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So Cal Fires (4 Viewers)

Growing up there, I know that fires are also the norm. Fire season gives way to wet/mudslide season. So If the heavily populated areas of SoCal keep getting caught in windswept infernos like this, I'll happily (or sadly) revisit the new norm.
I've skipped over the last few pages and missed what led to this, got busy this week, but you should check out the link I shared a link on pg 1. It's not the only one saying something similar, but this is the beginning of a new norm.
 
My daughter in West Hollywwod is planning to stay with her sister in SF for a few days because of the air quality. Her sister in SF was just awakened by a 3.7 quake centered at the SF zoo. California.

We hiked Eaton Canyon Falls and Runyon Canyon in 2023. Those are some of the things that make LA a great place to live. Hopefully the rains come soon.
 
My daughter in West Hollywwod is planning to stay with her sister in SF for a few days because of the air quality. Her sister in SF was just awakened by a 3.7 quake centered at the SF zoo. California.

We hiked Eaton Canyon Falls and Runyon Canyon in 2023. Those are some of the things that make LA a great place to live. Hopefully the rains come soon.
Hopefully light rains. Anything heavy is going to pose massive landslide risk after these fires.
 
I saw a report saying the damage in dollars is going to surpass Katrina making this THE worst disaster in American history. Financially, I don't doubt it. The loss of life is much less, so no, Katrina was worse. Still, I'll vote anomaly too.
The problem comes when it's less of an anomaly and more of a regular occurrence. It is changing based on hurricane patterns. (I live in Houston.)

I can't imagine the stress of fire season every year once one of these things hits your own house. The people who went through hurricanes here sure report it.
 
High school friend of mine lost their house. It was a gorgeous house on the bluff overlooking the ocean. Watching the news, I was pretty sure it was gone, but they just sent me pics. So sad

On the main hill in Palisades that burned in that massive inferno? I know the neighborhood so well I think it's why I went into denial.

This pic freaks me out

See the 405? I was on the ridge south of it overlooking that burning mess for several years.
 
Air Quality out here, and I'm in LB just north of the Orange Curtain and man, its not good today. I don't know anything about the air quality index but it was 101 yesterday and this AM it jumped to 152, all red
 
Air Quality out here, and I'm in LB just north of the Orange Curtain and man, its not good today. I don't know anything about the air quality index but it was 101 yesterday and this AM it jumped to 152, all red
EPA Guidelines are the following:
AQI 0-50 = Good
51-100 = Moderate
101-150 = Unhealthy for Sensitive Groups
151-200 = Unhealthy
201-300 = Very Unhealthy
301 - 500 = Hazardous

As we have employees working on restoration efforts for the wild fires, guidelines are that once the AQI is at 150 or above, it is recommended but not required that they wear N95 masks.
500+ and it is strongly recommended/required.
If sampling reaches 1,250, they are required to wear respirators for smoke particle filtration.
 
High school friend of mine lost their house. It was a gorgeous house on the bluff overlooking the ocean. Watching the news, I was pretty sure it was gone, but they just sent me pics. So sad

On the main hill in Palisades that burned in that massive inferno? I know the neighborhood so well I think it's why I went into denial.

This pic freaks me out

See the 405? I was on the ridge south of it overlooking that burning mess for several years.
Yep. On the northern end up above pch
 
given the extent of the loss and value of the properties, what is the effect on insurance carriers and coverage? not sure if this has been posted here…..
 
"Emergency information, resources and shelter, is available - all of this can be found at URL". :lol: Some brilliant bulbs running the emergency over there.
 
Looks like we’re finally catching a few breaks. Wind not as strong. It’s only 10MPH or so here. Many of the evacuation warnings have been lifted. They smothered the Calabasas (Kenneth Fire) in amazing fashion. That one was scary because it could have traveled down the 101 along the Santa Monica mountains with endless fuel. Right in our path. So thank God they jumped on it. Evacuation warnings lifted in other areas as well. Eaton Canyon getting better. Looks like they are making big progress here before the next winds come.

The volunteer efforts have been amazing. So many are donating. We sent bags of dog food to the shelter as they took on many new stranded pets. Many others did too. They had street food vendors (hot dog carts etc) make pleas on TikTok. All of a sudden not only did they show up with donated money to feed many people, Uhauls were lined up with donated food, water, blankets, clothes, baby food, personal care items and more. Love to see people stepping up. I encourage FBG’s to do what they can. Every contribution helps. These are catastrophic events but the bright side is seeing the community come together.
 
Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
My assumption would be that they land this thing at LAX and get some crack airframe mechanics to patch it up. Lord knows this has to be one of the best places in the world to find qualified folks to get this done.
 
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Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
My assumption would be that they land this thing at LAX and get some crack airframe mechanics to patch it up. Lord know this has to be one of the best places in the world to find qualified folks to get this done.
I agree, but I know that the protocols/regulations for aviation can be pretty insane. Being from California, I can tell you that we are a state that is a breeding ground for its own regulations—so I’m really hoping that they can work out a balance here. I certainly wouldn’t want any pilots flying any sort of compromised aircraft, but I also don’t want to see fires raging on (especially since they are projecting another wind event Monday-Tuesday-Wednesday) and more people losing life and property.
 
my neighborhood app today and yesterday inundated with posts from people looking for donation centers and volunteer needs. good reminder to me and any of us disenfranchised by the world that there is still a lot more good out there than the bad. mostly they just report coyote sightings, package thefts, and lost dogs, which possibly are related to coyote sightings.
 
Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
My assumption would be that they land this thing at LAX and get some crack airframe mechanics to patch it up. Lord know this has to be one of the best places in the world to find qualified folks to get this done.
Should be back in action by Monday. Good job drone guy. :rolleyes:
 
Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
More information on that plane getting hit: https://www.twz.com/air/one-of-just...es-taken-out-of-palisades-fire-fight-by-drone

The drone was flying despite a Temporary Flight Restriction TFR imposed by the FAA over the area from Jan. 9 to Jan. 23 to prevent any aircraft, manned or drone, from interfering with firefighting efforts. The drone was being flown by a photographer taking video of the flames, the LA Times reported.
 
Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
More information on that plane getting hit: https://www.twz.com/air/one-of-just...es-taken-out-of-palisades-fire-fight-by-drone

The drone was flying despite a Temporary Flight Restriction TFR imposed by the FAA over the area from Jan. 9 to Jan. 23 to prevent any aircraft, manned or drone, from interfering with firefighting efforts. The drone was being flown by a photographer taking video of the flames, the LA Times reported.
i hope he gets arrested right away. it's a federal mandate, right? good opportunity for the faa to create a precedence on the stupid.
 
My biggest concern is that this is an act of terrorism that could again happen in the future. Not just in Los Angeles, but anywhere really.

I think L.A. and California will make the adjustments necessary, that will be expensive, but I'm guess achievable.

But how do you adjust to wildfire terrorism?
 
Super Scooper airplanes from Quebec picking up massive amounts of water to dump on Palisades fire.

Way cool planes.
One of the two super scoopers used in fighting the fires got hit by an unauthorized drone yesterday and had its wing damaged. Now it is unusable for at least the near future. Murphy’s law in full effect.
Such nonsense. I hope they can find who is responsible and drop the hammer.

Also good to see that Canada can still act like good neighbours even while an incoming president threatens to destabilize our country 👍
I see we've reached that point in the thread where political drive-bys are encouraged now. Good to know.
As a general note on the Super Scoopers - they are leased (and have been leased for quite a while) by the US by my understanding. So it is a long standing thing there, not some emergency flight from Quebec.

Still, they're wicked cool planes and a huge boon to the firefighting effort there.
 
thanks for posting Sand, but it says it right there, previously scheduled maintenance. did see mentions of that reservoir earlier on local outlets, seems like a non-issue.
 
So, evidently there was less water available. The Palisades water reservoir was empty at the time of the fires.


:ponder:

Crazy people running california played a big part in this. Cut the fire dpt budgets down and diverted rivers to save some fish.
Uh no.
This is what the bots on X are spreading.

Millions of views spreading lies about the Palisades firefighters lacking water because of regulations, the boring truth comes late like usual and wont be shared.

Here it is:

1 - Reservoirs and water tanks were at normal levels and completely full before the fire.

2 - All 114 city water supply tanks were fully stocked pre-fire.
 
So, evidently there was less water available. The Palisades water reservoir was empty at the time of the fires.

If we ran out of road salt during the winter, there would be consequences, and nobody's house ever burned down because of a lack of road salt. I'm not a huge fan of my state's government, but they do get the basic "night watchman" functions right, at least.
 
