Steve Young (1 Viewer)

[switz]

I say no. He was good.. Was he Terry Bradshaw, Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana, Sid Luckman, Bart Starr, or John Elway good?No.

If you are including Bradshaw on your list, he belongs...

 

[BusterTBronco]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

If you've read it several places, then you'll have no problem providing a link.

 

[GregR_2]

Eight? Maybe I'm missing something. I was just browsing and noticed this and didn't strike me as HOF.

I see the SB MVP argument, but don't you think many QB's could have won that SB with that 49ers team?

When did the HoF start being about the career someone could have had, instead of being about the career they actually had?

 

[Fear & Loathing]

How old/young is Normie32?

I can't believe anybody who actually saw Young play with the 49ers would question his HOF credentials.

I have a hunch there's some revisionist history going on here based simply on seasonal passing yardage stats.

 

[Utter Chaos]

I say no.

He was good.. Was he Terry Bradshaw, Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana, Sid Luckman, Bart Starr, or John Elway good?

No.

Steve Young was far better than Bradshaw.

Not according to TommyGilmore's Calculations of Goodness via Super Bowl Rings. 4 Super Bowl Rings > 3 Super Bowl Rings - Thus Bradshaw is better then Young.

Using that logic then Trent Dilfer 1 Super Bowl Ring > Dan Marino 0 Super Bowl Rings and Dan Marino = Ryan Leaf

 

[BusterTBronco]

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

I can see Jerry Rice saying that Joe Montana was the best QB he ever played with. To him, they are probably 1 and 1A. I cannot see Rice using the word "superior" to describe Montana in relation to Young.

 

[Copeman]

No doubt in my mind he belongs. I see people in here comparing eras. I thought that was a no-no based on the Hines Ward thread. I thought people wanted to compare between peers. If so, he is a lock.

 

[KingEl]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

If you've read it several places, then you'll have no problem providing a link.

GO to the NEW YORK POST - November 17, 2006 edition- Interview with Jerry Rice..Q: If you had one game to win, who would rather have throwing you the ball - Joe Montana or Steve Young?A: It would have to be Montana with the chemistry we had. It is amazing. I'm very fortunate to have had two Hall of Fame quarterbacksYou can also google Interview with Jerry Rice and Montana to find this.Again, the quotes I referred to originally are from what I HEARD on his Radio show... And yes, the word superior is my word, but he was definitly asked which QB was better, and the answer was Montana.Since you challenged me to provide an interview I have read from Jerry Rice, I would think the Post article above backs me up, and I expect your apology and admittance that you were "flat out wrong"....

 

[jayboy444]

I say no. He was good.. Was he Terry Bradshaw, Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana, Sid Luckman, Bart Starr, or John Elway good?No.

terry bradshaw? total passing yards tb- 27, 989, young 33,124, tds-to-int, tb 212 to 210, young 232 to 107, rushing td's tb 32, young 43. oh yeah young threw 6 superbowl td's in ONE game. i'd say most definately YES. especially if the HOF is gonna include a dope like dan dierdorf

 

[Utter Chaos]

Somehow I bet if Steve had stayed in TB he wouldnt be in the HOF.

Yeah, and Montana may not have been successful if Bill Walsh stayed in college football coaching at Stanford.

That is up for debate. What Isn't up for debate was how bad Young was in TB. Thats fact. HTH

Part of the reason Young was bad in Tampa was because he was throwing to guys like Gerald Carter, Phil Freeman, Calvin McGee, and Kevin House instead of Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Brent Jones, and Terrell Owens.

 

[Ice Cream Man]

1st ballot, without a doubt.

 

[Ozymandias]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

Of course, Jerry Rice was talking about Montana and Young as passers, and I respect his opinion. But Young was also a great runner. Someone said it best; 1A and 1B. If I had to start from scratch and build a football team, I would probably go with Young. He posed unbelievable problems for defensive coordinators.

 

[largentslovechild]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

 

[pinda]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

link pleasethat would be interesting considering Rice caught more TD balls from Young than Montana, would be a very interesting read on why he thought that.

