So Joe Bryant; How do you go from building boats to owning a fantasy football website? (1 Viewer)

[Joe Bryant]

I would slightly disagree in that it is also about the people.  Whenever I have done hiring I care more about whether or not the person I was hiring could fit into the culture of my team than whether or not they had the skills to do the job.  I could teach the job (provided they had a minimum aptitude for the kind of work I needed done) but what I can't teach is attitude, work ethic, personality that would fit with the rest of the team.  

I don't think we disagree there @Gally I'm totally with you on this. We had several other boat manufacturers near us. I'd often get people applying for jobs that had experience at other boat companies. I rarely put much value on that at all. In fact, sometimes it was a negative as we'd have to retrain them to do things our way. I always put way more value on if I thought that person would be a good fit and if they could be part of the team. I've had to fire some talented people that just weren't the kind of people that fit within a team. 

 

[Psychopav]

Preach.

One (of the zillion) lessons I learned was the best person doing the job doesn't necessarily mean they're the best person to lead the crew doing the job. 

It's common I think in small business to promote the person doing well. I remember having a person in a crew that was fantastic at his job and I promoted him to a supervisor role for that area. He wasn't good at that at all. 

It was a young mistake for me. Now looking back it seems obvious. Leading a team requires a vastly different skill set than doing the actual work the team is doing.

I learned that one pretty quick. But I definitely screwed it up early. 

From my own experience and that of others I've known in various companies, I'd venture to guess this is not uncommon in large companies either.  The difference I think is that often with the large infrastructure that comes with a large corporation, the impact of one bad manager can be mitigated more easily.  And if the culture is solid, then the bad managers are found out and worked out over time...a luxury that small businesses don't have.

Then again, being big doesn't mean anything if the culture isn't solid.

 

[James Daulton]

I've always wondered when people start businesses, did you and your pops do any research into the market and figure out where a need was, or where you like "I bet we can build some kick ### boats, let's do that" without tons of research done.

Great thread btw.

 

[Capella]

What did your pops say when you first told him you were starting a fantasy football site? 

 

[BassNBrew]

What did your pops say when you first told him you were starting a fantasy football site? 

Son, if you only listen to one piece of advice I ever give you about imaginary football, draft Tom Brady in your dynasty league.

 

[BassNBrew]

I've always wondered when people start businesses, did you and your pops do any research into the market and figure out where a need was, or where you like "I bet we can build some kick ### boats, let's do that" without tons of research done.

Great thread btw.

Based on the earlier posts, Joe's dad had some special fiberglass knowledge.  What I don't understand is how you build a kick ### boat without a boatload of engineering or a "water" tunnel to validate your design.  These definitely weren't john boats for catching crappie in your pond.  This definitely isn't boat strapping a squatty potty or even a Ring doorbell.  I hope Joe might dive deeper into the steps between the kitchen table and delivering a finished product to a dealer.

 

[Joe Bryant]

What did your pops say when you first told him you were starting a fantasy football site? 

"Oh, that's nice".  

I've got a lot to talk about on that as I think it's fascinating and probably important from a parenting angle. And a being in business with your family angle. 

My dad is old school. Like never sent an email old school. Like still has a paper rolodex on his desk with a zillion hand written notes in it old school.

But he's legit awesome. One of the most naturally charismatic and natural leaders I've ever been around. And I've been around quite a few. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

I've always wondered when people start businesses, did you and your pops do any research into the market and figure out where a need was, or where you like "I bet we can build some kick ### boats, let's do that" without tons of research done.

Great thread btw.

Thank you GB. 

This thread is super interesting as I've been thinking a lot about this recently and how it started. 

I wish I'd done a good job of journaling back then but I did not. 

My usual take away from much of my thinking about the origin was just to shake my head at my naïveté and what an idiot I was. Today, I weigh out the pros and cons and reviews before I spend $5 on a beer. Back then I said the bank could have my house if the business failed because "it seemed like a cool thing". Now not really, but looking back, and doing a poor job of answering your question, I probably didn't put nearly the amount of time and research into starting the company as I would advise someone to do today.

