Redskins close to tipping from cap (1 Viewer)

[Faust]

Redskins in cap hell

How would you like to be Eric Schaffer, the cap man for the Washington Redskins? Your boss is the combustible Dan Snyder and your cap is a mess, so much so that two cap experts from other teams who looked at it say it's as bad as they have seen.

We pity poor Schaffer, who isn't to blame. It's not his fault Snyder throws money around as if he prints it, snubbing the reality that cap jail will eventually swallow his team whole.

"I'm glad I'm not Eric," said one of the cap experts. "That thing is a mess."

According to NFLPA figures, the Redskins have $115.4 million committed in salary for their top 51 players in 2006. The cap is expected to be $92 to $95 million. That means they have to trim $20 million or so. And that's not counting the $2 million or so the team will need to sign its rookies (thankfully, they don't have a first-round pick to pay, or that would be higher).

The Redskins have done a decent job trimming their cap down in recent years, but this time it might not be possible -- certainly not without a new collective bargaining agreement. A new agreement could help relieve some of the cap problems, but even with one, the Redskins face a daunting task.

"If they reduced everybody to a veteran minimum, and that won't happen, they'd still be $4 million over the cap," said one of the cap experts. "That's before cutting anybody."

So how did it get this bad? The Redskins have paid out big money deals under Snyder, and some of them have blown up in the team's face, leading to the chase factor. You chase bad deals with more bad deals to compensate.

Thus, they have trouble.

When room got tight in the past, they extended players' deals to create room, spreading bonus amortization out over the years. Eventually, though, it becomes time to pay the piper.

That time is now.

We would liken the Redskins' plight to a family that keeps putting off paying the credit card balance by paying minimums.

"All the deals, all the overpaying for years and moving money into future years has caught up to them," said the cap expert. "Last year they had to move $7 million in money into future years. That catches up to you at some point."

One cap expert said the Redskins might be forced to let good players walk, and could be forced to field a team with as many as 20 rookies -- or more.

If there's a new CBA, the Redskins might be able to get out from under the cap troubles a little easier, although it still will be a lot of work.

"Can you imagine the dynamics of what Schaffer is going through?" one cap expert said. "He has to go to Snyder and Joe Gibbs and tell them they have to cut players. That has to be ugly."

Cap hell. It's as ugly as it gets in the NFL, and it's a jail that's hard to get paroled out of.

Still think the Redskins will be playoff contenders?

Gibbs has his work cut out for him this season. Maybe auto racing never looked so good.

 

[Ozymandias]

They have been predicting cap hell for the Redskins for about a decade now. Somehow, it never really materialized. Maybe it will, this time, but I'd be sceptical.

 

[Faust]

They have been predicting cap hell for the Redskins for about a decade now. Somehow, it never really materialized. Maybe it will, this time, but I'd be sceptical.

I would agree in the past that the Redskins always found a way to get out of cap trouble, but it look like it finally caught up with them:The Redskins have done a decent job trimming their cap down in recent years, but this time it might not be possible -- certainly not without a new collective bargaining agreement. A new agreement could help relieve some of the cap problems, but even with one, the Redskins face a daunting task.

"If they reduced everybody to a veteran minimum, and that won't happen, they'd still be $4 million over the cap," said one of the cap experts. "That's before cutting anybody."

So how did it get this bad? The Redskins have paid out big money deals under Snyder, and some of them have blown up in the team's face, leading to the chase factor. You chase bad deals with more bad deals to compensate.

The scary part is where it speculates that they could be starting upwards of 20 rookies.

 

[jevy]

By what date do the Skins have to under the cap?

What is the punishment for being over the cap?

 

[diesel7982]

By what date do the Skins have to under the cap?

What is the punishment for being over the cap?

March 2ndWhat happens? From askthecommish.com

There have been instances in which a team has managed to sneak a cap evading contract by the league. Upon further review, the violations were caught by the league and the respective teams were penalized. Penalties include fines and/or forfeiture of draft picks. In recent history both the Pittsburgh Steelers and San Francisco 49ers have been penalized draft picks, while the 49ers' front office personnel (Carmen Policy and Dwight Clark) were also fined.