From Rice's Sirius Satellite Radio Show. Heard it with my own ears. A called called in and simply asked "Who was better- Montana or Young?" Rice actually mentioned what you just said about the TD catches. He said as close to a quote as I can remember "I actually caught more passes and TD's from Steve, but to me Joe Montana will always be the best QB I ever played with and in the history of the NFL. "We had a special connection... etc... He also said that when Young became the QB- it was hard to adjust to the way he threw the ball. He said that Montana had an amazing ability to put the ball where Jerry was GOING to be and where only he could catch it, while Young would throw it up and Rice would have to GO get it to make the play.... Several members of the board have talked about the quotes from Rice before, I think in one of the greatest QB ever threads...

cool thanks KingEI, didn't mean it as questioning you, was just very curious to hear why Rice thought that.i think this thread being that it's become a debate between Young and Montana answers the question on whether Steve should be in the HOF or not.

 

[Native]

This is the problem with just looking at statisitics. Watching him play, Young was arguably as dominant as any QB of the modern era. He was a duel threat QB that could beat you with his arms and legs. He had uncanny accuracy and was a tremendous leader.

The fact that people would question his worthiness in the HOF because he wasnt a statistical "compiler" is kind of silly. Anyone that actually watched him play knows he is an all-timer.

 

[Ice Cream Man]

This is the problem with just looking at statisitics. Watching him play, Young was arguably as dominant as any QB of the modern era. He was a duel threat QB that could beat you with his arms and legs. He had uncanny accuracy and was a tremendous leader.

Actually, I think his stats reflect that pretty accurately!

 

[dgreen]

Maybe he meant to say "Selvin" Young?

 

[switz]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

If you've read it several places, then you'll have no problem providing a link.

GO to the NEW YORK POST - November 17, 2006 edition- Interview with Jerry Rice..Q: If you had one game to win, who would rather have throwing you the ball - Joe Montana or Steve Young?

A: It would have to be Montana with the chemistry we had. It is amazing. I'm very fortunate to have had two Hall of Fame quarterbacks

You can also google Interview with Jerry Rice and Montana to find this.

Again, the quotes I referred to originally are from what I HEARD on his Radio show... And yes, the word superior is my word, but he was definitly asked which QB was better, and the answer was Montana.

Since you challenged me to provide an interview I have read from Jerry Rice, I would think the Post article above backs me up, and I expect your apology and admittance that you were "flat out wrong"....

Problem is, Rice didn't say Montana was a better QB, just that they had better chemistry...and I'm not the poster who originally challenged your comment, but I feel the need to point out what you are claiming is not supported by that interview.

 

[MarshallRob]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

I'm pretty sure the trade was DeBartolo's and Policy's call, not Seifert's.

 

[phthalatemagic]

It is the Pro Football Hall of Fame, so the USFL counts.

I wonder what this means for Doug Flutie, who had a truckload of records, MVPs and championships from the CFL, and Jeff Garcia who was a pretty darned good CFL QB as well.

 

[KingEl]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

If you've read it several places, then you'll have no problem providing a link.

GO to the NEW YORK POST - November 17, 2006 edition- Interview with Jerry Rice..Q: If you had one game to win, who would rather have throwing you the ball - Joe Montana or Steve Young?

A: It would have to be Montana with the chemistry we had. It is amazing. I'm very fortunate to have had two Hall of Fame quarterbacks

You can also google Interview with Jerry Rice and Montana to find this.

Again, the quotes I referred to originally are from what I HEARD on his Radio show... And yes, the word superior is my word, but he was definitly asked which QB was better, and the answer was Montana.

Since you challenged me to provide an interview I have read from Jerry Rice, I would think the Post article above backs me up, and I expect your apology and admittance that you were "flat out wrong"....

Problem is, Rice didn't say Montana was a better QB, just that they had better chemistry...and I'm not the poster who originally challenged your comment, but I feel the need to point out what you are claiming is not supported by that interview.

Come on, that interview doesn't support my claim that Rice has said that Montana was the better QB?!!! So if he had to win one game, he's going to pick the 2nd best QB?!! Obviosly he's going to pick the better QB of the two--- and he picked Montana....And, again, my assertions were based on Rice's radio show answer to a question. Obvisously I can't produce an audio clip of that- have no idea how to get it, but I think this interview certainly does back me up.. I just brought up the interview because someone said I was flat out lying and wouldn't be able to produce a quote of Rice saying Montana was better..... I think I basically did that. Sorry he didn't use the exact words, but the inference is certainly there... Anyway, I'm not downing Young.....He is a HOF'er, Montana is just better..