Also to be fair, "research" in 1989 was very different than today. You went to the Library or Chamber of Commerce to do research.

I knew the industry well and knew what kind of competition existed at that time. And read trade journals and that kind of thing. But mostly it was about me and my Dad thinking we could build a product that people would buy. 

I was just 26 years old. Which if you know 26 year olds, is a dangerous age as I thought I knew it all and in reality knew nothing. My dad was 48 and had 28 years of experience in the industry and did know a lot. So I VERY much benefitted from his expertise and insight. I put a ton of trust in him and when he said he thought it would work, that went a long ways with me thinking it would work too. 

But bottom line, no, I didn't put enough research into the idea before we started. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

So how hands on in the actual boat building were you or did you do the front office stuff?

It changed over time. When I say this was a bootstrap startup, I mean it was a literal me along side our folks working on the shop floor. And my dad getting his CDL license and driving the truck to deliver finished boats. 

We went I think the first 6 months or so without taking a salary so I was in effect, free labor. It was just how we had to operate. If could do a job on the floor that would save the money from us having to hire another person, I did it. 

I think some entrepreneurs today skip this step. They start off with "funding" and never learn the "on the floor" stuff.

Gary Vaynerchuk is a guy I've followed a long time. He does a lot of great stuff. He talks about "dirt" and "clouds". With the dirt being the actual work. And the cloud being more thought and strategy. I worked in the dirt and the clouds at the same time. But that time in the dirt was invaluable. 

 

[eoMMan]

I will say one thing I strongly believe on that "safe path" vs "entrepreneur path" is the number one thing I think people need is to be self aware. Know yourself. 

Up until a few years ago, every home I'd ever owned was on the line at the bank guaranteeing business loans along with other personal guarantees. For 25 years, my personal financial situation was closely tied to my business' financial situation. And there were some lean years. I never talked about it here, but 2008 was a bloodbath for the boat industry. For LOTS of people, that worry would be a terrible way to live. And I totally get it. I put zero credit on someone like me being wired a certain way. It's all about knowing yourself. 

Yeah, I know Morgan Industries (parent of Luhrs, Hunter Marine, Silverton, etc). got destroyed during the 2008-2010 or so period. They eventually filed for bankruptcy. 

It makes sense. Boats are a luxury item. If times are tough, people aren't to go drop six figures on a boat.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Based on the earlier posts, Joe's dad had some special fiberglass knowledge.  What I don't understand is how you build a kick ### boat without a boatload of engineering or a "water" tunnel to validate your design.  These definitely weren't john boats for catching crappie in your pond.  This definitely isn't boat strapping a squatty potty or even a Ring doorbell.  I hope Joe might dive deeper into the steps between the kitchen table and delivering a finished product to a dealer.

Thanks GB.

The boat industry has a whole market segment of design firms. They are nautical engineers who will create a set of molds for you based on your design and input. And then once you have a running surface that you like, you can use that to create more of your own designs. 

Neither me nor my Dad are engineers by trade. But he had a long history of experience with running designs and surface we knew performed well. 

Later on, we actually got into some pretty interesting innovative designs we came up with to address things that were a positive impact for us. 

For the rest of the boat that's not the running surface, it's way less technical and the focus there is more on aesthetics and functionality. Later on, I started diving deep myself into design in that way. But it was still way less "formal" than I'm sure a big company would do. I'm talking I'd spend the day visiting car dealerships and studying cupholder layout in a minivan. That kind of thing. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

But bottom line, no, I didn't put enough research into the idea before we started. 

Takeaway from the story: Don't be like Joe. 

 

[Gally]

I think some entrepreneurs today skip this step. They start off with "funding" and never learn the "on the floor" stuff.

