YTD (as of right now) including contributions on the 401k side and paying for college, our net worth (investments not house) is up 104%. Been a heck of a year return wise and definitely changed overall goal and timeframe.
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Personal Finance Advice and Education! (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter No. 16
- Start date
-OZ-
Footballguy
let's say annual salary of $100,000. Nasdaq rose around 10% in November, like 6% in December. $1 million gets you there for November, like $1.6M for December. Assuming he's just in the index and not single stocks that did better. 
Andrew74
Footballguy
joey
Footballguy
Besides remaining gainfully employed and busier than ever at my job (a huge blessing in 2020), I’ve continued to Max out the 401k, HSA, IRA and we were able to do an annual home project (backyard patio/deck/hot tub). But to me, the biggest gains (at least emotionally if not financially) have been TWO refi’s that will save us >$60k over the life of the loan, pay it off in the same amount of time as my original 30 yr loan from when we bought this home 16 years ago, and net us >$300/month that I might just put towards an electric car lease since my oldest son is getting close to driving age and will inherit my 2011 Prius. (Gotta fight off the chicks with those sexy wheels
)Santa Rosa? Rohnert Park? I've been thinking of the idea of moving north of Marin once my youngest (only 11 yrs old) graduates high school so we can stay in the Bay Area (love it here) but cash in on our Marin house and pile the (hopeful) profits on top of the 401k to head into retirement in 10 years or so.
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Judge Smails
Footballguy
joey
Footballguy
NutterButter
Footballguy
What looked like a terrible year early on has become one of the better one's. You folks that got out before the crash and got back in before the recovery had it even better.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
NutterButter
Footballguy
Got to be at least a couple of people that fall into that category. A couple posters mentioned that they got out in the early stages of the crash. I haven't heard any of the same people talk about when they got back in if they have at all. Personally, I'm just a dollar cost averaging kind of guy. I usually don't pay those other folks much mind. They remind me of the people that tell you about all the good days they had in vegas, but never mention the bad.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Keep going North - Oregon. Unfortunately I don’t have a Marin house to cash out of, I’ve been a renter most of my adult life.Besides remaining gainfully employed and busier than ever at my job (a huge blessing in 2020), I’ve continued to Max out the 401k, HSA, IRA and we were able to do an annual home project (backyard patio/deck/hot tub). But to me, the biggest gains (at least emotionally if not financially) have been TWO refi’s that will save us >$60k over the life of the loan, pay it off in the same amount of time as my original 30 yr loan from when we bought this home 16 years ago, and net us >$300/month that I might just put towards an electric car lease since my oldest son is getting close to driving age and will inherit my 2011 Prius. (Gotta fight off the chicks with those sexy wheels
Santa Rosa? Rohnert Park? I've been thinking of the idea of moving north of Marin once my youngest (only 11 yrs old) graduates high school so we can stay in the Bay Area (love it here) but cash in on our Marin house and pile the (hopeful) profits on top of the 401k to head into retirement in 10 years or so.
@cosjobs Not only got out at the peak. He invested all those monies in a 3X leveraged ETF that road the market down. I believe he is a 3X just from that
cosjobs
Footballguy
with a bad Fall, I'm just 2.5x
TVIX and CYDY were monsters for me in the spring and I had liquidated about everything else to get into them. Had I played it differently on peaks and dips, it probably would have been more like 10x
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joey
Footballguy
Oregon...cool. I have a few friends with a similar plan as well.
We own a house in Marin because the Mrs and I got super fortunate with timing and the blip of the 100% financing days back in 2001. Never had enough for a down payment, but both had good jobs with good salaries (but nothing close to the dotcom/startup $ or the financial/Wall St peeps). Along comes the 100% financing era, we buy a small 2 BR cottage in Mill Valley and sell it 3 years later for a nice profit that turned into a proper 20% down payment on this house we’ve been in now for over 16 years. There are those important moments in life that you remember as a key turning point and, for me, it was that simple lunch with a work friend, he told me he was buying a house in Marin, I said "how the hell are you doing that?!" (They just had a single income, as opposed to our double income) and he mentioned this 100% financing thing. Got his real estate and mortgage broker info, and we were on our way. If not for that conversation at that lunch, who knows where we'd be right now.