 

[shakeybarn]

4 really good years makes a HOF'er?

You serious? or just fishing here?Gale Sayers only played 5 years.... guessing he shouldn't even of been considered, yet was a lock.

 

[KingEl]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

I'm pretty sure the trade was DeBartolo's and Policy's call, not Seifert's.

Okay, I'm going to delve into this and no, I won't provide links- just my memories from being a die hard Montana/49ers fan and following ever scrap of info at the time.... The call was MONTANA's to be traded!! Montana was coming off a major injury and missed the whole season except for the 2nd half of the last Monday night game of the season... Young had firmly entrenched himself as the starter. During the offseason, two camps split up--- those who felt Montana was finished, and Young deserved a chance, - those who felt Montana was starter no matter what.... Raged on-- Siefert finally came out and said there would be an open competition in camps, with Montana being starter, but Young having the ability to become starter if he outperformed Montana.. Young was very upset, Montana didn't like it either as he felt he has earned the right to not have to look over his shoulder in open competition.. Battle raged on until DeBartolo who was very close to Montana, stepped in and told Seifert that Montana would be the starter as most starters are- as long as they play well- you know Montana would have-- they don't lose their job unless injured. No open competition. Montana then felt like it was dividing the team, and from his standpoint, now looked like he was just being given the job by the owner due to influence of their relationship..... Montana then asked to be traded to a team that would be competative, and Debartolo pulled off the KC trade..Montana had some great moments with KC-- outdueling Elway in a classic MNF game, and beating Young and the 49ers..Young had some great moments with 49ers..

 

[shakeybarn]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

I'm pretty sure the trade was DeBartolo's and Policy's call, not Seifert's.

Okay, I'm going to delve into this and no, I won't provide links- just my memories from being a die hard Montana/49ers fan and following ever scrap of info at the time.... The call was MONTANA's to be traded!! Montana was coming off a major injury and missed the whole season except for the 2nd half of the last Monday night game of the season... Young had firmly entrenched himself as the starter. During the offseason, two camps split up--- those who felt Montana was finished, and Young deserved a chance, - those who felt Montana was starter no matter what.... Raged on-- Siefert finally came out and said there would be an open competition in camps, with Montana being starter, but Young having the ability to become starter if he outperformed Montana.. Young was very upset, Montana didn't like it either as he felt he has earned the right to not have to look over his shoulder in open competition.. Battle raged on until DeBartolo who was very close to Montana, stepped in and told Seifert that Montana would be the starter as most starters are- as long as they play well- you know Montana would have-- they don't lose their job unless injured. No open competition. Montana then felt like it was dividing the team, and from his standpoint, now looked like he was just being given the job by the owner due to influence of their relationship..... Montana then asked to be traded to a team that would be competative, and Debartolo pulled off the KC trade..Montana had some great moments with KC-- outdueling Elway in a classic MNF game, and beating Young and the 49ers..Young had some great moments with 49ers..

well done. kudos... pretty much how i remember it as well... except the part of Montana being coke'd out of his gorde, only adding to his anger/impatience around that time.

 

[switz]

Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

Seeing as how Young and Rice hooked up for an NFL record 84 touchdowns, I think your statement is a flat out lie. Jerry Rice would never say that Montana was superior to Young.

Its no lie and you are flat out wrong. Rice did say that, I heard it, have read it several places, and have actually heard Jerry say similar things in other interviews.... How do you know Jerry would NEVER say that--- because Young played with Rice longer and in Rice's true prime- theres no way Rice could think Montana was a better QB?? That makes no sense... Call Jerry on his radio show and ask him....By the way, I do think Young is a hall of famer and great QB.. He's just not as good as Montana...

If you've read it several places, then you'll have no problem providing a link.

GO to the NEW YORK POST - November 17, 2006 edition- Interview with Jerry Rice..Q: If you had one game to win, who would rather have throwing you the ball - Joe Montana or Steve Young?

A: It would have to be Montana with the chemistry we had. It is amazing. I'm very fortunate to have had two Hall of Fame quarterbacks

You can also google Interview with Jerry Rice and Montana to find this.

Again, the quotes I referred to originally are from what I HEARD on his Radio show... And yes, the word superior is my word, but he was definitly asked which QB was better, and the answer was Montana.

