QB Caleb Williams, CHI (6 Viewers)

[Drake Hater]

If he didn't have Odunze to target his stats would probably be a lot worse. He may eventually improve and hopefully so but right now it's hard to trust any other Bears receiver. A better QB in this system with this schedule would have been awesome for fantasy.

 

[rschroeder1]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

 

[miqws]

Ben Solak (back from paternity leave) on Caleb, Drake for MVP, and other NFL takes.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/46739409/nfl-week-8-drake-maye-caleb-williams-sam-darnold-trade-deadline-offers

 

[calcinorjones]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When CW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

 

[Chaka]

There is no sugar coating it, Williams has been BAD this season. Of 34 quarterbacks with 100 or more drop backs) Caleb Williams is:
QB27 in Comp % Over Expected (-0.1%)
QB28 in Highly Accurate Throw Rate (51.9%)
QB31 in Catchable Throw Rate (69.7%)
QB33 in Off Target Rate (21.6%)

Is this a byproduct of learning a new system or is Williams just not the QB most of us thought he was. I was high on him coming into this season. I'm about ready to admit I made a big mistake.

What is the link for those stats? Thank you.

I can't remember who I follow on X that posted it but I believe the underlying stats come from "Fantasy Points Data". When I have a chance I'll look up the actual tweet.

Great. Please share the link here when you find it. Thanks.

Can anyone define these stats and speak to what they actually mean in-game? I'm having a really hard time figuring out what most of them actually mean.

I won't outright dismiss them because they do tell a story and I think (obviously my subjective opinion) they do kind of align with what we see in his play. Ultimately, he could improve his accuracy.

That being said, they are highly subjective metrics as any stat talking about catchable balls, off target balls, what specific level a player is "expected" to perform (or even non-QB metrics like missed tackles forced) that all rely on the one individual watching the tape and checking the boxes. There is no standard definition for this stuff. Again, not saying I'd throw it all away; but ultimately if we had to rank all stats and metrics, I'd have some of these subjective ones a bit lower than hard counting stats that are universal and just are what they are. Circling back, for Caleb in particular, as much as I think he needs to improve his accuracy, I don't think he's the absolute worst in the league with it metrically this season.

Well said.

My short answer is "over expected" stats are horse ####.

The most advanced AI in the world cannot account for the unlimited variability that occurs on every play, every game, every team, every player etc.

We don't need those highly spurious statistics to arrive at the conclusion that Caleb has underperformed our, also spurious, expectations.

 

[Chaka]

IDK if people have been paying attention but Jayden Daniels has been pretty mid this season.

He's on a CJ Stroud trajectory ATM, of course that can change but...

Remember when CJ was the next big thing? I 'member. And he's not performing any better than he did last year.

Bo Nix may have turned a corner over the last 5 quarters but he's still only averaging 6.3 Y/A this season which, is dangerously close to the Joey Harrington territory.

So far, Maye is the only one who really seems to have taken that next step but, we'll see.

Tons of people already thinks Jaxson Dart is going to be special but, give DCs some film to watch and let's see what happens.

Like most things, this stuff takes time to get good at but, we live in an instant gratification world.

I hope all these teams demonstrate the patience necessary to develop these QBs because, they're physical talent is unquestionable.

 

[Max Power]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

If we're being honest here Nix has a super bowl champion and offensive guru head coach. Daniels had a SB winning DC (should have won SB) HC and an OC with HC experience. Williams played 1/2 a year with a passing game coordinator HC after all three of the HC, OC and DC were booted from their positions.

Sure we can put some of William lack of development on him, but if you don't point to the Bears organization as the biggest issue in his development, you're doing it wrong. Another thing to look at is how these organizations get first round pick Left Tackles. Tunsil, Bolles, Campbell. The Bears? Well they're rolling with an undrafted FA.

 

[Mojo56]

There is no sugar coating it, Williams has been BAD this season. Of 34 quarterbacks with 100 or more drop backs) Caleb Williams is:
QB27 in Comp % Over Expected (-0.1%)
QB28 in Highly Accurate Throw Rate (51.9%)
QB31 in Catchable Throw Rate (69.7%)
QB33 in Off Target Rate (21.6%)

Is this a byproduct of learning a new system or is Williams just not the QB most of us thought he was. I was high on him coming into this season. I'm about ready to admit I made a big mistake.

What is the link for those stats? Thank you.

