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Wow, its been a while.
Although I think I disagree on Schmidt, he was great but clutch?
i think you and i watched a lot of the same phils games growing up (32 also). I think AI was clutch, especially in the 00-01 season when they went to the finalsWow, its been a while.Although I think I disagree on Schmidt, he was great but clutch?
I'm 32 and was too young to remember most of his career in detail but remember alot of game ending outs from Schmidtty.
For some actual data, playoffs vs career...
(Source: Baseball-Reference.com)
Career OBP: .380
Playoff OBP: .304
Career SLG: .527
Playoff SLG: .386
Career AB/HR: 15
Playoff AB/HR: 35
I know... take it to the baseball forum.
1) Considine is a scrub, and we've got a keeper in Demps so don't worry, he wont' be on the field much longer2) Rory is no John Harbaugh that's for sure3) An overstatement, but 2-minute drills aren't his strong suit that's for sure4) VERY frustrating, I agree. At least three times last night he had 15-20 yard first downs to be had and instead took a sack or threw an incompletion5) They're playing their hearts outdelusional said:
6) Indeed he is 7) I don't think the organization overrates him. The fact they didn't lock him up long term before his contract was up is a testametn to that. The Franchise tag was a smart move b/c it brings him back but doesn't commit to him beyond 20088) Of course, he's been the heart and soul of this team from day one
I agree, it's really frustrating. Eagles fans (most of us anyway) almost seem to prefer when the Eagles lose close games. Give us a chance to rip the team and cry "woe is me." We don't collectively know what to do with ourselves during prosperity.I responded to you ni the game thread, but it will get lost there....so here it is again:So...Eagles fans ripping on their own pro-bowl caliber QB is a big reason why so many other fans hate Eagles fans.Seriously...how about the drop DeSean had in the first half...that stalled a drive in the RZ...birds settle for 3? How about his drop in the second half...that forced a punt? How about Greg Lewis' drop that ALSO forced a punt? Am I happy that McNabb took a sack on the last drive...heck no! But I also realize he avoided 3-4 sacks in that game that all but one or two other QBs in the league would have taken. 1 minute to go, fighting like hell to make a play, after a TERRIFIC performance on the road...and you want to throw him under the bus for a sack?Dude...you don't deserve to call yourself a fan. That kind of "fan support" is disgusting. No wonder people hate Philly fans. More for this thread: NOW...I love DeSean Jackson, and he's going to be a big part of this team for a long time, but he did NOT step up in this game, making two big drops that ended drives. The defense did NOT make big plays (OK...they fell on Romo's UNFORCED fumble...but the key word is UNFORCED) and gave up 40 points!Philly is a legit contender, and will go toe-to-toe with Dallas to the end, but the defense has to play better against Dallas. I thought the defensive gameplan was...uninspired. Too many 4 man rushes on 3rd and long, leaving Romo all day to find open men deep downfield.Lehigh98 said:Ugh, that was brutal, we just let too many games slip away like that.Mostly play well but give up big plays, make big mistakes, and tighten up when the game's on the line.I put that loss squarely on McNabb, his fumbled handoff, and his inability to perform in the clutch once again.
I would say McNabb was fantastic AT TIMES; which is really a microcosm for his entire career. While I'm not one to jump on the hater bandwagon and have staunchly defended Reid and McNabb over the years, I have to say that he's a maddening guy. Looked like an MVP for three quarters and then comes up short with the game on the line. Made me think back to the Super Bowl. I think Eli is an overrated QB (or at least has been historically), but when he marched down the field and won the Super Bowl with a perfect drive, I thought, "wow, I would so much rather have my QB muddle through a game but come up huge when the pressure is on, versus what we usually get from our Eagles QBs."
Curt Schilling. The man defined clutch, but aside from '93, he never got the chance to show it much in Philly.
You say your view on McNabb has changed, yet you think he's the same QB he has been for his entire career. What has he done or not done that has made you change your viewpoint? Personally, I didn't think Eli Manning or Brad Johnson or Trent Dilfer would win a Super Bowl, but I was wrong. The Eagles and the fans know what they have in McNabb and that hasn't changed this year. If you don't like it or don't wanna cheer for the guy because he couldn't win a game in week 2 on the road against the best team in the league with a 6 point 4th quarter lead then don't. I'm as upset as most are about last night and Donovan was part of the reason they lost, but I'm not calling for the guy's head. IT'S WEEK 2.The last time I posted in here you were claiming how they shouldn't pay Westbrook. Now you're all over McNabb. You also say the Eagles don't play well against the Steelers when in fact they've played them a total of 2 times since Reid came to town, with a record of 1-1. As a lifelong Eagles fan you're gonna come to the stadium and boo as soon as the guy steps on the field? Just stay home.I'm sorry for the rant, but we need to relax. We have a really good group of guys and a very exciting rookie receiver. I'm looking forward to the Steelers game.
