***Officialish Detroit Tigers Thread*** (2 Viewers)

[Green94]

3 User(s) are reading this topic (0 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)3 Members: urbanhack, Limp Ditka, Green94

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I think Dombrowski has to fire McClendon tomorrow, enough is enough. That Guillen at bat last night showed the approach of the team, they need someone else.

If Leyland says no, he goes too. I like Leyland, I think he is normally criticized more than he should be, but this team needs a change and McClendon should have been gone at the end of last year.*

It's not too late to save this, but this looks like 2007 all over again and that didn't end well and that team won 88 games. Scherzer, Verlander and Porcello should at least get two wins so this streak is gonna end, but the next month is brutal. Time for some new faces, call Dave Bergman to see what he's doing.

*for the record I'm not the coach should always be fired type

 

[Frostillicus]

Possible, but with Inge out i think they will be looking for a 3B or SS first, they were already weak hitting before the injury.

You guys want Punto? He can play both and is only making $4 million this year.

 

[skillz]

I am getting so sick of this broken record....

In Jim Leyland's five seasons as Tigers manager, he has never had a losing record before the All-Star break or a winning record after the break.

Year Before After

2006 59-29 36-38

2007 52-34 36-40

2008 47-47 27-41

2009 48-39 38-38 *

2010 48-38 0-6

254-187 137-163

*- includes extra game loss to Twins

 

[Bojang0301]

FIRE F'NG LEYLAND ALREADY!!!

 

[Da Guru]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

[*]Getting a catcher is the #1 priority for sure.

[*]They don't need a shortstop, Santiago and Worth are both fine fielders and good enough at the plate. This is the one position where defense is easily more imporatnt than offense, catcher just behind.

[*]Sizemore is going to be just fine going forward at 2B. He's hit at every level and will eventually hit at the ML level. Guillen is done playing in the field though, he's fallen hard the last two years. The only place I'd play him right now is at 3B.

[*]They need another starter, preferably LH. Crosby a LHer will probably be ready next year though, and Crosby is a #2 ceiling starter. But even then, I think they need one more starter. Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Crosby/? would be a nice rotation for the next five years.

[*]They need a corner OFer with power, again FA.

[*]This team will be even younger next year so it probably would be a good time to get rid of Leyland. I think he's an above average manager but with the youth movement and with him not wanting to fire McClendon it might be time.

Also keep in mind the O/U on this team's win total this year was 80. They are 50-44 right now so they are slightly above expectations. I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

 

[Gopher State]

FIRE F'NG LEYLAND ALREADY!!!

"It probably will be like last year. We all will do pretty good, then flounder around a little bit, then do pretty good. Then at some point — hopefully it will be us — somebody will probably make a run, kind of like how Minnesota did (in 2009). That will probably end up deciding it." — Manager Jim Leyland on how he sees the second half of the season shaping up in the AL Central.Leyland has a plan, don't give up on Jimmy yet.

 

[skillz]

I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

I agree. While the fans may not have liked him getting rid of Granderson it looks like he sold high at the right time. He doesn't get any credit for that and fans were ready to crucify him if the move backfired. That trade took a lot of balls. Plus, he's drafted a lot of good young talent (some of which he used to acquire Cabrera), and traded for other good young players like Scherzer. A GM isn't always going to make perfect moves but overall he has this team light years ahead of where they were 5 years ago and positioned for a bright future given their overall youth. Lots of money coming off the books to so hopefully he spends it wisely this offseason to fill more holes on the roster.

 

[MAC_32]

Tigers needs, not in any order.1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB. 5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

This is why I was hoping for a late July meltdown so we'd become sellers, too many holes on this squad to realistically chase a pennant, especially with Inge's glove on the shelf.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

The easiest thing in the world is to say a team won't win. For example if you bet against the Yankees winning the WS the last 50 years you would be up money.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

FIRE F'NG LEYLAND ALREADY!!!

didnt they just extend him last season?

 

[whoknew]

This is why I was hoping for a late July meltdown so we'd become sellers, too many holes on this squad to realistically chase a pennant, especially with Inge's glove on the shelf.

But the Twins and White Sox aren't very good either. That's the dilemma. The Tigers objectively just aren't very good. Hell, they've been outscored this year and they only have 2 reliable starting pitchers and an overworked bullpen. But they just went through a 7 game losing streak and are still only 2 games out of first. Because the Sox and Twins are very flawed also.The Tigers are in very good shape for success in the next few years. This year? Well if they can make a small pickup without mortgaging the future, then they should do it. Its a flawed division that is there for the taking.

