dickey moe
Fingerpicker
The Stormtrooper ghetto.
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STAR WARS: EP 7 ***SPOILER ZONE*** - Go here if you've seen it (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Insein
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Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Just saw it. Two beefs:
1)I hate when they neuter the bad guys. The good guys must have killed a billion storm troopers/droids in the previous six movies, but a sissy, quitter of a storm trooper takes off his uniform and puts on a snazzy jacket and he becomes a formidable warrior. You can't build up Kylo to be proper villain to only have him struggle to best a failed storm trooper. I don't care if he was wounded, Luke could take off his fake hand, have a wank with his real hand with his legs tied together and he'd still slaughter thousands of storm troopers. What made the original trilogy great was Vader. I'm very disappointed this one had a pansy of a bad guy.
2)Why all the secrets? This was an extremely formulaic, predictable movie. Am I supposed to be shocked that a 90 year old actor who begged to have his character killed off 40 year ago met his demise? I'd have been much more surprised if he didn't die. Oh, and the bad guy was a relative of a good guy, mind blown. Personally, the secretive nature of the build up made this a tremendous let down.
I really don't understand how anyone could think this was anything better than ok.
1)I hate when they neuter the bad guys. The good guys must have killed a billion storm troopers/droids in the previous six movies, but a sissy, quitter of a storm trooper takes off his uniform and puts on a snazzy jacket and he becomes a formidable warrior. You can't build up Kylo to be proper villain to only have him struggle to best a failed storm trooper. I don't care if he was wounded, Luke could take off his fake hand, have a wank with his real hand with his legs tied together and he'd still slaughter thousands of storm troopers. What made the original trilogy great was Vader. I'm very disappointed this one had a pansy of a bad guy.
2)Why all the secrets? This was an extremely formulaic, predictable movie. Am I supposed to be shocked that a 90 year old actor who begged to have his character killed off 40 year ago met his demise? I'd have been much more surprised if he didn't die. Oh, and the bad guy was a relative of a good guy, mind blown. Personally, the secretive nature of the build up made this a tremendous let down.
I really don't understand how anyone could think this was anything better than ok.
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Poe's "So how does this work, you talk first or do I talk first" gag had me legitimately laughing out loud in the theatre.
Capella
Footballguy
Nerds are now saying when he gets hit in the game he says "curses" and that's what that is. I saw the clip and it sounded like cousin to me as well.
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Hang 10
Footballguy
Otis
Footballguy
Otis
Footballguy
I don't have a problem with the "neutered bad guy." The more I think about it, the more this was basically just a setup movie. It wasn't the big one. It was a chance to catch us up on all that has happened in the last 40 years; a chance to introduce the new characters that will be the future of the franchise and hope we come to like them. And a chance to introduce Rey and Kylo as two people who are naturally incredibly gifted in the force but young and not completed trained yet. Ren is a sicko; even sicker than Vader, which makes him scarier in that sense. Ray is more adept and less whiny than Luke was at her age and stage of progression (you wouldn't have seen Luke in hand to hand combat kicking tail like she did--she lived a much more hardened life completely on her own effectively as a slave laborer; he was whining to Uncle Owen about going to Taashi station to play with some power converters with his friends).
The setup is great here for two compelling characters to go back and train with the best of the best and come back perhaps the most powerful of anyone ever. Kylo will be more pissed off and vengeful than ever and will be obsessively motivated with beating Ray, a girl with no training who he probably believes he should have mopped the floor with, crossbow shot or not. She's just a bad ### in general and you know will come back every bit as lethal as Luke did in RotJ.
They've got my 20 bucks for the next one. Looking forward to it. I'm hoping they feel they've done what was needed in terms of paying homage and playing it safe and setting up the next one, so that now they can do something different and more ambitious in terms of the story, and we don't see another death star, but we get all the same "charm" of the originals, and we get two bad asses ready to go at each other in what will end up being classic light saber fights.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Geez, I guess most people like their villains all powerful and one-note.
Insein
Footballguy
I felt Poe should have been more involved. I didn't understand his excuse " oh I thought you were dead so I left completely forgetting about the droid I stashed on the planet."
gump
Footballguy
I asked pre-opening if Ridley was the most likely next Ford, with a huge career outside SW...seems to be the case.
Pipes
Footballguy
(HULK)
(Smash)
I don't think Kylo is supposed to be all powerful.
The Empire was supposedly fragmented post Jedi... the First Order is just one of those fragments.
