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Patriots being investigated after Colts game (3 Viewers)

Percent of NFL teams actively trying to steal play sheets?

  • 0%

    Votes: 90 33.0%
  • 25%

    Votes: 91 33.3%
  • 50%

    Votes: 19 7.0%
  • 75%

    Votes: 16 5.9%
  • 100%

    Votes: 57 20.9%

  • Total voters
    273
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.

Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.

Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
According to an unnamed source.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
I'm trying to be rationale here and not get into an argument because most of this thread is just like 5 people going back and forth but... what I think is trying to expressed is that people are taking the sources and reports with blind faith. The 11/12 number and 2lbs seem to originate from Mortenson's report which is all unnamed sources etc. You get into murky territory when you dismiss the mistake in one report and accept all the facts from another.

Mort's report could be 100% accurate but it can't be taken as 100% fact at this point. The NFL needs to address the issue and give the public the definitive facts of the case.

As previously stated above, there are a ton of potential variables and questions like were the same gauges used in both tests, did the refs fully and properly check the balls with the gauges, is it just an eyeball test at 12.5 or is it a precision test etc... Also the 2lbs is coming from Mort's report I think and therefore can't be taken as 100% fact at this point. What happens if it is 1.5 instead of 2 or under 1?

Again I am not defending the Patriots as a fanboy saying they are innocent just that the amount of hyperbole and cherry picking going on in this thread is dizzying. It goes to the trend in the sports media in using unconfirmed reports etc in a race for info. Sometimes info reported is wrong.

 
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I was just listening to the local radio which includes Warren Moon--their sentiment matches my own. It probably didn't matter one bit in any of those games and if you had asked those teams if the Patriots could underinflate them they probably wouldn't have had a problem with it.

The issue here is simply that there are rules that everyone follows and if one team is allowed to do it, the other should be able to manipulate the balls how they see fit as well. The act of tampering with the ball and not operating on the same set of rules is more egregious than the advantage it gives them, if that makes any sense.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
i find it so funny that YOU care more about this than the team that is directly involved in the game that this happened

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
i find it so funny that YOU care more about this than the team that is directly involved in the game that this happened
So true Busted Knuckles, Johnny U is the only one that cares. :doh:

Now that that's settled I'll switch on Anderson Cooper to watch him interview a reporter, Mike Perera and an ex-ball-boy. Im sure they have no interest in this and they'll be talking about ISIS.

 
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For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.

 
Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Unfortunately, it's hard to argue with this. I'll also add that the NFL and RG also took yet another direct hit today.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
i find it so funny that YOU care more about this than the team that is directly involved in the game that this happened
My team's season is over and I hope they get better next year by improving their defense, toughness, and running game. I personally feel they need to improve on the OL and get more talent at the RB position, but mostly they need to improve on the DL and at linebacker. I love our DBs, QB, and TE. All of that said, and nothing to do with the Patriots current situation, I think everyone is interested in getting to the truth. Brady is an idiot. All he had to do was say the balls didn't feel right so I asked the ball boy to deflate them some. I didn't mean for them to be deflated under legal limit. If he had done that, this would probably go away, but NOOOOO!!! He had to stand there and tell a bold face lie. When it comes out that he DID lie, the hammer will fall hard. Covering it up will be a lot worse on this organization. The reason why both Hoodie and Brady said this, is because they truly feel they should always deny wrong doings.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
i find it so funny that YOU care more about this than the team that is directly involved in the game that this happened
So true Busted Knuckles, Johnny U is the only one that cares. :doh:

Now that that's settled I'll switch on Anderson Cooper to watch him interview a reporter, Mike Perera and an ex-ball-boy. Im sure they have no interest in this and they'll be talking about ISIS.
i think you missed the point....J U is more upset and angry about this than the colts players ....that isnt strange to you? oh wait...it bothers you as much as J U ....never mind

