QBs outside of the Studs (1 Viewer)

[Babu Bhatt2]

Here's a QBBC that I've been toying with: Roethlisberger and Hasselbeck.

Both QBs can be drafted extremely late. Both QBs have something to prove this year. Both QBs are capable of putting up 25-30 TDs and between 3500-4000 yards passing.

It would be a very risky strategy but it would allow your team to load up elsewhere, get a top TE and Defense without sacrificing RB or WR depth. In a 12-team league you can get Roethlisberger around round 10/11 and Hasselbeck is usually available in the 14th round of a draft.

Hasselbeck has a favorable early schedule for when Roethlisberger is out. The only problem is that they have the same bye. For week 5, Sam Bradford could be a decent replacement since he plays the Lions.

Just tried a mock draft with this strategy. Favre was still available at my 7th round pick, and in most circumstances I would take him there. But I wanted to try this strategy.Round - (Pick) - Player - (Position)

1. (4) Ray Rice (RB)

2. (21) Marques Colston (WR)

3. (28) Ryan Grant (RB)

4. (45) Steve Smith CAR (WR)

5. (52) Jonathan Stewart (RB)

6. (69) Tony Gonzalez (TE)

7. (76) Michael Bush (RB)

8. (93) Santana Moss (WR)

9. (100) Vincent Jackson (WR)

10. (117) Fred Jackson (RB)

11. (124) Ben Roethlisberger (QB)

12. (141) Ryan Longwell (K)

13. (148) Patriots (Def)

14. (165) Matt Hasselbeck (QB)

QBs

Roethlisberger

Hasselbeck

RBs

Rice

Grant

Stewart

M. Bush

F. Jackson

WRs

Colston

S. Smith CAR

S. Moss

V. Jackson

TE

Gonzalez

K

Longwell

Def

Patriots

Replacing Bush with Favre would definitely be better, even if the last player rostered (in place of Hasselbeck) is a second defense or TE. I did not expect Fred Jackson to be available so late though. If Hasselbeck and/or Big Ben approach get 25 TDs and 3500 passing yards, I think this strategy could work. But you would probably look to trade depth down the road for a QB upgrade.

 

[adrenaline]

I have Eli at 7

 

[ditka85]

The good Dr. back to pimp Orton again this year. Keep expressing that objective opinion, Doc. I'm willing to bet you Orton doesn't sniff the top 5-6.

Never pimped Orton before.

Bro, I live in Chicago and have watched every Orton game since college. The dude has a superior arm. Much stronger than Brady and Manning. The furthest Favre could ever throw was 74 yards. Orton threw it 72 yards while still in high school. Let's not make up information and just repeat what idiots in the media say. We are smarter than that. The dude can throw hard and far. Now he has a nice offense and lots of real offensive toys to play with.... not to mention the best pass blocking line in the NFL.

Orton is going to have a great year. They may start out a little slow until they start clicking, their first three games are a joke, Cincy, Cle, Oak... they should be fine after that.

I understand if you view your team through rose colored glasses. Most everyone is guilty of that to some degree.

 

[Hear-the-Footsteps]

Of these guys in the poll, interesting to note that only Flacco has a nice SOS for playoff weeks (14-16).

Problem is last year he started out hot. It was at the end of the season when his numbers fell off a bit.

 

[sgtrobo]

aside from the week against Chicago, he was anywhere from mediocre to terrible after week 7 and he's been bad in cold weather. Flacco is nowhere near as talented as some seem to believe. Also might want to take note that 3 of Flacco's 5 games in December this season will take place outdoors in the AFC North.

Here are his career outdoor games in cold climates during December/January:

11 for 28, 115 yards, 0 TDs, 2 picks

15 for 36, 137 yards, 1 TD, 3 picks

13 for 25, 166 yards, 2 TD, 1 pick

13 for 30, 141 yards, 0 TDs, 3 picks

4 for 10, 34 yards, 0 TD, 1 pick

as mentioned earlier however, he absolutely tore chicago to shreds last season in December at home:

21 for 29, 234 yards, 4 TD, 0 picks

EDIT - he did ok at home vs. Detroit last season in December:

13 for 20, 230 yards, 1 TD, 0 picks

 

[rascal]

I think Palmer is underrated.