 

[whoknew]

The Leyland/Dombrowski hate is misplaced.

Leyland isn't the best manager in the world, but he's pretty good. He plays too much small ball, but this is a pretty flawed team and he has them in 2nd place. He's done a good job overall in these 5 years. I think he's fairly flawed with his in game strategies, but he seems to handle the team very well, manage the egos well and the bullpen (generally - he did cost them one win this year with a bullpen blunder).

Dombrowski is pretty good too. He has made some HUGE mistakes - mostly in the form of contract extensions for guys who shouldn't get them. But he has made some good trades and has very much improved the farm system.

The big trade last summer may go down as one of the great ones in Tiger history.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

[*]Getting a catcher is the #1 priority for sure.

[*]They don't need a shortstop, Santiago and Worth are both fine fielders and good enough at the plate. This is the one position where defense is easily more imporatnt than offense, catcher just behind.

[*]Sizemore is going to be just fine going forward at 2B. He's hit at every level and will eventually hit at the ML level. Guillen is done playing in the field though, he's fallen hard the last two years. The only place I'd play him right now is at 3B.

[*]They need another starter, preferably LH. Crosby a LHer will probably be ready next year though, and Crosby is a #2 ceiling starter. But even then, I think they need one more starter. Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Crosby/? would be a nice rotation for the next five years.

[*]They need a corner OFer with power, again FA.

[*]This team will be even younger next year so it probably would be a good time to get rid of Leyland. I think he's an above average manager but with the youth movement and with him not wanting to fire McClendon it might be time.

Also keep in mind the O/U on this team's win total this year was 80. They are 50-44 right now so they are slightly above expectations. I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

There are quite a few holes, but unless you can have a $200 million dollar payroll, you will not fill all of the spots. Looking at 3B, SS, and C, we can deal with one of those positions being weak hitting and another being mediocre, but one of those 3 has to hit. Our top 6 lineup spots are good enough. I think Dombrowski has done a good job outside of the bad contracts, but I think Leyland has to go.

 

[Da Guru]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

[*]Getting a catcher is the #1 priority for sure.

[*]They don't need a shortstop, Santiago and Worth are both fine fielders and good enough at the plate. This is the one position where defense is easily more imporatnt than offense, catcher just behind.

[*]Sizemore is going to be just fine going forward at 2B. He's hit at every level and will eventually hit at the ML level. Guillen is done playing in the field though, he's fallen hard the last two years. The only place I'd play him right now is at 3B.

[*]They need another starter, preferably LH. Crosby a LHer will probably be ready next year though, and Crosby is a #2 ceiling starter. But even then, I think they need one more starter. Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Crosby/? would be a nice rotation for the next five years.

[*]They need a corner OFer with power, again FA.

[*]This team will be even younger next year so it probably would be a good time to get rid of Leyland. I think he's an above average manager but with the youth movement and with him not wanting to fire McClendon it might be time.

Also keep in mind the O/U on this team's win total this year was 80. They are 50-44 right now so they are slightly above expectations. I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

There are quite a few holes, but unless you can have a $200 million dollar payroll, you will not fill all of the spots. Looking at 3B, SS, and C, we can deal with one of those positions being weak hitting and another being mediocre, but one of those 3 has to hit. Our top 6 lineup spots are good enough. I think Dombrowski has done a good job outside of the bad contracts, but I think Leyland has to go.

I have no problem with Dumbrowski, and I like Leyland. Jus time for a change. The Cabrera trade was one of the most lopsided in MLB history. The Tigers landed a top 5 hitter at the time who now is the best hitter in MLB for two bums!

DD just made bad mistakes in extending deals. I was OK with the Bonderman deal because at the time everyone though we stole Bonderman at that price. Can`t predict injuries. Willis was bad, Guillen and Inge are both way overpaid.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

[*]Getting a catcher is the #1 priority for sure.

[*]They don't need a shortstop, Santiago and Worth are both fine fielders and good enough at the plate. This is the one position where defense is easily more imporatnt than offense, catcher just behind.

[*]Sizemore is going to be just fine going forward at 2B. He's hit at every level and will eventually hit at the ML level. Guillen is done playing in the field though, he's fallen hard the last two years. The only place I'd play him right now is at 3B.

