***San Francisco Giants Thread (1 Viewer)

[Eephus]

Keeping the 2008 stuff but bumping the thread for 2009 Kicking off the official thread of the Giants' 50th year in SF with some words from Brian Sabean.

With three weeks until the pitchers and catchers report to Scottsdale for the start of the 2008 season, I want to take this opportunity to give you a state of the Giants message. This off-season has been an exercise in patience, both on your part as our loyal fans and from the club's standpoint in acquiring the right type of impact players who will help the Giants not only in 2008 but into the future.In recent years, you have become accustomed to us building our teams with an influx of veteran players, in many cases on a one-year basis. Moving forward, we are looking to build our teams with solid all-around players from within our system and supplementing them with high-integrity, impact players who will play major roles on our club for years to come. We have seen this formula work for clubs such as the Atlanta Braves of the early-1990s -- whose strength much like the Giants was strong starting pitching -- and we all know that they went on to win an unprecedented 14 consecutive division titles.One of those players who will make a huge impact not only on the 2008 team, but over the next five years is our new Gold Glove center fielder Aaron Rowand. As we stress pitching, speed and defense in the new era of Giants baseball, the 30-year-old All-Star embodies those three attributes while also coming off the finest offensive season of his career in 2007. Perhaps his most marketable trait to us as we look to change the culture around our team is his "all-or-nothing" attitude once he takes the field.When Rowand takes the field, he will be roaming center field at AT&T Park behind one of the top starting rotations in the National League. This winter our assumptions that Matt Cain and Tim Lincecum are two of the top arms in the game today were confirmed by all of the teams which wanted to acquire them. While off-season acquisitions often make headlines, I think our best moves have been the ones we did not make. In holding onto Cain and Lincecum, they combine with Barry Zito and Noah Lowry to be the foundation for a very strong rotation for years to come.While the game starts on the mound, having a solid defense is crucial especially if you have to manufacture runs. The baseball axiom of having a strong defense up the middle applies with this team, as Rowand combines with catcher Bengie Molina and shortstop Omar Vizquel for 14 Gold Gloves. Our outfield defense will be much improved this year, as we could possibly have three center fielders covering the gaps at AT&T Park this season in Rowand, Dave Roberts and Randy Winn. That trio, along with youngsters Rajai Davis, Fred Lewis and Nate Schierholtz, will be an asset to our pitching staff as their speed will allow them to cover a lot of ground and hold runners from taking extra bases as they have in the past. In turn, that will keep the doubleplay in effect and help lessen pitch counts for our pitchers, allowing them to work deeper into games.While pitching and defense will be key ingredients in our formula for success in 2008, we are also going to have to execute effectively at the plate and use a speed game to drive our offense. Bruce Bochy wants to instill an aggressive, selfless style in 2008 in which each player will be asked to do the little things and play for one run in an inning. The Giants have traditionally been a team that has relied on power, but this year's edition will be one that will need to execute the fundamentals and use aggressive baserunning to thrive.Going into Spring Training, we are definitely going to give our younger players a chance to compete for significant playing time this season. Daniel Ortmeier and Kevin Frandsen embody the type of players who play an all-out brand of baseball. To not give a fair shot to players like them, who seem ready to play on a regular basis after what they showed down the stretch last season, would be counterproductive to getting our club on the right track.One of our major downfalls last year was losing close games, as we played the most games in the majors decided by two runs or less (39-55). We expect to close the gap in those tight contests with an improved outfield defense, better situational hitting and a bullpen with young arms who have another year of experience.I'm heartened to know that we have three viable candidates to close games in Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker. As we all saw in September, Wilson has made great strides and appears to be ready to take the next step towards being an extremely valuable man in the late innings. Hennessey is a valuable commodity for us, as his versatility really give Bruce and Dave Righetti many options on how to use him -- starting, middle, setup or closing. Remember, he led our club with 19 saves last year. I am definitely intrigued by the return of Tyler Walker from Tommy John surgery at the end of last season. With even more time for his arm to recover, I look forward to seeing him help us close out victories with his late inning efforts.Even with Spring Training just around the corner, I assure you that we are not standing pat with our club. We are always looking to strengthen our team for both the present and the future. With that said, it is quite possible that the team that reports to Scottsdale in three weeks will not be the same team that opens the season March 31 at Dodger Stadium.Not only are we taking a new tact on the field, but we also made three major new additions to the front office to help supplement our baseball operations staff. To add the baseball knowledge of former White Sox GM Ron Schueler, longtime Dodgers' scout John Barr and former Pirates scouting director Ed Creech to the decision making process can only strengthen our personnel moves, both on the major- and minor-league levels. As we enter a new era in Giants baseball, I think that you will enjoy watching a core of energetic players who will leave everything on the field in pursuit of victories when you come to AT&T Park. Like any time there is change, there is the potential for growing pains, but watching a group of young players grow into established major leaguers that lead a winning team can be even more rewarding. I look forward to seeing you at AT&T Park this season to watch the dawning of a new era in Giants baseball.Sincerely,Brian R. SabeanSenior Vice President and General Manager

See, he has a plan after all. This year is going to be painful

 

[Bogart]

Two plus paragraphs on Rowand, and one word about offense (speed) and no words about Bonds.

