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**** OFFICIAL **** LOST - The TV Series (1 Viewer)

Tivo issues and the Red Sox - Yankees game cause me to miss the first 15-20 minutes of this episode.  Anyone care to summarize for me; first thing I saw was Locke asking Eko why he hit him.

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Pity bump now that the episode is over.
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Eko has a flashback where he AL and then sees that she is bleeding and she tells him to help Locke. He also sees his brother in what looks like the survivors hatch computer room and he is typing on a keyboard with all "?" keys. His brother says the same thing as AL except he tells him that Locke will resist talking about the "?" location. He also tells him to bring the axe, which you saw him use to open the hatch and climb the wall.Jack, Sawyer, Locke and Kate go back to the hatch and then Eko joins them (after waking up from the dream) and Michael falls out and says Henry shot everyone and got away. The find AL dead but Libby is still clinging to life. Lots of arguing, but Eko and Locke start out to track Henry, Jack then has Kate go with Sawyer to get the morphine and thus Kate will also know where the guns are. Michael obviously keeps asking about Libby.

Not sure if this happened before or after, but Kate finds out that Sawyer had the guns in the ground in his tent the whole time. Also, when Locke and Eko were tracking, Eko asked about the "?" and Locke didn't answer so Eko said sorry and head butted him.

I think that is pretty much it.

Oh and great, great episode. The preview are also awesome. Looks like a hell of a ride for the last two weeks! :excited:

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This is a very good summary!
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Aw shucks. Thanks. One thing I do have is a photographic memory!I am still pissed that Libby didn't out Michael, but thank god that Sayid mentioned Michael being compromised in the preview. I just thought keeping the Michael secret for too long would have been a bad idea.

Michael did seem to be at the camp he was describing, however, so maybe he isn't an Other and was telling the truth and for some reason did just snap and think killing AL was a good idea to get Walt back. I still think this is the case, especially with that look after killing Libby like he screwed up royally. I think he only shot himself to cover his ### for a dumb, dumb choice. Not saying he is a good guy again, but that he is just effed in the head because of his pursuit of Walt.

 
I'm a little surprised that no one questioned why AL was lying on the couch shot.  It looks obvious she was not killed in a struggle with Henry, otherwise she'd be in the lockup room.

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They did show Sayid talking to Jack and he said something like "I think Michael has been compromised", so I think that they will figure it out. I think the shock of AL being dead, trying to save Libby and Henry being gone made them not question anything.
 
I'm a little surprised that no one questioned why AL was lying on the couch shot.  It looks obvious she was not killed in a struggle with Henry, otherwise she'd be in the lockup room.

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I was thinking the same thing. Figured Jack would put Lilly whispering "Michael" together with AL's non-threatened position...Why was Michael standing alone in the armory at the end?

 
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I'm a little surprised that no one questioned why AL was lying on the couch shot.  It looks obvious she was not killed in a struggle with Henry, otherwise she'd be in the lockup room.

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They did show Sayid talking to Jack and he said something like "I think Michael has been compromised", so I think that they will figure it out. I think the shock of AL being dead, trying to save Libby and Henry being gone made them not question anything.
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Agreed
 
in the pearl hatch, what was on the table?  looked like dirt and cigarettes? :shrug:

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I noticed that too, and it was a little too obvious.Have we met anyone on the show that smokes that could have been down there?

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Just the smoking guy from the X-Files.I think that was put there just for the affect that these guys were just observers.

Did anyone else notice that the doctor in the orientation film used a different name in this one? I could have sworn he was Doctor Marvin? Candle in the survivor's hatch and something completely different in this one.

Maybe the ? hatch was also an experiment. They sure didn't know where the lab books were going and there was a camera observing them as well.

 
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I'm a little surprised that no one questioned why AL was lying on the couch shot.  It looks obvious she was not killed in a struggle with Henry, otherwise she'd be in the lockup room.

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I was thinking the same thing. Figured Jack would put Lilly whispering "Michael" together with AL's non-threatened position...Why was Michael standing alone in the armory at the end?

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So they could show that scene in last weeks preview and we'd all assume that Michael was locked up. :rant:
 
Another commercial.

http://sublymonal.com/

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The page title is "subLYMONal"
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Not too many anagrams that make any sense from sublymonalLonb Asylum

or.. something Boy ????

