What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

***OFFICIAL*** Washington Commanders Thread (4 Viewers)

MattFancy said:
Every quarterback would love to be insulted the way Kirk Cousins has

I've been saying these same things since it first came out that Cousins has felt disrespected during his tenure here.
Click to expand...
Totally agree.  I mean, he was a fourth rounder and his coach -- Gruden -- gave him a chance to start over a Heisman trophe winner that the team gave up a treasure for.  From article:

"The fourth-round quarterbacks taken the year after Cousins was drafted included Ryan Nassib (drafted behind Eli Manning) and Landry Jones (drafted behind Ben Roethlisberger). The year after that, there was Logan Thomas (drafted behind Carson Palmer). Something tells me they would love to be insulted the way Cousins has been insulted. Fourth-round quarterbacks don’t always get the chance he’s gotten."

And I don't think it was insulting to tag him after last season.  That season he basically had a good 1/2 season so "let's proove it while giving you 20 M is not really that insulting."

I like Cousins, but do agree he needs to get past the hurt feelings to negotiate fairly with the team (does not mean discount, just fairly).  Otherwise, he's gonna make an emotional decision and it may not work out for him as he thinks it is.  It's not like he's just gonna waltz off to SF and go to the Super Bowl...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
MikeApf said:
Totally agree.  I mean, he was a fourth rounder and his coach -- Gruden -- gave him a chance to start over a Heisman trophe winner that the team gave up a treasure for.  From article:

"The fourth-round quarterbacks taken the year after Cousins was drafted included Ryan Nassib (drafted behind Eli Manning) and Landry Jones (drafted behind Ben Roethlisberger). The year after that, there was Logan Thomas (drafted behind Carson Palmer). Something tells me they would love to be insulted the way Cousins has been insulted. Fourth-round quarterbacks don’t always get the chance he’s gotten."

And I don't think it was insulting to tag him after last season.  That season he basically had a good 1/2 season so "let's proove it while giving you 20 M is not really that insulting."

I like Cousins, but do agree he needs to get past the hurt feelings to negotiate fairly with the team (does not mean discount, just fairly).  Otherwise, he's gonna make an emotional decision and it may not work out for him as he thinks it is.  It's not like he's just gonna waltz off to SF and go to the Super Bowl...
Click to expand...
Agreed. I'm sure any player in this league would love to be under a "prove it" deal for $20M for 1 season. Let's say he stays under the tag this year, that mean's he will have gotten $45M over the last 2 seasons. That's good work if you can get it. Please, someone insult me and give me $45M over 2 years.

 
I don't know what to make out of the Allen/SMC rumors. They make a good team if they can work together. Allen brought some much needed structure and respectability to the front office and he's good at working the cap (aside from capgate but if you blame anyone other than Mara for that you're wrong). If he knew how to identify talented players he'd make a good GM. If either of them are trying to undermine the other to get more credit or power I'll be disappointed.

As far as Cousins goes, I still have no problem with the way he was handled. Signing him mid-season in 2015 was the first opportunity we had where we thought he might be a good long term solution. That was when there was some talk of getting a deal done cheap since he had only put together a few good games at that point. Putting aside the facts that negotiating a starting QB deal mid-season can be a distraction that hurts both sides, and locking up a player long term after showing just a few promising games can end up crippling a team if they get the wrong player, I'm not even sure Cousins would have been willing to sign cheap at that point. His value in his own mind has always been based more on a confidence in his potential rather than anything he's shown in the past. And good for him, it looks like he was right about himself, but that doesn't mean it's reasonable to pay big money to everyone who promises you they're going to be good. There was a similar gap at the end of the season. I think it was totally reasonable for the team to be cautious with a player who had only shown half a season of good play. In retrospect, we should have given him the $20M/year long term deal that he wanted. But if anyone on the Redskins staff was capable of seeing into the future like that we'd be winning Super Bowls every year with or without Cousins. If he's not willing to sign here anymore, OK, that sucks, but it happens sometimes. I won't believe that's indicative of the way we treated him though cause we've been fair with him at every step. 

