Santana Moss benched himself...Who's running the team? (1 Viewer)

[Ministry of Pain]

It bears mention that Moss stood beside his locker and took all questions from the media after the game, during which time he took responsibility for the loss.

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I will confess that I am torn in general with players taking themselves out of the game. If this is a guy with questionable character, e.g. Brandon Lloyd, then I'm probably not going to be charitable. Moss is a fearless competitor with no history of slacking or cowardice. I truly think in this instance he did it for the right reason.

Complete Baloney Mr Maloney, I just call it like it is. I don't have to hunt any further than the box scores weekly for ammo against Gibbs and the Skins.

 

[redman]

It bears mention that Moss stood beside his locker and took all questions from the media after the game, during which time he took responsibility for the loss.

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I will confess that I am torn in general with players taking themselves out of the game. If this is a guy with questionable character, e.g. Brandon Lloyd, then I'm probably not going to be charitable. Moss is a fearless competitor with no history of slacking or cowardice. I truly think in this instance he did it for the right reason.

Complete Baloney Mr Maloney, I just call it like it is. I don't have to hunt any further than the box scores weekly for ammo against Gibbs and the Skins.

I take back what I said. I think I was remembering this thread where you were very skeptical of Campbell. Ironically, I actually defended you as someone who wasn't a "hater", so my apologies.

 

[fatness]

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I hate the Skins...even if Portis were the guy getting 80% of the carries, you never get the juicy TD with him...even in best ball leagues, handcuffed to betts, we watch Sellers carry the ball into the end zone...no upside whatsoever.

Recent Link

 

[Bri]

if he really feels that way he should give back his check for this week's game

I have a lot of days when I don't get anything done at work...I'm not giving my check back. You must see the world through FBG goggles, where everyone has to be perfect.

No one has to be perfect but if they're getting paid to do a job they should do it for the time they're getting paid to do it. You write how you don't get anything done but not how you walked off the job midday and said "eh let someone else do it".Instead you probably "keep at it".I would think that walking off the job midday is similar to what Moss did.

These two situations are very different and have no basis of comparisson.

how so?

 

[redman]

if he really feels that way he should give back his check for this week's game

I have a lot of days when I don't get anything done at work...I'm not giving my check back. You must see the world through FBG goggles, where everyone has to be perfect.

No one has to be perfect but if they're getting paid to do a job they should do it for the time they're getting paid to do it. You write how you don't get anything done but not how you walked off the job midday and said "eh let someone else do it".Instead you probably "keep at it".I would think that walking off the job midday is similar to what Moss did.

These two situations are very different and have no basis of comparisson.

how so?

Substitutions and injuries are a normal part of the NFL. The whole concept of "lineup" doesn't have a lot of parallels in the normal work environment. Regardless, in an office environment it certainly is common for one member of a team to get another one to fill in on some part of a project if one person is overloaded, and the other one is available. Also, people call in sick all the time, and many jobs pay for sick time. I think you're reaching on this.

 

[thayman]

if he really feels that way he should give back his check for this week's game

I have a lot of days when I don't get anything done at work...I'm not giving my check back. You must see the world through FBG goggles, where everyone has to be perfect.

No one has to be perfect but if they're getting paid to do a job they should do it for the time they're getting paid to do it. You write how you don't get anything done but not how you walked off the job midday and said "eh let someone else do it".Instead you probably "keep at it".I would think that walking off the job midday is similar to what Moss did.

These two situations are very different and have no basis of comparisson.

how so?

Substitutions and injuries are a normal part of the NFL. The whole concept of "lineup" doesn't have a lot of parallels in the normal work environment. Regardless, in an office environment it certainly is common for one member of a team to get another one to fill in on some part of a project if one person is overloaded, and the other one is available. Also, people call in sick all the time, and many jobs pay for sick time. I think you're reaching on this.

The situations just don't relate to each other at all.

 

[428143]

He made the right move, and I'm sure Gibbs agrees as well...

 

[Ministry of Pain]

It bears mention that Moss stood beside his locker and took all questions from the media after the game, during which time he took responsibility for the loss.