 

[Go deep]

Suprised Eli Manning is getting a little more hype. He threw for over 4000 yards last year, and that was with a trio of young WR's who should be even better this year. It also appears that Bradshaw will be used at least as much if not more than JAcobs this year, and while Bradshaw isnt the best pass catching back in the league, he is far better compared to Jacobs.

Another 4000 yard season seems likely and i could see him throwing for 26-28 TD's, which would easily land him, in the top 5-10 QB range.

 

[Hear-the-Footsteps]

A little surprised by the lack of love for Flacco and Ryan.

Both are entering third year.

Ryan had 6 more tds last year than his rookie season...in 2 fewer games. So he was on pace for 25 TDs. With another year under his belt, plus still has White, Gonzalez, Turner (so Ds respect the run), I think he could throw for around 26.

Flacco's TDs went up (14 to 21 from yr 1 to 2; while his INTs did not). Still has the very nice dumpoff outlet in Rice. With another year under his belt, plus the addition of Boldin, he too could throw for around 26.

I understand the love for Cutler and Kolb. I know the reasons behind those votes. But I didn't think this would be a blowout. Are people basing their projections on Kolb from his two monster games last year? One was against New Orleans who put up nearly 50 points...so of course Kolb was going to keep airing it out all game long - they were behind. And the other was against the KC defense.

I am just trying to play all sides here.

 

[Eraser]

This thread just strengthens the strategy of being the last to pick your quarterback in a 10 team league. In a 12 team league, I may jump on one after 8-9 are already off the board.

 

[Hear-the-Footsteps]

This thread just strengthens the strategy of being the last to pick your quarterback in a 10 team league. In a 12 team league, I may jump on one after 8-9 are already off the board.

You could argue that it means just the opposite of this. With no one QB emerging as the clear favorite after the top 7, maybe getting a top 7 is the right call.Again, no one is just killing it in this poll. None of these non-top 7 (therefore can be had in the 6th round or later) have 50% or more of the votes. None of them have 40%, or 30%, or even 25%. Cutler and Kolb are both sitting in the lead at 23%. Favre, Eli, Flacco, and Ryan all each have between 8% and 16% of the votes.The only thing it is telling me is people are not too high on McNabb, Palmer, etc. if they wait and grab a QB later.

 

[Hear-the-Footsteps]

Cutler is just barely in the lead here. My question to supporters of Cutler after the stud QBs are gone is why?

Is it b/c of Martz? Is that the primary thing people are falling in love with regarding Cutler? With Martz, is it that you believe his passing attempts will go up? And therefore, simply b/c of additional pass attempts - he'll have more yards, more tds, etc?

How many more attempts do you think he will have b/c Martz is there?

My argument is: where can his pass attempts climb to? He had 555 pass attempts last year. How many more are you expecting? You expect 555 to climb to over 600 under Martz?

I was playing with the Data Dominator and here is what I found:

- 555 passing attempts is already a lot as it was 3rd highest in the league last year,

- In the last 6 seasons, only 6 times has a QB attempted more than 600 passes (Brees twice, Favre twice, Warner once, and Cutler once).

So if you voted for Cutler; and if you did so primarily b/c of the addition of Martz - then my question is: where do you reasonably believe his pass attempts can climb to?

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

One QB that is flying well under the radar is Kyle Orton. He finished 14th overall last year in fantasy scoring (for all positions), and is poised to have another amazing year. He was playing on 2 bum ankles, and a broken finger, in a brand new system. This year he is 100% healthy and knows the system. This same offense under the same coach put up record numbers in 2007 with New England. McDaniels is saying that Orton isn't making any mistakes and 100% of the time puts them in the right play and goes to the right guy with the ball. He is crisp and efficient in camp, as well as in preseason. He is making no mistakes and has a plethora of targets and wide receivers to throw the ball to.

He isn't being drafted, so he will outperform his ADP. You can easily pick him up off waivers. I am sure he will outscore Kolb, Eli, Cutler, Favre, big Ben, Flacco, Ryan, etc. He can easily break into the top 10 (he just has to move up 4 sopts from last year, which is easy). I can even see him finishing in the top 5 or 6. He will have over 4000 yards passing and over 30 TDs. It will be an interesting year.

WTF? how do u score where orton was 14 overall?

ETA:Hmmm I recant all of my vitriol. In my PPR league he was 31 overall. 23 in my 2 non ppr leagues (and was a free agent at the end of the year in BOTH leagues) Didn't realize it was that high...

You just blew my mind...

