Ozzie we trust.

 
The_Man said:
Legacies are such funny things. On the one hand, you could say Joe was one Lee Evans drop away from back-to-back Super Bowls. On the other hand, without either Ray Rice on the 4th-and-29, which got Baltimore into the 2012 playoffs, or without the Mile High Miracle to Jacoby - which probably never should have happened if Rahim Moore plays it right - then Joe is a guy who can't win the big one.
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yeah --you can go back and play "if this, than that" for any successful team really. IMO, in that particular title game, Joe was the primary reason we were still in it and should have moved on...

 
Killtops said:
Flacco is unquestionably the guy to me. You paid him, now you ride him, for better or worse, well into the 2020s. 31 sounds old, but old QBs are having unprecedented success. If you look at guys like Brady, Palmer, Peyton (for the first half of last year), Brees, they all have the game completely mastered, and modern physio, training, surgery etc. are able to keep them in good enough shape to play well into their late 30s. Flacco is good enough to get you there, you just need to have the pieces to support him.

I think the Ravens need to get back to what made them great. They have always had an aggressive, ball hawking, run stuffing defence, and a mauling run game. The run D is just fine (just ask Gurley), but they need secondary help desperately, and some young guns to take over for Doom and Suggs.

On the offensive side, RB is a concern now. Forsett's injury is a best case scenario for a RB season-ender. But he's not getting any younger and was never really able to take over games like Rice or Lewis from the Super Bowl years. I doubt that Buck has that ability either.

Flacco is a guy who can absolutely win another championship if you give him that aggressive defines and the running game. You might say that about a lot of QBs, but Flacco has proven it. For my money he's the best QB the Ravens have ever had, with McNair a distant second.

Last time the Ravens had a top twelve pick, the snagged Ngata, who became the anchor of an elite defence for most of the next decade. I think the Ravens will be picking in the 5-10 range, and they desperately need to nail that pick with an anchor in the secondary or the pass rush.

No need to blow it up. Ozzie just needs to have the draft of a lifetime. For the record, here is a list of Ozzie's top 12 pick in his GM career:

Jonathan Ogden

Peter Boulware

Duane Starks

Chris McAlister

Jamal Lewis

Terrel Suggs

Haloti Ngata

Every single one of those players except Starks (who was a key starter on the greatest defence in the history of football) made multiple Pro Bowls. Every one of those players save Starks and Boulware made multiple All Pro teams. You've also got a couple hall of famers, and both a OPoY and a DPoY on there. This doesn't even count Ray Lewis and Ed Reed, who were drafted in the 20s. Most importantly, in all of Ozzie's top 12 picks, not a single one was even close to a bust. Starks was the worst player among them, and he played in the NFL for ten years.

All this is to say that everything will be fine as long as Ozzie continues to be Ozzie. In Ozzie we trust.
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Don't forget Travis Taylor at #10! Oh, wait a minute - please do forget Travis Taylor.

 
The_Man said:
Killtops said:
No need to blow it up. Ozzie just needs to have the draft of a lifetime. For the record, here is a list of Ozzie's top 12 pick in his GM career:

Jonathan Ogden

Peter Boulware

Duane Starks

Chris McAlister

Jamal Lewis

Terrel Suggs

Haloti Ngata

Every single one of those players except Starks (who was a key starter on the greatest defence in the history of football) made multiple Pro Bowls. Every one of those players save Starks and Boulware made multiple All Pro teams. You've also got a couple hall of famers, and both a OPoY and a DPoY on there. This doesn't even count Ray Lewis and Ed Reed, who were drafted in the 20s. Most importantly, in all of Ozzie's top 12 picks, not a single one was even close to a bust. Starks was the worst player among them, and he played in the NFL for ten years.

All this is to say that everything will be fine as long as Ozzie continues to be Ozzie. In Ozzie we trust.
Click to expand...
Don't forget Travis Taylor at #10! Oh, wait a minute - please do forget Travis Taylor.
Click to expand...
I thought everyone knew that WRs don't count with Ozzie...

 
No sympathy from me. That's what happens on bad teams who miss field goals. He should have never been out there in a situation where they needed yards at the end of the game in the first place.

 
Uruk-Hai said:
Anyone got a list of whose contracts are up?
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Tucker is a no brainer, whatever it takes, highest paid kicker, etc.

Osemele at the right price, should be discounted off 2015 season.

Cox definitely.

Givens should be brought back. Really weak FA class at WR and the top pick should be CB/Safety.

Let everyone else walk, including Upshaw unless the teams sees something in practice I haven't in games.

Justin Tucker K 26 BAL TBD $2,356,000 UFA Matt Schaub QB 34 BAL TBD $2,000,000 UFA Courtney Upshaw OLB 25 BAL TBD $1,685,313 UFA Albert McClellan ILB 29 BAL TBD $1,200,000 UFA Kelechi Osemele G 26 BAL TBD $1,064,595 UFA Morgan Cox LS 29 BAL TBD $665,000 UFA Shareece Wright CB 28 BAL TBD $635,294 UFA Marlon Brown WR 24 BAL TBD $586,668 RFA Kamar Aiken WR 26 BAL TBD $585,000 RFA Brynden Trawick SS 26 BAL TBD $585,000 RFA Zach Orr ILB 23 BAL TBD $511,000 RFA Ryan Jensen RT 24 BAL TBD $510,000 RFA Dan Herron RB 26 BAL TBD $504,705 RFA Allen Reisner TE 27 BAL TBD $333,000 UFA Charles James CB 25 BAL TBD $330,000 UFA Zach Thompson DE 24 BAL TBD $318,000 ERFA Micajah Reynolds DT 24 BAL TBD $318,000 ERFA Raheem Mostert RB 23 BAL TBD $307,058 ERFA Jeremy Butler WR 24 BAL TBD $300,000 ERFA De'Ondre Wesley G 23 BAL TBD $255,882 ERFA Chase Ford TE 25 BAL TBD $240,882 RFA Cassius Vaughn CB 28 BAL TBD $240,882 UFA Terrance West RB 24 BAL TBD $210,000 ERFA Kaelin Clay WR 23 BAL TBD $179,117 ERFA Chuck Jacobs WR 25 BAL TBD $153,529 ERFA Chris Givens
 
So our base offense/defense looked like this:

QB - Mallett

RB - Buck Allen

FB - Juszczyk

WR - Aiken and Givens

TE - Williams

G's - Yanda and Osemele

T's - Wagner and Urschel

C - Jensen

DE/DT - Williams, Jernigan, Dumervil

LB - Mosley, Smith, Upshaw, Smith

CB - Smith, Webb, Wright

FS - Lewis

And we beat our hated rivals, for the 2nd time this season, with them with serious playoff implications and an almost entirely healthy roster. :shock:

 
humpback said:
Pretty costly win- dropped them from the 3rd overall pick to 8th (right now).
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Other than a chance at Bosa, our guy (CB/safety presumably) will be there. Now if we win Week 17. . .

But like DB said, I'll take that for a sweep of Pittsburgh in a down year.

 
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