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I will confess that I am torn in general with players taking themselves out of the game. If this is a guy with questionable character, e.g. Brandon Lloyd, then I'm probably not going to be charitable. Moss is a fearless competitor with no history of slacking or cowardice. I truly think in this instance he did it for the right reason.

Complete Baloney Mr Maloney, I just call it like it is. I don't have to hunt any further than the box scores weekly for ammo against Gibbs and the Skins.

I take back what I said. I think I was remembering this thread where you were very skeptical of Campbell. Ironically, I actually defended you as someone who wasn't a "hater", so my apologies.

Well I was smiling when I posted, so no need to apologize, but thank you anyways.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I hate the Skins...even if Portis were the guy getting 80% of the carries, you never get the juicy TD with him...even in best ball leagues, handcuffed to betts, we watch Sellers carry the ball into the end zone...no upside whatsoever.

Recent Link

There isn't any upside to him or any of the Skins right now in terms of FF bro...there really isn't. The Skins are better NFL team than they are in terms of FF, you have to admit that. They are not going to produce FF numbers the same way many elite offenses will...an it really starts with the up and down QB that I talked about during the off season...my opinion has not changed much.

 

[redman]

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I hate the Skins...even if Portis were the guy getting 80% of the carries, you never get the juicy TD with him...even in best ball leagues, handcuffed to betts, we watch Sellers carry the ball into the end zone...no upside whatsoever.

Recent Link

There isn't any upside to him or any of the Skins right now in terms of FF bro...there really isn't. The Skins are better NFL team than they are in terms of FF, you have to admit that. They are not going to produce FF numbers the same way many elite offenses will...an it really starts with the up and down QB that I talked about during the off season...my opinion has not changed much.

Oh boy. You're dead wrong about the cause of their problems, but let's take that up either in the Campbell thread that I linked above, or in the 'Skins 2007 season thread.

 

[spitkickers]

I'm actually re-rechanging my mind on this issue, Joe and others. I do not think a player should pull himself from a game, outside of a health issue. Moss still could serve as a decoy to defenses, even if it was known they should not to throw to him anymore. The coaching staff has a gameplan, and there are plays designed for Moss - you leave him in the game, even if as a decoy. With Randle El known to be somewhat injured, Moss pulling himself out hurt the team greatly with the deep threat. Plus, did he still get his full game check?

I saw a lot of hate when the other Moss (Randy) pulled himself out of a game before in a previous year. Santana seems to get a lot of leeway in this situation. The general attitude of the player may be different, but the result is the same. Even if you feel you cannot benfit your team, you may still serve a purpose. I believe it is a coaching staff decision, not a personal player decision. If it has come out since that it was a coach decision, apologies, but if it was all Moss pulling himself out of the game, that is completely wrong to do, and it hurts the team as a whole.

Ministry of Pain was right. This is a player making millions of dollars, and this player should have done what was best for the team. The team has a plan and that player, as a starter, is part of the plan, regardless of productive ability. Flame on, I guess, pool.

 

[Bri]

if he really feels that way he should give back his check for this week's game

I have a lot of days when I don't get anything done at work...I'm not giving my check back. You must see the world through FBG goggles, where everyone has to be perfect.

No one has to be perfect but if they're getting paid to do a job they should do it for the time they're getting paid to do it. You write how you don't get anything done but not how you walked off the job midday and said "eh let someone else do it".Instead you probably "keep at it".I would think that walking off the job midday is similar to what Moss did.

These two situations are very different and have no basis of comparisson.

how so?

Substitutions and injuries are a normal part of the NFL. The whole concept of "lineup" doesn't have a lot of parallels in the normal work environment. Regardless, in an office environment it certainly is common for one member of a team to get another one to fill in on some part of a project if one person is overloaded, and the other one is available. Also, people call in sick all the time, and many jobs pay for sick time. I think you're reaching on this.

good pointthanks for the genuine answer

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Anyone think Moss has a bounce-back game against 'Zona? He's a lot more talented than he's shown so far and hit what could be rock bottom this past week. You'd think the guy would be extra motivated to prove something this week, or is that line of thinking completely overrated? Is the guy too far gone confidence-wise or is it going to drive him to start producing?