[*]They need another starter, preferably LH. Crosby a LHer will probably be ready next year though, and Crosby is a #2 ceiling starter. But even then, I think they need one more starter. Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Crosby/? would be a nice rotation for the next five years.

[*]They need a corner OFer with power, again FA.

[*]This team will be even younger next year so it probably would be a good time to get rid of Leyland. I think he's an above average manager but with the youth movement and with him not wanting to fire McClendon it might be time.

Also keep in mind the O/U on this team's win total this year was 80. They are 50-44 right now so they are slightly above expectations. I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

There are quite a few holes, but unless you can have a $200 million dollar payroll, you will not fill all of the spots. Looking at 3B, SS, and C, we can deal with one of those positions being weak hitting and another being mediocre, but one of those 3 has to hit. Our top 6 lineup spots are good enough. I think Dombrowski has done a good job outside of the bad contracts, but I think Leyland has to go.

I have no problem with Dumbrowski, and I like Leyland. Jus time for a change. The Cabrera trade was one of the most lopsided in MLB history. The Tigers landed a top 5 hitter at the time who now is the best hitter in MLB for two bums!

DD just made bad mistakes in extending deals. I was OK with the Bonderman deal because at the time everyone though we stole Bonderman at that price. Can`t predict injuries. Willis was bad, Guillen and Inge are both way overpaid.

So are you saying Dombrowski should be fired?

 

[igbomb]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

 

[skillz]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

I love his defense - which fans will begin to appreciate more now that he is out for a while. If the Tigers could get a better bat for the lineup so he can bat way down in the lineup I have no problem keeping him for 2-3 more years. They just can't overpay him or give him too long of a contract term (which I don't see happening). If someone else does, then let him walk. I've just learned over time that you can't trust his hitting to be consistent so just get a better bat elsewhere and recognize that his defense is what makes him an asset to the team - sort of like a 3B version of Gerald Laird circa 2009. A lot of my hatred for Inge (outside of his frequent strike outs and inability to advance runners with less than two outs) stems from him saying he likes to play baseball everyday and will play anywhere in the field so long as he can play, but when they wanted to move him to C he pissed and moaned about it. I also didn't like that he played in the HR derby last year even though his knee was injured. I've always been a Leyland supporter but they need to make him get rid of Lloyd in the off-season and, if he doesn't, he needs to go. I'm also not a fan of his Sunday lineups throughout the season. He ends up resting players for a playoff run that never transpires. For some reason, I think it is more likely he just unexpectedly resigns one day rather than gets fired.

 

[whoknew]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

Another thread said that Jose Bautista is on the block. Low average, high power guy this year, would you like to see the tigers go after him?

 

[whoknew]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

Another thread said that Jose Bautista is on the block. Low average, high power guy this year, would you like to see the tigers go after him?

Not really. I mean, I guess it depends on what they'd have to give up. But I wouldn't want to see the Tigers give up anything of substance for the future to try to win this year. But its close. I think this year is really hard for DD. To go for it or not? Who knows?

 

[Leroy Hoard]

I think this year is really hard for DD. To go for it or not? Who knows?

I think a lot of his decisions (good & bad) are made by Mr. I, who at his age may want the future to be now.

 

[igbomb]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

wOBA is a much better stat. His career wOBA is .305, but since he became a full time player in 2004, it's about .325. Major league average hovers right around .335.He's far from great, but he's not nearly as terrible as Inge haters want to make out. He's a serviceable player who should be batting 7-9. And he's much better than a two day a week sub.

There simply aren't that many good third basemen. And the free agent market this year will not be good. The only better third baseman out there is Beltre, and he's having a career year and has an option that may keep him in Boston. Otherwise you're talking Peralta and Wigginton, who are both terrible.

 

[igbomb]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

Another thread said that Jose Bautista is on the block. Low average, high power guy this year, would you like to see the tigers go after him?

I'm with the crowd who thinks the Tigers need to focus on the long-term rather than just this year. Up to now in his career Bautista has been an average bat with a below average glove. If he's an improvement overall, it's probably pretty small.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

The hate for Inge in this town is silly. He's not an overpaid player and he's not a weak spot on the team. He's a just slightly below average hitter with well above average defense at a valuable position. He has more than earned his salary for this contract and if you took a minute to look at what else is out there for next year, there is no one shy of Beltre that would be an upgrade. I say re-sign him for $5M if you can and concentrate on fixing your real holes.