 
Gruden saying what he needs to say about losing Garcon and/or Jackson:

“DeSean and Pierre had great years,” Gruden told reporters at the combine. “Both 1,000 yards each. Those are going to be hard to replace. One thing I have to do is make sure we coach the guys we have. In free agency, you never sign everyone you want as a coach. I’d love to have Alshon Jeffery, Pierre and DeSean. What the heck. Give them all to me. I know that won’t happen. I’d love to have both back, I’d love to have one back. If we’re unfortunate to lose them both, I’m not going to blink.”
Click to expand...
And not saying what he's probably thinking which is "we'll be pretty screwed".

The Redskins would return slot receiver Jamison Crowder, who continues to improve and developed more ability to separate from defenders at the line. Crowder has caught 126 passes in his first two years combined. However, as in his rookie year, there was a disparity in the first and second half of the season. In the first eight games, Crowder caught 40 passes compared to 27 in the final eight. Still, he’s a solid talent who should continue to improve.

The rest is built on hope. They hope 2016 first-round pick Josh Doctson, taken 22nd overall, can be healthy after his Achilles’ issues (they like how he’s now recovering). Last year, they viewed him as a top-10 talent but his injury prevented him from ever proving them right. They hope Ryan Grant can contribute if given a bigger role. They hope Maurice Harris keeps developing the way he had throughout the season.
Click to expand...
Hope...hope...Doctson......hope......Grant....hope.....Harris

 
MikeApf said:
And I don't think it was insulting to tag him after last season.  That season he basically had a good 1/2 season so "let's proove it while giving you 20 M is not really that insulting."
Click to expand...


5 Digits said:
I think it was totally reasonable for the team to be cautious with a player who had only shown half a season of good play.
Click to expand...
I agree.

And while most people say that this past season Cousins "proved himself", I'm not sure that all of what he proved is what they (and Cousins) mean. He proved he can put up tons of passing yards, have a high completion percentage, move the team up and down the field like crazy in many games when he benefitted from an OC and HC who tailored things to him and some really good receivers. He didn't prove he could throw for a lot of TD's, he didn't prove he could put the team on his back when it mattered. He did prove he could take the team to 6-3-1, and he did prove he could take the team from 6-3-1 to 8-7-1. I have not forgotten the low point totals of the Bengals game, the Panthers game, and the season-killing Giants game.

 
Rich Tandler :lol:

The fact is that Cousins is very much available for the right offer. A conversation along the lines of this one could well take place in Indianapolis this week:

“How much do you want for your house?”

“It’s not for sale.”

“No, really, how much do you want.”

“Really, it’s not for sale.”

“I’ll give you $50,000 over whatever it gets appraised for.”

“Sold!”
Click to expand...

 
fatness said:
Gruden saying what he needs to say about losing Garcon and/or Jackson:

And not saying what he's probably thinking which is "we'll be pretty screwed".

Hope...hope...Doctson......hope......Grant....hope.....Harris
Click to expand...
Did Gruden really say he wanted Jeffrey? Isn't that tampering since he isn't a Free Agent yet?   :doh:

 
Listening to junkies ... they are speculating like Cooley now regarding alcohol issues ... claim it's an "open secret."  ?

Also acknowledging that Allen seems ti have been running the show all along.  

My main thought is to hope Scot M is ok ... that is the most important issue going on...

 
Mike Jones‏Verified account @MikeJonesWaPo

Redskins GM Scot McCloughan is not here in Indy for the Combine because he is "taking care of some family matters," team spokesman says.
Click to expand...
Mike Jones‏Verified account @MikeJonesWaPo

Reached for comment, McCloughan said he isn't at the combine because of a death in the family.
Click to expand...

 
Two people familiar with the situation said Redskins staffers were told Tuesday during their trip to Indianapolis that McCloughan was “tending to a personal matter.”

A Redskins spokesman Wednesday night confirmed that the team’s top talent evaluator did not make the trip to Indianapolis, saying only “he is taking care of some family matters.”

