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Phillip Rivers (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter jonboltz
- Start date
Jason Wood
Zoo York
He's certainly worked his way up the draft boards this year. He wasn't considered a first day guy heading into this year and now is being talked about as possibly the 3rd or 4th QB off the board, an impressive jump.Cheers
RandleEl82
Footballguy
Rivers will be money in the pros.
Tau837
Footballguy
All true. IMO he was the best QB in the nation this season, including Jason White, Eli Manning, Matt Leinart, and Ben R.He is definitely the best N.C. State player ever, although that may not impress many folks. He is arguably the best QB and best player ever in the ACC. Again, not a traditional football conference, but still...I expect him to be great in the NFL, and I think he'll be a better value as a late 1st, early 2nd pick than Manning or Ben R as an early 1st.
The Juggernaut
The Man. The Myth
Sheesh, he was going against Man ######'s D......Which always sucks for those not in the know....
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Torry Holt might have something to say about that...Cheers
As a Wolfpack alum, I have to chime in on Rivers.
Those doubting his ability clearly have not seen him play. He may not have the arm of a Ro-slinger (I'm not even going to attempt to spell his name) or the lineage of an Eli Manning, but Rivers is a smart player, a leader.
Named starter from day 1, Rivers led one of the best offenses in the nation, despite a mediocre running game early on. He excelled under 3 different offensive co-ordinators. He was among the top QBs in completion percentage, finding the open receiver if his main option was covered. He has great poise and can create when things break down.
Rivers is one of the best QBs in the draft. Although he will not likely be a first round pick, he will be an excellent NFL QB. Teams that pass on him in the round 2 will be regretting their decision (ala Butch Davis re Clinton Portis). Also, since he will likely be drafted in the second round, he will not have the pressure befalling a "franchise" QB (see Joey Harrington, Kyle Boller, etc.). Furthermore, Rivers has the character to accept his role as student behind an established QB. Rivers will be a star NFL QB in the near future.
I would LOVE to see Rivers play for the Panthers, but IMO he will likely go to a team with an older, established QB like the 49ers or the Packers. To me, he seems a fitting heir apparent to Brett Favre.
Those doubting his ability clearly have not seen him play. He may not have the arm of a Ro-slinger (I'm not even going to attempt to spell his name) or the lineage of an Eli Manning, but Rivers is a smart player, a leader.
Named starter from day 1, Rivers led one of the best offenses in the nation, despite a mediocre running game early on. He excelled under 3 different offensive co-ordinators. He was among the top QBs in completion percentage, finding the open receiver if his main option was covered. He has great poise and can create when things break down.
Rivers is one of the best QBs in the draft. Although he will not likely be a first round pick, he will be an excellent NFL QB. Teams that pass on him in the round 2 will be regretting their decision (ala Butch Davis re Clinton Portis). Also, since he will likely be drafted in the second round, he will not have the pressure befalling a "franchise" QB (see Joey Harrington, Kyle Boller, etc.). Furthermore, Rivers has the character to accept his role as student behind an established QB. Rivers will be a star NFL QB in the near future.
I would LOVE to see Rivers play for the Panthers, but IMO he will likely go to a team with an older, established QB like the 49ers or the Packers. To me, he seems a fitting heir apparent to Brett Favre.
Goat Herders
Footballguy
I'm surprised to hear you say that, Jason. I certainly believe you, but I had him down as the #2 QB (behind Manning) going into the year. He's been extremely solid since his freshman year when he was tossing it to Koren Robinson. I just figured a number of scouts have had their eye on him for a while. I think he'll be either 3rd or 4th of the QBs, after Rothlisberger and Manning and right next to JP Losman (Tulane). Rivers will certainly grade out as well as Chris Simms, which would put him in the 3rd round at the latest. HERD
Lightning-in-a-Bottle
Footballguy
He was too impressive...dammit...I was hoping he would fall all the way to my broncos...very accurate, strong arm...don't see him falling there now... :(
Chris Smith
The Head Goon!
