Patriots being investigated after Colts game (5 Viewers)

[BustedKnuckles]

This is such an odd phenomenon...this entire situation and how crazy people are about it

 

[massraider]

My point in bringing up the court thing was, in court they wouldn't make Brady self-incriminate himself. But the leage would levy a suspension for not cooperating with the investigation . . . which would be one reason why it would go to court.

In a criminal trial the defendant does not have to speak. In a civil case the defendant can be compelled to turn over documents and to respond in interrogatories, depositions, and in testimony. If a civil defendant refuses cooperation the court can instruct the jury that they may draw negative inferences therefrom. Your speculation does not comport with the process in a civil hearing, which this is most analogous to, though, being based upon League rules and procedures is not entirely so.

Hmmm, if the above is true (and I have no reason to doubt anyone calling themselves Ditkaless Wonders) then I am guessing Tom wouldn't care to turn over cell phones and emails, and this whole legal fight talk isn't going anywhere.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

 

[rockaction]

I wish I practiced at this point. I'm still sure that all the "legal fight" talk is a pure negotiation ploy and scare tactic, and that the NFL knows this. Doesn't mean it won't work, but they're probably a) prepared for the situation and b) confident they can win in front of an arbitrator (assuming that's who hears the case under the CBA)

 

[The General]

This is such an odd phenomenon...this entire situation and how crazy people are about it

You are in a Fantasy Football forum in May. Think this isn't the best place to get perspective.

People I work with who are casual sports fans barely know this is a thing.

 

[massraider]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be.

Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

Can you find someone that believes the Colts win that game with legal footballs? You can't. And the Colts fans around here were the FIRST ones to say it didn't matter in that game. So who are you arguing with?

The important question is: Do you believe this was the first time it happened?

Then you can ask: Did the Patriots beat everyone by 38 points?

If you answered no to both of those questions, then grab a torch, buddy.

 

[rockaction]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

Like I said, not a practicing lawyer, but I would think that the CBA governs where any appeal or action by Brady is heard and that it's likely an arbitrator that will hear any appeal under the CBA. I would guess Brady could sue and claim that this isn't governed by the CBA in some way, but I am guessing that would be a claim that is unlikely to win.

I'd hope a labor lawyer and employment lawyer would chime in here. Or DW, who seems to know his proverbial ####.

 

[rockaction]

This is such an odd phenomenon...this entire situation and how crazy people are about it

You are in a Fantasy Football forum in May. Think this isn't the best place to get perspective.

People I work with who are casual sports fans barely know this is a thing.

Then again, this was a prominent story on the Today Show, ESPN, Jon Stewart, every sports talk radio show, discussed on the front pages of SI.com, ESPN.com, etc.

Everyone is on this story.

 

[massraider]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

Like I said, not a practicing lawyer, but I would think that the CBA governs where any appeal or action by Brady is heard and that it's likely an arbitrator that will hear any appeal under the CBA. I would guess Brady could sue and claim that this isn't governed by the CBA in some way, but I am guessing that would be a claim that is unlikely to win.

I'd hope a labor lawyer and employment lawyer would chime in here. Or DW, who seems to know his proverbial ####.

This isn't under the CBA at all.

Teams and players don't collectively bargain about the integrity of the sport, and the player is really at the mercy of Troy Vincent here.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

I do not believe I implied, nor that it is reasonable to have inferred, that I believe or stated that civil process is not a two way street. I do, however, believe you massively overstate the fact that the NFL would have to turn over every scrape of paper or electronic evidence. Any Court would readily limit the scope of any inquiry to a time frame and a subject matter scope. The court would also entertain motions to limit production based upon various privileges. The Court would often demand provisional production for examination by the court in camera (privately by the court for those not intellectually polluted by a legal education) and would turn over only those matters relevant to the controversy at issue.

 

[JohnnyU]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

 

[The General]

This is such an odd phenomenon...this entire situation and how crazy people are about it

You are in a Fantasy Football forum in May. Think this isn't the best place to get perspective.

People I work with who are casual sports fans barely know this is a thing.

Then again, this was a prominent story on the Today Show, ESPN, Jon Stewart, every sports talk radio show, discussed on the front pages of SI.com, ESPN.com, etc.