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

The good Dr. back to pimp Orton again this year. Keep expressing that objective opinion, Doc. I'm willing to bet you Orton doesn't sniff the top 5-6.

Never pimped Orton before.

Bro, I live in Chicago and have watched every Orton game since college. The dude has a superior arm. Much stronger than Brady and Manning. The furthest Favre could ever throw was 74 yards. Orton threw it 72 yards while still in high school. Let's not make up information and just repeat what idiots in the media say. We are smarter than that. The dude can throw hard and far. Now he has a nice offense and lots of real offensive toys to play with.... not to mention the best pass blocking line in the NFL.

Orton is going to have a great year. They may start out a little slow until they start clicking, their first three games are a joke, Cincy, Cle, Oak... they should be fine after that.

I understand if you view your team through rose colored glasses. Most everyone is guilty of that to some degree.

 

[JHuber77]

Stafford should be your pick, improved offense (WR, TE, RB, O-line). Also has a year under his belt and will be playing from behind quite often. Definately will come cheaper than the others.

 

[Vicktimized]

Cutler is just barely in the lead here. My question to supporters of Cutler after the stud QBs are gone is why?Is it b/c of Martz? Is that the primary thing people are falling in love with regarding Cutler? With Martz, is it that you believe his passing attempts will go up? And therefore, simply b/c of additional pass attempts - he'll have more yards, more tds, etc?How many more attempts do you think he will have b/c Martz is there?My argument is: where can his pass attempts climb to? He had 555 pass attempts last year. How many more are you expecting? You expect 555 to climb to over 600 under Martz?I was playing with the Data Dominator and here is what I found:- 555 passing attempts is already a lot as it was 3rd highest in the league last year,- In the last 6 seasons, only 6 times has a QB attempted more than 600 passes (Brees twice, Favre twice, Warner once, and Cutler once).So if you voted for Cutler; and if you did so primarily b/c of the addition of Martz - then my question is: where do you reasonably believe his pass attempts can climb to?

I think Cutler could improve even if he throws less passes, in that under Martz his YPA should really climb from what it was. Martz's system is the definition of a vertical passing offense, and he's one of the best in the league at getting the most out of his players.Cutler's YPA wasn't very high last season, so even if he doesn't pass more, passing more efficiently would be a major boon to his value.

 

[Thomsen]

I really like Eli, most people think he threw more last year than ever, but he threw more in 2005, 2006 and 2007. He is just getting better and better, and his receivers are some of the most talented in the league. I like him for 4000 - 30-11.

 

[Pots]

I really like Eli, most people think he threw more last year than ever, but he threw more in 2005, 2006 and 2007. He is just getting better and better, and his receivers are some of the most talented in the league. I like him for 4000 - 30-11.

He was pretty close to that last season, and many FBGers think Nicks is going to step up as a top 20 WR this season. SSmith isn't going to go away, so obviously someone has to be throwing these 2 the ball if they're having such good seasons. I don't get why Eli isn't getting more respect as a FF QB this season.

 

[The Jerk]

I really like Eli, most people think he threw more last year than ever, but he threw more in 2005, 2006 and 2007. He is just getting better and better, and his receivers are some of the most talented in the league. I like him for 4000 - 30-11.

He was pretty close to that last season, and many FBGers think Nicks is going to step up as a top 20 WR this season. SSmith isn't going to go away, so obviously someone has to be throwing these 2 the ball if they're having such good seasons. I don't get why Eli isn't getting more respect as a FF QB this season.

I also voted Eli, as I see him by far as the safest of the bunch, with Ryan the second safest. Eli has averaged 24.4 combined TDs in the past five seasons, with a low of 22 and a high of 27. It's hard to be MORE consistent, really. Yardage is a different story, as prior to 2009, Eli had averaged just over 200 ypg for several seasons.I assume that what is going on here is that people believe that the Giants are rededicating themselves to the running game. That may be true, but I'm not convinced they will get back totally to the 2008 stat lines. The OL is weaker, in my opinion. Jacobs is clearly older and more worn out. Derrick Ward is long gone. While Bradshaw may be better, he's not shown to be a pillar of durability. The best I see the Giants doing is getting back somewhere in the middle of 2008 and 2009, which puts Eli at 24-25 TDs and 3500-3700 yards. Of course, considering the WR corps by all accounts is far better than 2008, there's room for those numbers to grow a little higher, perhaps to 26 TDs, 3800 yards.Eli has the highest floor outside of the top 7 QBs, but his upside is far from limited.