I said i dont believe in him any more. That i have lost my faith in his ability to win a big game when the pressure is squarely on his shoulders in the 4th qtr. Generally speaking, I dont think he's any different a player now than he was 5 years ago. The shine has worn off for me though. Its like when you finally start seeing all the flaws in that girl you've been dating for a while. Sometimes you can live with those flaws, other times you cant and therefore need to move on.I still dont think they should have renegotiated westy's deal...but that discussion is for another time and placeOh, and guess what...if I am going to spend $500 to fly up to Philly, $400 on a hotel, $300 on misc expenses, and $250 on tickets you better believe that i am going to voice my opinion. I'll cheer for the eagles b/c i've been bred to bleed green and silver, but if they announce the O before the game, i will let McNabb know how i feel about his "clutch" performances.Don't worry lil buddy, i know the fan'dom is blurring your vision now. But, 10-20 years from now, when the Eagles have a true clutch QB, you will look back at McNabb and see him for what he is.
My buddy told me basically the same thing, but I didn't post it because he didn't know the extent of the injury. He just said it was 'bad'.JaxBill said:
Lehigh...I think the real problem is that you're continously looking for a PLAYER to win it all, instead of the TEAM to win it all. it has been proven over and over again that TEAMs are more reliable then specific PLAYERS. McNabb didn't lose the game because without him, we wouldn't have been close to winning. There were dropped balls (DeSean, Lewis and Baskett each had a key drop), missed assignments (Considine), poor schemes (Dawkins man up on TO, ineffective four man rushes on EVERY Cowboys third and long), and yes, a boneheaded McNabb fumble. Stop asking for a player to win for you, and you'll be much happier.
Any insight from your friend into the return of Curtis and/or Brown and what Desean's role will be upon their return?
What I couldn't figure out was why JJ wouldn't dial up the bl;itz on third and long. While we got pressure on Romo at times, it was non-existant when it mattered most. How many times did Dallas convert third and 8+ yards? HINT: SEVERAL!
They were hoping Brown would be back for Dallas. I expect to see him this week or next. Curtis we're looking at coming back after the bye.
He's got the players? What down lineman is a legitimate pass rusher outside of Cole? Which one of the safeties has cover skills? If you say Demps; you didn't watch any of the preseason. Abiamiri's injury was & continues to be a big deal. Clemons & Bryan Smith's injuries have prevented them from being early contributors. This team lacks the personnel to generate an organic pass rush against a line like Dallas'. You want overrated? how about the starting defensive tackles that generate ZERO inside pressure? This team needs a healthy & contributing Abiamiri. Parker eats snaps, that's it. It needs it's defensive tackles to collapse a pocket; being stout at the POA & "battling" isn't a good enough return on the resources that have been spent. We lost the game because we failed to generate pressure despite an honest effort to address it in the offseason.
dirtywaters20 said:
A four man rush will never generate consistent pressure against an elite O-line + a back blocking, no matter how good they are. And without consistant pressure, a QB of Romo's caliber with half decent receiving options will pick apart any secondary.It's both way too early and very unfair to declare this D-line a failure. Considering the success against the run...I'd be more inclined to declare them a success. The problem Monday night was the defensive scheme/gameplan...not the players.dirtywaters20 said:A four man rush will never generate consistent pressure against an elite O-line + a back blocking, no matter how good they are. And without consistant pressure, a QB of Romo's caliber with half decent receiving options will pick apart any secondary.It's both way too early and very unfair to declare this D-line a failure. Considering the success against the run...I'd be more inclined to declare them a success. The problem Monday night was the defensive scheme/gameplan...not the players.
Aside from Cole, who in the front seven is a proven commodity when it comes to rushing the passer? Being successful at stopping the run but not generating a pass rush doesn't mean you're a success, it means you're one-dimensional. When your linebackers & safeties have trouble covering backs & tight ends (second week in a row) & you can't generate some resemblance of a pass rush, you're in trouble when you face an offense with Dallas' talent level. Blaming the defensive coordinator is easy, it doesn't make it correct. Quite frankly, he's got a lot more pedigree than the players you claim he has. With a few exceptions, the only thing they have is potential. Hopefully Monday night serves as another stepping stone in their development. I don't think the d-line is a failure (I think the defensive tackle rotation has enormous potential), but I do think they failed Monday night. Nonsense on the four man rush; Tenessee does it, as did the team that eliminated the Cowboys last year.