 
Lol @ Brady claiming be didn't notice the balls were underinflated after playing with them for 2 quarters, yet D'Qwell Jackson noticed immediately after picking him off. These guys

are terrible liars.
http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=12213533
"I'm a linebacker, I'm a defensive guy," Jackson said. "If anybody recognized anything it definitely wouldn't come from me."
He called the fallout "comical."
lets not sweep this tid bit under the rug...the media had this guy being the whistleblower when in fact he never even noticed the ball feeling deflated in the first place ...this is HUGE
We've known this for days, when Kravitz originally made the claim from an 'unknown source' he also claimed that it was brought to their attention when D'qwell noticed it. D'qwell refuted pretty much immediately, I believe he even said so on Kravitz's show.
I don't recall seeing this once in this thread. If I'm wrong, fine. But people have been running with the "DQwell noticed it but brady and the refs didnt" line all day long.
It had been mentioned a couple of times in passing, couple of us asked for links, none were provided ... UNTIL NOW

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
I'd be careful throwing around percentages like that. I think there's a more mathematically complicated connection between the two psi's.

 
I see it's already been posted, but let's keep it going to give all of the "Salty Haters" a chance to come up with some new arguments.


Colts ILB D'Qwell Jackson says he didn't notice anything unusual about the ball he intercepted in Sunday's AFC Championship Game.
Jackson was rumored to be the reason the investigation started, but says that's not the case. "I definitely wouldn't be able to tell if one ball had less pressure than another," Jackson said. "It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the game. They outplayed us. ... I don't feel slighted at all personally." If only the rest of America shared Jackson's desire to move on.
it boils down to credibility and mis-information...both of which the media is on the wrong end of right now
It doesn't matter what Jackson said, the balls were deflated, 11 out of 12 of them. Nothing he said changes that and the question here is how did 11 out 12 of them get deflated?
Wasnt it estblished yesterday that Jackson wasnt the main source of this? Please people, try to keep up.
yes, I heard that also. Just saying it doesn't matter what Jackson says. The proof is in the deflated pudding.
i find it so funny that YOU care more about this than the team that is directly involved in the game that this happened
So true Busted Knuckles, Johnny U is the only one that cares. :doh:

Now that that's settled I'll switch on Anderson Cooper to watch him interview a reporter, Mike Perera and an ex-ball-boy. Im sure they have no interest in this and they'll be talking about ISIS.
i think you missed the point....J U is more upset and angry about this than the colts players ....that isnt strange to you? oh wait...it bothers you as much as J U ....never mind
what bothers me is a a coach and QB that thinks they are above the league and that cheating is ok. That is what bothers me about this.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
what i love about belichick is that I can guarantee you this week in practice he's made sure there's a couple extra pounds in teh practice balls

 
You might be right that both their legacies having taking big hits this week but seem really premature to make that determination prior to the league providing any on the record comments about the situation. Of course, I think that those that already have the opinion that their legacies have taking a hit will continue to think so even if the league absolves them.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
what i love about belichick is that I can guarantee you this week in practice he's made sure there's a couple extra pounds in teh practice balls
Unnamed sources stated that they're practicing with medicine balls.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.
He was questioning if it had an effect on production. Source material says that it didn't. Chill, dude.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
I'm surprised you feel this way, but many media members have similar ideas. What surprises me the most is a lack of outrage at the NFL in this case, and a willingness to throw Belicheck and Brady under the bus and call them both liars for denying wrongdoing in this case.

There are really 2 issues here:

1. A lack of facts. This is a BIG problem. We have not had the NFL come out and give us enough facts. Yet, the media, former players and everyone with an outlet is giving their opinion on a matter when they don't know the facts. The NFL isn't providing facts and thus we are all guessing on a number of important things.