I have only had the opportunity to see Rivers play a couple of times at the collegiate level. However I was very impressed with everything he brings to the table.Is a Cannon for an arm nice? Yes it certainly is but it will only help the quarterback excel at the NFL level if he can hit his receivers in stride with the pass.I think the most important attributes for a quarterback to have in the NFL in this day and age is (a) intelligence and (b) determination and I believe Rivers has both of those qualities.If he indeed is the 4th quarterback taken in the draft, he is going to make some team very happy.My top three is(1) Rothlisberger(2) Rivers(3) Manning (I don't think he is as talented as brother Peyton)
dcgangstas
Footballguy
I've watched Phillip Rivers play in the ACC for several years, and have been on the Rivers Bandwagon for quite a while. I have known that this kid is one of the best three collegiate QBs in the country, without question. Strong and accurate arm, great leadership skills, has total command of the offensive playbook, and just shows tremendous poise. Being a Raider fan, my fervent hope for the first two rounds of the NFL Draft is Roy Williams (or Larry Fitzgerald preferably) in the first, and Rivers in the 2nd. Please, Al, please..... 
dcgangstas
Footballguy
Miami had better draft to fix that offensive line.
Yenrub
Footballguy
As a NC State alum and Giants nothing would make me happier than to see the G-Men grab Rivers in the 2nd. Have him sit behind Kerry Collins for a year or two and then take over.Rivers has okay arm strength.He has a quick release, ugly but quick, and he is very accurate.He reads defenses with the best of them.I also think Cochery is going to make a nice possesion receiver for somebody early on day two of the draft.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
As good as Rivers has been this year, I find it amusing that everyone is begging for their teams to draft Rivers as if he's a foregone, can't miss savior. I would hope we have learned enough to know that no one, especially a 2nd round QB, is a lock to ever do anything in this league, must less someone that warrants something akin to "please PLEASE draft him Mr. GM!"
Cheers
Cheers
simey
Footballguy
Rivers is the 2nd leading passer in NCAA history. I don't think he needs to change his delivery just because it is strange looking. That delivery is extremely accurate. Rivers is a great quarterback and reads defenses very well. I think he has a promising future in the nfl. I also agree that Jerricho Cotchery will make a good possession receiver in the nfl. It was nice seeing those two walk off the field together in their last game 
It was a kodak moment 
It was a kodak moment 
rebel34
Footballguy
Rivers has a lot of fire and plays well against top teams. Just because he beat up on poor KU doesn't mean that he's worthless. He's looked good his whole career, has a good completion percentage which is key in the NFL.
Remember Steve McNair played in the shotgun and he's turned out pretty good. There are several others that have failed in this transition, but Rivers has the look of a successful pro.
Remember Steve McNair played in the shotgun and he's turned out pretty good. There are several others that have failed in this transition, but Rivers has the look of a successful pro.
My top 4 right now. I think these are the guys that are most likely 1st rounders. Andrew Walter may sneak in there. 1) Roethlisberger - Extremly atheletic, big arm, great mobility, just about everything you want in a QB. Plus he's 6'5.2) Manning- Great arm, good mobility. Seems to lack leadership intangibles and has sometimes come up short in bigger games. 3) Rivers- Strange delivery but very accurate. Good reads and makes things happen. Not too many negatives but the delivery does shy away a lot of scouts for whatever reason it seems like you either love him or hate him. 4) Losman - Solid QB, doesn't get much exposer because he's on a bad team. Haven't really seen too much of him so I can't get real in depth but he looked sharp from what I've seen.
Goat Herders
Footballguy
Actually, Manning's arm isn't tremendous, but his intangibles are top-notch. HERD
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Well, until Koren Robinson learns to hold onto the ball and stay out of his coaches doghouse, it's blashphemous to compare him to Torry Holt. K-Rob has the physical talent, but he's nowhere close to the receiver that Holt has turned into.Cheers
Tau837
Footballguy
I'm surprised a few people have taken issue with this statement.First, I assume it was clear that I was referring to their college careers only. What Rivers, Holt, et. al. do in the NFL has no bearing on my statement.Next, let's dispense with Koren Robinson. Don't get me wrong, I like Koren and loved what he did on the field for State. But he only played two seasons at State. What he could or would have done if he stayed longer is nothing more than speculation and is irrelevant.As for Torry Holt, he was awesome, no doubt. He remains one of my all-time favorites, and, despite the fact that Cotchery has broken some of his records, I still consider Holt to be the best receiver in school history. Holt excelled at State for two seasons. Here are his college receiving statistics:
As good as Holt was, especially as a senior, his accomplishments did not measure up to what Rivers accomplished. Rivers started every game for the past 4 years, compiled a 34-17 record, including 3-1 in bowl games, threw for over 13000 yards, etc.State averaged 32.3 ppg during Rivers' career, compared to 26.2 ppg over the previous 4 year period, which included the last 3 years of Holt's career. As another poster mentioned, Rivers had 3 different offensive coordinators during that time. If I'm not mistaken, he also had 2 or more QB coaches.Aside from Holt, other notable players that would be considered all-time greats at N.C. State include Jim Ritcher, Roman Gabriel, and Ted Brown. Head coach Chuck Amato, who played at State and has a keen sense of school history, has stated repeatedly this season that Rivers has surpassed Gabriel as N.C. State's greatest football player. Like I said before, I agree.