 

[Bri]

Anyone think Moss has a bounce-back game against 'Zona? He's a lot more talented than he's shown so far and hit what could be rock bottom this past week. You'd think the guy would be extra motivated to prove something this week, or is that line of thinking completely overrated? Is the guy too far gone confidence-wise or is it going to drive him to start producing?

He's gonna bounce back, sure. when will it be though? Good luck guessing that one. If he's on his game, I mean rrrreally on, few DBs can stop him. However that isn't all too often

 

[spitkickers]

bounce back? from what?

In a PPR league, which should help his stats look a little better (you'd think), he has:

5

14

11

(bye)

0

-2

...it almost makes you want to look for Lee Evans on the waiver wire.

 

[Mikey16x]

I remember watching Santana on the Jets... I was a huge fan... he is a TEAM player.. for sure... never complained about returning punts or doing any extra work... i personally believe that he pulled himself bc of his groin...

Still more then half of the season to go still... i have 2 more words... "buy" "low"

 

[netnalp]

Could be he was feeling rusty or wasn't going full out, fearing reinjuring the groin. I do have him in a league and I think he'll get it together. He's been open deep a few times in each of the 1st 3 games. With Campbell getting better each week, I'm buying low on Santana in my other leagues.

 

[fatness]

Anyone think Moss has a bounce-back game against 'Zona? He's a lot more talented than he's shown so far and hit what could be rock bottom this past week. You'd think the guy would be extra motivated to prove something this week, or is that line of thinking completely overrated? Is the guy too far gone confidence-wise or is it going to drive him to start producing?

I think he certainly has incentive to have a big game. He knows he let the team down, he said so publicly, and he's a team player who takes things like that to heart. But he's had so little practice time this year, due to sitting out practices waiting for nagging injuries to heal, that his timing may continue to be off. Incentive and talent alone won't make a big game, he needs a lot of practice time.

 

[redman]

I'm a 'Skins homer to be sure, but I'm confident that he didn't wuss out by pulling himself. He's not that kind of player. I'm of the "buy low" mindset with him. Assuming he doesn't have an injury problem - which he might - I think he's going to bounce back, and probably big. He can't do any worse than he's done.

My major concern here is the offensive line. They've got major injury problems there, and that more than anything else could hinder the passing game.

 

[Bri]

bounce back? from what? In a PPR league, which should help his stats look a little better (you'd think), he has:51411(bye)0-2...it almost makes you want to look for Lee Evans on the waiver wire.

Hi, you're in a thread about Santana struggling(and benching himself)

 

[spitkickers]

Bri, I'm trying to figure out your context. Apparently it's too deep for me, or you didn't see who I was repsonding do.

 

[The Jerk]

My major concern here is the offensive line. They've got major injury problems there, and that more than anything else could hinder the passing game.

:whoosh: Poor protection might negate the deep ball, which is really the way Santana separates himself from others at his position. Without deep balls and long TDs, he's basically outside the top 30 WRs or maybe even top 40.

 

[trader jake]

Santana Moss has always seemed like a stand-up player. If healthy, I'd guess he bounces back to his form of prior seasons.

The question: Is he healthy?

 

[Assani Fisher]

I hate him for costing us that game, but honestly I think this is one of the classiest things I've ever seen an athlete do(on the field):

To sit yourself because you realize that someone else gives THE TEAM a better shot at winning is the very definition of "team first attitude" imo.

 

[zamboni]

If healthy, I'd guess he bounces back to his form of prior seasons.

Which season though - the few big ones or the bunch of indistinguishable ones in between?

 

[Assani Fisher]

I'm actually re-rechanging my mind on this issue, Joe and others. I do not think a player should pull himself from a game, outside of a health issue. Moss still could serve as a decoy to defenses, even if it was known they should not to throw to him anymore. The coaching staff has a gameplan, and there are plays designed for Moss - you leave him in the game, even if as a decoy. With Randle El known to be somewhat injured, Moss pulling himself out hurt the team greatly with the deep threat. Plus, did he still get his full game check?