I'm thinking World Series.

 

[commisholio]

At the end of the day, I sure do wish that they had kicked the tires on other GM candidates and gone in a different direction.

 

[commisholio]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

 

[Eephus]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

Who do they have that's decent? I suppose Frandsen or Aurillia will play 3B, although Frandsen hits more like a 2B.The paragraph touting Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker is evidence that you can't spell Brian Sabean without BS.Don't blink or you'll miss the one and only reference to Barry Zito.

 

[commisholio]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

Who do they have that's decent? I suppose Frandsen or Aurillia will play 3B, although Frandsen hits more like a 2B.The paragraph touting Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker is evidence that you can't spell Brian Sabean without BS.Don't blink or you'll miss the one and only reference to Barry Zito.

I have heard speculation that they were thinking of trading Lowry or J Sanchez for Crede. I think those would both be bad deals for the Giants.Not at all excited about Aurillia after last year. I just want the kids to get as many at-bats as possible and see if any of them might play for the next decent Giants team in 2010 or so.Wilson, Hennessey and Walker have to be an upgrade over Benitez, right? Right?

 

[Eephus]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

Who do they have that's decent? I suppose Frandsen or Aurillia will play 3B, although Frandsen hits more like a 2B.The paragraph touting Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker is evidence that you can't spell Brian Sabean without BS.Don't blink or you'll miss the one and only reference to Barry Zito.

I have heard speculation that they were thinking of trading Lowry or J Sanchez for Crede. I think those would both be bad deals for the Giants.Not at all excited about Aurillia after last year. I just want the kids to get as many at-bats as possible and see if any of them might play for the next decent Giants team in 2010 or so.Wilson, Hennessey and Walker have to be an upgrade over Benitez, right? Right?

I wouldn't put a Crede trade past Sabean but you'd think a young pre-arbitration arm would bring more in return. Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden is a pretty poor excuse for an infield.At least Benitez was fun to boo.

 

[commisholio]

I wouldn't put a Crede trade past Sabean but you'd think a young pre-arbitration arm would bring more in return. Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden is a pretty poor excuse for an infield.At least Benitez was fun to boo.

That's why I'd be pissed about a Crede trade. It will probably end up looking like Accardo for Hillenbrand and Chulk all over again if it happens.Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden looks really, really ugly, but would Tony Clark/Aurillia, Durham, Vizquel and Crede really be significantly better? I can't see it. Might was well play the kids and see if they can play. It's not like I really expect Ortmeier to succeed, but, heck, maybe they get lucky with him and he turns into a league average player. Unlikely, I know, but weird things happen like that sometimes.

 

[Bogart]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

Who do they have that's decent? I suppose Frandsen or Aurillia will play 3B, although Frandsen hits more like a 2B.The paragraph touting Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker is evidence that you can't spell Brian Sabean without BS.

Don't blink or you'll miss the one and only reference to Barry Zito.

Funny that with that huge contract and you get third billing on the staff.

 

[Eephus]

I wouldn't put a Crede trade past Sabean but you'd think a young pre-arbitration arm would bring more in return. Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden is a pretty poor excuse for an infield.At least Benitez was fun to boo.

That's why I'd be pissed about a Crede trade. It will probably end up looking like Accardo for Hillenbrand and Chulk all over again if it happens.Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden looks really, really ugly, but would Tony Clark/Aurillia, Durham, Vizquel and Crede really be significantly better? I can't see it. Might was well play the kids and see if they can play. It's not like I really expect Ortmeier to succeed, but, heck, maybe they get lucky with him and he turns into a league average player. Unlikely, I know, but weird things happen like that sometimes.

I can't disagree although Sabean's philosophical shift from Ryan Klesko, Mike Matheny and Dave Roberts to "You Gotta Like These Kids redux" seems a bit abrupt. The team's upside is so low that a guy like Crede won't make a significant difference this year. If Fransden is your 2B of the future, playing him at 3B isn't strategic. Let him compete with Durham for the 2B spot. 3B is just going to be a mess. Ortmeier at 1B is a sure thing compared to the other corner of the IF.I'm curious to see if one of the young OF (OK, Rajai Davis and Fred Lewis are 27 but that's young for this team) can displace Dave Roberts out of spring training., or whether they'll have to wait until Roberts tweaks a hamstring in May.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

I wouldn't put a Crede trade past Sabean but you'd think a young pre-arbitration arm would bring more in return. Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden is a pretty poor excuse for an infield.At least Benitez was fun to boo.

