Proper Punishment for the Patriots Poll (1 Viewer)

[Darth Cheney]

When we talk about "cheating," we're talking about things that are considered unacceptable regardless of the formal punishment imposed. Holding doesn't meet that definition. Taping signals does.

This is quite the spin. Holding is considered "unacceptable". That is why there's a rule against it, and yards are marched off when you get caught.

C'mon now. Arguing that an on-field penalty is even remotely in the same league as this type of cheating/espionage is just downright silly.

Agreed. It's a good thing I haven't remotely argued that. The original point was that there are degrees of cheating, of which holding would be one, though a pretty inconsequential one.

An organization conspired to cheat here and they built a system of information distribution around the cheating. The rules are clear. There is no way anyone sensible can make the excuse that they didn't know what they are doing. That's a big deal any way you slice it.

Um.. yeah... I'm talking about holding.

Holding is a penalty, it's not cheating.

Okay, you guys win. Breaking the clearly defined rules of play in a game is not in any way, shape, or form "cheating".

I guess you are just slow.

Hey, pretty excellent of you there. Way to get personal. In what way am I slow? You said holding isn't cheating even though it's clearly against the rules. Therefore I can only conclude that your position is that breaking the clearly defined rules of play in a game is not in any way, shape, or form "cheating". If there's something I'm missing there, feel free to point it out.

Don't you get penalized for the "cheating" move of holding?

 

[parrot]

I like the idea of banning them from the post-season. This is similar to college when teams are prohibited from bowl games. They have to play the games, but they can't get into the playoffs.

This should be done for the next 2 years.

Sorry, Randy, no super bowl ring for you !!!

Only if they take away their draft choices the following years, or are forced to take the last pick in each round. Otherwise they have incentive to tank those seasons for better draft position.

Incentive to tank? What would be the incentive to not tank? What you'd be looking at is a two-year preseason for the Patriots where there main concern would be not getting anyone important hurt. That would do a lot for the integrity of the league.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I like the idea of banning them from the post-season. This is similar to college when teams are prohibited from bowl games. They have to play the games, but they can't get into the playoffs.This should be done for the next 2 years.Sorry, Randy, no super bowl ring for you !!!

Only if they take away their draft choices the following years, or are forced to take the last pick in each round. Otherwise they have incentive to tank those seasons for better draft position.

Thus 1 year... and you dont announce until after week 17.If Goodell wanted to add another year, he wouldnt announce it until playoff time that year also.Thus the Patriots would play the season(s) out. Nothing says he has to state the penalty earlier then when it is most effective for the league.

 

[Gr00vus]

I voted other.

Franknbeans should be penalized for wasting his time posting this poll instead of one of his "usual" FFA poles, and, in relation, that I'm annoyed, frightened and confused by this Franknbeans poll as

$250,000 fine, 4 game suspension, no postseason, cessation of all non-ffa hottie poll related activities and no more cheerleading squad for Franknbeans.

 

[RudeDog]

I like the idea of banning them from the post-season. This is similar to college when teams are prohibited from bowl games. They have to play the games, but they can't get into the playoffs.This should be done for the next 2 years.Sorry, Randy, no super bowl ring for you !!!

Only if they take away their draft choices the following years, or are forced to take the last pick in each round. Otherwise they have incentive to tank those seasons for better draft position.On the other hand, the last thing the league needs is a team going something like 14-2 and not being allowed into the playoffs. It would diminish the accomplishment of the team that did win, because "they didn't have to play the pats"

The pats are a 10 - 6 team without stealing the other teams defensive calls. No big loss. If they do tank the seasons then they would have to deal with an even more tarnished image and hysterical Bostonians who would still want to watch their team win.

 

[Mungo Burrows]

I voted other.

Franknbeans should be penalized for wasting his time posting this poll instead of one of his "usual" FFA poles, and, in relation, that I'm annoyed, frightened and confused by this Franknbeans poll as

$250,000 fine, 4 game suspension, no postseason, cessation of all non-ffa hottie poll related activities and no more cheerleading squad for Franknbeans.

Your comment about "no more cheerleading squad" got me thinking...

 

[ookook]

Same as the Timberwolves: Five 1st round picks. Recuced to four if BB takes the rest of the year off.

 

[Southside Stosh]

500k fine for BB

500k fine for the Patriots Organization

....and the NFL announces the immediate termination and ban of any HC that is caught videotaping in the future.

 

[strong]

It's interesting that the majority of NFL fans are calling for players' heads for crimes they commit off the field, whether they are proven guilty in a court of law or not. In contrast, fans seemed split on this Patriots issue with many expressing a blasé attitude towards an organization that attempted to truly threaten the integrity of the game by cheating during it...

Do you feel that all attempted signal stealing should be outlawed?

Outlawed as in a felony carrying mandatory sentencing? Haha. It's already banned by the league and that's enough for me... I'm not going to call my congressman asking him to write up new legislation on this issue...

 

[chris1969]

All of the above and they should have to forfeit the game they got caught cheating.

 

[parrot]

It's interesting that the majority of NFL fans are calling for players' heads for crimes they commit off the field, whether they are proven guilty in a court of law or not. In contrast, fans seemed split on this Patriots issue with many expressing a blasé attitude towards an organization that attempted to truly threaten the integrity of the game by cheating during it...

Do you feel that all attempted signal stealing should be outlawed?

Outlawed as in a felony carrying mandatory sentencing? Haha. It's already banned by the league and that's enough for me... I'm not going to call my congressman asking him to write up new legislation on this issue...

I mean outlawed by the league. My understanding is that there is not rule against attempting to steal signals, just against using a video camera to do it. If we're concerned with the integrity of the game, shouldn't the league do whatever it can to stamp out the practice rather than just certain tactics?

 

[GregR_2]

All those saying forfeit, you DO realize it is likely well beyond the commish's power to order that, right?

Link

According to league rules and bylaws, the commissioner possesses the authority to investigate and take disciplinary action if the NFL determines a team has engaged in unfair acts. Goodell's powers include the "imposition of monetary fines and draft choice forfeitures, suspension of persons involved, and, if appropriate, the reversal of a game's result or the rescheduling of a game, either from the beginning or from the point at which the extraordinary act occurred."

Good find if this article can be trusted. The question is whether this incident is is an "unfair act" that falls under this rule or whether this quotation is a refelection of the commish's general powers.I have tried to find the league's bylaws so I could find this rule at issue, and couldnt find anything useful - tons ab out on-field rules, almost nothing on off-field rules.

FWIW, assuming they haven't changed this part from last year's rulebook:

Rule 17: Emergencies, Unfair acts

Section 2: Extraordinarily Unfair Acts

Article 1: The Commissioner has the sole authority to investigate and take appropriate disciplinary action and/or corrective measures if any club action, non-participant interference, or calamity occurs in an NFL game which he deems so extraordinarily unfair or outside the accepted tactics encountered in professional football that such actio has a major effect on the result of the game.

Article 2: [This part clarifies that Section 2 does not constitute a mechanism for protesting the outcome of a game because of official's judgments and the like.]

Article 3: The Commissioner's powers under this Section 2 include the imposition of monetary fines and draft-choice forfeitures, suspension of persons involved in unfair acts, and, if appropriate, the reversal of a game's result or the rescheduling of a game, either from the beginning or from the point at which the extraordinary act occurred. [... rules on rescheduling skipped...] In all cases, the Commisioner will conduct a full investigation, including the opportunity for hearings, use of game videotape, and any other procedure he deems appropriate.