We're conditioned to a situation where there are 2 dark jedi Sith Lords. That was the way of the Sith. Never more than 2 at a time, Master and Apprentice. But, this time, there are no Sith. Its the Knights of Ren, of which, Kylo is just one. Supreme Leader Snoke is the guy in charge of them and apparently the First Order. Who is to say that there are not several other similar set ups out there under Snoke? Each in different corners of the galaxy.
Kylo is portrayed as fairly weak. I think that is intentional. If he was one of two dark Jedi, we'd expect him to be super powerful for the story over 3 films... but I'm thinking he isn't one of two... he is one of many.
With this in mind, I expect Kylo to flip sides either in 8 or early in 9.
The Empire was supposedly fragmented post Jedi... the First Order is just one of those fragments.
We're conditioned to a situation where there are 2 dark jedi Sith Lords. That was the way of the Sith. Never more than 2 at a time, Master and Apprentice. But, this time, there are no Sith. Its the Knights of Ren, of which, Kylo is just one. Supreme Leader Snoke is the guy in charge of them and apparently the First Order. Who is to say that there are not several other similar set ups out there under Snoke? Each in different corners of the galaxy.
Kylo is portrayed as fairly weak. I think that is intentional. If he was one of two dark Jedi, we'd expect him to be super powerful for the story over 3 films... but I'm thinking he isn't one of two... he is one of many.
With this in mind, I expect Kylo to flip sides either in 8 or early in 9.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Ray finds out luke is her dad. Ben solo kills luke. Ray defeats snoke and ben solo return of the jedi style with ben actually killing snok but dying in the process.
Rinse wash repeat.
But hey i loved force awakens. This is what we want as fans
dschuler
Footballguy
Your first point is spot on. They made Kylo so weak, I won't be able to take this series seriously if he is anything more than a sidekick of some kind. I can't remember a weaker villain in a movie. That alone made it not great for me.
Billy Bats
Footballguy
Two things you guys are forgetting:
1. It's obvious Kylo is/was still struggling between the light and dark side. He even said as much to Han.
2. He is yet to finish his training.
Everyone expecting to see badass Vader are disappointed because Kylo is still Anakin before he completely turned. Relax, you will see a badder ### Kylo in Ep VIII.
1. It's obvious Kylo is/was still struggling between the light and dark side. He even said as much to Han.
2. He is yet to finish his training.
Everyone expecting to see badass Vader are disappointed because Kylo is still Anakin before he completely turned. Relax, you will see a badder ### Kylo in Ep VIII.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This issue a by product of people wanting the movie to be self contained instead of treating it as a chapter in a longer story. Since I think we need to look at the series as a whole, it is a mistake IMO to judge characters arcs before they have come close to being completed.
Capella
Footballguy
I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
Arsenal of Doom
Footballguy
One thing that ocurred to me about Rey is that she demonstrates many of the traits/skills associated with Anakin:
seems to be able to fix anything
incredible pilot
naturally skilled with a lightsaber/combat
obviously strong with the force
The simple (and probably most likely) explanation of course is that she's Anakin's granddaughter, but there are some other interesting ways they could go. If Snoke ends up being Darth Palgeuis perhaps she's another direct child of the force. Or a female Anakin clone, or perhaps daughter. It doesn't seem unreasonable that Palpatine would want contingencies in place to keep the Skywalker bloodline going after Vader, if he lacked the ability to create a force child himself.
seems to be able to fix anything
incredible pilot
naturally skilled with a lightsaber/combat
obviously strong with the force
The simple (and probably most likely) explanation of course is that she's Anakin's granddaughter, but there are some other interesting ways they could go. If Snoke ends up being Darth Palgeuis perhaps she's another direct child of the force. Or a female Anakin clone, or perhaps daughter. It doesn't seem unreasonable that Palpatine would want contingencies in place to keep the Skywalker bloodline going after Vader, if he lacked the ability to create a force child himself.
Sand
Footballguy
Saw this last night with the fam. Kids (16 and 10) thought it was great. Wife and I thought it was complete dreck. God, what a disappointment. Rae was awesome. I have to stretch back to Max von Syndow at the start to find another performance better than junk. Fischer and Ford delivered the most wooden performances in recent memory. The stormtrooper guy was merely bad, which easily put him in the top half here. Plot was trite and insipid - a veritable cascade of deus ex machina occurences. Who greenlit this disaster of a script? The only part of this that was truly entertaining was the Falcon's initial flight. The rest was completely forgettable.
Oh, and PSA to Mark Hamill - if you want to be a believable Jedi please lose that extra 60 you were hiding under those robes. Thank goodness you didn't have to speak any lines.