That's why I'd be pissed about a Crede trade. It will probably end up looking like Accardo for Hillenbrand and Chulk all over again if it happens.Ortmeier, Durham, Vizquel and Fransden looks really, really ugly, but would Tony Clark/Aurillia, Durham, Vizquel and Crede really be significantly better? I can't see it. Might was well play the kids and see if they can play. It's not like I really expect Ortmeier to succeed, but, heck, maybe they get lucky with him and he turns into a league average player. Unlikely, I know, but weird things happen like that sometimes.

I can't disagree although Sabean's philosophical shift from Ryan Klesko, Mike Matheny and Dave Roberts to "You Gotta Like These Kids redux" seems a bit abrupt. The team's upside is so low that a guy like Crede won't make a significant difference this year. If Fransden is your 2B of the future, playing him at 3B isn't strategic. Let him compete with Durham for the 2B spot. 3B is just going to be a mess. Ortmeier at 1B is a sure thing compared to the other corner of the IF.I'm curious to see if one of the young OF (OK, Rajai Davis and Fred Lewis are 27 but that's young for this team) can displace Dave Roberts out of spring training., or whether they'll have to wait until Roberts tweaks a hamstring in May.

I'm hoping Frandsen sticks at third at least for a little while. Give Ray a chance to prove he's worth something to a contender at the deadline. We'll deal with the hole at third after shifting Frandsen back to 2nd after Ray's gone when it happens. I don't think who ever we stick there is going to matter tremendously. In a perfect world, spring training would be a battle between Rajai and Freddie to see who gets the bulk of the starts while Roberts is coming off the bench.Although in a perfect world a lot of things about this team would be different, including Nate coming into the season with a chance to start.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Feliz is gone to the Phillies, though, so at least we won't have his sub-.300 OBP to kick around anymore. I really wonder what they're going to do about 3rd base. I guess they'll try Fransden for now, unless they trade for Joe Crede. I'll be pissed if they give up anyone decent for Crede, though.

Who do they have that's decent? I suppose Frandsen or Aurillia will play 3B, although Frandsen hits more like a 2B.The paragraph touting Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker is evidence that you can't spell Brian Sabean without BS.Don't blink or you'll miss the one and only reference to Barry Zito.

I have heard speculation that they were thinking of trading Lowry or J Sanchez for Crede. I think those would both be bad deals for the Giants.Not at all excited about Aurillia after last year. I just want the kids to get as many at-bats as possible and see if any of them might play for the next decent Giants team in 2010 or so.Wilson, Hennessey and Walker have to be an upgrade over Benitez, right? Right?

I'm actually expecting the bullpen to one of the few things to be at least decent on this team. I think we've got a enough talent in the rotation that we shouldn't have to worry about the pen being overworked or anything. They're records will all be ugly because this team isn't ever going to come from behind to get these guys wins, but I don't expect them to Boonitez bad.

 

[Eephus]

The Giants have signed right-handed reliever Scott Williamson to a minor-league deal, according to team sources.Williamson, who will turn 32 on Sunday, appeared in 16 games last season with Baltimore. He was 1-0 with a 4.40 ERA in 141/3 innings pitched.In his nine-season career, the first half of which was spent with Cincinnati and includes stops in Boston, the Chicago Cubs and San Diego, Williamson is 28-28 with a 3.36 ERA in 344 appearances.

Momentum building...

 

[commisholio]

The Giants have signed right-handed reliever Scott Williamson to a minor-league deal, according to team sources.Williamson, who will turn 32 on Sunday, appeared in 16 games last season with Baltimore. He was 1-0 with a 4.40 ERA in 141/3 innings pitched.In his nine-season career, the first half of which was spent with Cincinnati and includes stops in Boston, the Chicago Cubs and San Diego, Williamson is 28-28 with a 3.36 ERA in 344 appearances.

Momentum building...

That's it, they're clearly World Series bound with that move. Championship or bust!

 

[Bogart]

Got this in my Google Reader today:

After reading this I stumbled upon Dan Szymborski of Baseball Think Factory, who had released the first build of his 2008 Zips Projections. After noting that three San Francisco Giants had made their way onto Perry's list, I decided I would simply lay it out for you right here, in all its glory. Leaning on ESPN's listed depth chart for the Giants, here is the club's position-by-position Zips projection (AVG/OBP/SLG).Catcher: Benjie Molina - .267/.300/.403First Base: Dan Ortmeier - .255/.306/.407Second Base: Ray Durham - .242/.319/.382Third Base: Rich Aurilia - .262/.314/.398Shortstop: Omar Vizquel - .249/.314/.308Left Field: Dave Roberts - .266/.339/.372Center Field: Aaron Rowand - .278/.340/.429Right Field: Randy Winn - .282/.338/.429

ouch.