 

[jbz]

the only was the Skins take it in the ### for the cap is if the CBA isn't extended. They will continue to be able to push out their cap dues as long as the cap increases.

Plus, let us not forget the Skins are a more stable roster now then they have been in years past. Instead of getting guys like Deion Sanders, Jeff George, Bruce Smith, Trotter, etc for big deals AND short stays on the team (which is where the true cap killing bonus acceleration comes from), the Skins are paying their top dollars to young guys that will be around for a while. The only real exception to this is the Brunell signing and even he pushed his shelf life out longer then expected (most predicted he was gone after the 1st year). The Skins can get creative with bonus money because it that money can be prorated over the duration of a contract. Annual salary is what can't and that's when teams have to make cap decisions; when a player's annual salary becomes too big to take on and it becomes not worth it to convert that to more bonus. Case in point for the Skins could be Lavar Arrington.

The Skins IMO, will never reach true cap hell, but to me cap hell is when a team has to purge it's roster and start a bunch of no names and rookies. This won't happen. The core of guys like Portis, Moss, Washington, Griffin, Samuels, etc are signed and will be around to see a majority of the length of their deals. Cutting guys like that wouldn't even save the Skins immediate cap room anyway since the acceleration of the bonuses would outweigh the cap hit to just keep them on the roster. Now of course the Skins will NEVER be cushy with the cap either. They'll lose some guys along the way (see Smoot, Pierce), but cap hell with a roster full of no names? Doubt it. Remember this team was supposed to be in cap hell last year, yet they somehow found the cap space to take the FULL cap hit of trading Coles for Moss (9+ million) and still had room to give Moss a new deal and make offers to Smoot and Pierce as well as pick up Rabach.

 

[jbz]

An opposite opinion from a few cap experts:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6011802276.html

 

[fatness]

An opposite opinion from a few cap experts:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6011802276.html

Good article, thanks for posting that.

The Washington Redskins do not have to renegotiate the contract of LaVar Arrington to meet the NFL salary cap and could get rid of the linebacker while still being able to re-sign their own free agents and add to the roster, according to two experts who have reviewed the team's 2006 payroll.

The Redskins face a $12 million salary cap hit if Arrington is traded or released. He is due a $6.5 million roster bonus by July 15, but that can be converted into a signing bonus prorated over four years to save the team approximately $5 million in cap space in 2006, according to the experts.

But that space is not critical to the Redskins reaching Coach Joe Gibbs's stated goal of keeping the nucleus of the roster together and perhaps adding a key player or two, according to the experts who asked not to be identified because commenting on the Redskins' cap situation could harm their future relationship with the team.

"This isn't a salary cap issue for them," said one of the experts. "They can still get under the cap with that $12 million hit, and not have to really cut anybody they wouldn't want to lose, anyway. This is not a cap issue at all; this is an issue of cash. Does [owner] Dan Snyder really want to give this player a check for $6.5 million? That's what this is all about."

 

[Boston]

I didn't realize the Redskins actually had a salary cap...it was my understanding that the Skins, Knicks and Dallas Mavericks had received some type of salary cap exemption from congress.

On the surface it would definetly appear that the Skins should be heading to cap hell after signing big free agent names by the truckload every year. Yet, it never appears to slow them down. I guess this is one where when I see it I'll believe it.

 

[AB in DC]

Redskins in cap hell

"If they reduced everybody to a veteran minimum, and that won't happen, they'd still be $4 million over the cap," said one of the cap experts. "That's before cutting anybody."

Well, duh, maybe they'll actually cut some overpaid players instead? That would save a lot more than a bunch of restructurings, especially with no CBA extension.

 

[trollmonger]

They have been predicting cap hell for the Redskins for about a decade now. Somehow, it never really materialized. Maybe it will, this time, but I'd be sceptical.