McCloughan said via text message late Wednesday night he was dealing with a death in the family. His 100-year-old grandmother Marie McCloughan died Feb. 6.
Click to expand...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/redskins-gm-scot-mccloughan-a-notable-absence-at-nfl-combine/2017/03/01/127d9b3e-fefa-11e6-99b4-9e613afeb09f_story.html

Mike Jones‏Verified account @MikeJonesWaPo 6h6 hours ago

Scot McCloughan's agent Peter Schaffer said not true his client was sent home from work Feb 20. Said death in family is reason Scot's off.
Click to expand...
Either our GM is dealing with a death over 3 weeks ago and isn't at the combine, or is drunk and isn't at the combine.

Isn't it wonderful being a Redskin fan?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Redskins general manager Scot McCloughan was sent home from the team on Feb. 20, a source has told 106.7 The Fan, and he is not at this week’s NFL Combine in Indianapolis.

Reached for comment, McCloughan texted that he is away dealing with the death of his 100-year-old grandmother.

His grandmother, Marie Bessie McCloughan, died on Feb. 6, according to an obituary in the Loveland (Colo.) Reporter-Herald newspaper. The paper reported that the funeral was scheduled for Feb. 13.

McCloughan said the report that he’d been ordered to stay away from Redskins Park on Feb. 20 was “not true”. He said it would “take seven days” to go through the funeral process for his grandmother.
Click to expand...
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2017/03/02/scot-mccloughan-absent-from-redskins-park-since-february-20th/

Rehab?

 
Multiple Redskins officials were seen entering the Crowne Plaza hotel in Indianapolis on Wednesday evening for interviews with college draft prospects. Among them were coach Jay Gruden, senior personnel executive Doug Williams, director of pro personnel Alex Santos and multiple scouts. Neither McCloughan nor team president Bruce Allen were seen entering the meeting.
Click to expand...
Williams has taken on a larger role in his absence.
Click to expand...
Multiple Redskins officials were seen entering the Crowne Plaza hotel in Indianapolis on Wednesday evening for interviews with college draft prospects. Among them were coach Jay Gruden, senior personnel executive Doug Williams, director of pro personnel Alex Santos and multiple scouts. Neither McCloughan nor team president Bruce Allen were seen entering the meeting.
Click to expand...
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2017/03/02/scot-mccloughan-absent-from-redskins-park-since-february-20th/

 
Still think they tag Cousins and roll the dice to see what happens next year.  

Nice to see the Redskin name battle is finally over. Usually it starts up right after the Super Bowl every year but it has been pretty quiet the last two off-seasons.

 
Da Guru said:
Still think they tag Cousins and roll the dice to see what happens next year.  

Nice to see the Redskin name battle is finally over. Usually it starts up right after the Super Bowl every year but it has been pretty quiet the last two off-seasons.
Click to expand...
Give that turd Brennan time.  She'll bring the name back up when it best suits her purpose.

 
lod001 said:
I believe they offered that AFTER they realized they gambled and lost with their paltry $16 million and $25 million guaranteed before the season. Cousins put up a 2nd big season and then they upped the offer. Too late. Yeah, call him greedy but they made their bed. Only Tom Brady has a wife making zillions and $ is no object.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/football-insider/wp/2017/02/27/the-redskins-have-already-botched-the-kirk-cousins-contract/?utm_term=.c7ce1c708587
Click to expand...
Oh I thought they offered him 20 m this offseason...that's what would seem strange

 
MikeApf said:
Oh I thought they offered him 20 m this offseason...that's what would seem strange
Click to expand...
No the offer was flat out a gamble of 'hey you are not that good, we will give you $16 mil this year and as a slap in your face, a total of $24 mil guaranteed. Don't like it, then sign the franchise tag for $20 mil.' What is so ridiculous about the whole thing is that, if he flops, they aren't going to pay him what they offered and would be looking for a new QB. Instead they franchise tagged him twice now and may be in the same boat at the end of the season minus 44 million. :lmao:  

 
MikeApf said:
Oh I thought they offered him 20 m this offseason...that's what would seem strange
Click to expand...
Not sure why that would be strange. They are going to start low and Cousins is going reject the first offer because it's foolish to accept the first offer. 

