Targeting handcuffs before the primary player (1 Viewer)

[Rattle and Hum]

Let's say, for example, that I want Benson this year as I think he should be a decent value. Does it make sense to nominate and win Peterson (chi) before Benson assuming Pete goes extremely cheap?

I'm thinking it might mean I get Peterson for $1 ir $2 since noone else knows if they really want him. They might run him up to $4 or $5 if I already have Benson.

Does this mean that Benson's price will get run up higher than if I didn't have Pete already? Or, will owners be less likely to bid on Benson knowing he has an injury history and they won't be able to handcuff him?

 

[zed2283]

I think that if you already own Peterson that the other owners will run Benson's price up, knowing that you might overpay for him.

I think it's less likely they will run Peterson's price up if you already own Benson. This is a little different than bidding on a guy like LJ a couple years ago when he was Priest's backup.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I'm not sure what cause you're coming up with here that would make the handcuff cheaper. If anything, it seems the opposite.

Most people are less interested in handcuffs unless they have the primary player. So if you put up Peterson first they might be willing to bid on him under the thought that they might eventually end up with Benson. If you bid on Benson first then they go into the Peterson knowing they don't need the cuff, and probably bid less on him.

I don't get your point about them knowing you have Benson so being willing to bid more on Peterson, because even if Benson hasn't been bid on yet they know that SOMEONE is going to end up with him.

Lastly what happens if you go and spend that money on Peterson and then someone ends up bidding higher on Benson than you're willing to? Now you've just wasted money on Peterson. Further, what if the Peterson bid runs up to $4-$5 before you bid on Benson. Now you're faced with deciding whether to bid that much on him before you even know whether or not you have Benson. If you bid on Benson first, then at least you would know whether Peterson was worth $4-$5 to you.

I can't think of any scenario where bidding on the cuff first would be beneficial to you, but I can think of several where it would hurt you.

 

[-OZ-]

Lastly what happens if you go and spend that money on Peterson and then someone ends up bidding higher on Benson than you're willing to? Now you've just wasted money on Peterson.

Not if you think there's a chance Benson isn't a stud and Peterson sees significant playing time. I wouldn't do this with situations like Brian Leonard and SJax, but in a situation where you're less than sure about the lead back, it can make sense. If you don't get Peterson, you don't go after Benson (unless he's a great value). If you get Peterson and Benson's price is too high, you still have Peterson and haven't spent extra $ on Benson. I'd just make sure you don't miss out on other starting RBs.

 

[Rattle and Hum]

Lastly what happens if you go and spend that money on Peterson and then someone ends up bidding higher on Benson than you're willing to? Now you've just wasted money on Peterson.

Not if you think there's a chance Benson isn't a stud and Peterson sees significant playing time. I wouldn't do this with situations like Brian Leonard and SJax, but in a situation where you're less than sure about the lead back, it can make sense. If you don't get Peterson, you don't go after Benson (unless he's a great value). If you get Peterson and Benson's price is too high, you still have Peterson and haven't spent extra $ on Benson. I'd just make sure you don't miss out on other starting RBs.

I think this part of what I was getting at.Who cares if I spend $2 for Peterson and don't get Benson? If anything, I can get my money back in trade for auction $$ or a player from the owner that does win Benson.If I win Benson first and throw our Peterson in the late rounds evryone will know 3 things:1. That I have a great desire for Peterson.2. That I will likely pay more for Peterson than everyone else.3. How much money I can afford to pay for Peterson as we have likely already seen 80-100 players off the boards.If I have money left and need to fill some spots and I see the Benson owner trying to win Peterson and having a decent amount of auction dollars left you can bet that he will not win him for $2 or $3. I know that he will probably pay $5 or $6.I guess the question becomes whether or not Peterson will be cheaper early in the draft, more expensive, or the same as waiting until later rounds and Benson has been won.

 

[-OZ-]

Lastly what happens if you go and spend that money on Peterson and then someone ends up bidding higher on Benson than you're willing to? Now you've just wasted money on Peterson.

