Pro Bowlers to be announced today (2 Viewers)

[Doctor Detroit]

Why are people hating on Romo? That team was f'n dead before he got inserted in there.

Rex Grossman is 12-2. I guess he should be on the team following this rationale since the Bears got smoked with Orton last year. Grossman also has 22 TDS to Romo's 16. Romo doesn't deserve to be on a Pro Bowl team selected after week 15. Maybe after week 17 but not after week 15. And why wasn't Donovan McNabb selected? Because he's on the IR? Is he ineligible? McNabb>Romo/Bulger/Vick/Weinke

this is shtick, right?

Sure.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I just don't put much weight into the TDs considering Tiki has one of the best shortdistance runners in the game as his backup, while Westbrook gets to stay in for the TDs.

Westbrook is obviously a great player, a gamebreaker and one of the best in the league. Tiki is also one of the best. It's too bad 4 RBs couldn't make the team. Reminds me of the year LT didn't make it.

Fairly decent read: http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/9880915

Westbrook has 6 carries and 2 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line this season and he's scored 3 TDs on those plays.Tiki has 4 carries and 0 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line with 0 TDs.

Take away the "goalline" work for both players and Westbrook still has 8 TDs to Tiki's 1 (in 1 fewer game).

BTW, I agree that all 4 RBs in the NFC had Pro Bowl type seasons, but Tiki's lack of TDs would have been the easiest reason to exclude him. Westbrook has been amazing and deserved to go. In general, I think players with great non traditional stats tend to get unfairly excluded in Pro Bowl selections (i.e., Westbrook's receiving, Vick's rushing, CBs or DL with high tackle numbers).

 

[BoltBacker]

this is my initial list of snubsNFCCB Terence Newman (over DeAngelo Hall or Lito Sheppard)

If this list is supposed to be based solely on how they played this year then Walt Harris should have made the team. He's had a huge impact on SF being respectable this year.

 

[zoonation]

T.O. should have made it if performance on the field counted for anything. The guy leads the NFL in receiving TDs

Jackson should have made it too.

Steve Smith....no.

Boldin.......for sure not.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I just don't put much weight into the TDs considering Tiki has one of the best shortdistance runners in the game as his backup, while Westbrook gets to stay in for the TDs.

Westbrook is obviously a great player, a gamebreaker and one of the best in the league. Tiki is also one of the best. It's too bad 4 RBs couldn't make the team. Reminds me of the year LT didn't make it.

Fairly decent read: http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/9880915

Westbrook has 6 carries and 2 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line this season and he's scored 3 TDs on those plays.Tiki has 4 carries and 0 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line with 0 TDs.

Take away the "goalline" work for both players and Westbrook still has 8 TDs to Tiki's 1 (in 1 fewer game).

You've just earned your FBG stipend for the week.

 

[delusional]

T.O. should have made it if performance on the field counted for anything. The guy leads the NFL in receiving TDsJackson should have made it too. Steve Smith....no. Boldin.......for sure not.

I know, shocked to see Boldin in there. What about the rookie of the year canidate Colston? Or the MONSTER year Roy Williams is having in Detriot.

 

[PatsFanCT]

I don't know how Mathis or McAlister get in ahead of Samuel, but that just might be the homer in me.

 

[zoonation]

T.O. should have made it if performance on the field counted for anything. The guy leads the NFL in receiving TDsJackson should have made it too. Steve Smith....no. Boldin.......for sure not.

I know, shocked to see Boldin in there. What about the rookie of the year canidate Colston? Or the MONSTER year Roy Williams is having in Detriot.

Colston's numbers aren't good enough; Roy maybe, but he has been inconsistent and is fading somewhat.No T.O. is 100% because of the off-field drama that surrounds him. He should be starting, never mind going.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I don't know how Mathis or McAlister get in ahead of Samuel, but that just might be the homer in me.

Rashean Mathis has been probably the 2nd best CB in the league this year behind Champ. But, Samuel isn't far behind. He's been very good. I'd put him about even with McAlister, although McAlister probably would get the edge given that he's been playing at a high level for a long time.

 

[-OZ-]

I just don't put much weight into the TDs considering Tiki has one of the best shortdistance runners in the game as his backup, while Westbrook gets to stay in for the TDs.

Westbrook is obviously a great player, a gamebreaker and one of the best in the league. Tiki is also one of the best. It's too bad 4 RBs couldn't make the team. Reminds me of the year LT didn't make it.

