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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (17 Viewers)

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Otis said:
Big piece of business I’ve been trying to land. Want to show the customer based there that I am “all in” and get this over the finish line with an in person meeting. 
 

:unsure:  I confess I’ve never been before, but always thought it was an island, right off the southern part of Malaysia?  Am I missing something there?
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It is an island but wth does that have to do with stopping the flu? There are huge highways going straight to Malaysia but everyone flies anyway.

If this thing goes full on pandemic getting out of there could become problematic.

Are you willing to put your life on the line (above the usual risk of air transportation to land this biz - and you really can't land it three months from now when this thing has died down?

 
(Checks map).  Wow, I was wrong too in thinking it was an island like Indonesia.  TIL. 
 

I wouldn’t want to go right now.  Given the current events, it seems like a reasonable customer would understand wanting to wait a couple months.   :shrug:

 
msommer said:
It is an island but wth does that have to do with stopping the flu? There are huge highways going straight to Malaysia but everyone flies anyway.

If this thing goes full on pandemic getting out of there could become problematic.

Are you willing to put your life on the line (above the usual risk of air transportation to land this biz - and you really can't land it three months from now when this thing has died down?
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Really that dire?  Or just Haming me?

 
The General said:
Just landed from a red eye. On the outbound flight the gate next to me was going to Taipei. Was surrounded by Asians wearing masks. Guy sitting across from me in the airport took his GD shoes and socks off.

Hopefully I don’t have it.
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What part of Mexico?  I flew in to Mexico City yesterday and was surprised how few masks I saw.  I didn’t hang around long after we touched down so maybe I just missed any East Asian flights.

 
shuke said:
Has anyone dropped in here to mention that the good ol' regular flu has killed 7,000 Americans so far this year?
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Flu needs a brand manager.  Gotta start calling it CoorsLightFlu or DoubleIPAFlu if they want the Twitter mentions and the hysteria. 

 
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AAABatteries said:
What part of Mexico?  I flew in to Mexico City yesterday and was surprised how few masks I saw.  I didn’t hang around long after we touched down so maybe I just missed any East Asian flights.
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Mexico City as well. You here now?

The Asians were all back in Seattle where I left from. Just happened that the gate I left from had the flight going to Taipei right next to it. 

 
Otis said:
Really that dire?  Or just Haming me?
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well 2-3% death rate so far. 1% or so recovery rate so far. which means 96% undecided and very ill for a few weeks.

It's very early in the process, desth rate and recovery rstes fluid. IIRC It's already in Singapore (you should verify). It spreads before symptoms become evident. There is no proven vaccine.

None of that says that you can be sure not to get exposed, that if you get it, your immune system will fight it down, that if it survives in you, that you will.

That's taking a risk. is it snakeeyes you die or seven? 

We really don't know and that to me is putting your life at risk. Could be thst risk in effect is really small, point is right now the assessment of that risk is very difficult.

My :2cents:

Not trying to go all Ham on you

 
my company has shut down all travel to China, corporate wide.   Any travel to China must be personally approved by the CEO.

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
Perhaps Otis could get Otisdoctor to pre-prescribe some prophylactic antibiotics or other appropriate meds Otis could take with him, just in case. 
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It's a virus, so antibiotics are pointless.

I know that seems pedantic, but it's actually worth factoring that into this discussion.  If you get the coronavirus -- or the flu for that matter -- you're probably not going to die from it.  But you will probably be incapacitated for a week or so.  Influenza is no joke.  Completely healthy people get knocked on their ### when they get the flu.  When you're weighing the costs and benefits of a business trip, you should factor in the small likelihood that you lose a week of work in the unlucky event that you get ill.

 
Otis said:
I've done this in other circumstances in which I was exposed to risk of potential infection.
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The airports are going to be the high risk places along with the airplane travel.  Even if you mask up it's a risk but the risk is you get it and then give it to your family before you know you caught it.   

That's why we are sixing all travel also.  

 
Otis said:
Hypothetically if I had to make an urgent work trip to Singapore in the coming weeks, bad idea?  Mrs. O said absolutely not. I keep explaining it’s not China, it’s not even all that close to China, there are some countries between the two, and it’s an island.  I suppose the issue is lots of people probably travel to Singapore from China for the lunar new year.  But then again, is this thing killing a guy like Otis in his 40s who is healthy as a horse?  I doubt it.  I bet just like the regular flu deaths it is the elderly and those with weakened immune systems or other issues already.