Since you challenged me to provide an interview I have read from Jerry Rice, I would think the Post article above backs me up, and I expect your apology and admittance that you were "flat out wrong"....

Problem is, Rice didn't say Montana was a better QB, just that they had better chemistry...and I'm not the poster who originally challenged your comment, but I feel the need to point out what you are claiming is not supported by that interview.

Come on, that interview doesn't support my claim that Rice has said that Montana was the better QB?!!! So if he had to win one game, he's going to pick the 2nd best QB?!! Obviosly he's going to pick the better QB of the two--- and he picked Montana....

What if he thought both were equal?

 

[Young 8]

Does he belong??

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/YounSt00.htmhttp://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/YounSt00.htm

IS THIS SOME KIND OF JOKE ??

 

[Ketamine Dreams]

Does he belong??

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/YounSt00.htmhttp://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/YounSt00.htm

IS THIS SOME KIND OF JOKE ??

I'm pretty sure it's not a joke.

 

[KingEl]

Not to revive a dead thread, but I reheard the interview with Jerry Rice today on Sirius Radio where he says Montana was better than Young... Since several of you didn't beleive Rice would say that, or that I was misquoting him, or that I was "flat out lying"- I taped it on my Sirius reciever so I could quote it here...

I was wrong on one thing, I thought Rice said it on his Sirius NFL radio show, but it was actually on the Howard Stern Show. Sirius was playing the Best of Stern 2007 today and at around 10o am eastern, Stern is interviewing Rice about some energy drink he's promoting... Rice has just talked about Steve Atwater being a hard hitter.

Here's the exact text: Artie Lange (Stern Sidekick) asks Rice: "Real quick, who was better, Montana or Young?" Rice answers "uh, actually, uh, Steve and I scored more together, we scored more together, but Montana was the best" Lange says "really? that definitively, Montana was better?" Best ever?" Rice says "yeah, joe? best ever yeah, Montana. You know, I really had to adjust to Steve, he started out as a running quarterback who became a good passer, but Montana was great. We had a special chemistry, uh, uh, he knew where I was going to be before I did, threw it only where I could get it" "With Steve, I had to really make the play sometimes" Lange "Wow, Montana. this is so cool" Then Stern changes the subject.

okay, so thats the interview I was quoting from memory when this thread originally started that I got hammered on by Young fans.. I think I was pretty close......

For the record, back to the original intent of this thread, I do believe Young is a hall of famer....

 

[Ghost Rider]

It sounds like Rice is saying that Montana was a better passing QB from a WR's standpoint, since he obviously was always focused on throwing the ball, while Young could make plays with his feet, like running for a first down, or moving around and making something out of nothing, which would force the WRs to move around based on where Young was to get in position to make a catch. In other words, with Montana, you ran your routes and he would get you the ball, while with Young, sometimes you would have to break off your rout and break back towards the line of scrimmage to give Young a target to throw to. Given all of that, I could see why Rice, a WR, said Montana now.

 

[RUSF18]

Young deserves the HOF, not just based on his career, but because he had his helmet ripped off during a PRESEASON game and still escaped from the pocket and dove for the first down.

 

[Jason Wood]

I'm going to presume this wasn't a fishing trip in the first place...

1) Yes, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

2) Yes, it wasn't a difficult decision (witness the voters putting him in on the first year of eligibility)

3) It's irrelevant whether he was "better" than Joe Montana; if Montana were the litmus test for QB eligibility a LOT of QBs would have to be retroactively removed from the Hall

 

[Rebirtha]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

link pleasethat would be interesting considering Rice caught more TD balls from Young than Montana, would be a very interesting read on why he thought that.

He was on the Howard Stern Show within the last few months and said that Young was great but Montana is the best of all time.

 

[jasonbay]

He belongs, I sometimes wonder though that Bradshaw and Namath don't belong do to average stats.

 

[montanagold]

Young was with out a doubt.. probably the best QB I've ever seen play. ( yes, Pat's fans.. better than Brady )

Now Joe might have been better passer, etc... but, damned... Young had a fire. And.. he did some incredible incredible things on the field.

 

[TC]

When I see this cluster, only one player would I clearly rank ahead of Young - He was Mr. Everything for several seasons.