I'm not sure if they've finally reached cap hell or not but you won't reach it if you have high paid but poor quality players. Those are easy to cut. Cap hell comes when you have to cut someone you don't want to just to get under the cap. The current Redskin team is actually good and cutting a player may not be so easy this year.

 

[bigreese82]

Where can the projected cap numbers for this year be found

 

[jbz]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Comme...nolds022006.htm

 

[cstu]

By cutting safety Matt Bowen and offensive lineman Cory Raymer, who played sparingly last season; cornerback Walt Harris, who lost his starting job to rookie Carlos Rogers; and place kicker John Hall, who was injured for large parts of the past two seasons, sources said the Redskins could save $6.5 million in 2006 cap space.

Defensive tackle Brandon Noble, coming off career-threatening injuries, could retire or, if not, it is unlikely the team would keep him at his $1.7 million base salary. Trading backup quarterback Patrick Ramsey, as expected, would trim another $1.7 million.

By cutting Bowen, Raymer, Harris, Hall, Noble and Ramsey, the Redskins can cut out almost $10 million without much loss to the team at all. That leaves another $10 million to trim by restructuring contracts and turning them into bonuses.

Getting quarterback Mark Brunell and tackle Jon Jansen to agree to restructure their $4 million base salaries by converting the money to bonuses that can be spread out over several years against the cap would trim another $5 million.

Brunell adjusted his salary last year and Jansen has said he would be open to exploring the idea.

Cornerback Shawn Springs, running back Clinton Portis, linebacker Marcus Washington and defensive tackle Cornelius Griffin are among the players who, like Arrington, have large bonuses due in 2006. By restructuring the bonuses, and prorating them, Washington could save about $8 million more under the cap.

That's $23 million off the cap which gives them about $3 million to sign draft picks.

 

[buster c]

nothing to see here...

 

[fatness]

If I remember correctly the Redskins were in "cap hell" last year at this time and couldn't afford to keep the 2 players who held their whole team together, without whom they'd certainly fail: Antonio Pierce and Fred Smoot.

 

[GRIDIRON ASSASSIN]

Cap hell, or no cap hell...

For the salary their players are paid, the Redskins aren't particularly good.

Nothing inparticularly talented at QB.

No 'standout' players on defense.

I'm unimpressed.

 

[Native]

nothing to see here...

Agreed. Though it would be cool if they end up cutting Patrick Ramsey. Hes the Redskin player that would represent the most value on the open market.

 

[diesel7982]

Cap hell, or no cap hell...

For the salary their players are paid, the Redskins aren't particularly good.

Nothing inparticularly talented at QB.

No 'standout' players on defense.

I'm unimpressed.

Sean Taylor? Best saftey in the NFC?

 

[Prime]

Cap hell, or no cap hell...

For the salary their players are paid, the Redskins aren't particularly good.

Nothing inparticularly talented at QB.

No 'standout' players on defense.

I'm unimpressed.

Sean Taylor? Best saftey in the NFC?

Roy Williams and Brian Dawkins, are both better and they're only in his division.

 

[redman]

Cap hell, or no cap hell...

For the salary their players are paid, the Redskins aren't particularly good.

Nothing inparticularly talented at QB.

No 'standout' players on defense.

I'm unimpressed.

Sean Taylor? Best saftey in the NFC?

Roy Williams and Brian Dawkins, are both better and they're only in his division.

Santana Moss strongly disagrees with you.

I might have agreed with you two to three years ago but not now. Roy's only interested in the big hits that get him on SportsCenter. His game has sagged. Even Cowboys fans I know admit to this.

As for Dawkins, that's a far better argument but Taylor's beginning to overtake him and move into elite status. The guy flat out has physical talents that nobody at his position has in the league. I don't say that frivolously. It's just true.

 

[BlueOnion]

I personally believe the Redskins' salary cap is in dire straits, but every year the Redskin-backers denounce the naysayers and say, 'this is the case every year and it has not been a problem yet'.

But here is the kicker, the Redskins have been an average team these past few years and have had a roster full of players other teams don't necessarily want. Usually teams feel the this sort of salary cap pinch once they become contenders and other teams begin to vulture the roster. Trying to retain players coveted by other teams is quite difficult.