That's not true at all. He has a career 85 OPS+. He's a bad hitter who had 2 years where he hit over 20 HRs.

We will look back on his career and wonder how in the hell he spent 15 years as a Tiger.

Another thread said that Jose Bautista is on the block. Low average, high power guy this year, would you like to see the tigers go after him?

Not really. I mean, I guess it depends on what they'd have to give up. But I wouldn't want to see the Tigers give up anything of substance for the future to try to win this year. But its close. I think this year is really hard for DD. To go for it or not? Who knows?

IMO you don't sell the farm anymore to get guys to win a division. They probably don't have the juice to win a championship unless they got really hot, and the White Sox and wins aren't exactly juggernauts. I think you do what you can to win the division and make the playoffs short of trading Crosby, Turner, Porcello, etc unless you get a deal you just can't refuse. Bautista doesn't exactly excite me and I think the Blue Jays are selling real high here. Bringing in a guy like Jose Lopez for a fraction of the cost seems like a better idea and then the team can add some higher priced options in the offseason.

 

[MAC_32]

The 3B market is exactly why I think the anti Inge crowd should be a little more careful with what they say about him and what he's done in his time here.

I'm not arguing that he's played up to his contract (he hasn't)nor am I arguing that he has a good bat (he doesn't), but I don't see how Bautista (fluke/career year), Beltre (contract year player), Peralta ( ), and Wigginton (UTIL INF with a streaky bat) are going to be any sort of upgrade.

It's a lot easier to point out the problems than it is to fix them, especially at thin positions like C, SS, and 3B. Corner OF? Completely different animal, and I'm still bitter we didn't push for Abreu two years ago. Dom's done more good than bad with this roster, but how he missed that one is beyond me.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

The 3B market is exactly why I think the anti Inge crowd should be a little more careful with what they say about him and what he's done in his time here.I'm not arguing that he's played up to his contract (he hasn't)nor am I arguing that he has a good bat (he doesn't), but I don't see how Bautista (fluke/career year), Beltre (contract year player), Peralta ( ), and Wigginton (UTIL INF with a streaky bat) are going to be any sort of upgrade.It's a lot easier to point out the problems than it is to fix them, especially at thin positions like C, SS, and 3B. Corner OF? Completely different animal, and I'm still bitter we didn't push for Abreu two years ago. Dom's done more good than bad with this roster, but how he missed that one is beyond me.

I agree on Abreu but a lot of teams made a mistake there in thinking he was on the down slope. With Abreu last year the way he played, they win the division by 5 games. I'm not an Inge hater either, although I do hate him at certain times of the year. If we had a nice bat at SS or at C his hitting would be easier to deal with but he's actually been pretty decent this year. His defense is definitely above average, so I can deal with 18/70/.250/.330. Is he worth 6.6 million? Maybe, maybe not. I don't think that is an awful contract though, even when he is sucking.

 

[Da Guru]

Tigers needs, not in any order.

1. Shortstop- Santiago would suffice if we had a stud hitting second and third baseman, but we don`t.

2. Third baseman- Inge is the classic utility guy that should play 1-2 times a week at most. Too easy an out most of the time. At 6 million a year it is time to end the Inge era or good. No other MLB team would have rode Inge as a starter this long.

3. Second baseman- Guillen may have been OK there 4-5 years ago, but not anymore. No range at all.

4. Catcher- Worst hitting catching tandem in MLB.

5. Need another starter for sure, RP has held up pretty good cosidering the overuse.

6. Need to add another OF that can run and hit with more power than A-Jax. Love A-Jax but he seems more suited to be at the bottom of the order than the top. BB has been an outstanding find but Maggs is getting older and should be the full time DH because he can stilll hit, being DH would keep him fresher.

7. Need a new manager, Leyland was what the Tigers needed in 2006, but not anymore. The message has grown tired.

Dumbrowski has his work cut out.

[*]Getting a catcher is the #1 priority for sure.

[*]They don't need a shortstop, Santiago and Worth are both fine fielders and good enough at the plate. This is the one position where defense is easily more imporatnt than offense, catcher just behind.

[*]Sizemore is going to be just fine going forward at 2B. He's hit at every level and will eventually hit at the ML level. Guillen is done playing in the field though, he's fallen hard the last two years. The only place I'd play him right now is at 3B.

[*]They need another starter, preferably LH. Crosby a LHer will probably be ready next year though, and Crosby is a #2 ceiling starter. But even then, I think they need one more starter. Verlander/Scherzer/Porcello/Crosby/? would be a nice rotation for the next five years.