 

[jude]

I think McNabb surprises a lot of people.

 

[skillz]

I think McNabb surprises a lot of people.

I like how McNabb's schedule aligns with Eli's. I am targetting both of them. Hopefully McNabb keeps falling since he has the injured ankle now.

 

[Instinctive]

Of these guys in the poll, interesting to note that only Flacco has a nice SOS for playoff weeks (14-16).Problem is last year he started out hot. It was at the end of the season when his numbers fell off a bit.

SOS viewed now means almost nothing. Last year DEN was staunch against the rush early, but became an awesome playoff matchup to have, for example.Lot happens between last season's defensive ratings and this year's actual rankings. Don't mess with playoff SOS during your draft.

 

[meatwad1]

Why does everyone keep thinking the Giants are gonna start running the ball with ease again? Their oline is worse and Jacobs is a twinkle toes. I think Manning can put up 4000+ and 25+ again with ease and they have some talented WRs (and a full year of Nicks). I find it funny, Nicks & Smith are both going around round 4 yet nobody thinks Eli will finish top 12.

shhhh.....Eli will be top 5 this season...book it.

 

[Dr. Malo]

It's easy to look at all those things from the outside and say "Denver will suck this year". Losing Marshall, Scheffler, having no name or old WRs this year, a beat up OL, etc, etc. If you've been following camp, OTAs, the preseason, and watching game film on the Broncos, it'd be pretty obvious that they are going to exceed expectations (since they are so low) and really make some noise in the AFC. They only have 3 rather difficult games, the rest is a walk in the park. The team could easily win 10 to 13 games if they catch a few nice breaks.It's easy to say they will be awful looking from the outside. Mark my words, they are going to turn some heads and make a big splash. Once the two 6' 3" 230 pound rookie WRs are up to speed, all hell will break loose. Imagine Brandon Marshall, that can run a 4.3 forty. That's what Thomas is.I am not just being loyal to my team. I'm pretty objective. I just look at the evidence, see what I see based on film, camp, preseason, etc and make up my mind. They are looking very good this year. I don't know much about most other NFL teams, but I really know the Broncos.Pick up Orton off waivers, and plug him in against Jacksonville and Seattle the first two games.... you may not look back. The third game is Indy at Denver... may be a shoot out. Indy doesn't have a good enough secondary to cover all our weapons.

So I guess 1419 yards through 4 games is an NFL record (second best all time). They are a PASS FIRST team. I predicted over 4000 yards for Orton and he already has 1400 through the first quarter of the season. Could he throw over 5000? Possibly. But I doubt it. There is no run game, and they don't plan to even try to run anymore.Llyod, Gaffney, Royal, Thomas.... who are these guys? Mediocre WRs? Also rans? Nope. They have combined for the most passing yards by any 4 WRs through week 3 in NFL history. No other foursome has 10+ receptions, 140+ yards, 1+ TDs each through the first 3 games.McDaniels is doing something very special with his spread offense and has more leeway and control over the offense than ever before. You are going to see some very interesting results this year in Denver. Linnehan and the Saints are also revolutionizing the NFL with their unique offense and Brees at the helm. Two very unique spread attacks that share similar qualities. But the Saints can run. Although, they may not any longer after all their RB injuries.Once Denver's Oline is healthy (and it finally is) they will run better. But it seems that McDaniels has given up on running.

 

[basher]

Big Ben will out perform many of the top 7 guys over the final 12 weeks of the season.

big ben is the answer to this question

 

[Dr. Malo]

The Broncos have suffered a slew of injuries at RB and all along the O-line. Their current WRs are a journeyman that for some reason people have high hopes for and a third year possession receiver. They have no TE to speak of. Their two rookie WRs could be something special but unless you think they are the Randy Moss type of special I wouldn't count on them doing much to help Orton's numbers (at least not in the first half of the season).