2. Benefit of the doubt. The only thing we THINK we know is this: 11 of 12 balls were underinflated by 2 pounds at halftime. That's it. How did they get this way? No one has any proof. Who is the referee who did the inspection? Why isn't he being interviewed? What were the PSI of the balls 2 hours before the game? Were they manually inspected or not? Why does no one care about this, and everyone assumes that the head coach and quarterback, who are gameplanning to win an AFC championship game, were concerned with the PSI of the footballs?

The simplest answer is usually the best one. It's likely that Brady likes balls on the "deflated side", they deflate them how he likes them, and they submit them for inspection. It's likely that they were accepted without being measured and then lost a bit of pressure due to the cold. The Colts brought it to the attention of the officiating crew in the first half, possibly because they had wondered from a previous meeting and/or the Ravens and the officiating crew actually measured them and found they were under the limits. Then the balls were switched out, the game continued, and the Pats stomped the Colts.

This explanation is simple, doesn't require some grand scheme of deception by the entire organization, doesn't call for Brady and Belicheck to be bold-faced liars, doesn't involve the Patriots sneaking off with balls that Tom approved and letting out 2 pounds of air under the shadow of a tunnel, doesn't involve a scheme from Robert Kraft and Bill Belicheck to lessen the fumbles over a ten-year period, and doesn't involve a super diligent officiating crew that measures the PSI of every football and documents it.

I wish more media would call out the NFL here, instead of slam the Patriots.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
sounds more like wishful thinking

this is a hot topic right now with The View's demographic but when their careers are up and everybody's at the old man bar arguing over the best whoevers ever nobody will remember or give a crap.

we've all learned a lot more about the ball prep process than we ever imagined we would, this week, but as evidenced by the many accounts, including an aaron rodgers interview, these guys have spent all their careers prepping their balls to whatever standard they think might pass inspection, handing them to the refs, and crossing their fingers.

I doubt monitoring every football's psi is high on belichick's superbowl prep list, however much of a detail freak he's become infamous for being.

stop trolling your own site --- nobody in football gives a crap

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.
He was questioning if it had an effect on production. Source material says that it didn't. Chill, dude.
That's irrelevant. Only whether they cheated is relevant.

 
Much to do about nothing. I am surprised that this issue could result in almost 50 pages of discussion.

Even if Belichick purposely deflated the balls himself I don't understand why there would be sanctions. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.
yeah, they did it every other game this year and absolutely nobody else ever noticed...............until that fateful day d'qwell jackson's surgeon's touch came into play!

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.
He was questioning if it had an effect on production. Source material says that it didn't. Chill, dude.
That's irrelevant. Only whether they cheated is relevant.
And since we don't know if they cheated and probably never will, it's all a big pointless discussion.

 
Much to do about nothing. I am surprised that this issue could result in almost 50 pages of discussion.

Even if Belichick purposely deflated the balls himself I don't understand why there would be sanctions. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game.
welcome, newbie

hope you enjoy your time in the shark pool

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
sounds more like wishful thinking

this is a hot topic right now with The View's demographic but when their careers are up and everybody's at the old man bar arguing over the best whoevers ever nobody will remember or give a crap.

we've all learned a lot more about the ball prep process than we ever imagined we would, this week, but as evidenced by the many accounts, including an aaron rodgers interview, these guys have spent all their careers prepping their balls to whatever standard they think might pass inspection, handing them to the refs, and crossing their fingers.

I doubt monitoring every football's psi is high on belichick's superbowl prep list, however much of a detail freak he's become infamous for being.

stop trolling your own site --- nobody in football gives a crap
you pat fans sure use the troll and hater words a lot. It's a shame your team puts its fans through this, knowing their legacy is under a cloud forever. I know that would bother me a lot., so I can sympathize with Pats fans to some degree. No fan should have to look at their team this way.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
sounds more like wishful thinking

this is a hot topic right now with The View's demographic but when their careers are up and everybody's at the old man bar arguing over the best whoevers ever nobody will remember or give a crap.

we've all learned a lot more about the ball prep process than we ever imagined we would, this week, but as evidenced by the many accounts, including an aaron rodgers interview, these guys have spent all their careers prepping their balls to whatever standard they think might pass inspection, handing them to the refs, and crossing their fingers.