 

[Eephus]

Got this in my Google Reader today:

After reading this I stumbled upon Dan Szymborski of Baseball Think Factory, who had released the first build of his 2008 Zips Projections. After noting that three San Francisco Giants had made their way onto Perry's list, I decided I would simply lay it out for you right here, in all its glory. Leaning on ESPN's listed depth chart for the Giants, here is the club's position-by-position Zips projection (AVG/OBP/SLG).Catcher: Benjie Molina - .267/.300/.403First Base: Dan Ortmeier - .255/.306/.407Second Base: Ray Durham - .242/.319/.382Third Base: Rich Aurilia - .262/.314/.398Shortstop: Omar Vizquel - .249/.314/.308Left Field: Dave Roberts - .266/.339/.372Center Field: Aaron Rowand - .278/.340/.429Right Field: Randy Winn - .282/.338/.429

ouch.

Sabean's science fair project to see whether OPS is a meaningful offensive statistic

 

[boom king]

i think you guys are wrong on crede. if healthy (big if, i know), he can be a premier 3B. wathing him pick it at 3rd was one of my favorite things to do. love the guy. not to mention he swings a better stick than anyone you got right now. also, i absolutely hate the WSox. but crede is a bad ###

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Got this in my Google Reader today:

After reading this I stumbled upon Dan Szymborski of Baseball Think Factory, who had released the first build of his 2008 Zips Projections. After noting that three San Francisco Giants had made their way onto Perry's list, I decided I would simply lay it out for you right here, in all its glory. Leaning on ESPN's listed depth chart for the Giants, here is the club's position-by-position Zips projection (AVG/OBP/SLG).Catcher: Benjie Molina - .267/.300/.403First Base: Dan Ortmeier - .255/.306/.407Second Base: Ray Durham - .242/.319/.382Third Base: Rich Aurilia - .262/.314/.398Shortstop: Omar Vizquel - .249/.314/.308Left Field: Dave Roberts - .266/.339/.372Center Field: Aaron Rowand - .278/.340/.429Right Field: Randy Winn - .282/.338/.429

ouch.

Sabean's science fair project to see whether OPS is a meaningful offensive statistic

those projections sound about right. Ouch, indeed.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

i think you guys are wrong on crede. if healthy (big if, i know), he can be a premier 3B. wathing him pick it at 3rd was one of my favorite things to do. love the guy. not to mention he swings a better stick than anyone you got right now. also, i absolutely hate the WSox. but crede is a bad ###

I really have no problem with acquiring Crede if a couple things happen.1) Frandsen starts over somebody, Vizquel, Durham somebody. I don't care, he needs to start.2) We don't give up anybody significant for him. We could have had basically the same player (if not a better one) by re-signing Pedro without giving up anything. It would be a typical Sabean move to let someone go bring in a vet for a year to block a young player by trading away younger players.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

This guy did a great article on Matt Cain using the Pitchf/x to help his analysis of the year and what's to come.

He also did one previously on Zito that was excellent.

http://www.baycityball.com/2008/02/11/pitc...9s-2007-season/

very encouraging when there is not much reason for hope.

 

[commisholio]

Here's a link to a giants jottings, a weblog of a guy who goes to spring training every year. Usually ends up with some great pictures, at least he has for the past couple of years.

 

[commisholio]

i think you guys are wrong on crede. if healthy (big if, i know), he can be a premier 3B. wathing him pick it at 3rd was one of my favorite things to do. love the guy. not to mention he swings a better stick than anyone you got right now. also, i absolutely hate the WSox. but crede is a bad ###

I really have no problem with acquiring Crede if a couple things happen.1) Frandsen starts over somebody, Vizquel, Durham somebody. I don't care, he needs to start.2) We don't give up anybody significant for him. We could have had basically the same player (if not a better one) by re-signing Pedro without giving up anything. It would be a typical Sabean move to let someone go bring in a vet for a year to block a young player by trading away younger players.

I'm in total agreement. I don't object to acquiring Crede, I just don't see how he really fits in with a rebuilding plan. They need to see if the young guys can play or not. Maybe the answer is not, but at least we'll know.

 

[TitusIII]

Crede's glove is worth the price of admission, imo, he, and the starting pitching, were the main reasons the Sox won it all back in'05. Hate to see him go, due to the fact that Fields is a butcher, but I hope he does well in SF...

 

[Eephus]

Crede's glove is worth the price of admission, imo, he, and the starting pitching, were the main reasons the Sox won it all back in'05. Hate to see him go, due to the fact that Fields is a butcher, but I hope he does well in SF...

Titus: I hope you get to keep watching Crede on the South side all year.He's a good defensive 3B and a fan favorite and Lord knows he'd be spackling over a huge void at 3B for the Giants. But he's only signed for this year, has back problems and isn't much better suited to be a middle-of-the-order guy than Feliz was. Crede and Feliz are on each other's BR similarity list.An infield of Crede, Omar, Durham and Aurillia would not make me feel good about the future.