This "on the floor" experience is a huge factor in almost all industries.  Engineers that have done construction are so much better than ones that just know design theory.  I don't think this aspect of your success can be overstated.  

 

[Joe Bryant]

This "on the floor" experience is a huge factor in almost all industries.  Engineers that have done construction are so much better than ones that just know design theory.  I don't think this aspect of your success can be overstated.  

Thank you @Gally  I agree. 

 

[Ron Swanson]

Takeaway from the story: Don't be like Joe. 

 

[Corporation]

Thank you @raidergil. I'll be glad to answer questions on that. Running both was mostly a case of having an excellent team at both businesses. Because all of my Footballguys work could be done remotely, it made it easier to blend the two. Plus, when I was younger, there was a lot of put the kids to bed and then work till 3 am type nights. Not advisable.

Ultimately though, I realized I wasn't doing a good enough job for either company and realized I needed to pick one. I chose Footballguys. 

Glad you did!  I know it had to be a difficult choice in that you started Bryant Boats with your dad.  I love the community you've fostered here and wish you continued success.  I think it will be interesting to see as your existing customer base ages (I remember being on an audit almost 20 years ago, logged into the client's network so I could get a good member number on Footballguys  ) what type of community interaction you will offer. I know the boards are a pain to manage (because you can't please everyone) but they also hold an anchor for people here as well.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

This "on the floor" experience is a huge factor in almost all industries.  Engineers that have done construction are so much better than ones that just know design theory.  I don't think this aspect of your success can be overstated.  

God, ain't that the truth. I deal with structural & geotech engineers every day. I can tell right away who has practical experience and who doesn't. Most don't these days. It's not their fault; that's on the way the big GCs and Geotech firms staff their work nowadays.

Just drawing a bunch of circles on a page, or copying-and-pasting some other engineer's work without understanding constructability doesn't get it done.

Whenever I run into field issues due to design or inspection, I "request" (read: "demand", because I have very little filter left in my waning years and I've stopped work many times until my request is met) an on site conference where those folks with their pressed clothes and brand-new work boots can see what they've done. I don't do it to denigrate them, but to help them understand. Some get it, some don't. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

This "on the floor" experience is a huge factor in almost all industries.  Engineers that have done construction are so much better than ones that just know design theory.  I don't think this aspect of your success can be overstated.  

The other thing that helped me a ton with this is not just knowing how the jobs were done so I could manage better. Most importantly by a mile I think is the respect I learned for the job and the people doing the work. 

They knew that I knew. And that radically changed our relationship. 

 

[Tom Hagen]

The other thing that helped me a ton with this is not just knowing how the jobs were done so I could manage better. Most importantly by a mile I think is the respect I learned for the job and the people doing the work. 

They knew that I knew. And that radically changed our relationship. 

This can be a huge issue in second generation ownership.  It didn't sound like you and your dad had a choice but I encourage anyone thinking of bringing children into a business have them start with something hands on, even if its only summers during college. This is not only because it helps knowing how the business works at the ground level if you want to run a business, but also because employees and customers can usually tell.

 

[Joe Bryant]

This can be a huge issue in second generation ownership.  It didn't sound like you and your dad had a choice but I encourage anyone thinking of bringing children into a business have them start with something hands on, even if its only summers during college. This is not only because it helps knowing how the business works at the ground level if you want to run a business, but also because employees and customers can usually tell.

100% @Tom Hagen

It's been my experience most bosses kids are terrible. They're gifted way too much and haven't "earned" their position. And the rest of the team resents them.

I've got a few young guys I hang out with locally I semi mentor that are in this position. (I call it Lion Kings Club) and the number one thing I stress to them is you have to go over the top to prove yourself. First one to work. Take regular lunch break. Work your butt off. Don't give anyone anywhere a reason to say, "Oh that's because he's the bosses kid". Because EVERYONE there is going to expect you to suck because you're the bosses kid. 