The Giants had an ELITE line...one featuring two pro-bowlers. What I'm trying to say is that even a good line will struggle to generate a CONSISTANT pass rush on an ELITE blocking unit. There are only 2 or 3 teams in the NFL that will generate that kind of FOUR MAN pass rush on the Cowboys. It's hardly a damning comment that Philly isn't one of them. If JJ expected this young unit to generate that pressure with four men, then he screwed up. He made it worse when he didn't adjust enough after the first 4 times the Boys converted third and long with all day to throw. Basicly...he let TO's big play ability dictate how he ran the defense, and the plan failed miserably.Aside from Cole, who in the front seven is a proven commodity when it comes to rushing the passer? Being successful at stopping the run but not generating a pass rush doesn't mean you're a success, it means you're one-dimensional. When your linebackers & safeties have trouble covering backs & tight ends (second week in a row) & you can't generate some resemblance of a pass rush, you're in trouble when you face an offense with Dallas' talent level. Blaming the defensive coordinator is easy, it doesn't make it correct. Quite frankly, he's got a lot more pedigree than the players you claim he has. With a few exceptions, the only thing they have is potential. Hopefully Monday night serves as another stepping stone in their development. I don't think the d-line is a failure (I think the defensive tackle rotation has enormous potential), but I do think they failed Monday night. Nonsense on the four man rush; Tenessee does it, as did the team that eliminated the Cowboys last year.
I'm glad today's focus is generally on the only reason the Eagles lost the game and that of course is the lack of any passrush. For any of you guys to rip into McNabb for the way he played yesterday is literally insane. What the hell wer you guys watching???? How any Eagle fan isnt through the roof happy how good McNabb looked Mon given his injury history since 2005 is mindboggling to me. The passrsh is without question going to be what derails this team. Newsflash for all you guys moaning about the lack of an inside passrush - Patterson and Bunkley wrer brought in to plug the middle and improve thier run defense - I think they do a good job of that, and now that our linebackers look really good, I'm not worried about our run defense this year. How come no one gives JJ and Reid any credit for completely transforming this LB corps. Just two years ago, they were embarassing and now they are a strenght. Cole can only do so much, Clemons and Abrianmi hurt, but the Howard signing was a killer. They paid him elite money and he's been nothign short of a joke.dirtywaters20 said:A four man rush will never generate consistent pressure against an elite O-line + a back blocking, no matter how good they are. And without consistant pressure, a QB of Romo's caliber with half decent receiving options will pick apart any secondary.It's both way too early and very unfair to declare this D-line a failure. Considering the success against the run...I'd be more inclined to declare them a success. The problem Monday night was the defensive scheme/gameplan...not the players.
Dallas has an ELITE offense, one featuring at least 5 pro-bowlers. If you wan't to beat them, maybe you need ELITE defensive lineman/linebackers. I count one. Stop blaming Johnson. It's ridiculous. It's either death by gunshot or death by a 1000 cuts. He picked his poison & the team was still in a position to win because of it. I guess we should overlook that one of the touchdowns came via special teams & Romo was working with a short field all night long. Hell if you want to talk overrated; look at our kicker. How many touchbacks has he had recently? I honestly can remember 1 from Monday.The Giants had an ELITE line...one featuring two pro-bowlers. What I'm trying to say is that even a good line will struggle to generate a CONSISTANT pass rush on an ELITE blocking unit. There are only 2 or 3 teams in the NFL that will generate that kind of FOUR MAN pass rush on the Cowboys. It's hardly a damning comment that Philly isn't one of them. If JJ expected this young unit to generate that pressure with four men, then he screwed up. He made it worse when he didn't adjust enough after the first 4 times the Boys converted third and long with all day to throw. Basicly...he let TO's big play ability dictate how he ran the defense, and the plan failed miserably.Aside from Cole, who in the front seven is a proven commodity when it comes to rushing the passer? Being successful at stopping the run but not generating a pass rush doesn't mean you're a success, it means you're one-dimensional. When your linebackers & safeties have trouble covering backs & tight ends (second week in a row) & you can't generate some resemblance of a pass rush, you're in trouble when you face an offense with Dallas' talent level. Blaming the defensive coordinator is easy, it doesn't make it correct. Quite frankly, he's got a lot more pedigree than the players you claim he has. With a few exceptions, the only thing they have is potential. Hopefully Monday night serves as another stepping stone in their development. I don't think the d-line is a failure (I think the defensive tackle rotation has enormous potential), but I do think they failed Monday night. Nonsense on the four man rush; Tenessee does it, as did the team that eliminated the Cowboys last year.