I can't remember who I follow on X that posted it but I believe the underlying stats come from "Fantasy Points Data". When I have a chance I'll look up the actual tweet.

Great. Please share the link here when you find it. Thanks.

Here is the link: https://data.fantasypoints.com/nfl/tools/player/passing-advanced. It only highlights 5 QB's. The rest are behind a paywall. As for the validity of the stats, Comp % Over Expected is based on the depth of the throw. So if 25 yd passes are completed at an NFL average of 40% and QB XX completes his 25 yd passes at 30% then he is below his expected completion % by 10%. I think the other metrics are fairly easy to quantify and I'd love to see them become more readily available.

 

[rschroeder1]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

 

[calcinorjones]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

If we're being honest here Nix has a super bowl champion and offensive guru head coach. Daniels had a SB winning DC (should have won SB) HC and an OC with HC experience. Williams played 1/2 a year with a passing game coordinator HC after all three of the HC, OC and DC were booted from their positions.

Sure we can put some of William lack of development on him, but if you don't point to the Bears organization as the biggest issue in his development, you're doing it wrong. Another thing to look at is how these organizations get first round pick Left Tackles. Tunsil, Bolles, Campbell. The Bears? Well they're rolling with an undrafted FA.

Understood and you know from my criticism on the Bears organization that they are responsible for a good measure of the dysfunction from last year. My argument is explaining why and how the casual fan feels about the current situation.

I think we can agree that the HC, OL, and WR room have seen various levels of improvement. RBs are playing better and compared to the number of major injuries across the NFL - the Bears have escaped missing key offensive players - so realistically - the table is set for Williams to step up and backup that can’t miss prospect tag.

 

[Chaka]

There is no sugar coating it, Williams has been BAD this season. Of 34 quarterbacks with 100 or more drop backs) Caleb Williams is:
QB27 in Comp % Over Expected (-0.1%)
QB28 in Highly Accurate Throw Rate (51.9%)
QB31 in Catchable Throw Rate (69.7%)
QB33 in Off Target Rate (21.6%)

Is this a byproduct of learning a new system or is Williams just not the QB most of us thought he was. I was high on him coming into this season. I'm about ready to admit I made a big mistake.

What is the link for those stats? Thank you.

I can't remember who I follow on X that posted it but I believe the underlying stats come from "Fantasy Points Data". When I have a chance I'll look up the actual tweet.

Great. Please share the link here when you find it. Thanks.

Here is the link: https://data.fantasypoints.com/nfl/tools/player/passing-advanced. It only highlights 5 QB's. The rest are behind a paywall. As for the validity of the stats, Comp % Over Expected is based on the depth of the throw. So if 25 yd passes are completed at an NFL average of 40% and QB XX completes his 25 yd passes at 30% then he is below his expected completion % by 10%. I think the other metrics are fairly easy to quantify and I'd love to see them become more readily available.

So, according to their stats QB27 in Comp% Over Expected means he's -0.1% below the average, that suggests a very fat middle of that bell curve. So is +0.1% over expected QB5 or so?

I'm filing that under Stats designed to sound impressive but, really aren't.

 

[calcinorjones]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

 

[pinkstapler]

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

On the defensive turnover side of things I think it's just that watching games they were really relying on those turnovers more than relying on a top notch defense; and having a high number of the first doesn't necessarily mean you have the second as well. But I 100% get your point and you can't take it away from the Bears they were turnover machines through the first 7 weeks of the season and it was a huge help for the offense, field position, and ultimately accounting for some of their wins. I just think it was a bit of an aberration and possibly even a coached strategy considering all of the injuries on defense, namely in their secondary, before the season even started. Felt at times they were playing the ball and for picks/strips to the detriment of sound defensive fundamentals. Though I have been bought in since the offseason and watching all their games, I am obviously no expert on this, or even a full time Bears fan. Just how it looked to me. And I kept feeling like "if they suddenly hit a game where they can't force a few turnovers, I feel like it may derail this win streak".

edit: and as to Maye... I think he's on another level than all other QBs from that class. Some of the stats and records he's putting up right now are unreal and putting him into categories with truly elite QBs. "Maye also became just the fifth player in NFL history to rack up 200+ passing yards and a 100+ passer rating in seven consecutive games. The 2007 version of Brady is also in the group, along with Aaron Rodgers (2020, 2011), Patrick Mahomes (2018), and Peyton Manning (2004)." I feel like I'm seeing a new one of these every week. He's likely beyond being compared to Daniels/Nix at this point, let alone Caleb.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