 

[johnnycakes]

100% @Tom Hagen

It's been my experience most bosses kids are terrible. They're gifted way too much and haven't "earned" their position. And the rest of the team resents them.

I've got a few young guys I hang out with locally I semi mentor that are in this position. (I call it Lion Kings Club) and the number one thing I stress to them is you have to go over the top to prove yourself. First one to work. Take regular lunch break. Work your butt off. Don't give anyone anywhere a reason to say, "Oh that's because he's the bosses kid". Because EVERYONE there is going to expect you to suck because you're the bosses kid. 

With that in mind, what do you think the chances are that Bill Belichick fires his son?

 

[Joe Bryant]

With that in mind, what do you think the chances are that Bill Belichick fires his son?

That's a fascinating one. I don't know the details of their relationship or the team dynamics. But it's a challenging situation. 

 

[snellman]

To keep track of this topic because I greatly admire and respect Joe and his down to earth personality.  If you are ever in NW Iowa or SW South Dakota (Will probably never be because we are middle of nowhere lol) I would love to meet you and buy you some BBQ.

 

[Joe Bryant]

To keep track of this topic because I greatly admire and respect Joe and his down to earth personality.  If you are ever in NW Iowa or SW South Dakota (Will probably never be because we are middle of nowhere lol) I would love to meet you and buy you some BBQ.

Would love that, Buddy. 

 

[James Daulton]

Why are boats so expensive?  Like why do boats that aren't exactly yachts cost more than most houses?

 

[Phil Elliott]

Love the thread...My dad was an entrepreneur, didn't like working for someone else and was involved in starting many professional sports leagues (ABA, AFL, WHA, etc). I chose the other route of college and having a career at one DOW 30 company. A saying I have found to be very accurate:

"Experience comes from making bad decisions and good decisions come from experience". 

Totally agree with @Joe Bryant about finding the right people to promote to supervision .

 

[Joe Bryant]

Why are boats so expensive?  Like why do boats that aren't exactly yachts cost more than most houses?

That's a great question. They've just become fancier and fancier over the years. And honestly, it's part of what I didn't like about the industry. Boats used to be much more affordable. I know for us, it became sort of a "feature match" thing. It would be "Well the Sea Ray we're considering in this size has the custom aluminum ski tower and the 12 speaker Bose system, can you do that?"  And the answer was, "Yes, but here's how much it cost". 

And it seemed to go up and up. 

Boats are a tough sell already as for many people, they only can get half a year of use out of them. Some even less if you live in the North and MidWest. It's a challenging industry.

 

[steelerfan1]

I will say one thing I strongly believe on that "safe path" vs "entrepreneur path" is the number one thing I think people need is to be self aware. Know yourself. 

So, my cousin and I are the same age. For 30 plus years I’ve always wanted to know that each week I have x amount of money coming in and a pension when I call it a career.

My cousin was always a go big or go home type personality and put his money where his mouth was over 30 years ago coming up with an idea and risked it all.

My cousin drives a new G-Wagon and Corvette convertible, has a 66 foot Azimuth and 3 houses.

I drive a 2012 Kia….but I’m going to have a pension! 
 

 

[Joe Bryant]

So, my cousin and I are the same age. For 30 plus years I’ve always wanted to know that each week I have x amount of money coming in and a pension when I call it a career.

My cousin was always a go big or go home type personality and put his money where his mouth was over 30 years ago coming up with an idea and risked it all.

My cousin drives a new G-Wagon and Corvette convertible, has a 66 foot Azimuth and 3 houses.

I drive a 2012 Kia….but I’m going to have a pension! 
 

And it's all about what you want.

You know this already but 66 foot boats and 3 homes don't necessarily make you happy. 

 

[steelerfan1]

And it's all about what you want.

You know this already but 66 foot boats and 3 homes don't necessarily make you happy. 

This is true my friend. Just wish my DNA had a little more of that at times. And knowing myself if I made it like that I’d probably still be driving my 2012 Kia.