They aren't planning on being a run-first team. The RBs will all be healthy by the first game. And RBs in this system are a dime a dozen.The O-Line has only two newbies, the rookie center Walton, and Zane Beadles. Both of whom played all of the first preseason game, and did exceptionally well against Cincy's attacking style defense. Orton wasn't even touched. Cincy blitzed on nearly every down.The rookie WRs are not being counted on. They will play when they are ready. We still have Gaffney, Royal, Lloyd, Stokley, and Willis. All of whom are very capable.The TEs will be fine, Graham, Quinn, and Branson all can block and catch well. Branson will be the new Scheffler.There seems to be a lot of ignorance on the part of people who don't follow the Broncos about all of the changes and who the players are. They upgraded every single position group this off-season. Just because they don't have a good national following, doesn't mean they aren't good.Orton had two messed up ankles and a broken finger and still put up 3802 yards (career high for him). Now that he is healthy, understands the offense, and is surrounded by playmakers, he is just going to let it rip. 4000 yards is not insurmountable. Ten QBs threw for over 4000 yards last year, Orton was 198 yards shy of that number.You don't have to drink the kool-aid, but all the stars are aligned for him to improve on his numbers. What makes it even better, is that he isn't even being drafted. People are drafting guys like Garrard and Freeman and Henne... and ignoring a proven player on a well established team with a great offense and coach. He is just going to pick apart defenses, surgically, like Brady does. Only 3 games are against tough defenses: Jets, 49ers, and Ravens. The rest is a walk in the park.You are going to be very surprised. This offense is going to really rock!

Like I said....

 

[Dr. Malo]

The good Dr. back to pimp Orton again this year. Keep expressing that objective opinion, Doc. I'm willing to bet you Orton doesn't sniff the top 5-6.

Never pimped Orton before.

Bro, I live in Chicago and have watched every Orton game since college. The dude has a superior arm. Much stronger than Brady and Manning. The furthest Favre could ever throw was 74 yards. Orton threw it 72 yards while still in high school. Let's not make up information and just repeat what idiots in the media say. We are smarter than that. The dude can throw hard and far. Now he has a nice offense and lots of real offensive toys to play with.... not to mention the best pass blocking line in the NFL.

Orton is going to have a great year. They may start out a little slow until they start clicking, their first three games are a joke, Cincy, Cle, Oak... they should be fine after that.

I understand if you view your team through rose colored glasses. Most everyone is guilty of that to some degree.

Thanks Ditka. He finished 14th overall in fantasy last year. And he is in the top 5 this year. It's early, but he is diong damn well. And if his TD totals were a little more decent, he'd have more points than Manning and Rivers. The TDs will come, they are still adjusting to the new offense, new players, and new Oline. If he is available, i'd trade for him or pick him up.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Good call, Dr. Malo.

I'll be honest: I had no idea what to expect out of the Broncos offense this year, but I did draft Orton as my 3rd QB in a start 2 QB league, hoping he would be good enough until Roethlisberger, whom I drafted to be my number 2, got back. However, I don't know if I can even do that. Orton is putting up too good a numbers to be benched. It is not a bad problem to have.

 

[CaptainHook]

you said branson would replace scheffler. terribly inaccurate predictions.

 

[Instinctive]

Who would have thought that the best answer would have been Vick pre injury...

 

[RBM]

you said branson would replace scheffler. terribly inaccurate predictions.

Very nice job Dr Malo

 

[Dr. Malo]

you said branson would replace scheffler. terribly inaccurate predictions.

Branson got injured in the final preseason game, and was placed on IR. Hard to do that. They got Gronkowski from the Lions a week before the season started. But Branson was going to be the next Scheffler. Can't really predict that.Either way, the passing game is doing just fine with all their WRs and breaking records.

 

[Chaka]

Like I said....

Congratulations. It was a good call, sincerely. The crazy thing is that it looks like you actually underestimated the Broncos too.But seriously why come in here and crow about it? How many predictions did you make prior to the season? How many were wrong?

 

[CaptainHook]

Like I said....

Congratulations. It was a good call, sincerely. The crazy thing is that it looks like you actually underestimated the Broncos too.But seriously why come in here and crow about it? How many predictions did you make prior to the season? How many were wrong?

Did you notice how incredibly accurate his predictions were. why wouldnt he come on and crow about it

 

[Dr. Malo]

Like I said....

Congratulations. It was a good call, sincerely. The crazy thing is that it looks like you actually underestimated the Broncos too.But seriously why come in here and crow about it? How many predictions did you make prior to the season? How many were wrong?