Steve Young 1985-1999

Troy Aikman 1989-2000

John Elway 1983-1998

Dan Fouts 1973-1987

Jim Kelly 1986-1996

Dan Marino 1983-1999

Joe Montana 1979-1994

Warren Moon 1984-2000

 

[dagogrease]

He belongs, I sometimes wonder though that Bradshaw and Namath don't belong do to average stats.

If you base HOF credential on purely regular season stats only, I could see your point. However, Bradshaw had some of the most memorable playoff and Super Bowl moments in football history. He is arguably, one of the greatest "big-game" QBs of all time this side of Joe Montana. 4 Super Bowl rings, 2 Time Super Bowl MVP and a NFL MVP award are some impressive credentials. He bloomed late in his career but from 1975-1981 he was arguably top 3 at his position during that time.No doubt, Joe Namath is in purley based on the events that surrounded Super Bowl III.I will now sit back and listen to the ridicule....

 

[Q-Bert]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

I'm pretty sure the trade was DeBartolo's and Policy's call, not Seifert's.

Okay, I'm going to delve into this and no, I won't provide links- just my memories from being a die hard Montana/49ers fan and following ever scrap of info at the time.... The call was MONTANA's to be traded!! Montana was coming off a major injury and missed the whole season except for the 2nd half of the last Monday night game of the season... Young had firmly entrenched himself as the starter. During the offseason, two camps split up--- those who felt Montana was finished, and Young deserved a chance, - those who felt Montana was starter no matter what.... Raged on-- Siefert finally came out and said there would be an open competition in camps, with Montana being starter, but Young having the ability to become starter if he outperformed Montana.. Young was very upset, Montana didn't like it either as he felt he has earned the right to not have to look over his shoulder in open competition.. Battle raged on until DeBartolo who was very close to Montana, stepped in and told Seifert that Montana would be the starter as most starters are- as long as they play well- you know Montana would have-- they don't lose their job unless injured. No open competition. Montana then felt like it was dividing the team, and from his standpoint, now looked like he was just being given the job by the owner due to influence of their relationship..... Montana then asked to be traded to a team that would be competative, and Debartolo pulled off the KC trade..

Montana had some great moments with KC-- outdueling Elway in a classic MNF game, and beating Young and the 49ers..

Young had some great moments with 49ers..

well done. kudos... pretty much how i remember it as well... except the part of Montana being coke'd out of his gorde, only adding to his anger/impatience around that time.

Never heard this before. Any link or source to substantiate?

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Bob Griese is the one that does not belong.

 

[TommyGilmore]

e. kudos... pretty much how i remember it as well... except the part of Montana being coke'd out of his gorde, only adding to his anger/impatience around that time.

Never heard this before. Any link or source to substantiate?

Probably confused Joe with his cousin Tony......

 

[Dexter Manley]

Never bothered to open this thread until this morning, as it appeared to be a fishing trip.

Jerry Rice was on Mike and Mike this morning, and they asked him point blank who he thought the greatest 3 qb's of all time were. His #1, without hesitation, was Joe Montana. #2 and #3 were Brady and Marino respectively. Young didn't make his list (he did seem to hesitate on #3 though).

Also, at all the people in this thread saying how Young was such a great runner (which he was), but Montana wasn't. Montana had great escapability. In fact, Montana was better than Young at scrambling and buying time BEHIND the line of scrimmage, in order to get off a pass.

Finally, if you want to complain about a qb having no business being in the HOF, candidate #1 is Troy Aikman. Apparently throwing a bunch of swing passes to your rb's and checkdowns to the wide open te in the middle of the field is good enough to get you into the HOF as long as your team wins 3 Super Bowls. I guess if Jim McMahmon, Jeff Hoestetller, or Trent Dilfer won 3 Super Bowls, they would get to be in the HOF too. What a joke.

 

[KingEl]

Never bothered to open this thread until this morning, as it appeared to be a fishing trip.

Jerry Rice was on Mike and Mike this morning, and they asked him point blank who he thought the greatest 3 qb's of all time were. His #1, without hesitation, was Joe Montana. #2 and #3 were Brady and Marino respectively. Young didn't make his list (he did seem to hesitate on #3 though).