Fairly decent read: http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/9880915

Westbrook has 6 carries and 2 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line this season and he's scored 3 TDs on those plays.Tiki has 4 carries and 0 catches from inside the opponents 5 yard line with 0 TDs.

Take away the "goalline" work for both players and Westbrook still has 8 TDs to Tiki's 1 (in 1 fewer game).

BTW, I agree that all 4 RBs in the NFC had Pro Bowl type seasons, but Tiki's lack of TDs would have been the easiest reason to exclude him. Westbrook has been amazing and deserved to go. In general, I think people with great non traditional stats tend to get unfairly excluded in Pro Bowl selections (i.e., Westbrook's receiving, Vick's rushing, CBs or DL with high tackle numbers).

Nicely done. How many TDs would Tiki have if he got the short distance plays? (I realize this is impossible to tell, but we can speculate.) Consider that all 9 of Jacobs TDs have come from the red zone, while the only RB "taking" TDs from BW is Buckhalter with 1. FWIW, I only have red zone plays, not inside the 5, while looking at it, BW is very impressive there, surprisingly so.

Tiki's still smarter

I'd take the NFC's 2nd leading rusher, but more importantly, I'd change the rosters to include 4 RBs. Take Boldin out.

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

How many TDs would Tiki have if he got the short distance plays? (I realize this is impossible to tell, but we can speculate.) Consider that all 9 of Jacobs TDs have come from the red zone, while the only RB "taking" TDs from BW is Buckhalter with 1. FWIW, I only have red zone plays, not inside the 5, while looking at it, BW is very impressive there, surprisingly so.

Brandon Jacobs has 13 rushes from inside the opponents 5 yard line for 7 TDs. If Tiki gets all those carries, might be reasonable to suggest he adds 3 or 4 more TDs to his total.(FTR, this inside the 5 info is available on FBG player pages, split stats)

 

[commisholio]

Congrats to Frank Gore, first time pro-bowler and starter for the NFC. He totally deserves it.

 

[Tau837]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

Isn't Tampa one of the heaviest cover 2 teams in the NFL? If I'm not mistaken, CBs in cover 2 are responsible for providing more run support than covers in most other defenses. Isn't that true? So, doesn't it stand to reason that Barber would have more tackles than many other corners?More importantly, doesn't this illustrate that tackles are a poor metric for comparing corners (unless we know they play in the same base defense)?

 

[Tau837]

put Rivers on the Patriots this year and how do you think that team would do?

Either the same or better than the Patriots did with Brady.

put Brady on the Chargers this year and how do you think that team would do?

Either the same or worse than the Chargers did with Rivers.As usual with Rivers, I'm sure I'm in the minority. For whatever reason, people still don't realize how good he is. Coming into the season, most around here insisted that he would struggle, despite all the positives (his talent, his supporting cast, his two years of preparation, etc.). Now that he has not struggled, most people want to now just write it off to his supporting cast.One of these days, people will realize how good he really is.

 

[Tau837]

For all of you saying Brady should have made it over Rivers, I'd like to hear why.

I think Manning and Palmer are pretty clearly more deserving than Rivers, and Rivers is pretty clearly more deserving than Brady (if we are only counting this year, not the past five years). QB in the AFC seems like an easy choice this year, and they got it right.

Totally agree.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

Isn't Tampa one of the heaviest cover 2 teams in the NFL? If I'm not mistaken, CBs in cover 2 are responsible for providing more run support than covers in most other defenses. Isn't that true? So, doesn't it stand to reason that Barber would have more tackles than many other corners?More importantly, doesn't this illustrate that tackles are a poor metric for comparing corners (unless we know they play in the same base defense)?

well, I'm not exactly trying to argue that tackles are the best metric for comparing corners. But, tackling is a part of playing defense and some CBs are much better tacklers than others. And, yes, of course defensive system plays a large role here...but that happens at every other position as well. Schemes will always have a large impact on statistics...on offense and defense.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

Isn't Tampa one of the heaviest cover 2 teams in the NFL? If I'm not mistaken, CBs in cover 2 are responsible for providing more run support than covers in most other defenses. Isn't that true? So, doesn't it stand to reason that Barber would have more tackles than many other corners?More importantly, doesn't this illustrate that tackles are a poor metric for comparing corners (unless we know they play in the same base defense)?