I don't post a lot. I read a lot. I know the Denver Broncos very well. I dislike that people make statements that are untrue. Saying that Kyle Orton can't throw very far or has a noodle for an arm is irresponsible. I like to correct that information. Saying that Denver doesn't have any WRs is simply not true. We have plenty, and that doesn't even count the two stud rookies.This is a forum for the "best of the best" when it comes to fantasy football. We are supposed to come here for superior information, top notch analysis, and to gain an edge in our leagues. If you waited on a QB this year, and picked up Orton very late or picked him up off waivers, you will be winning a lot of leagues right now. I am not crowing, I was just really shocked at the negatvism and response that I got when I posted about Denver's offense and Orton. I thought that we come here to share information that we wouldn't get elsewhere and we hope it's quality information. Some of the reactions are not what I expected, that's all. I think that if someone is an expert on their specific team and knows them very well, we should not react so negatively. We can question and ask and debate, but there is no need to be negative. We all want that same thing. And that's an advantage in our fantasy football leagues over the other owners that don't discuss here.

 

[Chaka]

Like I said....

Congratulations. It was a good call, sincerely. The crazy thing is that it looks like you actually underestimated the Broncos too.But seriously why come in here and crow about it? How many predictions did you make prior to the season? How many were wrong?

I don't post a lot. I read a lot. I know the Denver Broncos very well. I dislike that people make statements that are untrue. Saying that Kyle Orton can't throw very far or has a noodle for an arm is irresponsible. I like to correct that information. Saying that Denver doesn't have any WRs is simply not true. We have plenty, and that doesn't even count the two stud rookies.This is a forum for the "best of the best" when it comes to fantasy football. We are supposed to come here for superior information, top notch analysis, and to gain an edge in our leagues. If you waited on a QB this year, and picked up Orton very late or picked him up off waivers, you will be winning a lot of leagues right now. I am not crowing, I was just really shocked at the negatvism and response that I got when I posted about Denver's offense and Orton. I thought that we come here to share information that we wouldn't get elsewhere and we hope it's quality information. Some of the reactions are not what I expected, that's all. I think that if someone is an expert on their specific team and knows them very well, we should not react so negatively. We can question and ask and debate, but there is no need to be negative. We all want that same thing. And that's an advantage in our fantasy football leagues over the other owners that don't discuss here.

And you did a bang up job on your breakdown of the Denver offense this year (so far). Spot on. I think SSOG's status as resident Bronco expert may be in trouble.I am surprised, however that you don't see where the negativity was coming from. An honest analysis sees two rookie WRs (always difficult to gauge) and two journeymen (Gaffney & Lloyd) who have never produced anything consistently at the NFL level. You have to question if even the Broncos believed in those guys otherwise why draft two rookies that high when the defense looked to need more help? They lost one of the better WRs in the game leading many to wonder how much of Orton's 2009 production would disappear with him. McDaniels certainly had a lot to do with Tom Brady's career year but Brady has never thrown more than 28 TDs without Randy Moss (he averaged just under 26. I excluded 2001 which would have brought that number down) so what Orton would do without Marshall was a legitimate concern. I also think it was reasonable to believe that Brady>>>>Orton.The team had offensive line injuries to their two best players coming into the season and a suspect running game. The defense was difficult to gauge, the loss of Dumerville was obviously huge but it was difficult to see them being as awful as they were last season.I think that most would agree that Denver's offense has been a surprise this season. Now the question is can they keep it up?Again great job. Keep up the good work.What do you think about Lloyd? Do you see this level of production continuing or will it taper off as the season goes forward and Thomas/Decker get worked into the offense?

 

[Dr. Malo]

And you did a bang up job on your breakdown of the Denver offense this year (so far). Spot on. I think SSOG's status as resident Bronco expert may be in trouble.I am surprised, however that you don't see where the negativity was coming from. An honest analysis sees two rookie WRs (always difficult to gauge) and two journeymen (Gaffney & Lloyd) who have never produced anything consistently at the NFL level. You have to question if even the Broncos believed in those guys otherwise why draft two rookies that high when the defense looked to need more help? They lost one of the better WRs in the game leading many to wonder how much of Orton's 2009 production would disappear with him. McDaniels certainly had a lot to do with Tom Brady's career year but Brady has never thrown more than 28 TDs without Randy Moss (he averaged just under 26. I excluded 2001 which would have brought that number down) so what Orton would do without Marshall was a legitimate concern. I also think it was reasonable to believe that Brady>>>>Orton.The team had offensive line injuries to their two best players coming into the season and a suspect running game. The defense was difficult to gauge, the loss of Dumerville was obviously huge but it was difficult to see them being as awful as they were last season.I think that most would agree that Denver's offense has been a surprise this season. Now the question is can they keep it up?Again great job. Keep up the good work.What do you think about Lloyd? Do you see this level of production continuing or will it taper off as the season goes forward and Thomas/Decker get worked into the offense?