joey
Footballguy
This was NOT a windfall, but the only thing I did was rebalance my 401k account after the drop, when my supposed-to-be-small-ish bond fund holdings became a much larger % of my overall 401k balance than I wanted, simply due to the fact that all of my stock funds had dropped so much in March. I simply rebalanced my funds to the blend I preferred, which for me meant transferring around half of my bond fund balance and spreading it across my 4 favorite/best stock funds in my 401k. As for the luck factor, the March 23rd date of that transaction was literally the bottom of the market by sheer coincidence, but I believe my process was still valid so not all dumb luck
-OZ-
Footballguy
Many people got out before the crash. Very few got back in at or near the bottom.
Cos is wicked smart but he still got lucky here. DCAing and maintaining your portfolio works better for most of us mortals.
Rebalancing is key.This was NOT a windfall, but the only thing I did was rebalance my 401k account after the drop, when my supposed-to-be-small-ish bond fund holdings became a much larger % of my overall 401k balance than I wanted, simply due to the fact that all of my stock funds had dropped so much in March. I simply rebalanced my funds to the blend I preferred, which for me meant transferring around half of my bond fund balance and spreading it across my 4 favorite/best stock funds in my 401k. As for the luck factor, the March 23rd date of that transaction was literally the bottom of the market by sheer coincidence, but I believe my process was still valid so not all dumb luck
Many of us are nearly fully invested in stock. If you can relax with the fall that's probably okay.i did for most of my stuff and got stupid with part of my funds. Went with one of those triple reverse hedge funds which was fun for the first week. Then it hurt as I stayed too long. Pulling the cord out and into the assets I want long term was one of my better moves.
NutterButter
Footballguy
I'm not nearly smart enough to know what the hell you guys are even talking about. I just have everything in an s&p 500 index fund until the day comes when I'll be diversify into something less risky as a near retirement.
-OZ-
Footballguy
joey
Footballguy
Agreed. Simple is best especially being smart enough to just go with an index fund.
next level of minor complexity for you might be putting some % if your total monthly investment into an international index fund and maybe another % into a total stock market index fund. Then it’s just 3 funds but diversifies you the tiniest bit. But it’s in the same vein of "set it and forget it" at least only once every few years.
here’s one example of a 3, 4 and 5 fund "lazy" or "coffee house" portfolio: https://www.wallstreetphysician.com/building-vanguard-three-fund-portfolio-simple-index-fund-portfolios/
BeTheMatch
Footballguy
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Lomez
Footballguy
Judge Smails
Footballguy
That makes me feel better. Because I do the same with a 401K and then have a financial planner (fiduciary, not selling any products) managing my portfolio otherwise. Have a plan we're executing on but got to admit I am a little envious of the returns I see in this thread. I wish the best for everyone. Being through these cycles many times before tell me this is going to pop, and I'm not talking first day IPO pop. The valuations are ridiculous. PE and VC's propping up chasing highest possible returns. There is no way Teladoc/Livongo is worth $28B. (edited typo)
It's like my friend who was riding high snapping up rental homes. He had 30. Then the real estate market crashed and he was left holding it all. It wasn't pretty. Lots of smart people in here and hoping they see the signs to tap or slam on the brakes when the inevitable happens.
That being said I am inspired enough to start playing with a smaller portion of my assets in 2021 to see if I can get outsized growth.
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NutterButter
Footballguy
Have something like that with my current 401k which is almost half of my portfolio; 25% each in small cap, mid cap, large cap and international index funds. I think I just went that route by chance since there was no s&p500 index.
Lomez
Footballguy
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Judge Smails
Footballguy
hah - yeah typo on my part. I think their market cap is $28B today. Still too high IMO. But that's me.
Instinctive
Footballguy
My wife and I just recently did our year end financial review, thought some might find interest in the highlights (because I'd find interest in others'). Big year for us, but not great from a savings perspective. One full year of single income AND paying MBA tuition to a top school (my wife, not me) instead of dual incomes is very different for your finances. It's like those of you with kids in college except WAY more costly (because I assume said kid probably didn't have a high salary that also disappeared on top of the cost, but this is FBGs, so maybe they did).