Also, at all the people in this thread saying how Young was such a great runner (which he was), but Montana wasn't. Montana had great escapability. In fact, Montana was better than Young at scrambling and buying time BEHIND the line of scrimmage, in order to get off a pass. Finally, if you want to complain about a qb having no business being in the HOF, candidate #1 is Troy Aikman. Apparently throwing a bunch of swing passes to your rb's and checkdowns to the wide open te in the middle of the field is good enough to get you into the HOF as long as your team wins 3 Super Bowls. I guess if Jim McMahmon, Jeff Hoestetller, or Trent Dilfer won 3 Super Bowls, they would get to be in the HOF too. What a joke.

This is true. People forget that Montana was known (especially early in his carrear) as being exceptional at moving around, buying time, making the play after it broke down.. That's what "The Catch" play was all about. Montana buying time until the last second.. Young was a better "rusher" as a QB, no arguement there, but I agree that behind the line, Montana was at least his equal and perhaps better.

 

[Snotbubbles]

7 time ALL-PRO, not Pro Bowl but ALL-PRO.

Compare that to:

Marino-8 times

Montana-7 times

Favre-6 times

Fouts-6 times

Elway-5 times

Aikman-3 times

Kelly-3 times

I'd say he belongs.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

It is the Pro Football Hall of Fame, so the USFL counts.

I wonder what this means for Doug Flutie, who had a truckload of records, MVPs and championships from the CFL, and Jeff Garcia who was a pretty darned good CFL QB as well.

I wasn't suggesting that USFL performance alone would get a player in, just that the USFL years would get added on to the brilliant but short NFL run for Young. I know the fact that the NFL's highest-rated passer once played tailback in the USFL has always impressed me.

 

[Tau837]

7 time ALL-PRO, not Pro Bowl but ALL-PRO.

Compare that to:

Marino-8 times

Montana-7 times

Favre-6 times

Fouts-6 times

Elway-5 times

Aikman-3 times

Kelly-3 times

I'd say he belongs.

Using what source for All Pro selections? pro-football-reference.com?I have often looked for a good source of All Pro information, and there is now a start on pro-football-reference.com, but it uses multiple sources, as well as first and second teams, which makes it misleading IMO. For example, in 1991 6 CBs made the Pro Bowl, but pfr shows 7 CBs as making All Pro. It does not seem intuitive that more would be All Pro than Pro Bowlers... there are other examples, just sticking with 1991: 7 LTs and 18 total OL; 13 DL; 14 LBs; 7 Safeties; etc. If you are looking for a better discriminator of the best players in a given season than Pro Bowls, I don't think this source helps with that. (And by the way, I love pfr.com!)

So until that source gets cleaned up a bit, I still think this is the best source of info: All NFL Teams. For purposes of this discussion, note that in most years, only one QB is named; there are occasional exceptions, some of which are noted below.

Using that source:

Young - 3

Favre - 3

Manning - 3

Montana - 3 (shared in 1990 with Cunningham)

Fouts - 3 (shared in 1985 with Marino)

Marino - 3 (shared in 1985 with Fouts and shared in 1986 with Simms)

Kelly - 1

Elway - 0

Aikman - 0

Brady - 0 (until this year, presumably)

Pretty amazing IMO that none of these greats were 1st team All NFL more than 3 times. I'd say Manning has a shot to make a 4th, which would make him the leader in the modern era.

Also interesting is that Elway never made it. Personally, I'm not surprised that Aikman didn't, nor that Kelly only did it once, but I would have thought Elway might have done it at some point.

 

[phthalatemagic]

It is the Pro Football Hall of Fame, so the USFL counts.

I wonder what this means for Doug Flutie, who had a truckload of records, MVPs and championships from the CFL, and Jeff Garcia who was a pretty darned good CFL QB as well.

I wasn't suggesting that USFL performance alone would get a player in, just that the USFL years would get added on to the brilliant but short NFL run for Young. I know the fact that the NFL's highest-rated passer once played tailback in the USFL has always impressed me.

Yeah, I wasn't trying to argue with you. I was just wondering if anyone else thought other lesser leagues like the USFL and CFL could have meaningful contributions to a player's resume - meaningful enough for HOFness.

 

[matuski]

no brainer. in.

 

[Bojang0301]

When are people going to get off this kick? It's f'n football people, not baseball or hockey or basketball where you can play for 16 to 18 years and still be mentally and physically stable. The average football players lasts like 3 damn years, I say if you have 3 great years where you dominated the sport the HOF should take off their hat to you.