Oh, and PSA to Mark Hamill - if you want to be a believable Jedi please lose that extra 60 you were hiding under those robes. Thank goodness you didn't have to speak any lines.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Correct. You are basically talking about the first 35 minutes of a normal movie.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
In trilogies people want each movie to answer everything. Umm, no, that would be three completely different movies then. This is not that. That is not this.
I liked Kylo's character a lot, and they made a nice pick on the actor who played him (forgot his name for the moment). For some reason (a reason we don't know of yet) he is trying to be something he isn't. He left Luke before finishing training obviously, which is why he is weak, not to mention he has no conviction in his thoughts..............though killing Han might change that a bit, and now Snoke wants to finish Ren's training, so yeah, Ren is about to change quite a bit.
Rey. Yeah baby
jabarony
Footballguy
I didn't take him seriously once he took the mask off. Such a non-menacing look. They should have gotten a different actor, not the kid from Real Genius. The near-crying when he couldn't read Rey's mind + the hissy-fits didn't help.
tommyboy
Footballguy
The Duff Man
Footballguy
This link shows the difference between book and movie. Potential spoiler - the book shows that Leia was keeping something from Han. So perhaps she kept the existence of another (female) Solo secret also.
http://io9.gizmodo.com/the-11-biggest-differences-between-the-book-and-movie-v-1749329046
http://io9.gizmodo.com/the-11-biggest-differences-between-the-book-and-movie-v-1749329046
Jobber
Footballguy
I'm hoping you can post some stock, political, or any other advice. So I can do the exact opposite. That's how wrong your post is.
tommyboy
Footballguy
Sand
Footballguy
I'm disappointed in feeling that way. I liked all the other SW movies. This was easily the worst in the series.
gump
Footballguy
dparker713
Footballguy
Hang 10
Footballguy
This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
Making your main antagonist weaker than your underdog hero just isn't a compelling way to start a 3 part story arc.
Insein
Footballguy
And making the supposedly defeated villains from 6 appear large and in charge without an explanation doesn't help either. I don't like the excuse to just roll with it. I do that for Fast and Furious movies where I know what I'm watching is a joke not be taken seriously. I like my Star Wars to be set in the Star wars universe.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films. Making your main antagonist weaker than your underdog hero just isn't a compelling way to start a 3 part story arc.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
Insein
Footballguy
This is true. Still don't like using sequels to explain everything. Give us something.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
Capella
Footballguy
They gave you plenty. Tons, actually. You just continue to disregard it.This is true. Still don't like using sequels to explain everything. Give us something.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
then our threads would be stuck onThis is true. Still don't like using sequels to explain everything. Give us something.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
"this sucked" vs "this was fun"
instead of some interesting speculation.
Come to think of it, I guess it is trending towards "this sucked" vs "this was fun" anyway :(
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dparker713
Footballguy
Give you what exactly? I mean this is the story of the search for luke and he's found by the end of the movie.This is true. Still don't like using sequels to explain everything. Give us something.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
I mean take Empire, whats actually done in that movie? There's an inconsequential battle, Luke training, a comedy of errors regarding hyperdrives, and a final fight that resolves nothing. There are great moments throughout, but the whole movie is killing time until the final confrontation in Jedi.
Hang 10
Footballguy
Sure but it worked didn't it? The force awakens also isn't the start of the lord of the rings either. The ending was pretty definitive.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
dparker713
Footballguy
No indication that they're Sith
Billy Bats
Footballguy
It's 30 years later. They just didn't pop up overnight, this is the culmination of reorganizing and rebuilding. You want thirty years explained in a two and half hour re-introduction movie?And making the supposedly defeated villains from 6 appear large and in charge without an explanation doesn't help either. I don't like the excuse to just roll with it. I do that for Fast and Furious movies where I know what I'm watching is a joke not be taken seriously. I like my Star Wars to be set in the Star wars universe.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films. Making your main antagonist weaker than your underdog hero just isn't a compelling way to start a 3 part story arc.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
ETA: you'll have to read the expanded novels/comics that they are writing and releasing. SW: Aftermath explains that there are still high ranking imperial officials gathering after ROTJ and planning to rebuild.
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Hang 10
Footballguy
Call them whatever you like.
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Billy Bats
Footballguy
Well considering they're not Sith (Knights of Ren) and not an evil empire (the first order), seems to me that things are expanding.
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Hang 10
Footballguy
This post is adorable.Well considering they're not Sith (Knights of Ren) and not an evil empire (the first order), seems to me that things are expanding.