Key stats: NW up ~14%, but only a savings rate only 6% (for reference, in 2018 and 2019 we saved 80% and 40%, respectively, of incomes - 2018 was the last year we both worked > 6 months)
Key events: purchased first home, COVID, wife got her post-MBA job, very little else happened to us personally
Personal finance goals for 2021: get back to a 50% savings rate, officially get promoted at work, figure out outdoor kitchen expansion project design and cost
Key stats: NW up ~14%, but only a savings rate only 6% (for reference, in 2018 and 2019 we saved 80% and 40%, respectively, of incomes - 2018 was the last year we both worked > 6 months)
Key events: purchased first home, COVID, wife got her post-MBA job, very little else happened to us personally
Personal finance goals for 2021: get back to a 50% savings rate, officially get promoted at work, figure out outdoor kitchen expansion project design and cost
jm192
Footballguy
Stupid but fun:
I had 1200$ in a work retirement account that got put in a rollover IRA. I've used it as a for playing around account. I invested in Twitter, Comcast and a few other things. Then at the end of last year I sold everything and bought Nintendo stock when it was way cheaper. The account is now at 2700$.
Going to look at converting it into a Roth and getting a bit more serious with it.
I had 1200$ in a work retirement account that got put in a rollover IRA. I've used it as a for playing around account. I invested in Twitter, Comcast and a few other things. Then at the end of last year I sold everything and bought Nintendo stock when it was way cheaper. The account is now at 2700$.
Going to look at converting it into a Roth and getting a bit more serious with it.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Instinctive
Footballguy
I will once I learn more. Home improvement thread getting a first time homeowner asking for boatloads of advice will be oh so original xDgo on...
Do you discuss in detail in another thread?
Desert_Power
Footballguy
We hit a new high in income and saved 51% of it this year. We typically save more in the mid 30s, so this has been a significant boost. It is a lot harder for me to blow money when there is nowhere to go.
Between increased savings and improved market returns (despite having quite high cash allocations at times), our net worth increased 42%. I believe this is the first time that has outpaced our yearly employment income. We expect to sell our former house/current rental in the first quarter, so have a lot of cash to work with.
2020 has sucked for a lot of reasons, but financially it was a great year.
Between increased savings and improved market returns (despite having quite high cash allocations at times), our net worth increased 42%. I believe this is the first time that has outpaced our yearly employment income. We expect to sell our former house/current rental in the first quarter, so have a lot of cash to work with.
2020 has sucked for a lot of reasons, but financially it was a great year.
bcnfinance
Footballguy
When everyone is saying they saved X percent of their income, is It X percent of gross or net?
Instinctive
Footballguy
I calculate mine as (Cash income + pre-tax 401(k) deposits + pre-tax FSA/HSA deposits - total expenses) / (Cash income + pre-tax 401(k) deposits + pre-tax FSA/HSA deposits). So it is on a net basis. I look at it as "of the money I could spend, how much of it did I save?" I also view my income and evaluate changes on a post-tax basis - e.g., I would need a greater than x% raise to move back to California because I'd go from no state income tax to a giant state income tax (even before accounting for cost of living increases). My total expense number is literally everything we spent, except the principal portion of mortgage payments. I update it from our checking account and our credit card transactions approximately once a quarter, and consider any cash withdrawals to be an expense (and deposits as cash income) for simplicity's sake.
Then I have my own separate metrics for tax efficiency - effective tax rate and post-tax income. The goal is to maximize post-tax income, not necessarily to minimize taxes paid (although the two are obviously related).
I'm sure it's not perfect, but I think it gives me the information we need to make decisions.
I don’t as much as I should but I did adjust a few things this year in terms of contributions. I’m planning to keep it fairly aggressive (stock index type funds not bonds) for the next few years. Might get less aggressive when actually retired or at goal. If you are young, I would stay aggressive and never own a bond fund or anything conservative.
Instinctive
Footballguy
I mean it depends on your options. I'm in my 20s and I have a 90/10 split of total market passive equity index and total market passive bond index. As I get older, I would slowly creep the bond % up. If I really sit down and take the time, I'll probably move my taxable accounts and 401(k) accounts to more pure ownership of things to make them more tax efficient, but for now I have every account at that 90/10 ratio.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
I use gross because I'm lazy. It will be months before I figure out how much taxes I owed for 2020
I don’t want to even know about taxes owed this year. I get spanked already with dual income and I sold a decent amount of stock (mainly CYDY and ZM gains) in my taxable account. It’s taxes on gains where I got out well so it’s OK, but still it’s sitting in my account and looks much nicer there than on a check I mail out at midnight on 4/15.