I saw a lot of hate when the other Moss (Randy) pulled himself out of a game before in a previous year. Santana seems to get a lot of leeway in this situation. The general attitude of the player may be different, but the result is the same. Even if you feel you cannot benfit your team, you may still serve a purpose. I believe it is a coaching staff decision, not a personal player decision. If it has come out since that it was a coach decision, apologies, but if it was all Moss pulling himself out of the game, that is completely wrong to do, and it hurts the team as a whole.

Ministry of Pain was right. This is a player making millions of dollars, and this player should have done what was best for the team. The team has a plan and that player, as a starter, is part of the plan, regardless of productive ability. Flame on, I guess, pool.

Thats where you're wrong...the team was much better without him on the field. Did you watch the game?

 

[redman]

If healthy, I'd guess he bounces back to his form of prior seasons.

Which season though - the few big ones or the bunch of indistinguishable ones in between?

The passing game under Campbell looks strong, even stronger than I thought it would be. (Campbell would have had a stat line on Sunday of 65% completions, 300+ yards, no INT's and maybe another TD but for those drops.) Assuming Moss and the o-line are healthy, I see the remainder of his season resembling his better years rather than his worse ones.

 

[Scruff Mcgruff]

Santana pissed me off more than anyone last week. But for some reason. I think he comes back in a big way this week no player likes being embarrased like that.

 

[redman]

Moss puts poor game against Packers behind him--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Associated PressASHBURN, Va. -- After nearly succumbing twice to tears in the locker room after a terrible game, Santana Moss did what good pros do. He went home and got over it."I had to really sleep on it to understand you ain't perfect, you know what I mean?" the Washington Redskins wide receiver said Wednesday.Moss had possibly his worst game in his seven-year NFL career Sunday. Six passes were thrown his way, but he failed to record even a single reception -- his first whitewash since 2002. He dropped two passes, bringing his season's total to six, second in the NFL to the eight by New Orleans' Devery Henderson.The one time Moss had the ball in his arms, he fumbled away the game. He was stripped on a reverse, and the ball was scooped up and returned for a touchdown by Charles Woodson in the Green Bay Packers' 17-14 win.Usually a steady, down-to-earth presence, Moss was close to a mess afterward. He blamed the loss on himself and was so upset that he didn't clearly explain why he took himself out in the fourth quarter. On Wednesday, he clarified that he did so because his hamstring was cramping -- not because he was having a bad day."I won't ever, just because you've had a drop or two, pull myself out. That's a coward," Moss said. "I just felt like my leg wasn't feeling good. I didn't want to be out there if I couldn't go 100 percent."Moss said he perhaps was trying to go full steam too soon after missing the previous game with a groin injury. He felt better Wednesday and took part in a complete practice, leaving Green Bay behind with the focus on the next opponent, the Arizona Cardinals."If you sit back and dwell on it, then you're not going anywhere," Moss said. "I always look ahead. Last week, after the game, you could see how I felt. The next day? It was [over with]. I'm going to just look ahead and do what I do because I know I've done plenty of other things. I've done a lot of good to let a few unhappy plays put me down."Moss has caught only 12 of 31 passes thrown his way this season and is part of a group of receivers that has yet to catch a touchdown pass. Those numbers might lead to a request for some receivers, but not Moss, who has been a hardworking, invaluable member of the offense since he arrived in 2005, the year he set the franchise record for receiving yards."That's 'Tana being 'Tana," receiver Antwaan Randle El said. "He felt he made some mistakes. He had some drops that hurt us, but he wasn't the only one."Coach Joe Gibbs met with Moss earlier this week and gave his receiver a public vote of confidence."I think he is absolutely one of the best playmakers I've ever been around," Gibbs said. "He means a huge amount to this team. I'm convinced that guy will make a ton of plays for us down the stretch. I don't think anybody works harder. I'm convinced the guy means a lot to us and will in the future, too."