I don't get your point. Yes, DBs in the Cover 2 are responsible for more run defense than other defenses. Does that mean that DBs in the Cover 2 shouldn't be eligible for the Pro Bowl? Barber's tackle numbers put him at second in the NFC for DBs. He also had 14 passes defensed which puts him at 10th in the NFC. His high tackle numbers indicate that he did a good job in run support which is what he was supposed to do in his defensive system. Are you honestly trying to say that because Ronde Barber's system calls for the DB to do more run support, that he should be penalized for doing a good job defending against the pass AND against the run?

 

[Tau837]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

Isn't Tampa one of the heaviest cover 2 teams in the NFL? If I'm not mistaken, CBs in cover 2 are responsible for providing more run support than covers in most other defenses. Isn't that true? So, doesn't it stand to reason that Barber would have more tackles than many other corners?More importantly, doesn't this illustrate that tackles are a poor metric for comparing corners (unless we know they play in the same base defense)?

I don't get your point. Yes, DBs in the Cover 2 are responsible for more run defense than other defenses. Does that mean that DBs in the Cover 2 shouldn't be eligible for the Pro Bowl? Barber's tackle numbers put him at second in the NFC for DBs. He also had 14 passes defensed which puts him at 10th in the NFC. His high tackle numbers indicate that he did a good job in run support which is what he was supposed to do in his defensive system. Are you honestly trying to say that because Ronde Barber's system calls for the DB to do more run support, that he should be penalized for doing a good job defending against the pass AND against the run?

No... I didn't say either of those things... and if I was "trying to say" them, I would have said them. Don't read things into my posts that aren't there.I guess I was responding more to OZ's post that high tackle numbers don't necessarily indicate a dominant CB. I agree with that, and was explaining one reason why that could be true. Sorry if my post was misleading on that front.

 

[Tau837]

I'm not sure high tackle numbers are a positive sign of a dominant cornerback. It depends how he's utilized I suppose.

I guess it depends. Ronde Barber is an example where tackles are a pretty good indicator of his value in run support, but he also makes big plays. Other CBs who tackle WRs after they got beat aren't really doing too much to help their teams. INTs generally determine who makes the Pro Bowl at CB, but even those aren't a perfect indicator b/c some of the best CBs are rarely thrown at.

Isn't Tampa one of the heaviest cover 2 teams in the NFL? If I'm not mistaken, CBs in cover 2 are responsible for providing more run support than covers in most other defenses. Isn't that true? So, doesn't it stand to reason that Barber would have more tackles than many other corners?More importantly, doesn't this illustrate that tackles are a poor metric for comparing corners (unless we know they play in the same base defense)?

well, I'm not exactly trying to argue that tackles are the best metric for comparing corners. But, tackling is a part of playing defense and some CBs are much better tacklers than others. And, yes, of course defensive system plays a large role here...but that happens at every other position as well. Schemes will always have a large impact on statistics...on offense and defense.

Of course, of course... I was more responding to OZ's post than yours, I guess, agreeing that tackles may or may not indicate a dominant cornerback. I wasn't intending to knock Barber.

 

[nxmehta]

The homer in me is upset that Sean Jones didn't make it, but for Kerry Rhodes to not make it is a complete crime.

Most of the selections are decent though.

Yet again no Browns players make the Pro Bowl. We've only had 1 since 1999 (Jamir Miller)...

 

[Ghost Rider]

Tiki Barber making it over Brian Westbrook is a sham, but I am guessing that voters kept in mind the fact that this is Tiki's last year.

 

[Capella]

Who were the players slighted the most this year? 1. Warren Sapp, DT, Raiders: All right, we know the Raiders' offense stinks. Aaron Brooks and Andrew Walter are just waiting to be sacked every time they drop back to make a pass. At 2-12, Raiders fans have a commitment to heading to the exits. But Sapp was sensational this year. He had eight sacks on the fourth-ranked defense in the NFL. Defensive coordinator Rob Ryan went back to the 4-3 defense, which plays to Sapp's strengths and he became a disruptive force again. He was beaten out by Richard Seymour (Patriots), Williams and Hampton. He wasn't even one of the top three alternates at the defensive tackle position. That's unbelievable.

boy he must have some enemies.

 

[flapgreen]

I equate the Pro Bowl to the Grammies. It's pretty meaningless imo. I can't remember if it's always been this way or I'm just to young to remember it otherwise.

 

[Gottabesweet]

London Fletcher - snubbed like always.

Zack Over-rated Thomas.