Billy Bats
Footballguy
This post is adorable.Well considering they're not Sith (Knights of Ren) and not an evil empire (the first order), seems to me that things are expanding.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I have no idea where the next chapters in the story are going so I have no idea what this start to a much longer story is leading to.Sure but it worked didn't it? The force awakens also isn't the start of the lord of the rings either.ANH was a stand alone movie. Lucas had no idea at the time there would have been a sequel.This is a poor excuse. ANH didn't need to be propped up by the following films.I seriously don't understand why people don't get this. It's 2 hours of a 7 hour story.
It was not even called A New Hope back then.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Just watched it this morning. Holy crap at 33 pages here. I tried to read through but couldn't get beyond 5-6 pages, so I'll throw my own thoughts here.
1) Overall, definitely better than 1-3 but not as good as 4-6. As many others here, I supposed, I grew up with 4-6 so that's not surprising.
2) As some commented earlier, the way the movie is shot is very well done and is probably my favorite part about this movie. It maintained that same feel and that's very hard to do.
3) I can appreciate it being somewhat of a remake but I do wish it had a bit more originality. There were enough new characters that it could have been pulled off. Still, not the worst thing.
4) Rey was excellent as an actress but the British accent really killed it for me. There seems to be a trend now to have many things done in a British accent but this isn't the movie for that, especially most of the other characters do not have one. And I typically enjoy that accent in films.
5) Carrie Fisher looks awful and was, by far, the worst actress in the film. Such a shame considering her previous roles as well as her role in this movie.
6) Harrison Ford did much better but his best acting days are also behind him. Not nearly as good as earlier but still good
7) Just not a fan of Kylo Ren. No need to take the mask off. Didn't like who was cast in it. Overall, not a character I really felt that strongly about. And his use of the force was very dull. I understand he may not have been intended to be powerful, but still.
8) Very disappointed in how easily he was defeated by Rey. Again, I get that it may be how powerful she is, but still, it could have been done in another way.
9) Loved the new droid. Well done.
10) Battle scenes were fantastic
11) I got most emotional with very last scene when Luke turned around and they panned around showing him and Rey looking at each other. Pure awesome.
12) Finn--Most difficult character for me. Parts of him and his acting I really liked. Parts of him and his acting I really didn't like. Overall, though, not bad.
13) The whole Death Star/Megaweapon thing was awful. Quite possibly the worst part of the movie. A weapon that obliterates planets with a single shot? And then destroyed that easily? Come on. Just not necessary.
I enjoyed the movie. I would see it again. I'm now looking forward to the next episode. I actually went in with low expectations and was quite pleased because I think it's almost impossible to outdo what the originals brought. That said, I don't get how some people are saying this is the best one yet. No chance.
1) Overall, definitely better than 1-3 but not as good as 4-6. As many others here, I supposed, I grew up with 4-6 so that's not surprising.
2) As some commented earlier, the way the movie is shot is very well done and is probably my favorite part about this movie. It maintained that same feel and that's very hard to do.
3) I can appreciate it being somewhat of a remake but I do wish it had a bit more originality. There were enough new characters that it could have been pulled off. Still, not the worst thing.
4) Rey was excellent as an actress but the British accent really killed it for me. There seems to be a trend now to have many things done in a British accent but this isn't the movie for that, especially most of the other characters do not have one. And I typically enjoy that accent in films.
5) Carrie Fisher looks awful and was, by far, the worst actress in the film. Such a shame considering her previous roles as well as her role in this movie.
6) Harrison Ford did much better but his best acting days are also behind him. Not nearly as good as earlier but still good
7) Just not a fan of Kylo Ren. No need to take the mask off. Didn't like who was cast in it. Overall, not a character I really felt that strongly about. And his use of the force was very dull. I understand he may not have been intended to be powerful, but still.
8) Very disappointed in how easily he was defeated by Rey. Again, I get that it may be how powerful she is, but still, it could have been done in another way.
9) Loved the new droid. Well done.
10) Battle scenes were fantastic
11) I got most emotional with very last scene when Luke turned around and they panned around showing him and Rey looking at each other. Pure awesome.
12) Finn--Most difficult character for me. Parts of him and his acting I really liked. Parts of him and his acting I really didn't like. Overall, though, not bad.
13) The whole Death Star/Megaweapon thing was awful. Quite possibly the worst part of the movie. A weapon that obliterates planets with a single shot? And then destroyed that easily? Come on. Just not necessary.
I enjoyed the movie. I would see it again. I'm now looking forward to the next episode. I actually went in with low expectations and was quite pleased because I think it's almost impossible to outdo what the originals brought. That said, I don't get how some people are saying this is the best one yet. No chance.
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