So although the Redskin spending has not hurt them yet, the reason is not good cap management by the Redskins. Instead, it is because the Redskins have filled their roster with non-championship players. Start drafting and developing some championship players and then ask yourself if the current cap management methodology is a good idea.

 

[fatness]

So although the Redskin spending has not hurt them yet, the reason is not good cap management by the Redskins. Instead, it is because the Redskins have filled their roster with non-championship players. Start drafting and developing some championship players and then ask yourself if the current cap management methodology is a good idea.

Why don't we see what moves they make in the offseason regarding cuts, signings, and renegotiated contracts, then see how they play next year, and then see if it's a good idea. You have to remember, what they were doing last offseason got the same criticism we're hearing now, yet they improved.Or is "Redskins are in salary cap hell for sure this year" one of those things that get repeated often enough that people begin to believe it on its face?

 

[BlueOnion]

Why don't we see what moves they make in the offseason regarding cuts, signings, and renegotiated contracts, then see how they play next year, and then see if it's a good idea. You have to remember, what they were doing last offseason got the same criticism we're hearing now, yet they improved.

Fair enough. But there pattern was to be average and spend big in the off season. Now that they made the playoffs, I will be more interested in seeing what happens next year. If the Redskins make the playoffs next season, this question will persist:1) All free agents and potential free agents will want a much bigger contract.

2) All players scheduled to make a lot of money will be asked to renogogiate their contract. If they refuse, then they should get an even bigger contract as a free agent.

A) And the above two items strictly pertain to current Redskin players, not free agents.

There is a reason the Redskins have been able to retain some players during their medicore years and the Cowboys could not during their championship years; winning drives up team payroll. The Redskins have drove up their team payroll prior to even winning, in my opinion this is not good.

 

[DCThunder]

This thread is like the first crocus that peeks up out of the still frozen ground or the first robin that returns from the south. It comes out about this time every year and is a sure sign that spring is just around the corner.

It's a annual event to predict the Redskins are in "cap hell" and the only contest is to see which internet hack will write the column first.

 

[BlueOnion]

Once the CBA is renewed, I suspect over the next 5-years a telling stat for how teams are doing in the Salary Cap era will be unamortized salary cap figures; which I suspect the Redskins lead the league in.

I don't think a team can be in 'salary cap' hell unless they are a competitive team, on the grounds that most teams don't want players from uncompetitive teams. If the Skins go to the playoffs again this year and start to be competitive, then we'll see what happens with the salary cap numbers.

 

[MikeApf]

Redskins in cap hell

One cap expert said the Redskins might be forced to let good players walk, and could be forced to field a team with as many as 20 rookies -- or more.



When I saw this comment, it made me wonder how unbaised this commentator was. Do you honestly think the Redskins will make so many cuts that they will field a team with 20 rookies next year?

M

 

[BlueOnion]

Redskins in cap hell

One cap expert said the Redskins might be forced to let good players walk, and could be forced to field a team with as many as 20 rookies -- or more.



When I saw this comment, it made me wonder how unbaised this commentator was. Do you honestly think the Redskins will make so many cuts that they will field a team with 20 rookies next year?

M

I think the article is a little far fedged myself.

 

[Orange Crush]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season. But almost no one called attention to it. Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year. Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

 

[MikeApf]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season. But almost no one called attention to it. Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year. Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

Marty was definitely screwed by Snyder. I think he had the team on the right track. In two years he was bringing them back to respectability. Sure, I think they were only 8-8, but they played hard and were much more disciplined than "pre-Marty." Obviously I am happy they have Gibbs, but I remember at the time really feeling for Shot..M

 

[DCThunder]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season.  But almost no one called attention to it.  Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year.  Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

Marty was definitely screwed by Snyder. I think he had the team on the right track. In two years he was bringing them back to respectability. Sure, I think they were only 8-8, but they played hard and were much more disciplined than "pre-Marty." Obviously I am happy they have Gibbs, but I remember at the time really feeling for Shot..M

Frankly, Marty was only the coach of the Redskins for one season, the 2001 campaign, when he lost his first 7 games and fought back behind Tony Banks to finish 8-8, winning by scores of 14-13 and 10-3 and the like. It was the most boring football possible.