I saw a report saying the damage in dollars is going to surpass Katrina making this THE worst disaster in American history. Financially, I don't doubt it. The loss of life is much less, so no, Katrina was worse. Still, I'll vote anomaly too.
More damage than Katrina. More consistently strong winds than anyone has seen before in LA. Nothing anomalous about that…….

Now, is this the new norm? Maybe. Maybe not. I’d say this is an indicator of where things may head from here.

But it is definitely an anomaly relative to the last 80-100 years.
 
Drop the politics please.
You guys should really start throwing a flag on the first shove. I reported that post two hours before responding to it. I am trying to do what you asked by reporting posts that are clearly over the "no politics" line, but you only follow up to the responses.
 
Drop the politics please.
You guys should really start throwing a flag on the first shove. I reported that post two hours before responding to it. I am trying to do what you asked by reporting posts that are clearly over the "no politics" line, but you only follow up to the responses.

That's as nicely as we can ask it. Nothing about first shove in our request.
 
I saw a report saying the damage in dollars is going to surpass Katrina making this THE worst disaster in American history. Financially, I don't doubt it. The loss of life is much less, so no, Katrina was worse. Still, I'll vote anomaly too.
More damage than Katrina. More consistently strong winds than anyone has seen before in LA. Nothing anomalous about that…….

Now, is this the new norm? Maybe. Maybe not. I’d say this is an indicator of where things may head from here.

But it is definitely an anomaly relative to the last 80-100 years.
I'm thinking we'll see more fires, high winds. Hopefully not as bad as this, and hopefully we continue to improve our preemptory mitigation and also the ability to respond. But the global climate has changed over the last 150 years. This is a symptom of that change.
 
given the extent of the loss and value of the properties, what is the effect on insurance carriers and coverage? not sure if this has been posted here…..
California was already heading toward what we see in Florida — brand name carriers basically leaving the state as related to homeowners insurance, leaving the market in dire straits with nowhere near enough coverage, far higher deductibles, and far higher prices. Will we under-capitalized, financially unreliable California-only insurers dominating the homeowners market like we see in Florida? I hope not — it’s a recipe for instability. But the CA insurance commissioner has perverse incentives to do exactly the wrong thing.

When it comes to commercial properties, I’m more optimistic. We will still see higher deductibles and prices, and some pullback on capacity/availability, but I don’t think it will be nearly as extreme.

Tough to say at this point though. This topic is being actively debated now within the industry.
 
Sounds like poor timing on the maintenance... sucks

Think repair would have been a better word choice.

There was a tear in the cover, which would have made the water undrinkable. Apparently they can’t just leave water in the reservoir in that condition - run the risk of contaminating the water supply.

Even if they had completed repairs to the torn cover, it would take several weeks to get it back online. According to the article above, the reservoir would not have been full regardless, because in the winter months they have lower seasonal demand. A full reservoir would lead to water stagnation, contamination, etc.

Bottom line is with a fire of this magnitude you would have ended up in the same place we’re at now. What they’re trying to determine now is exactly what was the impact.

There are tanks and reservoirs all over Los Angeles. In theory they could store 1 billion gallons. IDK what the actual, practical capacity might be at any given time.
 
given the extent of the loss and value of the properties, what is the effect on insurance carriers and coverage? not sure if this has been posted here…..
California was already heading toward what we see in Florida — brand name carriers basically leaving the state as related to homeowners insurance, leaving the market in dire straits with nowhere near enough coverage, far higher deductibles, and far higher prices. Will we under-capitalized, financially unreliable California-only insurers dominating the homeowners market like we see in Florida? I hope not — it’s a recipe for instability. But the CA insurance commissioner has perverse incentives to do exactly the wrong thing.

When it comes to commercial properties, I’m more optimistic. We will still see higher deductibles and prices, and some pullback on capacity/availability, but I don’t think it will be nearly as extreme.

Tough to say at this point though. This topic is being actively debated now within the industry.

Yup.

The big property insurers have VERY smart people running them (both the folks making the overall strategic decisions and the ones doing the math that support and drive those decisions). They've seen this coming for quite some time.

I don't work in personal lines (I'm on the commercial side) but I imagine they've been taking the same steps. We pay a LOT more attention to catastrophe models than we did even 10 years ago. Back then (at the desk underwriting level) , you modeled CA earthquake and wind down in Florida. That was basically it. There were strategies built around everything else, but it wasn't especially scientific. But now......you name it....we're modelling it before we put a new property risk of any significant size on our book. CA brush fire.....hail in the mid-west...wind on the east coast (even up through Eastern Canada). Flood pricing (even in low hazard areas)....... all of that is significantly more scientific than it was when I started out back in 2007.