Not if you think there's a chance Benson isn't a stud and Peterson sees significant playing time. I wouldn't do this with situations like Brian Leonard and SJax, but in a situation where you're less than sure about the lead back, it can make sense. If you don't get Peterson, you don't go after Benson (unless he's a great value). If you get Peterson and Benson's price is too high, you still have Peterson and haven't spent extra $ on Benson. I'd just make sure you don't miss out on other starting RBs.

I think this part of what I was getting at.Who cares if I spend $2 for Peterson and don't get Benson? If anything, I can get my money back in trade for auction $$ or a player from the owner that does win Benson.If I win Benson first and throw our Peterson in the late rounds evryone will know 3 things:1. That I have a great desire for Peterson.2. That I will likely pay more for Peterson than everyone else.3. How much money I can afford to pay for Peterson as we have likely already seen 80-100 players off the boards.If I have money left and need to fill some spots and I see the Benson owner trying to win Peterson and having a decent amount of auction dollars left you can bet that he will not win him for $2 or $3. I know that he will probably pay $5 or $6.I guess the question becomes whether or not Peterson will be cheaper early in the draft, more expensive, or the same as waiting until later rounds and Benson has been won.

In this situation, I would try your plan.My line of thinking is if Benson is available first, owners will bid on him thinking "I can always grab Peterson cheap later, in case he isn't a stud." The bidding for Benson would be at the rate of a good young starting RB. If Peterson is gone, owners are more apt to think of the risk involved with Benson.Now, it's entirely possible that an owner or two are convinced that Benson will be a stud and aren't worried about the risk, in which case this plan won't help. If you do get Peterson first, don't be the guy that opens Benson if you can help it. If your league talks a lot, make it sound like you're convinced that Peterson will have a large role this year and you got a steal. Not that you just wanted Benson's handcuff.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I think this part of what I was getting at.

Who cares if I spend $2 for Peterson and don't get Benson? If anything, I can get my money back in trade for auction $$ or a player from the owner that does win Benson.

The point was what if he goes up to $4-$5 like you expect he might. Is he worth that much to you if you don't have Benson? I doubt it.And while you might be able to recoup some of it from the eventual Benson owner, if they draft Benson and you go to him with Peterson he is going to know what's up and lowball you.

If I win Benson first and throw our Peterson in the late rounds evryone will know 3 things:

1. That I have a great desire for Peterson.

2. That I will likely pay more for Peterson than everyone else.

3. How much money I can afford to pay for Peterson as we have likely already seen 80-100 players off the boards.

This is all abstract theory that doesn't seem like it will matter at all in practice. With regards to 1 and 2, what does it matter if they know that you have Benson and need Peterson? If Peterson goes first they know that SOMEONE will need him. It doesn't matter if it's you or Chuck or Bill or Angelina Jolie. The way it's written it seems like you're expecting them to bid 4 or 5 bucks on Peterson specifically so you will have to pay more for him, with no desire to actually get him for themselves. I think in a 12+ person league people are far more concerned with their own teams than they are putting a minimal "block" on a team when everyone is starting from equal. It's one thing in a dynasty league if a division rival with a strong team is bidding on someone, but that's not the case here. Further, beforehand I think people would be more likely to pay the cheaper Peterson price to pawn them off to the eventual Benson owner.Plus, doesn't your point work in reverse? If you go after Peterson early they're gonna know you want Benson and if they do follow your "blocking" logic they're going to follow it there, only just given the nature of the amount of money being spent the "raise" on Benson will inevitably be higher than the "raise" on Peterson would be. Since the "raise" on Benson will probably be more than Peterson's entire auction value.

As for point 3, well that totally contradicts what you seem to be implying with points 1 and 2. If you think they don't really want Peterson but just want to make you pay more for him, then what good does knowing you don't have enough money to pay more do? That's counter-intuitive to what they'd be trying to do.

 

[radballs]

I really think it depends on the handcuff. This could work for some players. But, in this case I agree with FreeBaGel. I think all you end up doing is running up the price on Peterson (especially the earlier this is done in the draft). And then it does end up forcing your hand a bit to get Benson.

There are some handcuffs that I think this could work for possibly, but not in this situation.