Just for fun, here’s an article on how bonds had beaten stocks over 20 years because the starting point was at the peak of 2000 and right after the drop in March.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/05/01/business/bonds-beat-stocks-over-20-years.amp.html
Here we are 8 months later and the S&P with dividends is up about 1 percent a year for 20 years over long term treasuries even though yields are historically low meaning the best conditions for bond prices. The other thing is that S&P returns include big oil companies and GE that have been in the index and at points the largest market caps. Those stocks have around a 0% return over 20 years plus dividends. If you find good funds/ETFs/stocks you can potentially avoid those companies.
Anyway, if you are young be aggressive. Bear markets are blips and great DCA opportunities. I wish I knew back then what I know now. I will definitely be on my boys when they start really earning a living although I’ve already started some brokerage accounts for them this week.
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
Was able to max out HSA, 401K, and IRA for first time
Brokerage account up 77% in 2020, Roth up 71% - big thanks to the great posters in the stock thread!!
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Desert_Power
Footballguy
In a spreadsheet. I take our gross pay versus contributions into investment accounts, net change in bank savings accounts, and loan principal payments. Only on a total year basis for the last 6 years.
We use Personal Capital for the net worth figures, but it cannot track the detail of the ins and outs. Or separate out market gains.
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FishTacoTuesday
Footballguy
I currently have all of my allocations in equity/stocks. It wasn't as easy to find performance on COLUMBIA TRUST CONTRARIAN CORE FUND..
- 80% of my 401K in COLUMBIA TRUST CONTRARIAN CORE FUND ----->YTD Return 21.49%, 4 stars from Morningstar
- 20% in VANGUARD INSTITUTIONAL INDEX (VINIX), ----->YTD Return 14.01%, 5 stars from Morningstar, $331.47
9.2 scorecard from USNewsMoney
- The investment seeks to track the performance of a benchmark index that measures the investment return of large-capitalization stocks. The fund employs an indexing investment approach designed to track the performance of the S&P 500 Index, a widely recognized benchmark of U.S. stock market performance that is dominated by the stocks of large U.S. companies. The advisor attempts to replicate the target index by investing all, or substantially all, of its assets in the stocks that make up the index, holding each stock in approximately the same proportion as its weighting in the index.
I had a strong year with this mix so not necessarily looking to change, but want to see if others are big fans of any of these below. I'm 43 years old, still want to be aggressive.
Additional Equity Stocks to choose from:
- ABERDEEN EMERGNG MRKT CL INSTL (ABEMX) ----->YTD Return 16.66%, 4 stars from Morningstar, $20.32
The fund invests primarily in common stocks, but may also invest in other types of equity securities, including, but not limited to, preferred stock and depositary receipts. It invests at least 80% of the value of its net assets, plus any borrowings for investment purposes, in equity securities of emerging market companies. The fund may invest in securities denominated in U.S. Dollars and currencies of emerging market countries in which it is permitted to invest. It may invest in securities of any market capitalization, including small and mid-cap securities.
- Mostly Aggressive
[*]AMERICAN EUROPACIFIC GROWTH R6 (RERGX) -----> YTD Return 17.34%, 3 stars from Morningstar, $69.30
The Fund seeks to provide long-term growth of capital by investing in companies based outside the United States. The Fund Invests in companies based chiefly in Europe and the Pacific Basin, ranging from small firms to large corporations
[*]DFA US SMALL CAP PRTL CL INSTL (DFSTX) -----> YTD Return 2.90%, 3 stars from Morningstar, $38.42
The investment seeks long-term capital appreciation. The fund, using a market capitalization weighted approach, purchases a broad and diverse group of readily marketable securities of U.S. small cap companies. A company's market capitalization is the number of its shares outstanding times its price per share. In general, the higher the relative market capitalization of the U.S. small cap company, the greater its representation in the Portfolio..2
- 7.2 (of 10 rating) from USNewsMoney
[*]HARTFORD MID CAP FD R6 (HFMVX) -----> YTD Return 25.06%, 2 stars from Morningstar, $43.27
The Fund seeks to achieve long-term capital growth by investing primarily in high-quality U.S. companies with market capitalizations within the range represented by the Standard & Poor's MidCap 400 Index.