I agree, he hardly is accountable for any wrong doing. The defense needs to BLITZ against Romo, not drop 7 back. When they were blitzing they were getting to him. McNabb made a bad play with the botched handoff and yes, he maybe should have scambled for some 1st downs, but remember the last time he did he ended up with a torn ACL. maybe that's why he tried to throw instead of run? Either way I don't put the loss on McNabb, I put it on the defensive play.
Dude...making contact is one thing, pummeling a guy after the whistle is another. False start is one type of penalty and unnecessary roughness is another...nothing offsetting about that...
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...ly_bad_rap.html
I agree with the overall premise of the article but it is worth noting that most of the examples he uses to bolster his argument revolve around Brian Westbrook taking a short pass & turning it into a big play. Westbrook is money & the most important cog in this offense.
Good stuff scratcher.......thanks!
You negativity about McNabb is sickening. He is one of the 5 best QBs in the league, and has brought the Eagles tons of success in the last 10 years, despite his many injuries. If there is any problem with McNabb, it is his inability to stay healthy due to his playing style.a lot of good, level-headed posts in here, and i admittedly was fired up last night. BUT, i still have McNabb in my sights today (figuratively of course)
You guys who defend him are like moths flying around a big bug zapper. yeah, he looked great for 3 quarters of that game. Yeah, he made plays that very few other QBs could have made. But when it comes down to it, when the game is on the line, and when you need a clutch performance at the penultimate moment, McNabb simply cannot deliver.
Of course the D is to blame for the loss. Because if they dont get McNabb a double digit lead in the 4th quarter, he will find a way to blow it. Of course the WRs need to be better. Oh wait, they found a way to get open in the 1st 3 quarters and then magically couldnt get separation in the 4th qtr. C'mon, i'm not buying it.
McNabb hit the panic button, hard. He always has and he always will. I've always been a HUGE McNabb fan. But i simply do not believe in him anymore. The Eagles will be a playoff team, at best, with him at QB. nothing more, nothing less. So, all you defenders out there, hope you enjoy your 10-6 season and the crushing playoff loss that comes with it.
You should really talk to the Eagles and help them out. Getting rid of their franchise QB and one of the best backs in the league is a great plan. While we are at it, we might as well fire Andy Reid because he can't win the big game.
You sound like a Steelers fan that wanted to fire Cowher before he won a Superbowl despite all of the success they had. Get some perspective, buddy.
I'm glad today's focus is generally on the only reason the Eagles lost the game and that of course is the lack of any passrush. For any of you guys to rip into McNabb for the way he played yesterday is literally insane. What the hell wer you guys watching???? How any Eagle fan isnt through the roof happy how good McNabb looked Mon given his injury history since 2005 is mindboggling to me. The passrsh is without question going to be what derails this team. Newsflash for all you guys moaning about the lack of an inside passrush - Patterson and Bunkley wrer brought in to plug the middle and improve thier run defense - I think they do a good job of that, and now that our linebackers look really good, I'm not worried about our run defense this year. How come no one gives JJ and Reid any credit for completely transforming this LB corps. Just two years ago, they were embarassing and now they are a strenght. Cole can only do so much, Clemons and Abrianmi hurt, but the Howard signing was a killer. They paid him elite money and he's been nothign short of a joke.
McNabb is back to form, and he will give the Eagles a chance at the Superbowl this year. The lineman didn't get a pass rush, but does everyone realize that the Eagles were one fumble away from beating the Superbowl favorite in their house?
Sometimes the truth is hard to hear. And i realize it wont be a popular comment in a thread full of blindly faithful eagles fans. But, its what i see and what i know to be true based on the facts as they exist today. Like i said, McNabb is great...until it matters most. I hope i am wrong. I hope i have to come back to this thread and eat crow on Feb 2, 2009. But, i know i wont have to as long as a playoff game comes down to McNabb having to make a play late in the 4th.