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I figured it was a play on the word "subliminal". Anyway when I try to go to the URL, I get a server can not be found message...overloaded maybe?
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The Lost Experience SPOILERS...
I found this earlier today (see my post in the other thread "I guess Sprite is in on it").  If you hang around the Hanso page at 15 or 42 past the hour the clock changes to OB:EY.  If you clicked that it took you to subLYMONal.com

Anyway there are 6 television screens all with no reception.  You have to click one 4 time, another 8, another 15.... and they turn green one by one.  When you have finished all 6 they swirl and fade out and a new screen appears.  On the new screen flashes "hint" and "heir apparent". 

Under the screen is a hidden link to the Hanso Foundation's Executive's bios.  When you click on the 2nd guy's profile there is a textbox.  When you type in "heir apparent" you find out about his mysterious past.
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Care to recap what you learn about the past? I can't get the page to load...is his name Lymon?Why is that in whiteout text? It's not spoiler info, is it?

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No true spoilers.. I just don't want to spoil anyone's fun who wants to find stuff out for themselves.
Cal Tech has no record of him and Persephone question why he claims to be a doctor.  I think it's just adding up that Alvar Hanso is missing and his "heir apparent" who isn't who he claims to be, is probably behind it.
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I'm a little surprised that no one questioned why AL was lying on the couch shot.  It looks obvious she was not killed in a struggle with Henry, otherwise she'd be in the lockup room.

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I was thinking the same thing. Figured Jack would put Lilly whispering "Michael" together with AL's non-threatened position...Why was Michael standing alone in the armory at the end?

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So they could show that scene in last weeks preview and we'd all assume that Michael was locked up. :rant:
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:goodposting: That was what I was waiting for.

Putting Hulk on notice, or cabeel, for the Canadian preview as they always show something extra. I don't like super spoilers, but I love the previews.

 
in the pearl hatch, what was on the table?  looked like dirt and cigarettes? :shrug:

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I noticed that too, and it was a little too obvious.Have we met anyone on the show that smokes that could have been down there?

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Just the smoking guy from the X-Files.I think that was put there just for the affect that these guys were just observers.

Did anyone else notice that the doctor in the orientation film used a different name in this one? I could have sworn he was Doctor Marvin? Candle in the survivor's hatch and something completely different in this one.

Maybe the ? hatch was also an experiment. They sure didn't know where the lab books were going and there was a camera observing them as well.

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Awesome catch! I totally didn't listen to his introduction until now. :thumbup: This time he's Dr. Mark Whitman (or it could be Wickman, there was a hiccup in the tape). :unsure:

 
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The fact remains that that small prop plane could never have flown halfway across the world to crash land there. Not enough fuel. One must assume that the entire island is fake.

 
in the pearl hatch, what was on the table?  looked like dirt and cigarettes? :shrug:

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I noticed that too, and it was a little too obvious.Have we met anyone on the show that smokes that could have been down there?

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Isn't Sawyer the only smoker?
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You think someone from Flight 815 was down there?
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No way. But maybe someone that we've bumped into in the past.
 
So, what I take from all this is:

1) Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission. Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

2) Psychic guy's daughter either died or is in on something, per the conversation she had with Ecko in the airport

3) Regarding the island -- something there, possibly one of the Hanso experiments, does, in fact, have the ability to alter/affect/etc... the dreams and pysches of the Losties. Locke had some funky dreams that led him to the plane. Ecko has had funky dreams re: his brother (this entertwining with Locke's dream, thus a causality unless we want to get into the supernatural which I do not believe/hope this is where the writers are going with. Claire also had a dream related to Locke.

3a) Other pyschological "insights" not dream related have been played with Shannon and the Walt sighting, Hottie and the horse, Ecko and the cloud visions, and perhaps some others. I'm going to discount the Jack/Jack's father aparition due to apparent fatigue and Hurley's invisible friend due to a bad bout of the crazies.

All in all a good episode and while it does clarify and create additional mysteries, it seemed to me to push the underlying currents of the show more towards the supernatural rather than away from it.

 
Good point on the observation pst being an experiment....it most def. would make sense and now that i think about it it probably is, and the sending of the notebooks is the equivalent of pressing the numbers....there was a camera trained on that hatch too...like right above the tvs.

 
in the pearl hatch, what was on the table?  looked like dirt and cigarettes? :shrug:

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I noticed that too, and it was a little too obvious.Have we met anyone on the show that smokes that could have been down there?

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Just the smoking guy from the X-Files.I think that was put there just for the affect that these guys were just observers.

Did anyone else notice that the doctor in the orientation film used a different name in this one? I could have sworn he was Doctor Marvin? Candle in the survivor's hatch and something completely different in this one.