[*]VANGUARD EXTEND MARKET INDX FD (VIEIX) -----> YTD Return 32.23%, 5 stars from Morningstar, $124.74
This fund offers investors a low-cost way to gain broad exposure to U.S. mid- and small-capitalization stocks in one fund. The fund invests in about 3,000 stocks, which span many different industries and account for about one-fourth of the market-cap of the U.S. stock market. One of the fund’s risks is its full exposure to the mid- and small-cap markets, which tend to be more volatile than the large-cap market. The fund is considered a complement to Vanguard 500 Index Fund. Together they provide exposure to the entire U.S. equity market.
- Domestic Stock - More Aggressive (5 stars = most risk, most reward)
Anyone with any strong opinions/recommendations?
D_House
Footballguy
You don’t list one of the most important qualities of these funds - the expense ratio (ER).
Your current portfolio is 100% US large blend with the more expensive actively managed Columbia fund performing nearly identically to the passive S&P fund. I’d get rid of the Columbia fund as all it adds is manager risk, complexity, and higher costs.
For an aggressive portfolio, 100% US large caps is a totally reasonable strategy however there will be periods that small- and mid-size US companies and international funds outperform. You can add these segments of the market, but I’d choose low expense ways to do that.
In the case of the funds you listed, if you want exposure to smaller US companies you could add a slice of the Vanguard extended market fund (it held Tesla before Tesla graduated to the S&P and still holds Zoom and other stars of the COVID recovery). This fund is cheap and combined with the S&P fund covers the entire US stock market. Something like 4:1 S&P to extended market gets you market weight.
For international exposure, take the same approach. First, decide if you want the exposure, then pick the broadest, low ER Fund you can find in your plan. The two funds you listed are pricy and one is restricted to developing markets like China - I don’t like either fund. Next, decide how much exposure you want. International stocks make up about half the market, so anything from none to half your portfolio is reasonable.
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Lion to myself
Footballguy
D House gave good advice. I was going to mention the VANGUARD EXTEND MARKET INDX FD (VIEIX) also as an area of opportunity. 20% to 40% into that fund will add mid and small cap exposure you are lacking.
Thank you for the feedback. I added the Expense Ratio Below.
How much VANGUARD EXTEND MARKET INDX FD (VIEIX) do you recommend adding?
With the Columbia Fund performing well, but having a higher ER, do you recommend getting out completely and then moving that to what?
Ultimately, knowing where I'm currently at, how would you allocate on a 100% ratio, given I want to stay aggressive.
Current Holdings:
- 80%: COLUMBIA TRUST CONTRARIAN CORE FUND ----->YTD Return 21.49%, 4 stars from Morningstar
Net Expense Ratio: 1.02%
[*]20%: VANGUARD INSTITUTIONAL INDEX (VINIX), ----->YTD Return 14.01%, 5 stars from Morningstar, $331.47
Net Expense Ratio: 0.04%
Additional Equity Stocks to choose from:
- ABERDEEN EMERGNG MRKT CL INSTL (ABEMX) ----->YTD Return 16.66%, 4 stars from Morningstar, $20.32
Net Expense Ratio: 1.10%
[*]AMERICAN EUROPACIFIC GROWTH R6 (RERGX) -----> YTD Return 17.34%, 3 stars from Morningstar, $69.30
Net Expense Ratio: 0.47%
[*]DFA US SMALL CAP PRTL CL INSTL (DFSTX) -----> YTD Return 2.90%, 3 stars from Morningstar, $38.42
Net Expense Ratio: 0.37%
[*]HARTFORD MID CAP FD R6 (HFMVX) -----> YTD Return 25.06%, 2 stars from Morningstar, $43.27
Net Expense Ratio: 0.74%
[*]VANGUARD EXTEND MARKET INDX FD (VIEIX) -----> YTD Return 32.23%, 5 stars from Morningstar, $124.74
Net Expense Ratio: 0.05%
Thank you!
Same questions i asked D House. How would you allocate the funds from what I currently have?
Doing VIEIX sounds logical, just want to now figure out how to adjust