 

[Eephus]

Brave talk from the Giants' new (career 86 OPS+) cleanup hitter

To the legions of doubters who think the Giants will be too impotent to win games in 2008, catcher Bengie Molina offers a piece of jewelry as his counterargument. It is his 2002 World Series championship ring, which he won at the expense of his current team.Molina's Anaheim Angels hit 152 home runs that year, the fewest among the eight playoff teams. Granted, they had a few mashers. Troy Glaus hit 30 home runs, Garret Anderson 29 and Tim Salmon 22. But Molina said that was not how they rolled."We didn't hit many home runs," he said before strapping on his gear for the Giants' first official workout at Scottsdale Stadium on Thursday. "We killed people by getting a lot of base hits and stealing bases with all those speed guys. That's what we did. I'm expecting the same thing here. I think this is a major-league team, right? We all know that. These guys have to understand that we can do it by getting base hits."Anyone who spends five minutes with Molina knows he is as serious as a tax audit. He does not muse. He speaks from conviction. He was not smiling or winking when he said, "We need to get to 95 wins this year. That's what's going to get us to the playoffsBochy believes Molina is savvy enough to know that just because he is batting fourth, he is not, and cannot be, Bonds."Last year when he was in the cleanup hole, he didn't change anything," Bochy said. "I'm comfortable with him not changing his mind-set. I think as an offensive club we understand we're not going to be a team that tries to hit the ball out of the ballpark. We'll hit the gap, hit some home runs.

For the record, Molina only hit .245 w/ 5 HR and 47 RBI in over 450 plate appearances in 2002. But if he can stay in the middle of the Giants order this year, Molina could be a decent roto sleeper. Even with the Giants anemic offense, he'll have more RBI opportunities than a better catcher hitting in the #7 or #8 hole. He's no stud but Molina could outperform his draft position with Giants being overlooked in most fantasy drafts.

 

[Eephus]

Unfortunately, they can't steal first base but the Giants could be a source of cheap steals this season.

When he played, new first-base and running coach Roberto Kelly stole 235 bases for eight big-league teams. Last year, as manager of the Giants' low Single-A team in Augusta, Ga., he all but strapped firecrackers to the shoes of his players and lit the fuses. Kelly's GreenJackets attempted 297 steals in 150 games and succeeded 212 times. Opposing catchers must have had night sweats while lying in bed thinking about Augusta.

That is the "When in doubt, run" attitude that Kelly plans to impart to the Giants this spring as they make the transition from power ball to little ball. They had a decent head start in 2007, when they ranked fourth in the National League with 119 steals. Moreover, the top third of the lineup can take off now without fear of running the Giants out of a Barry Bonds inning and incurring the wrath of homer-drunk fans.

Kelly wants the Giants to be smart and aggressive on the bases, and he means everybody. He worked with the pitchers Sunday and told them, "Once you guys get on base, you become baserunners. That doesn't mean you're going to try to be crazy out there, but once you get on base, don't use the excuse that 'I'm a pitcher and I'm not supposed to run the bases well.' "Speed is exciting. We're going to have to use it as much as we can. We're going to be more aggressive on the bases. The guys who didn't run as much or steal as much and know they can steal, they're going to be asked to steal more and get the offense going."

Not that the Giants are rife with speed demons. None of the expected starters, besides leadoff platoon mates Dave Roberts and Rajai Davis, is a real burner. For the first time in recent memory, though, most San Francisco players are fast enough to make a difference on the bases. Omar Vizquel, Randy Winn, Aaron Rowand, Ray Durham, Kevin Frandsen and even big Daniel Ortmeier can run. Catcher Bengie Molina obviously gums up the works from the cleanup spot, but he is such a good contact hitter, even he can aid the cause by swinging effectively on hit-and-run plays.

"When you have a bunch of guys who can steal, not just one or two guys, it puts a lot of pressure on the pitcher and the coaches on the other side," said Giants special assistant Felipe Alou, who had a lot of speed at his disposal when he managed the Montreal Expos.

This year, manager Bruce Bochy plans to give most of his players a standing green light. They can go unless he gives the signal to stay put.

Players like that. Rowand loves it. Last year in Philadelphia, he lost his green light when he got caught stealing in a situation that his manager, Charlie Manuel, thought was ill-considered. Rowand has talked to Bochy and has been assured that in most cases, if he wants to go, he can.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Unfortunately, they can't steal first base but the Giants could be a source of cheap steals this season.

When he played, new first-base and running coach Roberto Kelly stole 235 bases for eight big-league teams. Last year, as manager of the Giants' low Single-A team in Augusta, Ga., he all but strapped firecrackers to the shoes of his players and lit the fuses. Kelly's GreenJackets attempted 297 steals in 150 games and succeeded 212 times. Opposing catchers must have had night sweats while lying in bed thinking about Augusta.

That is the "When in doubt, run" attitude that Kelly plans to impart to the Giants this spring as they make the transition from power ball to little ball. They had a decent head start in 2007, when they ranked fourth in the National League with 119 steals. Moreover, the top third of the lineup can take off now without fear of running the Giants out of a Barry Bonds inning and incurring the wrath of homer-drunk fans.