 

[Mene]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

Add to that, anyone who followed football in the 90's knows the Niners cut ties with all of thier Superbowl legends from the 80's when the game passed them by (Joe Montana, Ronnie Lott, Roger Craig, Jerry Rice). When the decision to keep Young over Montana was made Montana was a shell of his former self due to age and injuries, and Young was still, well...relatively young.As far as Youngs HOF worthiness, unquestionable. As someone else said in this thread, he was as mobile as Vick but could actually pass extremely well. He was dominant. The numbers are plenty good enough to back up the intagibles (SB MVP, NFL MVP's, SB rings... ).

 

[drummer]

There is no case to be made that Young > Montana..... Montana was superior.. Even Jerry Rice says so, and he should know.

49'ers record with Young > Montana. When given the choice between the two, head coach George Seifert traded Montana and kept Young.

Montana was at the tail end of a 15 year career, while Young, albeit already an 8 year veteran, had half his career ahead of him.It wasn't about who was better at that point, but who wouldn't battle Seifert for the senior citizen parking spots at candlestick.

I'm pretty sure the trade was DeBartolo's and Policy's call, not Seifert's.

Okay, I'm going to delve into this and no, I won't provide links- just my memories from being a die hard Montana/49ers fan and following ever scrap of info at the time.... The call was MONTANA's to be traded!! Montana was coming off a major injury and missed the whole season except for the 2nd half of the last Monday night game of the season... Young had firmly entrenched himself as the starter. During the offseason, two camps split up--- those who felt Montana was finished, and Young deserved a chance, - those who felt Montana was starter no matter what.... Raged on-- Siefert finally came out and said there would be an open competition in camps, with Montana being starter, but Young having the ability to become starter if he outperformed Montana.. Young was very upset, Montana didn't like it either as he felt he has earned the right to not have to look over his shoulder in open competition.. Battle raged on until DeBartolo who was very close to Montana, stepped in and told Seifert that Montana would be the starter as most starters are- as long as they play well- you know Montana would have-- they don't lose their job unless injured. No open competition. Montana then felt like it was dividing the team, and from his standpoint, now looked like he was just being given the job by the owner due to influence of their relationship..... Montana then asked to be traded to a team that would be competative, and Debartolo pulled off the KC trade..Montana had some great moments with KC-- outdueling Elway in a classic MNF game, and beating Young and the 49ers..Young had some great moments with 49ers..

When Eddie said he wanted to keep Montana before he got eventually got traded, Montana thought that was just trying to raise his value in the trade. Montana wanted to be traded after that. He wanted to be traded before that. No way was he gonna hand the mantle over to a guy he didn't like. He'd rather play for someone else, which he did.

 

[drummer]

Not to revive a dead thread, but I reheard the interview with Jerry Rice today on Sirius Radio where he says Montana was better than Young... Since several of you didn't beleive Rice would say that, or that I was misquoting him, or that I was "flat out lying"- I taped it on my Sirius reciever so I could quote it here... I was wrong on one thing, I thought Rice said it on his Sirius NFL radio show, but it was actually on the Howard Stern Show. Sirius was playing the Best of Stern 2007 today and at around 10o am eastern, Stern is interviewing Rice about some energy drink he's promoting... Rice has just talked about Steve Atwater being a hard hitter.Here's the exact text: Artie Lange (Stern Sidekick) asks Rice: "Real quick, who was better, Montana or Young?" Rice answers "uh, actually, uh, Steve and I scored more together, we scored more together, but Montana was the best" Lange says "really? that definitively, Montana was better?" Rice says "yeah, yeah, Montana. You know, I really had to adjust to Steve, he started out as a running quarterback who became a good passer, but Montana was great. We had a special chemistry, uh, uh, he knew where I was going to be before I did, threw it only where I could get it" "With Steve, I had to really make the play sometimes" Lange "Wow, Montana. this is so cool" Then Stern changes the subject.okay, so thats the interview I was quoting from memory when this thread originally started that I got hammered on by Young fans.. I think I was pretty close......For the record, back to the original intent of this thread, I do believe Young is a hall of famer....

Rice has always put Montana ahead of Young. He said it on KNBR as well. It isn't a slam against Young, it just is what it is.