I doubt monitoring every football's psi is high on belichick's superbowl prep list, however much of a detail freak he's become infamous for being.

stop trolling your own site --- nobody in football gives a crap
you pat fans sure use the troll and hater words a lot. It's a shame your team puts its fans through this, knowing their legacy is under a cloud forever. I know that would bother me a lot., so I can sympathize with Pats fans to some degree. No fan should have to look at their team this way.
Probably they are sensitive because everyone jumps on the "Pats are cheating" bandwagon when there is no proof of cheating.

 
Much to do about nothing. I am surprised that this issue could result in almost 50 pages of discussion.

Even if Belichick purposely deflated the balls himself I don't understand why there would be sanctions. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game.
I can't believe these kinds of posts are still being made. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, but has to do with whether they cheated or not. Having done this in the past and continue to do it now (arrogance), it is a big deal. I know it is with the other teams and coaches according to DA on talk radio.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
Given this I have two questions:

1. Does Brady always play with under-inflated balls?

2. If #1 is true, and there is an expectation of high scrutiny for the SB, does this affect his grip and passing ability enough to see a dip in production?

I do suspect #1 is true as I don't believe Brady is telling the truth, but I also suspect it won't, in the end, make a bit of difference in his production.
The second half of the Colts game they played with properly inflated balls and the Pats hung 28 unanswered points on them... so...
what does that (if even true) have to do with cheating? So are you saying just because they blew them out it's ok to cheat? How many other games during this season did the Patriots do this? I'm pretty sure it isn't a one time thingy.
He was questioning if it had an effect on production. Source material says that it didn't. Chill, dude.
That's irrelevant. Only whether they cheated is relevant.
And since we don't know if they cheated and probably never will, it's all a big pointless discussion.
TALK TO THE BALL BOY!!!!@

 
Lol @ Brady claiming be didn't notice the balls were underinflated after playing with them for 2 quarters, yet D'Qwell Jackson noticed immediately after picking him off. These guys

are terrible liars.
http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=12213533
Hey look, i found that link you guys wanted. :lol:
Lol.

It's funny that innocent until proven guilty is completely out the window here.

Is this how you would all behave if you were thrown into a jury box?

Blind hatred.

I can understand not giving Bill B. the benefit of the doubt at this point.

But Brady? Give me a break. He's been a stand up guy his entire career. He's given no reason to think he's a liar. None.

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
sounds more like wishful thinking

this is a hot topic right now with The View's demographic but when their careers are up and everybody's at the old man bar arguing over the best whoevers ever nobody will remember or give a crap.

we've all learned a lot more about the ball prep process than we ever imagined we would, this week, but as evidenced by the many accounts, including an aaron rodgers interview, these guys have spent all their careers prepping their balls to whatever standard they think might pass inspection, handing them to the refs, and crossing their fingers.

I doubt monitoring every football's psi is high on belichick's superbowl prep list, however much of a detail freak he's become infamous for being.

stop trolling your own site --- nobody in football gives a crap
you pat fans sure use the troll and hater words a lot. It's a shame your team puts its fans through this, knowing their legacy is under a cloud forever. I know that would bother me a lot., so I can sympathize with Pats fans to some degree. No fan should have to look at their team this way.
what the pats have 'put me through' the last 14 years is an absolute assload of winning by the greatest dynasty in sports, and absolute top shelf awesomeness by awesome people in doing it

I appreciate the sympathy

you can sympathize, but indy fans will never empathize

 
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Much to do about nothing. I am surprised that this issue could result in almost 50 pages of discussion.