Kelly wants the Giants to be smart and aggressive on the bases, and he means everybody. He worked with the pitchers Sunday and told them, "Once you guys get on base, you become baserunners. That doesn't mean you're going to try to be crazy out there, but once you get on base, don't use the excuse that 'I'm a pitcher and I'm not supposed to run the bases well.' "Speed is exciting. We're going to have to use it as much as we can. We're going to be more aggressive on the bases. The guys who didn't run as much or steal as much and know they can steal, they're going to be asked to steal more and get the offense going."

Not that the Giants are rife with speed demons. None of the expected starters, besides leadoff platoon mates Dave Roberts and Rajai Davis, is a real burner. For the first time in recent memory, though, most San Francisco players are fast enough to make a difference on the bases. Omar Vizquel, Randy Winn, Aaron Rowand, Ray Durham, Kevin Frandsen and even big Daniel Ortmeier can run. Catcher Bengie Molina obviously gums up the works from the cleanup spot, but he is such a good contact hitter, even he can aid the cause by swinging effectively on hit-and-run plays.

"When you have a bunch of guys who can steal, not just one or two guys, it puts a lot of pressure on the pitcher and the coaches on the other side," said Giants special assistant Felipe Alou, who had a lot of speed at his disposal when he managed the Montreal Expos.

This year, manager Bruce Bochy plans to give most of his players a standing green light. They can go unless he gives the signal to stay put.

Players like that. Rowand loves it. Last year in Philadelphia, he lost his green light when he got caught stealing in a situation that his manager, Charlie Manuel, thought was ill-considered. Rowand has talked to Bochy and has been assured that in most cases, if he wants to go, he can.

this will not end well...

 

[Eephus]

San Francisco shortstop Omar Vizquel will have arthroscopic surgery on his left knee Wednesday and is expected to miss four to six weeks.The 11-time Gold Glove shortstop, who turns 41 in April, tested his knee Tuesday but said the pain was too much to handle. "My knee was feeling good," Vizquel said. "I wanted to give it a hard shot in order to make a decision. It didn't work. I felt a little pop when I was running. That's what I wanted to see — to see if I could sustain the pain, and I couldn't."Minus Vizquel, manager Bruce Bochy plans to use Kevin Frandsen at shortstop. Once Vizquel is back, Frandsen could compete for the starting job at second base with Ray Durham.

Slight value bump for Frandsen since he'll probably earn SS eligibility, but the worst IF in baseball just got even shakier

 

[Encyclopedia Brown]

San Fran homers, any opinions on Brian Wilson as the closer?

He had a nice debut last year, especially ERA.

Any good vibrations from him?

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

San Fran homers, any opinions on Brian Wilson as the closer?He had a nice debut last year, especially ERA. Any good vibrations from him?

He's going to have to implode for him not going to get the job. They want to give him the job, but that was the same situation last year in ST. He looked great last September though and I would be surprised if he doesn't open the season as closer. If he's able to hold on to the job all year, I expect a god amount of saves (30-35), good era (3-3.5), a not as good whip (1.3-1.4, he strikes out a good amount of people, but walks a lot of people too), and a horrible record (2-8 ranging to 4-10) since he's going to have some bad outtings, and that offense is not going to come back to get him the win. There are going to be a lot of close games in SF this year. We've got no offense, but the pitching to keep it close (sometimes). I would think his ceiling for the year would be Chad Cordero from last year with a worse record.

 

[The Ref]

Kicking off the official thread of the Giants' 50th year in SF with some words from Brian Sabean.

With three weeks until the pitchers and catchers report to Scottsdale for the start of the 2008 season, I want to take this opportunity to give you a state of the Giants message. This off-season has been an exercise in patience, both on your part as our loyal fans and from the club's standpoint in acquiring the right type of impact players who will help the Giants not only in 2008 but into the future.

In recent years, you have become accustomed to us building our teams with an influx of veteran players, in many cases on a one-year basis. Moving forward, we are looking to build our teams with solid all-around players from within our system and supplementing them with high-integrity, impact players who will play major roles on our club for years to come. We have seen this formula work for clubs such as the Atlanta Braves of the early-1990s -- whose strength much like the Giants was strong starting pitching -- and we all know that they went on to win an unprecedented 14 consecutive division titles.

One of those players who will make a huge impact not only on the 2008 team, but over the next five years is our new Gold Glove center fielder Aaron Rowand. As we stress pitching, speed and defense in the new era of Giants baseball, the 30-year-old All-Star embodies those three attributes while also coming off the finest offensive season of his career in 2007. Perhaps his most marketable trait to us as we look to change the culture around our team is his "all-or-nothing" attitude once he takes the field.