Maybe the ? hatch was also an experiment. They sure didn't know where the lab books were going and there was a camera observing them as well.

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Awesome catch! I totally didn't listen to his introduction until now. :thumbup: This time he's Dr. Mark Whitman (or it could be Wickman, there was a hiccup in the tape). :unsure:

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Not sure what it means, but it lends a lot more credence to the whole acting thing. I almost think every hatch, including the Pearl hatch, were filled with dupes that didn't realize that they were being expiremented on.Although, he did mention that the folks observing in the Pearl hatch were to go to the barracks(?) when done, so maybe they weren't completely out of the expirementing loop.

 
So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

2)  Psychic guy's daughter either died or is in on something, per the conversation she had with Ecko in the airport

3)  Regarding the island -- something there, possibly one of the Hanso experiments, does, in fact, have the ability to alter/affect/etc... the dreams and pysches of the Losties.  Locke had some funky dreams that led him to the plane.  Ecko has had funky dreams re: his brother (this entertwining with Locke's dream, thus a causality unless we want to get into the supernatural which I do not believe/hope this is where the writers are going with.  Claire also had a dream related to Locke. 

3a)  Other pyschological "insights" not dream related have been played with Shannon and the Walt sighting, Hottie and the horse, Ecko and the cloud visions, and perhaps some others.  I'm going to discount the Jack/Jack's father aparition due to apparent fatigue and Hurley's invisible friend due to a bad bout of the crazies.

All in all a good episode and while it does clarify and create additional mysteries, it seemed to me to push the underlying currents of the show more towards the supernatural rather than away from it.

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My thoughts on your thoughts:1) I agree with you. I think he just made up the stuff on the flight because he was getting $$$ from some couple in LA. I don't think that he had any clue on the flight crashing anymore.

2) I think she did die and that that will be her only scene. I think that she was there just to give Eko faith before he got on the flight. I am a little unsure about what it has to do with him on the island, though.

3 and 3a) Bingo, I have been saying this for a long time. These dream sequences, like Charlie's weren't just a real dream. There was manipulation in there that showed that it wasn't just a regular dream.

By the way, don't discount Jack's images of his Dad because Jack's Dad's image ended up leading Jack to the cave/water when the survivor's were running out of water. That lead me to believe that the mental manipulation of the island/experiments had a purpose in showing Jack his Dad.

 
Maybe they put something in the water to alter their dreams and bring out their subconcious.

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Problem with it just being something like a hallucinogen is that in this case Eko dreamed about stuff he would never have known, thus not from his subconscious. For example, his brother told him that John knew about the ? and that John would not tell him at first. It is similar to Jack's Dad leading him to the cave/water/his coffin. Jack was seeing an image that wasn't really his dad, thus it was imagined, but that imaginary person actually had a purpose and led him to water that the survivors needed.
 
So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

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I disagree strongly. I think it's one of two things.To ensure Claire wouldn't let Aaron be "raised by another" he purposely convinced her to get on 815 "knowing" it would crash.

Or he has ties to Dharma/Hanso and had prior knowledge they were planning to take the plane down.*

*Following the Lost Experience, I read on another site that the guy who got sucked into the turbine in Episode 1 was Gary Troup and that Dharma/Hanso crashed the plane on purpose because Troup "knew too much". Now I don't know how accurate this part is, but I'm still kicking around the idea the crash was a setup.

 
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Maybe they put something in the water to alter their dreams and bring out their subconcious.

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Problem with it just being something like a hallucinogen is that in this case Eko dreamed about stuff he would never have known, thus not from his subconscious. For example, his brother told him that John knew about the ? and that John would not tell him at first. It is similar to Jack's Dad leading him to the cave/water/his coffin. Jack was seeing an image that wasn't really his dad, thus it was imagined, but that imaginary person actually had a purpose and led him to water that the survivors needed.
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Same with Locke and the "Up the stairs, down the stair" dream with Boone.
 
So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

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I disagree strongly. I think it's one of two things.To ensure Claire wouldn't let Aaron be "raised by another" he purposely convinced her to get on 815 "knowing" it would crash.

Or he has ties to Dharma/Hanso and had prior knowledge they were planning to take the plane down.*

*Following the Lost Experience, I read on another site that the guy who got sucked into the turbine in Episode 1 was Gary Troup and that Dharma/Hanso crashed the plane on purpose because Troup "knew too much". Now I don't know how accurate this part is, but I'm still kicking around the idea the crash was a setup.