I'm sure the average is a decent measure of how good an offer is, but there is so much more to a contract. For example, I bet Cousins would gladly sign a 5 year $100m deal if $80m is guaranteed. That could be better than 5/$125m with $50m guaranteed. There are also other factors like option years and early outs and whatnot. 

I don't think we really know what Cousins wants in a contract. 

 
MikeApf said:
This is what I was talking about 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/football-insider/wp/2017/03/02/after-20-million-per-year-offer-redskins-and-kirk-cousins-remain-far-apart-on-deal/
Click to expand...
Many NFL executives, coaches and agents at the NFL combine said they believe that a contract averaging $20 million per year would be a fair offer for Cousins, although there are still some who as if feel Cousins has played himself into a bigger deal with his performance and the rising salary cap in 2017.
Click to expand...
I don't think that's a bad starting offer for the Skins and it's probably in line with what most other teams think he's worth. Offer 20. Cousins wants 24. Wait. Wait. Wait. End up with his agent arranging $24 million from another team and good trade terms for the Skins, or end up at $22 million to stay here. It'll take months for things to play out. And as dgreen said a lot depends on the guaranteed money. 

 
I know it's the going rate and all that. But I have to admit, these sky rocketing salaries make it harder every year for me to give a #### if these guys sign or not. I've been losing interest for years, but this is only serving to accelerate that. Feeling insulted by a $20M a year offer? Yea, GFY. One single year of that and I'd never have to work again.

 
The problem isn’t that McCloughan is away right now. It’s that his relationship with the team has become so awkward that every action seems like drama leading to a doomed conclusion. For that, don’t blame the scrutinizing media. Blame Bruce Allen for leading a front office that has been determined to discredit McCloughan and minimize his popularity over the past two months.

Allen, the team president who hasn’t fully dismissed himself from his previous GM duties, has silenced McCloughan. He has spurred the narrative that McCloughan had a subpar second draft and free agency and needs to do better, even though it’s too early to make a definitive declaration about last year’s draft and even though McCloughan, overall, has done good work in only two years. Allen has tried to shift responsibility for Kirk Cousins’s contract debacle to McCloughan. He is also said to blame McCloughan for leaking several negative stories, even though Redskins Park is one of the leakiest buildings in sports because the team does so many foolish things.
Click to expand...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/redskins-ties-to-scot-mccloughan-are-fraying-and-the-gm-deserves-better/2017/03/02/b11bfc54-ff7c-11e6-8f41-ea6ed597e4ca_story.html

 
Well, fellas, if what I think has happened, has actually happened, I think I'm done for a while...and this from a guy who's Dad watched games at Griffith Stadium. Ugh.

 
nittanylion said:
Well, fellas, if what I think has happened, has actually happened, I think I'm done for a while...and this from a guy who's Dad watched games at Griffith Stadium. Ugh.
Click to expand...
What specifically are you referencing?  There is so much going on right now it's hard to identify the exact issue?  :(

BTW, I'm serious...which part are you talking about?

 
While other NFL teams’ personnel executives focused on evaluating the 303 prospects on hand Thursday, contradictory versions of McCloughan’s whereabouts led to widespread confusion and perpetuated an image that the Redskins have tried desperately to shake — that of a well-funded but ultimately unstable franchise teetering on dysfunction.

On Thursday, the morning after McCloughan’s absence from the combine was first reported by The Washington Post, Redskins President Bruce Allen said he expected to speak with his general manager by phone that evening and added that McCloughan could return to work next week. In the meantime, mixed messages rang out from inside and outside the organization.

“Just a family matter,” Allen said in a hurried conversation in the halls of the Indianapolis Convention Center, suggesting later that McCloughan’s absence was related to the Feb. 6 death of his grandmother, 100-year-old Marie McCloughan.