[*]They need a corner OFer with power, again FA.

[*]This team will be even younger next year so it probably would be a good time to get rid of Leyland. I think he's an above average manager but with the youth movement and with him not wanting to fire McClendon it might be time.

Also keep in mind the O/U on this team's win total this year was 80. They are 50-44 right now so they are slightly above expectations. I also don't get the "Dumbrowski" shtick, considering Boesch, Scherzer, Extending Verlander, Jackson, Cabrera, drafting Porcello, and keeping Mags I would think he'd get more respect than this. Detroit talk radio has no baseball sense.

There are quite a few holes, but unless you can have a $200 million dollar payroll, you will not fill all of the spots. Looking at 3B, SS, and C, we can deal with one of those positions being weak hitting and another being mediocre, but one of those 3 has to hit. Our top 6 lineup spots are good enough. I think Dombrowski has done a good job outside of the bad contracts, but I think Leyland has to go.

I have no problem with Dumbrowski, and I like Leyland. Jus time for a change. The Cabrera trade was one of the most lopsided in MLB history. The Tigers landed a top 5 hitter at the time who now is the best hitter in MLB for two bums!

DD just made bad mistakes in extending deals. I was OK with the Bonderman deal because at the time everyone though we stole Bonderman at that price. Can`t predict injuries. Willis was bad, Guillen and Inge are both way overpaid.

So are you saying Dombrowski should be fired?

Not at all. Just saying he has his work cut out.

 

[Da Guru]

The 3B market is exactly why I think the anti Inge crowd should be a little more careful with what they say about him and what he's done in his time here.I'm not arguing that he's played up to his contract (he hasn't)nor am I arguing that he has a good bat (he doesn't), but I don't see how Bautista (fluke/career year), Beltre (contract year player), Peralta ( ), and Wigginton (UTIL INF with a streaky bat) are going to be any sort of upgrade.It's a lot easier to point out the problems than it is to fix them, especially at thin positions like C, SS, and 3B. Corner OF? Completely different animal, and I'm still bitter we didn't push for Abreu two years ago. Dom's done more good than bad with this roster, but how he missed that one is beyond me.

I agree on Abreu but a lot of teams made a mistake there in thinking he was on the down slope. With Abreu last year the way he played, they win the division by 5 games. I'm not an Inge hater either, although I do hate him at certain times of the year. If we had a nice bat at SS or at C his hitting would be easier to deal with but he's actually been pretty decent this year. His defense is definitely above average, so I can deal with 18/70/.250/.330. Is he worth 6.6 million? Maybe, maybe not. I don't think that is an awful contract though, even when he is sucking.

I can live with one of the three of Inge, Santiago or Laird. We can`t keep trotting all three out there and expect to win a pennant.

 

[Greco]

I miss Inge. There, I said it.

 

[Limp Ditka]

I miss Inge. There, I said it.

 

[Bojang0301]

I am tired of the Leyland defense. They say that a manager will really only impact the decision of a handful of games a year. Well, almost every game I have seen Leyland have an impact on has been a loss. Using the wrong reliever, leaving in a batter who shouldn't be in (year's previous: Granderson, all the time), leaving a pitcher out too long. It just goes on and on. I get it, he's an ok manager that has had a decent career. His overall record is still below .500, his second half of season play with the Tigers is below .500 and Tony Larussa owned him badly in the '06 series. You know he isn't the best out there and he has had more than enough time. Give a new guy a shot or go and get someone you know is the cream of the crop. This second half should be make it or break it time for Leyland... it should have been that way last year.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I would not mind at all if the Tigers got Lilly. If he pitches well he could be re-signed as the LH starter we need, if not he is a FA after the season. Arizona is asking for both Jacob Turner and Oliver which is really a lot to pay. Haren is under contract for the next 2.5 years though and as someone else mentioned, this might be an Illitch decision not a DD decision. I think you get Lilly for a whole lot less or make Arizona take Furbush or another prospect instead of Oliver (we still keep what I think is the #1 pitching prospect in Crosby).

Right now the Tigers have four legitimate pitching prospects that have value to other teams. Crosby and Turner are probably going to be top of the rotation guys while Oliver and Furbush are probably #3 type guys. If you keep them you likely set up years of good starting pitching, most of it developed from within. If you go for Haren you better win a championship in the next three years.