Would you go to Singapore now?
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I'd assume Singapore has world class hospitals (if you can afford it, and if you have insurance, you can afford it).  so, if you were over there and got sick, you would be well taken care of.  Same for NYC if you brought it back.  so, risk of dying is low, IMO.

Of course, you would want to quarantine yourself afterwards so once you get back, you can lock yourself in the basement with internet connection, TV, and a fridge full of beer.  Wife and kids would be prohibited from checking in with you and, obviously, no going to work.  Sounds absolutely dreadful, especially with March Madness around the corner.

I say go for it.

 
culdeus said:
The airports are going to be the high risk places along with the airplane travel.  Even if you mask up it's a risk but the risk is you get it and then give it to your family before you know you caught it.   

That's why we are sixing all travel also.  
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You are nixing all summer travel?

We have flights to Tokyo for June.  No accommodations yet.  Should we hold off on booking rooms?  Really didn't think about this affecting our summer travel. 

 
Random said:
You are nixing all summer travel?

We have flights to Tokyo for June.  No accommodations yet.  Should we hold off on booking rooms?  Really didn't think about this affecting our summer travel. 
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No, my biz has forbid all asia travel and has recalled all people based or on trips in China.  I would hope by summer we are all dead or ok.

 
GF is flying to NYC for business tomm. Got her set up with n95 masks and hand sanitizer. 

Shes asian and already has a cold (cough, congestion, sniffles).

I set the odds on someone refusing to sit next to her on the plane at -120 :lol:  

 
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Random said:
You are nixing all summer travel?

We have flights to Tokyo for June.  No accommodations yet.  Should we hold off on booking rooms?  Really didn't think about this affecting our summer travel. 
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Also planning a Tokyo trip in early June. Not sweating that at all. But we’ll see. 

 
[icon] said:
GF is flying to NYC for business tomm. Got her set up with n95 masks and hand sanitizer. 

Shes asian and already has a cold (cough, congestion, sniffles).

I set the odds on someone refusing to sit next to her on the plane at -120 :lol:  
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Pretty great shtick to avoid someone taking the middle seat.

 
I’m not sure I’ve ever read the term prior in my life and now, suddenly in one post, I’ve read in my head “fecal cloud” 3 times

 
bradyfan said:
A lesson from history:

“SARS arrived in Hong Kong in February 2003, when a doctor who had treated some of the cases of SARS at Sun Yat-Sen Memorial Hospital in Guangdong came to attend a family gathering. Dr. Liu Jianlun, Hong Kong's index patient, checked into the Metropole Hotel on February 21, with a room on the ninth floor, specifically room 911. Even though he was already feeling somewhat ill he visited with his family and they traveled around Hong Kong. By the morning of February 22, he knew he was very sick and walked over to seek care at nearby Kwong Wah Hospital. He eventually died there in the Intensive Care Unit on March 4. As he likely had diarrhea, on the night of February 21, he created airborne fecal clouds in his bathroom by flushing the toilet. Those fecal clouds then traveled into the hallway because his room was positively pressurized. Nine 9th floor guests and one visitor breathed in airborne SARS from his fecal cloud and contracted SARS. Surprisingly, his wife who was with him the entire time did not contract SARS. Liu's brother-in-law sought medical treatment in late February, entered the hospital on March 1, and died on March 19. Twenty-three other guests from the Metropole developed SARS, seven of them from the ninth floor, and it is estimated that around 80% of the Hong Kong cases were due to Liu.”

Wiki Source
Hotel Floor Map
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Since I'm too old to start a band, I'm going to use this as my home wifi network name. 

 
facook said:
Well I for one absoLUTELY trust this Chinese-government-inspired-propaganda-video.
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Yeah the video from 2 days ago showed a ton of front end lo0aders working in an empty lot and now this one says they converted an empty building.

 
Otis said:
About the same as the US. 
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Slightly smaller area, though

Death toll rises, Chinese authorities expect cases to peak in ten days

Australia plans to quarantine its evacuees on Christmas island 2,000km (1,200 miles) from the mainland.