Tau837
Footballguy
Why? Can you explain why it will be a problem?If a QB's delivery is a problem, I believe it normally shows in his completion percentage. Rivers completed 71% of his passes this season and 67% for his career... no problem there.I have seen Rivers' delivery compared to that of Marino, Favre, and Kosar. Obviously those guys had no problem with their unorthodox deliveries.Aside from his delivery, he doesn't really have any negatives.- excellent statistical performance, both season and career- winner--34-17, 3-1 in bowl games- excellent size--6'5", 235 lbs- can make all the throws- not a scrambler, but mobile in pocket- good in short yardage goal line situations--17 career rushing TDs- durable--NCAA record 51 starts, with no history of injuries- intelligent- mature--no off field incidents, graduated this semester, married with 1 year old daughter
When you look past the big two...Manning and Roeth (who I think will make excellent QB's). Manning is football savy enough that he won't need as much of the "learning process" as well.I like Rivers, but, lack of arm strength and that wacky delivery scares me some.Personally, I'd go for JP Losman.He's got a rocket arm.He's got size.He's got speed and elusiveness.He makes good decisions.I don't think all these teams that most are mentioning will go QB at all. Especially first round. Speaking for my Packers, I'd love to see Losman handling the clipboard behind favre for a couple years. I think he's got the most QB qualities among this crop of draftees.F
Tau837
Footballguy
Rivers vs. Manning:I don't see why Manning is considered such a better prospect than Rivers. Rivers may not have the Manning name, but his father is a high school coach, so he grew up with the game, too. Actually, Rivers reminds me a bit of Peyton Manning (at Tennessee) with his maturity and ability to read defenses and direct the offense. Someone mentioned intangibles for Eli Manning. What intangibles does he have that Rivers doesn't have? Is it really just the family name?Rivers vs. Roethlisberger and/or Losman:I admit I know nothing about Losman and little about Roethlisberger.I do know that Rivers put up better numbers than Roethlisberger or Losman while playing stronger competition. I do know Rivers has a track record of excellent play, and I believe he has sustained his excellence for longer than the other two. Size was mentioned as a plus for both Roethlisberger and Losman, but Rivers is 6'5", 235, so that doesn't give them an edge.Rivers isn't a great runner, although he is surprisingly mobile in the pocket... perhaps that is an advantage for the other two.I have also gathered that the other two are considered to have better arms than Rivers. I have my doubts about that. N.C. State has a vertical offense, and Rivers throws an excellent deep ball. He consistently makes all the throws expected of an NFL QB.I suspect it boils down to criticism of his delivery. I don't think his delivery will be a problem at all... he has a quick release, and he is big enough to get it off without difficulty.So can anyone identify explicit reasons why Manning, Roethlisberger, and Losman are better prospects?
Nothing major to fix - they need one roadgrader at LG, and a LT to develop. That's about it. I am glad for the depth at QB this year, as I truly feel the fins will be cleaning house for next year at the position and will not retain any of the three currently on the roster.Rivers to the phins is fine by me, let him Carson Palmer/Chad Pennington it for a year or two behind a solid vet like Brunell.
i see no reason that rivers can't be as good as pennington or brady (as clutch, well that's intangible, but talent-wise), and he should be ready to give it a go right off the bat as he has been a starter the whole way. as a steelers fan, my dream draft is kevin jones/ste. jackson in the 1st, and rivers in the 2nd.
jurb26
Footballguy
Man I was hoping that he might fall to my Steelers in the 2nd. Guess there is no chance of that now.I have tried to keep up on him all year long. He is a great athlete and an amazing QB. He got better than average tools and all the intangilbes. I thot that game he played agianst OSU in the Horse Shoe was awsome and showed great poise.PackBacker
Footballguy
You've not read a single thing about Rivers if you believe he has a 'Jeff George' type personality. As a NC State homer, we've seen this kid grow up before our eyes. He's one of the class acts of ACC as well as NCAA football. In all the reports I've heard and read on this kid, his personality has never been in question.[Edited to say you might be talking about Lohsman's personality. Gotta love those ambiguous pronouns!
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I was talking about J.P. Losman.You've not read a single thing about Rivers if you believe he has a 'Jeff George' type personality. As a NC State homer, we've seen this kid grow up before our eyes. He's one of the class acts of ACC as well as NCAA football. In all the reports I've heard and read on this kid, his personality has never been in question.[Edited to say you might be talking about Lohsman's personality. Gotta love those ambiguous pronouns!
Well I guess we agree then. hmmm?Look he's had a damn good college career. I can't believe you would be TOTALLY sure he is a supreme NFL QB when he has an obvious strange delivery, something NFL coaches are nuts about. Bad things happen when you don't have good mechanics in the NFL. Brett Favre and other greats can overcome this, they are the exceptions. If you think Rivers is going to be a GREAT QB and can work around it, then maybe you should be next to Mel Kiper on draft day dispensing analysis. If you don't think strange mechanics and a primarily shotgun offense are any reason for concern, then I don't know what to tell you.
Tau837
Footballguy
No we don't agree. You selectively quoted me. I addressed why I think concerns about his delivery are overblown in previous posts.I never said anything about the shotgun offense. I think that is more of a valid concern than his delivery. I don't think it will be a big problem, but it is an adjustment he'll have to make.Do I think he'll be a "supreme" or "great" QB in the NFL? Do I think he'll be Favre or Marino? That remains to be seen... obviously the odds are against that as they are for any QB entering the NFL. However, Rivers has done/proven as much or more than any other QB has done prior to joining the NFL to put himself in position to be great.If you are so sure his mechanics will be a problem, then explain why. I asked this question before and no one responded to it.Will his delivery translate into poor completion percentage? Will it translate into more interceptions? More batted balls? More sacks? Less points? Less yardage? None of these were true in his college career, so why would anyone be so concerned they would suddenly become problems in the NFL?You don't have to be Mel Kiper to see that he has already "worked around" his delivery to achieve greatness on the college level.You say "bad things" happen when a QB doesn't have good mechanics in the NFL. Again, I am looking for specifics. Let's hear them.
You pretty much summed it up. I don't know which one will happen. Maybe coaches will notice something in his delivery that tips his hand as to where hes throwing. I think that we can both agree that college is a different game than the NFL, which is why I'm not sold on Rivers and his delivery. I could imagine how it could be a problem. I don't see how you can dismiss it.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
we are in for a long season chad.Good reading in this pre-Senior Bowl post.
cstu
Footballguy
I guess it's good not to have too high of expectations for a QB in his first year starting, but I really like the guy and have been hoping he'd become the starter for two years already. It not like the Chargers need Rivers to set the world on fire passing, he just needs to play mistake-free football and get the ball to Gates most of the time. He'll be shaky at first and make some mistakes, but the Chargers have had two years to evaluate him and figure out what he can and can't do. I also believe that Rivers can put fear into defenses in ways that Brees could not.we are in for a long season chad.Good reading in this pre-Senior Bowl post.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I think Drew was gonna do nothing but get better, he, gates, LT, Keenan were really starting to click. Im disappointed, they have NO SHOT of winning anything this year with an untested QB. This team is taking an unnecassary step backwards. Plus they are going to get NOTHING for an NFL starting QB.I guess it's good not to have too high of expectations for a QB in his first year starting, but I really like the guy and have been hoping he'd become the starter for two years already. It not like the Chargers need Rivers to set the world on fire passing, he just needs to play mistake-free football and get the ball to Gates most of the time. He'll be shaky at first and make some mistakes, but the Chargers have had two years to evaluate him and figure out what he can and can't do. I also believe that Rivers can put fear into defenses in ways that Brees could not.we are in for a long season chad.Good reading in this pre-Senior Bowl post.
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