 

[Frostillicus]

They probably don't have the juice to win a championship unless they got really hot, and the White Sox and wins aren't exactly juggernauts.

 

[whoknew]

I hate Gene Lamont. He's the worst 3B coach in MLB.

 

[Greco]

Day 2 Day I pray.

6 to 8 weeks.

/season

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I hate Gene Lamont. He's the worst 3B coach in MLB.

Fun fact: In 1965 Gene was picked in the first round by the Tigers becoming the first drafted player in franchise history.

 

[Limp Ditka]

And now Guillen goes down with a calf strain.

oof

 

[Greco]

Boesch is going to get a concussion if he hits head first when he lands.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a broken ankle.

 

[RenegadeGM]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a broken ankle.

Man, there's absolutely nobody in-house to replace him.Doesn't look like his $15 million extension will kick in now. It's now a club option with no buyout. As nice of a season as he's had, they can't bring him back at his age at that price in 2011.Guillen left with a calf strain tonight too... when it rains, it pours.

 

[igbomb]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a brokenO ankle.

Man, there's absolutely nobody in-house to replace him.Doesn't look like his $15 million extension will kick in now. It's now a club option with no buyout. As nice of a season as he's had, they can't bring him back at his age at that price in 2011.Guillen left with a calf strain tonight too... when it rains, it pours.

I sure hope they are smart enough to stand pat at the deadline and let this season die. It's done.

 

[Limp Ditka]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a brokenO ankle.

Man, there's absolutely nobody in-house to replace him.Doesn't look like his $15 million extension will kick in now. It's now a club option with no buyout. As nice of a season as he's had, they can't bring him back at his age at that price in 2011.Guillen left with a calf strain tonight too... when it rains, it pours.

I sure hope they are smart enough to stand pat at the deadline and let this season die. It's done.

If these things were going to happen, they couldn't have happened at a better time for the Tigers

 

[skillz]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a broken ankle.

How many AB's does he need this year to have his option vest for next year? On the bright side, the injury may prevent the Tigers from having to overpay him to be on the roster in 2011.Lots of Raburn for the rest of the year I guess.

 

[skillz]

Looks like his option won't vest for next season.

From Cot's Contracts:

http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/200...tigers_21.html

2011 option guaranteed at $15M if Ordonez has:

135 starts or 540 PAs in 2010, or

270 starts or 1,080 PAs in 2009-10

2009 PA: 518

2010 PA (incl. tonight): 365

Combined 09/10 PA: 883

2009 GS: 125

2010 GS: 93

Combined 09/10 GS: 218

 

[RenegadeGM]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a broken ankle.

How many AB's does he need this year to have his option vest for next year? On the bright side, the injury may prevent the Tigers from having to overpay him to be on the roster in 2011.Lots of Raburn for the rest of the year I guess.

Magglio Ordonez of

5 years/$75M (2005-09), plus 2010 & 2011 club options

5 years/$75M (2005-09), plus 2010 & 2011 club options

signed by Detroit as a free agent 2/05

$6M signing bonus (due 11/05, not guaranteed)

05:$6M, 06:$15M, 07:$12M, 08:$15M, 09:$18M, 10:$18M club option ($3M buyout), 11:$15M club option (no buyout)

Tigers may void contract after 2005 if Ordonez spends 25 or more days on disabled list in 2005 with recurrence of pre-existing left knee injury

$3M annually deferred from 2008-11 salaries at 1% interest

no-trade protection

2010 option guaranteed at $18M if Ordonez has:

135 starts or 540 PAs in 2009, or

270 starts or 1,080 PAs in 2008-09 (met)

2011 option guaranteed at $15M if Ordonez has:

135 starts or 540 PAs in 2010, or

270 starts or 1,080 PAs in 2009-10

award bonuses: $0.5M for MVP ($1M for subsequent MVPs) ($0.2M for 2nd-5th in MVP vote, $0.1M for 6th-10th); $0.2M for WS MVP; $0.15M for LCS MVP; $0.1M each for Hank Aaron Award, Gold Glove, Silver Slugger, All Star team or BA/TSN/AP All Star ($50,000 for All Star selection)

perks: suite on road, Ordonez to purchase ballpark suite at home

3 years/$29.5M (2002-04)

signed extension with White Sox 7/01

02:$6.5M, 03:$9M, 04:$14M

1 year/$3.75M (2001)

re-signed by White Sox 12/00 (avoided arbitration)

1 year/$0.425M (2000)

1 year/$0.305M (1999)

1 year/$0.175M (1998)

1 year/$0.15M (1997)

signed 1991 as an amateur free agent from Venezuela

agent: Scott Boras (formerly Reich, Katz & Landis)

ML service: 12.032

The Inge and Ordonez injuries hopefully will prevent them from giving up top prospects for a guy like Ted Lilly. Before Magglio's injury the Tigers had something like $53 million coming off the books in 2011... that may have just gone up. I can't see Ilitch spending all of that, but they'd be better off waiting to the offseason to hopefully make significant improvements to the team.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a brokenO ankle.