Construction costs are up. Reinsurance costs are up. Large scale catastrophic losses are getting more frequent and more serious. The good carriers are smart enough to know where they can and can't make an underwriting profit. And if local regulations prevent them from getting the rates and terms they need (like they do in CA with prop 103), they're not gonna stick around to be left holding the bag.

Its obviously awful if regular people can't get fairly priced insurance to cover themselves. But at the end of the day, these are for-profit companies. They're gonna pay the claims the contract says they should pay, abide by state rules (including sending proper legal notice for non-renewals....despite what the "experts" on twitter claim. Nobody's policy got "cancelled" with no notice 2 weeks ago. Its not legal. Our computer systems literally wont let us do it) and get out of markets where they can't properly fund for the risk.
 
Well our close family friends for sure lost their house. And their school burned to the ground too. She's going to Harvard so I mean I don't even know if they care if she finishes out the year, but ok.

I offered to take their daughter in to finish out her HS Sr. year here. Sounds like it will happen.
 
Well our close family friends for sure lost their house. And their school burned to the ground too. She's going to Harvard so I mean I don't even know if they care if she finishes out the year, but ok.

I offered to take their daughter in to finish out her HS Sr. year here. Sounds like it will happen.
Good on you. During/after the Santa Rosa fires we had a mom and her two daughters staying with us for several weeks. Do what you can to help others when you’re able.
 
Well our close family friends for sure lost their house. And their school burned to the ground too. She's going to Harvard so I mean I don't even know if they care if she finishes out the year, but ok.

I offered to take their daughter in to finish out her HS Sr. year here. Sounds like it will happen.
Damn, sorry to hear it. Palisades or Altadena?
 
For all those that are wondering about uninsured places, I can attest to the local news just beginning to cover this phenomenon. To many people, their notices probably feel like weeks ago. I know when they cancelled our auto last January (because Farmer’s and then State Farm were both pulling out of California for very political reasons, which I know because I called an agent my brother knew from State Farm and he gave me the straight dope), I got a few months notice, but time flies and it feels like two weeks ago.

Anybody saying that insurers leaving California is due solely to climate change and not the regulatory apparatus of the state is— I think—incorrect in that assessment. I don’t know exactly how or why, but I did watch two separate long-ish videos on it and a lot had to do with the regulatory state here.

And I’m not looking to get political, but chalking this up to climate change and climate change alone (and there is indeed a large component of climate change that goes into the new prices and coverage) seems wrong on its face.

Because if it is just climate change, there needs to be a policy change in how we regulate insurance. Telling people simply, “tough ****—you’re now uninsurable and at risk” is not acceptable in any society, even the one that has the most dynamic outlook on capital and investments you can have. Your government will collapse if you attempt to do that because now you’re trying to tell people to live in theory rather than in practice, which has analogous cousins I don’t want to mention for fear of red meat and red herrings. But you can’t have a system predicated and based on totally uprooting people constantly while declaring their best investment null and void.

I just want to make sure my free market friends aren’t adopting this posture. The government will collapse (even if another reason is stated) if you do that. That’s my sincerely held belief that’s probably not too far off.
 
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Well now it's threatening to cross Mulholland Drive. I'm just north of the Balboa/Woodley Park so Wednesday morning the fire there was closer smoke but not as elevated so didn't see any orange. Now the hills I can see on the horizon have flames.
 
Well now it's threatening to cross Mulholland Drive. I'm just north of the Balboa/Woodley Park so Wednesday morning the fire there was closer smoke but not as elevated so didn't see any orange. Now the hills I can see on the horizon have flames.
I hope they can get it cut down before it gets closer. Just in case, start prepping to go. I know it sucks (we had to evac Tues night), but be ready.
 
For all those that are wondering about uninsured places, I can attest to the local news just beginning to cover this phenomenon. To many people, their notices probably feel like weeks ago. I know when they cancelled our auto last January (because Farmer’s and then State Farm were both pulling out of California for very political reasons, which I know because I called an agent my brother knew from State Farm and he gave me the straight dope), I got a few months notice, but time flies and it feels like two weeks ago.

Anybody saying that insurers leaving California is due solely to climate change and not the regulatory apparatus of the state is— I think—incorrect in that assessment. I don’t know exactly how or why, but I did watch two separate long-ish videos on it and a lot had to do with the regulatory state here.