 

[Nigel Tufnel]

I'm not sure why, but I still feel confident playing him. Maybe that's why I'm .500 in almost every league I'm in.

 

[HoTnickZ]

I'm not sure why, but I still feel confident playing him. Maybe that's why I'm .500 in almost every league I'm in.

Me too. I'm hanging on to him. He seems like a class act and someone to root for as well.Give me a player who is pissed at himself for poor play any day of the week over someone who the game doesn't seem to mean as much to (Alexander, perhaps).

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Santana Moss practices Wednesday

Santana Moss, WR WAS

News: Redskins WR Santana Moss (hamstring) went through a full practice Wednesday as the team prepares for Week 7 vs. Arizona. Moss returned to action in Week 6 against the Packers after sitting out Week 5, but did not fare well. He had zero catches and receiving yards against the Packers, and then took him out of the game after a crucial fumble led to a Green Bay score.

Analysis: Moss will likely play Sunday against the Cardinals and will be motivated to have a big game after some of his comments following Week 6's performance. The Redskins host the Cardinals, who rank 13th against the pass but have allowed six passing TDs and 712 passing yards in their last three games. Moss has yet to post a 100-yard game or even a touchdown this season, but this could be the week. Figure him to be a low-end No. 2 Fantasy WR.



This can go one way or another depending on his level of self confidence

Talent was never an issue but if he is shaken his ability will suffer...or he challenges himself and rebounds to another level of play he has`nt reached yet THIS year and arizona is the team to start that surge.......if he cant perform this sunday i would consider him done for the year.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Redskins: Moss a full-go Thursday 10/18, 9:23 AM CT

Redskins wide receiver Santana Moss practiced fully on Wednesday. He tweaked a hamstring in Week 6 and previously dealt with a groin injury.

Our View: Hopefully Moss can shake off the rust this week and look a lot better come Sunday. Fantasy owners will want to steer clear until he shows us something.

 

[phthalatemagic]

If this guy has pride, he will have a big game this week

 

[redman]

If this guy has pride, he will have a big game this week

Keep your eye on the offensive line. Rabach, Wade and Heyer all say they'll go on Sunday, but none of them are practicing yet. That Cards defense isn't the same sieve that we've seen in recent years, so they can take advantage of 3rd string linemen.

 

[PsychoMan]

fricken great i played him last week instead of welker and got -2 out of him, now i'm going to play welker and watch moss blow up

 

[Skinsfansince72]

It also bears mention that MoP has historically been a guy to seek out stuff to use to take shots at Gibbs and the Redskins. Not sure why, but there's a pattern there.

I hate the Skins...even if Portis were the guy getting 80% of the carries, you never get the juicy TD with him...even in best ball leagues, handcuffed to betts, we watch Sellers carry the ball into the end zone...no upside whatsoever.

Recent Link

There isn't any upside to him or any of the Skins right now in terms of FF bro...there really isn't. The Skins are better NFL team than they are in terms of FF, you have to admit that. They are not going to produce FF numbers the same way many elite offenses will...an it really starts with the up and down QB that I talked about during the off season...my opinion has not changed much.

The qb play has been fine. Better watch a game rather than just checking the box scores. Campbell has been one of the better qb's in the league this year. Sure, he makes mistakes. So does every other qb in the league not named Manning or Brady. He's putting the ball where it needs to be and, for the most part, making good decisions. Guys are dropping passes left and right and the skins have been turning the ball over. I've only counted one interception that was Campbell's fault.And if you were talking about Campbell being "up and down" in the offseason, you were talking about a guy with 6 starts under his belt. If you haven't changed your tune at this point, it's fairly obvious that you are ONLY looking at box scores. I suggest you check out an entire game. THE kid is good. And he's going to be VERY good. That much is obvious to those who are actually watching him play. I don't know where the Skins will finish but I can tell this much:Campbell won't be the reason they don't make the playoffs.

 

[Skinsfansince72]

If this guy has pride, he will have a big game this week

Sure but if his hands don't improve all the pride in the world isn't going to help him or the Skins