When Rowand takes the field, he will be roaming center field at AT&T Park behind one of the top starting rotations in the National League. This winter our assumptions that Matt Cain and Tim Lincecum are two of the top arms in the game today were confirmed by all of the teams which wanted to acquire them. While off-season acquisitions often make headlines, I think our best moves have been the ones we did not make. In holding onto Cain and Lincecum, they combine with Barry Zito and Noah Lowry to be the foundation for a very strong rotation for years to come.

While the game starts on the mound, having a solid defense is crucial especially if you have to manufacture runs. The baseball axiom of having a strong defense up the middle applies with this team, as Rowand combines with catcher Bengie Molina and shortstop Omar Vizquel for 14 Gold Gloves. Our outfield defense will be much improved this year, as we could possibly have three center fielders covering the gaps at AT&T Park this season in Rowand, Dave Roberts and Randy Winn. That trio, along with youngsters Rajai Davis, Fred Lewis and Nate Schierholtz, will be an asset to our pitching staff as their speed will allow them to cover a lot of ground and hold runners from taking extra bases as they have in the past. In turn, that will keep the doubleplay in effect and help lessen pitch counts for our pitchers, allowing them to work deeper into games.

While pitching and defense will be key ingredients in our formula for success in 2008, we are also going to have to execute effectively at the plate and use a speed game to drive our offense. Bruce Bochy wants to instill an aggressive, selfless style in 2008 in which each player will be asked to do the little things and play for one run in an inning. The Giants have traditionally been a team that has relied on power, but this year's edition will be one that will need to execute the fundamentals and use aggressive baserunning to thrive.

Going into Spring Training, we are definitely going to give our younger players a chance to compete for significant playing time this season. Daniel Ortmeier and Kevin Frandsen embody the type of players who play an all-out brand of baseball. To not give a fair shot to players like them, who seem ready to play on a regular basis after what they showed down the stretch last season, would be counterproductive to getting our club on the right track.

One of our major downfalls last year was losing close games, as we played the most games in the majors decided by two runs or less (39-55). We expect to close the gap in those tight contests with an improved outfield defense, better situational hitting and a bullpen with young arms who have another year of experience.

I'm heartened to know that we have three viable candidates to close games in Brian Wilson, Brad Hennessey and Tyler Walker. As we all saw in September, Wilson has made great strides and appears to be ready to take the next step towards being an extremely valuable man in the late innings. Hennessey is a valuable commodity for us, as his versatility really give Bruce and Dave Righetti many options on how to use him -- starting, middle, setup or closing. Remember, he led our club with 19 saves last year. I am definitely intrigued by the return of Tyler Walker from Tommy John surgery at the end of last season. With even more time for his arm to recover, I look forward to seeing him help us close out victories with his late inning efforts.

Even with Spring Training just around the corner, I assure you that we are not standing pat with our club. We are always looking to strengthen our team for both the present and the future. With that said, it is quite possible that the team that reports to Scottsdale in three weeks will not be the same team that opens the season March 31 at Dodger Stadium.

Not only are we taking a new tact on the field, but we also made three major new additions to the front office to help supplement our baseball operations staff. To add the baseball knowledge of former White Sox GM Ron Schueler, longtime Dodgers' scout John Barr and former Pirates scouting director Ed Creech to the decision making process can only strengthen our personnel moves, both on the major- and minor-league levels.

As we enter a new era in Giants baseball, I think that you will enjoy watching a core of energetic players who will leave everything on the field in pursuit of victories when you come to AT&T Park. Like any time there is change, there is the potential for growing pains, but watching a group of young players grow into established major leaguers that lead a winning team can be even more rewarding. I look forward to seeing you at AT&T Park this season to watch the dawning of a new era in Giants baseball.

Sincerely,

Brian R. Sabean

Senior Vice President and General Manager

See, he has a plan after all. This year is going to be painful

I think if he got any part of this BS article right, it was this part. They need to get some bats in there, but the future of this franchise *should* be built around these two guys.

 

[commisholio]

San Francisco shortstop Omar Vizquel will have arthroscopic surgery on his left knee Wednesday and is expected to miss four to six weeks.The 11-time Gold Glove shortstop, who turns 41 in April, tested his knee Tuesday but said the pain was too much to handle. "My knee was feeling good," Vizquel said. "I wanted to give it a hard shot in order to make a decision. It didn't work. I felt a little pop when I was running. That's what I wanted to see — to see if I could sustain the pain, and I couldn't."Minus Vizquel, manager Bruce Bochy plans to use Kevin Frandsen at shortstop. Once Vizquel is back, Frandsen could compete for the starting job at second base with Ray Durham.

Slight value bump for Frandsen since he'll probably earn SS eligibility, but the worst IF in baseball just got even shakier

Over/under on number of days before they sign Neifi as a stop gap?