Everyone is on this story.

Talking about it is expected. It's the NFL and it's one of the biggest names in the game.

If you ask average person they give you an "oh yeah Brady let air out of his ball or something" type answer and move on.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Well people were talking lawsuits and discovery. You may be right about the CBA or maybe this is outside the CBA. Brady could also sue for defamation if the statement accuses him of cheating outright. He could claim lack of due process if the penalty is too great. And the last we heard from Troy Vincent he was in the middle if the AP situation. AP sued and won, but we never got to hear the merits if whether Vincent had led AP to rely on false promises.

Pure speculation for the fun of it, but bottom line is Goodell has made a real habit of going too far and then getting slapped down for it in court. Restraint would be advised here.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

Like I said, not a practicing lawyer, but I would think that the CBA governs where any appeal or action by Brady is heard and that it's likely an arbitrator that will hear any appeal under the CBA. I would guess Brady could sue and claim that this isn't governed by the CBA in some way, but I am guessing that would be a claim that is unlikely to win.

I'd hope a labor lawyer and employment lawyer would chime in here. Or DW, who seems to know his proverbial ####.

This is generally far from my area of practice concentration. I am no sports law, labor, or employment attorney. Primarily I concentrate in providing advice and service to a police department. That means I know my constitutional stuff, particularly fourth amendment stuff pretty well, and have prosecution and civil litigation experience beyond most. The questions in this matter have, thus far, been so elementary I have felt minimally qualified to opine. I still say we would be far better advised on these types of issues if somebody could get Big Bottom or Henry Ford into this thread. Those guys are wicked smart, and in the case of one, dead bang sexy.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

no, the point is that the WORLD CHAMPION new england patriots humiliated and emasculated the colts 45-7 in front of the entire world.

which is about what we'd expect, after embarrassing them 42-20 in the regular season, the hero of that game being our practice squad rb getting 200 yds, which was an almost identical score to the 43-22 drubbing in the playoffs of the previous year wherein blount put up a crazy 166 yds and 4 td, which was most likely particularly painful after the 59-24 whipping they suffered the prior year, when luck was first introduced to his new masters and the trend was established.

that is the point.

can't blame colts management and their fans for being a little salty and butthurt.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

DW that works both ways, in court Brady, who can afford every lawyer in the world, can seek Goidell's emails, texts, electronic documents, and every scrap if paper the NFL has jammed into warehouses from Manhattan to Paramus. It's an open question who has more to lose.

I do not believe I implied, nor that it is reasonable to have inferred, that I believe or stated that civil process is not a two way street. I do, however, believe you massively overstate the fact that the NFL would have to turn over every scrape of paper or electronic evidence. Any Court would readily limit the scope of any inquiry to a time frame and a subject matter scope. The court would also entertain motions to limit production based upon various privileges. The Court would often demand provisional production for examination by the court in camera (privately by the court for those not intellectually polluted by a legal education) and would turn over only those matters relevant to the controversy at issue.

I didn't say you were implying it wasn't possible, I was just raising the issue.But you're right, not every bit of data and paper would be accessible, just whatever the NFL has said and what Goodell has seen/read over the years on this particular issue.

As for privilege, there is zero reason the basic rule of maintaining pressure in balls would ever be subject to review by an attorney, unless maybe the league had reason to consult a lawyer about investigating the Pats. Now why would they want to do that...

(By the way the formatting here in this thread and on the forums seems off today, is that just me or is there some glitch going on?)

 

[the moops]

Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

I am sure if he came out and admitted to deflating footballs all of this nonsense would go away

 

[Jercules]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

no, the point is that the WORLD CHAMPION new england patriots humiliated and emasculated the colts 45-7 in front of the entire world.

which is about what we'd expect, after embarrassing them 42-20 in the regular season, the hero of that game being our practice squad rb getting 200 yds, which was an almost identical score to the 43-22 drubbing in the playoffs of the previous year wherein blount put up a crazy 166 yds and 4 td, which was most likely particularly painful after the 59-24 whipping they suffered the prior year, when luck was first introduced to his new masters and the trend was established.

that is the point.

can't blame colts management and their fans for being a little salty and butthurt.

You know the two things most damning about Gray's performance? No negative rushes, and no rushes beyond 20 yards.

He was never stopped in the backfield, and he didn't have any Chris Johnson-esque 80 yard runs to pad the stats. Just straight up, steam-rolling domination by an O-Line that's gotten even bigger and will get help from another mammoth TE.

Funny to see Colts fans on the 'tar Brady' bandwagon when we could whup them with Uncle Rico at quarterback.

 

[rick6668]

Anyone remember what happened to woman-beaters before Ray Rice?

Yeah, me either. Because nothing happened. Yet Rice was effectively kicked out of the league.

Anybody remember when Tom Brady nearly killed his wife on video tape? Wait, he let some air out of some footballs....

And then lied about it. Pete Rose got kicked out of baseball for gambling and then lying. Tom cheated and lied. He needs similar treatment to Rose.

come on.

Okay maybe not a lifetime ban but at least a year. What kind of message does this send our kids? You can cheat, lie AND get away with it?

what kind of message does acting like a whiny dbag on the internet send your kids?

Ask your kids and let us know.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

I am sure if he came out and admitted to deflating footballs all of this nonsense would go away

Is this the same commish and league that claimed they never got the Rice tapes? Ok.

 

[mbuehner]

Anyone remember what happened to woman-beaters before Ray Rice?

Yeah, me either. Because nothing happened. Yet Rice was effectively kicked out of the league.

Anybody remember when Tom Brady nearly killed his wife on video tape? Wait, he let some air out of some footballs....

And then lied about it. Pete Rose got kicked out of baseball for gambling and then lying. Tom cheated and lied. He needs similar treatment to Rose.

Lol. Ok guy.

It's true. cheated. Lied. Not sure how you can defend that honestly.

So if i suggested Brady should be burned at the stake as punishment, saying thats ridiculous means youre defending his actions?

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

(By the way the formatting here in this thread and on the forums seems off today, is that just me or is there some glitch going on?)

 

[mbuehner]

Still curious to where on the scale of cheating this falls on. Yes, they did it and it seems to potentially have given NE an advantage. But didn't they say at the start of this it only changed the weight of the ball by the weight of a dollar bill?

The other two questions I had were about the investigation. If this were a court case, a defendant would not have to testify and self incriminate himself. But in a private investigation you have no choice?

Also, if it is found on appeal or in court that the report did not prove Brady deflated a football or they have nothing that can directly tie him to telling someone else to deflate a ball, theoretically would everything after that get wiped out (not fully cooperating with the investigation, not giving cell phone, lying, etc. ).

I am not trying to make things so Brady skates. Just wondering from a procedural perspective if they haven't directly proven his involvement does that make the rest of the mess after go away.

Scuffing a baseball. The real crime was the coverup.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

no, the point is that the WORLD CHAMPION new england patriots humiliated and emasculated the colts 45-7 in front of the entire world.

which is about what we'd expect, after embarrassing them 42-20 in the regular season, the hero of that game being our practice squad rb getting 200 yds, which was an almost identical score to the 43-22 drubbing in the playoffs of the previous year wherein blount put up a crazy 166 yds and 4 td, which was most likely particularly painful after the 59-24 whipping they suffered the prior year, when luck was first introduced to his new masters and the trend was established.

that is the point.

can't blame colts management and their fans for being a little salty and butthurt.

You know the two things most damning about Gray's performance? No negative rushes, and no rushes beyond 20 yards.

He was never stopped in the backfield, and he didn't have any Chris Johnson-esque 80 yard runs to pad the stats. Just straight up, steam-rolling domination by an O-Line that's gotten even bigger and will get help from another mammoth TE.

Funny to see Colts fans on the 'tar Brady' bandwagon when we could whup them with Uncle Rico at quarterback.

yeah, look how excited they all are about gore and andre --- maybe if brady gets suspended that game we can just go old school and run the ball every down without even a single pass.

we'll put in an extra blocker and direct snap to blount.

lolz

 

[mbuehner]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

no, the point is that the WORLD CHAMPION new england patriots humiliated and emasculated the colts 45-7 in front of the entire world.

which is about what we'd expect, after embarrassing them 42-20 in the regular season, the hero of that game being our practice squad rb getting 200 yds, which was an almost identical score to the 43-22 drubbing in the playoffs of the previous year wherein blount put up a crazy 166 yds and 4 td, which was most likely particularly painful after the 59-24 whipping they suffered the prior year, when luck was first introduced to his new masters and the trend was established.

that is the point.

can't blame colts management and their fans for being a little salty and butthurt.

You know the two things most damning about Gray's performance? No negative rushes, and no rushes beyond 20 yards.

He was never stopped in the backfield, and he didn't have any Chris Johnson-esque 80 yard runs to pad the stats. Just straight up, steam-rolling domination by an O-Line that's gotten even bigger and will get help from another mammoth TE.

Funny to see Colts fans on the 'tar Brady' bandwagon when we could whup them with Uncle Rico at quarterback.

yeah, look how excited they all are about gore and andre --- maybe if brady gets suspended that game we can just go old school and run the ball every down without even a single pass.

we'll put in an extra blocker and direct snap to blount.

lolz

And next year they will outlaw that formation.

 

[The General]

Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

I am sure if he came out and admitted to deflating footballs all of this nonsense would go away

It would be a lot better than denying the obvious and in Kraft's case crying about needing an apology.

 

[rockaction]

Watching mbuehner and Kool-Aid Larry work off of each other is like watching Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Hulk Hogan become tag team partners.

Perfect for simpletons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62bYUbiPpc4

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Do people really want Brady to be suspended for this?

How tainted will the Super Bowl be this year if the Patriots fail to make the playoffs due to the Brady's suspension? Talk about having team with an asterisk next to its Super Bowl win.

This year's superbowl wouldn't be tainted at all due to a suspension of Brady. Last year's superbowl however...

Go flog that dead horse elsewhere.

We get it. You love Brady. To you he can do no wrong. You have to understand not everyone feels that way and instead feel his reputation has taken a huge hit just like any other athlete who has been caught cheating.

I have no love whatsoever for Tom Brady. Most people know that I am a Vikings fan. I just believe playing with an under inflated ball is not this huge advantage that people are making it out to be. Dwayne Allen gets it: "They could have played with soap for balls and beat us. Simply the better team." Other people don't

You're missing the point. Not only did Brady cheat he lied about it, which is worse than cheating.

no, the point is that the WORLD CHAMPION new england patriots humiliated and emasculated the colts 45-7 in front of the entire world.

which is about what we'd expect, after embarrassing them 42-20 in the regular season, the hero of that game being our practice squad rb getting 200 yds, which was an almost identical score to the 43-22 drubbing in the playoffs of the previous year wherein blount put up a crazy 166 yds and 4 td, which was most likely particularly painful after the 59-24 whipping they suffered the prior year, when luck was first introduced to his new masters and the trend was established.

that is the point.

can't blame colts management and their fans for being a little salty and butthurt.

You know the two things most damning about Gray's performance? No negative rushes, and no rushes beyond 20 yards.

He was never stopped in the backfield, and he didn't have any Chris Johnson-esque 80 yard runs to pad the stats. Just straight up, steam-rolling domination by an O-Line that's gotten even bigger and will get help from another mammoth TE.

Funny to see Colts fans on the 'tar Brady' bandwagon when we could whup them with Uncle Rico at quarterback.

yeah, look how excited they all are about gore and andre --- maybe if brady gets suspended that game we can just go old school and run the ball every down without even a single pass.

we'll put in an extra blocker and direct snap to blount.

lolz

And next year they will outlaw that formation.

maybe they should just cut to the chase and outlaw blowouts and domination, then everything the pats do could be asterisked

 

[the moops]

Still curious to where on the scale of cheating this falls on. Yes, they did it and it seems to potentially have given NE an advantage. But didn't they say at the start of this it only changed the weight of the ball by the weight of a dollar bill?

The other two questions I had were about the investigation. If this were a court case, a defendant would not have to testify and self incriminate himself. But in a private investigation you have no choice?

Also, if it is found on appeal or in court that the report did not prove Brady deflated a football or they have nothing that can directly tie him to telling someone else to deflate a ball, theoretically would everything after that get wiped out (not fully cooperating with the investigation, not giving cell phone, lying, etc. ).

I am not trying to make things so Brady skates. Just wondering from a procedural perspective if they haven't directly proven his involvement does that make the rest of the mess after go away.

Scuffing a baseball. The real crime was the coverup.

Joe Niekro got 10 games for his infamous emery board thing. So one game sounds about right for Brady

 

[mbuehner]

Watching mbuehner and Kool-Aid Larry work off of each other is like watching Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Hulk Hogan become tag team partners.

Perfect for simpletons.

Am i supposed to take being compared to Hacksaw as an insult?

 

[massraider]

For Realz!!!

Are you gonna enforce the ENTIRE rule book, NFL?

Where oh where will the persecution stop??

 

[JohnnyU]

For Realz!!!

Are you gonna enforce the ENTIRE rule book, NFL?

Where oh where will the persecution stop??

Yeah, why even have a rule book?

 

[rockaction]

NFL has always been totes out to get the Pats

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/sports/football/16spy.html?_r=0

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Watching mbuehner and Kool-Aid Larry work off of each other is like watching Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Hulk Hogan become tag team partners.

Perfect for simpletons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62bYUbiPpc4

ummmmm.....did you just zing yourself?

 

[mbuehner]

I love this, dare to suggest the punishment shouldnt be a lifetime ban on Brady and the record book changed and you don't care about the rules.

Brady will get about 4 games, knocked back to 2, and this will be over. The upside is all the Pats haters can settle in and believe it was 2psi of air pressure that seperated the Jets from a decade of domination. Im cool with all of that.

 

[massraider]

NFL has always been totes out to get the Pats

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/sports/football/16spy.html?_r=0

You know, my favorite part of SpyGate, was the little shnook they had taping the Jets sideline. After Mangini sent security down there to remove him, he was frantically signalling the Pats sideline. I think that guy thought he was getting executed, and dumped in the Meadowlands like Jimmy Hoffa.

Thank god he didn't have a hollow tooth filled with cyanide.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Watching mbuehner and Kool-Aid Larry work off of each other is like watching Hacksaw Jim Duggan and Hulk Hogan become tag team partners.

Perfect for simpletons.

no, I think he's saying his fellow wwf fans are the simpletons.

or possibly there's some reference I'm not getting about hacksaw and hogan's partnership being easily seen through, but this is getting a little beyond my areas of expertise.

although, if hacksaw was really all that smart he'd have used the actual hacksaw instead of that board I'm assuming he cut with it.

 

[JohnnyU]

I love this, dare to suggest the punishment shouldnt be a lifetime ban on Brady and the record book changed and you don't care about the rules.

Brady will get about 4 games, knocked back to 2, and this will be over. The upside is all the Pats haters can settle in and believe it was 2psi of air pressure that seperated the Jets from a decade of domination. Im cool with all of that.

He should get 8 games and BB 6 games because he is the chief and the Pats lose a 1st round pick. That would be due justice. I'm cool with all of that.

 

[massraider]

I love this, dare to suggest the punishment shouldnt be a lifetime ban on Brady and the record book changed and you don't care about the rules.

Brady will get about 4 games, knocked back to 2, and this will be over. The upside is all the Pats haters can settle in and believe it was 2psi of air pressure that seperated the Jets from a decade of domination. Im cool with all of that.

You know what happens when someone rapes more than one person? They call him a serial rapist.

Serial cheaters.

My mom used to whack me twice, once for the crime, and once for the time she didn't catch me.

Belichick is smarter than the rest. What's the chances they've been caught every time they cheated?

Pretty slim, no?

 

[massraider]

I love this, dare to suggest the punishment shouldnt be a lifetime ban on Brady and the record book changed and you don't care about the rules.

Brady will get about 4 games, knocked back to 2, and this will be over. The upside is all the Pats haters can settle in and believe it was 2psi of air pressure that seperated the Jets from a decade of domination. Im cool with all of that.

He should get 8 games and BB 6 games because he is the chief and the Pats lose a 1st round pick. That would be due justice. I'm cool with all of that.

I'm cool with that.

I think 6 for Tom is the sweet spot.

 

[rockaction]

NFL has always been totes out to get the Pats

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/sports/football/16spy.html?_r=0

You know, my favorite part of SpyGate, was the little shnook they had taping the Jets sideline. After Mangini sent security down there to remove him, he was frantically signalling the Pats sideline. I think that guy thought he was getting executed, and dumped in the Meadowlands like Jimmy Hoffa.

Thank god he didn't have a hollow tooth filled with cyanide.

I'd never heard that. Are there any links? That is

 

[Old Smiley]

Still curious to where on the scale of cheating this falls on. Yes, they did it and it seems to potentially have given NE an advantage. But didn't they say at the start of this it only changed the weight of the ball by the weight of a dollar bill?

The other two questions I had were about the investigation. If this were a court case, a defendant would not have to testify and self incriminate himself. But in a private investigation you have no choice?

Also, if it is found on appeal or in court that the report did not prove Brady deflated a football or they have nothing that can directly tie him to telling someone else to deflate a ball, theoretically would everything after that get wiped out (not fully cooperating with the investigation, not giving cell phone, lying, etc. ).

I am not trying to make things so Brady skates. Just wondering from a procedural perspective if they haven't directly proven his involvement does that make the rest of the mess after go away.

Scuffing a baseball. The real crime was the coverup.

Joe Niekro got 10 games for his infamous emery board thing. So one game sounds about right for Brady

There's a big difference between all of these supposed analogues. There is NO proven competitive advantage to underinflated footballs. This is all and only about what the finicky quarterback prefers. The number is in the rule book because it's a manufacturer's recommendation. No other reason.

Somebody (can't remember the name -- uses Magnum P.I. as his avatar) said way up thread that it's more like the "Do Not Remove This Tag" tag on a mattress.

As usual, our brain-dead league let a bunch of pearl-clutching moralizing click-hunters completely run away with the narrative, and now the league is responding to that runaway, horse dung narrative.

Enjoy.

 

[mbuehner]

I love this, dare to suggest the punishment shouldnt be a lifetime ban on Brady and the record book changed and you don't care about the rules.

Brady will get about 4 games, knocked back to 2, and this will be over. The upside is all the Pats haters can settle in and believe it was 2psi of air pressure that seperated the Jets from a decade of domination. Im cool with all of that.

He should get 8 games and BB 6 games because he is the chief and the Pats lose a 1st round pick. That would be due justice. I'm cool with all of that.

I'm cool with that.I think 6 for Tom is the sweet spot.

I wouldnt argue with 6.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

There is NO proven competitive advantage to underinflated footballs.

Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback of all time, but he doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to playing the position.

 

[mbuehner]

There is NO proven competitive advantage to underinflated footballs.

Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback of all time, but he doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to playing the position.

Richard Nixon was up 15 points a couple months before the election and would win 48 states. He proceeded to place a bug in the DNC headquarters.

People do irrational things all the time.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

There is NO proven competitive advantage to underinflated footballs.

Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback of all time, but he doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to playing the position.

Richard Nixon was up 15 points a couple months before the election and would win 48 states. He proceeded to place a bug in the DNC headquarters.

People do irrational things all the time.

If you're comparing Tom Brady to Richard Nixon as way to defend Brady, it might be time to step away from the internet for a little while.

 

[rockaction]

^

Beat me to it.

 

[Old Smiley]

Brady likes what he likes. This was probably all unspoken. A wink and a nod and a STUPID day worker.

edit: Like, I'll bet Brady was always griping about the balls. And the worker/texter took it upon himself to do whatever he did. Hence, all the cussing Tom in the text.

 

[mbuehner]

There is NO proven competitive advantage to underinflated footballs.

Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback of all time, but he doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to playing the position.

Richard Nixon was up 15 points a couple months before the election and would win 48 states. He proceeded to place a bug in the DNC headquarters.People do irrational things all the time.

If you're comparing Tom Brady to Richard Nixon as way to defend Brady, it might be time to step away from the internet for a little while.

Is there any way to participate in this conversation without being told your defending Brady if you arent calling to burn him in effigy and chase him out of Boston with torches?

 

[FBG Moderator]

There is no reason for personal attacks. If you cannot discuss things like a mature adult, don't post.