Japan, the US and the EU are also repatriating their citizens.

British Airways has suspended all flights to and from mainland China, as the UK's Foreign Office warned against "all but essential travel" there.

Several other airlines have taken similar measures, including America's United Airlines, which restricted flights citing a fall in demand.

Chinese President Xi Jinping called the virus a "devil" but said China would defeat it.

An expert from the Chinese National Health Commission (NHC) said it could take 10 more days for the outbreak to peak.

The number of deaths from the virus has risen to 132 in China.

Like the similar Sars and influenza viruses, the new coronavirus is a particular risk for elderly people and those with pre-existing illnesses.

The sharp rise in cases is in part attributed to increased awareness, monitoring and testing in recent days.
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That, to me, suggests it may be prudent to popstpone going to Singapore for a month, maybe two, assuming the data bears out this peak

 
Otis said:
Big piece of business I’ve been trying to land. Want to show the customer based there that I am “all in” and get this over the finish line with an in person meeting. 
 

:unsure:  I confess I’ve never been before, but always thought it was an island, right off the southern part of Malaysia?  Am I missing something there?
Click to expand...
It is, you're right.  I think he just meant that a narrow waterway isn't going to stop disease transmission.  My two cents, probably worth even less, is that Singapore's government is not necessarily the most liberal in the world (remember the kid who was caned?  Although that was many years ago so perhaps things have changed), so who knows how they might react to some cases of this disease appearing.  Your travel efforts back home could be impeded.  Probably a watch and wait situation. 

(Editing to say sorry, I read right over msommer and someone else already saying similar stuff.)  

 
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Aerial Assault said:
It is, you're right.  I think he just meant that a narrow waterway isn't going to stop disease transmission.  My two cents, probably worth even less, is that Singapore's government is not necessarily the most liberal in the world (remember the kid who was caned?  Although that was many years ago so perhaps things have changed), so who knows how they might react to some cases of this disease appearing.  Your travel efforts back home could be impeded.  Probably a watch and wait situation. 

(Editing to say sorry, I read right over msommer and someone else already saying similar stuff.)  
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No worries.
Singapore is still ruled by what some call a benign dictatorship

 
bradyfan said:
A lesson from history:

“SARS arrived in Hong Kong in February 2003, when a doctor who had treated some of the cases of SARS at Sun Yat-Sen Memorial Hospital in Guangdong came to attend a family gathering. Dr. Liu Jianlun, Hong Kong's index patient, checked into the Metropole Hotel on February 21, with a room on the ninth floor, specifically room 911. Even though he was already feeling somewhat ill he visited with his family and they traveled around Hong Kong. By the morning of February 22, he knew he was very sick and walked over to seek care at nearby Kwong Wah Hospital. He eventually died there in the Intensive Care Unit on March 4. As he likely had diarrhea, on the night of February 21, he created airborne fecal clouds in his bathroom by flushing the toilet. Those fecal clouds then traveled into the hallway because his room was positively pressurized. Nine 9th floor guests and one visitor breathed in airborne SARS from his fecal cloud and contracted SARS. Surprisingly, his wife who was with him the entire time did not contract SARS. Liu's brother-in-law sought medical treatment in late February, entered the hospital on March 1, and died on March 19. Twenty-three other guests from the Metropole developed SARS, seven of them from the ninth floor, and it is estimated that around 80% of the Hong Kong cases were due to Liu.”

Wiki Source
Hotel Floor Map
Click to expand...
Cloud of Feces.

 
culdeus said:
Still not seeing body count levels approaching even regular seasonal flu.  I'm going to keep my collodial silver supply untouched.
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thing with the seasonal flu is that the strain has been identified, and precautions (innoculation) can be taken. 

and i'd hazard to say that roughly 95% of the deaths are attributed to high risk humans - those already compromised via age or existing underlying conditions (COPD is a big one, as is diabtetes, heart disease, AIDS, etc) ... an otherwise healthy person does not contact the flu and drop ####in' dead as Dillinger ... that's pretty stinkin' uncommon, imo. 

now, this here Corona?  yeah, not that cut and dried, methinks. 

 
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