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So him having ties to Dharma would explain that, yes. But the "raised by another" point you bring up was at least strongly tempered by him admitting to being a fraud, wouldn't you agree? Either:

a) He is a fraud which means everything he did was either masterminded against his knowledge by someone else (per the possible Dharma connection), or it was based on self-interest (thus my initial statement); Or

b) He isn't a fraud and is psychic indeed, in which case the show is now telling us bold-faced lies, which it hasn't done yet. This would be bad for the show, so I'm throwing it out.

I'd say "b" would be strongly disagreeing with me and not "a". I'm just sayin'.

 
So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

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I disagree strongly. I think it's one of two things.To ensure Claire wouldn't let Aaron be "raised by another" he purposely convinced her to get on 815 "knowing" it would crash.

Or he has ties to Dharma/Hanso and had prior knowledge they were planning to take the plane down.*

*Following the Lost Experience, I read on another site that the guy who got sucked into the turbine in Episode 1 was Gary Troup and that Dharma/Hanso crashed the plane on purpose because Troup "knew too much". Now I don't know how accurate this part is, but I'm still kicking around the idea the crash was a setup.

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So him having ties to Dharma would explain that, yes. But the "raised by another" point you bring up was at least strongly tempered by him admitting to being a fraud, wouldn't you agree? Either:

a) He is a fraud which means everything he did was either masterminded against his knowledge by someone else (per the possible Dharma connection), or it was based on self-interest (thus my initial statement); Or

b) He isn't a fraud and is psychic indeed, in which case the show is now telling us bold-faced lies, which it hasn't done yet. This would be bad for the show, so I'm throwing it out.

I'd say "b" would be strongly disagreeing with me and not "a". I'm just sayin'.

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Hope this hasn't already been posted, but I've gotten a little afraid to read this thread after all of the spoiler talk.I think he lied. I think he knew something would happen to his daughter if he let Echo continue with the Vatican investigation. The whole family just acted way too weird when he showed up there. What I'm not sure about is if he is really a psychic or if the far-reaching DARMA people got a hold of him. I'm leaning towards he's really psychic but not all the time. So he made stuff up a lot of the time for money.

As for the dreams, there is something called lucid dreaming that could be another of the experiments.

 
So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

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I disagree strongly. I think it's one of two things.To ensure Claire wouldn't let Aaron be "raised by another" he purposely convinced her to get on 815 "knowing" it would crash.

Or he has ties to Dharma/Hanso and had prior knowledge they were planning to take the plane down.*

*Following the Lost Experience, I read on another site that the guy who got sucked into the turbine in Episode 1 was Gary Troup and that Dharma/Hanso crashed the plane on purpose because Troup "knew too much". Now I don't know how accurate this part is, but I'm still kicking around the idea the crash was a setup.

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This idea is starting to gain some momentum.First Jack meets Desmond running in California. Then we Desmond appears in the hatch. People like to speculate that he is connected to Dharma, but he could just be another person who crashed on the island.

Later this season, Kate's dad "worked with" Sayid to get information from an Iraqi officer during the Gulf War.

Then last week, we find out that Jack's dad knew Ana Lucia and he, she, and Sawyer had a brief interaction.

Tonight we see that Claire's psychic also had a direct interaction with Eko and that his daughter was together with Eko and Libby in the Sydney airport.

Last season, all the connections between characters in flashbacks only invoked people who were on Flight 815. This season, we've seen more frequent common interactions between non-survors and survivors.

I realize it has been brought up before, but it really seems like they [the writers] are setting things up to show us Dharma's/Hanso's involvement with Flight 815.

edit: Sayid's girl, Nadyia, also met Locke this season.

 
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So, what I take from all this is:

1)  Assuming the psychic guy was the guy Claire talked to, then he isn't psychic by his own admission.  Thus, perhaps the entire thing about her giving up her baby to someone of his choosing was a financial ploy by him (big dollars for babies).

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I disagree strongly. I think it's one of two things.To ensure Claire wouldn't let Aaron be "raised by another" he purposely convinced her to get on 815 "knowing" it would crash.

Or he has ties to Dharma/Hanso and had prior knowledge they were planning to take the plane down.*

*Following the Lost Experience, I read on another site that the guy who got sucked into the turbine in Episode 1 was Gary Troup and that Dharma/Hanso crashed the plane on purpose because Troup "knew too much". Now I don't know how accurate this part is, but I'm still kicking around the idea the crash was a setup.