I did hear some people throwing around this info in the offseason and it was shocking. That's some pretty terrible drafting. At the time I really thought Ben Johnson was going to follow in Coen's (supposed) footsteps and refuse to take the job unless Poles was fired like Baalke. I'd typically say he still doesn't have a chance at getting fired because the McCaskeys love him and have a history (IMO) of making bad decisions for the "right" reasons; but they proved me wrong when they hired Ben Johnson as they seemed like owners who would never hire a coach who doesn't bend the knee and be a good soldier for the organization. Feels like they haven't had a strong willed coach in there since maybe Ditka, but could probably make a good case for Lovie Smith early in his tenure too.

I know Poles was just extended, but there are enough examples of other GMs getting fired right after, if not still within, the same year they were extended. BJ seems to be doing a great job in changing the culture and making chicken salad out of the chicken sht he found in the fridge when he came in. I'd like to see them shove off Poles and include BJ in the hiring process for a new GM to lay some foundation for really rebuilding the franchise from the ground up. I think the offense legit has some playmakers, as does the defense when fully healthy. If they could get the o and d lines established and then fill in depth so an injury or two don't derail the team, I can see them on a Detroit trajectory sooner than later.

 

[Intston]

So, according to their stats QB27 in Comp% Over Expected means he's -0.1% below the average, that suggests a very fat middle of that bell curve. So is +0.1% over expected QB5 or so?

I'm filing that under Stats designed to sound impressive but, really aren't.

I think they list every QB with however miniscule a sample size, judging from Drew Lock being one of the 5. So QB27 is probably around lower middle of the pack.
However, I also believe the methodology is flawed if it doesn't account for how open a receiver is at the very least.

 

[calcinorjones]

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

On the defensive turnover side of things I think it's just that watching games they were really relying on those turnovers more than relying on a top notch defense; and having a high number of the first doesn't necessarily mean you have the second as well. But I 100% get your point and you can't take it away from the Bears they were turnover machines through the first 7 weeks of the season and it was a huge help for the offense, field position, and ultimately accounting for some of their wins. I just think it was a bit of an aberration and possibly even a coached strategy considering all of the injuries on defense, namely in their secondary, before the season even started. Felt at times they were playing the ball and for picks/strips to the detriment of sound defensive fundamentals. Though I have been bought in since the offseason and watching all their games, I am obviously no expert on this, or even a full time Bears fan. Just how it looked to me. And I kept feeling like "if they suddenly hit a game where they can't force a few turnovers, I feel like it may derail this win streak".

edit: and as to Maye... I think he's on another level than all other QBs from that class. Some of the stats and records he's putting up right now are unreal and putting him into categories with truly elite QBs. "Maye also became just the fifth player in NFL history to rack up 200+ passing yards and a 100+ passer rating in seven consecutive games. The 2007 version of Brady is also in the group, along with Aaron Rodgers (2020, 2011), Patrick Mahomes (2018), and Peyton Manning (2004)." I feel like I'm seeing a new one of these every week. He's likely beyond being compared to Daniels/Nix at this point, let alone Caleb.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

I did hear some people throwing around this info in the offseason and it was shocking. That's some pretty terrible drafting. At the time I really thought Ben Johnson was going to follow in Coen's (supposed) footsteps and refuse to take the job unless Poles was fired like Baalke. I'd typically say he still doesn't have a chance at getting fired because the McCaskeys love him and have a history (IMO) of making bad decisions for the "right" reasons; but they proved me wrong when they hired Ben Johnson as they seemed like owners who would never hire a coach who doesn't bend the knee and be a good soldier for the organization. Feels like they haven't had a strong willed coach in there since maybe Ditka, but could probably make a good case for Lovie Smith early in his tenure too.

I know Poles was just extended, but there are enough examples of other GMs getting fired right after, if not still within, the same year they were extended. BJ seems to be doing a great job in changing the culture and making chicken salad out of the chicken sht he found in the fridge when he came in. I'd like to see them shove off Poles and include BJ in the hiring process for a new GM to lay some foundation for really rebuilding the franchise from the ground up. I think the offense legit has some playmakers, as does the defense when fully healthy. If they could get the o and d lines established and then fill in depth so an injury or two don't derail the team, I can see them on a Detroit trajectory sooner than later.

WRT the Bears defense - they can’t stop the run and rank 26 or 27 giving up 140 plus yards a game. Teams are going to exploit this weakness especially with the turn into the second half of the season. Its odd w the Bears, when they win they have a history of defenses that grab TOs. When these opportunities dry up it will put more pressure on the offense to keep the defense off the field. This is pressure that CW needs to take on and overcome. Its coming and frankly it is here. Poles needed to fix that defensive interior but he appeased the offense early in the draft. Clearly a top priority in the 2026 draft. These weaknesses will doom the Bears vs the division unless something changes.

Maye? Have to be happy for the kid but NE - well that’s an NFL darling. They bring in a defensive minded HC, improve the OL, add a veteran WR and wammo!

 

[rschroeder1]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

The Bears defense gave up 30 points and a 116 QB rating to a third-string QB on Sunday. The defense registered two sacks and three other pressures. Baltimore punted twice and scored on every other possession.

Chasing a two-possession game in the second half, when your defense can't get a stop, is a heck of a lot different than chasing a one-score game (in regard to Santos).

Williams had his struggles on Sunday, but so did everyone else. That's my point. Let's assess him on his play, not his ability to overcome everyone else's problems.

 

[Max Power]

I heard a great analogy today on my drive in discussing how Caleb going #1 will always have to be compared to the QBs taken behind him. That's the wrong take to have. There is a good chance Caleb statistically becomes the best QB the Bears have ever had. They likened it to the 84 NBA draft. Hall of fame, MVP, 12 time all-star, two time NBA champion Hakeem Olajuwan was taken #1 overall. He was the right pick and great for the Rockets Franchise. The #3 pick that draft was Jordan who had a better career, but that didn't diminish what Olajuwan accomplished.

 

[calcinorjones]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

The Bears defense gave up 30 points and a 116 QB rating to a third-string QB on Sunday. The defense registered two sacks and three other pressures. Baltimore punted twice and scored on every other possession.

Chasing a two-possession game in the second half, when your defense can't get a stop, is a heck of a lot different than chasing a one-score game (in regard to Santos).

Williams had his struggles on Sunday, but so did everyone else. That's my point. Let's assess him on his play, not his ability to overcome everyone else's problems.

Third string QB passed for 186 yards w one TD. I believe his only TD was from the pick CW threw giving the Ravens the ball inside the 10 yard line. Third string QB or not the Ravens have a HOF RB that scored two TDs and racked up 71 rushing yards. The Ravens collectively ran on the Bears which is traditionally a strength of the Ravens team. They simply exploited the weakness of the defense. Sorry but this isn’t the 85 Bears. The turnovers didn’t happen. CW deserves better. That pick wasn’t on him. The mediocre passer rating, the intentional grounding calls, the passes lofting over the head of WRs or behind WRs not on CW. Its the kicker’s fault, the defense’s fault, the GM’s fault, the mediocre offensive playmaker’s fault, the OL’s fault, and the coaching staff’s fault. This is your argument. My suggestion is to accept the woeful situation CW finds himself in until he is no longer with the Bears. When that happens he can bring his awesomeness to the next NFL team who has the perfect organization.

 

[Chaka]

I heard a great analogy today on my drive in discussing how Caleb going #1 will always have to be compared to the QBs taken behind him. That's the wrong take to have. There is a good chance Caleb statistically becomes the best QB the Bears have ever had. They likened it to the 84 NBA draft. Hall of fame, MVP, 12 time all-star, two time NBA champion Hakeem Olajuwan was taken #1 overall. He was the right pick and great for the Rockets Franchise. The #3 pick that draft was Jordan who had a better career, but that didn't diminish what Olajuwan accomplished.

He could also be Sam Bowie.

 

[steelwind]

I am looking at Colston to fill in for Goedert on bye.
Is there any hope against Cinn this week? Initial box score analysis is not showing good results for Caleb the past three weeks.
Any thoughts from Caleb owners here?

 

[Gally]

Waldman has a nice article this week on FBG breaking down CW and a bunch of his throws from this week against the Ravens and how well he actually played. Correct decisions etc based on what the play was and how it was defensed. I think CW is getting the short end of the stick from many based on expectations and just the "feel" he gives off.

He isn't perfect. He is improving and getting better. I think that is what matters.

 

[Gally]

I am looking at Colston to fill in for Goedert on bye.

My mind immediately went to Marques Colston. I thought this was a mistake post from years ago...hahah

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

The Bears defense gave up 30 points and a 116 QB rating to a third-string QB on Sunday. The defense registered two sacks and three other pressures. Baltimore punted twice and scored on every other possession.

Chasing a two-possession game in the second half, when your defense can't get a stop, is a heck of a lot different than chasing a one-score game (in regard to Santos).

Williams had his struggles on Sunday, but so did everyone else. That's my point. Let's assess him on his play, not his ability to overcome everyone else's problems.

Third string QB passed for 186 yards w one TD. I believe his only TD was from the pick CW threw giving the Ravens the ball inside the 10 yard line. Third string QB or not the Ravens have a HOF RB that scored two TDs and racked up 71 rushing yards. The Ravens collectively ran on the Bears which is traditionally a strength of the Ravens team. They simply exploited the weakness of the defense. Sorry but this isn’t the 85 Bears. The turnovers didn’t happen. CW deserves better. That pick wasn’t on him. The mediocre passer rating, the intentional grounding calls, the passes lofting over the head of WRs or behind WRs not on CW. Its the kicker’s fault, the defense’s fault, the GM’s fault, the mediocre offensive playmaker’s fault, the OL’s fault, and the coaching staff’s fault. This is your argument. My suggestion is to accept the woeful situation CW finds himself in until he is no longer with the Bears. When that happens he can bring his awesomeness to the next NFL team who has the perfect organization.

The funny thing is Caleb already set some of those Bears records, and came very close to others, in his rookie season. A rookie season that people are saying was "bad" and something that has to be overlooked in future judgments of him.

Of course, as the prospect he was expectations were higher, but even similar prospects weren't judged nearly as harshly. His rookie year was better than Luck's and waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better then Lawrence's yet it was nothing but optimism for those other two guys and nothing but doubt/hate for Williams.

 

[calcinorjones]

Ben Devine
Some things I still think:
1. Caleb Williams has unlimited potential
2. He is growing but more slowly
3. He isn’t a fast learner
4. This offense is challenging
5. Daniels last year and Maye this year affect perception
6. We are impatient
7. He will put it all together
#DaBears

https://x.com/chicago_nfl/status/1982818963470860359?s=61

1&2 - Appear to be true.
#3 - There was an unconfirmed report from the last coaching staff that he has difficulty learning. There may be something here.
#4 - True. They compared Williams stats to Goff first 6 games under Ben Johnson and Williams is doing slightly better than Goff did to start in Ben's offense. Goff was also a 7 year veteran his first season with Ben as OC. https://www.bearstalk.com/2025/10/2...b-williams-jared-goff-ben-johnson-nfl-week-8/
#5 - Daniels has had his ups and down. While Maye is having a great year, just note the Patriots play the easiest strength of schedule by a WIDE margin. .362. They only have 3 games against playoff teams this year.
#6. - Absolutely and it's annoying. I have friends and family Bears fan who are already ready to draft another QB. Like we haven't been on this same draft and dump QB rollercoaster for the last decade. At the same time seeing QBs on their second or third team thriving. Mayfield, Darnold, Goff, Daniel Jones and to a lesser extent Mac Jones. These players need time.
#7 - I'm still hopeful. I'm not sure what else I can be at this point. I don't say all this to not have a bit of reservation, but what other option is there right now?

I'd be ok if Ben wants to take a late shot at a QB in the draft. This might be a good year as there is a massive tier of backup QBs in this draft. If Ben thinks one can run his system better, go ahead and grab one in Rd 5-7.

For me, I take anything the coaching staff from last year has to say with a grain of salt. I will not forget last year's team captains trying to get Caleb Williams benched to protect his development from the coaching staff. Not sure that's ever happened before in NFL history.

I don't know what it is about Caleb, but for some reason people do not want to ascribe the typical afflictions of rookie/young quarterbacks to him. Instead, there has to be some other (more insidious) explanation. The backbreaking interception on Sunday was a good example - he was a split second slow in delivering the ball to Odunze (if he should have to begin with), and he did so with Monongai wide open in the right flat. Like with all young QBs, the question is whether the combination of reading defenses and understanding pro game speed clicks with him.

We did see Caleb taking those easy and productive check-downs in weeks 3 and 4. Weeks 6-7, checkdowns have disappeared. His growth doesn't seem linear, but linear is the set expectation.

Ppl will measure him against Daniels, Nix, and Maye citing his almost unanimous “can’t miss” number 1 pick position over all 3. All 3 of these QBs have made significant contributions to turning around losing organizations. Denver and Washington snagging playoffs last year and Denver and NE in a nice position to go to the playoffs this year. The development of all 3 QBs has been head and shoulders above CW. I get last year being a total train wreck in Chicago but expectations were high this year and it just feels like another season unfolding for an average Bears team - decent RB, decent kicker, opportunistic defense and frustrating QB play.

When KW drops back its a wild card. Anything can happen. Confidence is not on the same level as Nix, Maye or Daniels. This is what ppl see. They want constant improvement. Something isn’t clicking and after heavy investments in the OL and offensive draft capital the blame is going to land on CW or the HC. If he busts it will set the Bears back years - AGAIN. Winning solves problems. Losing magnifies. That pick into double coverage on Sunday was rough. Let’s see what the nxt month offers.

People may blame Caleb Williams, but I would say people who follow the team have a general sense where the problem is - the general manager himself.

Of the starting lineups the Bears will roll out on Sunday, Ryan Poles has turned 28 draft picks over four years into three starting players. All three starters are top 10 picks. Zero starters from rounds 2-7. Zero Pro-Bowl players selected from any round. Seven players picked in rounds 1-6 in 2025, and none are contributing this year. It's a mind-boggling level of failure.

Disagree on your characterizations of the Bears K and D. Santos missed a 58-yard field goal woefully short on Sunday. If he makes that kick like most modern kickers do, the Bears are not chasing a two-possession game for most of the second half. The Bears are lapped again by the rest of the league.

The Bears entered Sunday with the most turnovers in the NFL and the most yards allowed per play. Injuries have played a big part in that, but turnovers are a pretty fickle strategy to rely on.

Suffice to say, I would assess Caleb on his play, and not pin the blame on him for the mediocre roster around him.

A decent kicker put up 10 of 16 points on the board on Sunday and kept the Bears in the game until Williams threw a pass into double coverage deep in Bears territory. Pinning the game on a missed 58 yard FG is interesting. If the offense finished drives the Bears wouldn’t be settling with FG attempts. This has doomed the team over the years and drafting a can’t miss CW is supposed to change that. Alas, its still a WIP.

Also, the Bears currently rank 4th in the league in terms of turnover differential for the 2025 season, with a differential of plus 10. That's a very strong position, putting them among the top teams in the league for taking care of the ball (a plus for CW) and creating turnovers. The defense has 16 turnovers which places them as the number 1 turnover defense in the NFL. I described the defense as being opportunistic. Not sure how you can be more opportunistic than leading the NFL in TOs. You call this fickle but its part of the value of an NFL defense. The game I was watching on Sunday was over after that terrible pick. Put the defense in a vulnerable position on the road. Again a WIP.

The same with CW’s woeful completion percentage - a WIP.

It’s fair to point out the current challenges with the draft class. Im not going to defend Poles. I was vocal at the end of 2024 that he needed to go. To counter, the OL has improved and there are good playmakers. Not sure if its accurate to characterize all the playmakers around him as being mediocre. CW completion percentage is at 62%. Maye is at 75%. Who are the great playmakers around Maye?

The Bears defense gave up 30 points and a 116 QB rating to a third-string QB on Sunday. The defense registered two sacks and three other pressures. Baltimore punted twice and scored on every other possession.

Chasing a two-possession game in the second half, when your defense can't get a stop, is a heck of a lot different than chasing a one-score game (in regard to Santos).

Williams had his struggles on Sunday, but so did everyone else. That's my point. Let's assess him on his play, not his ability to overcome everyone else's problems.

Third string QB passed for 186 yards w one TD. I believe his only TD was from the pick CW threw giving the Ravens the ball inside the 10 yard line. Third string QB or not the Ravens have a HOF RB that scored two TDs and racked up 71 rushing yards. The Ravens collectively ran on the Bears which is traditionally a strength of the Ravens team. They simply exploited the weakness of the defense. Sorry but this isn’t the 85 Bears. The turnovers didn’t happen. CW deserves better. That pick wasn’t on him. The mediocre passer rating, the intentional grounding calls, the passes lofting over the head of WRs or behind WRs not on CW. Its the kicker’s fault, the defense’s fault, the GM’s fault, the mediocre offensive playmaker’s fault, the OL’s fault, and the coaching staff’s fault. This is your argument. My suggestion is to accept the woeful situation CW finds himself in until he is no longer with the Bears. When that happens he can bring his awesomeness to the next NFL team who has the perfect organization.

The funny thing is Caleb already set some of those Bears records, and came very close to others, in his rookie season. A rookie season that people are saying was "bad" and something that has to be overlooked in future judgments of him.

Of course, as the prospect he was expectations were higher, but even similar prospects weren't judged nearly as harshly. His rookie year was better than Luck's and waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better then Lawrence's yet it was nothing but optimism for those other two guys and nothing but doubt/hate for Williams.

I maintain that its all a WIP and hope that it turns into championships for the team. The fans have suffered enough. The road to get there is going to be rough on some games and good to great on others. Personally- I ignore the hate and the doubt. I am on record as stating that he has to learn a new/ complicated play book with new coaches and teammates. So does the rest of the team. Criticism is part of the game so CW and his apologists have to ignore it or accept it. I hope it doesn’t turn out like Lawrence or even Luck.

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

Something needs to change in the red zone for him and the team to take the next step. Here's the data set of TDs thrown in the 24 games he's played:

0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,1,1,1,1,1,1,2,2,2,2,2,2,3,4,4

Mean 1.2
Median = 1
Mode = 0

More often than not he's throwing 0 or 1 TDs. He's thrown for 2 TDs or fewer in 21 of his 24 games.

Although his running ability is above average, it's only translated to 2 rushing TDs in his career. It doesn't appear that he's producing enough scoring, IMO. That could be mostly attributable to play calling, I don't follow the Bears closely enough. His yardage, YPA, and completion percentage are a bit low, but not so much to indicate he's not capable of it.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

 

[SoBeDad]

Food for thought. Put Williams in DET and Goff in CHI. Players matter.

ARSB, LaPorta, Sewell, and Gibbs are much better than their counterparts in CHI.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

If you hung your hat on Caleb in redraft, then you weren't paying attention. Many of us here predicted a lot of ups and downs this season based on him learning Johnson's system as well as learning how to be a professional QB (which wasn't taught to him as a rookie). I suspect he will end the season with close to 4k yards and 25 TDs and things will get progressively better as the season rolls on. The real proof of concept will be the 2026 season with him having a full year to learn the system and get familiar with his offensive core.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Only among the Chronically Online, Chubby, Old Guy Vaguely Angry for No Reason fantasy community

I have a name!

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Food for thought. Put Williams in DET and Goff in CHI. Players matter.

ARSB, LaPorta, Sewell, and Gibbs are much better than their counterparts in CHI.

This is a stretch, IMO. Goff proved in his Rams post-Gurley days that he could produce with a sub-par team around him and a shaky OL.

It’s easy to point to a team with a ton of weapons like the Lions and make that comparison, but in my opinion it’s a false equivalence. Goff would be better on this Bears team than Caleb because Goff is a better, more experienced, more developed QB. His NFL IQ is significantly higher than Caleb, and if Goff were a Bear today, Kmet, DJM, Odunze, Swift, and Burden would all likely be substantially upgraded for it. The Bears are actually pretty loaded with weapons right now.

Goff makes quick reads, understands what the defenses are trying to do to him, and can often make those mental adjustments to adapt.

Meanwhile if Caleb was the Lions QB, I think he’d be getting pummeled behind the line because he takes longer to process, and makes bad reads. I don’t think he has the touch to feed LaPorta & ARSB on the short and intermediate routes either. Not saying he can’t get there one day, but at present I believe Goff is a much better QB. Caleb is a work in progress.

Due respect, but I see the “if we swapped Goff & Caleb” thing as a swing and a miss. Definitely challenged me to think about it, so in that you were successful.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

If you hung your hat on Caleb in redraft, then you weren't paying attention. Many of us here predicted a lot of ups and downs this season based on him learning Johnson's system as well as learning how to be a professional QB (which wasn't taught to him as a rookie). I suspect he will end the season with close to 4k yards and 25 TDs and things will get progressively better as the season rolls on. The real proof of concept will be the 2026 season with him having a full year to learn the system and get familiar with his offensive core.

I drafted him for this week’s game against Cincinnati, AKA “Baker’s BYE week.”

I was fortunate enough to have started him week 3 when he put up 4 TD’s (44.5 points). Hoping for another big game this week.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

If you hung your hat on Caleb in redraft, then you weren't paying attention. Many of us here predicted a lot of ups and downs this season based on him learning Johnson's system as well as learning how to be a professional QB (which wasn't taught to him as a rookie). I suspect he will end the season with close to 4k yards and 25 TDs and things will get progressively better as the season rolls on. The real proof of concept will be the 2026 season with him having a full year to learn the system and get familiar with his offensive core.

I drafted him for this week’s game against Cincinnati, AKA “Baker’s BYE week.”

I was fortunate enough to have started him week 3 when he put up 4 TD’s (44.5 points). Hoping for another big game this week.

Probably a good bet Caleb will do well this week. The CIN DEF is not good and there's a solid possibility that their best pass rusher is out for the game.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Couple of interesting takes here:

https://x.com/SoldierFieldBlg/status/1983201381722010051

https://x.com/SoldierFieldBlg/status/1983202775342428540

Basically discusses that Caleb is playing really well vs most zone and man defenses (103.6 passer rating) and isn't vs 2 high safety (68.4 passer rating). Thought it might be relevant to the discussion, especially those who have more knowledge of NFL coverage than I do.

 

[Chaka]

This is a stretch, IMO. Goff proved in his Rams post-Gurley days that he could produce with a sub-par team around him and a shaky OL.

I agree with everything you wrote, for the most part. Goff, today is a much better QB than Caleb and it's not close.

But, in LA Goff proved that he could win 9 games and throw 21 TDs against 14 INTs without prime Gurley (or diminished Gurley). We'll see where the Bears end up but they're tracking similar.

The one thing that finally clicked for Goff in his fifth and final season with the Rams was his completion percentage which, jumped from averaging ~63% over his first four seasons to 67% in that last year and he's only gotten better since.

Goff had a very similar start to his career as Caleb.

 

[BadHombre]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

If you hung your hat on Caleb in redraft, then you weren't paying attention. Many of us here predicted a lot of ups and downs this season based on him learning Johnson's system as well as learning how to be a professional QB (which wasn't taught to him as a rookie). I suspect he will end the season with close to 4k yards and 25 TDs and things will get progressively better as the season rolls on. The real proof of concept will be the 2026 season with him having a full year to learn the system and get familiar with his offensive core.

I drafted him for this week’s game against Cincinnati, AKA “Baker’s BYE week.”

I was fortunate enough to have started him week 3 when he put up 4 TD’s (44.5 points). Hoping for another big game this week.

Probably a good bet Caleb will do well this week. The CIN DEF is not good and there's a solid possibility that their best pass rusher is out for the game.

I dropped him so proceed with confidence

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

This is a stretch, IMO. Goff proved in his Rams post-Gurley days that he could produce with a sub-par team around him and a shaky OL.

I agree with everything you wrote, for the most part. Goff, today is a much better QB than Caleb and it's not close.

But, in LA Goff proved that he could win 9 games and throw 21 TDs against 14 INTs without prime Gurley (or diminished Gurley). We'll see where the Bears end up but they're tracking similar.

The one thing that finally clicked for Goff in his fifth and final season with the Rams was his completion percentage which, jumped from averaging ~63% over his first four seasons to 67% in that last year and he's only gotten better since.

Goff had a very similar start to his career as Caleb.

Yeah, I’m not saying Goff put up elite numbers with middling talent.

But I think it’s fair to say that he played well enough on a terrible Rams team, and also fair to say that the 2025 Bears offense is more loaded with talent/weapons than those late Goff Rams teams.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I can’t think of another time when I placed my hopes on a player I didn’t believe in but I did this year. (Point at the shirt). I really believed in Ben & truthfully he has made the Bears good, I just thought expanding Williams’ role not hiding or limiting it would be the outcome. It’s killed my season but I really thought I should hang on for this 3 game stretch. And then the Baltimore game.

If you hung your hat on Caleb in redraft, then you weren't paying attention. Many of us here predicted a lot of ups and downs this season based on him learning Johnson's system as well as learning how to be a professional QB (which wasn't taught to him as a rookie). I suspect he will end the season with close to 4k yards and 25 TDs and things will get progressively better as the season rolls on. The real proof of concept will be the 2026 season with him having a full year to learn the system and get familiar with his offensive core.

I drafted him for this week’s game against Cincinnati, AKA “Baker’s BYE week.”

I was fortunate enough to have started him week 3 when he put up 4 TD’s (44.5 points). Hoping for another big game this week.

Probably a good bet Caleb will do well this week. The CIN DEF is not good and there's a solid possibility that their best pass rusher is out for the game.

Yeah, my only fear is the word that Flacco might miss this week due to his shoulder.

Unfortunately the Bengals might not generate many points with a return to Jake Browning.