I think if you go to camp and watch the practices and see what everyone is doing it becomes more and more apparent what the team is trying to accomplish. Watching their preseason games also tells you a lot. Watching every press conference also helps.The two rookies were injured when they were drafted and were not relied upon. Gaffney played very well for Denver last year when we benched Marshall in the last game. Lloyd has always been responsible for some of the NFL's most amazing catches when he was in SF and Chicago. He just has a knack for making amazing catches when he needs to.The OLine had issues last year. Hamilton and Weigman were pretty bad at the end of the year. Anything would have been an upgrade. Ryan Clady and Ryan Harris were both injured and healing, so the 3 new guys got a lot of camp and preseason reps. They improved big time. And are still improving. The full healthy offensive line hasn't even played together yet (which may explain some of the poor rushing game), but with that said, McDaniels isn't going to run just to say we tried to run. He will try it and work on it in practice... so that on the goalline, when you really need a TD, they can punch it in. But he isn't going to keep running just to keep running if it isn't working. Expect Orton to still be responsible for over 80% of the offense in the near future. And our running backs aren't helping, they seem underpowered and weak. They don't run straight ahead. Wish we had Hillis back.I think that Orton is the new Brady. He is smart, takes care of the football, gets them into the right play, and gets the ball to the right guy on every play. McDaniels offense is predicated on the fact that the defense can't cover everyone and they will exploit that fact and exploit matchups. Orton's job is to recognize the defense, examine the matchups, and get the ball to the WR that is going to be open and see what happens afterwards. McDaniels believes that 99% to 100% of the time someone will be open, you just need to get the ball to him. The WRs job is to read the defense, adjust their routes, and know what Orton is going to do and where he is going with the football.I think Lloyd seems to be Orton's favorite target. He trusts him, and Lloyd catches everything. Gaffney has some drops, so Orton goes to the guy that can catch everything. Lloyd seems to get open more often because defenses shade towards Gaffney (I have no idea why they view him as the No 1 threat), but this helps Royal and Lloyd. Defenses are going to have to adjust and treat them all as No 1 WRs, and then Orton can exploit them even more. Then they will bring in the big guy, Demaryious Thomas and unleash him again, and defenses will be scrambling to adjust, and they won't be able to. Orton is just too smart and the OLine gives him eons to stand in the pocket. Mathis and Freeney couldn't do anything and only got to him once. They were extremely inneffective.I think Lloyd stays steady. Every week a different guy will have more or less, but he will still be a great fantasy options. You can't really sit him at this point. I am not sure how defeneses adjust, but Denver has plenty of answers and McDaniels has a knack for making adjustments on the fly. He and Orton communicate a lot during games and halftime and make plenty of adjustments.Thanks for the comlpiments. I'd love to be the Denver expert. I know my team really well, and I am not just an optimist looking at things through rose colored glasses. I put a lot of time and effort into knowing my team very well.I love this website because you can get in depth analysis and talk to people who really have their finger on the pulse of their teams and this gives you an advantage in fantasy football. Everyone is mature and intelligent and you don't get too many "Cutler sucks" or "Moreno blows" threads. Just intelligent discussion. Which is why we are all here.

 

[jdubs952]

When I drafted Orton in the 16th round, I was laughed at, but I agreed with what the Dr. posted and now I have the owners with Eli & Flacco making offers thinking he can be had on the cheap. No chance....he's my QB every week.

Thanks Doc!

 

[Pots]

I really like Eli, most people think he threw more last year than ever, but he threw more in 2005, 2006 and 2007. He is just getting better and better, and his receivers are some of the most talented in the league. I like him for 4000 - 30-11.

He was pretty close to that last season, and many FBGers think Nicks is going to step up as a top 20 WR this season. SSmith isn't going to go away, so obviously someone has to be throwing these 2 the ball if they're having such good seasons. I don't get why Eli isn't getting more respect as a FF QB this season.

I didn't realise Eli would have 3 turnovers a game

 

[ponchsox]

Vick