 

[Eephus]

San Francisco shortstop Omar Vizquel will have arthroscopic surgery on his left knee Wednesday and is expected to miss four to six weeks.The 11-time Gold Glove shortstop, who turns 41 in April, tested his knee Tuesday but said the pain was too much to handle. "My knee was feeling good," Vizquel said. "I wanted to give it a hard shot in order to make a decision. It didn't work. I felt a little pop when I was running. That's what I wanted to see — to see if I could sustain the pain, and I couldn't."Minus Vizquel, manager Bruce Bochy plans to use Kevin Frandsen at shortstop. Once Vizquel is back, Frandsen could compete for the starting job at second base with Ray Durham.

Slight value bump for Frandsen since he'll probably earn SS eligibility, but the worst IF in baseball just got even shakier

Over/under on number of days before they sign Neifi as a stop gap?

He'd be about as productive as the late Jose Uribe

 

[commisholio]

San Francisco shortstop Omar Vizquel will have arthroscopic surgery on his left knee Wednesday and is expected to miss four to six weeks.The 11-time Gold Glove shortstop, who turns 41 in April, tested his knee Tuesday but said the pain was too much to handle. "My knee was feeling good," Vizquel said. "I wanted to give it a hard shot in order to make a decision. It didn't work. I felt a little pop when I was running. That's what I wanted to see — to see if I could sustain the pain, and I couldn't."Minus Vizquel, manager Bruce Bochy plans to use Kevin Frandsen at shortstop. Once Vizquel is back, Frandsen could compete for the starting job at second base with Ray Durham.

Slight value bump for Frandsen since he'll probably earn SS eligibility, but the worst IF in baseball just got even shakier

Over/under on number of days before they sign Neifi as a stop gap?

He'd be about as productive as the late Jose Uribe

He might throw a little better than the former Mr. Gonzalez. That's about it though. If Neifi weren't suspended for the first 20 or so games of the season, I wouldn't be surprised to see it happen. I think they think Omar will be healthy by mid to late April, though.

 

[Eephus]

Scott Williamson released

Randy Messenger demoted

 

[Eephus]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.

Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

 

[thecatch]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

oh come on, i just drafted Frandsen in a (deep) dynasty league. Does it still look like Frandsen will get PT at 2B and 3B?

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

oh come on, i just drafted Frandsen in a (deep) dynasty league. Does it still look like Frandsen will get PT at 2B and 3B?

With Sanchez and Noah falling apart, it's looking less and less likely that Crede will be arriving soon. So I still expect him to start at 3rd until Durham falls apart, and then who knows where he'll play. I think he'll be eligible at quiet a few positions, but mid season.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

What about Velez? Any word on whether or not he'll have any role yet? They wouldn't carry only 5 IF to start the year would they?

 

[Eephus]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

What about Velez? Any word on whether or not he'll have any role yet? They wouldn't carry only 5 IF to start the year would they?

Ortmeier, Aurilia, Durham, Frandsen, Bocock, Velez? Travis Ishikawa?The New Murderer's Row

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Brian Bocock has supposedly moved ahead of Frandsen as the short term replacement for Vizquel at Short.Bocock hasn't played above A ball and is unlikely to hit his weight, but he can run a little. Your league would have to be deeper than the Marianas Trench for this news to be of any fantasy interest.

What about Velez? Any word on whether or not he'll have any role yet? They wouldn't carry only 5 IF to start the year would they?

Ortmeier, Aurilia, Durham, Frandsen, Bocock, Velez? Travis Ishikawa?The New Murderer's Row

 

[Encyclopedia Brown]

Ortmeier, Aurilia, Durham, Frandsen, Bocock, Velez? Travis Ishikawa?The New Murderer's Row

Kind of makes you long for the Mike Ivie, Duane Kuiper, Johnnie LeMaster, Max Venable era.

 

[Eephus]

Ortmeier, Aurilia, Durham, Frandsen, Bocock, Velez? Travis Ishikawa?The New Murderer's Row

Kind of makes you long for the Mike Ivie, Duane Kuiper, Johnnie LeMaster, Max Venable era.

At least those teams had Jack the Ripper.

 

[Encyclopedia Brown]

At least those teams had Jack the Ripper.

And Bob Brenly

 

[thecatch]

Lowry needs arm surgery

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

although I do think giants fans will be a little crazy by the end of the year

 

[Eephus]

Bring back Crazy Crab

 

[Eephus]

The Giants promoted 3B Ryan Rohlinger to the big league camp. He apparently has a shot at making the opening day roster, even though he hit .235 in A ball last year.

 

[Regular Crust Pizza]

Schierholtz sent down to AAA.

Apparently Brian Bocock is going to make the Opening day roster, probably as the starting SS until Visquel returns. He's a phenominal defender according to the scouts, it's just the fact he hit .220 in A ball last year that makes me hesitant.

.220 in A ball.

 

[Eephus]

Schierholtz had options left and didn't help his cause by hitting like a Bocockian .229 this spring.

There's still talk of bringing in Crede, Helms or Inge. I don't know which of these infields is more depressing:

Ortmeier - Frandsen - Bocock - Rohringer/Velez

Aurilia - Durham - Vizquel - Crede/Helms/Inge