You should really talk to the Eagles and help them out. Getting rid of their franchise QB and one of the best backs in the league is a great plan. While we are at it, we might as well fire Andy Reid because he can't win the big game.
please show me where i said they should get rid of Westy..or McNabb? BEFORE HIS EXTENSION, Westy was locked in through 2010, at which point he will be 31. I know McNabb is their best option right now. It just sucks to know that his inability to perform in the clutch will most likely hold this team back at a critical moment.And i admit i was fired up about AR after last year, but i've got no problem with him. He's brought stability to this franchise that it has never known (not in my lifetime anyway).Like i said, the truth is hard...especially for the blindly faithful. Its like trying to tell that guy who found jesus in his breakfast toast that its just a coincidence. Go Eagles! They'll go as far as their D takes them. Because if its left up to McNabb, well...
and each of those guys put it together enough times to win a superbowl. McNabb is 1-3 in NFC Champ games and 0-1 in his lone SB. A SB that he had a chance to win. Unfortunately, he lost his lunch and then the game that day
The fatal flaw in your logic is your failure to recognize that the same arguments have been made about several HOF QB's before they were able to finally win the big one. How about Elway? More recently, Peyton Manning was crushed by fans and media for several years abut how he couldn't win the big one. Oddly enough, it wasn't until their respective teams filled other critical holes on the team that they won. (Terrel Davis, an actual NFL caliber defense)You have blasted McNabb. Folks BESIDES us "blind homers" have come back at you calling your criticism unfair. Statistics (such as in the article above) are shown proving the fallicy of your basic premise. Another poster describes each and every loss under McNabb the last three years, showing he had direct negaive influence on maybe 2, and STILL you want to attack him in here?Sometimes the truth is hard to hear. And i realize it wont be a popular comment in a thread full of blindly faithful eagles fans. But, its what i see and what i know to be true based on the facts as they exist today. Like i said, McNabb is great...until it matters most. I hope i am wrong. I hope i have to come back to this thread and eat crow on Feb 2, 2009. But, i know i wont have to as long as a playoff game comes down to McNabb having to make a play late in the 4th.You should really talk to the Eagles and help them out. Getting rid of their franchise QB and one of the best backs in the league is a great plan. While we are at it, we might as well fire Andy Reid because he can't win the big game.You sound like a Steelers fan that wanted to fire Cowher before he won a Superbowl despite all of the success they had. Get some perspective, buddy.
Like i said, the truth is hard...especially for the blindly faithful. Its like trying to tell that guy who found jesus in his breakfast toast that its just a coincidence.
Go Eagles! They'll go as far as their D takes them. Because if its left up to McNabb, well...
I appreciate the effort but don't really see how this proves anything. The only way to do this is to go back & review every single play from the games in questions...a painstaking task for sure. I can already point out a couple instances off the top of my head where your you seem to shift failure from McNabb where it isn't warranted. Tampa Bay game for instance; didn't McNabb "get picked 6" trying to throw deep outs in that game? I remember that Jacksonville game; they couldn't get a damn thing going offensively the whole game, they were terrible. As the captain of that ship, I would place a lot more blame at Donovan's feet than you seem to. Even the Washington game, I specifically remember he had Curtis wide open in the endzone on the drive you mention & missed him by a mile. I agree that McNabb (like every franchise QB who hasn't yet delivered a Lombardi) will get an inordinate amount of the criticism from the fanbase for their failure to do so. I guess the upside to being a franchise qb is that they also frequently get too much of the credit when the team does deliver a champhionship. Trying to retroactively assess a percentage of who is most responsible for a loss without looking at a game in its entirety just seems like an exercise in futility to me.
Congrats Wooderson! Have a great time and root on the Birds! Should be a great game for an Eagles fan.I just purchased tickets to my first Eagles game.October 12th vs the 49ers I can't wait.
It was apparent the impact Westy has on the team. The team seemed to be moving fairly easily down the field with him in the game but seemed inept without him. Granted, Pitt is a good D but here's to hoping he's back and healthy.
The injury to mcNabb seemed to have more of an impact then the one to Westbrook. Buckhalter looked good.After McNabb took the big hit, he looked off the rest of the first half.In the second half, McNabb looked better, but the play-calling went way conservative in an obvious attempt to protect McNabb a little more, especially when it was obvious the defense was playing lights-out. While Philly will never be quite as good without Westy, I really think it was more about play-calling in the second half.This would still be a good offense without Westbrook, just not the elite one it is with him.It was apparent the impact Westy has on the team. The team seemed to be moving fairly easily down the field with him in the game but seemed inept without him. Granted, Pitt is a good D but here's to hoping he's back and healthy.
I wasn't sure either. I assumed he must have touched the ball while the center was trying to grab it or something??
The only time I've ever seen Delay of Game called on the defense is for touching the ball before the snap or preventing an offensive player from being able to line up. Since it obviously wasn't the latter, it must have been the former. Not that the announcers were any help.zadok said:
