Patriots could be in trouble all over again... (1 Viewer)

[Class Dismissed]

Holy cow. This is truly the most overblown (non) story in the history of SPORTS. I really can't believe it got this big. This just proves how powerful sports media really is in this day and age. Specifically ESPN; their coverage of this has been so far beyond irresponsible that it’s not even funny. I actually feel sorry for NE, because I honestly think that they have become a pawn in something much bigger than filming freaking signals from the sidelines. All of you Patriot haters are naive if you think that NE or Belichick invented the practice of signal stealing. That is absurd!!!

It doesn’t take much of an effort for any sensible person to see that ESPN and Mike Fish (who has been fueling this story out of control from the start), have connections to Sen. Arlen Specter. The good Senator (not surprisingly) has been indirectly involved in a lengthy fight with the NFL because of its stand-off with Comcast over the NFLN. Ironically, Comcast is one of Specter's largest campaign contributors (go figure).



This is all about $$ people. Hate the Patriots all you want for how they carry themselves, but PLEASE don’t be so ignorant to actually believe that the integrity of the game is tarnished because NE taped signals from the sidelines as opposed to the Press box. That is just beyond silly. Every team in the league steals signals (legally) from the press box. All the Patriots have been proven wrong for, is stealing them (Illegally) FROM THE SIDELINES. How this is not understood at this point is just mind boggling to me.

What Belichick did, is provide the opponents of the NFLN with a perfect catalyst to take their fight to the next level. Goodell has handled this whole situation terribly from the start, and in the process has really put the league and their current position at a disadvantage.

I see this posted on this board by you and a couple others, I have seen it in huge letters. it's obvious that several are very passionate about this stance, but I'm not sure I understand the logic, are you suggesting that the rule states you can tape opposing coaches signals from the press box, or is the Press Box omitted from the language of the rules, therefore making it acceptable and subject to interpretation?If you, or anyone else could clarify that it would be greatly appreciated.

This is what I read (from the rule book), and how I came to that conclusion. Hopefully this is what you were looking for. V. Miscellaneous Rules and Regulations

A. No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game.

B. If clubs believe that violations of any of the Origination, Editing, Exchange, or Shipping rules have occurred, such violations should be brought to the attention of the Vice President of Officiating. Also, please inform the Video Directors Committee of any known violations. The Competition Committee will also urge that the Commissioner take appropriate disciplinary action in cases of substantiated violations.

C. Teams will be required to supply a yearly allotment of tapes to the Dub Center at NFL Films. Quantity required per club will be given to each team by May prior to the upcoming season. Tape stock will consist of brand-new 62-minute Beta SX tapes. For the 2007 season, 4,400 NEW tapes will be required.

D. To ensure the protection of equipment and employees of the team's video departments, please follow the guidelines listed for the video shooting locations at your stadium:

-All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead.

-Any doors entering the shooting locations within the public seating areas of the stadium are required to be lockable from both the inside and the outside of the location to prevent unwarranted access.

-All locations must have climate control (heat and/or fans). Any heaters and/or fans must be completely operational and produce the effect that is required. Heaters that do not produce any heat should be replaced.

-All locations must supply adequate power for each team (at least two outlets per team).

-All locations must be installed with the required video printer lines from both the sideline and the end zone shooting locations to the coaches' booth and field. It is not required that wiring be installed for the opposite end zone position, but if the opposite end zone is wired for the home team, it must also be wired for the visiting team. Home teams must provide visiting teams with the same situational set up for printers that they have themselves (i.e. cover, placement behind the bench, etc.)

-It is suggested that each location provide either countertop space or tables for both teams in the booth and a table on the field and coaches' booth.

Please ascertain that your club is in compliance with these guidelines.

What I get from this, is that NE took it a step further by actually filming the signals from the sidelines (strictly prohibited in the rules), but had they been filming from another enclosed location (such as the press box), it would have been perfectly legal. Maybe im reading it wrong, but that is how I interpret them. If that is not the case (and someone can explain in further detail, (in all seriousness) I'd love to hear it.

As far as I've understood the rules in play for this whole episode, you've got it nailed. The location of the camera is the rule that was broken.

But what about this?On top of that, the NFL's executive vice president for football operations sent a recent memorandum to head coaches and general managers that made clear that videotaping of any kind, including taping of an opposing team's offensive or defensive signals, is not permitted on the sidelines, in a coaches' booth, in a locker room, or from any other place available to a team's staff during a game.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

OOPS, sorry my bad, I had meant to reply to the Groovus post not yours and I did not mean to lump you in with the haters. Probably should have left MOP out as well since afaik he is only guilty of starting the mis-informed thread from the mis-informed article. Moving on however, Steelroid and Groovus have both been relentless with their bashing for quite sometime and can aptly be called haters who incessantly trash NE post after post regardless of fact. I ignore the vast majority of the haters opinion based posts, but when they appear to so clearly have their facts wrong it is nice to set the record straight as it speaks direectly to their credibility or lack thereof.Not sure I was looking for a conversation; just trying to point out that it appears as if Goodell isn't the only "bumbling fool" (your words not mine) in all this

Bro, in this very thread... I only posted when a NE apologist LIED to everyone here. A flat out LIE. A made up story. Now you call me names in this thread. He even chastised others who didn't "remember" his made up story. What did you say to him? Was it okay that I posted the truth of what the NFL and the commissioner stated on the record? Or was that just hate?

 

[BILLY_THE_BULL]

Holy cow. This is truly the most overblown (non) story in the history of SPORTS. I really can't believe it got this big. This just proves how powerful sports media really is in this day and age. Specifically ESPN; their coverage of this has been so far beyond irresponsible that it’s not even funny. I actually feel sorry for NE, because I honestly think that they have become a pawn in something much bigger than filming freaking signals from the sidelines. All of you Patriot haters are naive if you think that NE or Belichick invented the practice of signal stealing. That is absurd!!!

It doesn’t take much of an effort for any sensible person to see that ESPN and Mike Fish (who has been fueling this story out of control from the start), have connections to Sen. Arlen Specter. The good Senator (not surprisingly) has been indirectly involved in a lengthy fight with the NFL because of its stand-off with Comcast over the NFLN. Ironically, Comcast is one of Specter's largest campaign contributors (go figure).

This is all about $$ people. Hate the Patriots all you want for how they carry themselves, but PLEASE don’t be so ignorant to actually believe that the integrity of the game is tarnished because NE taped signals from the sidelines as opposed to the Press box. That is just beyond silly. Every team in the league steals signals (legally) from the press box. All the Patriots have been proven wrong for, is stealing them (Illegally) FROM THE SIDELINES. How this is not understood at this point is just mind boggling to me.

What Belichick did, is provide the opponents of the NFLN with a perfect catalyst to take their fight to the next level. Goodell has handled this whole situation terribly from the start, and in the process has really put the league and their current position at a disadvantage.

Guy A is prescribed marijuana and smokes it legally.Guy B grows his own marijuana and smokes it illegally.

Seems that there can be a major difference when something can be both legal & illegal.

 

[Road Warriors]

Holy cow. This is truly the most overblown (non) story in the history of SPORTS. I really can't believe it got this big. This just proves how powerful sports media really is in this day and age. Specifically ESPN; their coverage of this has been so far beyond irresponsible that it’s not even funny. I actually feel sorry for NE, because I honestly think that they have become a pawn in something much bigger than filming freaking signals from the sidelines. All of you Patriot haters are naive if you think that NE or Belichick invented the practice of signal stealing. That is absurd!!!

It doesn’t take much of an effort for any sensible person to see that ESPN and Mike Fish (who has been fueling this story out of control from the start), have connections to Sen. Arlen Specter. The good Senator (not surprisingly) has been indirectly involved in a lengthy fight with the NFL because of its stand-off with Comcast over the NFLN. Ironically, Comcast is one of Specter's largest campaign contributors (go figure).



This is all about $$ people. Hate the Patriots all you want for how they carry themselves, but PLEASE don’t be so ignorant to actually believe that the integrity of the game is tarnished because NE taped signals from the sidelines as opposed to the Press box. That is just beyond silly. Every team in the league steals signals (legally) from the press box. All the Patriots have been proven wrong for, is stealing them (Illegally) FROM THE SIDELINES. How this is not understood at this point is just mind boggling to me.

What Belichick did, is provide the opponents of the NFLN with a perfect catalyst to take their fight to the next level. Goodell has handled this whole situation terribly from the start, and in the process has really put the league and their current position at a disadvantage.

I see this posted on this board by you and a couple others, I have seen it in huge letters. it's obvious that several are very passionate about this stance, but I'm not sure I understand the logic, are you suggesting that the rule states you can tape opposing coaches signals from the press box, or is the Press Box omitted from the language of the rules, therefore making it acceptable and subject to interpretation?If you, or anyone else could clarify that it would be greatly appreciated.

This is what I read (from the rule book), and how I came to that conclusion. Hopefully this is what you were looking for. V. Miscellaneous Rules and Regulations

A. No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game.

B. If clubs believe that violations of any of the Origination, Editing, Exchange, or Shipping rules have occurred, such violations should be brought to the attention of the Vice President of Officiating. Also, please inform the Video Directors Committee of any known violations. The Competition Committee will also urge that the Commissioner take appropriate disciplinary action in cases of substantiated violations.

C. Teams will be required to supply a yearly allotment of tapes to the Dub Center at NFL Films. Quantity required per club will be given to each team by May prior to the upcoming season. Tape stock will consist of brand-new 62-minute Beta SX tapes. For the 2007 season, 4,400 NEW tapes will be required.

D. To ensure the protection of equipment and employees of the team's video departments, please follow the guidelines listed for the video shooting locations at your stadium:

-All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead.

-Any doors entering the shooting locations within the public seating areas of the stadium are required to be lockable from both the inside and the outside of the location to prevent unwarranted access.

-All locations must have climate control (heat and/or fans). Any heaters and/or fans must be completely operational and produce the effect that is required. Heaters that do not produce any heat should be replaced.

-All locations must supply adequate power for each team (at least two outlets per team).

-All locations must be installed with the required video printer lines from both the sideline and the end zone shooting locations to the coaches' booth and field. It is not required that wiring be installed for the opposite end zone position, but if the opposite end zone is wired for the home team, it must also be wired for the visiting team. Home teams must provide visiting teams with the same situational set up for printers that they have themselves (i.e. cover, placement behind the bench, etc.)

-It is suggested that each location provide either countertop space or tables for both teams in the booth and a table on the field and coaches' booth.

Please ascertain that your club is in compliance with these guidelines.

What I get from this, is that NE took it a step further by actually filming the signals from the sidelines (strictly prohibited in the rules), but had they been filming from another enclosed location (such as the press box), it would have been perfectly legal. Maybe im reading it wrong, but that is how I interpret them. If that is not the case (and someone can explain in further detail, (in all seriousness) I'd love to hear it.

As far as I've understood the rules in play for this whole episode, you've got it nailed. The location of the camera is the rule that was broken.

But what about this?On top of that, the NFL's executive vice president for football operations sent a recent memorandum to head coaches and general managers that made clear that videotaping of any kind, including taping of an opposing team's offensive or defensive signals, is not permitted on the sidelines, in a coaches' booth, in a locker room, or from any other place available to a team's staff during a game.

So, the rule is about the location of the taping. The league reinforced that by memo. The Patriots clearly broke the rule. Of all this, I don't think there is much reasonable argument. I guess I'm not sure what you're getting at.

 

[Big_Russel]

Holy cow. This is truly the most overblown (non) story in the history of SPORTS. I really can't believe it got this big. This just proves how powerful sports media really is in this day and age. Specifically ESPN; their coverage of this has been so far beyond irresponsible that it’s not even funny. I actually feel sorry for NE, because I honestly think that they have become a pawn in something much bigger than filming freaking signals from the sidelines. All of you Patriot haters are naive if you think that NE or Belichick invented the practice of signal stealing. That is absurd!!!

It doesn’t take much of an effort for any sensible person to see that ESPN and Mike Fish (who has been fueling this story out of control from the start), have connections to Sen. Arlen Specter. The good Senator (not surprisingly) has been indirectly involved in a lengthy fight with the NFL because of its stand-off with Comcast over the NFLN. Ironically, Comcast is one of Specter's largest campaign contributors (go figure).

This is all about $$ people. Hate the Patriots all you want for how they carry themselves, but PLEASE don’t be so ignorant to actually believe that the integrity of the game is tarnished because NE taped signals from the sidelines as opposed to the Press box. That is just beyond silly. Every team in the league steals signals (legally) from the press box. All the Patriots have been proven wrong for, is stealing them (Illegally) FROM THE SIDELINES. How this is not understood at this point is just mind boggling to me.

What Belichick did, is provide the opponents of the NFLN with a perfect catalyst to take their fight to the next level. Goodell has handled this whole situation terribly from the start, and in the process has really put the league and their current position at a disadvantage.

Guy A is prescribed marijuana and smokes it legally.Guy B grows his own marijuana and smokes it illegally.

Seems that there can be a major difference when something can be both legal & illegal.

That's a TERRIBLE analogy. One guy is smoking bud for health reasons, while the other is smoking it strictly for recreational purposes. Signal stealing from anywhere on the field (legal or illegal location), by any NFL team, by any method (film, binoculars, lip reading) is done for the same exact reason; to decipher the signals and gain a possible advantage.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Guy A is prescribed marijuana and smokes it legally.Guy B grows his own marijuana and smokes it illegally.Seems that there can be a major difference when something can be both legal & illegal.

That's a TERRIBLE analogy. One guy is smoking bud for health reasons, while the other is smoking it strictly for recreational purposes. Signal stealing from anywhere on the field (legal or illegal location), by any NFL team, by any method (film, binoculars, lip reading) is done for the same exact reason; to decipher the signals and gain a possible advantage.

Obviously it must be more difficult to be successful at it at other locations or they wouldn't have bothered breaking the rule. Not quite equal.

 

[Class Dismissed]

Holy cow. This is truly the most overblown (non) story in the history of SPORTS. I really can't believe it got this big. This just proves how powerful sports media really is in this day and age. Specifically ESPN; their coverage of this has been so far beyond irresponsible that it’s not even funny. I actually feel sorry for NE, because I honestly think that they have become a pawn in something much bigger than filming freaking signals from the sidelines. All of you Patriot haters are naive if you think that NE or Belichick invented the practice of signal stealing. That is absurd!!!

It doesn’t take much of an effort for any sensible person to see that ESPN and Mike Fish (who has been fueling this story out of control from the start), have connections to Sen. Arlen Specter. The good Senator (not surprisingly) has been indirectly involved in a lengthy fight with the NFL because of its stand-off with Comcast over the NFLN. Ironically, Comcast is one of Specter's largest campaign contributors (go figure).



This is all about $$ people. Hate the Patriots all you want for how they carry themselves, but PLEASE don’t be so ignorant to actually believe that the integrity of the game is tarnished because NE taped signals from the sidelines as opposed to the Press box. That is just beyond silly. Every team in the league steals signals (legally) from the press box. All the Patriots have been proven wrong for, is stealing them (Illegally) FROM THE SIDELINES. How this is not understood at this point is just mind boggling to me.

What Belichick did, is provide the opponents of the NFLN with a perfect catalyst to take their fight to the next level. Goodell has handled this whole situation terribly from the start, and in the process has really put the league and their current position at a disadvantage.

I see this posted on this board by you and a couple others, I have seen it in huge letters. it's obvious that several are very passionate about this stance, but I'm not sure I understand the logic, are you suggesting that the rule states you can tape opposing coaches signals from the press box, or is the Press Box omitted from the language of the rules, therefore making it acceptable and subject to interpretation?If you, or anyone else could clarify that it would be greatly appreciated.

This is what I read (from the rule book), and how I came to that conclusion. Hopefully this is what you were looking for. V. Miscellaneous Rules and Regulations

A. No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game.

B. If clubs believe that violations of any of the Origination, Editing, Exchange, or Shipping rules have occurred, such violations should be brought to the attention of the Vice President of Officiating. Also, please inform the Video Directors Committee of any known violations. The Competition Committee will also urge that the Commissioner take appropriate disciplinary action in cases of substantiated violations.

C. Teams will be required to supply a yearly allotment of tapes to the Dub Center at NFL Films. Quantity required per club will be given to each team by May prior to the upcoming season. Tape stock will consist of brand-new 62-minute Beta SX tapes. For the 2007 season, 4,400 NEW tapes will be required.

D. To ensure the protection of equipment and employees of the team's video departments, please follow the guidelines listed for the video shooting locations at your stadium:

-All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead.

-Any doors entering the shooting locations within the public seating areas of the stadium are required to be lockable from both the inside and the outside of the location to prevent unwarranted access.

-All locations must have climate control (heat and/or fans). Any heaters and/or fans must be completely operational and produce the effect that is required. Heaters that do not produce any heat should be replaced.

-All locations must supply adequate power for each team (at least two outlets per team).

-All locations must be installed with the required video printer lines from both the sideline and the end zone shooting locations to the coaches' booth and field. It is not required that wiring be installed for the opposite end zone position, but if the opposite end zone is wired for the home team, it must also be wired for the visiting team. Home teams must provide visiting teams with the same situational set up for printers that they have themselves (i.e. cover, placement behind the bench, etc.)

-It is suggested that each location provide either countertop space or tables for both teams in the booth and a table on the field and coaches' booth.

Please ascertain that your club is in compliance with these guidelines.

What I get from this, is that NE took it a step further by actually filming the signals from the sidelines (strictly prohibited in the rules), but had they been filming from another enclosed location (such as the press box), it would have been perfectly legal. Maybe im reading it wrong, but that is how I interpret them. If that is not the case (and someone can explain in further detail, (in all seriousness) I'd love to hear it.

As far as I've understood the rules in play for this whole episode, you've got it nailed. The location of the camera is the rule that was broken.

But what about this?On top of that, the NFL's executive vice president for football operations sent a recent memorandum to head coaches and general managers that made clear that videotaping of any kind, including taping of an opposing team's offensive or defensive signals, is not permitted on the sidelines, in a coaches' booth, in a locker room, or from any other place available to a team's staff during a game.

So, the rule is about the location of the taping. The league reinforced that by memo. The Patriots clearly broke the rule. Of all this, I don't think there is much reasonable argument. I guess I'm not sure what you're getting at.

The way I see it is it's not the location, it's the act of taping coaches signals, which is specified. The act of taping coaches signals is not permissable anywhere that is available to a teams staff, well, if a member of the staff is there, it' been made available.

 

[Road Warriors]

...

But what about this?

On top of that, the NFL's executive vice president for football operations sent a recent memorandum to head coaches and general managers that made clear that videotaping of any kind, including taping of an opposing team's offensive or defensive signals, is not permitted on the sidelines, in a coaches' booth, in a locker room, or from any other place available to a team's staff during a game.

So, the rule is about the location of the taping. The league reinforced that by memo. The Patriots clearly broke the rule. Of all this, I don't think there is much reasonable argument. I guess I'm not sure what you're getting at.

The way I see it is it's not the location, it's the act of taping coaches signals, which is specified. The act of taping coaches signals is not permissable anywhere that is available to a teams staff, well, if a member of the staff is there, it' been made available.

Intersting take, first I've seen like this. Basically, in your opinion, the person doing the taping is considered staff, and therefore banned by this rule. I disagree that is the intent of the rule. The location restriction in the rules appears to be describing any location with coaching staff access during the game. I think your interpretation is probably more far reaching ( including the videographer as staff ) than the rule intended.

Going back to the original rule: No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game.

This is the heart of the rule broken. They used a video recording device in a non-permitted location.

 

[BusMan]

Goodell press conference imminent. You can listen live on Sirius NFL radio or watch live on NFL.com.

 

[fatness]

Meeting lasted 3 and 1/2 hours. Press conference imminent. Tapes are being shown (intermittently between announcers) on NFL.com

 

[Workhorse]

Some of these tapes that they are showing are endzone and coaches box tapes, not sideline tapes. Seems to me that there's stuff in there that's legitimately "grey area" prior to the 2006 league memo and may not have even been against the rules at the time.

 

[BusMan]

Some of these tapes that they are showing are endzone and coaches box tapes, not sideline tapes. Seems to me that there's stuff in there that's legitimately "grey area" prior to the 2006 league memo and may not have even been against the rules at the time.

True. I haven't seen a sideline POV yet.

 

[fatness]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

 

[Workhorse]

Some of these tapes that they are showing are endzone and coaches box tapes, not sideline tapes. Seems to me that there's stuff in there that's legitimately "grey area" prior to the 2006 league memo and may not have even been against the rules at the time.

True. I haven't seen a sideline POV yet.

And everything that they're showing is edited together with the game film - It sure looks like none of this was used for in-game advantage at all.They're like scouting tapes.Again, it begs the question: Other than violating a league rule (which is admittedly a big deal but took place months and months ago), did this story really deserve this much play?

 

[twitch]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

 

[BusMan]

Steelers AFC Championship has sideline cam.

 

[Workhorse]

Steelers AFC Championship has sideline cam.

Watching it right now on NFL Network, I've seen a play or two showing the sidelines but the majority of it is simple game film from end zone and high angle cameras. This is the same kind of video that the Jets shot of the Pats (apparently legally) in past games.

 

[fatness]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

 

[BusMan]

Steelers AFC Championship has sideline cam.

Watching it right now on NFL Network, I've seen a play or two showing the sidelines but the majority of it is simple game film from end zone and high angle cameras. This is the same kind of video that the Jets shot of the Pats (apparently legally) in past games.

The sideline cam gets the signal, then the high angle cams get the play.

 

[twitch]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

 

[Workhorse]

Steelers AFC Championship has sideline cam.

Watching it right now on NFL Network, I've seen a play or two showing the sidelines but the majority of it is simple game film from end zone and high angle cameras. This is the same kind of video that the Jets shot of the Pats (apparently legally) in past games.

The sideline cam gets the signal, then the high angle cams get the play.

But the sideline shots are few and far between, from what I can see.

 

[fatness]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

I want as many of people to see them. It's the best way to restore faith in the game. You have other motives? Just asking.

 

[twitch]

Steelers AFC Championship has sideline cam.

Watching it right now on NFL Network, I've seen a play or two showing the sidelines but the majority of it is simple game film from end zone and high angle cameras. This is the same kind of video that the Jets shot of the Pats (apparently legally) in past games.

The sideline cam gets the signal, then the high angle cams get the play.

But the sideline shots are few and far between, from what I can see.

These tapes have all been edited probably for scouting purposes, so the 2 and sometimes 3 camera angles are merged into each tape. It might have been more beneficial to get the vantage point exclusively from the sideline or the overhead or both.

 

[phthalatemagic]

I wonder what's gonna happen

 

[twitch]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

I want as many of people to see them. It's the best way to restore faith in the game. You have other motives? Just asking.

Youre darn right I do. To make knuckleheads like you pay good money directly to needy causes to see such obviously right protected materials. You got a problem with needy causes?

 

[ScottyFargo]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

NE lost the property rights to them when they violated the rules in filming them, that's why the original tapes were confiscated. These tapes are being handled in the same way, with the notable exception that now we can see what is on there. I do think it's nice though that NE fans want to maintain the ownership of the scandal, even in theory. Property rights, what a gas.

 

[fatness]

Schefter says they're not going to play the tapes all in their entirety right now (that would be a hell of a long show I guess) and that they're not giving DVD's to the press attending. No word yet on whether anyone will be allowed to see anything than the plays the NFL has edited together for this show.

 

[fatness]

I want as many of people to see them. It's the best way to restore faith in the game. You have other motives? Just asking.

Youre darn right I do. To make knuckleheads like you pay good money directly to needy causes to see such obviously right protected materials. You got a problem with needy causes?

You don't want people to see the tapes of the cheating.

 

[BusMan]

Pretty low quality actually.

 

[twitch]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

NE lost the property rights to them when they violated the rules in filming them, that's why the original tapes were confiscated. These tapes are being handled in the same way, with the notable exception that now we can see what is on there. I do think it's nice though that NE fans want to maintain the ownership of the scandal, even in theory. Property rights, what a gas.

Right. Good stuff, eh? Theyre obviously going to be available for free. Theyre being shown all over the airwaves and media outlets will have free access to them. Just throwing a feeler and a charitable thought that obviously wasnt very well received. People clearly want to see the right things done in our world. They just dont want to pay for those things to happen if they dont really have to.

 

[Workhorse]

Pretty low quality actually.

Maybe Walsh was fired because he sucked at his job. Many of the sideline shots aren't even showing the opposing coaches.

 

[Big_Russel]

These tapes definitely seem edited.

To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

 

[fatness]

Pretty low quality actually.

Yeah, even the sideline shots blur the faces.edited to add: I wonder if that's the quality of the tapes Walsh made, or just the quality of the edit job done by the NFL?

 

[twitch]

I want as many of people to see them. It's the best way to restore faith in the game. You have other motives? Just asking.

Youre darn right I do. To make knuckleheads like you pay good money directly to needy causes to see such obviously right protected materials. You got a problem with needy causes?

You don't want people to see the tapes of the cheating.

We have a realist here I see. You were probably watching those tapes as you typed those very words. And how much influence did I have in whether or not you could view that footage? Not much. Enjoy the show.

 

[switz]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Regardless of what the tapes show, the league would be wise to let everyone see them who wants to see them. Full disclosure will do a ton of good in this situation, regardless of what's disclosed.

I couldnt agree more. They should give NE the property rights to the tapes though, and allow them to sell individual tapes for $19.99, and give all the cash to charity. How's that sound?

That sounds like a good way to prevent people from seeing it --- making it pricey. Put the tapes on NFL.com and let people stream them is a better idea.

Why? They dont belong to you. Theyre not the property of you or I. Why would we be expected to get them for free? Pay the ticket price, enjoy the show, and let some very good causes benefit. Im horrified that you would think otherwise, you good samaritan you.

NE lost the property rights to them when they violated the rules in filming them, that's why the original tapes were confiscated. These tapes are being handled in the same way, with the notable exception that now we can see what is on there. I do think it's nice though that NE fans want to maintain the ownership of the scandal, even in theory. Property rights, what a gas.

Right. Good stuff, eh? Theyre obviously going to be available for free. Theyre being shown all over the airwaves and media outlets will have free access to them. Just throwing a feeler and a charitable thought that obviously wasnt very well received. People clearly want to see the right things done in our world. They just dont want to pay for those things to happen if they dont really have to.

This is just off the top of my head, but I have a feeling that the 3/4 of a million dollars that the Patriots + Billichek were fined gets donated to charity. So that's donations already given in the tapes name, which satisfies me.

 

[Workhorse]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

Then you'd theoretically have to watch it and decipher it. While a game is going on.

 

[mdog1967]

To be clear, I am not saying what the Patriots did was fair and just, but I am suggesting that a lot goes on across the NFL and the Patriots are taking the heat for the entire league.

It's more likely the other way around. The league's credibility is suffering in part due to what the Patriots did, and in part due to the NFL's bad handling of it so far.

Ridiculous thread. I almost vomit ever time I read the "Integrity of the Game". Fatness....... So much to say and such a blatant waste of energy to respond to you. You are making stuff up to be mad about, its comical and sad at the same time. Note to Roger Goodell: Please send Fatness the Tapes, a box of paper towels and a Wha-ambulance to Tom Brady's house so he can moon him.

 

[switz]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

Then you'd theoretically have to watch it and decipher it. While a game is going on.

That is an entirely different story To be honest, though... if this data is being fed live into a shared system, these films could be merged within minutes of the filming, then they could have staff deciphering the film DURIGN the first half, and present it to the coaches during half time for use during the second half. Especially with a guy with a photographic memory, and a statistical genius evaluating the data. Honestly, if that's what they were doing (and I really do believe they were) it is brilliant - but illegal.Still, I don't doubt every other tea in the league would try it if they had the personnel in place to make it worthwhile.

 

[Workhorse]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

Then you'd theoretically have to watch it and decipher it. While a game is going on.

That is an entirely different story To be honest, though... if this data is being fed live into a shared system, these films could be merged within minutes of the filming, then they could have staff deciphering the film DURIGN the first half, and present it to the coaches during half time for use during the second half. Especially with a guy with a photographic memory, and a statistical genius evaluating the data. Honestly, if that's what they were doing (and I really do believe they were) it is brilliant - but illegal.Still, I don't doubt every other tea in the league would try it if they had the personnel in place to make it worthwhile.

Seems like a HUGE stretch. Have you seen the video? It's shaky handycam type stuff. I highly doubt that was live digital video fed into a system. To say nothing of "photographic memories" and the like.

 

[Big_Russel]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

Then you'd theoretically have to watch it and decipher it. While a game is going on.

That is an entirely different story To be honest, though... if this data is being fed live into a shared system, these films could be merged within minutes of the filming, then they could have staff deciphering the film DURIGN the first half, and present it to the coaches during half time for use during the second half. Especially with a guy with a photographic memory, and a statistical genius evaluating the data. Honestly, if that's what they were doing (and I really do believe they were) it is brilliant - but illegal.Still, I don't doubt every other tea in the league would try it if they had the personnel in place to make it worthwhile.

This stuff looks like it was done with a handheld video recorder. It doesn't look like a digital feed at all.

 

[Big_Russel]

These tapes definitely seem edited. To all the AV guys out there, how possible is it to edit/decipher this stuff at halftime (15:00mins)?? Seems like it would be a lot of work.

Actually, feeding this through a computer it is VERY easy to line this up and merge the shots. Technology is a wonderful thing.

Then you'd theoretically have to watch it and decipher it. While a game is going on.

That is an entirely different story To be honest, though... if this data is being fed live into a shared system, these films could be merged within minutes of the filming, then they could have staff deciphering the film DURIGN the first half, and present it to the coaches during half time for use during the second half. Especially with a guy with a photographic memory, and a statistical genius evaluating the data. Honestly, if that's what they were doing (and I really do believe they were) it is brilliant - but illegal.Still, I don't doubt every other tea in the league would try it if they had the personnel in place to make it worthwhile.

Seems like a HUGE stretch. Have you seen the video? It's shaky handycam type stuff. I highly doubt that was live digital video fed into a system. To say nothing of "photographic memories" and the like.

oops... beat me to it.

 

[phthalatemagic]

I can't believe they've done this stuff since 2000

 

[twitch]

The Browns just had FOUR defensive coaches sending in signals in that piece I just saw. That's good stuff. Musical signals. I wonder if NE had the signal for which guy was sending in the actual signal??

 

[Kit Fisto]

I wonder what's gonna happen

You're gonna have to find something else to harp on endlessly about? Maybe you'll go away completely?

 

[Kit Fisto]

I can't believe they've done this stuff since 2000

Get over yourself.

 

[AB in DC]

Pretty low quality actually.

Yeah, even the sideline shots blur the faces.

That may be a broadcast rights issue. I think if someone hasn't formally consented to being videotaped, using their image for commercial purposes would be illegal. It might not be blurred out in the original.

 

[Workhorse]

OK, Walsh himself confirmed to Goodell that the tapes were NOT used during games.

This is officially over, IMO.

 

[Kit Fisto]

OK, Walsh himself confirmed to Goodell that the tapes were NOT used during games.This is officially over, IMO.

Who would have thought that Walsh would have been the one to clear the Pats name?Thank god this is over, and we can all move on to the next conspiracy theory.

 

[Workhorse]

And "no further sanctions" according to Goodell.

G'night folks. Don't forget to tip your waitress.