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So him having ties to Dharma would explain that, yes. But the "raised by another" point you bring up was at least strongly tempered by him admitting to being a fraud, wouldn't you agree? Either:

a) He is a fraud which means everything he did was either masterminded against his knowledge by someone else (per the possible Dharma connection), or it was based on self-interest (thus my initial statement); Or

b) He isn't a fraud and is psychic indeed, in which case the show is now telling us bold-faced lies, which it hasn't done yet. This would be bad for the show, so I'm throwing it out.

I'd say "b" would be strongly disagreeing with me and not "a". I'm just sayin'.

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Hope this hasn't already been posted, but I've gotten a little afraid to read this thread after all of the spoiler talk.I think he lied. I think he knew something would happen to his daughter if he let Echo continue with the Vatican investigation. The whole family just acted way too weird when he showed up there. What I'm not sure about is if he is really a psychic or if the far-reaching DARMA people got a hold of him. I'm leaning towards he's really psychic but not all the time. So he made stuff up a lot of the time for money.

As for the dreams, there is something called lucid dreaming that could be another of the experiments.

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That thought crossed my mind too. The "I'm a fraud" bit might have been a way of keeping Eko away from his daughter and getting him on that flight to Los Angeles.By the way Pod.. I didn't mean any offense.. just that I don't think the psychic was in it for money.

 
Did anyone notice that at the end of the orientation film, the guys says something like "After your three weeks are up, go to such and such place and catch the ferry..." It kind of got slurred by the aging of the film / tape.

Also, did the original Orientation video we saw have a copyright date on it. I'm assuming it was later. (If I remember, the gut looked older in the "First" film).

Oops, also forgot to mention, did the psychic guy tell Claire her baby can't be raised "by another" or "by an other"?

 
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Who was the person talking to Michael in the preview? The black boy/girl (couldn't tell).

Older Walt? :unsure: :tinfoilhat: :fishing:

 
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Did anyone notice that at the end of the orientation film, the guys says something like "After your three weeks are up, go to such and such place and catch the ferry..." It kind of got slurred by the aging of the film / tape.

Also, did the original Orientation video we saw have a copyright date on it. I'm assuming it was later. (If I remember, the gut looked older in the "First" film).

Oops, also forgot to mention, did the psychic guy tell Claire her baby can't be raised "by another" or "by an other"?

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The first film is older; Im pretty sure it was made in the late 70's.Lost-media is really slow right now, so its hard to get screen caps, but the first Orientaiton film was reel-to reel while the latest one was on VHS.

edit: Swan: 1980

Looks like I was wrong and they were both made in 1980. Interesting.

edit 2: ?: 1980

 
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Is there any chance that Michael was filmed when he shot AL?

Looked like the monitor could have filmed it. Maybe it will show up later?

 
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Another commercial.

http://sublymonal.com/

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The page title is "subLYMONal"
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Not too many anagrams that make any sense from sublymonalLonb Asylum

or.. something Boy ????

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I figured it was a play on the word "subliminal". Anyway when I try to go to the URL, I get a server can not be found message...overloaded maybe?
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The Lost Experience SPOILERS...
I found this earlier today (see my post in the other thread "I guess Sprite is in on it").  If you hang around the Hanso page at 15 or 42 past the hour the clock changes to OB:EY.  If you clicked that it took you to subLYMONal.com

Anyway there are 6 television screens all with no reception.  You have to click one 4 time, another 8, another 15.... and they turn green one by one.  When you have finished all 6 they swirl and fade out and a new screen appears.  On the new screen flashes "hint" and "heir apparent". 

Under the screen is a hidden link to the Hanso Foundation's Executive's bios.  When you click on the 2nd guy's profile there is a textbox.  When you type in "heir apparent" you find out about his mysterious past.
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Care to recap what you learn about the past? I can't get the page to load...is his name Lymon?Why is that in whiteout text? It's not spoiler info, is it?

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No true spoilers.. I just don't want to spoil anyone's fun who wants to find stuff out for themselves.
Cal Tech has no record of him and Persephone question why he claims to be a doctor.  I think it's just adding up that Alvar Hanso is missing and his "heir apparent" who isn't who he claims to be, is probably behind it.
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This ticked me off. I found the site on my own, made it there found the box, entered the code, and nothing. Came over here to see if anybody posted, and you did exactly what I did, yet I get nothing. Even tried IE thinking it might be a Firefox issue. That sucks.
 
I believe that family and friends are somehow in on this. Possibly Dharma contacted them about their children. I don't care if that sounds ridiculous.

And in the end, they'll all show up including those "supposedly" dead: Eko's brother, Jack's dad and whoever else bites the dust.

 
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