 

[jbz]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season. But almost no one called attention to it. Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year. Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

that is true. Marty cut through a lot of crap, but he still made acquisitions as well. The Skins acquired Trotter and Renaldo Wynn that offseason amongst some other pickups. Marty actually made a huge mistake by keeping thinking he could go with Jeff George and that cost them capwise. Had he decided to cut George earlier, the Skins could have made a move on a QB like Trent Dilfer or someone to that effect and not been stuck with George's salary on their cap. But he went with George, basically fired him after week 1 and then was stuck using guys like Tony Banks and Shane Graham.

 

[Marvelous]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season.  But almost no one called attention to it.  Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year.  Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

that is true. Marty cut through a lot of crap, but he still made acquisitions as well. The Skins acquired Trotter and Renaldo Wynn that offseason amongst some other pickups. Marty actually made a huge mistake by keeping thinking he could go with Jeff George and that cost them capwise. Had he decided to cut George earlier, the Skins could have made a move on a QB like Trent Dilfer or someone to that effect and not been stuck with George's salary on their cap. But he went with George, basically fired him after week 1 and then was stuck using guys like Tony Banks and Shane Graham.

I also believe the Marty got the raw end of the deal. He clearly did not agree with the free spending ways of Snyder. Marty took all the cap hits immediately, including Deion Sanders who was signed the year before. He tried to make Jeff George work and ended up starting Tony Banks who they signed out of desparation at the end of preseason. He had very little talant and got them to 8-8. Boring football, yes. But he accoplished a lot with what he had.

 

[Marvelous]

How would you like to be Eric Schaffer, the cap man for the Washington Redskins? Your boss is the combustible Dan Snyder and your cap is a mess, so much so that two cap experts from other teams who looked at it say it's as bad as they have seen.

Just an interesting note: during one of my bouts of unemployment, I actually wrote a letter to Daniel Snyder attempting to interview for a job involved with calculating and managing the cap. I got a response that they already had someone doing that. So I think it would have been a really cool job.Schaffer has been their a while and has been promoted with another guy left (I wrote him too).

 

[buster c]

The Redskins actually went through cap hell once before ... Marty Schottenheimer's second season.  But almost no one called attention to it.  Schottenheimer demanded and got control over the personnel, didn't hire big money free agents, got rid of Jeff George at quarterback, and took the cap hits while setting up the team to have a lot of cap room the following year.  Then he gets fired and Snyder goes back on the signing bonus rampage.

Marty was definitely screwed by Snyder. I think he had the team on the right track. In two years he was bringing them back to respectability. Sure, I think they were only 8-8, but they played hard and were much more disciplined than "pre-Marty." Obviously I am happy they have Gibbs, but I remember at the time really feeling for Shot..M

Frankly, Marty was only the coach of the Redskins for one season, the 2001 campaign, when he lost his first 7 games and fought back behind Tony Banks to finish 8-8, winning by scores of 14-13 and 10-3 and the like. It was the most boring football possible.

Frankly, 0-5 became 5-5, and ultimately 8-8Two of my favorite games in their comeback from 0-5 were road wins against Den & Philly - something Norv never could have done

 

[fatness]

Just an interesting note: during one of my bouts of unemployment, I actually wrote a letter to Daniel Snyder attempting to interview for a job involved with calculating and managing the cap. I got a response that they already had someone doing that. So I think it would have been a really cool job.

Schaffer has been their a while and has been promoted with another guy left (I wrote him too).

Too bad they didn't hire you. You would have been marvelous.

 

[Faust]

Redskins in cap hell

One cap expert said the Redskins might be forced to let good players walk, and could be forced to field a team with as many as 20 rookies -- or more.



When I saw this comment, it made me wonder how unbaised this commentator was. Do you honestly think the Redskins will make so many cuts that they will field a team with 20 rookies next year?

M