And I’m not looking to get political, but chalking this up to climate change and climate change alone (and there is indeed a large component of climate change that goes into the new prices and coverage) is erroneous.

Because if it is just climate change, there needs to be a policy change in how we regulate insurance. Telling people simply “tough ****—you’re now uninsurable and at risk” is not acceptable in any society, even the one with the most dynamist capitalistic outlook you can have. Your government will collapse if you attempt to do that because now you’re trying to tell people to live in theory rather than in practice, which has analogous cousins I don’t want to mention for fear of red meat and red herrings. But you can’t have a system predicated and based on totally uprooting people constantly while declaring their best investment null and void.

I just want to make sure my free market friends aren’t adopting this posture. The government will collapse (even if another reason is stated) if you do that. That’s my sincerely held belief that’s probably not too far off.
I agree with a lot of this. Stuff like this is why I never understood the anti-clean energy argument. People think mass adoption of sola/wind/nuclear and electric transportation is expensive? Wait until they see the bill for NOT moving to renewable energy.
 
Well now it's threatening to cross Mulholland Drive. I'm just north of the Balboa/Woodley Park so Wednesday morning the fire there was closer smoke but not as elevated so didn't see any orange. Now the hills I can see on the horizon have flames.
I hope they can get it cut down before it gets closer. Just in case, start prepping to go. I know it sucks (we had to evac Tues night), but be ready.
Your family safe? Your home? 🙏
 
My biggest concern is that this is an act of terrorism that could again happen in the future. Not just in Los Angeles, but anywhere really.

I think L.A. and California will make the adjustments necessary, that will be expensive, but I'm guess achievable.

But how do you adjust to wildfire terrorism?
I don't understand why you're concerned with terrorism. You've been asking about it, and have been answered about it, multiple times in this thread. But you keep bringing it up, and I don't understand why. What are you reading or hearing (and from who) that says terrorism is a legit concern in these fires?
 
For all those that are wondering about uninsured places, I can attest to the local news just beginning to cover this phenomenon. To many people, their notices probably feel like weeks ago. I know when they cancelled our auto last January (because Farmer’s and then State Farm were both pulling out of California for very political reasons, which I know because I called an agent my brother knew from State Farm and he gave me the straight dope), I got a few months notice, but time flies and it feels like two weeks ago.

Anybody saying that insurers leaving California is due solely to climate change and not the regulatory apparatus of the state is— I think—incorrect in that assessment. I don’t know exactly how or why, but I did watch two separate long-ish videos on it and a lot had to do with the regulatory state here.

And I’m not looking to get political, but chalking this up to climate change and climate change alone (and there is indeed a large component of climate change that goes into the new prices and coverage) is erroneous.

Because if it is just climate change, there needs to be a policy change in how we regulate insurance. Telling people simply “tough ****—you’re now uninsurable and at risk” is not acceptable in any society, even the one with the most dynamist capitalistic outlook you can have. Your government will collapse if you attempt to do that because now you’re trying to tell people to live in theory rather than in practice, which has analogous cousins I don’t want to mention for fear of red meat and red herrings. But you can’t have a system predicated and based on totally uprooting people constantly while declaring their best investment null and void.

I just want to make sure my free market friends aren’t adopting this posture. The government will collapse (even if another reason is stated) if you do that. That’s my sincerely held belief that’s probably not too far off.
I have State Farm. Had it for 24 years at my current residence. My agent was my friend before I got insurance with her. When there were fires across the street from me, I called her and she said you’re good. Don’t worry about it. Then there was another fire across the canyon. Multiple 10M plus houses burned. Over the years there are more isolated incidents. Some huge fires. So far so good. I’m grandfathered in, in her words. No chance they drop me. I’ll be calling her in the next few weeks to ensure this is still the case.
 
My biggest concern is that this is an act of terrorism that could again happen in the future. Not just in Los Angeles, but anywhere really.

I think L.A. and California will make the adjustments necessary, that will be expensive, but I'm guess achievable.

But how do you adjust to wildfire terrorism?
I don't understand why you're concerned with terrorism. You've been asking about it, and have been answered about it, multiple times in this thread. But you keep bringing it up, and I don't understand why. What are you reading or hearing (and from who) that says terrorism is a legit concern in these fires?
The internet is full of lemmings. It’s frightening.
 

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