Another person familiar with the situation insisted the general manager hadn’t missed any work time at all but was busily working Thursday on scouting business in his office at Redskins Park.

Several agents who represent Redskins players said they had been told that McCloughan hadn’t been in the office last week. And in private conversations, a handful raised questions about the Redskins’ preparedness for the combine; the free agent signing period, which gets underway next week; and next month’s NFL draft.

There have been indications for nearly a month of friction between Allen and McCloughan, Allen’s hand-picked general manager and the man most responsible for upgrading the Redskins’ roster. McCloughan is under intense pressure to deliver a productive draft class after last year’s first-round pick, wide receiver Josh Doctson, idled nearly all of his rookie season with chronic pain in both Achilles’. McCloughan’s free agent signings have largely disappointed, as well. And in a departure from past practice, Allen restricted McCloughan from speaking to the media this offseason.
Click to expand...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/as-pivotal-offseason-begins-the-redskins-foundation-is-shaking/2017/03/02/cc471856-ff7c-11e6-8f41-ea6ed597e4ca_story.html

I think basically Allen has fired McCloughan, effective after the draft it not earlier. Bruce wants his job back.

With McCloughan absent, Allen has assumed the leadership role this week at the combine.
Click to expand...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
So who was most responsible for the Cousins debacle? Allen or this other guy?

As a Crowder owner, I would love to have Cousins signed long term, even I though it has become one of the toughest divisions in the NFL with all 4 teams having a legit starting QB.

 
lod001 said:
So who was most responsible for the Cousins debacle? Allen or this other guy?

As a Crowder owner, I would love to have Cousins signed long term, even I though it has become one of the toughest divisions in the NFL with all 4 teams having a legit starting QB.
Click to expand...
Probably a combo of Allen/Snyder. I'm just guessing so who knows. Either way, :(

 
Hey if Skins get like a full draft of picks I'm okay with it. Colt would be starting by week 3...I mean quarter 3 of week 1. 

 
lod001 said:
So who was most responsible for the Cousins debacle? Allen or this other guy?

As a Crowder owner, I would love to have Cousins signed long term, even I though it has become one of the toughest divisions in the NFL with all 4 teams having a legit starting QB.
Click to expand...
Allen's responsible. You know, Genius Bruce Allen who talked the Skins into dumping salary cap money into the uncapped year, which resulted in them losing huge amounts of $$ to spend for a couple years. Bruce Allen, the GM who McCloughan supposedly replaced but remained as McCloughan's boss, who's now trying to get rid of McCloughan.

As for Crowder on a fantasy team, if  they lose Jackson and Garcon you might want to trade him to someone who thinks he'll do better next year than this past year. Crowder's quite good and very tough to cover in the slot. But if the outside WR's are average or below he's gonna get much tougher coverage next year, as will Reed. Jackson and Garcon had a good bit to do with freeing up Crowder.

 
Mike Jones‏Verified account @MikeJonesWaPo 1h1 hour ago

Skins still want to work out deal to keep Cousins. If for some reason they had to move on, only legit backup plan discussed is McCoy.
Click to expand...
Mike Jones‏Verified account @MikeJonesWaPo 1h1 hour ago

Mike Jones Retweeted Clarence Hill Jr

And as @MasterTes reported yesterday, 9ers don't want to part w bunch of picks. Patient approach. Also, Skins don't want Romo, I'm told.
Click to expand...

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Ministry of Pain
Atlanta Falcons Offense '24- WR/RB/TE/QB and the OL
Replies
3
Views
205
zamboni
zamboni
Ministry of Pain
Jim Harbaugh vs Patrick Mahomes or How the West was Won
Replies
0
Views
161
Ministry of Pain
Ministry of Pain
zamboni
Players Whose Value You Believe Will Ascend In The Off-Season
2 3 4
Replies
195
Views
6K
Ilov80s
Ilov80s

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 5 (members: 0, guests: 5)
Top