Man, there's absolutely nobody in-house to replace him.Doesn't look like his $15 million extension will kick in now. It's now a club option with no buyout. As nice of a season as he's had, they can't bring him back at his age at that price in 2011.Guillen left with a calf strain tonight too... when it rains, it pours.

I sure hope they are smart enough to stand pat at the deadline and let this season die. It's done.

Did we move to the AL East?

 

[skillz]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a broken ankle.

How many AB's does he need this year to have his option vest for next year? On the bright side, the injury may prevent the Tigers from having to overpay him to be on the roster in 2011.Lots of Raburn for the rest of the year I guess.

Magglio Ordonez of

5 years/$75M (2005-09), plus 2010 & 2011 club options

5 years/$75M (2005-09), plus 2010 & 2011 club options

signed by Detroit as a free agent 2/05

$6M signing bonus (due 11/05, not guaranteed)

05:$6M, 06:$15M, 07:$12M, 08:$15M, 09:$18M, 10:$18M club option ($3M buyout), 11:$15M club option (no buyout)

Tigers may void contract after 2005 if Ordonez spends 25 or more days on disabled list in 2005 with recurrence of pre-existing left knee injury

$3M annually deferred from 2008-11 salaries at 1% interest

no-trade protection

2010 option guaranteed at $18M if Ordonez has:

135 starts or 540 PAs in 2009, or

270 starts or 1,080 PAs in 2008-09 (met)

2011 option guaranteed at $15M if Ordonez has:

135 starts or 540 PAs in 2010, or

270 starts or 1,080 PAs in 2009-10

award bonuses: $0.5M for MVP ($1M for subsequent MVPs) ($0.2M for 2nd-5th in MVP vote, $0.1M for 6th-10th); $0.2M for WS MVP; $0.15M for LCS MVP; $0.1M each for Hank Aaron Award, Gold Glove, Silver Slugger, All Star team or BA/TSN/AP All Star ($50,000 for All Star selection)

perks: suite on road, Ordonez to purchase ballpark suite at home

3 years/$29.5M (2002-04)

signed extension with White Sox 7/01

02:$6.5M, 03:$9M, 04:$14M

1 year/$3.75M (2001)

re-signed by White Sox 12/00 (avoided arbitration)

1 year/$0.425M (2000)

1 year/$0.305M (1999)

1 year/$0.175M (1998)

1 year/$0.15M (1997)

signed 1991 as an amateur free agent from Venezuela

agent: Scott Boras (formerly Reich, Katz & Landis)

ML service: 12.032

The Inge and Ordonez injuries hopefully will prevent them from giving up top prospects for a guy like Ted Lilly. Before Magglio's injury the Tigers had something like $53 million coming off the books in 2011... that may have just gone up. I can't see Ilitch spending all of that, but they'd be better off waiting to the offseason to hopefully make significant improvements to the team.

Cash coming off the books for next yearMaggs $18 million

Bonderman $12.5 million

Willis $12 million

Nate Robertson $9.6 million

Damon $8 million

Inge $6.6 million

Laird $3.95 million

Verlander will make $6 million more in 2011.

Everyone else makes basically the same salary (unless there is some arbitration I suppose).

Guillen is still making $13 million next year the same as this year.

 

[whoknew]

Mags gone 6-8 weeks with a brokenO ankle. :X

Man, there's absolutely nobody in-house to replace him.Doesn't look like his $15 million extension will kick in now. It's now a club option with no buyout. As nice of a season as he's had, they can't bring him back at his age at that price in 2011.Guillen left with a calf strain tonight too... when it rains, it pours.

I sure hope they are smart enough to stand pat at the deadline and let this season die. It's done.

#### standing pat. Either go for it or sell off.If they aren't going for it - which now seems unlikely - trade Damon, Bonderman and anyone else that they may get something for.