Even if Belichick purposely deflated the balls himself I don't understand why there would be sanctions. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game.
I can't believe these kinds of posts are still being made. It had nothing to do with the outcome of the game, but has to do with whether they cheated or not. Having done this in the past and continue to do it now (arrogance), it is a big deal. I know it is with the other teams and coaches according to DA on talk radio.
ok, this whole thing has been a masterful :fishing: but that one pushed it so far over the top even us pats fans are starting to catch on

 
For being cited as one of the best coaches ever, I find it alarming that after 3 days he has no idea how the balls lost 16% of their air pressure in 90 minutes despite being controlled by his staff. I always thought of him as being very detailed oriented. It sure seems like a head coach would be able to trace back all the people that would touch the balls AFTER Brady ok'd them.

To me the press conferences were about what I would expect if the franchise has been doing this for a long time. No one in the equipment is going to tinker with game balls outside of Brady's knowledge. Madden, former QBs are all saying this. Even Belichick said this. The balls are set up the way Brady likes them (which appears to be lower than the 12.5 psi mandated low despite him saying he likes them right at the edge of allowed). The statement by Brady that he touches them all and knows how he likes them pregame, but can't tell the difference of the 2-3 psi later in a game situation seems very disingenuous.

Belichick's press conference was to pass the buck to Brady. Brady's presser was just to buy time so he gets to play in the Super Bowl. I have no dog in this race, but it was hard watching Brady say things that look to be outright lies. I do think the legacies of both Belichick and Brady took a big hit this week in everyone but the biggest Patriot fan's eyes.
I'm surprised you feel this way, but many media members have similar ideas. What surprises me the most is a lack of outrage at the NFL in this case, and a willingness to throw Belicheck and Brady under the bus and call them both liars for denying wrongdoing in this case.

There are really 2 issues here:

1. A lack of facts. This is a BIG problem. We have not had the NFL come out and give us enough facts. Yet, the media, former players and everyone with an outlet is giving their opinion on a matter when they don't know the facts. The NFL isn't providing facts and thus we are all guessing on a number of important things.

2. Benefit of the doubt. The only thing we THINK we know is this: 11 of 12 balls were underinflated by 2 pounds at halftime. That's it. How did they get this way? No one has any proof. Who is the referee who did the inspection? Why isn't he being interviewed? What were the PSI of the balls 2 hours before the game? Were they manually inspected or not? Why does no one care about this, and everyone assumes that the head coach and quarterback, who are gameplanning to win an AFC championship game, were concerned with the PSI of the footballs?

The simplest answer is usually the best one. It's likely that Brady likes balls on the "deflated side", they deflate them how he likes them, and they submit them for inspection. It's likely that they were accepted without being measured and then lost a bit of pressure due to the cold. The Colts brought it to the attention of the officiating crew in the first half, possibly because they had wondered from a previous meeting and/or the Ravens and the officiating crew actually measured them and found they were under the limits. Then the balls were switched out, the game continued, and the Pats stomped the Colts.

This explanation is simple, doesn't require some grand scheme of deception by the entire organization, doesn't call for Brady and Belicheck to be bold-faced liars, doesn't involve the Patriots sneaking off with balls that Tom approved and letting out 2 pounds of air under the shadow of a tunnel, doesn't involve a scheme from Robert Kraft and Bill Belicheck to lessen the fumbles over a ten-year period, and doesn't involve a super diligent officiating crew that measures the PSI of every football and documents it.

I wish more media would call out the NFL here, instead of slam the Patriots.
I don't understand why you have this idea that the Patriots are off the hook if the NFL didn't test the balls or didn't test them properly before the game. It was the Patriots' responsibility to bring legal balls to the game. Heck, Brady himself was one of the guys that championed the rule allowing the teams to bring their own footballs, which I'm assuming came with the stipulation that those balls be legal.

Whether they were letting air out of the ball after inspection or under-inflating the balls ahead of time because they knew that the refs always skipped the inspections doesn't seem that relevant. It's like saying you don't deserve a ticket because usually when you speed in that spot, there isn't a cop there with a radar gun.

 
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